PreSonus Quantum 4848 v.s. Dangerous Music Convert AD+ | Part 4

[@JeanmarkRodriguez]

Like I mentioned in the comments on a KZbin Live video of yours. I have the Lynx Aurora 16. That is my main a/d and d/a in the studio. I noticed a great difference because all my mix enters and comes out through that in individual tracks to my gear and then back in. You will notice way more difference if all your channels came out through a great set of converters -> to all your analog gear and then print back to the DAW with it If I high end company like Lynx, Antelope or any other that has converters of 32 channels or more can lend you those converters that would be a great test video. With that we could hear once and for all if going up the chain on gear is worth it. Coming out the PreSonus to later get back in on another 2 channel converter I imagined you wouldn’t hear a difference. I believe your bottleneck here is the PreSonus Quantum. The thing is what we mostly want is the audio to enter our analog gear the best and clean way posible without our converter interfering in the audio. Also your playback system for your monitors is the PreSonus if im not mistaken. If you can utilize the playback system of another converter you’ll be able to notice more subtle changes done while mixing and everything else. Thanks for the video!

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

Thanks for the support! If a company wants to send me a 32 I/O box I will certainly test it but I am sure no company will because they dont want to run the risk of me saying that its not really any "better" than the 4848's.

[@Doctaj54]

Thanks. I watched part 1 and liked Mix#3 from the KZbin video. I download the files and was able to hear the differences immediately. Protools 2023.6, Apollo X8p, Drawmer MC3.1, Adam A77x. All three sound good and can be tweaked to match after the fact with a tiny bit of EQ. Anyway... Mix#3 had the most topend clarity and openness out of all three files. Mix#1 had some topend but a tiny bit more bottom end vs Mix#3. Mix#2 was similar to Mix#1 but had the least topend clarity of the three files. I will watch the other videos when I have time to see which mix was what converter.

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

Great, thanks

[@braxal6983]

Dave I really think you and David did a excellent and thorough job testing the converters and I 100% agree with the results. Like you said if you want to color the sound you can do that in processing or in the mix. I appreciate all your hard work and respect everyone's opinion.

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

Thanks Braxal!

[@pellevastano]

It is definitely interesting how little of a difference there was from the Quantum and the Dangerous, but also I'm not that surprised, and I would imagine that pretty much every other converter on the market that has the goal of transparent conversion would fair similar to both of these units, and that is a testament to how good the manufacturing of the audio conversion semi-conductors has become since most of us have been producing audio. I would imagine even lower level audio interfaces are surprisingly competitive.

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

I may do that exact test at one point. Try a $500 converter and see how much different it is. I'll bet its pretty darn close

[@JohnMichaelFord]

I have three Presonus Quantum interfaces, two are 4848s. I had one modded for increased headroom but was surprised when it came back sounding sonically better. I use a ton of i/o and these improvements really show up for me when I mix through the console. A 5% improvement across 64 channels adds up in a big way. It would be more subjective (less important) when only comparing stereo prints. I ended up modding all three interfaces, going back to recall old mixes and could hear clear improvement.

[@JeanmarkRodriguez]

@@JohnMichaelFord that sounds interesting. What company modded your 4848s? I saw that Black Lion audio modded the PreSonus gear but not the 4848

[@pellevastano]

@@JohnMichaelFord When you say better, what was specifically better about the sound? Would also be curious what the specific mod was.

[@martijn_nl]

The Burl B2 ADC is something special! You will definitely hear the difference. Hopefully Sweetwater will ship one soon!

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

We did those videos already and they are coming soon

[@rsbcenter]

​@@MixingMusicAnalognot going to hear much of a difference. The burls are getting outdated. Their chips are old.

[@Bhallmed]

@@rsbcenterla2a, fairchilds, and neve tech is old too. So it must be bad and dated now.

[@sekritskworl-sekrit_studios]

I'd be VERY curious about BOTH the Lynx Aurora(n) and the RME ADI-2 Pro FS BE.

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

I dont have access to those units so it wont be happening on this channel, sorry

[@Bhallmed]

Rme black addition is suppose to outstanding

[@dspoet1]

Ima just stick with my Apollo X6 and the outboard gear I have with it. At this point, as you stated, people will say their brand of interface or converters will sound better than the competition. It’s really about preference. I recently had a conversation with a trustworthy audio insider. This is what he said about the Apollo X series. We did blind shootouts at Sweetwater in 2018 before launch, and the Apollo X6 and X8 beat out the competition. This was with 200 sales engineers. That was enough for me to stick the Apollo X series interfaces.

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

Yes, stick with what you have. There is no reason to sell them. Also, don't believe everything you hear form SW sales engineers. You want the "real" truth about some of this stuff, come here! :)

[@kos.studio9304]

I come from lynx Aurora 16 old model to quantum 4848. I noticed lynx is so flat and clean but quantum is colored a little bit on high frequency. Not a train ears will hear difference whatsoever so I decided to sell lynx. My 2 cents experience here. Thanks uncle dave and all my fellow audio engineers.

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

Thanks for sharing

[@kevinbatchelor9566]

Interested to hear your MBC results. I saw another reviewer A/B that against the Apollo X16 and there was a pretty glaring difference in favor of the MBC. Even when using the conversion from the X16 and clocking it with the MBC made an appreciable difference.

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

Coming soon!

[@Spunkbreaker]

completelly agree, just to let you know: I own a dangerous conver8, the dangerous source and the canderous 2bus+, but it is different from the AD+. The AD+ cost near 4000Eur....I can instead buy a Fussion (2000 eur) and still having 2000 more eur for buying extra equipment...Bettermaker Limiter for example, which have 2 types of distortion units inside. I think the a Bettermaker Limiter and a Fussion will make much higher impact on the result than just a AD+ Converter....and I am not talking about subtle differences like in your 4 series videos, With the combination of those 2 gears you will hear clear differences.

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

You are correct. The fusion and the Bettermaker will have far more impact

[@analogrich]

I've got the Presonus 4848 and a Forssell MADC-4, All plugged into my SoundCraft Delta DLX (modded). This setup works for me, I'm prettty much done with conversion. I'm spending my hard earned money on other items my studio needs.

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

Hey, that is a great setup and if its working for you then that's great!

[@rsbcenter]

The forsell used to be a great mastering grade converter years ago. But its outdated now

[@analogrich]

@@rsbcenter I’d love to be able to afford the latest and greatest, I just don’t have those funds available to me. If you can that’s great and all the power to you.

[@davidchurch8828]

Well done on this series of tests Dave. Really enjoyed it. I agree and feel I would have made the same decision.

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

Thanks!

[@gwsound]

Usually the sound difference between converters is more then noticeable. So I wonder why you don’t hear a difference. What monitor speakers / headphone do you use?

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

Using Focal monitors and Nuemann headphone

[@nicolasmelgarejo]

What I think is that there isn't really much difference with the converters, I think that all the manufacturers just add extra functions just to stand out from others like the example of Dangerous... as in my case to capture on recording I use the Antelope Orion 32, a fairly old audio card but it gives me 32 inputs and 32 outputs with a good conversion quality that adjusts the studio workflow, and for mixing or mastering I use the HDX, due to the limiter function that brings an improvement to my workflow and for my taste in the mix it gives better quality to my work... always... and it's a philosophy of mine... the best audio equipment that exists is the one you can afford... Always continue with the Excellent content... It helps a lot to those who can't make up their minds when it comes to investing! Thanks for the excellent work and effort! Success always!

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

I have looked at those Orions before but every person I have ever spoken to about them say that their software is a absolute nightmare to use so I never considering them. How do you get along with it?

[@Bhallmed]

@@MixingMusicAnalogI’ve heard horrible things about Antelope stability and service.

[@jpmcrft]

Can you compare focusrite units ? Red 16 line

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

No, I dont have access to that gear, sorry

[@jpmcrft]

@@MixingMusicAnalog Could you possibly do a comparison/review of the ssl six 500 series channel strip ? Compared to the big ssl console ? Thank you 😃

[@muyeikasamurabi1602]

Hello and great mini series! I first found your channel while trying to find out more about the 4848. However, I was too late as it was already discontinued. Do you happen to know why they discontinued it?

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

I am not sure why they discontinued it. I hear there may be an updated version com ing out at one point.

[@AkiyoshiBeats]

Definitely would enjoy seeing a RND MBC test and review 🫡

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

Coming soon!

[@georgeconte5607]

I wonder if the sonic difference would have been more obvious had your SSL Origin been taken out of the equation. Either way, thanks for the effort you guys put into the comparison - saves us a lot of time & expense!

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

Maybe, but why would I ever do a test like that? The whole point of these tests is to see how the gear fits into "MY" setup with my console and outboard. If someone else wants to do that test, have at it! :)

[@dab7963]

The Burl B2 is AMAZING. I wish I would have bought one a long time ago. It sounds so amazing. Yes it's colored but how it does it is beautiful.

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

The B2 is know for its color

[@dab7963]

@@MixingMusicAnalog highly recommended. I love mine

[@Bhallmed]

I have the Burl B1D and b1 mic pres. And they add a special sauce and weight.

[@gfromshankside]

Good insight. Thanks.

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

You're welcome!

[@gwsound]

I gave it some thoughts regarding your test between the Presonus and the Dangerous Music AD+, and I might have the explanation why they sound the same. As far as I understood the test setup, you use the Presonus 4848 as output from the computer into the board and then record back into the computer through the AD+ or Presonus, right? This means that all the width, depth and sound within the music is already defined by the Presonus output (and it character) + the mixing board. Since the Dangerous Music AD+ is used in the full transparent mode it will not add anything to it what’s not in the source already. This explains why both recordings sound -more or less- the same. An more honest way to do this comparison is by recording a live playing instrument or drum-computer or vocals or synthesizer. In this situation you can compare what the Dangerous Music and the Presonus will pick up from the source and put into the recording. I think that is a fairer test. Can you do this as well? Hope this helps in the explanation what happened.

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

A more "honest way". That implies we are not being honest here? :) Anyway, no, I am not going to play live instruments and do that test. As I said multiple times, these tests are to see how the gear fit's into "MY" current setup / rig. Not test a bunch of configurations that I will never use in this studio. If someone else wants to do that test, great! send us the video link once you have done it and we will check it out.

[@gwsound]

@@MixingMusicAnalog "more honest" implies that you give the AD+ unit a chance to shine in its own right by providing an unlimited source material. I understand your testing approach but viewers can easily jump to the conclusion that the AD+ has no added value. Which, based on your test, can not be concluded at all.

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

Correct, because in my rig it really has no added value. but I did say several times that the Dangerous Music is a wonderful piece of gear and actually recommend it if someone is in need for a good stereo A/D converter. So that's that on this particular piece of gear. People can use the info as 1 data point and use it to help them with their own decision.

[@greenloungerecording9362]

This reminds me of the quantum and Apollo comparison videos you did. Just like in that video series, my old ears couldn’t really tell any difference between the 2 converters. The takeaway for me is that from an audio quality viewpoint there just isn’t much in this at all. You might want to look at the features which are important to you, and make your decision accordingly. From a long term capital investment into your studio, really anything closely tied to the computer will probably be worth zero in 15 years. Compare that with quality mics, analog hardware, musical instruments. If you want to improve the quality of your mixes, looking at the converters is probably a waste of time.

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

Well said

[@gwsound]

I use the meter on the DM AD+ all the time.

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

Great!

[@dab7963]

Why did they discontinue the 4848 if it was their flagship ?

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

Not sure to be honest. Probably due to it not selling as much as their lower priced items.

[@CP-mt1st]

I guess it had something to do with fender buying personus. @@MixingMusicAnalog

[@jroz8111]

Hey brother coming off an ssl the burl is gonna be the best in my opinion. These two are clean captures. I used to have a G+ I tried a bunch different ones. I find the burl gives it something the others didn't have. It pairs with the ssl center section best. Love the videos keep them up brother. Looking forward to the new course! For the record the burl can be extremely clean also pending your transformer and level settings. I now run a lavry and burl capture There is def a difference.

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

The Burl videos have already been done. They are coming soon.

[@pascalmerschaudio]

I´m glad you dont buy it dave. from my point of view .....I love RME i see in the US ......RME is not so known. I spend now 3 Grand in the RME UFX 3 the endless possibilitys to route and the AD DA converters are another World for me. They are well known on TV Productions and Live shows and Studio but more in Europe then US. I hope someday you can hear the new UFX 3 with the new Chipset , and love to see a Review from you. btw....Love your Videos Dave ;)

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

The UFX3 is about a $3,000 interface correct? I would bet anything its no "better" than the 4 other boxes we have already tired. which by the way are all great pieces of equipment.

[@Sinapsya]

Try the Rupert Neve Design converter

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

videos have been done coming soon!

[@rsbcenter]

No difference . Neve is not making great boxes lately their new 88m is not selling that much

[@rsbcenter]

You guys did a great job with these comparison videos . I dont think you are going to hear much of a difference on any converters. Until you get to mastering grade converters. I wouldnt spend a dime on dangerous music stuff. They are no where near top end stuff. I have already posted what is the top end converters. Try to get a hold of a anubis pro older version or the new neumann mt48. Also you are trying out older converters in 2023. Not going to be any differences. Not even burl they havent updated their converters. The chips they are using is older stuff. I think where you will hear a difference starting with the lynx stuff. Maybe some of the rme mastering grade converters. Again top end is stagetec nexus .dad ax32 new version and merging technologies stuff (which is what the top mastering engineer houses are using).. i know you are into sweetwater. Never bought anything from them. Everything they have ever reccommended to me was nonsense. Guitar center thr same.

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

I hear ya, but my "gut" tell me that there are too many people who throw around the word "mastering grade converter" and its just yet another buzz word that most people dont understand just like "null test". LOL. I would love to compare a true "mastering grade converter" if a company wants to loan me one. However, I am sure no company will do that because they already know that chances are we are not going to hear some remarkable difference and the cost of said "mastering grade converter" is going to cost north of $5k. So, I dont think that teat will ever be done here. LOL. Here's another thing I dont get.....what the heck does it mean when you say we are testing "old" converters? Like the converter chips from 5 years ago are no good anymore? Do they wear out over time? I know grammy award winning mixing engineers that use converters from 10 year ago. LOL. Again, I personally think, and until I can someone actually prove me wrong by sending me the piece of gear so I can actually hear it, all this stuff about converters is mostly marketing nonsense. They are buzz words that people think really matter but really dont. At least that is what I have experienced thus far. Maybe I will be proven wrong at one point and if I am, I will be the first one to make the video telling everyone how wrong I was. Anyone reading this want to loan me a "mastering grade converter" so we can see how wrong i really am? I am here! :)

[@rsbcenter]

@@MixingMusicAnalog i am waiting on the arrival of a merging anubis. I still have my 2022 antelope desktop. As soon as i receive it i will make a comparison video. There are other comparison videos out there. But why areall the big mastering engineers . I am talking the major label ones . Using the merging technologies hapi and horus now for the last few years. Why?. Be ause there is a difference. When i mean old converters. I mean the chips that they are using along with the technology that is implemented along with the chips. The new tech that is making a differeence is the newer chips implemented with newer technologies used to bring higher headroom etc. With no noise floor. Believe me there is a difference . Its just the europeans are leading the way in this technology. American companies are just not catching up with the lastest technologies. The only one trying to do it is ferrofish from what i heard. But the dont have a unit yet that is up to.par with the technology the europeans are uding like the merging stuff and stagetec. When even the library of congress is using your tech and brans to archive recordings. Including companies like universal music. They have the money to do the research in advance and try put every converter they wish. Why would they choose the mergong technology converters over all others? Thats a big question that i think would be worth looking into. And in case you do not believe it universal recordx yhe largest label in the world . Has a video out on the merging technologies website they made themselves showing that their archive divion is using it to archive olf anwlog recordings.. WHy? .. why not the b2 bomber. Or the dangerous music converters or the 48-8. Why not?.

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

Great! I look forward to your video. So, how much is the mastering grade converter you are getting cost? My guess it's way outside my budget but I am just curious.

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

are you speaking of this box as a mastering grade converter www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/MT48--neumann-mt-48-4-by-8-usb-c-audio-interface

[@rsbcenter]

@@MixingMusicAnalog kzbin.info/www/bejne/mGq7l3yombqdldE. Shoot out between the neumann and apollo.. yes the neumann is the same as the anubis pro version. Same converters and preamps. I bought the anubis premium

[@paultp12cora24]

I Got The Neve MBC Works For Me

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

We have the videos for that box coming soon!

[@zonarecordingstudio]

Way cheaper than my Radar Convertors ,to bad they discontinued them

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

Thanks for watching!

[@oldtreefarm]

Still think the age of the listener can make a difference. Old ears don’t hear as well. I know that first hand. Lol

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

We cant do anything about that now can we? LOL

[@JSSTUDIO-wr2jq]

🙂👍

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

Thank you!

[@zonarecordingstudio]

I had the burl ,great box, sold it, the radar does the trick for me.

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

Right on

[@JohnMichaelFord]

I've heard radar is where it's at! I've been tempted to sell my quantum interfaces to get a radar rig.

[@gravesg]

Apogee Symphony Mk2 still sounds better than both of these, print a mix on one, apogee sounds like tape with massive headroom.

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

Yea, Yea, Yea.....no matter which box we test someone thinks "their" box will best them all....LOL..just teasing. Hey, If Apogee wants to send me a unit to test, I will be glad to do so but they wont :(

[@gravesg]

@@MixingMusicAnalog Good point, apogee has had the same flagship since 2016 tho .... and mastering houses love the units, everyone else has brand new hardware out except them.. it was the only reason i gave them a shot. Low and behold .. the headroom and spatial image were a notch above anything 2k and below. The Neumann MT-48 has the same chip setup as the symphony.. look at the reviews on it.

[@bighousemusic628]

No contest the presonus quantum destroys that dangerous ad+

[@MixingMusicAnalog]

Thanks for watching!