Practical Penmanship: Fundamentals | Grip, Posture, Muscular Movement

[@richardteale3217]

Hello there young man and thanks for the very informative video. I am a seventy year old carpenter and four years ago I had an accident on a machine and lost the top half of my (right) index finger as a result. This has affected my handwriting more than anything else . I am a bit old school and appreciate good handwriting especially on the rare occasion that I receive a hand written note or Letter. I am presently trying to get back to a good standard and just your knowledge and obvious enthusiasm has spurred me on . I am in awe of the fact that you can also write so well left handed……amazing!! Regards from Yorkshire England. ✌️😊

[@DieyenDualPen]

Thanks for the note. I'm so happy you've found some value in the video. Best of luck on handwriting journey!

[@s.j4606]

Thanks for sharing. It's the best teaching of the essentials in palmer cursive.

[@DieyenDualPen]

My pleasure! Im glad you've found it helpful.

[@taiwilkin-corraggio1446]

I've been trying to figure out the muscular movement for ages. As soon as I tried turning my knuckles upward like you suggested, I started feeling the tiredness in my shoulder and back instead of my fingers! Wow!

[@DieyenDualPen]

That's awesome! Yeah all the old text recommend you do it that way. My knuckles will sometimes drift to the side but now the arm is more dominant in writing so it doesn't effect the writing. Once you've established the arm writing as the habit, finger movement can be introduced to a minute degree for finesse.

[@gpamanuel9798]

Thank you so much for taking the time to demonstrate the correct ways of penmanship writing. In a age of instant where everything is done now, I subscribe to the age of learning and enjoyment. Thanks for revisiting the fundamentals of penmanship.

[@DieyenDualPen]

It is my absolute pleasure! Makes me very happy to know you've enjoyed and appreciate the content :)

[@marinechapssemperfiout9939]

Truly a humble young man. It sounds as though you have a wonderful testimony! Stay the course! Semper Fi

[@JD.Giantulisan]

Sebuah informasi yang sangat mengedukasi, jadi semakin faham tentang dasar dasar dalam teknik menulis dengan tangan

[@rickalexander2801]

Very much enjoy your videos. You have a polished presentation and a pleasant voice. Keep up the good work and I hope to improve my penmanship. I'm taking a stab at Spencerian writing.

[@DieyenDualPen]

Hello Rich, Thank you for the kinds words. All the best on your journey through Spencerian. American penmanship and movement writing is an absolute joy of a practice.

[@calanm7880]

Thank you thank you thank you! I can't tell you how helpful this is - been working from PDFs of classic penmanship, but being able to SEE IT demonstrated and your tips to look out for - this is flippin gold, seriously! 😀 Only yourself and one or two other channels have this kind of content which is clearly described and demonstrated- plus the explanations WHY you do it this way, which feeds the mind and the reason and thus reinforces your lessons further. Plus the "common feeling" that it's stuff you've worked on - such an encouragement. I'm particularly struck by the rhythm of your penmanship, which I read recently was a big deal in getting into a good "groove" of movement ..... Please continue to share if you are able, although I respect you may be working on plenty other things... your modern experience and excellent demonstration style are such help. Would you do something on letter formation (I love your uppercase P 😋)?

[@Batflix-66]

19 may is going to be my exam....i am a English literature student...my each exam is 4 hours ...as a cursive writer your video got me back from coma .....tnx a lot

[@DieyenDualPen]

Wow. That's crazy. Best wishes on your recovery. Honor to help.

[@HumanStealth]

This was unbelievably helpful. I never understood what it meant to write with your arm and not your wrist or fingers. Also that inking montage was 🔥🔥🔥

[@DieyenDualPen]

Thanks! Glad it helped.

[@amandacroft1701]

Thank you for your advice. I am going to practice arm writing more. I broke my wrist as a kid and everytime I write I have pain and fatigue. I do not know how often and how long I should practice though. Also, I write in half print and half cursive. I would love to just write in cursive. Thanks again and take care.

[@DieyenDualPen]

20 minutes a day of consistent practice will get you there. Any more than that will expedite progress but the daily practice is really a must to see a change in writing and feel.

[@jnordfors]

I teach 4th grade and even though cursive handwriting is not officially in the curriculum I teach it anyway. Yeah, I’m a rebel! I love to write longhand. There is so much research about how it develops important pathways in the brain and writing information and taking notes by hand help solidify your learning more than typing it on a device. Your writing is beautiful and I loved your explanation for body posture and pen grip. I’ve been told by occupational therapists in our school that pen grip is almost impossible to change after third grade. I’m not letting that deter me. What advice do you have for people like me, teaching kids to write? I like to make it fun, so their favorite practice is copying jokes or poetry. Thank you for sharing your brilliant video.

[@DieyenDualPen]

I changed my writing grip at the age of 22. It's difficult but not impossible. I dont have much experience teaching kids I've taught adults mostly but one thing I would try is introducing it more like an exercise akin to yoga. Im not sure if you've seen my other videos but I mainly taught ambidextrous penmanship. So, the students would learn right handed to write normally and left handed in mirror image penmanship. At the beginner level we approach the drills like a yoga. For example, we would do the letter L lowercase loops, do a set across the page right handed in the normal direction. Then, flipping our form completely we'd do the same exercise backwards across the page left handed. Another way to implement this is through ambidextrous coloring. I have some coloring pages that are mirrored and you can color one side right handed and the other left handed. The point of the exercise is learning through observation. The dominant hand will always be more proficient, so, by observing closely how does our dominant hand write, how does it hold the pen, where does the arm rest, what part of the hand moves, the fingers? Or wrist? How is the non-dominant hand assisting? Then applying what your learning to the other hand. There is a phenomenon known as intermanual transfer of skill learning where it has been found when you train the non-dominant hand the dominant hand can improve more quickly. I know its unorthodox advice but I hope it's helpful. Best of luck! There's also the American Cursive handbook by Master Penman Michael Sull. They have a more traditional approach for teaching cursive and have a certification course for teachers.

[@luismarrafon1]

Thank you! This helped me a lot.

[@janehumphreys402]

Thank you so much! What a valuable and articulate lesson!!!

[@DieyenDualPen]

Thank you!

[@marinechapssemperfiout9939]

Not bad at all! Keep on teaching brother! Semper Fi

[@BeingReal1]

Goodness! This has been so helpful. I have been writing with my hand only. The tips about muscular movement and using the whole arm and shoulder. My grip was always the tripod grip, but I don’t know what happened…one day I suddenly couldn’t do the tripod grip. It was as if I had suddenly lost my hand brain connection. I knew in my head how to form the letters like I always had, but just couldn’t. My hand wouldn’t do what my brain was telling it to do. I have been struggling to get back my pen grip, and sometimes I slip in and out of it. My thumb tends to collapse inwards. Has anyone else experienced this?

[@meerufn4310]

hey, not exactly in handwriting, but I was pretty good cricket bowler, and one day I forgot how to bowl a delivery I liked, i regained it through tons and tons of practice, hope this helps

[@DieyenDualPen]

Wow I've not come across this before. You want to incorporate more exercise to regain the dexterity. Picking marbles, shaking and throwing dice, anything that involves some form of hand dexterity and build up in complexity. You can get really creative, throwing darts, sewing, ukulele, etc. I would also try things with both hands and see if that helps regain control more quickly. Wishing you the best.

[@BeingReal1]

@@DieyenDualPen many thanks for those ideas to regain my dexterity and strength back into my hand, especially my weak thumb that 'collapses' inward and thus, changes my usual pen grip/hold.

[@DieyenDualPen]

I would also suggest, when writing to be aware of how tightly you hold the pen. You dont need to squeeze the pen, your grip should be just firm enough to hold it in place. If you notice your nails turn white from pressure your holding the pen too tightly.

[@seowoo1228]

thank you so much. I am currently trying to learn muscular movement and this video helped me so much!

[@DieyenDualPen]

Thank you so much for your feedback! I'm glad the video helps :) Are you right or left handed?

[@stocks4bt]

What tips do you have to help me relax. I am an "intense" person by nature and it clearly shows in my handwriting. I like my speed but it's legibility, relaxation in my arm, hand make it very hard to read my own handwriting. It's as if something else is controlling my hand when I write. Basically I will write and them start making circular scribbles to relax then start writing again.

[@DieyenDualPen]

Hmm, I do practice some breathing techniques that I use to relax. I have a free download to the first three chapters of my book on my website, the breathing practice is described there. Relaxing can be hard but one point I focus on is my jaw and tongue. I regularly check on that and relax that area if it's tense. Hard to assist any further in a comment. Best of luck.

[@stocks4bt]

@@DieyenDualPen where can your book be downloaded

[@DieyenDualPen]

@@stocks4bt This can be found in the description of the video: "Get the first 3 Chapters of Creative Brain Training for Free at: goo.gl/YPNSGC"

[@StarKnightZ]

Have you done a video on how to flex with a flex nib with the whole arm method of writing? I'm struggling to vary the pressure to achieve fine lines after flexing. I'm also not sure where the force to flex the nib and then unflex it should come from.

[@DieyenDualPen]

I have not. Are you straight hold or oblique?

[@StarKnightZ]

​@@DieyenDualPenI'm a left-handed underwriter. I'm not using an oblique holder. I've actually just ordered a vintage flex fountain pen so I'm hoping to use that! 😁

[@DieyenDualPen]

What style of writing are you trying to replicate?

[@StarKnightZ]

@@DieyenDualPen I'm wanting to add flex to the downstrokes in my standard writing style. That's British upright joined up writing (cursive). I'm fairly certain it was created with line variation in mind because of how the letters are supposed to loop and how older writing samples look, although we weren't taught line variation in school. I can arm write and have built up some muscle memory but I don't know the correct body mechanics for varying downward pressure to get fat downstrokes and crisp upstrokes.

[@lojaen4life]

Hii, I'm very new to writing and stuff, I'm just learning cursive today and i decided to learn the correct way to hold the pen, posture, etc.. I'm wondering, if i continue to do these exercises would i be able to do finer details without moving my wrist and moving my forearm instead? For example, curves, small circles, etc. or is it okay to move the wrist? 😅

[@DieyenDualPen]

You can write using whatever kind of movement works for you

[@lojaen4life]

@@DieyenDualPen i see, thank you! 💗

[@tomgoggin3865]

That is a great video! Well done.

[@DieyenDualPen]

Thank you!

[@painpeace3619]

6:51 you are talking about arm placement for a single paper, but if i use a notebook , then it will be difficult to change the paper position. What do you think about it.

[@DieyenDualPen]

I try not to write in notebooks when I'm writing "this way" but you can put a book under you arm to create an equal platform with the notebook.

[@JJToyo]

Hi Dieyen - Thank you very much for these. Could you tell me what pen this is, nib size, paper and ink?

[@DieyenDualPen]

It's an extra fine pilot falcon. The ink I believe is smoky quartz by pelican.

[@JJToyo]

@@DieyenDualPen thank you. Please share the paper, everything works together so beautifully - I must get this combination of pen, ink and paper.

[@DieyenDualPen]

Velum grid paper I think

[@emmaponymous]

This is fantastic! Thank you!

[@DieyenDualPen]

You're welcome!

[@jerrywebster7678]

Anyone else having trouble executing the ovals with shaky erratic forms? I'm doing my best to keep up with about 160 bpm, but they look like wobbly eggs to me with no consistent slatings.

[@radshet3830]

Ive bee wanting to use whole arm writing spencerian. As a lefty it’s natural. But for creating a flexy downstroke like a t or d miniscule, do you add pressure w index finger or use a fast stroke? Not sure the rhythm?

[@DieyenDualPen]

I've seen done quickly. Not sure how to approach it left handed though.

[@marinechapssemperfiout9939]

Outstanding!

[@DieyenDualPen]

Thanks!

[@PriveGitaarles]

this is really interesting, subscribed!

[@DieyenDualPen]

Thanks, best of luck on your penmanship practice!

Many thanks for this video! Super awesome

[@DieyenDualPen]

It's my pleasure!

[@claudiacanales2662]

What a cool video! thanks for sharing!

[@DieyenDualPen]

My pleasure!

[@bmxt939]

Weirdly enough I only found out, that I write the wrong unergonomic way, when I started writing with my left hand. Thanks for clarifying important details.

[@DieyenDualPen]

I had the same experience. Left hand writing totally changed how I write right-handed.

[@duyngo3777]

This's a really good videos. Thanks alot. And by the way, which one is better for writing penmanship? The lamy2000 Fine nib or the pilot falcon with soft extra fine? I'm gonna get one but it's hard to choise. Thanks again ^^

[@DieyenDualPen]

Thank you! I personally use the lamy 2k far more often in my day to day. Its smooth reliable and holds way more ink. I use the extra fine falcon for practicing because the fine point makes mistakes more obvious. But I run out of ink quickly and I don't really like the extra fine point for casual writing or printing (if I must) I would recommend the L2k as the best all around pen. Super smooth, great ink capacity, sleek understated design. You'll be very happy with that pen.

[@duyngo3777]

Dieyen DualPen thanks you so much. And 1 more thing, should i get a lamy 2000 in extra fine or fine nib?

[@DieyenDualPen]

Duy Ngo mine is a fine, I've never tried the extra fine. But I'm sure you'd have a smooth experience with either

[@duyngo3777]

Thanks you alot ^^ i really love the falcon's fine line. But maybe i will buy a lamy 2000 for daily writing. Hope that extra fine's fine line is not too fat ^^. Many thanks. Love to watch your beautiful handwriting.

[@DieyenDualPen]

Duy Ngo thanks let me know what pen you get I would love to see a writing sample

[@stargazer1359]

I'm in my 50's and this brings me back to elementary school....Good advice for folks that need help....Not myself, just enjoy handwriting channels...

[@DieyenDualPen]

Thank you. Glad you enjoy it

[@freshprince512]

Excellent video!

[@DieyenDualPen]

Thank you!

[@falafelfajt]

Another great vid! One question, when for example writing on A5 size, like a notebook, do you still use the big muscles or do you change up and use finger movements?

[@DieyenDualPen]

Thank you! I still use whole arm writing. For me it's become rather intuitive at this point so it's the primary movement in my writing. However, once you've established that movement in your writing you can allow for some slight finger and wrist movement for a combo of all three movements (I talk about this combo movement in other videos). The problem most people have is they plant their palm and write solely using finger movement when your primary movement should be coming from the arm. So in the beginning you should try to isolate the muscular movement through the drills shown here till that movement is a habit.

[@greyareaRK1]

Precisely the same motor skills and similar exercises as drawing.

[@DieyenDualPen]

John Matthias working on my handwriting, form, posture, and grip had definitely improved my drawing as well

[@stevengarcia8428]

This video is very helpful to develop great hand writing! Thank you!

[@DieyenDualPen]

That's fantastic! Thanks so much for telling me! Best of luck to you!

[@FluentInMuse]

I have a serious question... were you and your siblings homeschooled by any chance? My siblings and I were, and we all learned cursive handwriting and took typing classes. In my experience, most people I've met who were taught writing basics in a homeschool environment utilized muscular movement writing techniques and had the most beautiful and unique handwriting. Thank you for this video!!

[@DieyenDualPen]

Hello, no we weren't. I learned cursive early in kindergarten but didn't explore muscular movement till I was in my 20s. Your welcome thanks for watching.

[@LecherousCthulhu]

Honestly never thought something like this existed and I really thought it didn't. Instant subscribe to improve my hand writing from the level of a cereal killer lol

[@DieyenDualPen]

Best of luck, it's an interesting journey with more to gain than nice handwriting :)

[@gormiksoc]

What graph paper do you use ? I just bought a French ruled one and was also thinking of buying graph paper with 4 squares per inch, is that what you use ?

[@dridrops]

I haven't used that paper in a couple years but I believe is is an 8x8 per inch.

[@maurolimaok]

Very nice video!

[@DieyenDualPen]

Thank you!

[@J.Leistikow]

Hey, great video. I‘m still on the beginner side wanting to learn spencerian. I do carolingian minuscle for years and I thought it would be an easier step towards better handwriting. Well, guess it‘s not. I‘m now trying to write with my arm as you told. But I have to say it‘s not that consistent as well as it isn‘t fine compared to wrist writing. Anyway I have to get the writing done first then refine the principles and after that I will go forward to writing minor letters. Keep it up pal. Greetings from germany!

[@DieyenDualPen]

Thanks. I'm not familiar with what carolingian minuscules are, I'll have to look that up. As far as the ambidextrous mirror writing goes I would recommend starting now. Practicing the opposite hand will accelerate your progress with the dominant hand. Good luck in your practice.

[@J.Leistikow]

dieyen DualPen hey mate. Carolingian minuscle was one of the first more simpler font ever created in latin alphabets. Before that there was the roman capitalis with major letters (eg. ROMANVM) Charles the great or charlemagne standardized letters so everyone could read the others script. Before that writings varied from region to region. All the old manuscripts of the early middle ages 9-11th century was mostly written in this minuscle. Yeah I‘m training with both hands, not only writing but more than less everything. Button up your sark, brushing your teeth. Today my noodlers ahab arrived so I can practice when I am on the way. I tested it for a few strokes and I have to admit a classic penholder is way superior. But at that price range it‘s okay I guess. There aren‘t really that much fountain pens with flexible nibs in europe. Most of them are imported from the us. The next few days/ weeks I will spend watching your videos and practicing my arm writing. Love how your videos are structured. Have a good rest of the week. Greetings!

[@DieyenDualPen]

Oh that's very interesting! Thanks for sharing. Are there any exemplars you'd recommend for Carolingian? Thank you for the compliment I really hope that they're helpful. Feel free to join the discord group and share some writing samples. All the best.

[@J.Leistikow]

dieyen DualPen it would be nice to get the discord informations so I can join.

[@DieyenDualPen]

Here is the link: discord.gg/49EnMh

[@soumyamajumder3444]

How whole arm writing differs with finger writing..!!??

[@DieyenDualPen]

Very much so. But once whole arm or muscular movement is attained and dominant finger movement can be reintroduced for finesse.

[@masgrimes]

Good stuff, Brother.

[@DieyenDualPen]

Thank you so much! 🙏🙏

[@satsuko444]

In this video, I noticed that the sense of distance was bad. .. Thank you for sharing. Dieyan✨🙏

[@JJScene]

Thanks for the info. How often do you suggest we do the drills? An hour a day? My handwriting is really, really bad. So using my whole arm to write will definitely be much worse. I'm just wondering how long it'll take until I can have decent handwriting.

[@DieyenDualPen]

An hour a day is plenty. If you can download the Palmer method book and read its directions carefully and often. You want to ensure your practicing in a correct way or else it will be harder to break any poor habits you develop. I still warm up with basic drills today at the beginning of every writing session.

[@shlomotaitz3373]

Thanks so much!

[@maurolimaok]

I'm strugling with the exercises in the Spencerian kit I bought at Amazon, in the matter of whole arm vs hand movements! Your videos will help a lot.

[@DieyenDualPen]

I'm happy to hear that you've found them helpful. Stick with it and be patient! Best of luck.

[@Jusangen]

Same man, not very easy to pick up. The book should include a QR code to this video!

[@dpkchohan]

Hi Deyen... Thanks man I have been searching for a long time for some help about improving my handwriting... Finally found you... My problem is writing speed and quality of writing for long hours of writing... I have a exam coming up I will need to write for 6 hours straight.. However I do not have such experience and my small letters are not always of same size.. I have learned the 3 point hold but still working on consistensy... Please help

[@DieyenDualPen]

Hello, I have made many videos that can help you improve your handwriting. Also I do a livestream practice session monday through friday from 7-8 a.m. P.S.T. For long sessions of writing I highly recommend you learn how incorporate whole arm movement into your writing. This style also uses a lot of muscle memory which will help with consistency. My practical penmanship series should help you. Be patient, this is not a skill gained over night. Good luck!

[@ubeymarmondragon6433]

Great video, thank you very much. Could you make another video explaining in more detail how the contact or support of the little finger and ring finger is made on the paper? It would be very important for me to see from different angles how these fingers rest on the paper.

[@susancruz729]

God bless you!

[@DieyenDualPen]

God bless you 😊

[@calibansfury]

I like that pen, anyone know what it is?

[@DieyenDualPen]

The red one? It's a Pilot Falcon EF

[@painpeace3619]

Good video

[@DieyenDualPen]

Thanks!

[@edoupdates9935]

Your the best

[@DieyenDualPen]

You're the best

[@anniekalusa8481]

My name is Annie l had an injury that made me lose my motor skills. I found your videos very helpful and l would like to continue learning from you.

[@DieyenDualPen]

Hello Annie, I'm very happy to hear that you've found my videos helpful. I hope that you may continue to progress on your journey in handwriting. Best of luck!

[@nguyennguyentranmainguyen6466]

Do you think practicing 15 minutes a day is enough? I don't have much time. :(

[@DieyenDualPen]

Absolutely, as long you practice every day in the correct way. You dont want to build bad habits in your practice.

[@wizardofb9434]

Great. A real Genius.

[@DieyenDualPen]

Ha, I wish.

[@abhiseksarkar9531]

I’m still struggling with the grip.😣

[@kpurpose1078]

Good video ✍🏽

[@DieyenDualPen]

Thank you!

[@charliewhitcroft8000]

I’d chooch down with you, dude. Stay turnt up, guy

[@DieyenDualPen]

I don't know what that means but i'm getting a friendly energy :)

[@charliewhitcroft8000]

The more medicated the more dedicated. Great penmanship. I like Palmer’s;)

[@DieyenDualPen]

Thank you sir! I love the Palmer style as well. Such elegant simplicity

[@F66-h5k]

you totally look like the night stalker

[@DieyenDualPen]

Lol

[@brianexplores285]

I think I may love you.

[@ared18t]

If you want to cross your feet your chair is to high

[@DieyenDualPen]

Interesting, I've never heard that before. Chair low or high I've always had a habit to do so.

[@DevSingh-zv4pl]

Bro you are Christian bale 😎

[@DieyenDualPen]

Lol