Public Charging NIGHTMARE with my MG ZS EV - both Ecotricity and Osprey let me down!

[@ModernHeroes]

Part 2 of this video is now live where I give Ecotricity a second chance and address some of your questions and comments! kzbin.info/www/bejne/f5PUhZ6IebuskMU

[@stevensanger]

Surely if the government wants us to be all-electric by 2030 they need to greatly improve the charging infrastructure

[@ModernHeroes]

Agreed - especially the provision at MSAs! Time has moved on since Ecotricity first rolled out and they seem to be standing still!

[@TheAlien1974]

The government couldn't organise a...........

[@jameschapman4824]

Why should the goverment improve the charging network? They never built petrol stations when people were changing from horses to ICE mobility! I think what you may have meant is the goverment should maybe give private companies tax breaks to help them develope the system the same as they did with the oil companies in the early years ( which they still do by the way.

[@stevensanger]

@@jameschapman4824 because the government want everyone to go electric I'm not saying it should be 100% them but they have a duty to make sure the network is kept in good working order

[@iainansell5930]

@@stevensanger they kinda have, they've given the petrol station a time limit to move over to EV and alternatives, by saying that new ICE cars will be banned from 2035... Shell has started investing, those fuel providers that don't, will fall by the wayside... they quite quickly adopted LPG when they thought they'd make money out of it.... Looking at the Fully Charged youtube channel, there are EV style service station starting to appear...

[@davidpearn5925]

If you don’t have reliability you don’t have a network at all.

[@dgurevich1]

Hey there! I know this is an older video, but you should know this was helpful to me recently. I had the same issue with a charger with my MG ZS. It was one of those ABB 50kw/h chargers, but the one I was using was brand new in a new location. I was testing it and after a failed charge attempt, the car started acting up. I followed your advice and unplugged the 12 volt battery, after a few minutes I connected it back and it started working. After speaking with the charging provider, they thanked me for raising this issue and fixed their charger. I'm not quite sure this is the video where you show it, but I did watch it and it did save me a tow.

[@markgilder9990]

Gridserve are planning to install 100 electric forecourts in the next 5 years. The one in Braintree Essex is superb. Things will get better. But I feel your pain.🤒

[@ModernHeroes]

Watching Gridserve very closely. Once restrictions ease I’m planning on visiting their Braintree site even though it’s so far from home I’ll need to charge on the way there! 😂

[@antwnpowell]

I will believe it when I see it, does it make financial sense? There might be a gap in the market, but is there a market in the gap?

[@elongatedmush7805]

Old Chinese proverb says: always have a plan B when you drive electric.... there's no mention of a plan C?.

[@johnmfjw]

I never have this problem with my ICE.

[@StuartDWright]

Some of tips for those new to EVs. 1 - expect Ecotricity chargers to not be working. Ignore them and plan your journey with other chargers. 2 - plan your journey by checking Zap Map to see whether your chosen chargers are reported faulty. Double check with the charger's network's dedicated app. 3 - Plan to arrive at your first rapid charger with 20% charge remaining so you have a buffer.

[@ModernHeroes]

What a terribly sorry state of affairs point 1 represents. I already knew this, of course, but wanted to see it for myself. Interestingly, ZapMap still shows the faulty Osprey charger as being in use, not being out of action. My report of it being out of use seems to have been overridden by data from the network.

[@StuartDWright]

Modern Heroes yeah it needs to get better soon. It will have to. And ecotricity need to lose their monopoly on motorway service station CCS chargers fast.

[@paulgoffin8054]

@@StuartDWright Thing is though, people have been saying "it needs to get better soon" for at least the three years since I first tried an EV. And it's not.

[@StuartDWright]

@@paulgoffin8054 it definitely is better. More rapid charges are being added along motorway routes on a regular basis. For example on the M40 there are several options at J4 to make up for the Ecotricity shambles at Beaconsfield services. Still there are not enough, though

[@paulgoffin8054]

@@StuartDWright Better but not remotely good enough and even more patchy. Still far too much of the country with barely any rapids - and those that exist are off the main roads and are single units "Plan B" could only be "get a flatbed" when there's only one rapid in an area. M-Way and other routes need Gridserv-like installations. Only bigger! (No way is that piddly 36 chargers in Braintree remotely good enough for the M5 on a bank holiday! Needs 200 or more!)

[@Richard-io9xe]

Ecotricity are putting multiple rapids into one site at Rugby, no doubt part subsidised by Tesla who have the rest of the site. But it is just not enough. Realistically they will never get to the point where they have multiple units at EVERY services. And it can't go on like this. Some of the motorway services companies renewed contracts with them - well if they are that short sighted then they deserve to lose business. Most of them are over priced hell holes anyway and we are now starting to see multiple instances of alternative Instavolt hubs next to the motorway, with Costa and fast food outlets on site. These will become the new services for EVs and the existing ones will die. And it will serve them right.

[@carlarrowsmith]

Ecotricity ..... don't bother for CCS. Ecotricity should give up and allow a provider that wants to install a good deal more, and more reliable units.

[@ModernHeroes]

Makes you wonder how the economics stack up for them. I’d assume they’d be paying some kind of ground rent to the MSA operators (unless it’s just revenue share?) and the equipment will have cost them yet if the chargers don’t work they aren’t earning!

[@carlarrowsmith]

@@ModernHeroes The funding came partly from the EU and Nissan. Maybe they still have some restrictions on the units due to that. These devices were never designed for CCS and it was retro fitted later and doesn't work that well even when working. I like that Ecotricity got in early but they're how hindering the effort of EV adoption.

[@leenewman5982]

Keep up the good work, I am scared to get an ev car just yet, I’ll stick to my diesel car for now, keep making brilliant vids

[@jarthurs]

I remember being in this position and doubting my car (Leaf), but I was just having a bad day. It took 6 hours to do a trip that would normally take 3 hours that day.

[@davetoday2]

I could've put up with that, 6hrs to do a 3hr trip, no way. I won't be getting a EV until there are more and better reliability ways of charging.

[@neddyl1225]

Only one charger at a motorway service station! Pathetic.

[@ModernHeroes]

Two if you have a Chademo car, I suppose. But yes, you’re right. Gloucester Services isn’t even that old.

[@johnathankain8033]

I go through swings of thinking "absolutely an EV next" to then getting knocked back to earth with stuff like this. Is tesla the only realistically usable brand?

[@ModernHeroes]

All depends on usage. Some EV drivers seem to recommend treating InstaVolt as the only rapid charging network and planning journeys accordingly due to their higher reliability - could work.

[@johnathankain8033]

@@ModernHeroes looking up, there network is expanding very rapidly too.

[@roygardiner4002]

Tesla - Yes. Impractical to buy any other brand yet. Supercharging is free for early Model S, low cost for Model 3 cars.

[@StuartDWright]

@@roygardiner4002 sweeping statement that isn’t true. I’ve had a Hyundai ionic since 2017. It has been incredibly practical because the vast majority of the time I don’t need to drive for more than 30 miles a day. It’s currently parked on the drive having not been charged up for two weeks. I agree that longer journeys require some planning and more time, but you can’t ignore the fact that people have different driving habits and for many people a car with a range of 100 miles is absolutely fine.

[@tinaturner9761]

Get the Zap-Map app and just see the choices - more Charing points than petrol stations - as some already stated, Ecoatrocity is the bad smell that put everyone off. 99% of my charging is done at home, while I sleep

[@terrylivermore9107]

Thanks for reporting your experience. The government needs to put penalties on all charging companies that do not live up to a reasonable reliability and standard. If they fail they should be forced to give up the franchise. I live near Gridserve Braintree, what a brilliant place that is, definitely worth a look at how it should be done. Unfortunaley for me I need them to build them 100 miles or so in all directions. I know they plan 100 further sites around the country. I am lucky I charge at home and in over 4,000 miles I have only needed to charge once when I did more than 130 miles in one day. That was on the A14 Newmarket South, unsurprisingly there was a problem with it, however it went on to give free vend so I shouldn’t complain.

[@esm7708]

Ecotricity is pretty near unusable. Thank god for BP Pulse and the mighty Instavolt. At the moment my next car will be a Tesla purely for the supercharger network.

[@pt6423]

One of the main problem of single charger sites is the electricity supply. Almost all the motorway service stations would love to install more chargers as its good for business. The problem is the supply cables to the sites are not heavy enough to cope with the demand. The supply cables come under the Network Distribution Operator, SSE for example. For them to lay new high capacity cables would cost millions. So in the short term certain places will not be upgraded due to Network Distribution upgrade costs. What we need is chargers to work as they should and not have all the software/hardware issues. Ecotricity in the UK and Izivia in the France have serious issues. In February 2020, Izivia France closed 189 out of 217 of their chargers on the autoroute network due to hardware issues. Apparently there were scorch marks on the exterior casings of two chargers. The result is they close 189 of them. A year on and they are still not fixed. The only chargers on the Calais/Paris autoroute A26 to A1 are Ionity. They work but are very expensive. I suspect its more down to economics as the chargers on the A26 and A1 autoroute were only used on average 2 or 3 times per week and so Izivia were struggling to make a profit. Hence why they have not jumped to prepare them. Like the UK, EV take up in France is moving fast and soon there is going to be problems at the service stations with EVs queuing to charge. Not everyone is going to have a plan C or D or F.......or patients. Good charging everyone.

[@ModernHeroes]

Are the supplies to service areas really that under-rated though or is it a convenient excuse? You’ll find twin 50kW InstaVolt rapids in locations that you wouldn’t expect to find huge supplies, I can’t believe a MSA has less power available to it than a KFC drive-thru. Granted, the upgrade costs could be lower in more developed areas. I don’t expect them to throw in 10 at a time, replacing the knackered old DBT units with ones that actually work in the same quantities would be a start.

[@johnkeepin7527]

It’s an honest comment about the unreliability of the systems overall. You’re almost certainly right about the capacity of the local District Network Operator (DNO). This is also likely to be an issue with large scale adoption of home charging. Where I live, the local DNO (which is SSE) is just replacing all their buried cable from the local transformer to our houses, and has recently replaced the local transformer with a brand new one - but not for increased capacity at all! It’s being done on account of a batch of cable faults in recent years, but they have not taken the option of upgrading in tandem, but they are following their normal standards of assuming the peak demand values so as to decide the size of the kit. E.g. their main fuse into my place is 100A, but we can’t all draw 100A at the same time, or the transformer would trip out and result in a local power cut. The rating of the local 11Kv/400V/230 transformer (the new one meets the new standards, not the old 415/240 one) is such that we can’t all jack up the load simultaneously. It might be that more work will be needed if we all start using it at the same time - say overnight charging, and maybe more demand for ‘night rate’ once gas boilers are abolished (another new policy), so we’ll see.

[@johnkeepin7527]

And a little bit more: Loads more can be found under this E&T publication: eandt.theiet.org/tags/electric-vehicle-charging The term I was searching for in my earlier one was “diversity”, used by DNO’s to work out the sizing of their supply kit. Some of the E&T bumf suggests that it should not be used for EV charge supplies, presumably that it’s likely that quite a few customers would want to charge their cars simultaneously, most likely at “Night Rate” by those on the “Economy 7” tariff.

[@robk1003]

Very useful video. I work as a Service Engineer and work nationally. My customers are as far apart as London, Swansea, Teesside and Grangemouth. My employer has announced that our next cars will be EVs. I just hope that the networks get more reliable before I get an EV.

[@ModernHeroes]

Guess it all depends on which model - if they give you a Tesla you’ll be just fine with their Supercharger network! 😂.

[@JL-us7wb]

I use the Shell app to fill up fuel. No bank cards on me and About 10 miles to empty. Shell app went down today, I tried three sites. My fault, but I get a little bit of the frustration you were experiencing!

[@ModernHeroes]

There’s the problem with reliance on apps in a nutshell! Why so many EV charging operators are going app-first is beyond me.

[@wobby1516]

I always head for instavolt whenever I’m travelling any distance.

[@nathanwolf5547]

I was using Ecotricity back in the early days when I had my Outlander and an Exotricity home account. It did give me 1000 miles of charging but even back then it was such a damnably unreliable network that I gave up on using it. If I was going into London I’d hit the save charge button and drive down from Lincolnshire on petrol then use EV in London. Ecotricity did cause a problem with the Mitsubishi and I had to have the system reset be the dealership. Like you, I have the MG ZS now. I have only used InstaVolt so far and, as I’m undecided about a house move, I’ve not installed a charger at home yet. InstaVolt in Boston has been reliable but slow. The fastest charge I’ve had was 38.8 for a short while. I think I do need the BMS update though. I picked the car up in December and have been under lockdown ever since. Being disabled, I cannot afford to use unreliable chargers. I guess I will stick to InstaVolt for now, despite it being expensive per KWH.

[@ModernHeroes]

I was seeing a solid 42-45kW out of a 50kW InstaVolt charger today. The ZS EV seems very sensitive in terms of charging speed - greatly affected by temperature and state of charge.

[@Whereswally606]

Strangely the chademo on ecotricity seem to be more resilient than the ccs. Though charging evs on long journeys is still a gamble.

[@ModernHeroes]

I wonder if that’s more about the Chademo protocol itself than the EcoT chargers actually being any good 🤔. Do hear of more problems on CCS across all networks.

[@keepawayfromthetrout]

​@@ModernHeroes I've been driving an EV for 5 years now as my only car and always plan my long journeys around using Ecotricity chargers as I've never ever been unable to charge using Ecotricity unlike other networks. In my experience there are much much worse networks than Ecotricity! How come though, plenty of people have a terrible experience with Ecotricity? Well I have a Nissan Leaf and not only are there more CHAdeMO connectors on the Ecotricity chargers - as you've said in your video, but it seems those connectors are a lot more reliable. Again as you've said in your video, I think now that CCS has become much more common, and the Ecotricity chargers were installed early on when CCS was quite rare, that the older Ecotricity chargers are having problems with the sudden increase and newer CCS vehicles. I think the resulting bad reputation on Ecotricity is quite unfair. And it's very easy for people to moan in their brand new cars that an older charger isn't up to the speed or new standard their car has. Given the number of alternative chargers there are now around the country - it's quite amazing compared to 5 years ago, it's really not that bad especially given the range you have in newer cards. Ecotricity will catch up - they are installing replacement chargers. But I think since they were one of the first to install chargers in the UK, they're also one of the first to have to change chargers to newer capabilities and I can't imagine how much that must cost them. This kind of thing is problem not only for early adopters but also early manufacturers/suppliers when standards are likely to change early on before they settle. Ecotricity have lost out by gambling early on that CHAdeMO was going to stay as the most common charging standard. I'll be getting a new EV soon so will be using CCS too so I expect my experience will suddenly change with Ecotricity. But is that their fault, or the fault of the standards changing quickly as EVs rapidly develop?

[@ModernHeroes]

@@keepawayfromthetrout I see what you’re saying but they’re the sole operator on MSAs - it is surely their duty therefore to keep up and be offering a suitable product? If for some reason every petrol station at a MSA was unable to dispense diesel to newer HGVs, they’d be fixed instantly.

[@zymurgic]

@@ModernHeroes The DBT chargers used on the Ecotricity Electric Highway network are of an overall design that pre-dates CCS. (That's why most of their locations have a unit that doesn't have a CCS connector - they were early to market). The CCS versions was an afterthought in the overall design, and was implemented at an early point in the CCS standardisation process. At the time, the CCS-equipped DBT units had problems with certain vehicle manufacturer's implementation of the CCS protocol (VW e-Golf was a known problem). They've apparently all had firmware updates to fix known CCS protocol issues. The problem for Ecotricity is that they've got many hundreds of installed assets on their network, that would cost tens of thousands of pounds to replace each of them. If they're serviceable and perform as intended when installed, they are in no rush to replace them. Sweat the assets, but for any new installs, they've not been fitting DBT for several years now, and a few have been replaced by EFACEC or Tritium units. If you do have any problem with any charging unit on any network, try to call the helpline to report the fault. They might not have it logged (or might need more information to resolve); without that information, how can you expect them to improve?

[@zymurgic]

@@ModernHeroes They're not the sole operator on MSAs. Many of them (mostly Welcome Break) now have Tesla Superchargers as well, and some have Instavolt or other networks as well. An issue is that lots of MSAs didn't have massive grid connections to start with and are in remote areas, and can only handle a handful of charge points. Tesla fund the installation of their supercharger network, including grid reinforcement, from the sale of their expensive cars.

[@nigelpage612]

You need to check Zap Map before going to a charger to check if any faults reported. Try to keep to Instavolt, Podpoint and Geniepoint. Generally they work. Beware Ecotricity, Charge Your Car and BP Pulse ( the new name for Polar which can also be unreliable).

[@ModernHeroes]

Both chargers were listed as working and reported as working recently. Interestingly, the Osprey one now seems to permanently show “Charging” on CCS which isn’t exactly ideal - that to me says it’s working but someone is using it! I’ve submitted reports for both, though.

[@richardoakley8800]

in 30 years of driving ive never had a petrol pump say NOOO.

[@anthonysinclair4636]

I have!

[@nickieredshaw7835]

Thanks for your great video. Take care and stay safe and safe travels if you need to travel everyone! Touch wood only had 1-2 problems that was easily fixed by rebooting unit in uk . But had 3/4 charges fail initially or needed helpline assistance on charge place Scotland over 6 months of charging before lockdown and 8500 miles. Yer charging infrastructure need to get better! More instantvolts and get rid of eh sites and put instantvolt in then motorway journeys would be so much easier and less stressful .

[@chriswills3603]

This would really stress me out. I have noticed that people are using the charging bays in supermarkets as a standard parking bay!

[@ModernHeroes]

Yeah it’s all too common unfortunately - supermarkets need to stop putting them in prime parts of the car park... this guy probably won’t do it again though m.kzbin.info/www/bejne/jmK2Zn2FaLyIpNk 😂

[@jameschapman4824]

Could I suggest that next time it happens you try the AC charger. It may be slow but at least you would have had a buffer on your avaliable range.

[@ModernHeroes]

Yep, not a bad suggestion at all. If I hadn’t been so cock-sure about Osprey being reliable I would’ve definitely considered that!

[@tweetchris46]

Because range anxiety isn't bad enough already

[@eurodat692]

Like others, I keep thinking I'll go electric but my mind is always changed by the failed charger stories.

[@ModernHeroes]

Depends wholly on your usage pattern and what charging infrastructure is available to you. You need to consider how useless networks like Ecotricity are but it doesn’t need to put you off entirely! I agree that it’s a poor show, though.

[@wangyu7]

My Zs Ev did exactly the same thing with ecotricity charge point at Hopwood services on m42, tried a few times, has put me off trying anymore; although i was surprised that there was 12 tesla charge points there, and only 2 ecotricity ones; I tried both, with no success

[@tonychallinor6721]

Mirrors my experience particularly Ecotricity that seems to be available and able to connect about 30% of time. Next time video you calling the Ecotricity helpline and whether they respond and can help? Very useful video tho - thanks

[@ModernHeroes]

Great suggestion and I really should’ve done this. Assumed my Plan B was solid enough that I didn’t need to! 🤦‍♂️

[@Testdriver2804]

those charger at 7:54, we have this in zagreb in croatia, aslo two public, those are worst chargers ever, always broken, so after a while a repair man came and fix them, they simply did some kind of upgrade as those type of chargers have some kind of mistake , also work wasn't done by their service, it was done by EV enthusiast who simply know this stuff better that charger at 10:11 we have one of those in croatia, on some cars there was an issue with AC, depend, on my car which is chinese EV JAC work normal, but some cars don't read (my friend have bmw i3 and can't charge there)

[@ModernHeroes]

Thanks - interesting stuff! I’ve used the second charger both with my ZS EV and BMW i3 successfully in the past so I suspect it just needs some maintenance.

[@Testdriver2804]

@@ModernHeroes we often make a call to service hotline but nobody answer, so just people from EV forum make a service and not it work, usually we have ABB public chargers which are much better and reliable

[@gregorygeorge1432]

Ecotricity chargers are the worst! I do my best to avoid them. My choices are BP Polar, Geniepoint, Osprey and ESB for my BMW i3. I'm picking up my MG ZS EV next week, so I'm hoping the charging experience works equally well using the good chargers listed: BP Polar, Geniepoint, Osprey, and ESB.

[@ModernHeroes]

Give GeniePoint a miss with the ZS EV - painfully slow (circa 20kW) and they know about it but are doing nothing.

[@gregorygeorge1432]

@@ModernHeroes Thanks for the tip! Much appreciated.

[@adamelliebuilds5619]

We did 330miles in an ZS ev the other day (surveys construction), charge failed on two machines (ecotricity), another fail on polar (bp pulse) but great customer service line and sorted a free charge.. then finally instavolt wasn't even turned on! Customer service was American and useless, awful Internet based line. Luckily used two tesco (pod point) to keep us out of 0miles between chargers.. hopefully they'll get better soon! 🙏 but luckily there was a great and easy to use instavolt near home! (That was turned on!) 😅

[@ModernHeroes]

Thanks for sharing - what time of day did you try to contact Instavolt? I heard that they divert calls to the US (ChargePoint) in the evening but I have no experience with that. Were the Ecotricity failures similar to what I’ve shown here?

[@EVMan298]

Never had a problem with EH chargers on CCS. Had some bad experiences Instafault bricking my car a few times though. Actually had to lock my car for 10 mins and try again. Didn’t work, so went to EH and by the time I arrived, it worked .

[@ModernHeroes]

What car? Seems to be the exact opposite of everyone else’s experience with CCS charging!

[@johng5474]

Just stay away from Ecotricity, there's lots of alternatives just off the m/ways.

[@ModernHeroes]

Not good enough though is it - shouldn’t need to divert from the motorway and add even more journey time just to be able to charge. Put into ICE context - choosing to do so because the fuel is cheaper at a supermarket versus having to do so because the service station pumps don’t work. They’d be fixed very quickly.

[@lozzamanuk]

Tesla Model 3 and unbelievably never had a failed charge on a "working" ecotricity unit. I have had them trip out after 10 minutes though. It's a poor network. Instavolt and Tesla Supercharger are both superb.

[@dereknicol5284]

Good news for your 200th comment, Ecotricity are partnering with Gridserve to replace all Ecotricity chargers with modern units over the next few months (see Fully Charged video).

[@ModernHeroes]

Saw this - video coming soon with my thoughts! 🤩

[@settertwo]

Never any problems filling my petrol Range Rover

[@ModernHeroes]

@@settertwo it’s a different kind of range anxiety with a Range Rover to be fair.

[@steverichmond7142]

I bought an MG ZS EV in July 2020 and had a minor accident in September 2020. It is now February 2021 and my car will not be repaired for a further 2 months. DO NOT TOUCH MG WITH A BARGE POLE.

[@computerbob06]

It's this nightmare that's stopping mass EV adoption in the UK! It was an interesting camera angle, at the end. All those cheap 10 Yr old cars, driving past with upto 600+ miles worth of range sloshing around inside them! My mates 'new' car has 5 seats (not an i3/e-up etc), is nice looking (not a leaf), split fold rear seats(not an older Zoe), has a 400 mile range (but isn't a Tesla) and cost only £800 - so isn't any other EV out there either! Yes, he bought a Golf!

[@esm7708]

You may notice that with ecotricity they put a prepayment on your card and take a few days to refund the difference. So for every failed charge they charge your card £20 or so.

[@ModernHeroes]

It’s £12, and retrying the same unit didn’t repeat the charge. Fairly standard across the industry - not ideal though. IONITY preauthorise something daft like £60! 😳

[@esm7708]

@@ModernHeroes £60! The precharge thing is unnecessary. I don't think I've ever run up a bill more than a tenner. Usually it's a five pound splash and dash.

[@ModernHeroes]

@@esm7708 well they do charge 69p/kWh! But yes, I agree.

[@esm7708]

@@ModernHeroes 69p! Thank goodness I have a home charger at 5p/kWh and sufficient range. I understand there is bugger all money in fast charge networks but that is why the Tesla business model makes so much sense.

[@jamiedykes6382]

Need to start towing a diesel gen set with you :D

[@ModernHeroes]

😂

[@davidpearn5925]

@@ModernHeroes it’s called redundancy. Apparently there is none.

[@ModernHeroes]

@@davidpearn5925 this is what InstaVolt are doing well - they tend to install pairs of chargers at a minimum.

[@esm7708]

@@ModernHeroes and they always work.

[@keithware5314]

When you was at the Osprey charger did you try the 22kWh type 2 plug as that looked available on the app? It would have been quicker than the 7kWh charger at Tesco. And thanks for the videos.

[@ModernHeroes]

The 22kW Type 2 is a bit of a misnomer - only certain cars can accept a charge at that speed on AC. The MG ZS EV only has a 6.6kW onboard charger, so that’s the maximum it can achieve on AC.

[@keithware5314]

@@ModernHeroes Thanks for the reply I forgot about their charging limitations.

[@TheAlien1974]

I am toying with the idea of going electric next car but this sort of review doesn't fill me with confidence hmmm

[@Yermommy59]

This is when Nio’s battery swap starts to look the safer choice

[@ModernHeroes]

If we can’t get chargers that work where we need them due to the required infrastructure and it’s cost, battery swaps might be rather ambitious too!

[@zenbudhism]

Why not use the other charger next to it?

[@ModernHeroes]

The second Ecotricity unit didn’t have CCS.

[@richardsedorski1206]

That’s brill thanks for reply.

[@grahamhorne596]

Did you try the AC on the osprey charger?

[@ModernHeroes]

I didn’t because paying 36p/kWh when I could charge at 7kW (6.6kW) at Tesco for free didn’t appeal. Give them their due, Osprey’s helpline people offered to start an AC charge for free after they couldn’t get CCS working for me.

[@grahamhorne596]

Like you say, it would be handy if there was more than one charger at each location

[@johndoyle4723]

Ecotricity are a disgrace and are holding back EV adoption, they need to go but I suspect they have a contract and will keep their stranglehold. I now avoid Ecotricity as much as possible, I expect a failure and only use them if I have plenty of reserve charge. Instavolt is my go to choice. Thanks for the video.

[@Aviationjay76]

Who’s got time to charge there car like this? Petrol king

[@kieronsmith3914]

I've been driving electric cars for 9 years on Chademo and CCS and rapid charging on ecotricity. It's only let me down twice in all that time. Maybe I'm lucky! Ecotricity are a fantastic company with a vision. Without them in the UK, EV adoption would have been slower here. We are in exciting times. In a couple of years the network will be much better. Instavolt, Shell and others are now in the game and we shall soon see huge capacity charging stations. Ecotricity are also moving to 250kw rapid charge stations. Goodbye diesel, you won't be missed.

[@nixer65]

I disagree - Ecotricity have been severely hampering EV adoption for the last 3-4 years. They have tied up access to the motorway services in a non-disclosed contract. The current generation chargers have been terrible for a long time - I get a failure about 1 in 3 times with them and always have to have at least one backup plan. I’m desperate for the contract to end so we can see Instavolt, BP and Shell get access to these prime sites and see charging infrastructure like Tesla superchargers. A terrible, terrible company.

[@kieronsmith3914]

@@nixer65 each to their own

[@computerbob06]

Where we mostly go on holiday, North Wales, most of the rapids are Ecotricity or time limited Morrisons chargers, so I would have to buy an EV with a big battery - that I can't afford! I don't know why other EV makers can't set up EV charging stations just off the road network (as Tesla have)? I'm wondering where the money for Gridserve came from? I hear they're building another 30 stations over the next few years? Maybe they're funded by the legacy auto makers?

[@ModernHeroes]

Don’t Morrison’s have a bunch of GeniePoint rapids? Are these ones you’re on about time limited 7kW chargers instead? 😳

[@terencereeder9830]

There are plenty of chargers now that are contactless payment simple.All people need to do is boycott the ecotricity network they soon improve it.

[@bernardhilton3527]

Electric Highway are that bad I don’t bother with them any more. Whilst on holiday in the north east last year I found two Osprey chargers at a M and S food store on a new commercial estate. It wasn’t Osprey then. The chargers looked brand new but neither of the two units worked. A Jaguar owner had tried before me and given up. Anyway I am a stubborn so and so and I rang them up. I got a reasonably quick response and managed to get both the units working and charged at 50kW. Later in the week I went for another charge and had no problems. Apart from this one occasion I haven’t had problems with Osprey. I agree that Instavolt are fantastic. When on another break in the Lake District I used Instavolt all the time. Every Booths supermarket in Cumbria has Instavolt chargers. Some have four units, charging heaven.

[@peterball8241]

Chademo was first because it was the Japanese standard, I have 2 Mitsubishis with it. Ecotriity was early on the scene so installed a lot of Chademo chargers. Unfortunately Europe started a new standard CCS so we now have multiple plugs and Ecotricity have been slow to upgrade. We could do with a standard connector and unified charging network but probably too late to change now.

[@ModernHeroes]

CCS very much the standard now though - even Nissan have said they’ll be using it on the Ariya.

[@peterball8241]

@@ModernHeroes I know, if only that had happened 10 years ago. Both standards are still on sale today and will be on the roads for the foreseeable future.

[@scotiajinker8392]

This is one of the reasons I’ll stick to diesel. Imagine having this trouble in the summer with lots of people dicking around trying to get fuel.

[@Gdank72]

Three rules of owning an EV. 1. Always use Instavolt if you can. 2. Avoid Ecotricity at all cost. 3. Use Ionity if desperate unless you own a Merc or other car with an account. I've travelled 500+ miles trips and had zero problems using the above 3 rules. Problem is we are used to using motorway services.... But lots of good EV chargers just off the motorway, almost as close as a service station.

[@scotiajinker8392]

@@Gdank72 if everyone was foolish enough to buy ev imagine the Q’s for hours of people trying to get fuel in the summer. Way too slow to refuel & not enough fuelling stations. I want to get from A to B in the shortest time . In my opinion EV’s are the emperor’s new clothes, hydrogen is the way forward, refuel as quickly as petrol & just as economic.

[@richardsedorski1206]

Enjoyed vid very much but could you not just tell us what the charge cost.👍👍👍

[@ModernHeroes]

The first two cost nothing because they failed 😂 but the final charge at InstaVolt was £12.19 for just under 35kWh (35p/kWh). I have another video specifically reviewing InstaVolt if you’re interested - m.kzbin.info/www/bejne/mJW3k6Wup7Vjo8k . Thanks for watching!

[@richardsedorski1206]

Thanks.

[@jimporter7418]

I've got an MG 5 for less than a week and have had the same problem already! 🥴

[@ModernHeroes]

Which chargers did you have issues with, Jim? Thanks.

[@jimporter7418]

@@ModernHeroes BP Pulse at Lifton Devon. Chargers are so few and far apart here, when you get caught out it gets difficult.

[@1966human]

That's the problem with banks and cards ( cashless ) and atms

[@ModernHeroes]

Neither issue was payment related 🤷‍♂️

[@lesjohn2]

It's more likely to be the software in the MG that's at fault and not the pumps. Think about it. 2 pumps giving problems? Not likely.

[@ModernHeroes]

Osprey confirmed that their unit was faulty (and I’ve used the very same one before successfully!)

[@BRI535D]

For your future sanity do what I do and ONLY use Instavolt and plan your trips accordingly.EV owner for 5 years.

[@ModernHeroes]

Hearing this a lot recently, doesn’t sound like bad advice!

[@computerbob06]

But not great advice! Only limits your travel to certain parts of the Country!

[@dg115]

I second that instavolt are excellent. The rest are pot luck with one stupid app after another.

[@ModernHeroes]

@@dg115 Osprey are normally good too though. It seems this particular charger I used has an issue but it’s not the norm for them. Single charger sites do seem quite common on their network though which is definitely a negative point.

[@BRI535D]

@@computerbob06 Not if you have a decent range EV to start with.

[@jeremyaustin9103]

You are just reminding me of why I sold my useless PHEV Mitsubishi and drive a lovely mercedes estate. Until EVs crack 500miles routinely driven the same way as ice the majority of drivers will not choose EVs. The UKs lack lustre infrastructures just cement's my view. Enjoy your MG

[@nixer65]

It depends on your needs...I totally understand if you have a job that requires pounding of the motorways that there is no EV that really meets your needs. Most of us only travel a few tens of miles in a day and hence don’t normally need that kind of range. When I do take a long trip I normally want to stop after around 3-4 hours which matches well to the 230-250 mile range of my EV. My last two ICE cars got nowhere near 500 miles on a tank of fuel - more like 300-350 and I suspect that was an acknowledgment of that fact. Most people could use an EV now...the problem is not range. It’s the god-awful charging network - with Ecotricity being the chief culprit.

[@jeremyaustin9103]

@@nixer65 I live in the country. I always work from home. The current crop of EVs are a major compromise compared to all ice. I've just sold a sixteen year old mercedes. All original. Still did 55 mpg on a run. Comfy just a lovely motorized armchair. 2.7 litre engine. Why on earth would I pay more for less? Range is a key choice for consumers. Batteries that after a few years don't have the same capacity when manufactured. In ten years who knows. Today...no thanks

[@nixer65]

@@jeremyaustin9103 Yep - I get it. I also live in a small village in the middle of nowhere. I also always work from home. I have had no issues with range given that I'm over ten miles from the nearest town. I have a BMW i3 BEV that's three years old that I've had from new - total battery degradation since new = 0% so far. Range is 100 miles in the worst conditions and around 135 miles in the best - this works for 99+% of my journeys. Cost to run is tiny (no RFL, cost per mile is 2-4p in electricity depending on whether it's Economy 7, servicing is once every two years and is cheap as there's no oil to change etc etc). Battery technology in BEVs is not the same as your phone - they will last longer than the car and the degradation at 100k miles is expected to be around 10% or less (you will lose more bhp than that in an ICE vehicle at the same age). The i3 has depreciated to the point where it is not very affordable if you're more sensible than me and buy second hand (I like new cars and am prepared to put up with owning most of the depreciation). My point wasn't that EVs are perfect yet, more that for almost all of my journeys they are brilliant (I don't pound the motorway). I have just taken delivery of a Polestar 2 - but we're not getting rid of the i3 as it's just too good a car - so it will stay in the family (daughter).

[@jeremyaustin9103]

@@nixer65 Nissan leafs after ten years have lost at least a third of the range. Tesla the same. My mitsi after 28 months the same. My recently sold 16 year old merc diesel had all of its horses intact. As does the SL awaiting the summit...as does my C class waggon. I really understand battery technology so happy to discuss. An estate car was 250hp. RWD. A boot of around 500 litres. A 200kwh battery with a warranty. Why not. Today's crop are all just about good enough for a second car. Your BMW was one of the few EVs that has a modular battery so one dead cell can be replaced. Petrol and diesel are cheap and understood. Maintenance in all of my Mercs is affordable...and the depreciation is far lower than the vehicles you mention. Horses for course's. Still far too new for mass market. Utterly useless for a road trip with the family too.

[@martingrady7654]

Apps always require passwords, nobody likes having to use a password, GRRRRR!

[@niceboy60]

I m not a Conspiracy guy however Ecotricity is so bad it almost seem deliberate 😳 I mean what if BP or Shell Created Charging facilities which their main Point was to Deter People from going EV ??

[@index6738]

Reason to stick with ICE or hybrid. Power point cars seeking life support doubtful.

[@paulf3353]

Yeah, not having tesla sucks in UK... not sure how they're going to solve it in 8years...

[@niceboy60]

you spent a considerable amount of time filling , Name , Address , Date of Birth , Inside leg measurement , Bank Details , on this Ridiculous and intrusive app ( Ecotricity ) Than you Plug in and you get an Error ???

[@paulgreen7906]

Some practical tips for EV charging on a long journey...leave the EV at home and drive a diesel. . Fill up in 5 mins and range 800 miles. Simples

[@ModernHeroes]

No thanks, I’d rather shit in my hands and clap than spend 800 miles listening to a horrible diesel engine chuntering away

[@markbradley5365]

After watching the video it looks like the car was still turned on when you tried to charge it. This could be the reason it wouldn't charge. It could however be how the video is edited. I have been a Leaf driver for over 4 years and rarely have a problem charging an any rapid charger. Something to double check next time you rapid charge 👍

[@ModernHeroes]

Thanks Mark - can confirm it wasn’t, though, and it is just the editing. Seems CCS charging is a bit more prone to issues, sadly.

[@Tom55data]

Uk is a special shit show for electric car charging, and range anxiety is incorrect term, it is charging shit show. Please note to all ICE drivers, my car is charged "fully" (EV's you usually charge to 80-90%) EVERY morning, I have a full tank of fuel every morning which can take me 300 miles in my T-M3 LR. I don't think about having to stop. Second, I charge at home where my electric is 5p/unit making it 1p/mile to drive my car. I probably need a long journey 1/2 year - so I bought a Tesla as they have sorted charging; and it is VERY important to note that CCS charging has standard protocol already defined since 2015 for personal identification of your car - how Tesla auto-charges and pays for your car. Just think, every charger supports auto payment by personal identification - plug and charge. The problem has been the terrible fiddling of the companies with their apps and codes, and the government not stamping down telling where they can get off.

[@whocares264]

yes range is everything .....avoid public charging UK.....or buy a Tesla....

[@rastarabbit1470]

This has just reaffirmed my belief that diesel is still superior and will be for many years to come

[@jimmacgregor4122]

I hate to ask the obvious question - Why didn't you buy a self-charging hybrid? - I can't believe that static charging, with all these problems you were faced with, makes sense. Two of my friends run self-charging hybrids - hassle-free, and very economical.

[@ModernHeroes]

Self charging hybrids are a fallacy. A triumph of marketing, sure, but no discernible benefit over their solely petrol/diesel brethren. A potential tiny increase in fuel economy (debatable in real world conditions) versus having to haul a (however small) battery and motor around.

[@jimmacgregor4122]

@@ModernHeroes Hm - my 2 friends run Toyotas - a Prius and an Auris - both claim to average 58/59 mpg in mixed driving. The drawback - as I can verify - is acceleration best described as "leisurely" - but your criticism of "a tiny increase in fuel economy" is false - it is significant, as any independent road test will verify. I would point out that self-charging hybrids are significantly cheaper than EV's or Plug-ins - and sales of self-charging cars far exceed sales of EV's and Plug-ins. Sorry we don't agree - I'm wrong about lots of things! - and I hope you don't have any more charging problems - ATB.

[@devonbikefilms]

@@jimmacgregor4122 But they are still producing the pollutants that are the problem. Yes the network is poor, but getting better, but give it another 3 to 5 years there will be dramatic improvements. Bear in mind that in 5 to 7 years, who will want a vehicle with a piston engine in it? My next car is an EV, and currently it will be the Tesla “small” car due out next year. I’m not a Tesla fanboy, it’s just none of the others make a good case for themselves. The supercharger network is a valuable and expanding asset for Tesla owners. No doubt it will be made available to others in due course.

[@jimmacgregor4122]

@@devonbikefilms You're right - a self-charging hybrid will be producing pollutants when running on its' petrol engine - but that's going to be mainly on the open road when petrol engines are at their most efficient, and least polluting - in the town, they are running on the electric motor just the same as an EV. From what I've read, those manufacturers with most experience of producing self-charging hybrids (ie Toyota) have them set up that way - they are the only ones I've experienced - some of the more recent models from companies like Hyundai are not set up that way and go on to the petrol engine too readily - but they'll learn pretty quickly. At the end of the day, people will buy what appeals to them - at the moment that's self-chargers, not plug-ins or EVs - but you're right, that may well change. I hope you're right about simple petrol engined cars going out of fashion - I'll be able to replace my 55 plate (rust-free!) Fiesta cheaply - or maybe I'll just walk more... Good luck with the Tesla - they're not cheap!

[@markthomasson5077]

I get 65mpg from a diesel, so they are a con

[@JohnDoe-ox5ni]

I drive a 20 yr old diesel cars on free vegetable oil when they eventually break down beyond uneconomic repair I scrap and buy another diesel .I usually get 3 to 5 yrs Of skinflint services of nothing apart from checking oil levels and water .then drive them to death unless I can get the engine oil for next to nothing for a yearly change also I take the paper oil strainer out of the filters and stuff them with wire wool and put a magnet off a old speaker on the bottom of the sump to catch fragmented metals .i would never buy a EV for obvious reasons.

[@Lewis_Standing]

Very old deisels are the ones with the most particulate emissions that cause asthma and early cardiovascular deaths.

[@CitybeatPaul]

You wont find any in NI ! And in fact you will have difficulty finding any chargers in NI !!

[@johnhannam4327]

why put up with this crap

[@belgarionbob]

If you cant home charge then forget about an EV.

[@ModernHeroes]

Not sure I necessarily agree - plenty of people who can’t charge at home have access to destination charging at work or near enough to their homes (kerbside, public car parks etc) that they may well not need to use rapid charging much more often than someone who does have home charging.

[@petercushing8272]

this is why i won`t buy a ev..............the cars are ok its the bloody charging points, looks like a ice car again

[@davetoday2]

Sorry but this is what puts a lot of people off getting a EV

[@ModernHeroes]

Agreed, the rapidly progressing upgrades of Electric Highway now that they’ve been sold to GRIDSERVE should go a long way to reduce these issues on the motorways though.

[@Aviationjay76]

Electric cars = AA RAC AND GREEN FLAG

[@ModernHeroes]

😂 yeah you can’t move for them cluttering the road can you? 🙄

[@davehedgehog4391]

NOT SUCH A HERO NOW M8 R U? LOL JUST BUY A GOLF M8 NOT BRITISH

[@ModernHeroes]

😂😂😂😂😂😂

[@wimschoenmakers5463]

You wanted a EV to save the planet, so you have to deal with it. Meanwhile, I'll use my petrol hybrid until the charging mess is solved.

[@ModernHeroes]

Don’t remember at any point wanting an EV specifically to save the planet but you know what they say about assumption.

[@wimschoenmakers5463]

@@ModernHeroes If you don't want to save the planet, a EV these days is not a really smart choise I think. The early adapters always pay the price! 😁

[@ModernHeroes]

@@wimschoenmakers5463 early adopters? People that bought a Leaf in 2011 were early adopters.

[@maximporkey3856]

# I hate electric cars!

[@ModernHeroes]

Seems strange to be watching videos about them if you do, but whatever

[@maximporkey3856]

@@ModernHeroes There is no charging network round my ways otherwise Would of had a Tesla model s.

[@Brian-om2hh]

@@maximporkey3856 Does your house have no electricity? I rarely charge my car anywhere else but at home..... Fully charged, my Kia has in excess of 250 miles range. It's 4 or more years since I drove more than 200 miles in a single trip. A full charge does me for the best part of 2 weeks... The average UK commute is around 20 miles per day.

[@maximporkey3856]

@@Brian-om2hh I have a V8 LPG Audi which is Great . It will be a sad day indeed when everyone runs electric cars and the sound of the glorious piston engine is gone.

[@ModernHeroes]

All of those 4 cylinder diesel engines will be sadly missed 😭