Post-Exertional Malaise (PEM)

Post-Exertional Malaise (PEM)
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[@richardcerniglia8417]

Been dealing with PEM for 5 years now. After all the blood tests and supplements, I kinda gave up. A few months back discovered brain training which educated me and helped some. Discovered Dan here recently, with his messages of safety, I've noticed more improvement right away. Thank You Dan!

[@kaylaberry7983]

I deal with this as well, but when I’m doing an activity I feel my body so tense so I stand and tell myself I’m safe and healthy and make myself relax and keep going on and continue to make myself relax. I know this will pass eventually. I keep telling myself that I am safe but sometimes my NS gives me panic when it doesn’t believe me.

[@annemay3897]

I was just thinking, that I could see teaching my brain as if I am teaching my scared puppy about the world, and how most things are not scary, but it does take several steps and exposures for her to learn this.

[@gregschmelzle8227]

You’re absolutely right Dan! I lived at several years like the doctor said don’t do too much that just made my world smaller! I have been taking it the other direction and when symptoms show up respond calmly know what it is and shift focus away it’s working thank you so much!

[@janakedakin4367]

I've had a lot of experience with this for many,many years and now, with my understanding of mind body conditions and perceived danger I can say.yes, this does make sense. And, Dan, you did an excellent video a while back related to this. It was called ,Seven steps to Resume Activity. That was very helpful to me and I'm sure would be for others. Thank you Dan!💜

[@1STBUCKLEY]

Post is unreal. Are you following me lol. Yesterday I actually attended my first group Writing course. My anxiety was so high. Beforehand I did a walk, nerve "pain" upped, didn't think I'd be able to go there. Anyhow I managed to stay sat for two hours despite wanting to get up and leave. Trying to sleep and my foot went into spasm, then my calf and thigh. Woke at 2am both legs hot and inflamed and I was burning up. This morning I feel flu like and very tearful and the overthinking high. I am having to keep reminding myself it's too coincidental, it's PDP. Struggled to get in my car and go for a drive to the shop but I did it. Yes "pain" keeps spiking but I'm calling it PDP. Am sounding like a used record lol On the other hand I thoroughly enjoyed the class. Can't believe this video came up 🙏👏👏👏 PS. Have to remind myself I had blood tests less than two weeks ago, all good.

[@jessIe76468]

So proud of you!! It will get better. You're proving that you ARE able to live your life, you're living your life and you're serious about it. Everything else will follow and settle in place. Been viewing my flare ups as tantrums a baby would throw. They look extreme but the child is safe, just very uncomfortable. (PS: Same, been told for years my pain was all in my head, started to distrust myself. Now when a cascade of symptoms come and it don't stop, self-doubts arise and I doubt my own perception of safety. Need facts to calm down too.)

[@sherylmarshall1444]

Well done you sound so much like me. I have disc degeneration c5 and c6 but been told it’s mild and shouldn’t stop be doing anything yet I get numbness/pain/tingling/tightness in my head, neck, bottom of my back,arms, legs , back , fingers and toes. I also get burning on top of my legs hands and feet at times. I get heaviness I know it’s PDP but it’s damn scary. I just keep puting one foot in front of another as it comes and go so has to be mind body.

[@Lenneke8422]

So proud of you you went to the writing class wow what a big Win 🏆❤️😘🙏🌷

[@Josh-if7to]

Had PEM probably a hundred times since getting diagnosed in CFS two and a half years ago. Discovered mind body work 7 weeks ago via the tms forum and then found your channel. PEM for me is almost always caused by emotions related to my core fear. It has nothing to do with how much I do which is what I used to think. If I'm able to release these emotions (usually via meditation) then the severity of PEM drops massively. I believe I was one of those that sarno explained as needing therapy, as my symptoms are reducing a lot by working through early childhood trauma (on my own right now). Just refocusing myself worked to an extent, but my body would still often go into a freeze response. Thanks for the video.

[@Maria-ld1kq]

I'm reading Gabor Mate's the Myth of Normal and it is so impressive that the mind and body are ONE. His theory actually verifies that TMS is very, very real.

[@Inge508]

You can have the whole encyclopedia full of labels, to make doctors feel useful, to keep us fearful.. you are spot on Dan: every out of proportion symptom ( that is benign)just needs 1 label: TMS/ PDP! And the cure is calm and safety to the system. P. E.M.: Practice your Exercise Mindfully- there will be no problem then! Have a good day Dan and everyone ❤

[@Lenneke8422]

❤

[@LilyOscar333]

Hi Inge how are you today ? Did you find the success story helpful? Wishing you a calm happy day..Hope sun is shining, thunder showers forecast for here. 🌴🌲❤️😊💕

[@LilyOscar333]

@@Inge508 Hope all goes well for you today 🙏 It will be pouring here soon too. 💕❤️

[@SusieV59]

Hi Inge, sending you love ❤️ and blessings.

[@Inge508]

@@LilyOscar333 thanks Lily!🥰

[@josiejo117]

Initially I had this labelled response P.E.M...but thanks to all your correct information I gradually began to trust it's not real. Now I have to apply the same to emotions as sometimes I appear tired after releasing emotion & a brain that thinks it was too much...does anyone else experience this? Thank you Dan for another fantastic reminder. Nature keeping it real in the background!!❤

[@Ale-rj5xo]

After over a year of PEM afflicting me even after a brisk, slow 20 minute walk, this guy's videos have helped to completely erase PEM from my body. I wake up every morning feeling so rested and fresh. I'm able to jog, run and lift weights now. Still working my way back up to 100%, the body needs to unlearn sickness and it needs to strengthen its systems again. My PEM was not real. Much love

[@meganobrien1019]

​@@Ale-rj5xo this is a great reply 👏 just wondering if u mind sharing - wad it simply watching Dan's videos and a full belief that pem no longer existed thst has got u there? Or did u kinda build up what u were doing slowly like graded exposure, and implement other things? ❤️🙌

[@Ale-rj5xo]

@@meganobrien1019 Well first, I started with Alex Howard's three reset program videos (do not buy his program, it's just a coaching program. The 3 videos are completely free). Those videos tell you everything about how this stuff works. And then Dan's videos helped me with reassurance and shifting my mindset. I remember, it took I believe a little over a week from when I discovered this mind-body stuff to when I first exercised without PEM and felt refreshed. I think it worked so well so soon because I believed so strongly that there was nothing wrong with my body structurally. But until I went on that walk, yeah I pretty much rested and took it easy. Hope this works well for you, friend. Recovery is possible.

[@Ale-rj5xo]

​@@meganobrien1019 Hey, i replied but my comment isn't showing up for me. Can you see it? If not I'll send it again

[@andybreedlove]

@@Ale-rj5xohi, I’m interested.. can you send again please? Thanks

[@Lenneke8422]

What a word pff ......another doctor diagnose. But it is all PDP.. Still having a challenging day going on a trip this Saturday for 5 days to the forest in the Netherlands. A bit nervous because of sensations. I am changing my story like I am going to have a smashing amazing time full stop ❤😊 ty Dan sending you love and to all of you on KZbin 😁😘❤️🌷

[@Inge508]

Joepie!! À great vacation in nature Lenneke ! That will do you so good! Relax , breathe and let your pain/ symptoms in that forest when you return back home. Nature can take care of that❤🌳🐝🐌🐞🐜🦉🐦‍⬛

[@Lenneke8422]

​​@@Inge508 I will leave them there 😊 🌷🌳🌳🌳🌳🌳🌳🌳🌳🌳🌲🌲🌲🌲🌲

[@LilyOscar333]

Lenneek you will feel better .. nature heals 🌲🌴🌲Enjoy 🌺🌸💕

[@1STBUCKLEY]

The break will be wonderful. Wish I was going 🌳🌲🙏

[@Lenneke8422]

@@1STBUCKLEY ty yes changed my story it is going to be a super trip ❤️😘🙏

[@martha-louise]

This came at a perfect time for me. I used to get this all the time after activity, though it's been getting a lot better recently. I went swimming yesterday and I knew since I hadn't done that for a while that my brain would probably perceive some danger. I took it easy swimming and had such a nice time. This morning I've felt a little flare up of symptoms but I thought of your videos and I said to myself that's fine and I know why it's happening and I don't have to worry about it. I know if I keep going swimming and having fun soon my brain will get the message that it's not dangerous. This has already happened with yoga and pilates. The "don't do too much" messages I'd hear used to freak me out a lot and it was only with your videos that things "clicked" and I started to get better and not worrying so much about activity. Thanks Dan :)

[@CherryLane-si1yj]

People suffering from ME/CFS symptoms are on a constant merry-go-round of blood tests and experimental IV treatments. PEM and other terms came about gradually. In the beginning, speaking historically here, it was difficult for CFS sufferers to be taken seriously. Hence, all the terminology and blood test panels and what-not. Most of the people suffering from it are women, which adds to the complexity and aggrieved feelings about taking the suffering seriously. Western medicine has a dodgy track record around conditions associated with women. I’ve known quite a few people with the condition. They struggled to get docs to believe them for years before getting a diagnosis. But all that effort to be taken seriously by the medical community is a catch-22. Now you are in their clutches. Now you have a stack of blood tests and a word salad to describe your human experience. Trips to MDs, NDs, therapists, etc. And once you have that and pursue that path it becomes harder to retrain the brain to think psychologically about the issues at hand. It requires an ontological shift. It’s very hard to argue with someone who is in the thick of it, especially when all this effort has been done historically to get the condition to be taken seriously. We have to be respectful of the history of this problem. It requires compassion and understanding.

[@Candiedclouds]

Dan was being respectful though…

[@mirjam3169]

And it is interesting to know what is going on in the body when the mind is in stress, because there is a totally different chemical reaction switching cells on and off. So when we destress the mind and gently support the body with nice movement, food, supplements, hugs, sleep etc we have a handy toolbox.

[@kristykoster3367]

I think we can be respectful of the very real suffering of these symptoms, and still acknowledge and treat them with the mind-body approach. The fact that symptoms can be made better or hopefully non-existent with changing your thought patterns, mindset, focus (everything Dan talks about) shouldn't invalidate how debilitating it is for patients stuck in this horrible cycle. The view that needs to be challenged in western medicine is the one that says "if it's psychological, it can't be taken seriously." In fact, I would argue that it should be taken even MORE seriously, but there are VERY few programs or treatments that doctors can offer that are centered around TMS/mind-body approach. I'm fortunate that my doctor believes my pain is caused by a hyper-vigilant nervous system, causing my thresh-hold/tolerance for pain to be very low. I literally asked if there was some kind of intensive outpatient program, like a "boot-camp" for desensitizing the CNS by being more immersed in the messages Dan promotes. Basically a rehab where you learn how to calm the nervous system to make the brain feel safe. But my Dr. had nothing to offer me. I just started Dan's program, and it's already helping me to feel more calm and safe.

[@Laura_B__]

Thank you for this video, Dan! I do think you are on the mark. I have CFS - diagnosed in 2017 after a whole slew of tests. I've been pursuing a mind-body approach to healing for about a year and a half now and have made some progress over that time, although I have a ways to go still. PEM is my main symptom although there are many others, and I have come to understand that they are all caused by a sensitive brain perceiving danger. Today I am experiencing significant PEM because I spent two hours outside working in the garden yesterday. Even though I had a good night's sleep, I woke up feeling like I ran a marathon yesterday. I love gardening, but my brain seems to always interpret physical activity as dangerous. It's deeply frustrating, but I try to just accept the symptoms without freaking out and give my brain messages of safety. I believe I will have a life without PEM eventually, but it's taking a long time to train my brain to understand that I am really safe, which is understandable as I was in a state of high stress and anxiety for pretty much all of my 45 years.

[@andybreedlove]

Right there with you - we got this! Slowly calmly.. 🕊️

[@alexandrecouture2462]

Thank you! At first, when I got long covid, my PEM was insane! Any activity that I would do would mean being bedridden the next day, even sometimes more than one day. But, as I worked with the knowledge of John Sarno and Dan Buglio, PEM almost completely disappeared, which is amazing!

[@infinitepossibilities337]

Did you just keep exposing yourself to the activities with a new mindset and eventually the brain learned?

[@alexandrecouture2462]

@@infinitepossibilities337 Hi! Do a favor to yourself and get a copy of The Mindbody Prescription book by Dr John Sarno. It would be too complicated to explain it all in a YT comment. Wishing you the best!

[@penelopedickinson1675]

Hey Dan I couldn't believe my ears when you talk about the brain shutting us down when it perceives danger. I've long said my body shuts me down when I do any kind of exercise. I used to be an obsessive exerciser and I imagine when I even think about the gentlest exercise a big red light and a loud alarm go off in my brain saying "shut her down, we're not going through that again. I'm grateful to the person who recommended your channel 🙏😺

[@mikeshields2530]

Very helpful. I tell myself I need a break or a cool down,then go back to doing something.

[@amysin963]

Dan, I appreciate you tackling this issue and also for welcoming new information and ideas. There is in fact testing and science behind PEM. A few good researchers to look up are David Systrom, Maureen Hanson, and Lucinda Bateman. The main way to test for this is through what’s called a 2-day CPET (cardiopulmonary exercise test). The key is, folks with fatiguing disorders can get through the test on day one, but all of their physiological markers start tanking on day two. That is specific to people with ME/CFS (and now many with long COVID); even people with congestive heart failure get through the second day of testing just fine, but not folks with ME. It’s what is meant by “post-exertional” because the physiological effects happen 24-48 hours after the physical (or cognitive) exertion. If fear were causing this, there’d be no delay in symptoms. But that’s not to suggest fear isn’t contributing to the severity of it, as you say in your video. I myself have had this test (only offered in a few places in the U.S., very expensive, not covered by insurance, and 99% of doctors don’t know anything about the test). It showed significant, measurable impairment and it helped me obtain disability benefits, because it specifically measures problems with everyday functions - blood and oxygen getting where they need to go, for one. And even though I’ve had this test, I’ve still been able to dial down my fear over time and my PEM is much less severe than it used to be. Pacing my activity and strategically pushing my body’s limits (easier to do when you dial down fear) have also helped me improve the PEM. It all goes hand in hand.

[@dotot341]

I hesitated to reply to this as I really don't want to get drawn into a debate, as my own mental state isn't the most confident right now (recent reinfection). Thank you for sharing and please please don't take this as an attack on your experience or like I'm trying to invalidate anything you're saying. I just want to post something quickly in case anyone reads the comment above and gets discouraged as comments like these were what sent me into spirals of fear and those deep holes near the beginning of my illness. I would say that fear absolutely can cause PEM a day later. In my experience, my mental state during and after exertion 100% determines the PEM I get. Ive had days where I do a workout and don't get PEM then days where I do the exact same workout and get PEM. We know that mindbody conditions can absolutely cause physiological changes. Look for the inconsistencies, almake an evidence list. Unfortunately I was reinfected with covid recently so taking it easy for now but I had got to the point where I was running 4km again a few times a week, sometimes getting PEM sometimes not. This wasn't through resting this was through doing what I needed to do and not fearing the symptoms. At my worst I was bed bound in an almost vegetative state just staring at the ceiling every day

[@amysin963]

@@dotot341​​⁠I do not want a debate either and I don’t take your comment as an attack in any way. I could never invalidate what you have experienced. Dan asked if there was any known research on this area and I wanted to let him and his viewers know that there was. Also, if I had never gotten that test, I’d never have gotten approved for disability, and being able to breathe and not worry so much about meeting my everyday financial needs definitely helped me dial down stress and fear. The info I shared is not meant to be doomsday or to send anyone into a spiral. I won’t take responsibility for that, because I chose my words carefully and this information could help someone else just like it helped me. I hope you get back to feeling better soon.

[@nestechen]

If you believe you’re sick, you’ll always stay sick. I learned so much from Jesus. He didn’t just heal people, he first asked them "Do you believe I can heal you?” Or "Do you want to get healed?” It all starts with the Belief that we are actually okay. The belief doesn’t have to be big. But we mustn’t doubt. If we doubt, we sink, like Peter did when he doubted Jesus. I think the Bible has so many valuable stories for our lives :)

[@SusieV59]

I totally agree with you. I love Jesus. He taught love and forgiveness. He said that whatever we believe will happen it will be done.

[@SusieV59]

He also said "your faith has made you well".

[@nestechen]

@@SusieV59 Yes ❤️

[@Thankyouinfinite]

By His stripes you are healed.

[@nestechen]

@@Thankyouinfinite I don’t believe in that. Sin can’t be forgiven by killing someone innocent. That doesn’t make sense. Jesus taught only by keeping the commandments you are healthy and have eternal life.

[@user-gp8xc6sx7m]

I had never heard of this. But it is so recognizable. Had this the last 4 days since I had half a day working in the garden. I thought I will get the flu, but now it is over all of a sudden. Aching body and very low mental state. I am glad now to know what this is. Thank you Dan.

[@alyeskakochanek]

Love this video, Dan. Thank you from all of us who experience these symptoms. I have been expanding activity and I just developed a bout of PEM that really scared me, so this video was absolutely perfect. It's all perceived danger and I'm not sick!

[@PainFreeYou]

Exactly

[@JulieTobin-Ruszczyk]

Yes, we are so subject to believing labels. So, " I am well". " I am strong".

[@lenaferra1923]

Thanks so much, this is what I have ❤

[@Sophier1892]

This makes a lot of sense - thank you so much for covering this topic! PEM is the ‘main’ thing left that I’m still experiencing with CFS. Most other things have faded away now. The challenge I’m finding is that it’s kinda a negative feedback loop: I’ve had SO many experiences of severe PEM now, that when I want to do an activity a part of me immediately fears doing it because of the potential for it to cause PEM. But that fear is the thing that actually causes the PEM. Without the fear, it happens a loooot less. It’s such a tricky cycle to break!! It’s not just physical activity that causes it though. Conversations with people do too - BUT only when they include bigger emotions, so I absolutely know that it’s not the talking itself, but my oversensitised brain seeing emotion as unsafe. Same with a whole host of other things. And this has shown me that it’s PDP.

[@Bachconcertos]

I went to the gym came home ate lunch and i got the malaise and fell asleep for 2 1/2 hours and i had a fever when i woke up - so i took a hot Epsom salt bath and the fever went away. I was then able to go out to the grocery but i still had the fatigue when walking

[@carolnascimento7494]

Hello. It makes sense. Wishing everyone well

[@Inge508]

Wishing you well too❤️

[@marieleak8731]

♥♥

[@Lenneke8422]

And you ty 😘❤️🌷

[@ashleyg.76]

My comment a few days ago was about this type of thing. Thanks for making a longer video about it. I've been reading the comments and so many people can relate to what you're saying. It truly is about gently nudging our brains to believe we are OK, isn't it? I've been reading Neville Goddard and studying the law of assumption for a while. A lot of what you're saying makes sense from that perspective as well. In that paradigm, people even heal from verified medical issues by adopting the belief that they are awareness/consciousness, that imagination is primary reality, and that they do have the power to choose something different. It just takes a lot of bravery and persistence, but I've seen many people heal. I've set a personal goal to do one "new" thing each day. It doesn't have to be anything crazy, just something I don't normally do or going someplace I haven't been in a long time. Yesterday, I got a manicure and pedicure for the first time in years! Today, I am going to the gym . I'm teaching my brain that we are safe and we're not waiting around ot live life anymore!

[@eleanor543]

I was thinking about this myself as I've just gone back to the gym after 3 months of inactivity plus socialising a bit more. Everything you said resonated with me..spot on information ❤

[@suerichardson8990]

This couldn’t have been a timelier message! After finely getting healing from Rheumatoid Arthritis, neck pain and spine pain; I have now developed PEM. I had chronic fatigue for a year where I barely left the bed and I have been “afraid” that it is coming back. Thank you for the message Dan. I believe that my body has gotten so deconditioned at 64 after years of being sedentary and/or bed bound, that it’s going to take some time to adjust to my new daily exercise routine. I want to think I can just be in shape and active like I was at 61 when I got “ill”. I’m going to tell my brain it’s okay and be more patient with myself. Thank you for all you have done for me in my healing journey!!

[@kristykoster3367]

I like the point he makes about doing an activity you enjoy and the absence of PEM vs. something you dread doing and can cause PEM. I struggle with compulsive exercise, a lingering effect from an eating disorder which began at age 14. When I engage in this type of exercise, I am always anxious, frustrated with my body, and it feels like a punishment. My chronic pain started after a major surgery that was extremely physically/psychologically traumatic for me because it took all control I had over my body away. Now if I engage in compulsive exercise, I have a major pain flare. I'm just now realizing that I have to let go of control, let go of exercise as punishment in order to heal.

[@belayanoch]

I have the exact same experience. ED at 14, compulsive exercise as a punishment and symptoms flare up as a result. No flare ups when I exercise in a relaxed and mindful way/not compulsively. Letting go of control is key. I wish I remembered that on a minute to minute basis. Thanks for the reminder🙏🪷🙏

[@denisemarie5394]

Agree with your assessment (in the absence of a medical condition that may be causing it). I tell myself (brain), "I know you're tired and want to stop. We're not doing too much. Tired does not equal pain. Tired is just tired and you can handle it and will take a break at an appropriate time." We don't need to be energizer bunnies to prove the point. Especially if you're 68 😁

[@mamacraw4d]

I had never heard this term, but that was exactly my experience before I discovered TMS and began healing. I spent years doing the bare minimum activity because the pain and fatigue for the simplest things was so outrageous.

[@matthewdemitroff7279]

thanks Dan...this is spot on and i will likely reference this video a lot in my journey moving forward : )

[@LilyOscar333]

Morning Dan yes my understanding is that if you start exercising to get fit .. ie go to the gym, walk or run more etc. is using your muscle more to strengthen them. Within the next 24/48 hours you can get what my physio calls DOMS , Delayed Onset Muscle Soreness. It goes away and muscles will get used to doing more.. so nothing to be scared of. Brain saying your muscles need a rest..thats my take. Dan more or less the same that you are saying.. take it easy but don’t stop moving and living life. I have some muscle soreness today after weekend trekking a bit further than usual. My friend Orla walked 30k in Saturday, much longer than she is used to (10k) and has sore muscles in legs and glutes.. which she knows is normal.. take Dan’s advice and don’t be scared 😱 ❤❤❤❤

[@SusieV59]

So true Lily. The work I did created so many sore muscles, and I use to keep working and eventually the pain left. I am finding it harder now I am older, but easy does it and it works in the same way, I just do it a bit slower.

[@LilyOscar333]

@@SusieV59 ❤️💕🌺

[@Freespirit038]

This is so true! I’ve been telling myself I have PEM as I have been diagnosed with long Covid, but if you don’t do much exercise, when you do it, you’ll get tired! And the fact is, when I did exercise before, I would often get DOMS a day or two after. Same thing.

[@Hinz2005]

I’ve never heard of this!

[@steviemc7794]

Thanks Dan!

[@meganobrien1019]

❤❤❤❤ and they tell you the "spoon theory" or "battery theory " which just escalates the overthinking, worry and fear 😅🙉🙉 currently still working thru all this, trying to undo those terribly unhelpful teacings, reteach my brain 🙏❤️

[@luiscrespo9902]

Thanks for this, Dan!

[@lesleymansell7519]

Dr Myhill explains it in her book. People with M.E/CFS and experience PEM often have a mitochondrial problem as well as other things. Also it takes much longer to make the ATP to replenish the energy used in people with CFS, that is why it takes time to recover. So it is a physical body thing but it’s still a dysfunction of the nervous system which needs to be calmed down so your rules still apply I think and calming the nervous system should allow the body to function more normally again. To me it doesn’t matter if I do something I enjoy or not, results are the same. Working on your/Dr Sarno's theory because I believe in it

[@cb77153]

I’m trying and hope this helps, no harm in trying. Watching your quick start videos. I could be wrong, but this only appears to be a small piece of the puzzle according to recovery advice from the FLCCC for those with fatigue and PEM related to Long Haul Covid Syndrome.

[@PainFreeYou]

We have Long Covid successes. Scroll through to find them. PainFreeYouSuccess.com

[@elaineevans2712]

I have been full on doing things, and I think we have to accept that we will ache . I've been doing stuff for the first time in years. I tell myself it's good ache as I'm using my body again. I'm experienced a few extra symptoms because my stupid brain is worried about a long trop to grandchild and long days out. I'm glad you put this on today as it makes it so much clearer. I know my brain is doing it.

[@Thebetterkeepsgettingbetter]

Lol I just finished 3 days of heavy duty yard work. Was I tired afterwards? Heck yeah! Got in the jacuzzi, stretched some achey muscles and went to bed happy. Feeling good today...thx..love how your vids just hit the target 🎉❤

[@Ali-sl1sx]

That is not PEM.

[@kathystoner5239]

Great video! I totally agree! Follwimg this approach ive seen huge improvement! Im now going to the gym and doing tahitian dance and actually have energy afterwards

[@Montyofkittentopia]

Thanks for this video. This is something that has been challenging for me even as other symptoms have vanished. I do t consciously fear movement but sometimes have pain disproportionate to my exertion afterwards. It’s PDP, I’m sure of it. Darn unconscious!

[@genevievebaril4746]

Hey Dan. Huge fan of your work here. I’m a lot better since starting TMS work6 months ago. Not 100% just yet. But. I have a counter argument to PEM some proponents would debate and I’d like your take on it. I’m a MD and have done mbs courses, so don’t think I’m against you theory. But some peeps would argue that there actually is a muscle necrosis on muscle biopsy in people with pem. And also lower oxygen levels, mitochondria issues and lower oxygen intake peripherically. I have a theory that explained all of this, but it makes it harder to argue doctors with this theory. Your take please?

[@mirjam3169]

Can you share this theory? I am very curious.

[@PainFreeYou]

I'm basing my opinion on seeing people end what is described as PEM with the concepts I teach. Thus, PEM is a perceived danger response. The key question is whether or not the changes you note are the CAUSE of the PEM or the result of a fearful, overprotective brain. I don't have an answer to this question. Bottom line, my approach has no downside and only benefit. Let's say you are correct and the necrosis is there, what is the solution from the medical world?

[@zeusthegreek4664]

Great video and timing

[@1STBUCKLEY]

Found myself telling myself "I'm unfit" . It's a real effort to do another length of the park field. Even attending a social event does the same. I need PDP tattooed on my wrist🤔

[@user-zs1ew8mo3p]

Hi Dan, I hope you're doing well! I've got a question about changing a level of pain when on vacation or in another location. I would be grateful if you could point me to the right direction. For the last year I observed that when I'm away from home in some different country, doesn't matter if on vacation or working remotely, my pains very significantly lower or even disappear for the whole period. But as soon as I'm back home, it gradually returns within a few days. While being at home or in a different country, I have pretty the same level of physical activities and stress. Do you think it's just a conditioned response? It's as if the brain considers being at home dangerous. But consciously I'm not aware about any "dangers" here.

[@1STBUCKLEY]

Also known as an Adrenaline Dump. 💤💤

[@rachelk5272]

Fatigue/energy are determined by the brain. What they r trying to describe with PEM is a real thing but people get really fixated and scared of PEM and that is where the problems roll in. I think this constant reminder of the symptoms are caused by the brain perceiving danger is necessary bc for some reason we have a hard time holding onto that thought

[@dougivey7209]

Very interesting…

[@PainFreeYou]

Glad you think so!

[@stacymeyers8821]

Tysm Dan for touching on this. I'm one of your listeners that has struggled with fatigue for many years. I have been a massage therapist my whole adult life, part of what sent me to crash (abusing my body in earlier years) I've been doing recovery for a year. Doing massage is what crashes me. So I've been wondering (I know anything is possible) but how I can train my brain that doing massage is ok, safe. Because I've tried and it doesn't seem to be getting the message yet. It's hard to remember a time when doing massage didn't fatigue me. I stopped for 6 weeks and gradually went back. I haven't progressed in increasing yet.

[@neo23hun15]

Can this be during(!) the activity (like sitting) after a while also?

[@PainFreeYou]

Yes, perceived danger can occur any time.

[@oasisenterprises5780]

Sir can in avascular necrosis ,can this tms applies Because in avn ,there is necrosis of hip joint Can avn pain be eliminated completely

[@tina_820]

Boom

[@UltimateJoke]

Hi Dan, can you talk about RLS(Restless Legs Syndrom)? I get it if i drink caffein. Do you think it is PDP too?

[@sherylmarshall1444]

Maybe but magnesium before bed may help too I take 120mg or use the spray. I whole heartedly believe in pdp but also a proponent of good nutrition and most diets aren’t high enough in certain nutrients especially magnesium not to mention stress causes greater nutritional needs.

[@UltimateJoke]

​@@sherylmarshall1444Agree! I take magnesium too. Yet even one cup of coffee morning give me RLS at night and I love coffee😢

[@JochenBilderbeek]

Sounds like a conditioned response to me. Coffee doesn't give symptoms.

[@susan174]

Yes and no.

[@CruisingWithElena]

Agree

[@cassieopia532]

What are your thoughts on mold exposure?

[@Alguien0101]

Hi Dan! I'm going through a bad flu and I was wondering, which tools/mindset that apply for PDP could work in this case?

[@sherylmarshall1444]

Telling your brain you are safe your body can fight the infection, relaxation along with lots of rest, fluids, some garlic , ginger, echinacea, zinc, vitamin D, C and time. When you are well make sure you have a good diet.

[@gshep3151]

Hi Dan, would you say that AFIB is caused from PDP? I was working in the yard and I felt really out of breath and tired, my heart was out of rhythm so I had to stop and rest.

[@sherylmarshall1444]

Unsure but unless you are already under a doctors care with it go to gp or hospital to get checked. I assume your body is stressed so using methods of calming would defo be helpful. Take care.

[@lukebighair]

Phone is ringing. I think it's Dr Google

[@booya5584]

it can happen after sex too, just sayin....I think it was Jamie Foxx did a bit, how his legs gave out after sex and he would just conk out asleep, but his wife was ready to paint the whole house.

[@kristykoster3367]

There's a very real physiological phenomenon that happens to men after sex, but it doesn't appear to be a negative experience. More of a content, total relaxation, happy form of sleepiness. I can't speak for all women, but I have the opposite experience, I'm ready to run a marathon lol. I feel totally content and relaxed, but have a burst of energy.

[@eviemorgs]

I am inherently safe and okay 🩷🩷 your only infection is fear