Problems with Protestant Christianity (w/ Keith Nester)

In this episode of The Cordial Catholic, I'm joined by my good friend ‪@KeithNester‬ to unpack some of the problems with Protestant Christianity that drove us to convert to Catholicism.
Keith Nester is a former Protestant pastor - he spent over 20 years in ministry before converting to Catholicism. Keith is the host of the Catholic Feedback podcast, the author of a fantastic book for new converts, and has an incredibly popular KZbin channel (that I'm sure you've already heard of).
To check out Keith's book, A Convert's Guide to Roman Catholicism: Your First Year in the Church visit his website at www.keithnester.com. He's on KZbin (of course) at ‪@KeithNester‬.
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[@ucheodozor4147]

Keith is an amazing addition to the Family of Jesus in the Church Catholic. I'm unspeakably proud of you and your deep discernment and understanding of the Church and her Faith. Only the Holy Spirit can make this happen. Blessed be the name of Jesus Christ in the Most Holy Sacrament on the Altar!

[@fejacinto7709]

😅

[@lois2997]

We are lucky to have him

[@albertoascari2542]

I agree with you both. I finally received my confirmation a few years ago as a Catholic after years of being on the sidelines of Catholicism and as a former Protestant. I loved tbe faith of the Catholic Church as i for the first time received supernatural grace but I was ashamed by my none Catholic background so i hid that in pride. Finally i asked a new Priest, he accepted and told me i can't believe your not Catholic as your so knowledgeable of the faith. I got in with out RCIA anyway after a few questions and answer sessions. It was a wonderful moment and no my faith or wonder hasn't died down at all it's increased

[@anitapaulus937]

I converted to my Husband’s Catholic faith. I didn’t have an interesting conversion story, because there was no pressure from where I came. One thing I think would be helpful to “Cradle Catholics” would be what my husband did, going through RCIA with me. He benefited greatly from the experience.

[@boychodurendes752]

Cradle Catholic here, thanks for pointing out the beauty of the Church. All I see are the beautiful altar, window tainted glass and ceiling paintings

[@jeremiahong248]

I am glad both Keiths were open to the Holy Spirit to consider the validity of the truth in Catholic explanations instead of engaging in mental gymnastics to explain away the Truth presented to them.

[@MrJoebrooklyn1969]

I'm a revert to Catholicism as well!!

[@johnalexis8284]

what did you do? how did that happen?

[@MrJoebrooklyn1969]

@@johnalexis8284 I started watching Catholic apologetics.

[@marianweigh6411]

Hans Urs von Balthasar's _In the Fullness of Faith_ and _Truth is Symphonic_ are awesome books that express the Catholic faith at the highest level of devotion and philosophy in conversation with Protestant ideas. On many topics he's able to show that at the core of Catholic theology there is a desire to hold all of Scripture in view; whereas Protestant claims often arise from a picking and isolating, a selective emphasizing that, while giving a coherent picture, leaves other aspects out of the frame - and thus believes it sees the whole when it only sees in part. For Balthasar, I might say, to see the form of Christ means keeping everything in the frame as much as possible - the whole Christ. This will inevitably lead exegesis and theology to embrace _mystery_ in its very form and approach, because the whole of God is ever-greater, and we have never grasped or comprehended Him. At the same time, it is only by embracing the fullness of His mystery that a true definitiveness, a definitive rule for the faith, can be achieved. Better yet: a true statement of faith that is _united with the act of faith itself._ For that is what we read preeminently in the saints: their saying is a doing, an existential act involving the whole person in response to God's offer of eternal life. Faith is an act for all eternity, a conferance of myself into Him. The saint's believing is not abstract or simply intended but an entrance into the life of the Triune God. And the Word of God is not merely words on a page but the power of God growing within, while the outer nature decays. By grace and cooperating self-consecration, the Gospel becomes a living reality in the saint's soul, such that anyone who encounters them encounters it. Their presence on earth points to Christ in His Church. That is where the Church knows herself the spouse of Christ and a virgin for His sake, where the purity of an encounter with God is made completely concrete in a flesh and blood human being - and the "new creation" is not just a way of speaking or a far-off idea but a _real thing._ (Incidentally this is the importance of the Dogma of the Assumption of Mary.) All of humanity is to be remade in the image of the New Adam: that is the Church's task and there is no greater. Find where this new creation is taught, exhorted, practiced, and realized, and you will find you are in the Catholic Church.

[@gk3292]

@Marian…AMEN!!!🙏🙏

[@kathymarshall3914]

unpacking the mass is a great help to converts and cradle Catholics alike. thanks to both Keiths

[@jntwyatt]

You guys are both awesome. I can relate to your discussions because I am a cradle Catholic, turned New Age, turned Protestant, returned back to Catholic. lol. It was through listening to KZbin talks by Taylor Marshall, Fr Chad Ripperger, E Michael Jones and others that I felt myself being pulled back to Catholicism in a much deeper way than I could have imagined, with a better appreciation and understanding than what I initially grew up with.

[@johnchung6777]

May Blessings Patience and Endurance be granted to both of you catholic men from the Holy Trinity along with an unprecedented endowment of perseverance YEAH 👍 AMEN 🙏

[@annecarter-vq3nr]

The pearl of great price.

[@linettefranks5459]

Love this discussion, two things. We bring our kids to mass because it is the most powerful prayer on the planet imparting grace that children need. One mass attended during life will be of more prophet to the soul than many more offered after your death. Parents should be teaching the faith along with Psr classes outside of mass. The church teaches they cannot definitely say anyone is in hell but many saints have been shown that many are. Private revelation is not required to believe but it helps.

[@jonathanbohl]

Thanks!

[@iselgisgarcia8059]

IIN GENERAL WE CATHOLICS HAVE GAIN MOMENTUM 🌟 CONVERTS ARE OUR GREAT ACQUISITION. I think that the internet has a lot to do with this grace. KZbin expose the truth about the original church, where other denominations can discover christ message from His own Spiritual perspective. I thank you brothers and Sisters!!! I am a better catholic today because of YOU!

[@RecoveringLiberal1984]

My 2 favorite guys ❤ ❤ ❤

[@TheCordialCatholic]

Well that’s sweet!

[@angelamote19741]

I’ve been Catholic since 2018 from evangelical non- denominational. I can identify with his enthusiasm-and I’m having these encounters with the Holy Spirit but the cradle Catholics I know look at me like I have 2 heads or something. Lol. The lack of answers as a Protestant brought me to the door of the Catholic Church and I won’t ever leave.

[@TheCordialCatholic]

Welcome! That’s too often the case, isn’t it?

[@claudialis406]

Eucharistic Christ. Once you realize that, it is what feeds your faith. 7 years ago, I reverted and I still feel alive in my faith.

[@nicoleyoshihara4011]

❤

[@ilonkastille2993]

A person converts in order to enter the Church which Jesus instituted Himself. The Truth of the Faith and the whole story is taught . This does not mean every Catholic is a Saint. All of us are people . The difference is, the Catholic Church is a Church of sinners and a Church of Saints. We are called to be saints, nothing else. The Church is the Mystical Body of Christ and it is and will be attacked and violated from day one, just like Christ was. There are traitors inside just like Judas was and there are ennemies on the outside. We are called to protect and defend it instead of complaining.

[@adamnowak926]

👍

[@johnchung6777]

There’s something I want to mention about Protestantism,and it’s when I read 1John verses 18 and 19 and every time I read it I think about what John is revealing and he’s talking about many Antichrist in his time for he mentions that there were those who were of them meaning the Apostles and then John goes on to say that they had left them meaning the Apostles and have not returned to them meaning the Apostles then he says so seeing that they have not returned to they are not of us meaning the Apostles ain’t that something to think about

[@dsonyay]

At about 40:40… anytime, I am having a discussion with a protestant and we disagree on something .. And can’t seem to come to an understanding on it I always say OK neither of us agree on this position, so let’s go to the authorities, which is the church founded by Christ.. the apostles.. The Catholic Church that’s the authority… then we go straight to the catechism and I say I guess that’s the answer because it’s right out of the Catholic Church, which is the church of Jesus Christ. Boom.

[@johnchung6777]

Yes that is true the connection of and linage of the apostolic succession cannot be severed or come to an end because Jesus Christ told his Apostles which is there in scripture that he IS WITH THEM EVEN TILL THE END OF TIME HOW MUCH MORE PROOF DO PROTESTANTS NEED FOR IF THEY SAY THAT THEY BELIEVE IN JESUS THEN WHY DO THEY DENY WHAT HE SAID IN SCRIPTURE?🤔😳😯

[@tenderlyone]

I think you’re doing one of the things that Catholics complain all the time. We complain that the protestant churches speak badly and poorly about the Catholic Church and, yet, you are doing exactly the same. The nature of a protestant faith is only a matter for those who practice it.

[@aGoyforJesus]

You know I made a video with the two of you in it, right? Addressing the weaknesses of why you converted.

[@gch8810]

So what? Your opinion regarding their conversions carries very little weight, as well as having nothing to do with the topic at hand. A Catholic could just as easily pick apart your conversion story and deem it weak.

[@paulsmallwood1484]

No offense but neither of you gentleman came out of a background that strongly identifies with the Protestant Reformation or what might be called historic Protestantism. You both come out of contemporary American Evangelicalism. There is a massive difference between the two. So you should call this problems with Evangelical Christianity. I would be the first to say that contemporary American Evangelicalism has massive problems. Neither of you are competent to talk about historic Protestantism. You don’t know the confessions, the people, the creeds or the history. I totally expect every caricature trotted out by Roman Catholics who know nothing about historic Protestantism to be trotted out in this video to “prove” how bad Protestantism is. I can refer you all to a number of actual Protestant seminary professors who could provide well informed arguments. Terms like “excitement” and “personal relationship with Jesus” clearly are Evangelical terms. Keith is wrong. Many Protestant liturgies recite the “words of institution” as part of the Eucharist. Millions of Protestants around the world believe in a “real presence” understanding of the Eucharist and take the Eucharist very seriously.

[@mikelopez8564]

@paul- you want make a distinction, thinking you have creeds and the Eucharist. Well, for starters, the Protestant Reformers immediately denied the sacrifice of the mass and sacraments. So you err; no sacerdotal priesthood, no sacrifice means you have no Eucharist. The “confessions and creeds” which you do have are clear regarding this. These guys followed a mixture of Luther and Calvin, your heroes, because they believed the formal and material principals of the reformation; faith alone and scripture alone. What’s more is they bought into Protestant soteriology. The distinction you make really isn’t. Why should we listen to you anyway? What authority do you have or for that matter your minister? Your church? Aren’t you in a church that broke away from the Church Jesus built on the Rock of Peter? Maybe there are a few breaks from the first to yours. Do you claim your church to be apostolic? That is a line running unbroken to the churches founded by Jesus through the apostles. You are correct about there being Protestants who believe Catholic beliefs, as you would expect; not all beliefs were thrown off by the Protestant reformers.

[@paulsmallwood1484]

@@mikelopez8564 Your knowledge of Protestants and the Reformers is awe inspiring. I wish I was half as brilliant as you.

[@christopherlampman5579]

Paul do you have any credentials that make you a certified expert in Protestant thought? I’m a member of a reformed church and these guys are pretty spot on in my experience. My church has 500 members with 500+ unique understanding of the scriptures. I’m not narcissistic enough to call myself an expert in reformed Protestant theology but I see absolutely no unity or deep connection to the creeds in my experience. Maybe your older or more educated in Protestant thought but you have to admit that 95% plus of Protestants fit this description.

[@paulsmallwood1484]

@@christopherlampman5579 I never said I was an expert so are you being sarcastic? Are you an expert? Nor did I say that within Protestantism at the street level that people don’t have disagreements with classical Protestant theological understanding. So you are making an issue out of something unrelated to what was my main point. Namely that the much touted Roman Catholic claim that their magisterium brings about uniformity and unity is a myth. It doesn’t. At the street level, there is evert bit as much diversity among Roman Catholics departing from official teaching. Perhaps more. Why does that fact annoy you?

[@christopherlampman5579]

@@paulsmallwood1484 you implied you were an expert when you suggested that no one else was competent enough to explain/understand Protestant thought. I figured that your confidence in your own understanding of Protestant thought means you must be some sort of expert. Turns out your writing style is naturally condescending.

[@wardashimon-australia33]

The Gospel: Plain and Simple “But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ.” - 2 Corithians 11:3 Ask someone today if they are saved and you will most likely hear responses like these: “I have accepted Jesus into my heart.” Or “I have made him Lord of my life.” “I’ve been baptized.” “I said a prayer.” Sounds all good and churchy don’t it; but it is difficult to de-termine whether or not a person actually knows the gospel that saves them. These use￾less phrases don’t describe a thing about what the gospel is and has left a devastating effect of people not knowing what it is that they are saved from nor how they are saved; which leaves a more serious effect of people ques￾tioning their salvation. Let’s not muddy the simplicity of salva￾tion that is in Christ with vague church sounding phrases that do not communicate anything. But rather present God’s word with clarity and assuredness. So here is the gospel: plain and simple. Sin was passed upon all men by one man Adam, and death is a consequence of this sin (Rom 5:12). Mankind has an eternal destiny of condemnation and wrath - Hell - because of this sin (Rom 6:23). No matter what good works one might do we are still found sinners in the sight of our Creator God. And all un￾righteousness and those who follow get in￾dignation and wrath. We cannot be found righteous for by God’s law we are found sin￾ners (Rom 3:19-20). If we have broken even one law we are found guilty. It is for this reason of not being able to create our own righteousness and being born in a sinful flesh that we need a savior (Titus 3:5). Christ is that Savior, God manifested in the flesh, sinless, died in our place on a cross 2000 years ago. Taking upon him the wrath and judgement that was intended for us sin￾ners. And it is through his bloodshed, burial, and resurrection on our behalf that we are able to have peace with God and forgiveness of our sins (1 Cor 15:1-4, Col 3:14). This good news is unto all but only those that believe in it are made righteous in Christ (Romans 3:22). It is then after we have heard this good news of Christ’s righteousness available to us freely, that we are sealed with the Holy Spirit and we are now part of Christ’s body the church (Eph 1:13) There is nothing that we need to do, no good works that are required, and no bad works that can separate us from our new po￾sition in Christ (Romans 8:35-39). Faith and belief in this information from God’s word is the gospel. The gospel is not accepting Jesus into your heart. The gospel is not making him lord of your life, it is not saying a prayer and it is not being baptized with water. So next time someone asks you if you are saved. Give them the clear assured answer “Yes! And let me tell you why Find more free resources at: www.graceambassadors.com

[@TheCordialCatholic]

What?

[@ucheodozor4147]

You're right in saying that salvation comes from taking refuge in Christ and him alone. However, "plain and simple" does not necessarily mean "absolutely right". Neither does it imply "completely correct". It's unbiblical to say that baptism is unnecessary and that one who is already in Christ doesn't need to do anything else, except to simply claim to believe. Those are not what the Bible--I mean the entire Bible--says. Even the demons believe to that extent. What happens to Christian charity? How else to demonstrate obedience to Christ and the gospels, except through sacrificial love to God and humanity? If works were unnecessary, why does Jesus command them all over the gospels? How come no one ever taught or believed that baptism and works were unnecessary for 1500 years, until Martin Luther and his colleagues did so? All over Acts of the Apostles, we find that everyone in the early Church was baptised. Every single incidence of conversion to the faith was instantly followed up with baptism. On the issue of works, James clearly talks about using "works" of charity to "back up" one's faith in Christ (James 2: 14, 17-18, 20-26). What Paul frowns at is the belief that "works of the law" are potent enough in themselves to bring salvation; certainly, not that works of Chritian charity are unnecessary in the expression of Christian faith. That would be an absurd doctrine and a contradiction to everything else in the scriptures.

[@marianweigh6411]

Another instance where picking and choosing verses gives a 'version' of the Gospel, a 'simplification' pretending to be complete. But it is not. Notice also how this 'plain and simple' version doesn't even use the words of Jesus Christ!! Rather it spins around and remixes verses of Paul. 2 Peter 3:v16 already warns about the danger of doing this. Let's read Matthew 7 instead, even simpler (with emphasis): 21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who _does_ the will of my Father in heaven. 22 On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many deeds of power in your name?’ 23 Then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; go away from me, you evildoers.’ 24 “Everyone then who hears these words of mine and _acts on them_ will be like a wise man who built his house on rock. 25 The rain fell, the floods came, and the winds blew and beat on that house, but it did not fall, because it had been founded on rock. 26 And everyone who hears these words of mine and _does not act_ on them will be like a foolish man who built his house on sand. 27 The rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and beat against that house, and it fell-and great was its fall!” People of Christ, let's build our house on _rock!_

[@michaelibach9063]

The Way is HARD and few find it - Jesus Christ

[@mikelopez8564]

@warda- what’s your point? You get the “most incoherent use of the Bible” award today. Cheers