Real or Fake: Montblanc 264

[@pasttenseSara]

I can completely relate to your dilemma. However, 2 years is a long time to keep such a lovely pen 'under wraps'. Like other's have alluded, you appear to have a genuine Montblanc, and a very nice version of the 264 with a terrific flexy nib. The resin hue is correct and the band marking are consistent for the period. And like you write ... none of the doubt really matters. It's a wonderful pen ... that happens to be a gorgeous Montblanc! ;)

[@adventuredenali]

Rick Hoover it is a wonderful pen! Thank you so much for your input. It is too long a time. I used to keep it at work, but wouldn’t let anyone borrow it (that’s what the twsbis were for!), the nib was just too precious to run the risk of damage.

[@pasttenseSara]

@@adventuredenali Continue enjoying that beautiful pen! It's a keeper!

[@anniliu3876]

Would you consider making a beginner's guide to vintage pens video? Or a video with some tips for folks interested? It is really hard to tell what to look for and what prices are reasonable. Thanks! Love your videos, by the way, and Little Bean!

[@adventuredenali]

anni liu hello! I could certainly try to put something together, although to be honest, I myself am still stumbling around in the vintage realm. It’s a difficult world to penetrate, haha! If you have any specific questions, maybe I can at least give you an answer in the meantime time!

[@anniliu3876]

@@adventuredenali Thank you, that's very kind of you! One thing I would love to know where you've found reputable sellers. I know of Peyton Street Pens and Vintagepen.net--are there any you'd particularly recommend? Or any small sellers on ebay/etsy?

[@nadines.1107]

Yes, pleaaaase, I would love that!

[@josedominguez1965]

Two cap bands , the fonts are correct, straight section, blue ink view window, a beautifully aged snow peak that is a real 264 the nib size should be imprinted on the blind cap. Don’t be embarrassed of a pen that you enjoy using . I use use a Parker jotter and a zebra g30 I think it’s called as my throw around pens. Don’t use that as a throw around pen though.

[@adventuredenali]

JOSE DOMINGUEZ thank you so much for your feedback! Extremely helpful. I will enjoy and honor this lovely pen. Glad to know a bit more about it.

[@gabem.2249]

Looks legit and you did the right tests as far as I know...like some people have said, trying to trace back the year and legitimacy is hard with a lot of the older mbs. I think you got a wonderful find!

[@adventuredenali]

Gabe M. Thank you for your input! I think I lucked out, my impulsive purchase did indeed leave me with a wonderful pen.

[@ahmadzaid3943]

I think your Montblanc 264 fountain pen is authentic. everything about it is just unmistakable from the resin shine against light and the red color when you back light it to the gold nib and gold painting of the clip and the bands. the lettering and the snowflake are just typical of this particular pen and what makes it more interesting and adding to its authenticity is that this model is one of the older models that are not any more produced. I think this pen is magnificent and genuine.

[@jthunder57]

Barry Gabay is one of the Montblanc experts in the hobby. He also has a column in Pen World magazine. He thinks your pen is a Montblanc 254.

[@andrewtongue7084]

Joe, it's not a 254 ( I happen to own two of them)- they had slip caps, not screw types.. :)

[@cuauhtemocmedina]

Your pen looks perfectly real: it happens that model 264 was a cheap model, aimed to the mass market, rather than the 100 series or Meisterstuck which had a high quality plastic and very precise production standards. This was an entry level pen, so its appearance is different from modern MB pens conceived today as a luxury brand, despite that the feeder is indeed bakelite and very consistent with late s feeders. Furthermore, there is no significant market for low tier pens like yours, so producing a fake would be entirely irrational. If this were a fake it would be a truly work of art. You can find a nice review of your pen at: www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/topic/234216-50s-montblanc-264/ Enjoy your beautiful pen!

[@teresa8287]

I so appreciate your candor and willingness to help others learn! Thank you!

[@adventuredenali]

Teresa thank you and you’re welcome! The biggest mistake was simply not doing my research first before making the purchase. I was just so eager to grow my newly forming vintage collection, I’d see a shiny thing and feel the impulse to bring it home, no questions asked! In the end, it still resulted in adding a very solid pen in to the bunch. It’s got a wonderful nib, and has been a workhorse of a pen. Took a long time to consider that I could just post here and ask! Of course! This KZbin is a resource, use it, haha! XD

[@raybeckon1235]

This is genuine. At that time they weren't using modern lasers to etch the band. The tiny montblanc symbol in the band is a stylized, minimalist way to represent the star in such a tiny area with old tech. Great find and the nib's a gem. Enjoy your pen!

[@NightWaveChannel]

I'm pretty sure this pen is legit. I have muliple Montblancs and a friend who has a 264 too, it looks the same. The font of the engraving looks real too, the snowflake is maybe a bit overpolished by the vendor. Great fountain pen, I like their felxible nibs too and a great video. Thanks for that! ;)

[@adventuredenali]

Night Wave thank you so much for your help! I thoroughly appreciate it! :D this is a great writer, regardless.

[@nolawalter6273]

There was no laser etching in the 60s. It would have been had engraved. The first laser etching was in the 70s

[@andrewtongue7084]

Exactly right, Nola !! :)

[@wajidmalik5487]

Don't feel heartburn. This is a genuine Mont Blanc. No need to feel embarrassed.

[@ichirofakename]

Small point of info, the "585" means 58.5% gold. For reasons mysterious to me it seems this duplicate info is always stamped, along with "14k", on gold nibs. Thanks to all the commenters who proved it's genuine, despite my doubts that the cap band looked bogus.

[@angelynnV08]

Thank you! i got my pens today and cant seem to see the illuminated red resin. i followed what you did and saw the red now. Went to MB boutique earlier and they confirmed my pen are authentic. But am happier as I can see now the illuminated red.

[@inharmonik]

Looks totally legit to me. Sky slope feed is ebonite.

[@adventuredenali]

kevin parks thank you for the information! Very helpful. :)

[@inharmonik]

Thanks for the fun videos. I love the old pens too. Super old desk. How is that vintage waterman ink? Would love to find some.

[@VampireKa1n]

I have one I got from a reputable dealer at the Chicago Pen Show two years ago. Looks the same, the snowflake is just like that. Your nib has a bit of a different design, but I think mine is older than 60s. They must have changed it. I wanna say I paid like $250 for mine.

[@adventuredenali]

Mike D okay that sounds about right. I paid $200. Thanks for your input! Sounds like a legit. It’s always been an enjoyable writer, despite the questioning!

[@timelybehaviour5318]

I love it. Looks the genuine article me lady

[@boop8621]

It looks pretty authentic, but several things concern me: 1. There should be an imprint of the model# on the piston nob 2. I've seen legit models of the 264 with and without a white mont blanc stamping on the barrel mountain included (so that's a toss up). 3. I have not seen a double ring on the 264 but I have on the 254, nor have I seen cap band engravings on either model. Also, My understanding is this from the mid 50's. The 60's models,which I have, are very different in design

[@adventuredenali]

Boop yes, there are absolutely no markings on the body, which is what I’ve seen in other 264s. It’s eluded me, there’s doesn’t seem to be anything definitive. Although, reading through the comments, seems the majority seem to argue it’s real.

[@mevrouwdebeer]

It is a real pen that writes! A real Mont Blanc would be too big to keep in your desk ;) Apologies for the dad jokes, I am compensating for all the missed Saturday family dinners since the lock down. I have a green striped 144 that is unlikely to be a replica (got it from a friend and it used to be her fathers and it is bought in 1955), mine also has a yellowish star, my fond also looks like that, very rough and drilled, only my feed looks very different in shape, but also looks like it is plastic. I have no idea if the feed is supposed to be plastic or not btw. Your pen looks very good and also that you enjoy using it. If it is a replica, then how can they get such good quality? Or maybe only some parts are replicated, but that also would not really make sense.... such a mistery... Enjoy your day! and your pen!! Greetings from the Netherlands.

[@adventuredenali]

Rianne Francis ahahaha your jokes had me laughing out loud, an authentic “lol” moment Thank you for your input! Very helpful. The thought occurred to me as well that the pen could have borrowed parts. The nib is luxurious to write with, which wouldn’t make sense for a knock off. I couldn’t figure out any information in regards to feed material either. 1950/1960s can go both ways, ebonite or plastic I think.

[@Altusiam]

I looked around and I've seen two posts on ebay with the similar "unfinished" star like yours has. Hopefully someone with experience on Montblanc pens can tell you more info!!

[@adventuredenali]

Tea_Tography thank you for your information! Very helpful.

[@SarcoidosisWarrior]

Looks genuine to me and I believe its late fifties.

[@stampedinhisimage1]

I wish I knew also because I bought a planner for $10.00 at an estate sale that had one in it. There was another planner for $13.00 that had another one in it. I figure at the price of these pens if legit, the planners would have been real leather. One was not and one may have been, I truly can't remember now. The pen I have is so light that I thought all along it had to be fake. I figured the genuine pen to weigh twice the weight almost of the one I bought. I do however wish I had bought the second planner just for the pen just in case. I went back on Sunday but the estate sale was closed. I grieved for a few months over that one; in fact I pass that way almost every weekday and I still wonder and wish over it.

[@paulschumacker9901]

My impression is that fake MB vintage pens are very rare. The fakes use gold plated nibs and black plastic- not the red resin in yours. The springiness in your nib isn’t consistent with a gold-plated steel nib. And the fakes don’t have the genuine piston fill system that yours has. The engraving on the gold band shouldn’t be laser-sharp, as that technology wasn’t being used then. So I think you can rest assured that it’s the real thing.

[@BASHER193]

The cap was most likely polished, that's why the font is weird. Just my guess

[@adrianhughes5831]

I am a bit hesitant to comment, because there will be lots of folk who know a lot more about these Mont Blanc pens than I do. The 25x and the 26x were introduced in the mid 1950's. Unlike the 25x series, the 26x was only produced in two sizes (264/262). In contrast to the 25x series it featured a screw on cap and a traditional shaped nib and the larger 256 version. From your video the nib and (ebonite) feed look entirely correct. Your (earlier) version has two cap bands and a blue ink window. I have a (later?) version with a single, un-engraved cap band and a clear ink window. The piston filling nob should be engraved with the serial number 264 and the nib size. I am not sure what to make of the quality of engraving on the cap band, but in all other respects, this looks a perfectly good MB264. You might like to look at some of the articles on the Fountain Pen Network which have some informative threads. Please don't worry too much about the provenance of the pen, and just enjoy it.

[@adventuredenali]

Thank you for taking the time to add in your two cents. Very helpful information. Yeah, no engraving on the body anywhere, all the “legit” models I’ve seen have that.

[@catwhisperer911]

Mountblanc apparently doesn't document every iteration/generation of a pen line, which makes it difficult to determine its lineage. I have a Montblanc 144, which is no longer manufactured, and I have been unable to determine which generation it is (there were three) because it seems to have properties that overlap the 1st and 2nd generation of the 144 line. That gold nib on yours looks legit and so does the resin and it writes like a dream.

[@adventuredenali]

Jeff Schwartz aah that would explain why it’s been difficult to find any solid information out there. I’ve looked at other sales listings for comparison, but that’s really the only information I’ve found in regard to the specific model. The seller I bought it from had no information. Thank you for your input, very appreciated. It is a dreamy nib to write with, which seems inline with the montblanc experience.

[@catwhisperer911]

@@adventuredenaliMy 144 writes buttery smooth but I actually wish it had more feedback which is why I rarely use it.

[@adventuredenali]

Jeff Schwartz I know exactly how you feel. My first vintage pen (Sheaffer Oversized Balance) was an amazing writer, with just the right amount of feedback to let you know it was there, making contact with the paper. It had cracked so I sent it to a local pen smith to have it repaired, and without asking, he had tuned the nib. Which, I appreciate the gesture, but the nib felt so different. It changed the whole experience. It’s still a wonderful pen and I wish I could use it now - but that pesky crack has since returned. :/

[@txjgb1]

I think when the pen is back lit it should look like the color of red wine

[@rmdcade1717]

I'm impressed you got such good video through a loupe!

[@adventuredenali]

RMD Cade me too, haha! It’s really quite awesome that I can do that. Saw another fountain pen you tuber doing it, thought I’d give it a go too.

[@eily_b]

They even fake the plastic Lamy Safari.... So everything is possible. And I guess a lot of Chinese knock-offs are around in all the ex-Soviet countries as they share borders with China. But I am not an expert at all just pointing out what could possibly be. Sadly. But if it's a fake one it is really well made, usually fakes are just manufactured sloppily and this one looks quite good regarding the logo etc.

[@adventuredenali]

Eily Bergin yeah that is true. The fact is, it’s a wonderful writer, and a very consistent and well built pen! Who knows what its story is. But, the mystery is half the fun. :)

[@Ortopedija1989]

Ok i got the same model like yours. Its really nice flexy nib. I like to write with. Fake or not fake? Have you find out?

[@c.s.johnson7691]

No your biggest concern is, what other people will think about your Mountblanc, and your decision to to purchase it. You can always send your pen to a factory representative to have your purchase validated.

[@adventuredenali]

C. S. Johnson haha, perhaps! You must understand, I came from an art community based hobby prior, in which associating with “knock offs” was the same, or worse than befriending the devil. It got pretty bloody. Plus, it’s embarrassing, I spent x amount of dollars on something I didn’t research first. I kind of just jumped in enthusiastically when I was only just beginning to establish a vintage collection.

[@RBullCZ]

There are fakes of 50's / 60's Montblancs? Franken pens pieced together from several broken "donor" specimen, yes, but "replica" of vintage MB? Or vintage replica made during 60's?

[@landlockedwy4603]

Could you do a video on what to look for if someone wanted to start collecting vintage fountain pens?

[@adventuredenali]

Sara Burnside I will try my best, it’s very tricky 1) because I still know very little about it all, and 2) there’s such an overwhelming amount of information! Hard to organize it all into something that makes sense. I just posted a video though about my journey, offering some of what I’ve learned, mistakes I’ve made, and some suggestions. I hope it’s helpful, I feel like it’s mostly just rambles, lol. -.-

[@landlockedwy4603]

AdventureDenali well your Instagram feed convinced me to finally take the plunge and purchase a refurbished typewriter. I have been looking for years and never purchased...I guess vintage fountain pens could be next

[@axiomist4488]

Whatever it is , it's beautiful and it writes like a charm . So dont hide it , just use it while you figure out whether it's legit . Find an expert who can figure it out . You could send it to Fountain Pen Hospital , in New York City . They sell anything to do with pens and also have a vintage dept. so if they buy them to sell, they have to know how to tell . Call them first and ask if they can check it for you . Then you send it in and youll finally clear the mystery and be able to live shame free . OK?

[@dhg5451]

Your pen is totally legit. It’s a 1950s Montblanc and shows it’s age, especially on the cap ring and piston nob (both of which seem to have been over-polished by a previous owner or repair person. Nib and materials used are all correct. By the way, hardly anyone was duplicating Montblancs in the 1950s, especially models in this somewhat lower to mid-range. Enjoy your pen. It’s a real Montblanc 264.

[@jennieeveleighlamond]

Completely off topic but what is the green pen more on the left of the screen? It is super beautiful! (I have no idea if your Montblanc is legit or not, I'm sorry that I can't contribute)

[@adventuredenali]

Jennie Eveleigh Lamond hey! That’s a Conklin Endura (standard size) in the speckled green from the 1920s. It’s a fantastic little pen, i love the conklins.

[@jennieeveleighlamond]

@@adventuredenali Thank you so much! And thank you for all your kind responses to my comments on your videos. I adore your content, and two videos uploaded today really made my day. I am thinking of expanding my pen collection to include some vintage pens, and really love the look of ones like that, so I will keep my eyes open for one in my price range when shops are allowed to open up again.

[@adventuredenali]

Jennie Eveleigh Lamond Esterbrook J Series might be a good starting place, they’re reliable, abundant, and a work horse of a pen made between the 1940s-1960s. Lots of colors and nib options. The Pen Addict wrote of them as the vintage Lamy Safari, as they were inexpensive, mass produced and easy to get a hold of. They’re charming and wonderful writers. Some shops to peak at that could help too would be: Peytonstreetpens.com LetteringWorld on Etsy ImpulseTradingCo on Etsy

[@adventuredenali]

Jennie Eveleigh Lamond I’ve had great experience with Conklin Endura pens. They seem fairly abundant, and when restored properly are very reliable and enjoyable writers.

[@goghfurther]

Do you have resources to start collecting fountain pens for beginners?

[@adventuredenali]

Katie Blundell I wish I had some concrete sources. It’s all a bit overwhelming isn’t it? I’m still trying to learn it all myself. I just made a video about my own journey, in hopes to help a bit. It’s rather rambling, but I tried to share some tips, suggestions, and personal mistakes, in hopes it can help In some way.

[@tinglestingles]

It's perfectly real.

[@nickturner2813]

I'm late to this party, only just found your channel, but, as others have said, the pen you have seems to be genuine and the "imperfect" inscription (in close-up) seems to be normal for that type of Montblanc, they weren't exactly Meisterstücks! The "585" inscription is not the nib number, it's just the gold content of the nib (58.5%), i.e 14-karat.

[@IAT1964]

Its the real deal. Everything about this matches. The period is from1955 to 1960. Remember, in that period Montblanc made different tier pens. The 264 is a second teir pen. Nowadays Montblanc only makes so called top tier pens. Feed is ebonite, the nib is flexible, the star yellows over time, and the fonts look good for the period. The clip has the right thickness, and no markings. Markings a d serial numbers came in later. Modern nibs dont have such wonderful flex (espacially a fake).

[@mikeiokhvin2853]

Original 264 (2nd generation). It’s not expensive pen from end of 1950th. This pen have not “special quality” of Meisterstück range of Montblanc. About your pen you can read here (biggest resource about MB pens): www.collectiblestars.com/Montblanc-II-Serie-no264-piston-filler-black-engraved-capring-with-MB-no PS Sorry for my English. I am from Russia

[@BrandochGarage]

Don't forget, they would not have had laser etching back in the 60's. I think the pen looks cool, as does that ink you are using. That Gentleman's Gazette guy states he had collected hundreds of Montblancs in the past. he'd probably be a good person to ask, although from the comments below, it looks like you might have gotten your answer already. Heck, I wish I had your problem. I'm worried about getting stuck with a fake Amazon Basics fountain pen... hahaha

[@adventuredenali]

Brandoch Garage hahaha you’re funny! XD Oh that’s a good call, I could reach out to him. A more recent comment seemed pretty confident it was a fake, so it’s still up for debate apparently, haha!

[@scubabeegl]

I think you’re being too hard on yourself. Genuine or not, that nib looks really sweet. I’d chalk it up as a win.

[@adventuredenali]

Bryan Levano thanks Bryan :) It is a wonderful writer, I’d say it’s a win too. :)

[@lyndasnart7823]

Lol my only ball point a montblanc lives under the same grey cloud ........is it isn’t it.........all I know is it feels like quality ...substantial in the hand for a ball point it is better to write with than most other pens that aren’t fountain pens 😝it ticks all the boxes for real except it took one doubt sayer to say it is a brand that people love to copy ....sssoooo many fake montblancs out there🥺',,,,,,,,,,,,,,,they are expensive it is a snob value brand etc etc lol and for normal folks it seems to own one ...they say maybe it is a fake ..............But if so a damned good imitation I say 😜 quality ...that grey cloud can ruin the pen just with doubt even when it’s a real pedigree..........funny be cause same person who said mine could be fake.......because I am by no means wealthy and pen was acquired like you second hand ..said about yours-on studying it for ages here ...That no that looks genuine for the time ...and the nib is def real ....... yet because mine is a ball point lol it will forever be in the grey area as far as he is concerned .......I rarely use a ball point but there are times out in the world where it is more suitable than one of my fountain pens ✒️ it’s pedigree always tarnished with no certificate ( I argue that can also be copied a fake aswell) lol 😂 Some well known brands really have real quality issues but people still buy because of brand. where yours in concerned ..... If it looks like a duck ...waddles like a duck ....sounds like a duck it probably is one ........lol sorry for rambling on but you made me relive my Mont Blanc grey area dilemma my poor well made pen who is tarnished for life with doubt but still gives better work than most sighhhhhh

[@adventuredenali]

Lynda Snart that’s the cloud! Such a funny little thing isn’t it. I hope you pull out that pen though, have a little writing session simply for the sake of it! :D

[@ainstolkiner2063]

Ill buy it from you

[@disfiguringthegoddes]

It is real

[@adventuredenali]

Disfiguring The Goddess thank you for your input, much appreciated!

[@scr5051]

Son muy caras

[@adventuredenali]

scr5051 very expensive?

[@scr5051]

Yea do you know spanish. Great interesting greetings. I like te calligraphy more chello please

[@adventuredenali]

Un poco - I wouldn’t count on it though haha más cello, maybe haha!

[@scr5051]

Little ......but i Like talk with you.

[@adventuredenali]

scr5051 we find a way ;)

[@Ortopedija1989]

ja, :))

[@Ftallabas]

First! ♥️ lol

[@adventuredenali]

Felix Tallabas yay xD

[@denmarkleopesi7108]

Looks fake. The nib imprint is not crisp enough, the threads on the barrel don't look warn enough for a pen that age even if it spent a long time in the drawer. While the colour of the star looks aged too, its shape feels a bit off. Finally the veins on the feed look much bigger than a montblanc. We would need a nice look under the clip to see, but I have my suspicion and would turn it down if it crossed my path

[@adventuredenali]

Denmark Leopesi thank you for your input! Seems I may never know for sure. Many have already said it’s legit. That’s okay though, it’s a wonderful writer, and that is its primary purpose after all.

[@IAT1964]

Older Montblancs did not have markings like modren ones. These things changed over time. You cannot apply the same rules. The feed is ebonite, 100% accurate for mid 1950's model. Modern plastic feeds have a much finer fin arrangement. These plastic feeds were introduced sometime in the 1990's

[@unboxingmontblanc4956]

Just on the point of logic, no company would go through the effort of reproducing a pen that is not immediately recognizable as an iconic montblanc. These older pens are just different. but i see why the nib imprint is off-putting. but if it writes well, that is enough to validate it.