Quarter Sawn or Flat Sawn Lumber? Red or White Oak? What's The Difference?

[@TheTinkerer]

Excellent and very informative. I cut a few giant red oaks on my property that I want to mill and kiln myself to make my staircase. Great video, helps me understand why I may want to do the extra work rather than flat sawn. Thank you.

[@johnford7847]

Thanks, Kevin. It is very useful information, especially showing the flat-sawn and quartered boards and how the slices of flat-sawn wood, on edge, becomes quartered. Now I understand your laminated necks better.

[@douglasaxtell]

I started building guitars a year ago. Have been doing woodworking for a while now always a hobby. I build my guitars and furniture from wood from my farm or trees people ask me to remove. I have a Norwood mill and have modified it to resaw. I also make Timbers and dry my wood as big Timbers for about ten years before sawing. You have some excellent material on KZbin. Btw I’m in Ossian NY.

[@boulderdesigner]

Kevin, thank you for a most informative video! I enjoy and appreciate your thoughtful content!

[@JoshWard-g5i]

What a great shop.....I'm seriously humbled.

[@thepragmaticluthier]

Thank you for your comment, but you needn't feel humbled. I'm fortunate to have the shop that I do, but it's just a collection of things under a roof. Many have very nice shops and many more are more capable than I am.

[@DergEnterprises]

I like the long explanations. Very helpful. Thanks.

[@tedrowland7800]

Very nice video. It is just a re-visit for me. As an apprentice carpenter/cabinet maker, I had to learn this in the 1st year and be tested on it. Also wood identification, (I still have trouble by sight telling birch from maple, lol), and humidity ranges.

[@markpell8979]

Good discussion, Kevin. For folks interested in woodworking or what to look for in wooden products and trying to get a grip on these concepts, reading the structure and overall grain orientation of a board helps us understand how it will behave following milling, machining or carving, joining to other boards, and then how it will possibly move and react in the future as it's exposed to its environment and expected structural/service loads and forces- as with furniture, guitars, house frames vs. trim, etc. combined with some consideration for visual beauty and other aesthetics. Reading the grain just helps us decide the best way to utilize a particular piece of wood to take advantage of its best properties and characteristics as both a building material and also a means of expression as a woodworker. Sculptors and masons working in stone think largely the same way.

[@MrDaveKC]

That's a great overview, thanks for sharing this information.

[@martinlaroche-rx3su]

Great informative video! Since red oak have opened pores in the springwood, how does it affect its stiffness and crossgrain strenght, especially if there are many rings per inch? Would it be good for backs? Thanks

[@thepragmaticluthier]

I can say from experience that Oak, Red or White, make an excellent back and rim. You needn't concern yourself with porosity unless grain filling before finishing is a concern. When considering the crossgrain strength of materials as thin as made for instrument purposes, porosity and actual strength are practically irrelevant. What is to be considered in back materials is density because it relates to the amount and character of the backs vibration. Allow density back such as Butternut, may flex more in sympathy with the top, producing a slight increase or character in low frequency, while a very stiff back will be more reflective, producing a more percussive response, possibly with slightly reduced low frequency response.

[@walterrider9600]

thank you

[@johnsee7269]

Can one hear a difference between an Adirondack Spruce guitar top that's quarter sawn and the same that's flat sawn? I know the raised panels on my 'flat sawn' (oak of some kind...) kitchen cabinets allow for shrinkage and expansion within the 'frame' of each door that has a raised (beveled) center panel... I'd guess that a flat sawn log would have a 'quarter sawn' center section even though it's not quarter sawn... (just threw that in for the Hell if it; thanks for what you do to help us understand this stuff)

[@thepragmaticluthier]

You pose and interesting question. I doubt that you would hear any difference , but you'll never find a flat sawn Adirondack, Sitka, Cedar or any other instrument top because the tangential shrinkage and swelling would be too great and the orientation of the grain would render one side of the top too weak because the bridge would be pulling the grain layers apart. To my knowledge, no one flat saws coniferous instrument tops. Tops are usually split on a radius from the center of short billets. Sawn tops do exist, but are far less common, but will always be quarter sawn. Lastly, on the humorous side, I think if someone flat sawed any coniferous instrument tops, come judgement day, they'd be sent straight to hell for doing it; kind of like a blacksmith hammering cold iron.

[@terencehorrocks421]

​@@thepragmaticluthier 0:40

[@tedrowland7800]

@@thepragmaticluthier That is too funny.. Wouldn't it also crack in 2?

[@malcolmboynton7652]

another great video. stupid? question. obviously i want my guitar top and back quarted. on the braces do i want the grain running north/south for greater stiffness or east/west for more vibration? i've only built about 6 and with dumb luck they work/sound good. going to start another soon using new hampshire lumber per your suggestion. thoughts?

[@thepragmaticluthier]

You want the end grain of your braces to run north and south. Good description. As for backs and rims, you don't necessarily need quarter sawn material. You would be surprised at how much of it isn't, but for tops, it's a must.

[@malcolmboynton7652]

@@thepragmaticluthier thanks

[@jonheath7502]

Thank you for making a distinction between rift sawn and quarter sawn.