Previously On…| 4-Sided Dive | Episode 11: Discussing Up To C3E52

[@theonionqueen3519]

Ashton’s dynamic with Laudna is so interesting. Laudna had no say in her first death, she was tricked and betrayed, and she woke up alone, looking like a monster. She was alone for so long, but somehow she has found people who love her, she’s found her own piece of happiness, she’s turned out relatively ok. So if Laudna can go through all of that, and still be a good, happy person, then there must be something wrong with Ashton, from his perspective. But they don’t want to admit that, so they want to poke and pick and claw until he finds something wrong with Laudna, so he can say “Look! It isn’t just me! Life truly is just horrible, and we’re all miserable!” “You can’t be as unlucky as me, and still be this happy, because if that’s true, then that means there’s something wrong with *me,* something *I* need to fix. Ands that’s not right, because that means all this time I’ve spent miserable, angry, and alone has been for nothing.”

[@TimpanistMoth_AyKayEll]

Nailed it.

[@trzynasty909]

To a certain point - yes. But then I feel like Ashton does have a fairly easy explanation - he wasn't really dealt the same hand. They both died and it sucked, sure, but Laudna is just a little cold to touch. He is falling apart ever since. For her there was a fresh start, even though she wasn't accepted by society. He was, but his physical life is just shit ever since then. So it wasn't for nothing, or rather, it does have a clear cause.

[@allylavender3023]

@@trzynasty909 Plus there’s a difference between waking up alone because everyone else is dead and waking up alone because your “family” decided you weren’t worth it. Not saying one’s more or less traumatic than the other, just that there’s a distinction here that’s shaped their worldviews.

[@smashbrandiscootch719]

Yes, that is pretty much exactly what the cast said.

[@Drekromancer]

@@allylavender3023 That's a good point. On some level, I think Ashton's trauma would fuck with one's ability to trust others or care about themselves a lot more than Laudna's trauma. Laudna experienced something truly horrible at the hands of a monster, but she knows that most people are okay and trying their best. But Ashton wasn't just left alone - they were abandoned. Repeatedly. That does some shit to people's heads.

[@elliekitabjian2069]

29:57 Liam describing Orym with the Bell’s Hells as “trying to be Keyleth but EVERYONE is Grog” 😂😂

[@4persephone]

So he is either going to either ascend to a higher level of consciousness and become a tribe/leader God if they succeed. Or he'll flip and win by become the God OF the chaos Gremlins is what you're saying. 😂

[@vomitfountain]

​@@4persephoneJust as long as he doesn't end up polymorphing himself into a goldfish.😮

[@timfriday9106]

yeah that shit cracked me up so hard. lol

[@BoojumFed]

Reminds me of an eerily accurate description of the characters from 'Mob Psycho 100'; One really sweet, kindhearted protagonist and everyone else is just "Oops! All Lancers!"

[@Quadraxis]

Liam saying "You won a BAFTA" is peak Ashley energy.

[@jetvulcan2020]

"you wouldn't know it " oh Ashley your so great

[@deaconstjohn4842]

She won 2 actually 😂

[@littlefurnace]

​@@deaconstjohn4842 and deserved more

[@Kosukie]

100% XD

[@C33Fernandez]

And now it's time for and with that

[@PianoMyHeart]

i love how the opening conversation started as a bit and then became an actual conversation.

[@blackpeoplestorytime802]

Legitimately the best part

[@SPACEHARICE]

Most conversations start like that

[@AdmirableRedPanda]

And may it always be that way...until we find out Pate' was the true evil master mind in the moon.

[@thisiscait]

They often do!

[@TheKrilicious]

I want a one-shot, or ExU-style mini-series, of Beau and Caleb hunting mages from the Cerberus Assembly, or other rogue mages causing trouble

[@troikas3353]

One shots would be great, but I'm also hoping we get a couple novels centered around that. I feel like Caleb and Beau vs the Assembly and their machinations is the perfect set up for an Exandrian fantasy-noir detective novel series

[@KristenWood317]

I would also go for a comic series.

[@rachelbreault700]

I think this is going to be an amazing opportunity for animation!

[@mayaenglish5424]

Only if it's set after this C3 stuff and there's real risk involved, otherwise I'm a little meh on all of the flash back mini series ideas. New evil wizard, new danger, new fight? Heck yeah! Flashback to Balthazar or whoever where we already know they win because they show up here in C3, meh, no thanks. (I'm totally fine with a book/ comic exploring that storyline, that sounds great, but a toothless one shot doesn't appeal imho).

[@Lucarioguild7]

​@@KristenWood317 Seconding this, I'd love a comic of this

[@caedodice]

Long time no see all. Likes and comments are appreciated so others can see this. ❤ 4SD Ep 11 Timestamps 0:00 - Previously on… 0:38 - Pickles and Cucumbers 1:22 - Kentucky MF Drink 2:30 - Rollin for Tavern Keep 3:19 - Ashley is Tavern Keep 4:55 - Moppo! Broomie’s Replacement 5:09 - BAFTA Winner Ashley Johnson 5:57 - Intro actually starts 6:22 - WTF is Up with That 6:42 - The Fey Realm 6:58 - Nana Morri and the Bird House 9:18 - Fearne’s Friends and Cathy 9:44 - Ashley’s visit to Versailles 10:45 - Fearne’s Wildshape 12:19 - Destroying the Key 12:37 - Feelings on the Fey Realm 13:40 - Kathy 14:00 - Fey Dragon 14:39 - Portable Hole Idea 15:35 - Fey Entity on the Dragon 16:26 - Dani reminding the cast of lore during episodes 16:58 - The Apogee Solstice (Medium) 18:36 - Caleb & Beau 19:08 - Expecting Caleb 20:16 - Low level and Ludinus 20:33 - Caleb getting Collared 20:48 - Enjoying Failure (and Skyship Plan) 21:45 - Keyleth and Vax 22:29 - Unable to Sleep 22:48 - Liam’s Thought Process (The Attack on Zephrah) 24:25 - What if a Character is dead 24:46 - Last Leaf on the Tree 25:30 - Beau & Caleb better be fine 25:57 - Separated (Where’s the trio at?) 26:47 - Backwards in Time 27:30 - Keyleth getting curb stomped 28:20 - Last of Us Reference 28:38 - Fearne misses Orym (Morally Gray + Orym) 30:10 - Keyleth surrounded by Grogs 30:40 - Dark Orym (Liam dodges the question) 31:06 - The Guests 33:02 - Made to mess with Sam and Travis 33:26 - Watching from the sidelines 35:00 - Travis’ expressions 35:58 - Tower of Inquiry 36:57 - Marisha pulls a block 37:20 - What has been your favorite scene that your character wasn’t a part of? 40:19 - Liam pulls a block 40:49 - What have you discovered about your character that has surprised you the most? 42:28 - Winners and losers or interventionist gods 42:55 - Laudna and Ashton conversations 45:42 - Orym’s backstory thoughts 46:20 - Exandrian Mind Palace 47:20 - Synthetic Memories 48:05 - Ashley loves making the others uncomfortable 49:47 - Travis’ reaction to Fearne’s decisions 50:32 - Tal picks a block 51:04 - Daily Routines 52:45 - Not Trusting Pate 53:36 - Ashton’s Routines (Pain Management 54:21 - Chronic Pain (Dani pitches in) 56:29 - Ashley picks a block 57:02 - Do you have any favorite spell or class feature that you love using? Which one is the most fun? 58:28 - And now it’s time for… And with that. 58:39 - The Deep Dive 59:11 - Liam goes first or does Ashley? 59:43 - How is Orym feeling, knowing that he is the one who called Keyleth in for this mission with the Ruby Vanguard and that he now has an answer for why Zephrah was attacked? 1:00:44 - Ashton possibly could be connected to the dark Ashari cult 1:01:04 - No matter what you say Liam, Orym’s gonna turn at some point 1:01:14 - Delilah in Orym 1:01:33 - Is Fearne worried about her own magic, since things seem a little topsy-turvy? 1:02:10 - EXU Duo separation (Dog Walker not present) 1:03:24 - Only Sending was Affected (School of Magic look up) 1:03:55 - What was it like for Laudna to watch Imogen struggle with her choices? Did Laudna ever feel a similar conflict regarding the Ruby Vanguard? 1:05:28 - Cyclical 1:05:40 - Sending is an Evocation Spell 1:05:58 - Getting rid of the gods, but also the consequence of releasing Predathos 1:06:58 - Understanding Imogen’s struggle, but also Laudna was murdered by these people (Sarenrae brought Laudna back) 1:08:06 - Can’t deny the gods exist 1:08:42 - Limogen (New ship name, folks? Or just a drink) 1:09:52 - Ashton Devil’s Advocate (maybe come up in a future episode, but also anger when we get to Earth, Wind and Spooky) 1:12:12 - Caduceus 1:13:05 - Tal & Marisha: Conversation about deaths and loneliness, what was that heart-to-heart like for both of you? 1:14:32 - Astrological Taliesin 1:17:35 - Having something to lose 1:19:26 - Life and Love is hard 1:20:04 - Orym kept Dorian in the loop on everything occurring with the Apogee Solstice, but learned that the Crown Keepers are dealing with a tense situation regarding Opal. Is he worried about his friends in Tal’Dorei? 1:21:01 - Hopeful for an EXU Part 3 1:21:28 - How did Fearne feel listening to Ludinus’ justifications for his actions while in Kadija Sumal’s office? What was that experience like for her? 1:22:17 - Fearne is afraid of Ludinus 1:22:59 - Liam & Marisha: What was it like having Beau and Caleb show up? All three of your campaign characters were sharing a map, for a moment. 1:24:09 - Seeing Vax 1:26:18 - Ashton referred to themselves as having “extremely useful damage” - what is their relationship like with their abilities? (Doesn’t understand so others don’t as well) 1:28:41 - Three Witches, Three Bodyguards/Knights, and a Robot 1:29:21 - Liam & Tal: Chetney directed Orym and Ashton to kill the Paragon’s Call halfling who surrendered. How did this affect them? If Ashton hadn’t stepped up to kill him, would Orym have done it? 1:30:10 - The locket (Tal’s thoughts) 1:31:36 - Liam’s locket interpretation 1:32:11 - What does Fearne think about Ira? 1:33:00 - What Laudna thinks of Ira? 1:33:50 - Marisha’s final three questions (Hates not knowing where Imogen is, Loves Pate as a familiar, “Just held her hand”) 1:34:51 - What did Ashton mean by FCG is dangerous in a way they don’t understand? What does Ashton think about FCG’s desire for martyrdom and newfound faith in the Changebringer? 1:37:04 - FCG being a bomb 1:37:57 - Liam pulls from the tower 1:38:12 - If you could spend one day with your character, how would you like to spend it? 1:39:30 - Tal pulls a block 1:39:52 - What would you or your character’s room in Widogast’s Nascent Nein-Sided Tower look like? 1:42:09 - Marisha pulls a block 1:42:42 - Can you share a particularly immersive narrative moment, or moment in the story that brought you to the surface of Exandria? (C2 spoilers) 1:46:16 - End C1 spoilers (skip to 1:47:00) 1:46:25 - Ashley pulls a block 1:47:05 - What would your character’s favorite movie genre be? 1:50:09 - BREAK STARTS 2:03:00 - BREAK ENDS 2:03:26 - Level 1 (Marisha Ray Trivia) 2:04:24 - How has Orym felt seeing Imogen and others waffle on whether to stop the Vanguard? (Orym doesn’t think Imogen will turn) 2:05:35 - Silly voice starts 2:06:08 - Was it difficult for Ashton to call in a favor from Jiana Hexum? What do they think of her and their situation now that there has been a bit of distance? 2:07:16 - Level 1 End 2:07:45 - Liam & Ashley are Mobsters 2:08:33 - Level 2 2:08:38 - What was it like for Fearne to see Nana Morri physically come to her rescue and fight off the Fey dragon? 2:09:14 - Rhyming in that episode 2:09:50 - What did Laudna think of the Fey Realm? Too much spooky? 2:10:14 - If y’all could have any item from Nana Morri’s collection what would it be? 2:11:46 - (C1 Spoilers) What was it like to see Vax return to save Keyleth but then be used in this plot? What was going through your mind in that moment? (Forever and ever and always) 2:12:39 - What inspired the shenanigans of Ashton’s time with Violet and the Kenku? 2:14:10 - Level 2 Failed 2:14:24 - Level 2 Take 2 2:15:40 - Fearne is Ruidusborn and was part of the group that helped power the Malleus Key. How does she feel having been forcibly made a piece of this plot to release Predathos? 2:17:24 - Pâtè isn’t with Laudna. How do you feel about not having Imogen or her rat bird familiar? 2:18:26 - Shimmer 2:19:40 - Level 2 Complete 2:20:02 - Rhyming (Laura’s Achilles) 2:21:12 - Replaying Level 2 2:22:54 - Level 3 Start (Pro Mover Tip) 2:23:59 - Who in Bells Hells would be least helpful in a move? 2:25:52 - What would Laudna want to make with Nana Morri? 2:27:32 - What did it mean to Orym to have Seedling given to him by the Wildmother specifically? (Stories of his own, but also stupid kids toys) 2:29:10 - Level 3 Complete 2:30:43 - A wild Moppo appears 2:30:56 - Outro music 2:32:00 - Post-Credit Scene Let me know if I missed anything. These come out while I’m in the middle of school, so it’ll be a few hours before I’m able to get all the Timestamps done. Thanks for your patience. Is it Tuesday yet?

[@mustang1888]

comment so others can see this heehee

[@b.k.6077]

Thanks :D

[@Banquet42]

Thank you!

[@AB-xj9tz]

Love that you do this!!

[@stardustsupernova]

Thank you!

[@huntertuggle2667]

Orym is like a cold glass of plain water after working outside on a hot day. He is just refreshing when everyone else is coke or hard liquor.

[@MrBevoRules]

Dang, well said. Orym is a pretty simple character, but Liam plays him so beautifully that I would die for the little dude.

[@nickmorgan3199]

Coke and hard liquor… I feel you may have been watching my exploits last night at the strip club

[@timfriday9106]

coke AND hard liquor after sucking down a few whipits lolol

[@timfriday9106]

@@MrBevoRules SO much this! I think people REALLY underestimate how hard it is to play a straight laced character well, so that they are enjoyable/liked and not just a constant buzz kill to the group. I certainly can't do it, which is why I ALWAYS play chaotic/neutral characters. Playing the nice guy who always shits on everyone else's dreams is hard and Liam plays it fucking perfectly. It's gd impressive.

[@TheQwuilleran]

Coke and 40 year old scotch 😏😅

[@chocolateal21]

So much love to Dani and Taliesin for being so open and honest about their chronic pain! They are both so amazing and do so much for CR and the community, and it's such a special kind of happiness of seeing chronic pain being talked about like this.

[@mikeoneill1425]

Chronic pain sucks because you tell people you have Chronic pain and they just think your bullshitting.

[@louisgunstone723]

as someone with chronic pain in my balls of all places (consequence of a surgery on a torsion i had!) i agree, talking about chronic pain is very cool

[@meggyrichard]

This!!!!

[@jamescanjuggle]

recently got diagnosed so hearing others is something I needed to hear 😅 makes ya feel less alone

[@trently89]

As someone who's new to chronic pain I found myself relating to Ashton more and more to where they're my favorite player character.

[@BurttheBard]

Why is no one talking about how smooth and cool Tal was when he pulled his first block from the tower? Threw the piece out, followed by the block flip? Rad as hell

[@rmoenmjea]

Well if you have millenia, at some point I bet you learn how to do anything in a cool way

[@Zasek2112]

Now I'm just waiting for Ashley to turn into a platypus. The king of all awkward animals.

[@marcellacarter1274]

Aussies Represent!

[@thisiscait]

She did our quokkas proud 🇦🇺 (we'll forgive the pronunciation) 💕

[@riverkath]

Now we just need a fedora.

[@kaniamia]

I hope her swimming shape is a goblin shark.

[@KingsBard]

Absolutely loved her as a Shoebill, they've been my favorite bird since learning Loftwings exist.

[@Nobody-dl4tm]

Every time Taliesin comes on and talks about Ashton it's mind-blowing. So deep and sad and subsequently beautiful

[@TheQwuilleran]

Taliesin hits it out of the park creating my favorite characters every time (close tie with Beau in c2)

[@morkmon]

Loved the part at 43:10 where Marisha and Taliesin talk about Laudna and Ashton, their emotional intelligence is of the charts, such great deep stuff.

[@Doom1491]

Is it ok to ship Lashton? :)

[@TimpanistMoth_AyKayEll]

@@Doom1491 I believe Tombstone is the official ship name. (And it's always okay to ship anything, if you ask me! Also, friendships are valid 'ships!)

[@Doom1491]

@@TimpanistMoth_AyKayEll I like that name

[@Kris-wo4pj]

@@TimpanistMoth_AyKayEll never heard of it im emotional support witches shipper but i can also ship tombstone and magic fuckery (ashton and fearne) too.

[@majorzipf8947]

@@TimpanistMoth_AyKayEllTOMBSTONE!!! 🤣😂🤣

[@susannahmitchell5558]

54:22 I had no clue that Talisen actually struggled with chronic pain. He is definitely doing a great job at representing people who struggle with chronic pain through Ashton. Ashton is one of my favorite characters because of how strong he is. He pushes through the pain to protect the people he cares about, and that is something that I admire. 💚

[@chrisnewman2737]

If I recall correctly he has some nerve damage or a neurological condition. You can actually see evidence of it in this episode when he's pulling from the tower. He's got a pretty bad tremor in his left hand that he usually goes out of his way to hide.

[@kingkitryne]

@@chrisnewman2737 he takes medication for it, he has an essential tremor! as someone who also has a tremor, i love seeing some sort of representation in an actor i love

[@andyneal7937]

I don't know how many people saw it, since not even the captioner knew what Taliesin was talking about, but I love the fact that Ashton's side quest was a Leverage episode. Really cements the fact that Ashton belongs in a heist group

[@bornstellarmakes7363]

Was just looking for this comment, thank you!!!

[@chillycharizard5985]

Wait really!?

[@Dairkun]

Having guests come in and actually play important characters from BH's background is a genius move.

[@MorinehtarTheBlue]

I definitely think that was all Aabriya

[@Yoder023]

***if you know they can pull it off I've heard some horror stories 😮 🤔

[@emilyhumphreys9316]

@@MorinehtarTheBlue I hope hope v is 🎉🎉🎉v🎉 🎉🎉 thanks for 🎉 birthday and hope your day is good for you you all hope 🎉🎉 much 🎉🎉🎉 I hope 🎉🎉 🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉 vv😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊vv

[@itsnochi9447]

Genius move and was def just aabria once again being innovative and wanting to fuck w Travis after Cerrit managed to survive 😂😂

[@cjtrules1]

Christian also wanted to give Sam a gift because Sam helped Christian in the past.

[@anastacianikitina5080]

It's interesting to see Taliesin bringing up the 'waking up from being dead all alone' and it being a significant groundstone for Ashton's character after it was subtext to Mollymauk/Kingsley in last campaign. Because Molly woke up in a grave that Lucien's dug for him, but Kingsley woke up surrounded by MN because Molly made friends that he loved and who loved him.

[@Picklescape]

I thought exactly the same.

[@TheQwuilleran]

I'm not crying, thanks 😢

[@jammerknight5490]

Best 4 sided dive yet! Talesin & Marisha’s discussions were insane to listen too and Ashley being the audience surrogate/host was perfect. You could also see Liam enjoying just soaking in the other player opinions. More of this!

[@LithNeo]

What's crazy is when it was happening to Kiki and she was being attacked, I could see Marisha doing the hp math in her head and the realization of "oh fuck..."

[@SirButterlegs]

It was still completely silly that Keyleth has Shapechange, a 9th Level spell to become any CR 20 creature she has seen before, and decides to come down as a creature with less than 150 hp. But the weakness of that is the constant concentration checks and she was getting hit a lot and hard.

[@nemonamenlos7330]

@@SirButterlegs I think with Shapechange, she might actually have died, because those would have been some pretty high concentration checks to hit. Though I haven't gone back and done the math...

[@Drekromancer]

@@SirButterlegs That was an earth elemental Wild Shape though, wasn't it?

[@thegamingintelligence9422]

​@@SirButterlegs It's probably her best bet to start earth elemental, especially since she's an arch druid and can wild shape every turn to refresh while casting some other stupid powerful spells. More importantly though, there's nothing more Keyleth than Earth Elemental

[@beedlebur]

28:20 “Ellie, get in the moon” is my favorite thing now

[@griffin_9450]

what’s the time stamp?

[@beedlebur]

@@griffin_9450 edited to add timestamp! it came up in the discussion of keyleth's earth elemental/"ellie" form

[@modredastal1644]

I will now patiently wait for fan art of Orym dressed as Keyleth surrounded by Grogs in the size, shape, and dress of the rest of BH.

[@hanatelige]

i have never wanted anything more

[@dougmoore6612]

I miss the old fan art intermissions with hundreds of pieces of art over 10-15 minutes. I would actually sit and relax while watching the whole section. My gal is a professional artist, and I am not. I would sometimes see a piece of art that I liked, but couldn’t articulate why, and vice versa. I would pause it, show it to her, and she would be able to describe both the technical and interpretive aspects of the piece to explain to me what made me like or dislike it. I hope, someday they bring back the long, each week being different, art intermissions.

[@modredastal1644]

@@dougmoore6612 I also miss the fanart reels, but I doubt they'll return as long as the show is pre-recorded.

[@anastacianikitina5080]

I was like "two and a half hours? they sure are enjoying doing this aftershow" and then i remembered the murder subplot

[@wouldiwasshookspeared4087]

And there's been a hiatus

[@QemeH]

I can relate to what Liam calls "synthetic memories" _so freaking much_ ... I have lived a whole other life in my head with my DnD character and not even 10% of it has come out in game yet and most of the rest will never come out. Yet, it feels like "true" memory of a life lived... the mind is strange at times :)

[@queenofpups]

Flando is missing, all is not right with the world

[@kirbyfreak73]

Flando was vaporized in Apogee Pit!

[@tyberiuscarter5011]

Look to their coming on the first light of the fifth day, at dawn look to the east

[@mikeoneill1425]

@@tyberiuscarter5011 seriously where the fuck is flando?

[@vomitfountain]

Flando was transported to Ruidus!😄

[@billberndtson]

You folks scared me - I had to go look to see if Flando posted on the last episode.

[@fuelbot]

Ashley's reaction to Taliesin's reading of FCG should be in the Hall Of Fame. 1:36:37

[@ZekariusZetorian]

As someone that suffers from Chronic migraines, I relate to taliesin/ashton so much. I had no idea that Dani also suffered from Chronic illness, but hearing Dani talking about dealing with people when all you want to do is sleep or scream or throw up or Taliesin talking about Ashton dealing with his Chronic pain and anger issues by drinking enough to pass out at night both hit me really hard. Thankfully, I have a good enough support structure that I don't need to abuse pills or alcohol to survive, but I can easily see how someone in my/our position would do that. Thank you Taliesin for putting so much work into your characters to make them relatable and putting so much of yourself into them even though it must be difficult.

[@EnderDragon]

As someone with an autoimmune condition that has caused me chronic pain for the past 15+ years, I thoroughly enjoy seeing how Taliesin portrays Ashton.

[@karahtar]

Now I picture Cadeceus working on sanctifying the rebuilt house and temple and on the last day the magic gives out because of Predathos and the Wildmother and him being like "I'ma go slap that bitch God-eater back to the moon"

[@UninspiredArtemis]

Omg the quiet rage of cad having had to pray every single day in the same spot for a year only for it to get messed up on the LAST DAY He may actually yell! 😅

[@raffaeleperniola5285]

„Respectfully“, though. That said, I think after all these cameos it would really make sense for Cad and Pike (and maybe Fjord) to have bigger roles in the semi-background in the future.

[@whoanellynelnel3874]

Artagen dropping by asking after Jester cos sending is fkd I'm gonna assume scry too

[@iamsherley]

Think about this too, not only Cad, Jester, Pike, and Fjord, but once Vex, Percy, and Grog find out what happened to Vax and Keyleth, that wizard pissed off several very powerful individuals on Exandria. I would love to see an end game where all these individuals arrive to support the Bells Hells and bitch slap that snooty, asinine, geriatric wizard off his high horse, and grind him to mulch.

[@Lucarioguild7]

I wasn't ready for the wave of angst when Taliesin was talking about Ashton's feelings of being abandoned and just thinking about how he would feel that FCG tried to message Orym and not them.

[@loTonks]

Ashton's name was mentioned ONCE by the entire team wildmount since they've been seperated. They all did something for Orym and Laudna and brought them up multiple time but seem to completely forget about ashton

[@TheQwuilleran]

​@@loTonks What sucks about relationships is that if you keep people at arm's length, this is what happens (personal experience). Most people won't work to connect with you, which proves you right that no one cares and you shouldn't even try, so.... It sucks that FCG tried to contact Orym because "he has a good head on his shoulders." It sucks that the person who is closest to Ashton (even with all the time FCG has spent with them) is Orym, but Ashton wouldn't know they didn't try to contact him, so maybe it's better that someone he's already comfortable with is there for the initial shock of separation. 🤷🏽?

[@cjtrules1]

@@TheQwuilleran I think Ashton's take on FCG is incredibly spot on. FCG thinks he does things selflessly and for good reasons but he has no clue what his actions really say. Not being able to feel emotions is really making FCG unintentionally a bit two-faced. Not only does he not think to contact his best friend, but he fails to think what Ashton would be going through at the same time as them. Hearing FCG could have been calming for Ashton. Sam is playing a fantastically complex robot while also showing the simple archetype of "the robot who can't feel and only operates on logic."

[@gabriellealtman]

When I saw that this week's 4-sided dive was Liam, Marisha, Ashley and Taliesin, I was SO happy

[@MorinehtarTheBlue]

I was kind of hoping for the others what with 52 not involving these folks at all. But honestly I'm just glad to watch it. Though I feel like the one month format makes it harder to cover everything.

[@TimpanistMoth_AyKayEll]

Such a good episode!! They got into so much juicy stuff.

[@enderplaysvidjagames8542]

One of my favorite parts of this show is just opening it up to hear the cast talk about something completely random, especially with this episode lol. Idk how going from Broomey's death to Liam talking about pickles can be so entertaining but it is indeed, and I love it.

[@krumpits]

everyone is SO convinced that orym is hiding some deep dark secret. I really think hes just a nice little guy lol

[@leojamesclune1730]

He is a little sweetie pie, but when he snaps...run

[@viktorstagnetti7491]

He's the nicest and yet probably the one you'd least want to go apeshit. Everyone else has a little bit of that crazy to them already.

[@theatregeek299]

See I don’t think Orym is hiding a secret, but I am worried about Matt

[@leojamesclune1730]

@@theatregeek299 I don't either, but he's just the quiet kid that will have everyone else go silent when he finally raises his voice.

[@raffaeleperniola5285]

I think the scariest thing about Orym is just the whole „beware when a good man goes to war“-thing. Like I agree that he‘s probably just a nice lil guy with a tragic past due to war, and when he really feels like something can only be solved by picking up the blade the situation must really be fucked.

[@PancakeMonster359]

I love how Liam fully committed to his character voice in the gaming section. He only broke character when he answered questions

[@hanatelige]

i also love that he picked the classic nerd voice while everyone else went full mafia

[@inevra4053]

52:27 Liam's Pate took me off guard with how good that was

[@gorgonheap9770]

I really enjoyed the conversations between Marisha and Taliesin. They really have a *lot* going on with those characters.

[@sybariticcupboardrat3763]

1:19:05 So Ashton's main theme is the same as in The Last of Us. The fear of loss is making him resistant to emotional bonds, but not immune.

[@mayaenglish5424]

By far the best 4 sided dive yet, the long uninterrupted conversations and deep insights from Taliesin make this a lovely and engaging watch.

[@Picklescape]

Totally agree! Great to have lots of in depth discussions that focus on the show.

[@Hmhya]

This might be my favorite 4-Sided Dive yet. They got so in depth with their conversations, and you could see how much thought they were giving it. Obviously there's a time constraint, and stuff they don't want to reveal yet, but I would watch them introspect and posit theories for any length of time.

[@aFallenWolf]

Insecurities, Jealousy, Petty Secretes, Faults; those are GREAT points to add to a character. NPC or PC. Even if some of those never turn up in game they'll affect how you'd play, how you'd act as them.

[@TheQwuilleran]

Starting with a character who is imperfect begins the story with so much more possibility because now you've added Character Growth to the roster of things you could do

[@ComBlogger]

"If you dont know what you are doing, no one else can either" It reminded me instantly of Grogs "If i dont see where i am swinging, neither do you" from TLOVM

[@evalynn1863]

Seeing Ashton and hearing Taliesin talk about him hits really deep. This campaign started almost exactly a year after I had brain surgery to save my life. I had to have part of my skull and brain removed and as a result I have permanent nerve damage, I have tremors, and I struggle to walk and stand for extended periods of time. I'm very limited in what I can do now, and I live with pretty severe chronic pain. I am a completely different person now, and I can very much relate to the toxic, abusive, angry side that Ashton has. It's take a lot of work and therapy to get out of that, but I'm still in pain. What happened to me still defines what I'm able to do every day. It's changed how I view the world and others.

[@ultima8229]

Taliesin had a lot of great emotional insights this episode -- so much of what he said caught me off guard.

[@TehOvermind]

I loved Liam mentioning the Matron scene at the end of C1. He lingers there for a sec while the next question comes in and I love that these stories are so deeply important for them. Like, hearing Tal talking about how he can walk through Whitestone in his head, and how Liam has a part of his mind that lives in Zephra...it really shows how important this story is to them. And to us.

[@artie1523]

My favorite artifact from the St. Louis City Children's Museum is a quote written on a random wall in gold paint marker that says "if you don't know where you're going, any road will get you there." And that quote has lived in my heart for a long time! (Please go to the City Museum if you get the chance!)

[@EmilyF0915]

Glad you clarified - it's better known as the City Museum (I've never heard it called the Children's Museum!) and has booze etc. It's incredible, highly recommend!

[@hfar_in_the_sky]

"Bells Hells is basically Batman villains/the Suicide Squad with Orymn being the only well adjusted one." That...huh. I never actually thought of it that way but yeah, with just a slight push more into villain territory I could totally see just about every single one of Bells Hells being a Batman villain. It wouldn't even take that much

[@Isaac-gj8tf]

Fern as Catwoman Ashton is bane Laudna and imogen maybe joker and Harley quinn chetney as twoface and fcg ? Freeze maybe ?

[@hfar_in_the_sky]

@@Isaac-gj8tf I was thinking more each on their own would be a Batman villain as is. But if we're assigning each of the Bells to one of Batman's preexisting rogues gallery: Ferne I'd say would be a bit more in the Harley Quinn with elements of Catwoman due to her love of pushing boundaries and general anarchy, along with her general kleptomania. Ashton I'd say would be Anarky, but with Bane's powers on top (which now that I think about it is basically Bane from Dark Knight Rises.) Laudna I think would be more of a Scarecrow but like if Scarecrow got a Black Lantern ring. Imogen I'd personally peg as more a Talia al Ghul type due to her massive parental issues coupled with her drive, her difficulty opening up to people, and her headstrong personality. Chetney would be totally be Man-Bat but in wolf form. And FCG I would probably put down as a more well meaning but still misguided Jeremiah Arkham

[@viktorstagnetti7491]

@@hfar_in_the_sky Laudna could be a Scarecrow/Poison Ivy hybrid just for the simple fact that her Form of Dread since dying is usually the rotted Suntree.

[@theatregeek299]

I guess it makes him their Rick Flagg

[@Isaac-gj8tf]

@@hfar_in_the_sky I was saying Catwoman for fern because of the stealing and cause of the voice also reminds me vut yeah Harley quinn also 100% which if they are suicide squad then she is harley chetney will be like king shark or ferret or something Ashton as peacekeeper

[@tamrymer4153]

Someone should make a compilation of fern being told no.

[@Blue9393Star]

I wish I could just have a long, long, long conversation with Taliesin one day. Like. To talk about life. It feels like one of those people who are going to gift you with a sentence you'll remember fondly for the rest of your life.

[@Camaika1997]

I lOVE that we got a glimps into Taliesins head and as to why Ashton are the way they are. I love them both so much, such interesting people!

[@jemplayer]

29:40 Marisha is a HUGE fan of Ashley apparently xD

[@Isaac-gj8tf]

Who isnt

[@sirephlyrrian6242]

around 1:45:45 the most immersive moment(s) for me was in the first campaign, when they visited the 3 gods: Pelor, Knowing Mistress and Sarenrae, it was breathtaking, when they stepped in each of the domains and met actual gods of their world

[@TheQwuilleran]

It really was! Unfortunately they were on a time crunch (and also I wanted to live there so any time there would never have been enough) so it felt rushed

[@mayaenglish5424]

At 1:35:19 in the VOD on twitch Aabria (Who's Quiddie in the chat) wrote this comment about what she'd say to Ashton: "Like, the game isn’t to play Traumolypmics with Ashton - it’s to tell him kindly and with absolutely certainty, life is hard. And here’s what happens if you stop. So why don’t you?" Which I've been thinking about a lot. And honestly, Part of me hopes it happens and part of me doesn't. Because I think it will be interesting but I don't think it will have the affect she intends. My first thought when she said it was that he would genuinely, with her description of the afterlife and how restful it was, think, "Yeah, why don't I stop? Why am I still here?" I think Deanna could easily plunge Ashton into a vague suicidal ideation accidentally while trying to pull the whole, "Life is hard for everyone, chin up, there's stuff to live for" routine. (FIY this is a bad approach to pull with chronically ill people, and it makes your face look infinitely more punchable.) Think about it. Her Description of the afterlife was incredibly appealing (And a storyline straight out of BtVS but that's another story). Ashton's clearly hanging on out of spite, stubbornness, momentum, and sheer willpower more than anything else. Imagine him really examining the reasons why he's still here and coming to the conclusion that there aren't really that many good ones. Maybe sticking around to take care of FCG, but They have the rest of the group to look after them now. Maybe trying to figure out what happened to his parents? But he watched them die so really what's learning more going to change, and he can find out everything he wants to know on the other side anyway. etc.

[@anneroosv]

I really hope we're gonna get some sort of Dani cam again, I would've loved to see her face while Liam was talking about the synthetic memories. Love our Lore Keeper

[@CapnRaye]

As someone who also deals with Chronic Pain? Ashton also means a lot to me too and I can't wait to see where their journey goes.

[@theonionqueen3519]

I feel so honored that Taliesin really took his assignment of understanding the punk scene seriously. Like, Ashton is so fucking real for me, because I’m surrounded by people just like them.

[@jayanderson7072]

As another human who's got chronic issues, I just have to agree with Dani so much. I love all the characters so much but every once in a while when I'm reminded Ashton is in pain all the time it is like a little "hey you aren't alone" reminder. And logically I know I'm unfortunately not alone in the chronic pain/ issues community, but still. It's incredibly isolating and being represented well , in something that helps you escape just makes the whole world of cr feel more like home. Thank you all on the cr team who see this. You guys truly have something so special going on and it's been so amazing to be a part of the community for the last 2 years 💜

[@amymurata]

Fsr Liam's character voice throughout them playing Moving Out brought me a very specific joy

[@TinycanKill]

It was killing me 😂😂😂

[@samuraiko]

This was a SCREAM and I hope to gods he does it again.

[@rcdehaai]

It gave me a very specific headache

[@tahaqazi5595]

It's kinda like the squishy cuttlefish voice he does some time, it's adorable

[@sainmanstanding]

Really want to see him make a goofy character with that voice now.

[@KingsBard]

"What if we bounced back 3 days" With a small evil moon locked in the sky? Yeah, no thank you, I've played Majora's Mask.

[@asifloserface]

54:40 As someone with Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome (A condition which a hallmark symptom of is spontaneous joint dislocation) I felt that "You were built poorly" on a cellular level.

[@kelseymiller8137]

Fellow eds person here… I feel ya ❤

[@asifloserface]

@@kelseymiller8137 ❤

[@olestampevestergaard4746]

Don't really know how to get questions in... But I would love to know from Travis specifically, and everyone else, what it's like to balance what you want to do as a player, and what your character wants, I'm sure Travis would love to infect all of exandria with "werewolf" but I also feel like that is the worst thing that could happen to Chetney...

[@kateschaefshorts2536]

You could submit that to the tower and hope Travis is on whatever episode it gets pulled on

[@marauderdz]

@@kateschaefshorts2536 Sadly, I think the Tower questions need to be character-neutral and "evergreen". The character-specific questions in the mugs are written by Dani.

[@kateschaefshorts2536]

@@marauderdz the part about balancing character/player desires

[@HeyLetsDoAThing]

Loved everything about this group of people except the fact that Ashley was the only person from her group when we’re fresh off that episode and the other three can’t talk about their’s yet.

[@footnotelovenote]

For anyone looking: the lyric Liam mentions (at 1:19:24) is, "Oh, how good it must feel to not love anything" from Matt Maeson, ♫ "Twisted Tongue" ♫ - and yeah wow the whole song is pretty on the nose for the recent episodes of this campaign.

[@montgomerym5407]

To add to Liam talking about the end of C1. Sam apologizing to Liam and then breaking down, that was some very raw stuff and made those moments so memorable. In my headcannon it makes sense that Scanlon would do the same to Vex, so I hope they animate that moment.

[@rgcountdown]

As a person with chronic pain, I love this about Ashton.

[@Sarahdamonster]

Same. It makes me feel seen - something that doesn’t often happen in media.

[@sentient.ball.of.stardust]

I find these conversation so important in being able to connect to the characters and who they are, during actual game play things are usually happening so fast, and it's not always easy to understand their actions and choices. Ashton is one of those characters I've had a real hard time with, even though I myself suffer with chronic pain I find them so unreadable and unknowable, even when their motivations are clear...having Taliesin talk about Ashton like is is invaluable!

[@mikonyx7712]

I forgot how long it was since the last one. When I saw broomy at the beggining I was like "WAIT?! I DIDN'T SKIP ANYTHING XD?!"

[@thomassmart4088]

Moppo is sus

[@phoebica]

Every Episode with a lot of Dani is a good episode - and this is a very good episode. Also: I love Ashley as host 🙂

[@Draedaja]

Taliesin's little "oh you get me :)" was adorable xD

[@psykonikk]

i love when they just start talking about anything and everything, like they forget they are on a show and are just really good friends talking about this super fun game they play together, i could listen to them talking about this stuff for way longer then a 4-sided dive episode ever goes on for hehe :D

[@llamafromspace]

This is my favorite 4sided dive. They all gave such good insights into these characters. I'd love more like these serious ones about the world and less jokey .

[@erinmcdermott6299]

Love, love, love this show, and really loved the quiet shoutout to Leverage, which is one amazing show.

[@eartheclipse8]

Only halfway trhrough and this is by FAR my favorite Talks/4 sided dive episode in terms of awesome conversation and hearing the thoughts they didn't get to say in-game ♥♥♥

[@theonionqueen3519]

Oh yeah this episode has so much introspective conversation about things not said or done during the game. I think it’s fascinating!

[@ArchReverend]

I wonder if Ludanis Got a hold of Patia's memory orb and gleamed some information from it that taught him how to build, or at least where to find, plans for the malious key. The age of Arcanum was full of wizards wanting to surpass or kill the gods so could be a thread.

[@wouldiwasshookspeared4087]

I had a stroke of inspiration the other day... what if Ludinus got hold of Halas' gem and is not in control anymore? There's no way Ludinus is that old, and Yussa mentioned knowing him, so there's a connection there to who had possession of the soul.

[@tuesdaynext7370]

Patia wouldn't have known anything about the Key, though... that was an Aeor thing, and she just had secondhand knowledge that they were testing something (Also while Ludinus having the orb is a possibility, I do think there's a more likely candidate in Tal'Dorei Reborn)

[@ArchReverend]

@@wouldiwasshookspeared4087 That's actually a really good angle as well and far more likely than my orb idea. And if Halas did not take him over, then perhaps this is part of a deal he made with him. only issue i can see is Ludinus procured likely procured a beacon before the Mighty Nein found Halas' gem.

[@notsomagicalmike7429]

@@wouldiwasshookspeared4087 I think it's more likely that Ludinus had made use of the Clone spell, like Delilah did back in C1, as the spell allows the user to create perfect copies and even younger version of themselves. Halas while also old, didn't give a damn/hated the world and literally made another one to avoid it.

[@whoanellynelnel3874]

@@wouldiwasshookspeared4087 Beau says to Caleb that Ludinas got rid of Halas. Implying he's the mage that made the stone that locked Halas in, in the first place. He also mentioned witnessing the Calamity. Potentially he got his hands on Cerrit/'s kids for Patia's download but I'm *hoping* the Cobalt Sol eventuated from her download

[@awesomeman532]

As a long term fibromyalgia Ashton is great. That deep seated anger is personal and very close to home.

[@jonathangriffin5093]

I am so glad that the Leverage vibes I got from Taliesin’s kitchen adventure weren’t just me, and were intentional. That show needs more love

[@jacecole5348]

That whole chronic pain portion hits too hard. I have chronic migraines as well as a form of eye allergy that causes me to develop blisters on the inside of my eyelids. So, imagine rubbing your knuckles together roughly, that's what my eyes feel like every time I blink, look around, ect. When tal said the whole other people's perspective of "they're an asshole, oh wait I understand now, I wouldn't want to deal with people if I dealt with that too." I used to feel that C1 Percy was my representative when I was going through depression, and I eventually recovered from that, mostly. When I was depressed, instead of being sad all the time, I completely and utterly suppressed my emotions. Just a tip, don't do that. Its not like bottling them. Not feeling those emotions severely affected my empathy and relationships. I eventually got to the point where I was nearly on the level of a sociopath. A Critical Role episode is the one moment where I could feel my emotions push through enough for me to get past that mental block I had mad over 2 years. Its been 2 years since then. It took a little over a year to re find my ability to feel empathy properly and remember which emotions felt which way. I'm 18 now. All the chronic pain was also happening, and my severe anger issues never left. One good thing I got from the lack of emotions was self control. I can choose if I'm purely logical or if I want to feel the emotional aspects. Most people can't fully separate their logic from their emotions. One of the arguably bad parts about it that hasn't gone away, the time in which I would have explored and discovered my sexual and romantic interests, around 15 & 16 yo, is when I was in that lack of emotional state. Nowadays, I'm asexual even after regaining my emotions. I have a very mild interest in a romantic situation, but absolutely no sex drive. Its one of the weirdest things when you're body still has the hormonal response to people but it is only on the level of your body, it doesn't influence your thoughts. So, caduceus and molly heavily helped me on the path of self discovery and understanding, which likely isn't healthy but fuck it, it worked out ok. Now, I'm at that Ashton/ old Percy point. I have it all back, but I still have far too much to figure out at once and I'm still coming to terms with how to interact and interpret people. Trust matters more than anything to me, and I have trust issues, which I feel the same from Percy and Ashton. Somehow, for some reason, Taliesin seems to have made characters that perfectly followed and supported my growth as a person. Do I have a likely unhealthy connection with cr, probably. Do I care, no. Y'all have a good day

[@CerotheDemon]

My favorite thing about this campaign is how cerebral it is it makes you you really think about how these characters think in any situation. Last campaign was about finding their own place in the world especially the last half. Man I love Critical Role.

[@OtherSara]

I loved how much everyone really enjoyed talking about their characters in this episode. Deep dives indeed!

[@esther6138]

i think that it’s really great to mention the interventionist gods, when ludinus of all people just wants to be the one intervening instead. it’s always ‘fun’ to see the people who are all about “freedom” turn around and say “oh, but just for me” could be great for ashton’s story and growth tbh

[@Pingviinimursu]

Man, I love Taliesin when he gets to talk about he or his characters see things. Always so different from me, yet super insightful! Really liked the deep questions and conversations we got this episode!

[@theonionqueen3519]

I am holding in my heart, like a precious flame, that Orym truly is Just a Little Guy, and that he truly is just a good dude.

[@Foxxy_Steve]

To what Marisha was saying about watching the games ; My DnD group records all of our sessions to help keep lore and I also love hearing our games back. I do feel a little narcissistic though lol

[@jaredking5737]

I think one of many moments that really stuck with me throughout C2 was the scene where caleb showed his scars to the Nein. The moment of vulnerability and humbleness, as if he was pleading for help. That really got me. and of course when he told Essek “you were not BORN WITH POISON IN YOUR VEINS”

[@mmisskriss1590]

I love the super serious heavy talks. It's fun to see everyone's pov and reasoning

[@takakhan-z3w]

On Tuesday, Taliesin said that FCG insists on endangering the party by running headfirst into danger and obligating them to follow. On Thursday, FCG ran headfirst into danger and obligated the party to follow.

[@probablynotasith5355]

It is definitely ironic but remember spoilers :)

[@TheQwuilleran]

Sometimes I can't tell if Sam insisting he doesn't watch this show or CR is just a bit

[@xenwraithtealix1075]

The descent into Aeor was one of the most immersive moments for me too. I still imagine the ice caverns, and the intuits going off

[@wouldiwasshookspeared4087]

That was an excellent moment, for me it was the battle at the Dawn Chantry

[@tomawen5916]

Love it when Ashley is the tavern keeper for these episodes. No rhyme or reason, chaos supreme!! Just love it she has no qualms about pulling from the Tower. Pure berserker energy by the way. Fearne and Yasha projected!

[@makinoi]

I felt so...idk what to call it nostalgic? When the cast was talking about their memories of what scene grounded them in the world of Exandria. It was so romantic in a way that it made me feel so warm and fuzzy... 🥰

[@rhokesh4391]

After watching a TLOU reaction vid JUST for the few scenes with Ashley in it, this feels like a treat 🤩

[@tuhnu_the_king2656]

It feels so nice for Taliesin to talk about chronic pain. As a person suffering from continuing pain and dislocation of joints, it is really nice to hear someone talk about it ❤

[@Yoder023]

The convo at 42:52 is what I didn't know I needed in life I also didn't realize how much like Ashton I am until in-game convos happened 😅

[@lemonoclefox]

YES I've been thinking that about FCG from the start, Taliesin put it so perfectly here, about how self-serving that little robot actually is in their attempt to help others. he feels like such a great representation of the kind of person who is almost arrogant in their way of helping, thinking they know best, well-meaning but also so selfish in their motivations

[@StevenJQuinlan]

Oh god, I just realised that all the impulse control is in one party, Orym, Laudna and Ashton, and all the chaos gremlin people are in the other party

[@douglaslain5962]

When the barbarian is a voice of restraint in your party, that's a red flag. Whenever he leaves they end up making a porno.

[@TheQwuilleran]

"Even Imo-" Yes. Even Imogen.

[@vomitfountain]

Prayer circle for one of Fearne's goofy wildshape forms to be a Dire-Capybara.🕯

[@Camaika1997]

The chronic pain discussion just made me incredibly happy! I love them so much for sharing this!

[@slimmonkey8164]

For those what were wondering what Dani used for the episode description for episode 48: Bells Hells need to leave the Fey Realm behind, but the threats on their scent are extremely unkind...

[@beauyashter]

marisha talking about kentucky without travis here to bully her for it :(

[@Nobody-dl4tm]

Nana Mori is something from my Labrynth/Dark Crystal/Jim Henson nightmares

[@Nobody-dl4tm]

@Aggromemnon Never played. Too old

[@prettyoddvices4306]

I love hearing about Ashton’s punk rock viewpoint about the gods, it’s so interesting!!

[@snuffles504]

44:20 made me think of Bucky Barnes telling Sam Wilson, "If he was wrong about you, he was wrong about me."

[@kief453]

'I don't know about Orym, but Liam, maybe.' 30:50 Genious

[@4persephone]

With Orym's passive perception I'm not all that sure in a few more sessions and with a little more stress character Orym won't just merge with Player Liam into some kind of Godhead

[@samuraiko]

Easily one of my favorite 4 Sided Dive episodes yet... and please, please, PLEASE play "Moving Out" again... that was an absolute riot!