Final Fantasy 16 - Why It Isn't a 10/10 Game

Mike has now played the game for around 40 hours, and while it has provided some INCREDIBLE story experiences, the most bombastic boss fights you could imagine, and one of the best romances ever in a game. It does also now show some glaring flaws, likely in service to the legacy of the FF franchise
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Displate: displate.com/preachgaming?art...
Gear: preachgaming.com/shop/
Twitter: @Preachgaming
Live Stream - twitch.tv/preachlfw
Website: preachgaming.com/
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00:00 - Intro
00:23 - 40 hours in
01:00 - Story & A Great Romance
03:22 - Combat & Gameplay
05:54 - The Bad: Gearing & Crafting
11:05 - Bounties/Hunts
14:19 - Renown
15:26 - Side Quests
17:23 - Music Collection
18:46 - Summary

[@Preachgaming]

Hey folks, apologies for some small audio issues - we have some gremlins in the mic/mixer setup somewhere, I'm doing my best to nail it down asap. As before I have done my utmost to keep this spoiler free but with something to watch, so I've stuck mostly to demo content, stuff that's already been part of marketing like the Titan fight and the S Rank hunt, or stuff that isn't story relevant like combat gameplay. Mike has now finished the game as of this video going up, so next week you can expect his final full review, and then a nice and in depth spoiler discussion. Plus maybe another video dissecting Clive and Jill's relationship since we think its worth talking about, so look forward to that.

[@EpicKillstreak]

Definitely would like to see that Clive & Jill video : 3

[@Niikkos]

Hey man it happens, just like FF16, your videos can't all be 10/10 either.

[@tbone007]

I'm not even that new game plus and I've got ten most of the music tracks just by selling unwanted crafting materials

[@stephentrader9142]

Havent finished game yet and while some side quest had nice world building I wish they had secret eikons with new moves. Also the stronger optional bosses and mini games. Story, music, battle system, and graphics I loved.

[@Blackwing02]

You had me concerned about my headphones for a minute >XD

[@nolson946]

I will say with the music, I left the 35% extra gil accessory on for a long time by mistake, and by the end I had so much Gil I didn't know what to do with it. I literally bought all the songs and still had over 100K gil left. I noticed the music cost was a lot at the beginning, but for me it ended up not being a problem.

[@leserbeacerbe6910]

Where to buy boss battle theme?

[@eredkaiser]

I kept the gil and exp boost on the entire game. It gets fun when you are spending 80k for accessories.

[@Maraaass]

Yeah. Pretty much only spend gil on songs and accessories (3 ring slots) as they are only thing that gets expensive. Some of those accessories get very expensive later on. I equipped the extra gil accessory later on in the game for some time, and rather luckily because after I finished the game I had to sell few things in order to get some accessories I may use/enhance in ng+. Extra gil ring is nice but the extra exp is definitely a must if you plan on doing FF mode in ng+. Also the extra ap points is useful too (there is a trophy to max out all abilities).

[@eredkaiser]

@End7essness the completionist in me made me reload my clear data after seeing the accessory upgrades and go buy all the ones I skipped over previously.

[@ExadraLP]

While I totally agree that the gear progression is fucked, I think the sidequests rewards are just designed around being done immediately as soon as they're unlocked. In the example you used in the video of Excalibur, I'm guessing you just did the sidequest way late, as I think I got like 6-8 hours of play on Excalibur before upgrading from it just because I did the sidequest that gives it to you right when it unlocks

[@thatonegeeksite5251]

Yeah I made it a habit of just doing every side quest and hunt as soon as they popped up. Definitely could see the rewards not being worthwhile if you’re just plowing through the main story.

[@KGLordofhollows]

There is a huge pacing issue with what you just described though. When the main story quest is something along the lines of "our friend X is in this place and they are in trouble, we need to get to them immediately" or "we need to get here because this is where our enemy Y is currently staying", I as a player don't want to ruin my immersion so naturally I will go do this "urgent" task. But the game will give you these kind of story quests and unlock 5-10 side quests at the same time that will be "get ingredients for a new dish", "collect dirt samples", "help children fix a scale". And as the game progresses and everyone understands who Clive is and what his mission entails, I think it ruins both immersion and all the quest givers as people, when they ask their active leader, Cid 2.0, who has to fight literal monsters and gods, to go do the most mundane of tasks that everyone else could do for them or do themselves. It's terribly constructed.

[@aytony4090]

@saitoge The only time it really felt awkward was when Jill just got captured and you return to your base and find 4 quests to do. That was the only time I felt taken out of the narrative because why the hell wouldn't they just save them until after you get back with Jill? Definitely an area taken directly from FF14 that should have been thought out more.

[@KGLordofhollows]

@@aytony4090 Remember the time Mid was in Kanver and the city is under attack? The main quest says "the city guard won't last, we need to get there through Tabol asap" and boom 6 more side quests.

[@dayaralattar54]

I honestly feel so bad for the side quests. I think they are great and the world building in them is fantastic. The only problem for me is that they appear in bunches usually of 3 or more after a big scene in the MSQ. So i see them and while i really like sidequests, i just wanna find out what happens next in the story.

[@aslanameret]

Very good point and very much how I felt.

[@gearhead417]

This is a valid point that I can concede. I want to know what happens next and it never feels like there is a good point to just go do side quests because everything seems important.

[@JJMomoida]

It's a bit of a double-edged sword that works against the side-quests. On one end of things, me delaying the gratification of going IMMEDIATELY to the next MSQ bit generally makes it a bit more enjoying... On the other end, this kinda sucks for the side-quests because some actually do have pretty good writing and world-building, but I can hardly shake the feeling of wanting to get them over with so I can return to the MSQ.

[@Zakemaster]

The most egregious moment is right before the final mission, where the game drops a double digit amount of side quests all at once. It takes hours to get through these, most are longer than the usual side quests you’ve been getting for the majority of the game, and it completely undercuts the momentum the story had just been building to. They are also, hands down, some of the best written and most interesting side quests in the game. It’s maddening.

[@gearhead417]

@@Zakemaster luckily the game let's you return to right before the final boss to do them but I kind of like when the game just gives you more shit to do when you get near the end. But I can see why that would be annoying for some.

[@moogleboy]

Art direction was beyond what I expected out of a Final Fantasy game. Dhalmekia is hands down the best looking desert area I've ever seen in a video game. Gear could have been fixed by having the Elemental Swords add something, anything to the Eikons they represent. Cooldown reduction, damage amp, anything to make gear matter.

[@enderfawx3063]

The gear wasn't even a problem, it was a bad criticism from Preach. Having weapons get replaced after a couple cutscenes is not an issue, especially when the crafting materials are always super easy to obtain. This game isn't an mmo where the devs want you to be attached to your shiny new sword for a month. It's an action game where the pace is set by your pace with the kind of quest you choose to do and the way you choose to fight. Preacher didn't give the sidequests a chance after a couple fetch quests (which set up for an impactful storyline later on like most of the fetch quest-y sidequests do, and he is completely wrong about there only being a handful of good sidequests, a good majority of them are very impactful and interesting sidequest chains) and so he had his weapons replaced very quickly cause he only followed the msq.

[@milemile4813]

I miss the more creative and colorful worlds and characters of the older FFs. Love XVI regardless.

[@Maraaass]

Also it's more of a skill check than gear check. Also leveling up raises stats and they stack together with gear. You can hit 50lvl (max lvl on first playthrough) get best sword and you still won't be able to be overpowered and one-shot even 17lvl lower enemies because it's action game - do combos, cool moves and dodge/parry enemies skillfully.

[@Xander501st]

gota agree with this you main gear should have had something other than just raw stats.

[@motorolasamurai1635]

@@milemile4813 Same, I kinda wish they took a more FF Tactics approach with the world.

[@satisfry8710]

just a heads up in regards to the music collection, you can easily get the vendor music before ng+ from just doing the hunts bc they give a whole bunch of gil.

[@PantheonContent]

This - I bought every single accessory/song from vendors before finishing the game just by doing all the side quests and hunts as they became available, and I never once equipped the extra gil accessory.

[@bmack1708]

And if youre really hurting for gil, you can also sell some of those 2483 sharp fangs you've been stacking all game long ....

[@FloorTankMain]

Yeah I never used the extra Gil accessory but still made more than enough money throughout the game to buy every single song available. I was only missing one that I missed in a treasure coffer by the time I finished the story.

[@motorolasamurai1635]

A minor gripe that really annoyed the hell out of me is the fact that the Invictus (canon sword Clive wields in posters) cannot be upgraded, like Cloud's Buster Sword in FF7R or the Kingdom Key in KH3. They could have at least had some kind of glamour system for the sword.

[@aeolussvichi7680]

I love the game. Definitely has some rough edges but I love the direction of it. If they give Yoshi another shot at a mainline game I can see him and his team ironing out the gearing and side quests people have issue with. Those were the two weak points in the game, the rest was just incredible, in my opinion.

[@stefanlovric1345]

I think they'd need to rethink the game design it's designed too much like an MMO for obvious reasons... I don't know if they will change anything drastically in the future honestly.

[@ThatGBAGamer]

@@stefanlovric1345they take feedback well so I hope their next attempt works out

[@Siul_987]

@@stefanlovric1345yeah at least this team really read feedback, hopefully on a second try we will see something more polished on those areas that this one failed.

[@ajyvonne4486]

If they keep the game how it is but just add a gearing/sub-stat system it is literally perfect. The story is amongst the best in the series and the combat system is incredible.

[@arceptor]

​@@ajyvonne4486eh the ending sucks it killed a ng+ run for me

[@dom8072]

My brother in graegor- name me one linear single player RPG where the crafting isn’t just “beat boss, visit anvil, get bigger weapon”

[@neil4692]

The side quest design is bad but from doing them all I found that they were all a part of a chain which eventually built up to something great even more so for some endgame ones just a shame they didn't realize somehow that MMO fetch quest style side quests were only looked past because it was an MMO.

[@007GoldenLion]

Side quests actually provide a lot of world building and lore...they are nowhere as bad as some people make them out to be

[@Ilidan9]

@@007GoldenLion Great sidequests for World building, but horribly implemented. The truth is, this game tries to appeal to modern audience that is action focused, there you will hit alot of people which are not compatible with the way these quests are designed, its like trying to get a Counter strike player who never played any RPG's to get into FF14 style quests

[@Mighto]

Since I mostly play MMOs and very rarely a single player game I always wonder when people talk about fetch quest…. What is there else? How would you design a quest to not beat enemies and collect items.

[@Ilidan9]

@@Mighto Minigames or Puzzles for example, have interactive stuff in the Quests. It depends on the type of game tho, like FF7Remake has more lenient types cause of its siliness ( Pushups, dance and so on) Shooting range, Chocobo racing, Time Trial challenges with some sort of gimmick, or just straight up Puzzles with moving blocks. But not just "go there, come back" or "kill, and talk to me back"

[@VampireNoblesse]

imo the side quests are mostly interesting from a story or dialogue perspective.., doing them all atm.. ... same with the hunts (enjoy roaming the map, insearch of them..)

[@idleeidolon]

The rreal customization and optimization of the game is the eikon abilities. Which leaves the gear feeling vestigial, like trex arms or penguin wings. They should've made the gear interact with more than just the eikon abilities, but with the basic abilities as well, like lunge downthrust, parry, etc. That or just drop the gear altogether. The way it is right now instead of being servicable its just being annoying. Like a pea in your bed. The bed is amazing but the tint little pea os making you more frustrated than you should be.

[@thorinhannahs4614]

You mean like an accessory that gives you an additional stomp? Or one that gives your titan counter combo a ground slam launcher? Gear that interweaves into the combat in a meaningful way.

[@idleeidolon]

@@thorinhannahs4614 the accessories feel good. The weapons being nothing but attack power feel bad.

[@JPrescottQ]

@@idleeidolon The thing is....weapons and gear being just stat increases are actually very common in FF games. I understand the criticism as a whole, but I don't understand why XVI is being singled out. Why is it that I walk into a new town in previous FF games and buy stat upgrade only gear from a vendor for gil and nobody bats an eye, but Clive walks into the hideaway and buys stat upgrades with "crafting mats" and people downgrade the game because of it.

[@blkwng]

@@JPrescottQ i feel exactly this way. I feel like this criticism is something being done to sound like having a rational reason for "i dont like the game just because i don't want to like it". I mean ff7, the ORIGINAL, is literally the same thing where the weapon upgrades are nothing but atat increases, and the real customization is inside the materia you put in them. People haven't noticed that in terms of build freedom and customization, you have less of it in gowr!! See how much your build in gowr changes depending on your gears rather than instead juat having gear do one single thing yhat gears you towards a preferred playstyle. Much like what you van do by shifting eikon abilities and upgrades. There are other complaints in terms of story, side quests and pacing that I can agree with, but not this "customization is little" one.

[@fish5645]

@@blkwng Literally quote where in that comment did they say "i dont like the game just because i don't want to like it" because they really didn't. You are just an aggressive little tosspot that can't hear anyone have anything bad to say about your precious FF game. You jump to conclusions and then react to them even though it didn't happen. Work on yourself and be better.

[@TheAssirra]

Honestly I was so surprised when I found that the eikon weapons didn't effect your abilities/attacks at all. Could have had them upgrade automatically with Clive and give them unique effects, maybe a dot with fire, slow ice, shocked for Ramuh or just raw damage for Titan.

[@LimeNox]

Hey, Mike, about those expensive scrolls. Aside from resources you also receive items which are sold for gil. After i started selling those i always had gil to buy scrolls.

[@Gillrien]

I really liked the sidequests, bounties, and renown system, but I was looking at them through the lens of the story and characters and never really about the mechanics or rewards. Bandits giving the Cursebreakers problems, Clive has taken down Eikons and giant fallen golems so it's no problem for him to handle. People sending gifts as thanks, even though Clive doesn't need them my favourite part is always reading the messages and who they're from. As for orchestrions, I sold all the crafting mats I wasn't using and could afford them no problem :^) crafting system really could have used an overhaul though. Would have LOVED to see something like a dot added to Garuda's sword or something, maybe the swords could have boosted that aspect of magic or eikon stance. Great video all the same, super loving going back and watching the VODs once I pass those parts in the story, seeing the eikon battles and Mike + Chat (thanks for adding it) reactions have been so fun to relive.

[@Maraaass]

Same. I was invested in those side stories more than I thought. At the end I found it very endearing how each of them gave its own resolve and ending. Also I was amazed how all of them directly impacted the world, its people or Clive personally. I was impressed.

[@grizzybehr3281]

100%. No other game has done a better job at incorporating sidequests into it. The world building it allowed for by only having a few at a time and directly relating to what was going on in the world at that specific time was insane.

[@ZayTheOracleArchive]

I feel like people are looking at the progression the wrong way a bit. Would a bit more interesting weapon system be neat? yeah i wouldn't complain but its an action game. Your build, weapons, materia, etc comes in the form of eikon abilities and mastering and mixing things around. The only real complaint I have is that I wish Final Fantasy mode wouldve been available from the get go, or some equivalent of it. I also did every side quest and hunt as it came available and had a great a time personally. The story and world building of those quests were top notch. The gameplay and rewards of them are arguable I guess but I needed to do most if not all of them to craft the best 3 items at the end of the game, so it was worth it to me. Dunno, feel like people are nitpicking over little things. Even in old final fantasy games your weapons were stat sticks.

[@A203D]

Theres a few think we can nitpick here and there. For me what you said was very interesting because you are right the enjoyment from the game comes from the different Eikon abilities, mixing them up and then mastering how to use them. Unfortunately thats my biggest problem. You have too many moves and abilites and a lot of them will never get used because you can only equip 3 on Clive at any one time, on top of that you can only use 2 abilities. It would have been a lot better to have a battle party with different characters equiping different Eikon's and then switching between party members to target enemy weaknesses. Having only one party member leads to a lot of the abilites sitting in the menu, never getting used.

[@kblue1436]

@@A203D I mean thats up to the player at that point. If the player just wants to use the same abilities for their entire playthrough then thats on them, that was their choice but the options are there. Some people also change their eikons regularly to see differences and such. The core of this was from the very beginning is a character action game like Devil may cry, Bayonetta, MG Rising, ect. and the draw of those games is the complete freedom of how the player wants to express themselves through the combat. If one wants to use the same abilities and not ever change them out for their playthrough then they have the luxury to do so. But its not like there isn't an entire library of options to choose/use/swap out at any point if they wish to do so. The combat is only as limited or widely expressive as the player chooses to make it to be.

[@A203D]

@@kblue1436 Yes thats true, yet still I feel they mismanaged the combat engine. Let me elaborate; when you get Titan you have Titan Block, but you also have Raging Fist. Which is a variation of Titan's block. Two moves that could have been intergrated into one move, which would allow you to map another of Titan's moves to the face buttons. Its limiting in the sense you have moves that can't be mapped because you wasting the space for two very similar moves. The issue I also have is that, you have 6 Eikon's, they could have give the player a battle party of three players. Which would give you all those Eikon abilities in the same combat arena as opposed to having swap things in and out. In a Final Fantasy style RPG its more engaging to have all those abilites and moves available at your disposable, which is what FF7 Remake didn't exceptionally well.

[@kblue1436]

@A203D While yes could have the developers culminated both into 1 ability, sure but they also fundamentally work differently. I would also argue it isnt flawed really since it can also give one the option if they wanted to make say a full counter build. Along side that I would say for this given example: 1.) The 2 abilities have different functions. Titan's block is meant to build LB and give Clive a constant block/shield button. In comparison to Raging Fists were its meant to destroy the enemies Will gauge and/or provide more DPS. While both counters they both have different roles. 2.) Keep in mind one is not limited to using Eikon specific abilities on the same Eikon. The player has the freedom to mix and match. So to use your example again lets say the player did want a counter but they really want to use a Different Eikon like Odin or something, that person is free to use Odin and put on Raging Fists which now gives them both things they wanted. In terms of the party system I feel like thats more up to the game director preference of what they wanted to make as the focus in combat. Also that specific idea you shared wouldn't really fit with the narrative of the game since the point is that there was only one person that developed the ability to hold and use multiple powers. You give that to the rest of the cast then you would have to completely change the narrative for this specific story their trying to tell.

[@JPrescottQ]

@@A203D Honestly, just no. I love party systems, but what you are describing just wouldn't work here. Raging Fist having a block component along with the Titan specific block isnt a mistake. Raging Fist is a great choice to Master and put into a different Eikon slot if you want a Titan style parry, but don't want use Titan itself. If I do have a criticism, I found myself wanting to swap around Eikon abilities more, but going into the menu to do it prevented me from doing it more. Having loadouts would have been nice so I can swap between different builds depending on what I am doing.

[@James-kv3ll]

Sounds exactly like what YoshiP did with FF14. Focus on the game’s strengths (story and encounters) and oversimplify literally everything else to the point of making it arbitrary. The double edged sword of making a game “Ultra-Accessible”

[@DoctorPlato]

My only real complaints are the side quest and gearing as well, but I really dont care about gearing because the real customizability comes from Eikon abilities and how you use them. Everyone seems to use a different set up and I think thats way more interesting than using xyz sword or ring. Every streamer/chatter seemed to like different eikon abilities and hate others. Not sure why no one really mention this.

[@FlashlegendSC]

One aspect of character customization/preparation isn't enough to sing home about when many people who've played other ff games expect much more.

[@mikeconstanza]

@@FlashlegendSC Other FF games also let you do far less on your main character, so it's a trade-off. You need gearing and status effects because combat in most FF games is mostly just menuing with pretty much no other player expression other than gearing. This game allows the player to express through gameplay itself. I wonder if they didn't even pretend to have a gearing system at all and only had ability customization/upgrading if people would have felt differently. Perhaps it existing as barebones is worse than just not existing.

[@miau384]

With the exception of upgrades coming way too fast, the very limited and boring gearing is like a staple of JRPGs. I've not played a single JRPG, FF or otherwise, that didn't have like 4-6 slots of just boring one number upgrades. In fact, most of those don't even change a single thing about the appearance, so ironically FF16 having a different look for swords is better than most in that aspect.

[@Stanzbey69]

@@FlashlegendSCwhat do they expect? Rpg elements to make their turn based magic do a little more damage? Get over yourself, all of the effort here was put in the combat and it’s miles ahead of any other final fantasy, even ff7r

[@pleasedontkillme1185]

The eikons I seem to use the most is Phoenix (with Flame of Rebirth and Ignition), Titan (with the fist that is more potent if it blocks an attack and megaflare/gigaflare, cant remember which it was called) And finally Odin (with his dash attack and Diamond Dust) The fist and Diamond Dust is for shattering their will, rebirth and ignition for pack clearing, flare and Odin for big stagger damage. Phoenix is for mobility, Titan for defense since the block is extremely useful and Odin for big burst in his special power.

[@subculturenz]

To be fair, I have bought all the music and currently sitting on 200k gill, the last track I need is from the final renown reward and I haven't finished the MSQ yet but am on the last boss. So it definitely is possible, especially if you do every side quest and open every chest.

[@subculturenz]

But I agree, the gearing system is pretty bad, but maybe in an expansion they will introduce a material system and the ability to reinforce weapons you like the look of and add materia slots, but some of the accessories are fantastic but you dont get enough accessory slots.... Also, I hope they add more ability to change outfits.

[@BronzeMartin]

In fairness, you can get Excalibur pretty early. It was nice having a weapon that lasted a few hours lol

[@pedrostrauss4848]

Crazy how there are so many mix reviews for this game. I know it has its issues but FF16 became my favorite out of the whole franchise, there were so many nods to anime fans and 90's/ 2000's kids. I absolutely adore the way we make combos using Eikon's habilities, the more mature take on story, the world building side quests and those danm gorgeous boss battles (Titan and Bahamut ❤). It just looks like there are many people out there wanting the game to fail instead of appretiate the beauty of a perfect imperfect game.

[@kamii_999]

💯 agreed FF16 is god tier 10/10 🙌

[@derpderpin1568]

yikes. it's not even top 10.

[@kamii_999]

@@derpderpin1568 you mean Ff15 is not top ten yeah I agree, FF16 tho is god level.

[@SumEpithet]

I didn't quite get the gearing criticism up until Preach said that gearing was specifically important to him in general. Mostly because that it was so minimal and inoffensive that I couldn't quite believe that anyone could have a problem with it. I probably spent a grand total of 20 minutes in the blacksmithing menu over the course of the entire game even doing all of the side quests. In my case it makes it pretty insignificant since it takes up an insignificant amount of my time. But if you go in wanting to invest time and energy into it and find it absent, I could definitely see that being disappointing. Honestly, they should have just ditched the stats and had the weapons and gear have effects similar to the accessories. Just having the 3 slots is pretty limiting, so having more would go a long way to making me feel like I'm making a "build" instead of just buffing one ability. Although I personally don't feel its absence as greatly as Preach does, I wouldn't say no to having something more substantial.

[@alexandraalmagest]

It's also worth noting that he liked the FFXIV gearing because you get right into the action which are the Savage/Ultimate Raids by equipping your BiS. They simply reused that concept in XVI and made you equip your BiS that is possible for you to equip at certain points in the story without needlessly grinding. This is a trade-off of pacing the story and gearing system. If you want a complex gearing system with grinding, you will lose your momentum for the pacing of the story.

[@tjongdavid1921]

​@@alexandraalmagestWhat I think would be best is to have unique properties attached to them like increase all of Phoenix dmg, lower Phoenix cd, increase phoenix dmg but increase titan cd, or add an decrease Titan range. They have 7 eikons + torgal, there are a lot of combinations they can do.

[@CL-jq1xs]

@@alexandraalmagest thats mostly a grinding issue. The problem is how simple the gear are. CD reduction, more charges of fall recovery, unique abilities attached to a weapon/armor etc. As they are they are just simple stat sticks. Even stats stick can be interesting if you make the attributes it give mean something.

[@NPDStudio]

Solid video, fair critisisms. 👌 Will say though, the music collecting isn't a NG+ thing, I've bought them all and haven't beaten the story or final hunts/sidequests yet. (And I haven't been grinding or equipping any gil boosts). My issue is... Why are expensive music tracks the only valuable thing Vendors in the whole game sell? Why not also sell Books to add to the Loremaster collection? New outfits would have been nice, Mount speed upgrade or new saddles for my Chocobo? Rare materials for Crafted Weapons instead of having everything you need from the get-go? etc etc. Anything to mix it up a bit and make gil + vendors more valuable o,o

[@bigballs7911]

I did every single side quest, I'd say like 60-70% are really good, 10% are really really good, and the other 20% are ok. Even the 20% had interesting dialogue imo. Some side quests (about 10%) have entire cutscenes, some side quests have multiple parts that unlock other side quests, some unlock hunts. I don't see anyone ever mention this but the npc chatter in this game is absolutely amazing, this is probably the most alive ff universe yet. Every single npc in your radius has npc chatter that changes every single main story beat and even some side story beats. You'll complete a story section and everyone is chatting about what just happened and what they feel or think about it. You do the next step of the story, and everyone has new things to say again its insane. And this is for everywhere in the game, the hub, martha's pass/northreach/Dalimal/ + any npcs near side stories.

[@fayte0618]

16:41 side quests are hard to digest mechanically since game doesn’t have puzzles, platforming and mini games. It double downs on its primary mechanics of talking, fetching, and killing. Does help that they’re short but I can see the fatigue if you’re doing them in a bunch. Stories for them are good though esp. the ones near the end.

[@Xilibrius]

I crafted both of those swords but i got them spread apart. I used excliabur for quite a while then got brightburn so i don't know what happened in your palyhthrough. I do agree that gear feels like an afterthought. I wonder if final fantasy mode crafting will be slightly better but i'm sure it's more of the same

[@Marusinae]

There was a point where he didn't want to do sidequests for a little while and let them build up, so he continued going through the main story until he hit an acceptable breakpoint to tackle the sidequests. That's why he ended up getting Excalibur at the same time as Brightburn.

[@omensoffate]

Bro Excalibur lasted like 2 main story missions and they were filler lol

[@Xilibrius]

@@Marusinae that explains it. Ive been doing every side quest before the campaign

[@franciscopena3283]

If you do everything you can reach the end of the game with 300,000 g and with all the swords crafted

[@icebox1954]

@@omensoffate I don't know what you're talking about. I just fought Odin at sea and Brightburn does 225 ATK and stagger vs Excalibur 280 or so. Maybe they've nerfed it but I don't have something to upgrade from excalibur at this point and I am further than Preach is when he made this.

[@marajango]

100 % agree with everything you said. About the music scrolls: I think those are meant as a money sink, since the game offers Gil as a resource without the real need to ever spend it (as you pointed out you can craft more than enough equipment and your potions get refilled anyway everytime you die). Another thing I wish was better is the overall encounter design. All fights are basically the same: make stagger bar / hp bar go down. And you do that by spamming your favorite attacks over and over until everything around you is dead. I would have loved to see some variations to it. Like in the old games where you would encounter a certain foe which is resistant or immune to certain attacks and you had to adapt and change your tactics to win the fight. But again, as you already pointed out, that isn't really possible here since you don't have a real party to play with. Maybe SE can find some middle ground in the future between FF16 and FF7R to deliver both fast paced action as well as somewhat deeper customization and strategizing.

[@Sirin2099]

I completely agree with the combat mechanics they needed to add more variations or other mechanics atop the stagger. Like the regular mobs had heal, protect, and courage but this was only added very slowly. They should've leaned in more to mechanics for combat since the combat system is very good but under-utilized.

[@icebox1954]

@@Sirin2099 Those mechanics don't really add anything. There's a healer? Kill enemies anyway with strong abilities or focus healer, someone is casting defense? Same as before, someone is casting attack increase? Same as before. It doesn't change how you play at all since they don't happen in boss fights and only with easily killed enemies. Not to mention the Eikons count as magic so the protect one is rather useless.

[@khellchevere546]

I'd love for Preach to play Vagrant Story

[@thegallantrayku2677]

The thing with the crafting system is that the devs didn't want to be a gear check but a skill check, enemies can't be beat just by getting a better weapon they have patterns so you can dodge or block attacks

[@MsBaseball19]

That’s the reason it’s so shit?

[@Maraaass]

Also when you level up it all scales together. Agree. It's more skill check so you wouldn't get overpowered and just one-shotting everything.

[@goscubasteve]

Skill checks are good, but the crafting system does feel very bland because of the stat upgrade decisions. Small variety changes could give it a good QOL upgrade.

[@mattp994]

I don't think that's an excuse really. They could still have equipment give a greater variety of effects, without those effects significantly altering the gameplay. For example, instead of Stormcry offering 5 more attack than your existing weapon, it gives you 5 less attack but a 10% increase to Wind damage. You've just acquired Garuda, so it's a viable upgrade, but at the same time, it provides a valid choice between investing in your Wind elemental skills, or just grabbing the raw attack upgrade.

[@sconnolly88]

Lmfao. I never once encountered a hard enemy. I'm 52 hours in. I've steamrolled everything. There is no challenge.

[@obamaorb7426]

Ngl I loved the sidequests in this game, a lot of them were genuinely really interesting and entertaining storylines that span across the whole game and allow you to see your progress reflected through them. Plus the lore in a lot of them is truly fascinating. (Take the ‘An Inconvenient Truth’ quest for example)

[@shinkenrock]

They bored me beyond belief for me :/

[@UnashamedlyHentai]

I loved them, as well. They were too back-loaded. They needed to be spread over the course of the whole game better, but they were great at fleshing out all the characters.

[@Gnarlbones]

@@UnashamedlyHentai This is how I feel, personally. I actually enjoyed the vast majority of them - even the ones that some people seem to dislike - but the really good ones are all near the very end of the game. Personally I'm very glad I did all the side quests, but there are definite improvements to be made.

[@DawnAfternoon]

@@shinkenrock It's absolutely a mixed bag for sure. One quest has you MMO fetching a bunch of dirt, and the other literally rearranges the world and wipes an earlygame settlement off the map. The sidequest quality yo-yos like crazy.

[@KGLordofhollows]

There is a huge pacing issue with them though. When the main story quest is something along the lines of "our friend X is in this place and they are in trouble, we need to get to them immediately" or "we need to get here because this is where our enemy Y is currently staying", I as a player don't want to ruin my immersion so naturally I will go do this "urgent" task. But the game will give you these kind of story quests and unlock 5-10 side quests at the same time that will be "get ingredients for a new dish", "collect dirt samples", "help children fix a scale". And as the game progresses and everyone understands who Clive is and what his mission entails, I think it ruins both immersion and all the quest givers as people, when they ask their active leader, Cid 2.0, who has to fight literal monsters and gods, to go do the most mundane of tasks that everyone else could do for them or do themselves. It's terribly constructed. And lastly, I think that it's extremely lame that "lore" as well as story is so heavily delivered through exposition. It's extremely lazy in construction, I would have expected stuff like books to be laying around you can collect (you have a character called Tomes ffs, could have been a quest for him too) or that music could deliver some story too, but nope.

[@mikeoakeshart3823]

If the RPG element of this game leave a hole in your mind, you should try Tales of Arise. It has similar story theme, action combat than didn't totally abandon the "party-based" element that make Final Fantasy game a Final Fantasy game.

[@UnashamedlyHentai]

i generally agree with you on the gearing system, but the specific example with excalibur, you just did the quest late. i did the quest and crafted excalibur as soon as i could and used it for a little while. not really long enough, but it wasn't outmoded before i crafted it. probably related to the fact that once you get to a new sotry area, you can immediately go back to the hideout (before _doing_ any of the story in the new area) and get new sidequests and store upgrades.

[@MiniatureMorpheus]

To those complaining about gil. Its used in NG+ for accessories. The last Odin accessory costs 200k in NG+.

[@azazel166]

My biggest gripe is that we can't visit the big cities outside of missions. Yeah the file size would be far bigger but when did that stop developers?

[@cr4sh212]

I would split my thoughts on the side quests in 3. There are the ones that unlock something and are bad and/or really shallow in the narrative department; those that expand the world and are generally great; and those that are amazing and character driven. That being said, the lack of diversity in their gameplay can be an issue for a great amount players, would not say that it is coming from FF14, because other games that have big maps do those things, just that in FF16 they are all fetch quest or that involve a bit of combat. Still, would say that the vast mayority of narrative quests are welcome or "let me bring a tissue" material

[@CidLufaine]

I do wish they would've used something more like the ff7 remake combat system. I think that combat has the best combination of faster action combat while still feeling like a final fantasy game. Don't know exactly how to explain it but ff7 combat felt much better to me. Hoping they go back to that and expand on that style of combat for future games.

[@Dad2Kids]

The combination of action combat and strategic thinking when inputting the command. I can agree with this.

[@RealityDysfunction85]

Ff16 has me disagreeing with youtubers I usually 100% agree with. SkillUp and Preach have usually been guys I agree with on all games. Ff16 is really dividing people.

[@autumneagle]

What's your opinions on the game?

[@SILVERONIN]

It's FF in name only, not substance

[@Eredom]

I noticed that the really good sidequests all are towards endgame and the terrible sidequests are all in the beginning to middle of the game. I would say overall I had more good than bad sidequests, but the bad fetchquesty ones are all in the beginning of the game (and also well into the middle) so they leave a terrible first impression.

[@YoSmoked]

Keep up the good work, you never let your fans down with great entertainment 😎

[@alternatelevi2099]

Wait, am I the only one who had 100000s of gil by the end of this? I never had a moment I couldn't buy the music past mabye the halfway point.

[@derrickpanciera5644]

As a final fantasy fan the biggest sin of the weapon system in this game was when I found the Masamune, the fucking MASAMUNE in a treasure chest, and it was worse than a crafted item I made 10 hours earlier. So I never even put it on.

[@thorinhannahs4614]

One of the two chests that contain something interesting and yeah it was worse than what I had when I opened it. But hey at least it'll make you look cool in your combo mad videos.

[@ramontavarez7256]

Great points I do think side quest get wayyy better towards the end of the game. Some of them were such a slog though. I really enjoyed the game despite its shortcomings. It was so much fun.

[@TrowGundam]

Personally, i didn't mind the majority of the side quests. Then again I'm one of those psycho weridos that do every single side quest in MMOs before moving on. I never leave a side quest undone. Partly because I don't want to see it on my map, and partly because I want to experience all the quests. Maybe I just have a higher tolerance for it. A lot of the "boring" side quests actually provide additional context to the major ones or flesh out little details on how the world is changing or enduring, which I enjoyed. I agree the gear was kind of boring. I would have preferred something like elemental affinities or something on weapons, or maybe change up your combos. Just something that made different weapons unique instead of oh now I"m just a few more points stronger. Couldn't even enjoy the aesthetics as I could barely even see the thing and most of them were fairly similar looking anyways. As for Orchestrion Rolls, you absolutely do not have to wait to NG+ to get them. I got all of them easily by the end of the game. You don't really need to spend your money on much except restocking consumables, and if I was able to get to 500k+ with how bad I am at action games thus having to regularly buy more potions, I'm sure most anyone else that isn't just rushing MSQ should be able to do the same. And for Hunts? Some of us are just bad at the game (and know I'm not gonna cheat with the accesories, to me it defeats the purpose of playing the game, i could just watch a stream if I didn't play it myself). I couldn't beat the S ranks until I was a level or two above them, so having additional C, B and A hunts was a very welcome addition for me. I'm not some god at the game and beating Atlas at 30 something, I had to wait till the end of the game and I was 47 before I could beat him. I barely killed Svarog the Level 50 S Rank, and I only got that through luck and many attempts.

[@johnschaeffer7008]

Definitely agree about the gear/crafting system. Probably the least satisfying thing in the entire game. Side quests really grew on me though. By the end of the game, I actually looked forward to them. Especially some of big ones for certain characters. I just beat the game and I am "conflicted" about where the story ended up at and the final encounters. I'm still making up my mind exactly how much I liked this game and if it is GOTY. Either way, I still think the game is exactly what it wanted to be, except for maybe the gear and exploration. I think this can go a long way to firming up Final Fantasy's reputation again as a must play series

[@Ninos.D]

Wondering if Covid was the reason certain parts may feel unpolished. The game has been in development for 4+ years.

[@Verd254]

Ironically, still the smoothest development an FF game has had in probably 10 years if not more.

[@Eversoul12]

​@@Verd254probably the lowest bar an FF game has achieved since then too. This game is very poorly designed on a gameplay level.

[@LessLuck]

I had 0 reason to bother about anything regarding crafting and could just easily afford any new gear I was presented with and I loved it, didn't want to waste my time on any of it and that's exactly what I didn't have to do.

[@marks2807]

I fond the side quests where really good when they showed you what life like a bearer was like, but other side quests suck.

[@fayte0618]

6:30 I do agree with the main gear and stats being there just to give you a feeling of progression akin to other action adventure games upgrading your gun stats. The accessories do augment your abilities to some degree. I think the numbers just throw people off because it gives the impression of customizability. Then again, game isnt really about that but it is a missed opportunity

[@Casemister36]

This is exactly how I feel. 10/10 MSQ and combat. 6/10 for side quests, hunts and crafting

[@Xander501st]

yeah thats fair maybe 7/10 for side quest the like 2 or 4 that are good are really good.

[@KiryamaThil]

Thank you for being so straight forward and no sugar coating preach

[@AndrewNajash]

The TLDR for my experience was: Everything to do with the main part of the game, the story, visuals, voice acting, fights, abilities, action combat and the music was exceptionally good, 10/10 stuff. But the content that didn’t have that same effort put into it, the side stuff or the secondary systems, felt distinctly lower quality and some of it felt just tacked on. The item placement in the open world literally felt like they finished the game then just dropped some stuff around because they felt like they needed too. I think the game overall is amazing, but there are glaring weak points which only stand out more because the high points are some of the best I’ve ever seen in a game. If they make DLC, and I hope they do, they need to iron out the pacing of hunts and gear unlocks. You never want to feel like an item you worked for or are working towards could be, or was, made meaningless instantly, and you don’t want to go from fighting amazing S tier monster to multiple C or B tier ones either.

[@weltall445]

Even the main quest is a snooze fest at times though. I just went through the part where you have to fetch parts for the steam ship or whatever. So bad. Talk to someone at hideout, they send you to desert. Go pick up 5 things by the river. Go back to hideout. They send you somewhere else. Fight one easy enemy that you already did in a hunt. Go back to hideout. Talk to a person. Go to the other side of the hideout. Talk to a person. It’s mind numbingly boring at times and I’m not sure why more people don’t call out these low points in the game. The only parts of this game I find live up to the hype are the actual main story dungeon/battle areas. These are the areas where you can’t open the map and you go through battle after battle culminating in one of the epic boss fights. This feels like maybe 25% of the actual game: the rest is MUCH lower quality and really boring IMO.

[@92JinKazama]

​@@weltall445Urgh, the steam engine part almost made me howl with despair. I have not pressed X to skip the dialogue any faster than this. Also, why tf do we need to run to Otto every 5 seconds across the entire hideout, telling him about every minute detail of what we're doing?

[@icebox1954]

@@92JinKazama Because Otto is the backbone of the hideaway which you'd know if you did the sidequests. Clive is away for most of the time and as such it is Otto that manages it and he has his nose in everything because that's his job. That's like asking why do we go to Vivian when needing information about the world changing geopolitically after main quests. Otto is the most important person in the hideaway and as such he needs information to lead effectively. That's why.

[@NorGlace]

Nice video but I had 240,000 gil at the end of my playthru on 1st play, and i bought almost all songs, so i had no issues xD .. and i did not use ANY items for more xp, or gil so I guess I spent almost no money on other things XD

[@BananaMellor]

Partway through, and I agree with most of what I'm hearing. But as I'm listening to this, the one thought I can't shake that keeps popping up (especially after watching other streamers start their journey) is that the decisions to have that weird mix of easy and hard, or to have constant upgrade options are based on the assumption that some players aren't going to be doing literally every sidequest or bounty, they're going to be skipping stuff. While I have the same issues with how arbitrary it feels, it makes more sense to me when you consider they are giving options to the people who are going to be beelining through and skipping most of the optional content.

[@icebox1954]

As someone that is further than Mike was when he made this I'd like to throw my 2 cents in. The crafting he got spot on. The upgrades don't feel like something you'll miss out on, eve though that isn't true for some of it as you'll need to do specific side missions or bounty quests for he's mostly correct in that it isn't exciting. As for side quests I'm surprised he feels this way as only about half of them are unoriginal go get or kill X thing. Side quests are amazing for building context and immersion. If you skip them then you won't experience the world really. In Lostwing you have an entire side quest chain that feels like a main quest thing. Many of them give context and Mike may not have remembered but you get your mount (who holds important emotional attachment to the main character) from a completely skippable side quest. You get inventory expansions from side quests that build on the story of previous side quests. Mike has totally missed the mark on side quests as they're amazing for building immersion, continuity and context to the world. They make you attached to places you normally wouldn't care or remember. I found myself remembering names exactly because they held importance narratively in side quests and you shouldn't skip them. When it comes to bounty quests many of the lower ranks are refreshing and different whereas A and S ranks might kill you but also be fun while challenging. The combat is amazing, the story is amazing and the side quests are hit or miss like he said but many of them are just as amazing as main story quests. It's an amazing game overall.

[@skryah]

This mirrors a lot of the experiences I had, especially with the "replacing this epic purple sword I just crafted with a white one from the vendor" part. I love the gameplay and the story, couldn't care less for the RPG systems like gearing, crafting, and sidequests. Overall though, I had a ton of fun and it's still one of my favourite games ever, because the highs are so high, as Preach mentioned. Good video!

[@unloyal4847]

I wish they went with the KH gearing where keyblades kind of changes how you play.

[@Xander501st]

you would think at the very least you would have will damage swords and hp damage swords

[@ThaNinjazTube]

Good video, I had similar reasonings for most of these positives and negatives, but I almost completely disagree with the larger point you made about the side quests. Because it's limiting it to just a couple side quest stories that were really good. A significant amount of them were exceptionally good. It is just the decent chunk that are weaker, however even those offer stories of value. Even a good section of the "weaker" side quests are just part of a chain that makes for a pay off better than what you get for characters in a large amount of other game stories. It is not just one or two. Blacksmith's Blues final two, For Great Justice I and II, Trading Places I & II, Duty Undying chain, Litany of Errors, Priceless, Under New Management, Nobody's Tool, Three's Company, Lines in the Sand I & III, More Than Words (Torgal is the best), Rekindling the Flame I & II, Payback. Just to name some of the ones that are stand out. Just going through a list of all the side quests in the game, a majority of them have profoundness and a lot of quality put into them, some with unique soundtrack that only appears there, and a most of the ones I mentioned, and other have some of the best voice acting work in the game. That is not to say that there aren't several uninteresting side quests, and especially for those on the gameplay side. But these are definitely a minority as opposed to a sentiment for the side quests in-general.

[@andrewclear8905]

There are a few side quests that miss, but overall they are pretty good. There are some chains that really flesh out the the supporting characters. My issue with the side quests was that the pacing on how they are handed out was bad. I don’t like the complaints about them much, because the ones that miss are generally the standard fare in any other game.

[@yoyomama99]

yeah. just unlocked the final dungeon.. and also 11 new sidequest popping up suddenly in the world. And I've already pushed myself to the brink finishing every side quests before it, why they do it just before the final dungeon man

[@Sweetzluf]

The sidequests that unlock right before the final mainquest, 3 of them made me almost cry. My eyes where watering. That said, there are some really good sidequests throughout the journey in the story/lore department. Then there are the sidequest that are not so good. I do think the sidequest needed more variety in gameplay though.

[@Siul_987]

I finished the game last Monday night (I marathon it the hell out of it tbh), I 100% my first playthrough (hunts, challenges and side quests), I agree with everything you have said on this video. I loved the experience the game gave me but the game has some very awesome highs and then some very “okish” lows, like you said I felt like some of the side quest had an mmo feeling to them and for me they definitely destroyed the pacing of the game and even main story having some side quest feeling in the middle of the adventure definitely hurt the pacing a lot, though I would say the last side quests ended up been way better (better pacing, real cutscene, great endings/conclusion for side characters). Anyway my biggest issue was itemization, gear (is almost decoration like it was on god of war 2018 and ragnarok), mmoish side quests feeling (alright in mmos, very weird in an action game) and the general pacing of the game which went from 0-100 and then 100-0 (since they divided every encounter like “arcs”). Combat was great, music was amazing, I ended up loving most of the side characters, the main character and the story. Is a great game in all honesty, but I can see people struggling with the pacing (some very long cutscenes moments with barely any gameplay, which I am fine with but it will not be for everyone).

[@Sorakovu]

I did enjoy the sidestory missions lol, lots of great lore value there Also story, gameplay and music are insane, finished the game yesterday and Im completely satisfied, but I would love a DLC for leviathan

[@tonberrygaming3267]

hot take: dlc will be about taking the enterprise away from the twins continent to another continent, much like what mid and jill said they wanted to do after all was done and said.

[@TheMexRAGE]

Leviathan Dominant being a badass cool pirate captain would be awesome

[@Sorakovu]

@@tonberrygaming3267 that would be amazing

[@arceptor]

​@@tonberrygaming3267i want clive and jill happy ending

[@sydney8578]

Completly disagree

[@SuperRamos619]

The upgrade argument doesnt make sense to me. Every FF game gear is gated by story. You get to a new town, buy new gear, maybe find a piece in the next dungeon. And then get to the new town and repeat. Its the same process, in FFXVI but just streamlined.

[@MatthewKorpas]

A very fair review. This game definitely has some amazing peaks, but valleys like the ones you pointed out are a glaring weakness. I'm excited when this comes to PC, because people could make some spectacular mods that put in things like new crafted weapons that upgrade say, lightning abilities, or change Eikon powers a bit. There's a lot of room for improvement for CBU3 continues patching the game for other issues (Overheating, FPS drops, ect).

[@VeralionRawr]

15/10 and 5/10 still averages out to 10/10. As a diehard 14 fan, I will never forget how this game made me feel.

[@Plasmacat1]

The gearing and crafting is odd and very simplistic but tbh I really don't care. Same with the side quests because I have MMO brain rot, like I don't mind giving people soup but I agree they need more spice or variety or maybe chain some quests stories or objectives. As for the map, it's like a 3D environment of the old FFs screens that you went through and for the kind of combat this has I like that better than senseless open world. Also most of the customization comes from Eikons, but like in any character action game, variety comes from you actually changing abilities but in reality most people stick to 1 load out, like you are addicted to Ignition lol. It's been nice seeing people have favorite abilities. So while I agree with your assessments, I don't care lol, I'm just here for the story and combat. If anything I would like a very simple gambit system from Ff12 to your AI companions. Either way one of my top FF games for sure and Clive is easily best protagonist.

[@hkoizumi3134]

The gearing system was the only worry I had and I was correct. It's no surprise that gearing system in FF16 was paced bad. Compared to other games like the Witcher 3 and Kingdoms of Amalur, it's basically the worse for FF16. I mean Yoshi P does the same thing in FF14. Gearing is uninspired and boring.

[@thorinhannahs4614]

Gearing could of been great. Those Eikon trials could of changed the way you play the Eikon. Give you an accessory that gives your Titan counter combo a launcher as an ender or give your megaflare form the ability to fire magic between dodge charges. So on and so forth.

[@mnopinion]

The game is a 9.5/10 for me, combat feels soo satisfying especially once you pull off those amazing combos, and especially so once you get the last eikon. Main story quest is captivating and indulgent, i loved eikon battles very much. However, its the side quests that pulled the numbers for me… okay, im not saying the side quest stories are bad its just.. not varied enough or deep enough (akin to witcher 3).. its more like talk to npc-go to destination-fight mobs-go back to talking to same npc, it really became reptitive. There are side quests that truely shocked me, but its few and far between imo. I have to agree with the gearing/crafting though, it wasnt deep enough. Usually its just pick the highest number and roll with it… I wish there was more to the weapons and armor is all im saying.

[@wildpartyticket]

I'm blown away....999999 out of 10 for me.

[@ButtTrauma]

Do you have your FF7R playthrough uploaded anywhere?

[@godword99]

Completely disagree about the Side Quest After doing almost all of them if don't care about npc lore , a world building or npc that help you along the way story then it would look bad. And a hunt board rank Based on Lore it's depend on cursebreaker sighting so it would be incredibly stupid if after some point in the game that every monster that post a threat is S rank.

[@ajyvonne4486]

I agree the gearing system is bad and only there because they are afraid RPG fans need it but disagree that the reason is to timegate you. I know someone who did no sidequests and rarely upgraded his gear and while the game was harder, it was by no means too difficult. You can go through the game barely engaging with gearing and you will be powerful enough to complete it just by the leveling process. Overall, the devs clearly didnt care bout gear, they should just take it out.

[@blueblazer9991]

My heart says 10/10, but I get the criticisms

[@TheOne23_]

Most sane KZbin commenter haha

[@Alvun416]

@@TheOne23_ more like insane if you think this was a 10/10 😂

[@TheOne23_]

@@Alvun416 I mean someone that has an opposing opinion and can see the other side. I havnt even played the game dont have a ps5…. Lol. You could probably learn something

[@salmanhannan9052]

The eikon loadout stuff is the "gearing" of the game

[@mfyippekiyay728]

then just make it even more indepth and drop the entire crafting system and just have bosses and quest drop the gear, if u do something half assed people will complain about it, rightfully so. why would u put something in thats so arbitrary and mundane it just feels like its wasting ur time and attention? unironically the game will be better and the "haters" will have less things to hate on if they just scrape the entire crafting system altogether.

[@JPrescottQ]

@@mfyippekiyay728 because its not really a crafting system. Think about previous FF games. Most of your gear comes in the form of stat upgrades from vendors at specific parts of the story. An iron bangle becomes a mythril bangle, or something like that. XVI is literally the same thing as most FF games except instead of spending gil, you use materials. If you want to criticize the entire FF franchise for the way it upgrades gear, thats fine, but I find it weird that XVI gets singled out.

[@mfyippekiyay728]

@@JPrescottQ because thats exactly what it is, a tacked on crafting system, my suggested solution is exactly what u said, keep at as item drops or vendor items. my point is if it was infact like other FF games there wouldnt be any criticism regarding the crafting system, because well, there would be no crafting system. There might be criticism that there is a lack of 1 instead but thats another discussion. if u create a system that mimics some kind of customization, then force players to engage with that system, they are going to form an opinion, and unfortunately that opinion is an overwhelmingly negative 1 for most people including my self. Its as alot of others have said, it just feels like they went down the list and ticked the boxes on what to put in the game, it actively takes away from the experience by forcing u to engage with such an arbitrary system and even brings a false sense of expectation because rarely are other games crafting system this mundane.

[@TheAssirra]

@@JPrescottQ But the other games have a different way to adjust stats. Be it materia in 7, espers in 6 or a complete make your own weapon system like in 10, 16 has none such system. Also weapons were a lot more unique rather raw stats, be it elemental damage, inflicting debuffs or straight up unique things.

[@TheAssirra]

Maybe but those are still a couple abilities with a decent cooldown for each. the "super" attack at least should have been each own button imo.

[@gizenzirin8351]

I'm not going to defend the gear system, it's not great, BUT, the one thing I will say about it, is that the impression I get is that you're not actually intended to always be wearing the best gear possible at all times. That things like the epic boss weapons are the game going 'this is the minimum strength we want you to be until your next epic weapon' and any other weapons you buy/craft that are better are just intended to be a way to make the game easier for yourself if you need it.

[@levitastic]

For me I wanted elemental weaknesses as well for more rpg feeling, they said that it would be annoying for players to be forced into a specific element, but thats what FF has always done and it gave at least some strategic elements which i kinda miss here

[@Plasmacat1]

Elemental weaknesses don't work in action games because then you will have color coded enemies and that isn't fun at all in these kind of games. Happened to God of War and to the DMC reboot too. "oh look a red enemy, time to use Shiva, etc.

[@Eversoul12]

​@@Plasmacat1 the enemies in kingdom hearts have elemental weaknesses and resistances and other than the mage enemies they arent color coded. not to mention it still feels fast paced and adds more depth than just blowing your cooldowns at opportune times. Where this combat failed is it limits you to 6 abilities in battle that all have lengthy cooldowns to avoid resource management. Which makes the game feel extremely repetitive because one set of abilities is viable for the entirety of the game because every enemy is vulnerable to it at all times. There absolutely should have been knowledge checks about enemy weaknesses etc in the combat to keep it fresh the whole playthrough. not having that stuff for a 10 hour action game is fine but for a 50 hour RPG? not really. i was beyond ready to finish the game at the halfway mark because the combat was offering no reason to do anything other than what i was doing besides purposefully nerfing myself with worse abilities to change it up for a different repetitive set with worse damage and thats not good

[@Plasmacat1]

​@@Eversoul12KH is not a character action game though. The style of combat they have works better for that rock paper scissors thing because it has a pace unlike this one where you cna go as crazy as you can csncel and juggle enemies.

[@theinsfrijonds]

I didn’t find the upgrade system for God of War 2018 to be that rewarding either. It was really weird because right when I unlocked Niflheim and the lava place, I went to them and did their challenges but only got gear that was at best slightly better than what I would’ve gotten if I just progressed the story. Sindris gear so much better in general. Also dont play that game on hard your first time.

[@Siul_987]

I completed ragnarok on the highest difficulty available which was give me god of war and the gearing of god of war is kind of similar to this, both exist almost as a decoration, yes upgrading/new gear increase stats but they feel forced on the structure of the game and barely felt rewarding.

[@phant0mdummy]

​@@Siul_987yea it's shallow and poor design.

[@Kalan3rd]

Yes a fair comparison the only reason why it's being pointed at so heavily here is cause it's tagged to the ff name and even then some games in the franchise it's self have gear systems that are close to meaningless unless your looking for like a 10 to 20 damage increae

[@vivid8979]

You will not go to any God of War game and expects an in-depth gearing system.. It's like DMC where you get the weapon from a boss and then have some moveset upgrades and that's it.... Not in a Mainline Final Fantasy tho.. The lack of party member to customize their gear doesn't help as well..

[@Siul_987]

@@vivid8979 I mean… I agree but come on both ffxvi, god of war 2018 and ragnarok have very dumb kind of fakes numbers that go up with every gear change and upgrade. I would rather DMC it and not have any number at all at that point.

[@Frozenbozo]

while it may not be a perfect game. the highs are so insanely high that it really carries the experience of the game, and still 100% currently deserves GoTY.

[@Sweetzluf]

As much as I love the game, I do not think it’ll beat Zelda on that front but I would not be mad either way. But if Soken does not win for best music… This year is insane with the games. Every gamer wins this year.

[@Frozenbozo]

@@Sweetzluf Was never much of a Zelda player so I cant say much on that, but I have heard nothing but good things. Its gonna be a very close competition.

[@papasfritas3853]

In single player FF games you always aim for the best endgame weapon. All the other stuff in the middle doesnt matter.

[@brucexu3471]

I actually like bounties&hunts in this game. The fact that u have to find the actual location of bosses make it feels like a real hunt

[@Vkec1]

The side quests get progressively better but they could have done a culling of a 10 or so. Or adjusted when they unlocked so you don't feel overwhelmed by how many you 'have' to do . One of the earliest quests i enjoyed not because of the gameplay but the consequences later was the apple/farm quest in the first quarter of the game. The payoff for that was 😢

[@RockR277]

I think something they coulda done to fix the gearing, at least for the swords, would be to have them not affect damage, but instead improve a certain set of abilities. Have all the eikon weapons be their own thing instead of a vertical tree and let them strenghthen their related eikonic abilities, and have the normal swords strengthen some core abilities.

[@gearhead417]

I think the problem with that is it pigeon holds people into only using the things that their gear gives a boost to instead of what they find fun to use. Its the Diablo 3 problem.

[@RockR277]

@@gearhead417 Nah, I don't think so. It would strengthen hat you already use. You would choose to equip what fits your playstyle. It's not a random drop. Game already has plenty of ability accessorie, I wouldn't say they make me feel pidgeon-holed

[@CL-jq1xs]

@@gearhead417 or it makes them use gear that fit their preferred playstyle. Then crafting comes to mind.... just craft gears that make the build you like more fun.

[@Kat1kafka]

I love both old and new style of FF's gameplay. But to me gameplay was always secondary because what Final Fantasy to me is the story they tell,the characters, the music and the world, which have always been masterpieces(except Lighting returns),and as a ff and dmc dragon's dogma fan i have to FF16 is masterpiece to me

[@Cassandra_Solidor]

One of the major criticisms I've had towards Yoshida is his insistent that customization isn't worthwhile because players will always min/max it. Now in a MMO, you can understand that logic because it's a multi-player game. In a single player game, people are far more likely to experiment with sub-optimal builds that just seem fun. Case in point, Tifa is the strongest character in Remake but that isn't going to stop people from making her a mage. FFXVI is a fantastic game but you can definitely see where Yoshida's MMO background may have hurt some aspects of it.

[@k.vn.k]

Don’t forget to add “In my opinion”. IMHO works too.

[@k.vn.k]

I certainly disagree, it’s not what this game about. In my opinion this game is about taking you along the journey, which is very well crafted, so that you too can experience the way they want you to experience it. Everything else including gearing and builds are minimised.

[@lothar3073]

Yoshida doesn't know anything about RPGs, FF14 and FF16 are proof of it.

[@eddaggett56]

The side quests are definitely backloaded. All the endgame ones are pretty good imo and have some great storytelling in them. It’s unfortunate that they start off so rough and are basically FFXIV side quests. They still kinda feel like FFXIV side quests near the end but the better kind imo. Also yeah the most obvious flaw of the game is the gearing system needed to be more fleshed out. Even with all that I still enjoyed at a 10/10 level. I finished the game this morning and liked the ending. The villain could’ve been better but didn’t take away from my enjoyment of beating the game

[@DaDuJuGo]

I really wonder how he is gonna like FF12 hearing his thoughts and issues on FF16 so far. While it has other issues, I think 12 handled those things pretty well instead.

[@Eversoul12]

i want 12s meat and gameplay with a story on the same level as FF7 or 14. Its honestly sad that 12s gameplay set the bar so high that modern FF hasnt been able to even match its depth the last 3 mainline titles. Hunts actually felt organic in FF12 and the rare game spawns added a sense of mystery to the world with their specific spawn conditions. It was the last FF game that had meaningful strategy building as well.

[@thorinhannahs4614]

My take is that FF12 handled hunts and gear better. You do hunts and get rare drops not knowing what they are for and then the bazaar suddenly has a high combo ninja sword available. The secrets were great as well. You explore and stumble upon Adremmalech or some summon and get annihilated. Go back with an appropriate gear and gambit load out and win a new summon.

[@inthebeginning4751]

FF12 was easily a 10/10 game in my book. Had so much fun with that one.

[@solugad]

Yeah 12's a top 3 FF in my opinion

[@blkwng]

For me ff16 has been a good 9/10. But can defintively see some pacing issues. There were some moments, especially when they tried to get more lighthearted in tone, that it brought down my enjoyment. I think if they would have simply gotten rid of those lighter tones in some of the quests(like getting mid's engine, ugh) e en if the game was shorter, it would have been better.

[@Mogel-]

I definitely agree with most of this, though I enjoy the side quests way more than you (though gameplay wise they're definitely nothing special). It's an excellent game for what it is (Combat, story, characters, visuals), but I feel it does lack these things you talk about, and probably mostly for me is the loot/gear stuff, which could make exploration way more engaging as well. As a completionist, I also think the game is exceptionally easy (except for the first 2 S ranks), and wish they had a hard mode (or at least a mode that was scaled to doing all side quests and hunts) before unlocking the hardest in NG+. Personally, I think the negatives are very much outshined by the positives, and as I'm close to the end(I think at least), I would probably land on a 9/10 or maybe even 9.5/10 because I like the good parts so much that they almost outweigh the negatives completely for me

[@inzone88]

I could see them patching some things in the future for a few things based on the feedback they are receiving.

[@juggernaut6666]

they should have just removed weapon and "armor" stats just leave the accessories then unlock sword apperances and use whichever you like. after the first 4 hours i stopped looking at weapon stats if it was new i throw it on. if a new one pops up at the blacksmith grab it upgrade to +2 immediately without looking at the stats its always better.

[@janstraka8674]

I love the game. I love the story, the combat and the feel of the world. Also Soken going ham is great to hear. I dont mind the gearing process, as I never was a fan of "Build-a-bear" kind of gearing, but I know for some people it´s not that way. Side quests are..... ARR level. You can find some good there, but overall, its go there, fetch this, done. Ultimately, though, a lot of the enjoyment is up to the player to engage with the characters and their story. I see this as an amazing game that nevertheless has some deal-breakers for some people. Not me, but I can see it not being for everyone.

[@KaliWaggles]

Completely agree about gearing but disagree about side quests. I don't think it's people being disingenuous; I genuinely liked about 75% of them becuase of the world building and how they develop side characters. I do, however, think that the pacing of them is off. They also lock them off too frequently when you begin part of an MSQ mission (you got excalibur about 5-10 hours later than I did because I did it immediately and you had it locked for ages). As for the music, I sort of agree but there really isn't anything else to spend gil on, so I don't mind as much. The game needs some other things to buy, even if these are just outfits or accessories.

[@blackfox4138]

I feel like something that would've really helped this game is to frankly just remove a lot of the RPG elements and strictly focus on the combat. Rather than adding an arbitrary and frankly redundant crafting system, just let us gain a new weapon everytime we gain an Eikon and possibly give each weapon varying properties like in the DMC games.

[@veselinrankov7322]

Currently doing a second playthrough on hard mode. Must say, it has been a while since I enjoyed a game so thoroughly (maybe since Nioh 2 or starting ff14 - albeit for different reasons). The gameplay was a bit easy during the first playthrough, but I completely expected that from a story focused game and is not a complain at all. The difficulty is starting to ramp up now, but I am quite early into my second playthrough (haven't reached the 5 year timeskip yet). During my first playthrough, I loved the side quests. Some were simplistic yeah, but the world building they did was worth it. Some even ended with cool bosses. Every time new greens popped up on the map I was excited, never felt like they were a drag. Only thing I can say about bounties is that there weren't enough. Th renown system was kinda just there, not sure what the purpose was, but it was nice having some free loot to claim when you get back to the hideout. The simplistic gearing was a joy to witness. There hasn't been a game, mmo or otherwise, that has made me interested in complicated crafting. I think the upgradeable green quality swords are meant as a crutch for people who need more dps to have an option rather than getting stuck and frustrated, which I can understand if it is the case.I just stuck to upgrading my purple sword and the couple of yellow swords. On hard mode I can see a few more options when visiting Blackthorne, but I haven't fiddled enough with them to comment. In regards to the music, I bought all of it during my first playthrough and ended with 300k gil, which I can confidently say will be enough to cover my expenses during my hard mode playthrough. I didn't do any excessive grinding (I don't even know if you can), except doing all sidequests and bounties. Overall would definitely give it a 10/10 in terms of personal enjoyment I got from the game. Definitely my favourite FF game ( not including 14 in the comparison since it's an mmo) by a large mile - fenomenal story writing (it's the Heavensward writing team, so I didn't rly expect otherwise), very fun and engaging gameplay with a look of room for customization, finally an FF main character that doesn't make me cringe at every interaction with other human beings (looking at you, Cloud).

[@Lctl10]

GG on the adventure - was an awesome ride Gav and Dion True Kings

[@None38389]

Review scores are arbitrary at best, there's really no point in discussing why it is or isn't a certain score. Everyone have their own measures and if it's a 10/10 for you then it is a 10/10 for you, doesn't really matter what score other people gave it.

[@gildedgrimoire7733]

Played through the whole thing and loved it, gotta say tho I just couldn't bring myself to do all the side quests, by the time I reached the 2nd to last major plot point I just quit doing them. Interrupting the pace of the msq just to fight some bees or something just doesn't feel good.

[@zetton1374]

Honestly this game didnt need gearing, crafting, or a semi open world even. The best action games are well paced with tightly designed levels designed to take you from beggining to end in one awesome ride which makes the replay value amazing. Replaying FF16 in Final Fantasy mode is very slow especially since the difficulty doesnt rise that much, the arcade mode is the only relief because the tightly designed levels you can replay on higher difficulty outshine the exploring through the world getting stuff for Mid. IMO it shouldn't have been "Go gather things around the world for my ship" it should have been "lets raid these bandit engineers to get what we need" or something along those lines, some excuse for more action instead of gathering stuff and chatting to people.

[@notrewe]

I agree about the gearing system and if I can wish for something, the Eikon weapons should be different upgrade trees, like u can choose upgrade the Garuda one and envolve this one, and each eikon weapon will change a bit your combo or something to express the eikon personality . That said the game already give you a lots of customization by choosing your 3 main Eikons and how you make your own Clive build, and some sense it’s more customizable than others FF, cause the characters always will play like they are supposed to. My favorite on building party and customization is FF tatics of course. But when I remember, FF9, my fav, it’s kinda fixed. So instead of they focusing on gear, they focused on the abilities tree. I prefer if we have booth,of course, but they are trying being very accessible. The first half side quest are kinda more miss than hit, the last ones are quite good, they still keep the same structure just is clear the last ones are more well produced . But the first impression matters more, so it’s a bad side of the game. I can see way they make some decisions but disagree with the decision makes. The story I enjoyed a lot and also the combat, Final Fantasy mode is looking fun so far. That being said, it’s a long game to be required to play one time to start a hard mode. I’m happy with the game cause they delivered a good story and I can see they put a lot of care on that part also the showdowns. So it’s a question about you care most on the game.

[@reshypoo9447]

Issue with a heavy focus on story, is that it leaves little room for replayability. In prior games you might go hours between the next story beat, so the "everything else" was the majority of what you were doing. But since they already offer NG+ and "do it again" options to cater to combat enthusiasts, there's really no reason to play it a second time.

[@brohogany9920]

Yes I wonder what they're going to do with NG+ because either way it doesn't seem good. They either keep all the cutscenes in with no way to skip or player just endlessly have to skip cut scenes to get to the small slivers of gameplay between

[@Dinosberg]

I feel like Preach would absolutely love Dragon Quest XI.

[@trying2b689]

I'm glad I waited. I'll get this on sale

[@2Deniya]

Uh... I ended up with 400.000 gil and nothing to spend it on in the normal game, including having bought all the music Scrolls. Nah, those are not for new game plus xD (I did not grind at all at any moment, I even skipped encounters with the chocobo)