Ranger School Isn’t for Everyone - Why I Picked Sapper School Instead

[@deanhodgson2087]

I completed Sapper school in 1991. I’m glad they finally recognize the accomplishment with a tab.

[@FMD023]

What’s the point or skill u learn in sapper school? I just know if u had a sapper tab, you were a bad ass. It’s kinda like having a path finders tab. U know it’s hot chit but really don’t know what skill are learning

[@SB0083]

​@FMD023 Sappers are the best of the Combat Engineers. They can go anywhere and make a bomb out of anything. They're practically like real-life McGuyvers with bombs. Many of the elites are tough badasses, but being a Sapper means you're smart too. Essayons!

[@FMD023]

@@SB0083 so by comparison, a guy with airborne and air assault is nice but compared to a guy with Pathfinders he must be smarter because he’s a pathfinder? 😂 and by the way, I heard pathfinder school is somewhat tough. Requires a little bit of thinking over lining up with a static line waiting to jump out. I’m a five jump chump and I’m proud of it 😂

[@strategygalactic]

It always had a tab. Just wasn't authorized to be worn.

[@davidjohnson307]

I followed you and graduated in 1992

[@untilvalhalla7854]

Understanding the depth of your profession is something every Soldier should strive for. For you that meant Sapper. Good call and a great example for those on their own development path.

[@SupaSargeakaQ]

I appreciate the fact that you gave the Sapper Tab its flowers. The Sapper Tab was the one tab i really wanted to earn but unfortunately i was in the National Guard and there weren't many opportunities to go to Sapper School until later in my career where i didn't have the urge anymore but i did manage to get four deployments to Iraq and a Combat Action badge. I believe i got a mention in the Washington Post for my actions on my first deployment to Mosul, Iraq. So 26 years later, i'm still serving, but i'm now in the Army Reserves, trying to share my wealth of knowledge with my soldiers.

[@PlasmaCoolantLeak]

Years ago, the Discovery Channel (when it used to show quality programs) had an episode on the Sapper School. Respect.

[@jpanglao00]

Essayons! I understand the feeling you had as a 12B originally, as a fellow engineer-earning my tab was the goal, unfortunately I suck at math! Thanks for this shout out!

[@shalakabooyaka1480]

I was heavy mech engineer for 4 years, loved my stupid little 113's. Back when I was in(99-04) every yahoo was called sapper by our nco's. We had a few of our nco's who actually wore their tabs, they would sew them on the inside of the chest pocket flaps or inside their patrol cap. I think it's dope it's an approved patch these days.

[@Jay-en4bc]

wood ? maybe you're mistaken your MOS for a 12Bang combat engineer. The only reason Sapper School is a thing. The ultimate Sapper is a 12B.

[@shalakabooyaka1480]

@@Jay-en4bc You replying to the right comment there?

[@Jay-en4bc]

It looks like, no. I can't even find the comment I was replying to. Some person with wood.. idk (12W) calling themselves a Sapper.

[@richardstengline5743]

I am old school, one that is overlooked because they did away with it was Recondo school at Bragg. You had so much jammed into 2 weeks.

[@jackwalker9492]

Yeah, it was done away about my first year in the 82nd (11B) and man, did I want to go. All E4s had to go in at least my unit

[@sandleman3006]

82 ABN, 307E I went to 18th ABN CORP Recondo School. Class 2-84

[@jackwalker9492]

@@sandleman3006 SALUTE! I was just a cherry. DEP 81, AD 82. IRC in Grenada and it nver stopped, but man, you guys and the 173d NCO raised a Gump like dumb ass as right as coulld be. Thank you and I wish you the best.

[@jackwalker9492]

@@sandleman3006 FYI, 11B. The very first 11BS to go to Sapper School and I made it. I did like 10 schools. Sapper was the best and 12Bs, you all have my utmost respect

[@richardstengline5743]

@@sandleman3006 Class 10-86

[@falsealias2046]

I just signed up with the National Guard as a combat engineer. Going to basic in January.

[@d.rcarrera6599]

January 2025? You got time to work out and get in the best possible condition..Good luck and turn off home life, friends, and relationships; focus only on and prioritize your basic training and AIT school. Enroll in my military training schools as possible. Don't become complacent with just one area of study. The Army offers training, official schools and correspondence, grow mentally.

[@falsealias2046]

@@d.rcarrera6599 copy that. Thanks.

[@jaehongjun842]

Enjoy Leonard Wood brother. It’s gonna get real chilly up there…

[@d.rcarrera6599]

@@falsealias2046 Become an informed Soldier and take all the training schools available. A military education is a good education if applied correctly. I learned from a different model that, in some respects, I learned better than civilian education. After active duty, I served two years in the Army reserves and took one correspondence course and it was an eye opener. I was given like almost two years to complete and finished it in almost 5 months..Learn and grow.

[@falsealias2046]

@@d.rcarrera6599 I plan on going to airborne and air assault school. It may be ambitious, but I do plan on attending sapper school as well. SF if I’m crazy in love with the military life.

[@davidjohnson307]

By far the best description of SAPPER school I ever heard online

[@chrisweidner4768]

Decades ago, when I went to Ranger school it was, and remains, the most physically and mentally challenging experience, by far, in my life, and I am an Army infantry gulf 1 war vet. No idea how to compare any other. Thinking Sapper would be just as important. All the best to you sir. Thank you for your service.

[@andrewbantick6311]

I was a British Sapper have a look at the Royal Engineers they do trades also combined with combat Engineers, armoured Engineers, plant operators, divers ,EOD plus commandos and airborne (paras) parachute don’t think I’ve missed anything 🤔😂

[@stevelawrence5123]

Although combat engineers do mines and boobytraps as well as demolitions, EOD is done by people in the Ordinance Branch of the US army.

[@doom4067]

A Sapper tab is practically required for engineers, just like a Ranger tab is practically required in the infantry. The difference is that you have to be affiliated with the engineers to go to Sapper school.

[@monetandameron4744]

Not true. You can go as any mos

[@michaelmichaelagnew8503]

As a combat engineer you can also go to Ranger School. Combat engineers are usually mixed in with infantry because of their special skills dealing with demolitions and mine warfare. Combat engineers always have had the option to do both schools. Why would someone want to be a sapper and not a Ranger? Usually at that level you would want to be around a more disciplined unit so its either Rangers or if you can get the invintation then try to become a green beret. Would hate to be a sapper who was towards the top percentage of combat engineers and get stuck with an average unit filled with average soldiers because either they lack intelligence or discipline.

[@michaelmichaelagnew8503]

@@monetandameron4744 When did that change? I remember back in the mid 90's it was only available for combat engineers but the Army has changed allot. They even went the dodo bird and gave everyone a black beret which used to be only for Army Rangers. Glad I switched to the Air Force before this happened. Spent my summer hanging out and speaking with retired commanders in their 70's and 80's. They had nothing good to say about that general who made that decision.

[@SB0083]

The Sapper tab is not a requirement for 12Bs. I've served with plenty of highly motivated 12Bs who did not get a Sapper tab. However, for those that earn it, they're treated with a lot of respect.

[@lelandgaunt9985]

None of us “soft” engineers were “required” to go to sapper school. In fact we were laughed at for asking to go. I know of one 51, who went to train up, don’t know if he passed to go. Triple Nickle 2001

[@mafiasoftviral]

I'm a very old long retired 12B. I just heard every 12B in Fort Leonard Wood, Missouri yell HUAA! and Thank You Sapper

[@gwatv9636]

My old neighbor was a former Sapper instructor. This video just backed up everything he said about Sapper vs Ranger schools. He told me that Soldiers coming to Sapper with Rangers tabs said Sapper teaches you stuff while Ranger is do as I say and repeat it.

[@vernonbigham4760]

Not true. Ranger 62 days 3 phases, sapper, 28 days 2 phases. Ranger sucked more. But to your point Sappers Waterborne ops was the hardest two days at lake of ozarks. General studies is not hard. Just listen to the instruction. 12 mile course is above average difficulty, land nav is done in pairs, 5 graded PT sessions demo test, knots check point and purpose, combatives, sling load, mountaineering, Pass one graded patrol. Pass on points Pass land nav, PT test, swim, demo test, 12 mile road march faster that 2:45 hrs

[@Morningstar_Actual]

It’s apples and oranges.

[@j.taveras8447]

I did both and went to Sapper w a Ranger tab. This comment is bullshit. I was also a Ranger instructor later on in my service so I know what I'm talking about. Ranger school is harder physically, which makes sense since it's longer. If I had to say the key difference is that Ranger school is specifically a leadership school that uses SUTs to develop the soldier. and he graduates having a very proficient level of understanding of SUTs. Sapper school is a demolitions specific course and as such academically harder, there are more knots in Sapper and explosives math is a shit show, but while you get a basic understanding of SUTs and mountaineering, you get actual training and certification in demolitions and breaching. That demo/breaching aspect is the big difference, I went back to my unit and was a breacher afterward.

[@j.taveras8447]

@@vernonbigham4760 My Sapper school land nav was an individual event, I went in 2001 iirc. And I agree, the waterborne phase was brutal, I kept saying these emeffs think we're Seals or some shit, 5 mile zodiac boat runs, hours of cap size, boat flood clearing drills, man recovery etc...fuq my life... Still, hours and hours of getting smoked on the rocks during zero week at Ranger school still gives me nightmares.

[@vernonbigham4760]

@@j.taveras8447 I went in 2007 when I was a drill sergeant as an infantry guy who already went thru Ranger as well. The swim and land nav were done in teams not sure when it switched over.

[@MarvinThomas-nw3yi]

Dude, you got me. Great information put together concisely, then you gut-punch me with that "...then they were expected to do math." I'm glad I didn't have a mouthful of coffee. 🤣

[@coopsrolling5896]

I'm a navy veteran. Pops was an army Vietnam vet. And that was the best I've ever heard someone break down army schools . I now understand

[@GallowsPole805]

That Ranger tab is for getting promoted. That Sapper tab is for saving lives.

[@robertisham5279]

How so? Is the Ranger not useful aside from getting getting promoted?

[@Jaeger04]

@@robertisham5279Ranger School is very much overrated. It’s basically just a leadership school where your body gets beat up. Ranger Tab itself is imo unnecessary unless you decide to go to RASP and do a tour in the 75th RR. Although unnecessary to be SF, it does help a lot with SUT and Leadership. Most 18Z’s and 18B’s I have met have the tab.

[@kennethponder3883]

SAPPER is a joke! Simple as that!

[@VictoryOrValhalla14]

Gtfo with that shit, sounds like you were too scared to attend.

[@TankRangerTek]

My ranger tab didn’t expedite any promotions at all.

[@sethq1478]

Nice video and explanation. God bless you man ♥Jesus loves you

[@GreenBeretChronicles]

Thanks, you too!

[@upsetters3156]

As a former infantryman I’ve always wanted to negotiate Sapper school. Respect to all Sappers 🫡

[@TheDivingBee23]

Look as a SeaBee I’m trying to get a seat at SAPPER only because it’s the premier elite tab for the Engineering community just like you said. Marines have completed SAPPER. To my knowledge no Bee has attempted

[@RogueSeabee]

I'm a seabee as well I didn't know who could do that

[@TheDivingBee23]

@@RogueSeabee So 12B deal more with demo but I have spoken to SAPPER school house and it falls back to our commands signing off on SRC if there’s a seat we can go. I’m at LOGSU so they’re more willing than Bn

[@RogueSeabee]

@@TheDivingBee23 oh ok. Will ask my chain thanks

[@TheDivingBee23]

@@RogueSeabee reach out to the school house, see if there’s a seat get the CANTRAC Id number, start date, get a POC preferably a SSgt or if you can the Ops Sgt. Put all of that on SRC and hopefully it works out. I’m doing same on my end. What Bn are you with?

[@RogueSeabee]

@@TheDivingBee23 im with NMCB-5. Thanks for the info

[@TSPLY]

When you see someone with a Sapper tab you already know they are extremely competent in their craft. With ranger tabs ( not scrolls) you sometimes question how that person made it 😂

[@ZeusRanger75]

Bro they really need to limit the number of times individuals can recycle in general. I say that all the time ‘how the F*** did this guy pass Ranger school’

[@lelandgaunt9985]

Ion know Brogan wasn’t that bright.

[@j.taveras8447]

Bullshit on all levels. I've seen incompetent "how the fuq he made it" rocks everywhere...Battalion, Seals, SF, all have idiots., and the engineering battalion is damn near all idiots. Few places in my experience without idiots....PJs, MARSoc, Tier 1

[@adamjam9541]

Mad respect for anyone who TABS

[@hnguye22]

Army has three schools. SF, Ranger, and Sapper. Any of these. You're A BAD ASS!

[@josephcote1227]

I loved that course. Former 12B then 37F. Now Space Force civ. Went from a E-5 to GS14-O-5 (civ) level. The world is interesting.

[@rex8255]

See if you can get in touch with Jack Zweig, Sapper School might be something he'd be interested in guiding some of his recruits to.

[@thomasgomez7516]

Sapper school is tough. My old platoon sergeant from Campbell was an Airborne Ranger. Went to Air Assault School and Pathfinder school as well. Failed out of Sapper school. Back when I was a 12 Bravo, 99-2005, they couldn't wear the Sapper Tab. Then it became a Department of the Army school and everyone that went got to wear their tab. It aint no joke. Much respect to those that went and earned it.

[@timothyfrisby6508]

Anybody can fail out of any school. SF soldiers, SEALS, Para Rescue, Sappers etc. have all failed out of Ranger School at one time or another. Just respect all the TABS and INSIGNIAS.

[@Valleycommando-d9g]

In the U.K., the Corp with the highest pass rate for SAS and SBS are the Royal Engineers, majority do come from 9 para Sqn or 59 commando Sqn, we don’t send a lot of staff, like the Royal Marines and the parachute regiment, but those allowed to attend selection want it the most and are the best in the unit. Difference in the U.K. in the engineers, is we are all combat sappers first, then go onto trade training, you can then go to a regular unit or volunteer for commando or para support, but you have to complete their courses, AACC- All Arms Commando Course or P- company ,both are gruelling courses to wear the coveted green or red beret

[@parawill7074]

Sapper School would definitely be the course I would have chosen because it would have made me a more versatile infantryman and support soldier learning those engineering skills. I learned during my career that Ranger School was more of a prestigious personal accomplishment than something really tangible. If I didn't have my injuries early in my career, I would have bypassed Ranger School and went straight to SF selection, because I'm not interested in learning how much suck I can handle and get sent back to my unit once I graduate to stand around a number of other guys with the same thing. Oh no, I'm trying to be the guy that does the specialized job that most won't do. You put all that effort into training and preparing for such a tough course, and you don't want to go SF or another SOF unit first? I get the career path and all of that, but I'm just saying. Smart move to do Sapper because you are 100% correct about the Q course teaching you small unit tactics. That's why I always looked at team guys sideways who volunteered to go to Ranger School. I was like "Why? You already have your PhD in this business, so why you trying to get a Bachelor's degree?". I get all the personal desire to do it and check the box, but I viewed being an SF operator beyond schools that don't really make you better at your job. Sapper made perfect sense for an 18C, but I don't see the benefit for any other SF operator to attend Ranger School while they are in group. Again, I get the passion behind it, but I'm putting my energy towards my SF job or I'm getting my ass kicked trying to get into CAG. Just my .02 cents.

[@Frank-uw5xq]

Just for that Tower of Power baby. It goes back to the old culture, back in the day Ranger & even Airborne, was only for elite infantry, Rangers, SF,.now a lot go for Leadership to Rank, or for a recruiting experience

[@parawill7074]

@@Frank-uw5xq - Yeah, I know. More power to them if they want to chase it, but if I'm already SF and didn't go before, I ain't going now. Lol

[@robertisham5279]

@@parawill7074 How would you be a more versatile infantryman and support soldier if you went to sapper school?

[@parawill7074]

@@robertisham5279 - Learning and testing yourself with a new skill set where you could utilize it if faced with a situation where your unit would need a subject matter expert that isn't readily available. An infantryman doesn't need Ranger School to be an effective leader. You can learn all the planning and squad tactics at your unit, and the expectation to perform on the battlefield doesn't change at all. Now, you give me a couple of infantryman or a support soldier assigned to a combat arms unit with Sapper training and now I have some guys that I could utilize which could make my unit more versatile in combat operations, especially with using demo (I would send them to advance courses as well). The battlefield is changing and infantry units need 11Bs with a variety of skills that take them beyond just having infantry skills. Engineers support the infantry, but there are benefits to having personnel who have engineer skills who would be capable of planning missions that would normally need engineer assistance, but could be potentially handled themselves.

[@tillmen4444]

I think this post by TFVooDoo tells why many still go and need to go to Ranger school after the Q-course. Why Go Back To High School When I Already Graduated College? I’ve had quite a few guys over the last few weeks ask me about Ranger school for Green Berets. When should you go, is it worth it, why go back a level? I know that we’ve tangentially had this discussion before, but not as a separate thread. So here goes. First, Ranger school is not a ‘step back’ from the Q course. The high school to university analogy just isn’t valid in this case, no matter how many times it gets repeated. The guys who spout this nonsense are the same guys who say they don’t need to take any college courses because they already got a “PhD in UW from the school of hard knocks”. Or even worse, Pineland U! Fucking weirdos. Ranger school is THE premier small unit tactics school. Not just in the Army or the US, but in the world. I know that this is a grandiose statement, but it’s true. I’ve surveyed all of the big ones, talked to graduates and instructors, and I’ve even been an instructor in some. There are some good ones out there. Tough, austere, rigorous. But none are better than the US Ranger school. The quality of instruction, the quality of instructors, the training environment and resourcing. The best. We’ve wrung every ounce of efficacy out of it. Unmatched. I know that Ranger school is a “leadership school” and open to all now. So by default it’s less than and doubly so because they let chicks in and they lowered the standard and it’s all RI Roulette and fuck that noise. Keep making excuses, you tabless bitches. So why go down to the Benning School for Wayward Boys (Fort Moore just doesn’t have the alliteration!) if all Green Berets already go through SUT during the Q? I’ll grant that the SUT training in the Q is absolutely top notch. It always has been and I’m hearing reports that it’s getting better, which is hard to do. It is phenomenal training. My SUT Cadre was SFC Paul LeFavor…yes, that LeFavor…so I know I was trained by the best. He was incredibly knowledgeable, very demanding, and a top-tier instructor. But… A key component to SUT is repetition. You need to see multiples TTPs, under multiple conditions, with multiple variables, and different teammates. The Principles of Patrolling are very broad and good instruction creates a box to learn in. So the more times that you can bounce around inside that box the better you can understand the topic. SUT (I know the Phase is labeled Tac Skills, but the tac skill is SUT) in the Q is only a few weeks AND you’re dealing with many non-combat arms guys or really inexperienced guys. So the training, for as good as it is, is governed by the lowest common denominator. Ranger school is 8 weeks (more…if you want it!) is hyper focused, and you will get multiple leadership positions across multiple levels, guaranteed. In the Q it’s not unheard of to only get one look at a Squad Leader or above graded patrol. Quantity has a quality all its own and you simply can’t replace the power of repetition. I’ve talked to multiple recent Q course grads and their grasp of SUT is good, but not nearly as good as it needs to be. My old Team Sergeant, a former 75th guy and mountain RI would blow a gasket, though. He would berate you if you called a transport tightening system a trucker’s hitch….IYKYK. Made a junior Bravo cry once. That’s a good enough barometer for me. The problem is that Ranger school is a suckfest. There is no other way of putting it. You are going to get smashed. You have to swallow your pride and do somebody else’s pushups. It’s humbling if not downright humiliating. And the mantle of shame if you go and fail? It can be too much for many. So many senior guys are reluctant to submit to this. It’s human nature. Completely understandable. But they are misguided in their thinking. All Green Berets need to become experts in SUT, and a few weeks in Pineland just isn’t enough. Every JCET that you go on is focused on Advanced Light Infantry Tactics or whatever the current popular vernacular is. FID, and its wartime counterpart UW, is SUT-centric. Could you learn SUT with a concerted focus during team training? Maybe. Could you get just as much by doing an in-depth analysis and study of doctrine, training manuals, and smart books? Nope. Are there SUT SMEs with no Ranger tab? Yes. But why fiddle-fuck with a bunch of half measures? Just swallow your pride and go to Ranger School. Learn from the best in the best environment. Are you elite or not? Why not Sapper school? It’s just as good, right? Nope. Sapper school is good, no doubt. But it’s not Ranger school. It’s just not as credible, either with your US counterparts or definitely not with our allies and partners. It’s just not. Perception matters. So when should you go? The answer is that you should go as soon as possible. It makes no difference to your chances of getting selected, even though a Ranger tab is a good predictor of success (correlation not causation). But you should go at your first opportunity. It will definitely put you in a strong position for the Q course since you will have all of that experience to help you during Tac Skills, but also sends a message of credibility. It’s not infallible, but it’s marked. If you don't go prior to SFAS, then go as soon thereafter as possible. You'll be a stronger asset for your team. And I would be remiss if I didn’t cite the 3 Rules. There is nothing that looks cooler than the venerable Triple Canopy. The stacked Airborne, Ranger , and Special Forces tabs just look cool as fuck. I submit that it looks better than the 4 tabs of adding a Sapper (or God help us an aRcTiC, jUnGLe, or President’s Hundred tab). Always look cool. I also recognize that I come from a prehistoric age when silly things like colorful patches held higher esteem than normal. A pre-GWOT mindset where training was everything because there were no wars (for the record, I’m pre, mid, and post GWOT and I’m still ‘in the fight’, so I get it). Then we spent two decades of sustained combat in multiple theaters, so Ranger school took a backseat for many that looked at deployments, CIBs, and combat patches as better options. Well, guess where we are now? Post-GWOT. And we’re returning to the Army of old. Suck it, zoomers! There it is, your answer about Ranger school and Green Berets. Am I biased? Probably. Am I right? Absolutely. I’ll close with more words of wisdom from my Team Sergeant, “You’ve either got a tab or a story, and nobody wants to hear your fucking story.” Ruck Up Or Shut Up

[@michaelmichaelagnew8503]

I was a combat engineer for 2 years before I switched to the Air Force. You can be both a Sapper and a ranger. Sapper is a specialty school for combat engineers. Allot of Sappers usually go to ranger school too if they can.

[@REMOTEDESTROYER]

The Space Ranger in your thumbnail, I went to pre-Ranger with him. Most solid guy I’ve ever met

[@ExpatriatePaul]

I never went to Ranger school because I already knew what it was like to be tired, cold and hungry, and I knew that an Op Order had 5 paragraphs.

[@paulleach3612]

All British Royal Engineers are trained as Sappers before heading off to do their final trade course. An entire Corps full of deranged individuals, with vices that would make the 3rd Earl of Rochester blush, and with an unhealthy fascination with H.E. (If you nibble on a little bit of plastic explosive while busy cutting about, CE4 was my favourite, it helps combat fatigue.)

[@intrepidapollo]

Never knew that. Thank you for the explanation.

[@shawnmckenna3288]

I wish they had this when I was in. I was a. 1l2B and later a 12F!

[@TheLAGopher]

Ranger school could also be looked upon as a little redundant to a person who is Special Forces qualified. Ranger school is a small unit leadership course. Sapper is a specialized skillset .A person who got Special Forces qualified as a young troop, and is in the SF branch could look at Ranger school as not increasing ones chances of promotion as a Green Beret while Sapper course would be looked upon as a form of cross training for someone who is not a SF Engineer Sergeant.

[@meligoth]

My first uni was the 317th Eng Bn, 24th ID at Ft. Benning (mid 90s). I have never in my entire stint seen a unit full of high speed troops. Many of my experienced peers (Somalia by many) were hitting air assault and sapper schools and crushing it. Eventually I had my first taste of deployment with them,but I never felt more assured being with the best a new private can be with.

[@TheBizziniss]

I was in 317 eng bn when it was disbanded on Kelly hill, ft Benning. The unit was folded into 2/69 armored. That was 2004 I believe.

[@meligoth]

@TheBizziniss that was my first unit that left a great impression on me, and aside the 44th Eng Bn in Korea (also long gone) no other unit was as battle ready as those two.

[@duganashley1337]

Ranger school is like a slow marathon, sapper school is like a sprint.

[@overlordisgoogle8431]

I subbed. Thank you for sharing your journey!

[@josephcote1227]

I joined in 2008 as a 12B and attended Sapper School in 2010. Literally had females crying in the field and trying to quit. I never had my chem light broken and was told, come back. I’m now 40, fit, and work for the Space Force as a civilian. The Sapper Leader book lives in my truck. Let me back. That shit is forever a point of bitterness in my career. DoD for more than 16 years now.

[@josephcote1227]

Who cares. I’m an old head. Can probably out PT Sapper Leaders of today. Let’s test it.

[@davidspin5353]

92-94 I was at Fort Leonard Wood, never new much about Sappers. HOOAH !

[@IvanhoeWolfe-zn6fc]

That's strange. To me Sapper was well known. But few went through it. Though we also were not allowed to wear the tab. However, one bonus to engineers Is, you don't see people that say they were. When they were not. Lol. BTW I'm not saying you were wrong. Just to me Sapper was well known. Just few did it.

[@davidspin5353]

@@IvanhoeWolfe-zn6fc I was only in for 2.5 years so didnt see much, just Fort Leonard Wood.

[@diIbert]

Sapper is a very dangerous job in a near-peer war.

[@eddieBoxer]

Sapper school is for Engineers, not Infantryman, Ranger school is for any MOS. Been there, retired 11b / airborne / Ranger.

[@WalterRutledge-l9i]

If I'd been born ten years sooner, I might have gone into the Corps of Engineers 'cause my Granddaddy wore the Castle (and railroad tracks) during WWI. The cool thing about Engineers is they're not expecting you to spend the whole war trying to kill people. Most of your time is spent building cool stuff while the other guys are trying (and failing) to kill YOU. Unfortunately I came of age in the Nixon era and didn't trust him to send me to the right wars anymore than the two Commanders -in-Chief before him, so I took my degree in math and went to work at the Federal Highway Administration, with its strong contingent of Corps of Engineers alums and (pun intended) a salting of Seabees. Now I'm retired and nothing but a recovering bureaucrat 😊 !

[@JelMain]

A year with RMRE was work-up to what they wanted me for, SAS Field Handler. That didn't work, because I was as good as they thought and discovered why the slot was open, political betrayal. BUT, the idea behind it was unstoppable, and you've started to listen to us about Tier One competence, the ability backed by knowledge to change the world.

[@jimmyboy131]

I wanted to be a combat engineer, so I probably would have wanted to go to the sapper school, too. Wasn't medically qualified to sign up so of course never did it. But I became a different kind of engineer professional, so I guess there's that. :)

[@warlord562]

How you weren't medically qualified

[@jimmyboy131]

@@warlord562 I needed to take regular medication for certain issues. Also had a slight curvature in my spine.

[@lelandgaunt9985]

You didn’t miss anything, 12B is a good mos to get your foot in the door at BK.😂

[@MrSanford65]

I did two tours in Iraq as a combat engineer. It was as a third rotation so we looked for IEDs , and various infantry tasks . But I think in an initial assault force being a combat engineer is very dangerous because you are the first ones in…

[@techno6467]

"Now they were expected to do math" Terrifying

[@derrick9653]

You know? Looking back many years after getting out and feeling all the pain that the high-speed go-fast stuff leads to, if I had to do it again, I think I'd rather be that guy who hands out towels and basketballs in the AF gyms. Those dudes had it made...

[@jackwalker9492]

Best school I went to and the Sapper Handbook is slightly more practical than the Ranger Handbook.

[@savoirfaire5460]

I went to Air assault when I was in the 25th ID I was on the Air Borne list till I reenlisted I got to the 4th ID and we spent all the time going to NTC the only way you could go to Sapper or Air Borne was to leave the 4thID

[@benburrowes8767]

Very interesting, thank you

[@barrysmith1202]

as i suspected, the Vietnam military still has the only sapper training for night infil, sneaking thru the wire, sentry removal, sabotage, etc, as a basic course (not some Tier, ad hoc, post-operator practices)

[@mikesmith7497]

where can you learn about Vietnam's sapper course?

[@barrysmith1202]

@@mikesmith7497 no idea. i'm 68, read and hear dozens of stories about Viet Cong Sappers making it past WHATEVER FireBase perimeter defenses, (''GOOKS INSIDE THE WIRE!!!"), to do lots of damage. largely suicidal. good luck finding current VN 'military' online. i suspect that such specific training would only be conducted, once well into a real war.

[@lelandgaunt9985]

Now it’s all woke, stress cards maternity uniforms.🙄🤣

[@Rockin_Ross]

I was 12B at Ft. Ord in 90-93 and when I was up for reenlistment, asked for Sapper. As Ord was closing, I couldn’t get schools until we went to Ft. Lewis in Washington. Bye bye Sapper, hello ETS. Not the career choice I wanted, but what choice did I have?

[@d.rcarrera6599]

Based on the information I have found, Ranger School is a 62 days long course and Sapper School is only 28 days long. This, in my opinion, is a huge difference.

[@CoachPlags]

I'm NG but have already dropped my packet for Sapper school. And I've been told that Ranger school is a marathon while Sapper is a sprint

[@michaelsanchez9594]

Sappers make things go boom. Making things go boom is fun. I think that sums it up for anyone interested.

[@millennialsleadtheway5453]

Not for the weak or faint of heart

[@sellickusa]

Well for an 18C, Sapper makes more sense than Ranger school.

[@gbrockwell5619]

As a NBC Spc in a 12b company I was told you must be a 12b to goto sapper school and at the time it was two weeks. The guys would go to ft Lynwood for it. The funny things is that a basic training post and if you are a non NCO you are expected to act like a private and basic training. so I was told…

[@lelandgaunt9985]

Nope

[@lifeisa.smalllesson333]

When i was at Bragg, UDT was the most elite school, then Sapper, then HALO.

[@Vato-Psyko-Loko]

I was a combat engineer at Ft. Stewart Georgia from 1992 to 96. Never saw a Sapper tab in my life.

[@brett76544]

It was not a reconized tab or DOD school back then, but it was fun as hell.

[@Vato-Psyko-Loko]

@@brett76544 you went thru it??? what years??? I remember when an NCO first mentioned it and I was like ... what the hell is that??? can I go???

[@brett76544]

@@Vato-Psyko-Loko it was CSM Karon was at the 8th, 94 or so. no tab on uniform, but no DOD school status. It was more hands on. Even after it started as a DOD school nothing for past grads.

[@MrBodyguard380]

I finished Ranger school before most of y’all were born. That was in the real Army. Long before the “all volunteer” Army came into existence. I finished after my first tour of duty in Vietnam, 68-69. My 2nd tour was with the 5th SFG, 70-72. Transferred to the 8th SFG the end of 72 and was an instructor at the Jungle Operations Training Center, Ft. Sherman, CZ. I’ve known Sappers and have respect for a few of them. But I have go with the wisdom of age and experience and say, “Ranger’s lead the way”.

[@malcolmedwards1472]

Love these recaps!!

[@ShriekingCrows-bp3vh]

Sappers clear the way! 12B here.

[@cm-pr2ys]

What about the Expert Infantryman Badge? Be interesting to see what you think about that.

[@theirishhammer9451]

You have to have the EIB to get the CIB.

[@Robert_H_Diver]

@@theirishhammer9451lol wrong

[@Napoleon1323]

Some services member have the special forces, ranger and sapper tab.

[@OttoMatieque]

I can't resist calling it SLAPPER

[@conquerordie230]

And if you have both tabs, remember that the Sapper tab is to placed above the Ranger tab boys and girls.

[@Frank-uw5xq]

Back in the day I saw a video of Sapper School, looks really cool,..my Dad said it looked legit, he's SF too

[@strongjaymusicgroup]

Not for the weak or faint hearted.

[@JohnTaylor-t9i]

Sappers and Rangers have always been a rival. A lot of sappers get Ranger qualified aand return to their sapper units just because. "Sapper school" is more of a leadership course and has less to do with combat engineer. 1987 RA SAPPER

[@juliandeacon8212]

Ranger school is not for the faint of heart. Period

[@DonaldGoodwin-y7n]

Once a Engineer always a Engineer

[@jimmy-zr1bt]

19D 2/16 INF unit HQ Custer Hill in 1984.

[@petediggs8850]

👍🏽 up to good old Junction City KS.

[@d.rcarrera6599]

It seems like this school is tailored for Combat Engineers and not necessarily Infantry..

[@robkamman4578]

As a former 51B, from 249th Engineer Bn, 18thth Engineer Bde what did the course entail? is there a video of what is taught in Sapper School? I was in Desert Shield and Desert Storm.

[@lelandgaunt9985]

Hello brother 51😊

[@1900MAR]

Did anybody had to take the ASVAB just to be in ranger school, or was anyone drafted to the program

[@MAC-tv6zq]

Still, the "Red and White" will never trump the prestige of the "Black and Gold."

[@austinshannon4197]

It’s hard to believe the Steelers are 2 and 0.

[@rbenke]

COOK tab is next. No math in ranger school so not really worth it. You learn all that ranger stuff in basic anyway. Actually, those regular army cooks are like gods. No shit. Come at me. Class 5-88 :)

[@3mindgame]

Great Video!

[@Jdelli0916]

Why not both?

[@duttyboukman6854]

12 Bravo hooah .. sapper steel 💪🏾💪🏾

[@cjjonez]

Never heard or seen this tab.

[@TheReysinhell]

Thats freakin cool! Sapper!! i like it

[@genecps]

I’m a bountyhunter. Next level of training for me (since I had a high risk entry / warrant service course) is swat course. Seems like a natural progression in training.

[@mikesmith7497]

Where would you recommend taking courses? Do you know any good instructors on the west coast.

[@genecps]

Direct Action Group in Huntington Beach. Progressive Force Concepts in Las Vegas. Google. Lots in Cali.

[@mikesmith7497]

@@genecps Thankyou

[@lelandgaunt9985]

Redditor

[@mikesmith7497]

@@lelandgaunt9985 Your a Redditor?

[@Mocha69A]

Just because your in a mechanized unit doesn't mean you walk everywhere. Don't get it twisted.mechanized Infantry also do alot of rucking and they also dismount and clear the battlefield.

[@jameskerrigan2997]

Just get both and get above E-7 or drill badge and get stuck at E-8 work in s shop😂

[@rustyshaklefurd4700]

Rancher school used to be one of the most respected courses offered in the military until they lowered the standards to accomodate women

[@elevenb6967]

"Rancher school used to be one of the most respected courses offered in the military until they lowered the standards to accomodate women" Yeah man, I heard those Black Angus bulls are terrors. 😀

[@rustyshaklefurd4700]

@@elevenb6967 normally id call it a typo bc i hate phone keyboards but i was drunk af when i commented...

[@elevenb6967]

@@rustyshaklefurd4700 I was just giving you shit. But yeah, women going to RS is pretty much insignificant, if they're lowering the standards just for them. We know when we see them, what the real deal is.

[@rustyshaklefurd4700]

@@elevenb6967 also to clarify i dont blame women in any way, the school or any course for that matter should be open to all that can hack it. However across the board we are seeing a decline in military standards, a good example is airborne school at ft moore. Its insane how they have lowered the bar to pass more students

[@elevenb6967]

@@rustyshaklefurd4700 😫Ugh

[@Mark-r2z9u]

What MOS should attend Pathfinder and Calvary Scout school, respectively, instead of Ranger school?

[@lelandgaunt9985]

Cav scout is a mos…

[@ChrisHansen5.56x45]

I shouldve became a 12bravo they always had the most fun out in the field and a few of them just wore whatever tf they wanted on there heads im talking curved truckers cap with Peltors lol

[@robertisham5279]

Any thoughts regarding those who attended both ranger and sapper school?

[@QuisUtDeus828]

As an MP I always thought sappers were high speed. Sadly we didnt have any cool green side schools. All our achools were focused on our Law and Order mission which is only 1 of 5 MP functions, the other 4 are all combat / combat support stuff. And the schools we had got you put in a garrison unit. I hated the garrison I joined for the green side stuff in 05 as an army brat, I just wanted to be more comfortable during that green side 😂

[@navrhy3075]

Do marines go through sapper school?

[@FtLivingRoomHomestead]

Custer Hill, Charley 2/16 INF, 1994, Hooah!

[@ERCowboy1776]

Ranger school. Even girls can do it!! Yay!!

[@charlespowell5847]

What are the soldiers in the video, JROTC 😂

[@WSNight-]

Ever job is not for everyone people up here comparing is lame, if i wanted to be a mechanic and excelled at it than im happy ,if i wanted to be infantry and excellee at that than im happy. This real life not everyone wants to join to jump out planes and be on call to leave thier family yes we need people like that but just because someone doesn't wont want to do that, it does not make them less of a patriot or sailor or soldier, they called elite force for a reason its not meant for everyone especially as you get order and have kids you just want your war to be over and enjoy your family.

[@willholly7526]

Can't do both?

[@spencer5143]

Question from someone who isn’t military.. but why can’t you just go to both schools and have both tabs?

[@michaelmichaelagnew8503]

You can if your a combat engineer. They can do both Sapper and Army Ranger school. You usually do Air assualt and Airborne too before these schools as well.