Racing games need more diversity (in gameplay) and other rambles about storytelling with cars

[@ketrub]

if only EA weren't cowards they should've done a the run 2 (similar to shift 2 where they kinda move it into its own side franchise) focused more on crazy setpieces and weirder race types

[@SummonerArthur]

We would end up getting nitro 2

[@Johnny-ux7yi]

Or even a follow up to Need For Speed Unbound by making the WHOLE game cel shaded (a La Jet Set Radio) and borrow a few elements from the underrated Tokyo Xtreme Racer series (the Drift series too) by having Touge, Highway battle (kinda like Undercover but instead functioning like the ones from Tokyo Xtreme Racer) and even Canyon drift duels. Abandon the Day and Night cycle of Heat (it feels like it was there as an afterthought) as well as The Grand as it suffers from grinding. Instead focus on racing against street racing crews (akin to NFS Carbon) with distinct personalities, music choices and also requirements to complete.

[@luisortega8085]

there was supposed to be a the run 2 but EA is fucktarded

[@ketrub]

@@Johnny-ux7yi imagine if every crew like had their own setlist with rap, rock, edm, dnb, etc

[@Lucios1995]

I read the title of the video and reminded myself of that The Run 2 idea I had, where the race in the first game was a way to find the best getaway driver they could for heists, turning it into kind of a linear GTA game. We kinda got that with Payback?

[@X1erra]

You make a lot of good points tbh, and me as a simracer, I'm already devoted to the intricacies of car physics and getting the best laptimes. But I still remember the good times with NFSMW, they were great because I did something other than racing; survival against cops. I love Driver: San Francisco because I'm bending reality itself to complete objectives. I love Burnout because I'm encouraged to slam opponents to walls and not crash yourself. If there is someone who loves these simpler times, just make a racing game that goes back to the 2000s but not as a remake of the Black Box NFS games. We need something that takes these concepts to greater heights.

[@JZStudiosonline]

The problem with sims is there's no reason to do anything other than hotlap which is boring as hell. And online sucks no matter what the game is, though at least in burnout the intention is to ram into other people.

[@speedeespeedboi9527]

​@@JZStudiosonlinethe hotlap is the fun part

[@JZStudiosonline]

@@speedeespeedboi9527 No, it's not. That's not even racing. The hotlap is practice mode for the real races, but since AI and online are dogass you never get that far.

[@speedeespeedboi9527]

@@JZStudiosonline yes it is. people spent their time round the track perfecting racing line, hitting the apex, finetuning the car, nevermind the actual racing.

[@Appletank8]

Getting good times and better driver skill is nice and all, it it's creatively boring. We've been doing hotlaps since car racing was invented, the only change is new cars and more polygons which every single sim racer game is doing.

[@DiegoGTRatty]

The moment you brought up Road Trip Adventure it all clicked. Racing games have had no gameplay variety for ages now, and less so to help them stand out from one another. Road Trip Adventure had generic races, customization and collectibles for sure, but then you also have all the side activities: the curling or sky high minigame where you brake, or jump into a target, the soccer minigame that uses your recruited teammates, the hill-climb minigame, the huge maze, the barrel dodging stuff, and just, tons of *stuff to do*. Looking back at older racing games, some would often have gameplay elements and changes to mix it up. Often times I look at a racing game now, and there's very little STUFF TO DO, and nothing that's changed in the main racing. You'll have some sprint events, maybe circuit events, generic "go fast" or "jump here" collectables a plenty, and if you're lucky, maybe drift and drag events. In a Need for Speed, maybe police too. And that's IF the game comes out complete at launch. So then that begs the question, where is the gameplay variety there? Many big racing franchises have been around for 15+ years, you'd think these games would have way more to them by now. But it just isn't there nowadays. No mix-ups or changes to keep the racing gameplay fresh at a bare minimum. No Midnight-Club style open-ended races that encourage map mastery with far checkpoints & good shortcut usage. No Driver San Francisco car shifting, or Watch Dogs inspired traffic light sabotaging to think outside the box with the traffic. No Most Wanted pursuit milestones that encourage police interaction instead of dodging them out of annoyance. No track changes in a similar vein to Split Second that encourage people to switch up their routes mid-race. No extra objectives or obstacles, like ones that could be seen in Outrun 2/2006's Heart Attack modes, making players drive into gates or drive along weird racing lines for the best score, all while trying to reach the goal in time. And that's just for the actual racing parts. The driving sections outside of the racing (such as in open worlds like many racing games have nowadays) just feel bland without good side activities or ways to push what can be pretty fun driving physics when used properly. I think that's a reason I've been enjoying stuff like Forza/The Crew's multiplayer mini-game modes (Infected or King), or the recently introduced Link-ups in NFS: Unbound's multiplayer (take out cops, smash collectables, jump through gates, draft players... just a collection of small goals and missions that aren't just racing). They're a nice break from the otherwise repetitive and uninspired racing that suffers from not having variety itself. Having Road Trip Adventure inspired side activities put into these games would help a ton (who wouldn't wanna play car soccer in every racing game amirite?), though devs can always get creative and put their own game-appropriate spins on them. However, they also need to bring that variety to the racing. Have tracks implement shortcuts, obstacles, real-time changes and rules that mix up the races. On top of that, applying those changes and scenarios to work within a game's story so it isn't just dialogue distracting people in a race would help tremendously as well. Anyways I'm gonna boot up the PS2 again, gonna head to Road Trip Adventure's Sandpolis Roulette (which you have to jump the car into instead of a ball. Seriously. No wonder racing games are so bland. So many ways to use the driving beyond just racing is beautiful. It really makes you feel like Car™).

[@phlyingphalanges]

You have well summarized my thoughts. Job well done 👍

[@Muhluri]

Sounds like you would enjoy FlatOut. I think it has one of the largest game mode varieties in racing games

[@DiegoGTRatty]

@@Muhluri Oh boy, the third game in the series has a massive discount compared to the other two, I should buy it while it's so cheap then Nah but fr, I've played the first two & Wreckfest, good games there with the demo derby aspect 👌

[@ZouneShot]

Yeah, we definitely need more diverse racing games on the market. It's a real shame how sim racers make up a bulk of modern racers now. I'm glad at the very least there's some indie devs that make their own arcade racers, though some of them lean more towards Outrun than Ridge Racer, which is a completely different world of car games. Speaking of Ridge Racer, have you ever played R-4: Ridge Racer Type 4? That game has a story mode of sorts there's a unique plot for each racing team. It's not just a collection of cutscenes either; the position you get in each race affects how your boss reacts to you. I picked the Pac-man Racing Club and your boss is really hard at you at first, and if you place low then he does not let up his frustrations and wonders if he hired the right guy, but he's impressed if you get first (just don't lose the next race or he'll start thinking your shocking first win was just a fluke!) It's a rather simple mode, it's all just text boxes, but the writing is enough for you to grow attached to the characters, and there's even motivations and stakes, too! Finally, this is completely unrelated, but you know what other genre is severely lacking in diversity? sports games. Sports games suffer more because not only do all sports games seek to emulate real life and have all the real teams, leading to a lot of same-y-ness, the genre is also almost completely dominated by EA and 2K Games and their decades-long exclusivity deals with the world's biggest sports associations. We need more sports games that appeal to gamers outside the Sports Game niche, even if they don't have Real Teams or Realistic Gameplay.

[@antarcticpenguin1151]

this is why arcade games falter, everybody is obsessed with the idea of realism, they forget the value of actual game making like adding your own ideas and twists and make games appealing and approachable to the masses, now youll hardly see a game that does that.

[@whiskeycorridor90]

I blame GTA V for shrinking the arcade racing market so much. "But can I get out of the car?" They say as if they dont spend 95% of the time in GTA driving or searching for a fast car. Same with arcade flight games. Cant recommend Ace Combat because you cant do teh heckin cool rendezook.

[@phlyingphalanges]

You could make a wholly different video about how GTA impacted the video game industry, for both better and worse. Better, for how it pushed the industry forward in terms of immersion and gameplay variety within a sandbox setting. Worse, for how it altered the public perception of how much value a video game should hold. I have seen people complain that Witcher 3 and GTA V hold hundreds of hours of content for $60, so why shouldn't a game like Resident Evil 4, Wolfenstein New Order, or Doom have the same amount? It's not inherently wrong to desire more from a game, but too often it seems consumers want all the same "stuff" in every game. This of course leads to bloated, meandering experiences similar to every Ubisoft game that just has "content" for the sake of content. The customer is always right but sometimes the customer does not know what they actually want until they already have it.

[@blehmeh9889]

Damn, the same thing happened to Elite Dangerous. "Hey, I can't get out of the ship and use space legs to walk around." "OK, here's a DLC for that! It took us years of work to develop this thing, and it's still pretty rough around the edges because it was challenging to implement small scale first person action into our huge scale space game, but here ya go!" "My immersion is ruined! The on foot gameplay is extremely glitchy because the flight simulation engine wasn't made for on-foot gameplay! The game is ruined now!" "Well, if it's not fully cooked, you can always hold off on buying the DLC until it gets better..." "No, the game is completely ruined now! It's dead, and the only people who will frequent it now are fanboys! I'm leaving!"

[@donnycorn3086]

fun thing, NFS The Run did plan to have a mode where you go outside of the car and walk by foot. I assume it's for car transferring and avoiding cops in the race within each stage available, but the 1-year development window didn't get it more than what it is now.

[@huyra8019]

Test drive unlimited 2 is where I'd like games to be

[@BDozer666]

@@huyra8019 TDU2 was garbage. TDU1 was the real deal.

[@scottthewaterwarrior]

I'd love another Interstate 76 game. For those who haven't played it, it was a car combat game, but unlike something like Twisted Metal, wasn't arena based but rather had large open maps that you had to explore and complete objectives in.

[@SvenElven]

Awesome game! The music alone was worth the money!

[@markymark6229]

Jesus. I'm hella jealous of that racing game collection

[@ENKTDeeColon_and_randomnumbers]

My brother in Christ, I whole-heartedly agree with this video

[@floppa9415]

It is a god damn warcrime that the Driver Series has been mothballed and Ubisoft instead now makes poor man's Forza Horizon which by itsself has become the Call of Duty of Racing games. Same game since Horizon 2 with a few new cars and a new Maps every release. But the people buy it so it gets re-released over and over with slight tweaks. Also, thanks for naming all these obscure unique racing games. Definitly gonna check those out some time.

[@phlyingphalanges]

There are no distinguishing features between Horizon 4 and 5. I am convinced they made the map for 5 in one year and took the remaining time at the bar to have a beer.

[@floppa9415]

@@phlyingphalanges Or going on a spree signing deals with every car related brand ever for a product placement.

[@ZAINILEXTHE1ANDONLY]

hate how the crew 1 gets ignored

[@ashar8192]

facts Bruder

[@AhmadWahelsa]

there were rumors that the first Watch Dogs WAS a Driver game called Driver Nexus

[@KanzakiZD]

i don't care how bad the game was, if it's fun to play, it is fun. that's all i can say about it. but well, most racing games that has the best quality in any terms possible, do often get critics and harsh comments, giving the game a bad result of reviews. and it's because the game needs to keep on their roots otherwise people would leave the game and there'll be no one plays it, leaving the game or the entire series abandoned or at least played by the community.

[@haaxxx9]

The thing about that is that so many people in many fanbases can't handle a basic fair and valid criticism to a set game that they so enjoyed/loved. We already got one example that is pinned in the comment on how to be a total asshole over one opinion about something that ultimate don't change anyone at all but have a valid and fair viewpoint and thoughts about the current state of modern racing games which I don't like to admit but Phlying Phalanges have some decent valid points that should be taken into consideration.

[@KanzakiZD]

@@haaxxx9 i'm here for the emphasis on the first sentence tho. play for fun, not for stupid criticism. and if they're a long time fan, a blockhead, or just a retarded fan and they're giving critics on their favorite game and series, then i'll simply leave them alone. it's their problem and not mine. although sometimes i'd like to rant about my favorite games being sucked for the time it was released, if the game is decently fun, i can keep playing it, until it's no longer fun for me.

[@haaxxx9]

@@KanzakiZD In the end that really all that matters if you enjoy a game or not. Video games core purpose is supposed to be entertaining to an audience that they want to bring in or already have on the surface. I love playing The Crew games despite many people are understandably criticality vocal about those games. So at least you understand that part for sure. Now I am curious, what do you like to play? No, this isn't a bait question because I just explained to people on here typing a overly long and wordy comment about peoples preferences to enjoyment.

[@KanzakiZD]

@@haaxxx9 my favorite? well, nfs series. i grow up with arcade racing games that allows you to customize, do a riot with cops, and having an intense full speed race. that's my kind of race, but unlike assfart 9 which is basically p2w and stupid arcadey, i prefer nfs.

[@haaxxx9]

@@KanzakiZD I also like the NFS games but it varies on what I like to have in a NFS game. High Steaks, Shift and Heat are my favorite games out of the series so far and honestly well captivate on different styles of NFS games. The rest are a hit or miss too me if we go by "I like this!" or "I don't like this." I wouldn't say all NFS games are bad because each one I played I had some moments of fun but it wasn't consistent about it. The Fanbase are ironically the worst thing about the NFS games since I always see an endless cycle of either hating the new games and always want the black-box era of games to come back, Black-Box era of NFS are clunky and a mess of games that is not worth your time and vice versa. I know you can't please everyone but this shit is just plain childish on how certain "fans" always react overly negative to the series when a new game is made that isn't like their game they wanted it to be. I just stay away from the fanbase since I see no one is happy at all and constantly bitch about the games regardless of era and year is in. Same goes for Pokémon and Sonic for me as well on how a long-running franchise can make older fans clash with the new/recent fans of the series and just be an total asshole about it over an opinion that means nothing to them at the end of the day. And we can agree on something that the asphalt series that is heavy P2W bullshit just like 95% of mobile smartphone games now are on the insanely bloated market. I rather play on my Switch lite thank you very much (Having an iPhone 14 Pro and I still prefer using a Custom Desktop/Gaming Laptop for general use, can't stand how small and limited smartphones are).

[@exnamekian]

It would be cool if the Wreckfest physics were used for a Driver SF sequel

[@ECfuckingW22]

I always annoy Bug bear to do That lol

[@Arexion5293]

I'd say Tokyo Xtreme Racer 3 is an example of a good racing game with not so good driving. Its specific progression, the car customization and tuning, the gameplay systems that add both immersion and offer a very specific experience, and the numerous unique rivals with backstories that create a well realised setting that you're partaking in, are all that make it work so well. TXR Drift 2 meanwhile also has good driving, although it comes with ridiculous rival requirements even for progression which is very annoying. Usually the stupid requirements are saved for optional stuff and the completionist final boss, not normal final boss.

[@chuckfinley3152]

The Tokyo extreme games were fun to play

[@phlyingphalanges]

It seems my back catalogue grows even longer with everyone's recommendations. The only game I've played in the series is the (rather rare) Xbox 360 title Import Tuner Challenge. I wasn't too crazy about it, but as I understand that particular game had less content as the devs had to make new assets for the then new HD era of games. I'll certainly have to play the older ones.

[@FellianTheDragon]

Burnout Blur ChoroQ (Road Trip is part of this franchise) Crash N Burn Driver Flatout Juiced Midnight Club LA Motorstorm Split Second Stuntman Toca Race Driver/Grid (the 2008 game) Racing games can be so much more than sim racing/Mario Kart/festival themed Forza Horizon clone

[@frazarshad5821]

Such good content deserves more views

[@Otherfabbros]

Also thank you so much to bring back the "Fuck those Sim nerds" theme I miss those times

[@GeriatricFan1963]

0:53 The Queen of England died last year, so yeah, she doesn't go particularly fast anymore.

[@mattmattmatt131313]

Interesting take. Even I as a really hardcore simulation fan, I have always wished for a sim game that had a good story and/or RPG elements. Arguably there have only been two games that I can remember that came even close to that, My Summer Car and the original Mafia: The City of Lost Heaven game. Because yes, no matter how good the physics and the gameplay, just driving around in a circle does get boring after a while.

[@ariasandhygustidiredja8197]

Off topic from me but i think car dependency does affect the general population view about cars, it is no longer a something to be enjoyed and admired anymore, but instead it is just a tool to go from point A to B because there is no other choice beside driving a car in a car dependent city, if only we could leave our boring commuting manner into train or bikes instead of cars, cars can be something else entirely

[@markjohnson1734]

I play both Forza/GranTurismo and MarioKart/Burnout/NFS and my biggest complaint with them all is I still am a virgin P.s. Racing game with diverse gameplay, adequate corny but entertaining plot, music, level design, not just racing but also fighting/battling Hot Wheels Velocity X. Look it up. Its unironically fantastic. Yes I have a slight amount of nostalgia for it. Guns, tricks in mid-air, nitrous, the main character is voiced by the same guy from Danny Phantom.

[@jacksonmann3161]

I would love a persona style racing game where you have to balance school life with racing. There would be a social link system with a diverse cast of characters, and hanging out with them would give you bonuses for races. You could also work part time jobs to earn extra money and be able to increase your drivers stats to help with both racing and life simulator stuff. If there’s an indie dev reading this please make this game!

[@ReiCaixa]

I didn't watch the HUD or anything, and I was blind until you Tookdown someone. Then I was like: "OH, Burnout!" This is the kind of identity I miss about racing games. Burnout, Driver: SF, FlatOut, Midnight Club. Good old times. Today we only have Wreckfest (and maybe Trail Out) are the only interesting thing happening right now, but one could say they are basically the FlatOut 3 we never got.

[@KiraKiraDaze]

We need another Racing Lagoon. Racing Lagoon was SUCH a good game with a intruiging story in my oppinion!

[@AmodeusR]

Though I agree with what you say in this video, you're mixing up car games with racing games. You can have a game with cars, but it can be not a racing game and vice-versa. The fact is, when people think of games and cars together, they think of the same thing, which is what people generally want: A sim or sim-like game as Forza (Motorsport/Horizon) or Need for Speed with car customization, with the only focus being racing in a track to win. Most people don't care if the game has a football mode with cars, or stunt area or whatever. Although it would be nice to see such variety, most games today focus on the "racing" part, and it's not to blame, since it's what people actually want.

[@Кожуркаотпомидора]

The question is if it's all about story and RACING or story and CARS? Because first one seems quite a challenge, since it's kinda hard to make sensible and logical story correlating with gameplay.

[@phlyingphalanges]

A racing story would be quite difficult to make, unless of course it caters to people who already enjoy racing. Gameplay wise, I assume you could have some nefarious opposing race team that sabotages your car: Such as forcing you to race on low grip tires after they slash them. Of course that may be slightly unrealistic, but in the case of storytelling you could stretch the truth.

[@maxway7465]

I appreciate someone else is spreading the gospel about Racing Lagoon. Such a fascinating game on all fronts. A shame Square hasn't done anything with it yet. Not sure they'd be able to remake it or do a sequel either.

[@Toby_Kat]

Dude, you seem friggin' awesome! 😹 Also completely correct. Phallic Phalanges seems to know his vroomy games :v

[@phlyingphalanges]

I prefer the nickname "The big PP".

[@NickCage-cq5tc]

I think developers don't spend enough time thinking outside the box, the sim racing game market has taken over the racing game genre for the most part. I think they should take notes from various movies like the 2008 Speed Racer film. give us gadgets like jump jacks and advanced technology like 4 wheel steering and integrated jet engines with "converginators" like speed racer and give us hot wheel style tracks. phlying phalanges is right, that we should integrate the story and gameplay. need for speed the run had quite a bit of it and its something we need more of. also trying to drive a real life car around a real life track is fun but it gets boring. why not liven it up and try to add some spice into the mix? just my 2 cents

[@Zippy_Zolton]

The title is just perfect, I wish more people had your sentiment about this genre, there is so much potential that will probably never ever be explored in AAA

[@TheAnimationEz]

its like watching regular car review but about my games , instant like !

[@kofiro253]

Subscribed! I have been thinking about making racing games that standout in terms of gameplay and this video showed up! I hope I'll be able to make some decent racing games as a solo dev. Heck I would probably ask you to try it out if and when I am done!! Awesome video btw!!

[@Soroosh.S83]

Hello im also a game developer are you still working on it? Wanna help me out? I wanna make racing game too

[@SvenElven]

Gotta say I like this channel! Kind of a «cheekier» taker on the «philosophical» style videos of Raycevick and Whitelight! +1 subscriber!

[@blehmeh9889]

I really enjoyed this video, so much so that I've still got a few minutes left but felt compelled to leave a comment. For starters, racing games may not have great stories, but if you expand your scope back to "Driving" games, you actually get way more stories. Notably, I consider the Grand Theft Auto series to be very much a driving game, sometimes even with racing elements, and these games have arcade-style car handling and prominent stories. The car integrates somewhat into the story because the car is the most important tool the game gives you in evading the police. Grand Theft Auto is also one of the most popular videogame franchises ever made, so there's that. Then again, it's also fair to say GTA isn't strictly a "Driving" game because while the car in GTA is useful, it's very common to leave your car and complete missions on foot. Speaking of "Driving" games, another one I enjoyed that I think would appeal to you is "Vangers". It's a top down driving game where the car is your sole means of interacting with the game and exploring the world. It has a unique plot, a surprisingly detailed and destructible mini-voxel landscape, and a very strange and intriguing story (although it's so weird and obscure that the developers copped out from only telling it in an immersive manner; they frontload a newgame with an optional wall of text that spoils all the background lore for you, rather than forcing you to go through the game and talk to all the weird bug people to figure out what happened to the bugs and to humanity. You can skip this wall of text and do that if you really want to though, and I'm sure there's story outside of the creation lore too that isn't just spoiled at the beginning of the game). I'll admit I didn't get too far in this game, but it does have some interesting driving mechanics, it has a few "race" sections that I know of where you gotta outdrive competitors to complete a story objective, and even outside of those race sections it's beneficial to learn the handling for your car so that you can navigate the landscape quickly and effectively.

[@phlyingphalanges]

Thanks for the comment - I feel I interchanged "racing" and "driving" games far too much in the video. Wreckless, Driver: SF, Runabout, Spintires, etc. certainly fall into the category of "driving" rather than racing - a genre sorely missing as of late. Maybe because they do not appear as exciting as racing titles, so most have fallen into obscurity. GTA certainly has driving game elements, but the game is otherwise focused on doing everything (walking, shooting, flying, swimming, etc.) at once to the point it can't be called a "driving game". I also have just looked up Vangers, it seems rather bizarre and unique - my kind of game - so I will certainly have to try that out.

[@ervinas_matulis]

After watching this. Thought how this idea sounds? Futuristic arcade car combat racing set in different planets where each has somewhat different physics like gravity, all cars are bulky diesel powered monsters, drivers are busty women and each driver has somewhat different reason why she entered dedly race where there is no 2nd place. Gameplay is like typical car racing but more chaotic. AI is ruthless laser sharp beast which always breathes to players neck no matter how good it is. Tracks themselves can change on last lap. And player is forced rely on it's skill to not finish in last place. Just idea.

[@RE-zl7sy]

rember me when u become big on yt

[@Willowello]

Subscribed. Bang on, made some good points. I am an epic gamer man also!!1. I knew you would mention nfsmw05 and Driver: SF.(loathsome French) Also gud mems and you reminded me to go get Gran Turismo 4.

[@dextera808]

I liked these kinda video, hope you make more video like this 🤣

[@joshcopeland]

Would be so great if someone could list every game shown in this video. Great video by the way.

[@phlyingphalanges]

Peep the updated description 👀

[@jacksonhopp2003]

Bro, I want more games like Motorstorm apocalypse, Split/second, and mad max. But sadly it’s almost seems like bad luck is always on their side. It happens once, it’s bad luck. It happens twice, it’s a coincidence. It happens thrice, that’s when I start getting suspicious.

[@Phenom98]

You are hilarious and based. This channel is underrated ah

[@LiquaFusion]

I mean, i'd argue that the story in Grid Legends does its job and it does it really well. it wasn't made to affect the gameplay, it's there to immerse the player in the game's universe and give them more of a reason to play the game, and it worked on me really well. all it really did was say "here's your team, you kinda suck and you need to work to be better. here's the antagonists, their team is really good and we're gonna remind you that over and over and over so that you develop a strong desire to beat them, and it'll be really satisfying when you do" and it worked on me. because of that, Grid Legends is one of my favorite racing games of all time and really stuck with me more than any other racing game has recently instead of saying "this isn't good enough" i'd rather praise Grid Legends for its story, that way other game companies can see how much of an impact a good story has, and then they'll try to make an even BETTER story. by crapping on it then the companies will go "next time we're just not gonna risk it and we won't put any sort of story in our game next time"

[@glitchtvtr]

I feel that NFS Payback had the best ever story. It's not perfect and had loops but I enjoyed it so hard. I think everyone can enjoy if they are not tired of Fast n Furious movies. NFS The Run had the best story mode as a journey. Coast to coast ride with great scenery. Both games had great action sequences. NFS Undercover was had the worst story and gameplay, mission names were giving spoilers 🤦‍♂ The Crew 1 story started so good but I haven't played it yet. R4: Ridge Racer Type 4 had little story about racing teams. Weirdly, NFS No Limits had in-depth and very long storyline. It's really surprising for a mobile game. I don't recommend the game at all because it's a cashgrab game where you spend most of your time in menu rather than racing. However I watched the story videos on youtube and it really surprised me.

[@ventilo1825]

It's a shame that we can't emulate all those old xbox gems...

[@phlyingphalanges]

Hopefully at some point - Xemu is making good progress. Yet you are right, it cannot emulate Double Steal in its current state.

[@haaxxx9]

I think you're the first youtuber that I seen that mentions the "Choro Q" video games when people started to express there complaints about modern racing games in the past few years. I first herd about the series on "FailRace" channel that did a let's play on it and my eyes was mainly glued to the screen how wacky and so customizable the game is! I currently have Choro Q (4) for my PS2 that I owned since 2018 along side with a PS2 and everything about the game oozes with charm and personality! I also got "Enthusia Professional Racing" along side with a used DFGT and was captivated on how the main game was structured and how you progress though the game that you don't pick your car and drive it, you spin a wheel and lands on a car that you might get or not depending on your placement after the race have ended. It's an interesting take on car selection that you might not drive the cars you ever thought of and maybe appreciate them for what they are! And I didn't know some Japanese exclusive racing game since I am a Texas American that's loves arcade places like "Round 1 Amusement" and some retrocades that have hydro thunder in it so I am basically cater to a niche thing that many don't care about around here which is fine by me because I'm not interested in their enjoyment either. And the best part is that you're not even a video game racing enthusiast which is very funny to me to see the flaws of modern racing game that I painfully can agree on. Do I think modern racing games is all trash? No, I enjoy playing NFS Heat (IMO Fuck Unbound) and Forza Horizon 5 to a certain point in hours and then after like 30+ hours I start to see the lack of appeal and motivation to keep on playing because the game just give you everything (FH5) with a few hours of game play and just say "Hey, do these races that you get barely any credits and exp for than just roaming about and doing mindless shit for way more rewards!" which I eventually drop FH5 (And FH4) because it have no substance or drive to make me want to keep playing. And the worst part I spend over 300+ hours on FH3 which is the last Forza Horizon games that you are working on some goal that will take weeks or some months to achieve to get better things in events, exclusive cars and just more cash/exp. And the start of the decline with the unnecessary wheelspins and bloated economy making a good part of Modern Forza Horizon games feels so hollow and have no weight on what you're doing at all. Modern racing video games is lacking on one thing that the 90's and 2000's racing video games had, personality that it is a video game at the end of the day and can do all kinds of crazy shit that real life can't do without major repercussions to one's action! And music too from Daytona USA, Ridge Racer, San Francisco Rush, Metropolis street Racer/Project Gotham, OutRun, Scud Race, Dirt Dash and so many more that I can't list them all or we will be here all day. And by the way Square-enix made another racing game called "Driving Emotion Type-S" for the PS2 back in 2000 via sister company. It basically got panned across the board for being a glitchy and poorly handling model for a racing game. The other racing game that they got involved with like with Gravel and Chocobo GP had different companies that developed the games and Square-enix published them.

[@marx4538]

I think games like SEGA Rally and Ridge Racer were really fun as they had no filler and just purely great controls and track design, no upgrades or repetition, just a few tracks and that's the game.. Also loved Midtown Madness and Trackmania for mod-friendliness and high potential for creativity. F-Zero and Wipeout are dead unfortunately, as are all the other series mentioned. Would love to play Kirby Air Ride with Henry Ford. Don't like cars. Sonic R is great

[@donnycorn3086]

Love the video so far. You made a good point in terms of "telling a story with human in a racing game". Maybe I don't need to understand human to make a racing game important, but the cars itself should. Initial D gets you along with an AE86 and his tofu delivery boy and see him win races on mountains. Most Wanted gives you a street-illegal race car to establish you as a rule-breaking menace before the story takes everything off it away. Hell, you wouldn't expect Gran Turismo to even bother having human or a story to be memorable, and yet its presentation gave the cars so much more characteristics and memes. I love and hate how Racing Lagoon got one of the most interesting concepts of storytelling execution for a racing games and yet I never knew about till now. But again, the only game that utilizes the driver-shifting mechanic of Driver SF is Driver SF. Just a quick note tho, you might wanna check out holeecrab on twitter. The artist do draw anime and cars, but also made an animation of a game that never exist. p.s: I'm a Dodge Viper fan. Being able to race R34s and Supras on a touge with a fckin Viper in GRID 1 was the best thing I've ever experienced in a racing game.

[@Nadesey]

bruh I'm LGBT asf and Burnout Revenge is my FAVORITE racing game. The Burnout series is my morning coffee.

[@AndyAlex-dz6wf]

Oh finally I found someone mention runabout, its my childhood game, its a simple thing but its made my day. good video.

[@rayyagamer2011]

I liked both sim and arcade I like sim because of gran turismo 4 and i like arcade because burnout

[@AronHallan]

Driver San Francisco and The Crew 1 were pretty good to me mashing story telling and gameplay i really enjoyed them.

[@ZAINILEXTHE1ANDONLY]

You named 2 of my favorite racing games that are exactly what I think about with this topic, we almost think on the same wave. and shoutout to you for giving the crew 1 the credit it deserves shits way better than 2 or the new motorfest

[@AronHallan]

@@ZAINILEXTHE1ANDONLY I Wish he used The Crew 1 as an example because it was the first thing to come to my mind when i clicked this video. I played the Crew 2 coop with a friend and the whole time i was telling him how The Crew 1 was better and very different from 2. Crew 2 is a poor mans Forza Horizon wanabe.

[@HeavenhoundGiuseppe]

​@@ZAINILEXTHE1ANDONLYBoth Crews are great. 1 certainly has a much better story (probably the best story in a racing game). However, I've beaten it twice, and after doing all the explory stuff it just gets a bit boring, and VERY grindy. 2 has no real story, but it's generally just fun to dick around (no cops, hallelujah!), and is way less grindy.

[@Journey_to_who_knows]

Crew 2 could have had underground across an entire country, like The Run but dynamic.

[@No-vq1iv]

Should've compared Wreckfest to Flatout 2 instead, since they're made by the same studio. Either all the devs that worked on Flatout have since left the studio or they all suffered the worst case of mass amnesia ever recorded, because they seem to have forgotten everything they learned while working on those games. I'm not talking just about the fun factor which is completely absent from Wreckfest, but that game also has a lot of design problems that none of the Flatout games have. Hell they even botched the demolition derby mode, they have 3 versions of it and none of them are good, how does that happen? Smh.

[@skythundersky1544]

The intro alone fucking killed me dude. Great video, keep it up

[@Benzo97]

I was not expecting a "Everywhere Road Trip" mentio (named as "Road Trip Adventure in my country) but it was a very nice surprise to see and I think it's very underrated. I think it has huge potential if it miraculously gets a modern sequel or even a remake with the world itself having more content as the one in that game has a huge world with a lot of wasted space in it (but still a good one in my opinion)

[@sarmatiancougar7556]

Forza Horizon titles are the most *boring* games that LOOK very fun and inviting. "I got a new car. It's a limited collectors edition again. Wooow... I guess" And the variety of races is so pitiful you often forget the realistic driving physics are even there. I mean I could see Forza driving physics making the gameplay more interesting and challenging in something like NFS Underground 2, but Forza games? They're just interstate cruising simulators.

[@laurentiusmcmxcv]

That reminds me of an oldie called Circus Maximus Chariot Wars, that sucker was a perfect mix of arcade and similation ..with chariots. The Academy mode is like a series of driving tests and you FEEL like you're in-the-flesh learning how to drive back then as well as when to switch between a chariot's driver and fighter. Plus, each chariot and horse has its own stats.

[@SteveBrandon]

I kinda want to "well, actually" your statement about Runabout being the first 3D open world racing game series but I suppose you're technically correct because Vette (1989) never got a sequel and Test Drive III: The Passion (1990) was the only fully open world game in the series until Test Drive Unlimited in 2006.

[@phlyingphalanges]

I should have specified on Console, as you otherwise would have been correct.

[@eurosonly]

The way he pronounced boat lmao.

[@SummonerArthur]

Well, now I just got some old odd racing games that I really play thanks for this video. Gonna check some of these out for sure

[@No-vq1iv]

Driver SF isn't made by the French, Reflections is based in England, like most studios that make good driving games.

[@doodle4503]

Hey, nice video, and thanks for the recommendations, even if I have heard and played most of them. A recommendation I will give out is for a game coming out in the very near future, named Dr. Robotnik's Ring Racers. It is a fan-made Sonic racing game that has been in the works for many years, based off of Sonic Robo Blast 2, another fan game game which has been in the works for many more years. I've been anticipating it for a long time and I have heard promising things from its developers and testers. Also, I'm kinda getting greedy here, but you saying that you pulled out a bit too many obscure racing/driving games implies that you have more in mind. Any chance that you could give out names for some more?

[@phlyingphalanges]

As far as car games that are unusual, Racing Battle C1 and Super World Police on PS2 come to mind. C1 is a track version of Tokyo Extreme racer and has all the usual quirks (Only in Japanese, tho). Super World Police is a car combat game with Visual novel storytelling. GTI Club on the Wii is also a charming arcade racer, it's getting rather expensive, though. It has an HD version on PS3, but there was no physical release, so unless you have a modded PS3 and are fine sailing the high seas, it's lost to time. Grooverider: Slot Car Thunder is like the drag mode in NFS Underground 2, but it is the entire game and is rather difficult. There are plenty of other rather unknown "normal"racing games but the majority are unknown/forgotten because they did not do anything special, like Shox on PS2 or Race Pro on Xbox 360.

[@doodle4503]

@@phlyingphalanges Thanks! Yeah, a lot of obscure racing games are meh or worse, but there are some real gems I have found. Like with a lot of genres, there are many games made by well-known developers that didn't catch on or really degraded in popularity as time has gone on. Sega has MANY arcade exclusive racing games (and some with ports) that fit that bill, including what I'd say one of the more notable ones being Motor Raid.

[@robinhut8284]

I came across this video and I found it informative, smart, funny, and entertaining. I hope you make more videos and get much more subscribers.

[@JDGamez15]

They don't make these games like they used to. I would love to have another Burnout with Revenge's racing and 3 Takedown's crash mode and that would be my dream Burnout game. With Need for Speed, I grew up with Underground 2, Most Wanted 2005, Carbon, Prostreet and Undercover (mostly the Wii version as I liked playing in a mirrored Most Wanted world though Tri-City Bay looks nice). The Run was interesting but it had potential to be a much bigger game and could've been a great thing but it lacked compared to others. Driver San Francisco was great, the only racing game to cover a story that involved being in a coma with some interesting gameplay mechanics that aren't seen elsewhere like "possessing" other drivers on the road. It would be awesome to have more games like these but companies (mostly EA) just love getting money and don't care about what we actually want to see and do in racing games. Why don't companies know that if they give us what we really want, there would be A LOT more sales going their way to getting more money? And they wonder why we don't like them as much.

[@ZAINILEXTHE1ANDONLY]

Holy shit did you're funny as hell keep going !! 🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@Muhluri]

This is a fire video! I’ll have to check out those games you recommended

[@Soroosh.S83]

That's why I really wanna try to make a racing game with great story and interactive feature that show some simple elements of rpg but overall ONLY story with great characters and racing which means No customization, no licenced cars The problem is unfortunately, there are no game dev who helps me with that (also I'm currently using godot)

[@phlyingphalanges]

I wish you well on your ventures! 😀

[@Djhg2000]

I only watched the first 9 minutes but I have a very important point that, to me, keeps looming in the background in your reasoning: The racing genre has become diluted by AAA titles full of microtransaction-friendly elements. This is an expansion on the DLC trend that killed off the more creative franchises like Test Drive: Unlimited, where racing was an element in a social driving experience MMOR game. You could go race around a track drawn onto the map but at least me and my friends used it to just cruise around and enjoy the cars for what they were. I have hopes but low expectations for Test Drive Unlimited Solar Crown, which is developed by a completely different developer under new ownership. It has potential to go either way in regards to the above.

[@phlyingphalanges]

The new Forza and Gran Turismo 7 being online only are very good examples of the microtransaction creep. If the game is online only, you can "prevent cheating", but also make sure players are always seeing the new paid content, since if they were offline they wouldn't know that there was DLC for the "live service". It also ruins the preservation of the game, considering that once the servers are shut down the game is unplayable, thus ensuring players will be buying the next game. It's a shame that one day all of the Crew games will be unplayable, hell, even Need for Speed 2015 will suffer that fate.

[@Djhg2000]

​@@phlyingphalanges Yeah that's another thing; single player cheats used to be a thing. We who grew up as kids in the 90s always had that one favorite book or collection of magazines with cheats. I had a pocket-sized book called "A-Z Cheats for PlayStation 2" or something like that, by the time I moved on to XBox 360 that book was so worn out you could mistake it for trash if it wasn't on top of the stack of games. Single player cheats used to be a feature. Then achievements became a thing and everyone panicked about cheats. The now iconic Konami code wouldn't have happened today. At first, achievements were what people used to excuse internet connected consoles and games. You could get achievements offline but you couldn't show them off to your friends without being online. Then game publishers started using the online features to push anti-piracy stuff, most notably Ubisoft went hard on this with plenty of backlash but they just kept pushing, and here we are. Kids who grow up with modern games genuinely don't know what we used to have. The "remastered" versions of old games are making the problem even worse because people will play those and think they're getting the original experience with better graphics. Trust me, you're really not. Get some old games, an emulator, and a book full of cheat codes from a second hand store.

[@WayneKerr69420]

@@phlyingphalanges God dammit they can't be shutting down the servers of the crew 1 :( I freaking hate the crew 2 and the new one whatever the hell its called

[@DrProfessorBello]

​@NissanAltimaBeater how can you hate the new one already if it hasn't even come out yet????

[@WayneKerr69420]

@@DrProfessorBello I've watched videos It doesnt look like a good game

[@hashtunr4952]

Road Trip Everywhere was my childhood. I've spent so many hours in that game. The racing genre nowadays is a shell of what it once was in variety. But then again, the entire gaming industry is for the most part an absolute shitshow nowadays also.

[@Jacadac]

I'm so glad Road Trip got a mention, it was my favourite game as a kid

[@emmanuelumeadi4048]

I prefer racing game over simulator game

[@Latham06]

Just from the first minute i can tell this is going to be amazing

[@benn87]

I don't necessarily need a story in racing games. But what has been lost more and more in the last few years are proper in-depth career modes / campaigns because the developers often only focus on the multiplayer part.

[@isshikikogo3056]

i want something like driver 2, i mean, a game that you cat shoot, but you can drive cars, and escape police just running

[@phlyingphalanges]

Police chase in a car, but when you are cornered driving you get out and escape with Mirrors edge style parkour running 💨

[@calvinstraveldreams]

Honestly A LOT of problems with arcade and even simcade racing games (in terms of limits on customization, limits on damage models, limits on which cars can be included (especially in games involving street racing and/or police pursuits)) could be avoided if the game developers took the Tokyo Xtreme Racer Zero approach, and simply took real cars, debadged them, and put them under aliases (that anyone with a decent knowledge of cars would be able to identify which car is under each alias) so as to avoid licensing issues (for example calling the Nissan Skyline GT-R R34 V-Spec the Type-R34RV). Car customization could thus be expanded to include changing the front and rear ends to tube frame, replacing the cars' bodies with carbon fibre, adding extreme wide body kits that are inspired by real cars but DO NOT exist IRL, etc.. (where if the licensed cars were used, licensing agreements may forbid that). In addition, the damage model could be expanded to be more similar to Grid 2008 or Burnout 3/Revenge, and the car rosters could be made more diverse, particularly if developers were willing to sacrifice a little bit of graphical fidelity to make cars quicker to model and allow for more diverse rosters (using 7th Gen models in an 8th/9th Gen game is more forgivable if you are transparent about it, which Turn 10 SHOULD HAVE BEEN with the new Forza, just as Polyphony was about using 6th Gen car models in the 7th Gen Gran Turismo 5/6).

[@dawnslayer]

i'm trans and a racing game appreciator. but i am autistic too, so..

[@phlyingphalanges]

All racing gaymers are treated with equal respect on my channel❗

[@dawnslayer]

@@phlyingphalanges based?

[@phlyingphalanges]

Based? Based on what?

[@dawnslayer]

​@@phlyingphalangesummm uhh

[@abody7862]

this deserves more views

[@wheeljack210]

As a fellow Driver franchise enjoyer. I like your video.

[@Rockhoppr3]

Really hit the nail on why I love strategy and racing games in the beginning there 😅

[@AlexVanScken]

Dude I was playing unbound today and I thought about this exact same shit. I'm tired of these tear your ass up for winning a race with a lot of cringy dialogues and stuff like that. After an hour or two I was bored, It was like a employee job, Do task A and B and then go home and do these again tomorrow again and again and fucking again. On the other hand when I was a kid I used to play Driver San Fransico every summer from beggining. Every single time It felt great. And maybe this on might sounds weird but NFS The Run was a great example of these type of games. Not gonna lie Handling was pain in the ass but pressing these and that middle of a cinematic thing and all of that in 2011 was insane. We can't find these new ideas right now. Devs are too greedy and lazy right now and to be fair there isn't any real new idea for now, They should move on and create something new, old formula doesn't work for me atleast. I'm playing racing games for almost 16 years, Racing is my jam like for ever but these things are not. On PS2 there was a tons of "different" type of racing games but now best thing is ASAP Rocky on some random game with cringy story with gen z type of shit which I can't understand why we should discuss about anime (Literally) in the middle of a high heat chase. Old MW was corny but had a feeling like a badass and being a underground racer not an Instagram influencer. Great video by the way, Waiting for your new one. Sorry for my English too I'm bit shabby with it.

[@phlyingphalanges]

The irony in all of this is that NFS Unbound is probably one of the better made NFS games since the Blackbox era. Truly upsetting that racing games have fallen so far to the point that Unbound is considered "acceptable".

[@AlexVanScken]

@@phlyingphalanges It's funny cus I'm able to play The Crew Motorfest Closed Beta right now and holy shit this game is crap. Looks like a Forza Horizon ripoff with shitty graphic and Mario Kart handling, There are some good things like good radio songs (In a new game which is great) and great map but the rest is same old thing. Starts with Hello superstar like FH5 and cringy talking all the time and gameplay is really annoying. Drifting is so random and bad I rather play it like a sim racing. You can see the gameplay on youtube i think, If do you like I can send some screenshots and videos for you.

[@Eebens]

It's a crime to talk about demolition derby games and not mention Flatout 2

[@drift_works]

what do you think about TDU2 and NFS The Run?

[@Rian911s]

very good video. deserves more views.

[@shyguy85]

i just want flatout 2 destruction and ragdoll with the aesthetics takedowns and courses of burnout 3 is that too much to ask the gaming gods

[@scottthewaterwarrior]

How about some more mission based driving games like Stuntman or Spyhunter?

[@sonyx5332]

The design and even the game play (I think) of Driver - San Francisco reminds me of a Mafia themed game with the same or similar design look.

[@speedeespeedboi9527]

Asseto corsa is all you need! Physics may not be accurate as they say or whatever, but the moddability makes up for it. You might even make your own game modes there. If you really looking for variety have you considered being game dev? i used to do it when i made a fan game of driver but im more of a remasterer type of developer rather than creative. World needs more 70s bouncy american cars driven fast games! Driver is the only series i cared about although i never touch a Driver game in 2 years i think. Speaking of obscure games, do you know Driver Syndicate? Or Car Chase Simulator? They are so far the only games that i can be a 70s cop show hero that i know.

[@LZRDDL]

Best video I’ve seen in a while

[@murazor007]

This is why I like Asphalt rather than any mainstream PC/Console racing games nowadays. Even though it's mostly p2w, I can get the feeling playing a 2000s arcade racing game. The p2w is also not a big deal for me since I only play Career and special events.

[@thetexanhusky]

22:25 - Are those people wrong though? Cars are more of a necessity than a privilege in regards to North America (only very few places, like NYC, are cars considered a privilege), despite what we're told otherwise. Public transit, where it exists, is mediocre at best and awful at worst. Bike and pedestrian infrastructure is lacking, and were they do exist, are quite lackluster and dangerous. Nobody should be forced to buy a car and drive to almost all important places that people have to go to, but North America makes it quite hard to do so. If you think I'm gonna walk across a stroad, or even drive on said stroads and highways, you got another thing comin', bud. Now granted, I don't mind buying and playing driving games. I'll admit that I have a love-hate relationship with cars. I don't mind driving cars in games, since it doesn't require much skill and you're not really bound to as many restrictions than in the real world. Now compare to IRL, where driving a car requires skill, patience, and energy (and probably a few other things I'm forgetting). Hell, I probably have the same opinion that much of Gen Z has (despite being born between the millennial generation and Gen Z). You've got a lot to learn. That's all I can really say without going into a insult game that some people would go to when seeing an opinion like that. I like the video otherwise, but that opinion just seems a bit tone deaf. Ignorant, if you will.

[@phlyingphalanges]

Thanks for the critique. My comment on people complaining about car based infrastructure is slightly half assed. I was attempting to state the idea that people will exclude themselves from certain experiences based off of pre conceived notions. In this case it would be a disliking of cars due to the impact it has had on the globe, and thus excluding themselves from possibly trying driving/racing games. Of course, when I edit all this together in my hackneyed words and writing, I just come off as an ass. Yet another result of me being an Engineer, not an English major, but alas I will improve as I go on.

[@reaperclank]

+i want to play soccer with cars... -you can play rocket league +HELL NO DUDE. Instead im going to play the nichie game, the lost gem of PS2 where you can do the exact same thing that you can do on rocket league but actually in a better way: TEST DRIVE EVE OF DESTRUCION HOLY JESUS

[@Leedleleedle101]

16:08 it’s actually ps1 to 3ds, there’s a title for the 3ds called crash city mayhem, out of state it’s known as runabout 3d drive impossible edit: I know you didn’t know this especially after the 3ds e shop shut down, I just wanted to point it out

[@epitomicmess]

This video autoplayed & i found it very interesting. I was super into racing games as a kid. And these days its almost exclusively mario kart. I've never heard a deep dive on racing games. Hope the algorithm will pick this up.

[@CrashD6]

As a Sim Racing nerd, I can attest that we, Sim Racers, are in fact a bunch of nerds

[@cazao24]

I woudn't mind if you make a 1-hour analysis video about Racing Lagoon. Just sayin'.

[@luisortega8085]

that intro is fucking fire man, subbed

[@RonaldMcVale]

They're scared that their arcade gane will fail. They have grown some sort of paranoia.

[@Mr.Goldbar]

I'm one of these rare types that need both an open world and a scenic or exploration aspect but at the same time demand good physics for a force feedback wheel. I was always fascinated by the physics of driving a real car when I was a kid and now I use games as a form of therapy as a recovering speed addict and a former IRL street racer. The only games that made me satisfied in that aspect are the Forza Horizon series, Need For Speed games with Unite mods and the Assetto Corsa SRP map (but I never joined a server yet since it's a pain in the ass). The only thing I want is a new JDM open world racing game with good wheel physics. A good story aswell is also really appreciated. I learned over the years that even a very minimalistic story with just characters popping up every once in a while like Forza Horizon or a cringy story like NFS 2015 is more enjoyful to me than just going around in circles on the same tracks. Even track racing games can do it right. NFS Pro Street is a track racing game but it has all my favorite over the top aspects from other Black Box NFS games, and in the NFS Shift series and Project Cars 3 you can convert every car into a crazy full blown race car inspired by real GT3 cars.

[@mattmattmatt131313]

It is so frustrating. It seems like you can only get good wheel force-feedback and realistic physics OR an immersive open-world/story mode, but never the two together in the same game. A game I can recommend is emulating Tokyo Xtreme Racer Drift 2 on PC that works on a wheel with (somewhat) realistic if simplified car physics with characters and a story all set in a JDM touge world of street racing. It's not a perfect game, but it's the best we've got. The other option as you have already figured out is making your own game with mods. Like Assetto Corsa touge, drift and SRP racing 90s jdm mods. Third option is GTA V with real car physics mods and steering wheel mod (with ffb). Works surprisingly well.

[@karlsylvain]

i agree 100%. great vid.

[@superninja252]

Great video, totally agree with you

[@Tonini08]

15:36 I have never heard of this game but I instantly want to play it so much 😭

[@NeedForMadnessAuto]

Trail Out Game Has 9 Modes