Prophet 600 vs Prophet 5 // Is the 600 a better value option?

#prophet600 #prophet5/10 #review
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Is the Prophet 600 a viable alternative to the Prophet 5? We're here to find out! The Prophet 600 is about £2k cheaper than a Prophet 5 but can it make similar sounds? are they essentially the same synth, same circuits with different interface and a couple of minor differences?
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0:00 Intro
1:43 The BIG ONE - Envelopes
5:57 Knob Resolution
9:28 Main Functions
11:31 Poly Mod
13:02 Oscillators
18:41 Filter
22:58 Conclusion

[@decimal1815]

The other big difference is that you can play a 6-note chord on the P600 :)

[@rrocktoo]

I can see why Behringer has been taking time to release its homage. Looking forward to that comparison. Great work.

[@wrmusic8736]

with GliGli mod you can use (to tape) 2 2 to switch LFO range from low to high. Also GliGli mod comes with 'vibrato' which is basically another, if simpler, LFO and it has a decent range. Also the mod gives you 4 types of envelopes and "exponential" ones should be used exactly for when you want to generate fast kind of sounds. But I do agree envelopes require you to take time to find that "right" spot. Also 600 will almost always lose in lushness against Prophet 5 in Rev1/2 mode because it's CEM vs SSI filter. Now with Rev3 mode - this is a lot more fair. If not more advantageous to 600 because 3372 filter does not lose lows when resonance is dialed in - unlike 3320. Prophet 600 is a great value even now. And it does some ridiculously fat bass in its unison mode, especially when you detune oscillators some more using GliGli mod. Of course it's not Prophet 5, but boy oh boy - at that price point it still can trade punches with more expensive Prophet 6 and OB-6 quite easily.

[@niceheartwhitesuit]

The best part of Starsky Carr reviews is the cat cameos, followed very closely by the thoughtful analysis.

[@chrisolley2762]

I've had both but I found the 600 was boring because of the envelopes, although I think it sounds better than the Prophet V. The Prophet V is a classic synth for a reason and it can't be beaten for making music with (that's what these things are for yeah?). If you want that sound and you want to save some real dosh, get the Sequential Circuits SixTrak. Unbelievably cool sounding synth and the filter is much better than the one on the 600 because it doesn't step. I'm a professional musician and since I had a Prophet V in the studio, I totally get why it is on so many records since from when it came out to now. It's a brilliant musical instrument that can do so much. You go through the presets and the way that they are laid out makes you familiarise yourself with what sound is where very quickly. Then you can adjust the sound and tailor it a bit if need be. And just like a Minimoog, it sits in the mix without doing anything. I use it all the time. I'd never sell it because it helps me make and create music. My only other synth is a Minimoog but I rarely use it since getting the Prophet V now. I find the sound of the Prophet equal to that of the Moog and it records just as well. If you buy a synth, don't get too fussed about how 'fat' and 'big' it sounds because you end up taking that part away anyway when you mix the track. Buy a synth because of how you interact with it. Every synth pulls you in to its way of working and you shouldn't really try fighting that because you want things to be as quick and easy as possible in the studio. It's hard enough anyway trying to write a good song! Classics are classics for a reason. Sound is important, but the reason some instruments are classics and other aren't has more to do with the way the synth draws you in to manipulate it and how it records. Size, amount of knobs etc. don't even come into it for me. You don't need more than 5 bits of gear to make a great album. In fact, if you have any more, I believe it becomes counter-productive. Too many colours.

[@StarskyCarr]

Nice… all good points - especially not getting too focussed on fat sounds. There’s always a mix to consider. The interaction is why we love them. Simple interfaces with limited functionality really does help you to focus your thoughts and produce what you need without additional complexities that can hinder the creative process.

[@rachelar]

I like how you only have two synths and are creative. .. Versus all those "collectors" with rooms of synths who maybe are, maybe aren't!

[@moegreen77]

In 1983 choosing my first synth, it was a toss up between the 600 and the Six-Trak. The multi-track sequencer seemed like having a whole studio at the time so I went with the Six-Trak. Didn't have the foresight to recognize what a turnoff one-knob editing would be but, lots of fun creations came through that little guy never the less and I still have it!

[@OnlyMyPistol]

i found a way through some midi black magic to turn my six trak into a 3 voice prophet through the stack function :)

[@SPAZZOID100]

Gigli mod.

[@cortical1]

Lovely little experimental comparison, man. Thanks! I love my Gligli Prophet 600 for exactly the reasons you stated. It's got bark and grit and its filters have character. I just kind of prefer the sound over some of the newer Prophets, frankly. Cheers from Carlsbad, California.

[@theoriginaldanalogue]

Thanks for a great demo! Very interesting comparison. I’ve recently acquired a P600 GliGli and I have to say, that despite a few shortcomings (nothing that can’t be fixed in the mix), it’s a brilliant synth. I actually like the envelopes too - quite snappy. Not as much attack as the Prophet 5. What I like is that it’s a bit wild and unpredictable with much more character than the Japanese single osc poly synths I find. I really love the filter and it always gives me a nice surprise - which I look for in a synth. Compared to my Juno and Polysix, it’s far more interesting. Love how you can now overdrive it with the mod and the with the right programming, the bass is amazing! I would certainly recommend this synth.

[@synthmaven]

I have two of them and paid premium in 2009/10 to get them + costly tech visits to get them stable an fully working and recently had one of them upgraded to Gligli.. Will never give them up.. from my cold dead hands as they say. Nothing is as wild and dark as the Prophet-600. It's the Brian Jones of synthesizers.

[@lundsweden]

The Prophet 5 was a flagship synth with flagship looks- I've saved a ton anyway with my Bro-800!

[@PatrickRosenbalm]

Fine Demo on those axes. I really enjoyed your video. I had a friend back in the 80s and 90s that had a Prophet 600. I always liked that thing. I tried to get him to sell it to me, but he wouldn't budge. He also had a Pro One that he would sell but it needed a lot of work and he wanted too much for it at the time. $300 USD in the mid 90s. If I knew then what I know now I still doubt I would have bought it. We lost touch about 20 years ago when I relocated. Sadly, he passed away in 2015. No clue what became of the synths he had. Except the Crumar Performer. He gave it to me in the late 90s. I still have it.

[@noisetheorem]

In my opinion, they’re close enough. I think I prefer the 600 as well.

[@danwentz]

If the exponential envelopes fade quicker, that’s actually a good thing to leave room when mixed with everything else.

[@nicks.8003]

The 600 does sound a little less polished, but in a good way. It's like a mix of an analog and a chip tune synth.

[@brettwayne8103]

Excellent video and comparison as usual. I like that the 600 is brighter ... really looking forward to the pro800. Was bummed it didn't get released this year. Just can't buy another vintage.

[@StarskyCarr]

Me too. I guess this will be out of the door if the Behringer hits the spot.

[@0e0]

i rock the that chord feature on my p600 all the time. I haven't set up the mod yet but i'm so excited too

[@StarskyCarr]

It’s really easy to install. I’ve taken mine in/out a few times just to compare functions. I’ve now left the GLIGLI in.

[@samjones714]

Nice comparison. Btw. You can easily sweep thru the whole cutoff range on the P5/P10 with the cutoff knob if you activate krytracking. You can also get PWM mod thru zero if you put the initial amount to max and add some additional modwheel

[@StarskyCarr]

Thanks nice tips

[@BaltimoreReese]

600 sounds grittier to me which I actually prefer

[@nilsvanderplancken]

Sound: prophet 5 rev 2 > prophet 5 rev 3 > Prophet 600 > prophet 5 rev 4, owned and played them all. 18:20: not a single new synthesizer has that kind of sizzle in the sound. On the vintage prophets the sound can be so phat and gritty that it almost feels like it's doing some damage inside :) this vibe is non-existing on the rev 4, it's more tamed. The more and more analog synthesizers I play and own, the less I look at features. Sound is everything.

[@wrmusic8736]

Sound and usability for me. It's why I realized I don't gel with Behringer's modules. They sound great, but knobs are so small - it feels like you are battling a synth when trying to make patches. It's also the reason why I wouldn't go for Pro-800 module and got 600 instead. Even if 800 is going to be super responsive and smooth in its controls and envelopes - big knobs are way more fun to use.

[@nilsvanderplancken]

@@wrmusic8736 well, the rev 4 has the big knobs, and they are good. Don't like the wood however :) certainly not the quality of rev 2-3, let alone rev 1. I would refinish the wooden case immediately if I'd get one. The pro-800 might be great and I love rack synths, but you can't go wrong opting for vintage. Just make sure your pots are very clean when going gligli (highter pot resolution).

[@thepaintingtube7965]

Your two greatest videos imo are the Minimoog comparison with the Behringer clone and this one. Better value by miles its not even close. Sounds are sublime all around. Even if not exactly the same they are so close you need an oscilloscope to show it. You should work for Behringer on the new 600 clone as im sure you will come to the same conclusion..

[@henrikgerlach4765]

WOW! Great comparison! I was actually anticipating it since I really wanted to hear them side by side. Starsky, Is it possible to create some pad/string comparisons as you did at 9:15. I would love to hear how the "grittiness" will affect those kinds of sounds. I am also asking myself if the P600 has more bass? When you compare both (P600 at 9:15 and P5 at 9:18) it sounds like the P600 has more power in the lower register - or is this just due to velocity and you hit the lower "f" just a little softer on the P5?

[@Synth_Tools]

It might be due to the CEM3372 chips (filter + VCA). The 3372 filter has no loss in the low end even with high levels of resonance.

[@henrikgerlach4765]

@@Synth_Tools Yes, could be. Why is @starsky actually not answering after 11 (eleven!!!) months? 😳

[@johnschreiber5424]

13:22 Yes! Ramp and saw waves together sound like PWM... Forgot about that trick!

[@cymonalex]

Q. Does the re-issue Prophet 5 have pink noise selectable on the Poly Mod LFO (source mix) ?

[@nabooka316]

Prophets basically comes in 4 variations - they either use Curtis 3320 filters (V rev3), 3372 filter&amp (600), 3396 synth on a chip (rev2) or SSM2044 (V rev1,2 & 4) - the CEM & SSM Wiki is a good resource for reference

[@wrmusic8736]

'08/Rev2 don't use 3396. They use what was going to be 3397, a very different thing. CEM3396 has analog noise source on DCO2, can continuously go from saw to triangle and can output multiple waveform at once (pulse + however you cross-shape saw/triangle). Noise is digital on P'08/Rev2 and it can only do 50/50 mix of saw and triangle and can't do multiple waveform output.

[@NickHowesAstro]

Now the Pro800 is out (and the 1.26 update, giving you those fantastic envelopes), what's your take on the 800 vs a 5

[@SacSynths_Jack_Z]

I've got a P10 Rev3 and a Rev4, but I still rock my P600 all the time. It does not deserve its reputation, especially now with gligli upgrade available. Yes, the envelope release, etc. is terrible, but almost any synth comes with compromises. Does it sound great and do you have fun playing it...? That's what matters to me.

[@user-pk1mj4lb5f]

Hi Starsky, nice to see the P600 in the spotlight. You show some graphs (around 3:54). In preparation of potentially making that kind of envelope shape change (or rather: option) to the P600: what exact settings were you using on the P5 to get this decay shape? BTW: the "shortness" of the decay time on the bottom right (P600 exponential) is unfortunate, but the characteristics of the decay, which you criticize (I agree) are related to the shape of the curve.

[@StarskyCarr]

That shape was created with a very simple envelope setting. The sustain was in full and release was turned to about 70% as far as I can recall. It’s basically a plot of the release curve (no decay portion). Are you writing some code for GLIGLI ? If so… cool! It could really do with this. I imagine it is just a simple case of tweaking the exponential curve function - at least to get the first half of the decay more aligned. The final fade out may be more tricky!

[@user-pk1mj4lb5f]

@@StarskyCarr Hi, thanks for the quick answer! Yes, I am working on what I would call an overhaul (plus some features). And sorry, the concrete question that came up is whether that curve is the rev 1/2 setting or the rev 3 setting. Actually, I now see from the video that the rev 1/2 LED was on, right?. Maybe you can say how the rev 3 on the P5 sounds to you (assumption is that it also affects the amp shape)? This would make it easier to make a choice for the new curve. BTW: new env shapes on the P600 will have to be an additional option, in order to preserve the sound of "old" patches.

[@johnbarron4308]

P600 is a great synth but it can't quite match the Prophet 5 for creaminess and lushness. I think the extra money for a Rev4 is worth it imo.

[@Synth_Tools]

Only if you prefer creamy sound over harsh sound. Some people prefer it to sound harsher indeed.

[@johnbarron4308]

@@Synth_Tools agreed. It would be pretty boring if all synths sounded the same and we have a synth for literally all tastes. We're so lucky.

[@SPAZZOID100]

I had a P600 years ago sitting next to my rev 3 P5. There is a lot of overlap, but as you stated, the slow software envelopes on a stock p600 are too slow, especially when compared to the lightning fast envelopes on the P5. And the resolution on the p600’s lfo mod is not fine enough. And the build quality and design is far better on the p5 as well.

[@jeffc1753]

I really don’t understand the envelope and resolution of the P600 argument, given that this was resolved years and years ago with the gligli firmware…

[@UniQueWerkx]

You're going to drive the price up doing this! LOL Love these comparisons! Thank you!

[@DavidLee07]

I love my 600. The biggest drawbacks are that the envelopes never quite match the P5's (although you can get close), that the GliGli features take you out of one knob/one function mode, and that it doesn't have lights to show you if a waveform is on and such. Having to flip the switches around every time you load a patch and are trying to remember what you were doing is a pain. With GliGli, one thing to remember on the Oscillator volume levels is that 5 is full up on the original model and you're overdriving the signal beyond that (which is great to have as an option, just remember that you don't have to turn it to 10 every time!). The fact that the 600 can easily be modded is plus, and I can get pretty close on my favorite P5 sounds. Definitely a fun synth to use; you just have to fight with it a bit more than a P5 to get it to do what you want.

[@StarskyCarr]

just got a new keyed for my P600. I bought it just to have a play, and note I'm definitely keeping it!

[@DavidLee07]

@@StarskyCarr Awesome! With a techs mechs keyboard I like playing the p600 a lot more. The feel is so much better! Definitely a worthwhile investment.

[@christianthompson1473]

Have you checked out the prophet 12 yet? It's my new favourite synth.

[@kimzim2001]

What was the vintage knob setting on the P5? Would different settings perhaps have made it more gritty like the P600?

[@SPAZZOID100]

The p5 doesn’t need the vintage knob to sound more powerful than the p600.

[@rachelar]

I d rather six note poly and midi, seq/arp, than five!

[@SPAZZOID100]

The rev 4 p5 has MIDI-plus velocity, aftertouch, layers, splits, both filters, & much better looks & build quality. And much quicker envelopes.

[@Komet163B]

Was the comparison with a Rev 3 or 4 Prophet 5? I can’t tell what Prophet 5 you were using.

[@skaneverdies]

Without the GliGli mod, I could justify sacrificing a voice for the envelopes and general look of the P5. With the GliGli mod, the P600 is the winner without question in my mind. More flexible, extra voice, and sonically (nearly) identical to the 5.

[@SPAZZOID100]

I have a 600 with the mod. I don’t find the envelopes much snappier than before, and still not as quick as my p5.

[@mr.irrelevant3588]

man that is actually very close. I think i would prefer that 600 and spend the rest on other gear.

[@DBCisco]

Love your comparison vids but the slight differences usually are meaningless in a mix or on stage with a band.

[@StarskyCarr]

Absolutely, which hopefully people can see by watching these. There’s so many ridiculously polarised opinions out there - I’m trying to lay it out as it is. The big difference here is the feel of the interface and sluggish response. But no-one hearing it in a track is aware or would care anyway.

[@DBCisco]

@@StarskyCarr Can't get the 'feel' through KZbin. That is something musicians need to checkout before buying. Agreed

[@Syntox]

☝️☝️THIS☝️☝️

[@mr.irrelevant3588]

for some reason synth fans obsess and fetishize over synths. but you are right once you track and mix nobody is going to know or even care what you used to record with.

[@wrmusic8736]

it is often true in a busy mix, but when it's a track that consists of something like 2 synths tops with minimum of effects or a certain synth takes a main stage - its sound does make a difference. That Blade Runner soundtrack would never sound as good using a DCO-based synth or even many VCO-based ones.

[@rachelar]

For sure at the time, needed midi etc

[@firatakyl6901]

Are you planning to do a comparison/review with the JX-08 and JX-8P?

[@StarskyCarr]

I've not got either, so not at the mo sorry.

[@synesthetica]

Prophet 600 is surprisingly good! I many ways I prefer it over P5. It's brighter, but has less of that 3k bite that P5 has, which in my book is good. I'm looking forward to Behringer's Pro 800.

[@georgegeorgio1751]

@@datapusher- When you say "Don’t waste your money” how do you know how close it will sound before it’s even released? you need to wait to see if some great programmers will get it to sound close, it won’t sound exact most in the know peeps will already know this but if it gets to around 80% of it then it can still be thought of as great synth in it’s own right with a kind of Prophet flavour and will be desirable to those that won’t be able to afford the original.

[@samjones714]

Can the Gligli Prophet be played with Aftertouch and velocity over MIDI?

[@wrmusic8736]

No aftertouch - but velocity - yeah

[@brettlarson3504]

The CHORDS @9:15 say it all. The 600 is warmer, fatter, better. I've owned them both BTW. The new Prophet 5 is not what the old one was. And I have compared Rev 3 to Rev 4 in person on good monitors and the life is just not there. Even leaving comparisons aside, the Rev 4 just didn't inspire me in the way any of the other Prophets have (including the Prophet Rev 2, and to a lesser extend the Prophet '08). I really feel strongly about this and everything I see on the net seems to make it sound like the Rev 4 and Rev 3 are close to identical but this is not the case in person at all. It's nice but I would take a Poly Six or Prophet 600 over it anytime!

[@thedarkestrainbow]

I wouldn’t pay Prophet 5 rev 4 prices for a Prophet 5. I would for something new (not an OBX8) from Oberheim. For that old Prophet sound the Behringer P800 is fine for me. Just don’t see the point of paying top dollar for super basic synths that we have heard over and over again. These days I want things that are either fresh designs or more unusual rarities.

[@ChrisCebelenski]

Not sure how Sequential could have messed up so badly on the envelopes... I do rationalize the envelope control problems as being perhaps related to the digital control scheme, where the P5 had voltage sampling at a higher resolution, maybe that was too expensive for a cut-down price point.

[@StarskyCarr]

Very poor quality digital circuits from the early 80s. Much cheaper than analog stuff, but the resolution was/is awful.

[@Eimost]

Original P5 envelopes were analogue, using CEM 3310s - no 'voltage sampling' involved. The P600 envelopes were software generated by an early 80s 8 bit Z80 uProcessor running at 4 Mhz. The Z80 also did all the voice assignment, LFO generation, mod assignments, glide etc. Generating 12 envelopes would have been pretty taxing back then. The modern P5 has software envelopes of course but they'll be generated at audio rate.

[@simonwehner]

Thanks for this nice comparison! The P5 is a really beautiful instrument! (But don‘t like the mono only output). The big question: P5/P10 vs OB6 - which one would you buy and keep?

[@StarskyCarr]

That is difficult. OB6 is probably the more flexible given the filters plus the sub. The P5/10 is very sexy though plus an extra octave, FX and stereo output. Theres no point in stereo out on the P5 as there’s no panning.

[@simonwehner]

@@StarskyCarr yes it‘s really difficult because it would be my first DSI synth. Love the OBs filter. And the basic tone of P10 has „something“ - would be great for my music (more melodic techno context). Dual Mono out would be nice because my FX pedal chain in the patchbay is stereo. So I have to re route the signal in logic to the stereo FX. Do you keep your P10?

[@MIDERA]

@@simonwehner my take is - P5/10 sounds much better than the OB6. I tested an OB6 a few different times and never really liked it. It does do some extra things (octave transpose, interesting filters and oscillators), but I never really jived with it.

[@simonwehner]

@@MIDERA really like sem style filter sweeping of the ob6. But the general tone, the big knobs, look and feel of the P10 catch me more. Still think about P10+IridiumKeyboard or a Moog one as my main poly setup / update this year - hard decision. 🙉

[@SPAZZOID100]

Well, the P5 graced many records wonderfully. The mono output was never a hindrance.

[@MorbidManoeuvres]

I’ve got love for both so much True the P5 is slightly warmer The p600 being a bit iceyer..harsh I have played both and own a P600 It has a dark heart a true character of its own.. but then all sequential circuits do You can not fail with any !

[@StarskyCarr]

Yeah. Sequential are just great… old and new.

[@saren6538]

Make way for the behringer pro800

[@pheotus]

For me the 5 sounds much better.

[@juno6]

Amazing comparison! I do prefer the P600, but the 5 is great too.

[@treproductions9522]

ngl the 600 just sounds like an HD version of 5

[@geevee7823]

600 unison on original sounds detuned just the right amount. Original P5 does not have chord memory. Biggest omission on the 600 has always been the noise generator.

[@lundsweden]

Behringer Pro-800 has noise plus snappy envelopes

[@Dsil303]

Funny, i was trying to make a few prophet10 sounds on my p600 gligli this afternoon. Now i see this. Been experiencing the same difficulties with the envelop differences. By the way, you should try the 2.1rc3 from gligli. I had those tuning issues as well, but 2.1rc3 has no tuning problems what so ever.

[@synthsandstuff]

What kind of tuning problems did you have?

[@Dsil303]

@@synthsandstuff osc b on voice 2 was out of tune, but only when played together with voice 4. When defeating voice 4 there was no tuning problem. 2.1rc3 fixed this problem, but still now sometimes the filter of voice 4 is tuned flat in comparison to the other filters

[@synthsandstuff]

​@@Dsil303 I also had some tuning problems. At first I thought it was because of the Gligli update but it doesn't seem to be consistent. The problem mainly occurs if the Prophet has been turned off for an extended period of time. Nowadays I put it on every day and don't notice the tuning problem anymore.

[@Dsil303]

@@synthsandstuff sorry forgot to answer. I see you're Dutch as well. Are you on synthforum? Misschien handiger om daar verder te praten

[@stephenbaldassarre2289]

I have a Prophet '08PE but there's some things I really miss about the P600.

[@qlyde]

4:26 I don't understand what you were saying about your prophet 5 being a prophet 10 and needing to turn down the voices? It says Prophet 5 on the front panel. How were you getting 10 voices?

[@StarskyCarr]

I’ve added the extra 5 voice card. I’ve a video showing how it’s done if you’re interested :)

[@qlyde]

@@StarskyCarr Oh so it's like the Rev2 in that sense where you can expand it, Super Cool! I'm actually about to buy a Prophet tomorrow, maybe you could help lol. It's between the Rev2 and the Prophet-6. It will be my Main Poly Synth for a little while, so the 6 voices and 1 LFO scare me on the P6 but it has "the sound". If you could only have 1, would you chose the P6 or the Rev2?

[@StarskyCarr]

@@qlyde I made a Rev2 ve P6 comparison that’s worth checking out. I kept the P6 as the Rev2 had issues (solvable via software apparently so should’ve kept it!). The Rev2 is the sensible option. More to play with… unless you’re after the specific P6 tone. But Rev 2 would be my pick.

[@qlyde]

@@StarskyCarr I’ve been through that video probably 6 times this week haha, seriously never stop making them, they also helped me decide to buy my Alpha Juno and Subsequent 37. I’m not hunting after the exact Prophet sound, I mostly want a great analog poly, but some of the people who inspire me most, are using the P6 so that’s where the idea started. Thanks for your help, I think you’re right, the Rev2 makes more sense, the P6 just pulls on my gear lust big time!

[@TiberianFiend]

Will Behringer clone the 600's filter for accuracy? Should they? 🤔

[@Synth_Tools]

Don't think so. They will probably use their CEM3320 clone instead of the (better) CEM3372.

[@nzreggae2534]

I like the synth sounds Wally Badarou used on Gregory Isaacs 'Night Nurse' album. Smooth pads and flutey leads. Really special sounds. Wally also did some cool stuff on the Grace Jones albums Nightclubbing and the other one with Sly and Robbie hmmm, Private Life. I thought the Prophet 600 might be capable of similar sounds for less money. But all the online demos of the P600 sounded like horrible unusable patches to me. So my mind concluded that the P600 is nothing like the synth Wally Badarou uses. Or all that funky early 80s music. Never touched one though.

[@zmix]

16:45 Hello Kitty..!

[@sidefish8362]

Is there any info about when the Behringer Pro800 is coming out?

[@jermstorm5008]

I wish I knew. It was supposed to be last year but who knows these days. 😕

[@georgegeez8708]

April 2023, as what they said a few days ago on their video.

[@DannyKavka]

It's shipping from the factory now, estimates are 8-12 weeks for it to show up at retailers.

[@GNeuman]

Did you sell it or hold on to it, Starsky?

[@StarskyCarr]

Still got it. Put a new fatar keybed in it as well!

[@MIDERA]

I tested a Prophet 600 right before the pandemic hit (remembering wondering whether I should even be in this guys house). But within seconds of touching it I thought no way, it had just an absolutely abysmal feel to it. I think the Polysix has a nicer feel to it (or build, to be precise). Everything about how the P600 felt was just terrible to me. Without even hearing it I knew I would walk away with out it. Indeed it does sound good in your demo and I remember thinking it sounded good but I have a Polaris and thought it sounded much nicer than the P600. Thanks

[@SPAZZOID100]

?????

[@moritz_schoenermann]

Does the Behringer clone feature white noise? :)

[@StarskyCarr]

No idea, I've not seen one yet.

[@moritz_schoenermann]

@@StarskyCarr Thanks! :)

[@lundsweden]

Yes, I've got one and it does have noise (yey!)

[@moritz_schoenermann]

Niiiice Thank You & Kongraaatz! @@lundsweden

[@DestroyER82]

Keep P-600, sell P-5... Profit! ;-) Just based on this comparison, I like P-600 more. Raw tone of oscilators and tone/behaviour of filter are really winners for my taste. Envelopes (and all controls) are simply about early 1980's low-res DAC, nothing to do about it, its acceptable tho. :)

[@Synth_Tools]

The current P600 envelopes aren't 1980's low-res... they are generated by a new AVR processor.

[@DestroyER82]

@@Synth_Tools They are indeed handled by new processor. But still readed and generated by old low-res DAC's.

[@Synth_Tools]

​@@DestroyER82 the DAC used to translate data to CV in the Prophet-600 is 16-bit (to be exact, a Burr-Brown DAC71 model). It is shared by all CEM chips by the use of multiplexing techniques and sample/hold registers. The fact it used to sound steppy with the Z80 wasn't a bit depth issue, it was due to the slow scanning rate (the Z80 had to update data of all chips in real-time, but only one per cycle of the loop, as selected through the set of 4051 demux ICs). This problem has been drastically mitigated with Gligli's upgrade (the AVR CPU mounted on the Teensy chip is about 30x faster than the original Z80A@4 MHz). Currently, a new Gligli-based FW is being developed and it will include further improvements in the scanning module (among a lot of other additions).

[@DestroyER82]

@@Synth_Tools Oh ok. Thanks for deeper information. My mistake, sorry for that, I was so certain that CV translating DAC was lower bitrate (12bit or even 8). 16bit is changing things a LOT when Z80 is replaced by new CPU.

[@RealityShiftUK]

Weird I actually prefer the sound of the prophet 600 and the pro 800 from behringer

[@davidpetersonharvey]

The Prophet 5 is slightly warmer. I think a tube preamp would warm up the sound and make the 600 sound really great.

[@wrmusic8736]

it's because most of the comparison is done using an SSI/SSM filter (Rev1/2 mode). That's peak analog filter, only one other can compete with it - Oberheim's SEM. Note how when Starsky switches to Rev3 mode in a latter part of the video - they start sounding a lot closer in terms of warmth.

[@lucy5668]

i get more disappointed with the prophet 5 after every vs video... its lacking in bass and sizzle

[@SPAZZOID100]

Incorrect.

[@falconbravo66]

Prophet 600 the iconic synth of Broken Wings Mr Mister!

[@SPAZZOID100]

According to who?

[@_gilmusica]

Actually today you can get a used prophet 5 module or even prophet 10 module cheaper than a serviced prophet 600 or about the same price. And it’s killing me because I actually prefer the sound of the prophet 600! I think I am the only one in the world 😂 rev 4 is a better choice considering literally any other parameter: stability,reliability, more voices, knob resolution, bi-timbral... I love the more dirty, vintage sound of the 600. A hard decision.

[@StarskyCarr]

I got the P600 out of intrigue more than anything. Was planning on demoing it and selling in. I ended up fitting a new date keybed in it and it’s still here!

[@_gilmusica]

Nice to know. The Keybed is another let down of the 600.. the main thing holding me from wanting a rev 4 is that I don’t think it will replace my prophet 08. Its mono, “clean” sounding in comparison and more “to your face” which isn’t as good for more in the back strings and stuff that the prophet 08 does well. The prophet 600 on the other hand I think could sonically replace the 08 with no problem. Actually if you plan on doing a comparison between 08, 600, rev 4 that would be welcome!

[@StarskyCarr]

@@_gilmusica I wish id never sold my 08 but can't keep em all!

[@ingoodmusic]

the 600 is beating the modern p5 in richness of tone, i’m wondering about the vintage P5

[@SPAZZOID100]

It’s not beating anything.

[@polygonsunset5431]

The P-600 is hot garbage unmodded. It’s massive sounding for sludgy bass and amazing at the things it can do well, but good god are the digital bits SHIT. Suuuuuper slow everything and quantized to hell, plus trash build quality. It’s a second tier synth like the Jupiter 6 and JX3P. Pretty cool, but there’s a reason they have always been cheap

[@SPAZZOID100]

$1,600 now.

[@morbidmanmusic]

5 has much richer low end

[@killswitchmediastudios]

P600s are selling anywhere from $1400 - $2000. I wish people would stop saying words like inexpensive and cheap. It’s cheaper than a P5 in a few ways, but inexpensive is not the word that should be used these days for this cult classic. I never heard of the Juno 106 referred to as inexpensive.

[@StarskyCarr]

I think I said it was relatively cheap, which is a different thing altogether. But yeah nothings cheap… hence the relatively 😂👍

[@killswitchmediastudios]

@@StarskyCarr You really do read all of your comments. I didn’t mean you per say. I meant in general from many of the comments that word is being used in contrast to the P5. I’m not sure when that amount of money became cheap. Since I have been toying with the idea of a P5, your channel has helped me to realize I truly don’t need a Prophet 5. I want one but not at that price. I’ll keep pushing the P600 till the wheels fall off. Thanks for the reply.

[@StarskyCarr]

@@killswitchmediastudios just getting my P600 out of the studio and onto the test table with the Behringer!!

[@Magnus_Loov]

I heard the Juno was cheap before I bought one for 3000 SEK or about $300... That was in 1993! Sold it for about $350 a year later (I thought it was a great deal. Now seeing the prices it goes for. Hmmmm!) At one point or another almost all Analog Synths were inexpensive, if they were not very rare (like the CS-80, the ARP 2600 or the Memory Moog which always seems to have been expensive). Got one Korg Mono/Poly in 1990 together with a Poly 800 for $80. The Poly 800 was just hanging along for free (bought it from a friend when we studied at Uni) These were so unpopular at the time that nobody wanted them. Well except the curious me (seeing that Techno was just around the corner and I being into old school Synth anyway) If I just had kept all the Synths that "passed by" a little bit longer (the second hand market was great in Sweden at the time though. Bought maybe 90% of all kinds of electronics used)¨ Pro-800 incoming for me in a week or so...

[@killswitchmediastudios]

Interesting how people don’t listen to their own ears.

[@AlainHubert]

As I suspected all along. This new P5 REV4 is high harmonics hampered. Now I know that my ears didn't deceive me, since a vintage P5 will have all those high-end harmonics present as well. This REV4 is not worthy of carrying the name Prophet 5. It's a dull-sounding synth for waaayyy too much money for what it offers. Especially when an "inexpensive" vintage P600 can offer all of the frequencies without compromise.

[@henrikgerlach4765]

Sorry, but that's complete bs.

[@AlainHubert]

@@henrikgerlach4765 I'm sorry if you're deaf, but I'm not.

[@anoniconoclast2030]

@@AlainHubertDamn, I was going to buy a rev4.

[@henrikstolpe]

That is strange IMO. I use to own a rev2 Prophet 5, it had a bit more distorsion in the vca but that didnt make it brighter but a bit rougher, it still sounded dull compared to my minimoog. The organic floating oscillators and 2040 filter made it heavenly for pads though. But, my rev4 that I have now is exactly as organic, it really is, but has more meat in the vco’s. CEM vcos and SSM filter seem to be the best combination, I can also do bass on this as it has a CEM filter too, basssounds never worked well on the rev2 P5. I am obsessed with filter brightness, and always compare everything to the frequency range of the minimoog, it is not as bright as that but not much is, it is however as bright as the Behringer Odyssey which is pretty bright. The P5 rev4 is the best poly Ive ever played. In the video here I show how organic it is, it is not dull sounding, then I would hate it, and I dont, if it had a bit more distorsion internallt it would be cool but as it is, its still rawer and nastier than most vintage polys, like the Jupiter 8, OB-8 etc, and the first truly vintage sounding modern poly I have ever played actually. kzbin.info/www/bejne/jnjXnaR7jKmCiZo

[@SPAZZOID100]

I own a rev 3. The 4 sounds identical, and with a host of amazing new features.

[@robertcrystals]

So did the Behringer Pro 800 fix the envelope problems?

[@StarskyCarr]

No, but there was an update to the gligli system making them smoother. Behringer has made them snappier, but not necessarily 'better' - just different.