Prototype Gustloff 206 Rifle

[@Jibriltz]

Sold for $63,250.... Someone reeaally wanted that rifle.

[@sollitdude1]

cant blame him. i mean, this looks like a proper wolfenstein rifle. makes me wish the german army did adopt it, just so it had a cool weapon to add to the bunch.

[@malithion5046]

@@sollitdude1 came here to say pretty much that; it's extremely dieselpunk in its aesthetics.

[@raharuko]

jesus rich fuckin neonazis lol

[@Gameprojordan]

@raharuko low IQ comment from someone who doesn't understand that military relics from once powerful militaries are very sought after collectibles. Cry all you want but germany in ww2 was an extremely powerful foe and because of it that makes anything from them extremely sought after on the collectors market

[@chlorhexidine2506]

@@sollitdude1 I bet this dude's like 14

[@opmdevil]

Is it a standard operating procedure to say "dud dud di du di duu" when releasing the magazine?

[@ForgottenWeapons]

Yes, I had to translate that from the German manual.

[@NoharaLoco]

I laughed more than I probably should have at that. :)

[@lapislazuli2896]

If a German Police Officer reloads (what doesn't happen so often) he's "dud di du"ing too. :D

[@Hesric]

Just a small ritual to calm the machine spirit of the rifle.

[@feraligatorade99]

+NoharaLoco same

[@johnaffleck6572]

Completely fascinating; and the piece itself; completely crazy. The egg-shell "stock" is jaw dropping mad. What an amazing channel; there's always another design effort you never would have thought of.

[@beargillium2369]

Agree! I wonder what kind of wood it is?! Really shows how prescious supplies were that we often take for granted

[@rochatka]

this is a perfect demo of why certain weapons don't get adopted by their militaries, just going off the basic disassembly it would be near impossible to fix and or service this in the field.

[@therugburnz]

Yeah, I do try to understand how much infighting that if it did not happen would have made the horrible war last even longer. How many lives would have been different.

[@DawsonWebster]

Alot of the ergonomics look ak in nature

[@unknown0soldier]

I'm seven years late lol xD But you do realize this is just a prototype? had this been adopted, it would have been simplified to ease disassembly. That's something totally normal for a prototype

[@ahobimo732]

Ian, I am always impressed at how you casually use the proper technical term for nearly every last component of the firearms you showcase. I can never use technical terminology fluently, even when I know the technology and the terms very well. If I was as awkward and clumsy with my tools as I am with their names, I would have broken my neck years ago. You on the other hand, are like the poet laureate of the history of weapons manufacturing. It's a great talent and makes your videos highly watchable.

[@BrandonBaumvideo]

My grandparents were directly affected by the Nazis and I think that even though the Nazis did horrific things, the flag and swastika should not be censored because it is part of history. We should not censor history thus I don't think people should be censoring the swastika. Just my opinion. If people want to be offended by parts of history, let them be offended because we should not hide or deny history just because someone feels offended. The only reason we should ever censor something is if it is advocating violence or hate towards others and this video does not advocate either of those so I think the flag should be able to be displayed on the thumbnail of this video. “Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it” -Winston Churchill Great video none the less. I really enjoy these videos

[@buster7797]

BrandoSpoke blame youtube

[@theonewhodoesstuff548]

BrandoSpoke I thought Santayana said that.

[@mrlucky5025]

The "quote", from a 1948 speech, attributed to Churchill, was a paraphrase of “Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.” (George Santayana-1905).

[@nopeweeb5511]

Thank you I appreciate you saying what needed to be stated

[@julemandenudengaver4580]

here in Denmark the Jewish community got one of the biggest retail platform to ban Nazi things by telling how arfull they had and everyone who collect German ww2 is nazis..

[@lennarthoek8392]

"puhhh" -ian 2016 lol

[@dizzydisset8563]

Lennart Hoek The most french pronounced word on the channel ;)

[@dizzydisset8563]

The most french pronounced word on the channel ;)

[@Trve_Kvlt]

Great video as always Ian. That's a beautiful rifle right there.

[@Ostenjager]

I wonder if the reason for the hollow sheet metal stock wonkiness has something to do with trying to meet some requirement for the Fallschirmjäger - maybe weight and the ability to take it apart "easily" for stowage.

[@flynn88MN]

so in theory you could put a standard mg-18 magazine on that thing, making it the highest capacity semi-auto rifle of its time.

[@polygondwanaland8390]

Could you put the 75 round AA drum for the MG13 on it? 🤔

[@builder396]

@@polygondwanaland8390 Had to google it, but it has the same locking mechanism, so apart from being heavy nothing really prevents it.

[@TenebrusI07]

This is straight out of valkyria chronicles

[@vito7428]

I know right,I was just about to comment that. It looks like one of the upgraded versions of the Lenfield

[@leathery420]

The bolt hold open reminds me of the SKS. It's just a little tab that's pushed up by the mag body. You can also push it up yourself with the mag out because it's not spring loaded, just gravity or the mag body holding it one way or the other.

[@KriegBoy]

The trigger, in my oppinion, really show how progressive the trial and error process was on the fabrication of the gun. Amazing.

[@foldedsteel8633]

This gun looks like a gun that should've seen actual use. It looks better than the G43 and likely also functions better. I wish I could get my hands on one as easily, that's for sure.

[@jidk6565]

Question How the fuck do you measure the greatness of a rifle I'd say this would be unfun (to say the least) to disassemble

[@christopherdrekr1078]

😮

[@DoRC]

another great video! It seems like this mechanism is the product of a reactive design process. Just keep adding things to fix each issue as they come up. awful lot if parts.

[@matthewking2274]

I know it's late on my post dont know if you're going to see this but anyway I'm not a expert just someone who really enjoys your videos. It looks like the hole in the back of the receiver is a cleaning rod access point instead of being a take-down detent. If It was ment to hinge open you would have to remove the front take-down pin to remove the op-rod/metal handguard which would defeat the point of it to hinge open. Awsome content i watch all your videos best channel in my opinion.

[@DaxMarko]

I imagine this would been an another iconic WW2 rifle if it made it into mass production and distribution

[@AdoringFan]

Have you ever broken or damaged anything you looked at Ian?

[@RaDeus87]

I think he fixed something accidentally in one of his videos once :P

[@Reavenant]

If I'm correct it was a pistol firing mechanism . Can't remember the video name :/

[@laci816]

+Jesper O (RaDeus) If anyone could link it I would be so very grateful.

[@WBtimhawk]

That was one from the Cody museum I believe. Either a US carbine or SMG prototype. Can't remember exactly. A recent video anyway. It's at the very end of that video.

[@salmjak]

How did he fix it? Did I miss something because it stills jams in the end, doesn't it?

[@chrome4ks]

Ian, you have my respect, in that your extensive study and research gives you the intuitive sense of how complicated these firearms function. I know how meticulous German manufacturing was, and it makes me thankful in part to the same approval process that what could be considered "crude" in terms of presentation, still gave the allies a superior advantage in the ability to field effective weapons in greater numbers.

[@THEGHOSTBURNER]

He had to censor the flag because KZbin flagged it. Look up his earlier video that addresses this controversy.

[@hugebartlett1884]

@Kerosin Fuchs This is a dangerous move,aimed at suppressing certain facts which are considered inappropriate by a group of people who cannot tolerate reality. This is how historical records and documentation is altered,to suit present thinking,a very insidious form of censorship and control.

[@commodorjack8633]

@@hugebartlett1884 what terror! nobody will know about nazis because youtube doesn't want people posting nazi imagery on their site

[@hugebartlett1884]

@@commodorjack8633 There seems to be a universal attempt to suppress information and details about Nazi atrocities during the thirties and the war,almost as if it is certain people's interest to hide everything. This is a defamation of history,leading to a future generation knowing nothing about it. Eventually,even the war itself will be altered,probably insinuating that it was all our fault from the start.

[@commodorjack8633]

@@hugebartlett1884 ok dumbass.

[@huntertice3883]

@@commodorjack8633 "Life is too short to get into vitriolic arguments on KZbin about this" -Ian

[@WAQWBrentwood]

"Wow, It's really weird inside.” A most apt description of Nazi era Germany itself! Thanks!

[@knives9284]

NS Germany was Valhalla on Earth, a grand transformation form the ashes of WW1 into a prosperous nation full of dignity, spirit and traditionalism. Aye, it would be weird when the only thing a person know's is a degenerate hedonist lifestyle.

[@thehighwayman8776]

@@knives9284 uhm... Are you for real, bud? "Valhalla on earth"? Like, thats even nuttier than the shit the Wendler spouts. Way to go...

[@saltymcginger2027]

@@knives9284 Ladies and Gentlemen, we got him.

[@Aldebaran1945]

12 years free

[@drmaudio]

While unusual, depending on the gauge of the steel, the wood over stamped stock could potentially be fairly light, strong, and comfortable, at least compared with the early '40s alternatives.

[@ItsMrAssholeToYou]

Probably. But with the wood clamping onto the tang like that, making it the only means of attachment, I have serious doubts such thin wood would be up to the rigors of the battlefield.

[@LibertyTreeStudios]

Crude and rough looking but I really like the design of it, great video!

[@Omnihil777]

Maybe with the sheet metal inner stock they tried to save weight to get this into the specs for the Fallschirm Jäger Gewehr?

[@SirBob42]

That was my thought as well, particularly with that foregrip. (How much weight would that actually save?)

[@alexleake3491]

My first thought was it was a resource saving thing as a prototype, since you dont want to be using a lot of wood for what is basically a test for the action, but it being a weight saving measure does make more sense

[@cs-rj8ru]

If it's for the Luftwaffe, they should have made the stock from balsa wood.....

[@marine6680]

The Sig 320 pistol uses a similar disconnect system. In that the trigger bar slips from the sear during the trigger pull. it does not have the extra disconnecter piece, as the amount of movement between the release of the striker and the disconnect of the trigger bar from the sear, is very small.

[@samsonn25]

You are an excellent historian and Firearms technician

[@thedude1671]

Ian, do you typically have info on how to disassemble weapons like this, or do you just figure it out after messing around with them after a while?

[@ForgottenWeapons]

Guns like this one (which I have virtually zero documentation on) I poke and prod until I figure it out. There are only so many ways to put a gun together, and I've done enough strange ones that I can usually figure things out.

[@Sir_Godz]

hes been stumped a couple of times but he doesnt own them so he cant whack and pry thankfully.

[@panzermacher]

very cool rifle, but I can see why it was dropped, it's an absolute nightmare for field stripping, it would just take far too long to reassemble in an emergency.

[@cherenkov_blue]

This looks very similar mechanically to the Maroszek rifle, and even shares some aesthetic choices. I wonder if there was some inspiration?

[@charpsteve36]

You shouldn't have blurred out the swastika in the thumbnail. As a fellow history buff, I believe that history should be represented as accurately as possible so that future society can remember the mistakes that we and our ancestors made. Just my unrequested opinion. Update: Shit, I just saw your video addressing this. It restored and extended my faith in you as an honest consumer of history. Keep up the great work!

[@lyedavide]

It's a nice looking rifle with some really cool operating system in it.

[@TheSnowWolf1000]

Hey gun Jesus I love your videos I’ve been watching for years a lot of history has passed threw your hands

[@A3roboy]

I would bet that the rear crosspin is temporary, because that rear, unfinished disassembly button is completely superfluous with it in place. If you imagine that the button is functional and the rear pin is not there it becomes a swing-open design (like an AR) with the front crosspin as the swivel.

[@sae1095hc]

As far as I can tell, the stock is held together with just those thin wood outer shells. Would last a couple of days in combat.

[@thewiezman]

Possibly. But if it broke the main metal part is still there. And I suspect if this ever went into large production the would redesign the stock.

[@sae1095hc]

No doubt.

[@colinsmyth9211]

They may have replaced the wood with Bakelite when it came to the production stage.

[@jackfuller8960]

Prototype

[@Modellbyggaren]

No, it's a dufflecut in the metal stock. Naturally the full length metal stock is meant to handle a hard paratrooper landing (or just being dropped..). The wooden outer shells is needed if you use the weapon in extreme cold or warm conditions.

[@aeronwilliams94]

Thanks Ian , for another factual and interesting video .

[@SolidTrashTier]

Ian, I remember in one of your videos, you were talking to Karl about your SKS that he had described as being very crudely made. If possible, I would like to see a video on it.

[@mohammedcohen]

Gustloff Werke was a LARGE producer of the KAR98k...definitely NOT a 'minor' producer

[@xXGUNMAN357Xx]

willing to bet that stock area was cut with a hacksaw to fit in a duffel bag

[@zachbrummett9672]

Why cut the mag down ? A 30round battle rifle makes sense to me 😂

[@caymanhunter2612]

Howdy Zach! So to answer your question 2 years later... The reason. Is, a battle rifle is not as versatile as an assault rifle. With an assault rifle you can adapt it for CQB or medium long range, really a lot of goals can be accomplished. The battle rifle meant to be a precise rifle able to hold it's own in a fire fight and get long range picks but not necessarily a sniper, it isn't meant to assault or rush B as it were. It's mission might require laying down quickly and a big mag would mean you'd need a nip of when realistically you also don't want to add extra weight. 10 to 15 round mag capacity is generally great and the battle rifles with this amount tend to be the most effective for those reasons. There may be a few scenarios someone wishes they had a larger mag but in order to end up in that scenario they would have had to have made a big mistake

[@TheSnowWolf1000]

More agile

[@lastdayonearth8381]

Yep, I Will Never Understand Why People Nerf Greatness.

[@TheTuttle99]

@@lastdayonearth8381 I Will Never Understand Why People Type Like This

[@lastdayonearth8381]

@@TheTuttle99 I Will Never Understand Why People Care. They See This Way Of Typing And They Just Can't Control Themselves.

[@nicolasmauser]

This rifle looks like an last-ditch efford,like an end of the war weapon

[@yam83]

The look of a prototype at the start of the war, becomes the look of a frontline weapon at the end of the war.

[@knives9284]

its a prototype firearm, they aren't supposed to be refined and pretty

[@jfrorn]

Lot of thought into making this light weight. Shame Ian doesn't mention it.

[@basedury]

Seems like they originally built this particular rifle without the wood guard and stock, but then covered those components with the wood, maybe for the sake of presentation.

[@imsteevin]

One day Ian is going to open some part of an old gun I've never heard of and there will just be a tiny city in there or something

[@forsakenace9577]

I get the BAR AK feel from this gun just a lot different

[@Daemascus]

I wonder how much of that locking block movement could be felt while firing. It doesn't move that far, but its a pretty chunky looking part.

[@damienthomas6655]

❤❤I believe the metal shell is to give the wood strength so the would would collapse been so thin ,,the overall weight saving from all the wood scalloped out and a thin sheet metal strength peice inserted would save a bit of weight .❤❤

[@thorsteinwolfgangson2178]

That rifle is gorgeous.

[@davidbowman6689]

I just saw the video and I noticed Captain Howdy’s face etched on the magazine. Left side of the mag upper right.

[@da8352]

If there is no disconnector and you hold the sear down in a hammer fired gun like that, instead of fire full auto i think the bolt and the hammer will just drop together and fail to fire the next round because the hammer drops too slowly.

[@paulhedeen7659]

I marvel that you handle these super rare metal components without gloves of some sort (to shield the metal from salt and skin oil).

[@RichCommander]

Man imagine how well Germany would have done if hitler didn't intervene as much as he did. Small arms development, Dunkirk, the invasion of the Soviet Union.

[@kaidog9528]

the action and trigger group look similar to the internal workings of a winchester 1300....with the addition of the gas operation

[@hernerweisenberg7052]

hi, nice vid. i wonder if you are aware of the roller-ball in the front of that type of pen you are using to point with, are mostly made from tungsten carbide. this stuff has a mohs-hardness of 9.5 and should be easily be able to scratch any kind of steel :D

[@donaldasayers]

I cannot help but feel that the metal inner in the rear of the stock was supposed to be one with the rest of the gun, even the zigzag pressed grooves line up. Why it was detached, or never joined I cannot tell.

[@elryanoo]

Ian is a highroller with that Bic stic pen.

[@calehane]

i wonder what the markings at 16:12 are... did anyone catch a better glimpse at them?

[@coreddit]

The stock design would make sense if they were planning to make it from Bakelite in the mass production version.

[@Zuggy]

I can see why Hitler would push for the development of this weapon. He was easily impressed with overly complex weapons over practical weapons.

[@americanmilitiaman88]

The back pin looks like the sks receiver cover pin

[@CitizenSmith50]

Wow! A prototype Gustloff rifle No. 13 to go with the prototype Gustloff pistol No. 13 !

[@henningklaveness7082]

I love how it's been extensively worked with a ball peen hammer. That may be an indication of why it never went anywhere.

[@Leetgrain]

Oh wow, that looks awesome.

[@rangercal1]

The locking lugs seem too thin for regular use. But with further development they could have made it work.

[@dwightehowell6062]

Interesting gun. I find the hollow wood to be...a strange choice to say the least.

[@dj1NM3]

Hogging out all the wood to fit over the metal appears like it would make the stock a lot less durable than it seems before disassembly. I suppose that on a post-war weapon, that it would be done with injection-moulded plastic and be fairly strong.

[@Modellbyggaren]

It's a dufflecut. Originally there would be a full length metal stock underneath. It's supposed to be stronger than a solid wooden stock, with hard paratrooper landings in mind.

[@dukeradwardthe5th843]

The mag makes the 203 so much cooler looking ^^

[@terrykyte1845]

amazing that anyone would design something so complex and fragile for military use

[@ThePandaSlasher]

I can see they got inspiration from the polish Maroszek rifle there.

[@beckhamhome]

I'm guessing that the wood furniture was made this way as a prototype and that plastic would replace it in production. Very interesting rifle but it looks more semi-auto shotgun with the twin transfer bars and dropping locking block than rifle.

[@andrewmandrona7891]

why did they even have the wood bits? it just seems to make things more expensive

[@amrozijohar3365]

hebat sekali hasil rancang bangun senapan otomatis tempo dulu, sangat menarik

[@PatrickMHoey]

I’ve been watching these videos for days and only now fallen into Ian’s WW2/Nazi Germany videos from years ago.

[@kutamsterdam]

Smart Ian, thanks! ...

[@tutes0133]

Well she is a beauty though. Pretty rifle, I love it's Industrial look compared to say a Gewehr 41

[@davepetrini1195]

Wow!!!!! Spectacular investment for the seller.

[@ScreamingSturmovik]

there may not be much new to say on it as i've read about it on your site but i would like to see and hear about the MG-30/Solothurn S2-200, seem to me like it would have been a geart mg but got taken over by the MG-34 and belt fed mgs

[@MrStarTraveler]

I bet the metal inner part of the stock was one piece once. I bet some one cut it like that at some point.

[@J.DeLaPoer]

I'm having a really hard time trying to understand the stock, and like Ian says I've never seen nor heard of another like it. Why not just leave it all metal (close enough in weight, stronger, quickly stamped out) or all wood like a conventional rifle with a few bits of metal hardware if it needs to detach? I'd almost say it was intended like a "veneer" for the aesthetic value, but in a purely functional military rifle of this era that makes no sense either, and I'd imagine that thin wood shell would split easily in combat. In the end, it's doubling the required materials plus adding time, complexity and expense to the production (all things you're trying to avoid in wartime) in order to end up with a stock that's objectively worse than just picking one material or the other. Anyone have a solid theory on this decision?

[@borjesvensson8661]

Why not all metal? Well when the two places you are fighting in are russia and the sahara some heat insulation is really nice. And wood supricingly good at that.

[@Gameprojordan]

Maybe a resource cutting method. Use as much steel as possible then insulate it with a thin piece of wood instead of relying completely on wood, or relying completely on steel which doesn't insulate well.

[@huntaerospacecorp]

If this used a cut-down MG13 magazine, could it use the regular 25-round magazine like the Mauser Selbstlader and the G.41? If it could, was there any real advantage in having those magazines interchangeable? I mean, sure, it would be nice to fire twenty-five rounds before having to reload, but would that be any real advantage if these weapons went into production? I suppose the one advantage would be not having to change the tooling - you would just be able to use slightly modified MG13 magazine stamps.

[@Zeratewl]

For some reason that gun looks like it should be in something like Star Wars or even Firefly

[@doctim111]

Action underside reminds me of a Rem 742

[@Magic_Moments_MTG]

Is it possible that metal stock was just cut like a duffel cut? Perhaps it was one piece and the wood just covered over it like the hand guard?

[@zaca3256]

You might say this rifle was... a flash in the pan.

[@chapiit08]

Had the designers thought of a pistol grip instead of that overcomplicated hollow stock, this would perhaps have been the first full powered assault rifle ever built

[@laci816]

No way it would be an assault rifle just because it has a pistol grip. Sure, it would look more like what many people today think of when someone says assault rifle, but a true assault rifle sports an intermediate cartridge (which 7,92x57 mm Mauser definitely isn't) and a select fire switch (safe/semi-auto/full auto).

[@laci816]

Not to mention the fact that the Mkb42 already existed it that time. Actually, the whole idea of an assault rifle predates to the '30s and some designs already existed, but were never produced in big enough quantities.

[@opticalecho119]

chapiit08 really it would still fall into the category of battle rifles

[@Gameprojordan]

No, It wouldn't be an assault rifle. This would be the equivalent to the AVS36 select fire battle rifle. An assault rifle would need to be chambered in an intermediate round, and 7.92x57 Mauser isn't intermediate in the slightest

[@bigmal1690]

i wonder why they even bothered with the thin wood covering, was it just for to look good, seams like a lot of wood work for sumthing that can easily be metal stamped?

[@NateNizz]

This is a pretty creepy rifle. The hole in the back of the receiver surrounded by mangled hammer marks, and the tab inside that's supposed to slot into it, but it doesn't... it's just, bleh... Also, it's serial number 13. I wouldn't pay a dime for this cursed object.

[@Tired_Sloth]

I wonder how much of the estimated price is due to that little eagle.. I want to think not any but one can't help but ponder. Cool to see something that isn't from one of the big firearms developers of Germany at the time!

[@aaronbuckmaster7063]

It has a short stock with a sling cutout for walking fire like our BAR. That’s the German version of our BAR.

[@gundree]

So, outside the trigger group, how reliable/accurate do you think this style of bolt group would be? Great stuff as always Ian.

[@ForgottenWeapons]

Seems to me like it would have been pretty good...

[@Jesses001]

I have read about these, and seen pictures, but this is the first time I ever have seen the inside. Well that is a really interesting stock. I wonder why they did that. I mean it could not had been to make the stock easier to make, ha. Otherwise the general design, lock up excluded, seems to be taking a page from most good semi-auto designs of the time. The lock however, first time I ever saw that, ha. That trigger group is...umm...very German, ha.

[@akku845]

Intresting, I live near the kz Buchenwald where the Gustloff Werke were.

[@nathaniellahti2449]

Can we get a forgotten weapons t-shirt that features Ian’s wonderful facial hair?

[@huntercompton9650]

Was the inner metal part of the stock originally welded to the receiver? it seems like it wouldn't be structurally sufficient to handle the recoil of 8x57 if the only thing holding the stock on was the two wood sides of the stock.

[@meatmissilef111]

It looks like the back of the receiver got damaged and somebody just welded the snot out of it to fix it.

[@ihavenoname3014]

It's amazing that came out of 1942 because it looks like a Kriegsmodell - like a 1945 made rifle. It's really crude and weird in certain aspects.

[@timothylevin2661]

Interesting locking mechanism

[@BrunoSchagasLeiter]

Forgotten Weapons Shooting with Gustloff 206 rifle.

[@Punisher9419]

To be fair the infighting and the influence of the party wasn't all bad.

[@BenignGamer]

Exactly, their infighting may well have saved the world a lot of trouble.

[@Surv1ve_Thrive]

+wood1155 divide and conquer!

[@longlongtran]

I dunno, hitlers comical tank gun was pretty bad

[@CitizenSmith50]

Also - someone else mentioned the stampings on the back edge of the bolt; looks like - Fed St I - or similar. Any ideas?

[@soldtobediers]

Agreed... It's action has more chaotic moves to date, than Ex-Lax... -gilpin 8-18-16

[@1959Edsel]

Could this rifle have originally been made without wood on the stock? The shape of the metal piece inside makes that seem possible. Maybe someone was worried about a soldier's cheek getting frozen to a metal stock in cold weather.

[@lubossoltes321]

Ian, do you see any issues with the rifle as it is and why it was not adopted ? I mean from construction point of view. Any weak parts ? The trigger group is a bit complicated as you mentioned, but the locking block looks like a decent idea to me ...