POV: How to Use Third Person Limited

[@whakabuti]

This is personally a very frustrating method of writing for me. I keep slipping into an omniscient third person because i just can't colour the narrative of my characters and it's killing me. Thank you for the tips! I just wish I could write limited third person as easily as some other writers.

[@girv98]

I don't know what kinds of fiction you're into, but I think the ASOIAF series is a great example of a character driven, 3rd person limited narrative with tons of mystery. I've personally learnt a lot from it.

[@andrewgoldstein5319]

Three successful examples are: The Sniper/The Secret Life of Walter Mitty/Story of An Hour. They're all about documenting the internal life of a character and how that internal life changes over time.

[@kikin5922]

@@andrewgoldstein5319 could you help me with having dialogue in the 3rd person I’m a little confused about implementing it in while telling to story

[@tomkent4656]

It is not impossible to include the occasional 3PO scene involving characters other than your protagonist, but you must make sure that the scene takes place in a separate chapter. Also, you must avoid getting into the heads of any character in your 3PO scenes, just report action and dialogue.

[@Victoria-tf9bp]

Hello! I was originally planning to write my story in 1st person, following the 1st main character who was on the outside-looking-in part of the mystery. I was testing out a lot of scenes and I realized how important it was for me to have to internal thoughts of at least 1 other character. This 1 character is the antagonist for majority of the story. I was thinking of a really sentimental scene where the 2nd main character, (who was the mystery), would have a heart-to-heart moment with the antagonist and they would dissolve from enemies into friends. There were huge parts of the story that would be best written from the antagonist’s point of view. I discovered it would be impossible and even silly to have my 1st main character spying on my antagonist all the time because in the story the main character avoids the antagonist. Limited Omniscient would be the perfect narration for this. I also do want to get the point of view of the 2nd main character, so I can explain his story better. All in all, I will be going through the point of views of 3 characters. The 1st main character would be most of the time, especially in the beginning. The 2nd main character would be more than the antagonist sometimes and sometimes the antagonist more than him. Thank you so much, Reedsy!

[@wulfeb8674]

I love third-person limited because you can have intimacy with the character without the need to present the story as a retelling of events. For me, too much of the suspense is lost when the story is presented as having already happened.

[@arlenecastro521]

Tama ako sa second periodical test ko ty talaga

[@JoleCannon]

I have a question. I'm trying to do limited 3rd person for my mm. My first MC's physical attributes are described at the beginning of the story while he sits in a dance club. He's a large man who doesn't feel he fits in here. So, I describe his build, height/weight, and the thickness of his arms and legs. His wavy black hair (he runs his fingers through it) Later I describe the beard as he washes something out of it. When someone touches him, without permission, I describe how the other person shows disgust in feeling his body hair. I think this fits because the story revolves around this man wanting another larger set man. That's what he's attracted to. He's tired of seeing men like him who only want thin/athletic men. So, while he doesn't want to change who he is, he is hyperfocused on his size. Does this work for a limited 3rd? I don't want to do the mirror thing (he does look in a mirror, but it's for another reason).

[@shehnacheppilath6055]

Thank you.... I needed this for my tomorrow's exam

[@gauravvishalcrn28]

Thanks... Watching from India

[@garygreenfield-wm4hq]

Quick question…Would there be any issue going from 3rd limited to sprinkling in a little omniscient commentary to add a bit of humor, then clearly go back to the actual story with 3rd Ltd? Don't want to confuse peeps…and by peeps I don't mean those marshmallow birds at Easter! Thanks for all you do for us!

[@Reedsy]

It all comes down to execution! Your idea reminds me a bit of some Terry Pratchett, where he would have footnotes that are a bit more omniscient, providing context of his world (and sneaking in some extra gags)

[@brendancoulter5761]

Question about head hopping, If we are following the point of view of Character A but character A knows Character B very well, is it jarring for the narration to assume the thoughts and motivations of character B, even if they are only from character A's perspective? Or should we always clarify that is what character A thinks, not necessarily what is actually happening?

[@quillink3817]

Hello, I am confused about something, and would be very appreciative if you or someone knowledgeable here could help clarify, please. I am new to writing and am doing a lot of research on how to write stories. I have stumbled upon an issue that I never had before. I can't seem to get passed it. I am having difficulty deciphering when a narrator is telling us what is happening, and when the audience is reading what the character is thinking or feeling. It's a confusing dilemma / question to try to put into words so I'll use an example: Benjamin picked up the pace on his way to the school bus stop. If he was late again, Mrs. Snim would be really mad. Here is what I am having trouble understanding: Is the narrator is telling us that if Benjamin was late again, Mrs. Snim would be really mad, or are we witnessing what Benjamin himself is thinking and feeling? Another writer said to me, regarding this issue, that if the narrator includes, 'Benjamin thought/said/felt, ___,' or, '___, thought/said/felt Benjamin,' then that is the narrator telling us what Benjamin thought/said/felt. Whereas if it was written without thought/said/felt included (as in the example above), then it would be the character himself doing the thinking/saying/feeling - without the narrator/narration telling us. That is opposite to what I've gathered from a different video. In another video, it's explained that if you're not using thoughts and you're not saying that the character thought something or that it was the characters perception, then everything in the narration reflects on the narrator and the narrator's opinion. Any help is most appreciated! Please provide some examples of sentences being told both ways to help me (and others) understand. Thanks!

[@lauralaura396]

I'm not a professional writer, so this is purely my interpretation. I think this sentence can be used both in a third person limited and third person omnicient perspective. I would have to read the rest of the paragraph or book to be able to tell. If the book is in third person limited I would interpret the sentence as Benjamin's thoughts as the writer kind of sees the story through the experience of that person. If the book is in third person omniscient I would interpret it as knowledge that the narrator has. Again, I'm far from a pro, this is just my opinion.

[@phoebea]

@Quill Ink :The answer to your question is "it depends." There would need to be a bigger sample pool (more writing) to determine if the POV is 3rd Person Limited or 3rd Person Omniscient. The sample sentences you provided are not sufficient to figure out one way or another. They were pretty basic sentences that "told" more than they "showed." As readers, we don't feel Benjamin's urgency to "pick up his pace." And, unless it was previously established, I don't see why Benjamin should care if Mrs. Snim is mad. Having taught teenagers, I wouldn't think that a regular guy/student wouldn't really care if Mrs. Snim (assuming she is his teacher) gets mad at him. 1. 3rd Person Limited is when in the POV of the scene or character is in one character's POV. The scene shows what is happening through one character's POV at that moment, which means, the POV character cannot know something that they don't already know at that point in time. A good 3rd Person Limited scene should quickly establish in whose POV the reader is supposed to "see" the story through by how the scene is described and the words/lexicon used. The POV character's name is rarely used outside of dialogue when describing the scene unless it would cause confusion (ex. Characters of the same gender talking back and forth where "he" or "she" is not clear.) 3rd Person Limited used to be written mostly in past tense, however, writing this POV in present tense is gaining popularity. Example 1: Your sample scene in 3rd Person Limited POV He hauled ass to the bus stop, the cold air hitting his lungs like needle pricks. Mrs. Snim told him that if he was late one more time, he'd have detention until the end of the year. "Not. Today. Son." He wheezed after reaching the empty stop. The bus loomed in the distance only a couple stops away. He scanned for others his age, but, there were only old people walking around. An old lady glared as she sat on the bench behind him, a large cantaloupe rested on her lap. Ben rummaged through his pack for his cell. Where were his guys? "Manny, where you at?" He said when a long yawn greeted him. "I'm at the stop. You're late." "It's Sunday, dumbass." Manny muttered. "Lemme sleep." [End Scene] 2. 3rd Person Omniscient is when you read the scene as you would see it in a movie. There is a narrator telling you the thoughts and feelings of a person (or people) in the scene/story. There is basically no rules as to how this can be done so as long as the reader can follow it. The narrator can have their own voice or be and impartial narrator just telling the story. The story tends to be written in the past tense. Example 2: 3rd Person Omniscient Benjamin ran down the street almost mowing down three guys in a suit, an old lady carrying a cantaloupe, and a kid his age out of uniform. If he was late one more time, he'd have detention until the end of the year. "Not. Today. Son." Benjamin gasped when he leaned against the bus stop poll. He'd made it on time. Little did he know how it wouldn't matter. "Manny, where you at?" Ben said into his cellphone and eyed the approaching bus. "I'm at the stop. You're late." "It's Sunday, dumbass." Manny yawned. "Lemme sleep." He was a dumbass. [End Scene] I hope this helps. I'm not great at writing in 3rd Person Omniscient POV as I prefer to write in 3rd Person Limited - present tense. To be honest, there was no point in my adding the "Little did he know it wouldn't matter" line, but Omniscient POV tends to use lines like these for foreshadowing or to show that the story has already happened in the past and the reader is reading a retelling of the story. My advice is to read books in different POVs to get a feel for them: see what you like about one POV over another, and, see how you can use these tools in your own writing. The point is to use these techniques to tell a great story that will make a difference in the reader's life. A good story has to leave some sort of impression and the reader has to care about why what the characters are going through matters.

[@silasraye4777]

Thanks! I found this video really helpful.

[@santiagojuarez7556]

Hello, greetings from Argentina. First of all, nice video and nice blog! I've bookmarked it on chrome so I can visite it if I need to clear some doubts that emerge while I'm writing. I have a little question, do you suggest or do you know if it's possible (with good results and not affecting the plot and book at all) to start a book with a prologue in 3rd person limited and write the first chapter 1st person (like a letter my character is sending to someone or a flashback remembering everything that lead him where he is at the prologue). And after doing so, going back to present and 3rd person limited for the rest of the book?

[@teisonedwards7111]

I would think so, prologues can have a sort of different perspective or point of view than the rest of the story without making the reader be too confused because its not usually part of the main narrative. Personal opinion here.

[@notsafeforchurch]

Hey Reedsy, I'm just starting to learn the basics of novel writing (world building, character building, flaws, etc.) so forgive me if this is a really basic question... But with respect to 3rd person limited, how would one go about informing the reader about important bits of information that relate to the development of a character that isn't the protagonist and the protagonist shouldn't be aware of it occurring. For example: Character A doesn't think very highly of the protagonist, but after a conversation character A learns something about the protagonist which actually changes their perception about the protagonist quite a bit. The protagonist doesn't pick up on this change in perception but I'd still like the reader to be made aware it. Is head hopping always a no-no within a scene, or is it acceptable so long as its very limited? Asked another way, is there anything wrong with a 3rd person omniscient point of view which focuses 95% of its attention on one characters point of view and only, on a rare occasion, gives the reader insight into someone else's inner thoughts? Thanks!

[@Reedsy]

This usually isn't something that would be done within 3rd person limited, but here are some possible options: -It can be read from Character A's actions, dialogue or body language, the protagonist just doesn't pick up on it, but it's fairly obvious to the reader -You include certain scenes from Character A's POV, although random POV shifts can be a bit clumsy, if done well it's a possibility -You could do something like you suggested, with a few very subtle head-hops. This isn't usually advised, but there are cases where it's done. I wouldn't necessarily recommend it, but like all things, if you can find a way to do it well, it's possible. Finally, I'd carefully examine why it's so important the reader is aware of this change. Although it's the challenge of 3rd person limited, it's also what makes it so engaging, that the reader only knows what the character knows. Committing to their viewpoint can make the writing difficult, but it's what makes this POV so interesting!

[@normanzsvsp]

Problem with me in third person limited is I keep writing the characters thoughts and feelings without it being in dialogue. Such as “he wasn’t sure if he could trust him, yet piecing together their forgotten memories almost made him sure that he could” Is this okay?

[@PredatorPL-vp2qt]

If characters told one to another their stories and one of them is main character, then why not.

[@phoebea]

That would work in 3rd Person Limited POV if you stuck to one character's thoughts in a scene. Pick which character you want the reader to experience the scene with and write in that person's POV. If you wrote every character's thoughts in a scene (head hopping) it would make the narrative POV hard to follow. Example of Head Hopping: "Did you see that?" Adam asked as pain radiated up his arm when his elbow hit the partially opened window. "The guy standing there is wearing a neon leotard." Betty refrained from smacking her head against the steering wheel and rolled her eyes. How were they even related? "You mean the scarecrow?" ***it is unclear in whose POV we are viewing this scene because the POV switched from Adam's POV (feeling pain) to Betty's POV (asking herself how they were related) in the same scene, causing confusion. *Versus* 3rd Person Limited (Adam): "Did you see that?" Adam asked as pain radiated up his arm when his elbow hit the partially opened window. "The guy standing there is wearing a neon leotard." Betty rolled her eyes with pursed lips. "You mean the scarecrow?" ***notice how the reader has more insight into Adam's feeling of pain because of the word "radiated." 3rd Person Limited (Betty)" "Did you see that?" Adam said pointing out the open car window. "The guy standing there is wearing a neon leotard." Betty refrained from smacking her head against the steering wheel and rolled her eyes. How were they even related? "You mean the scarecrow?" ***notice how the reader has more insight into Betty's POV because of the word "refrained" and the 'How were they even related?' line.

[@Izzy-bq1rc]

I love using 3rd limited. The current book I'm writing has 4 characters and 4 narrators, all completely different, and they're all in this house and basically never see anyone else... they've all got different thought processes and goals and paranoias and outlooks. My favorite one to write is the wannabe psychologist, because he gives me licence to read into every little detail and theorize about anything and everything. I just have to remind myself when I switch to different POVs to drop that little habit... Ethan might notice when a character changes their tone of voice and think about how the power dynamic just shifted there, but Harvey sure as hell won't. I've definitely gotten better at it after 300 pages of writing this book (although it still gives me trouble here and there lol)

[@horrordevil1413]

Which pov to select when i have more than one main characters

[@Reedsy]

That's up to you! Many writers like 3rd person limited for multi-POV novels, but you can use whatever POV you think would work best.

[@kikin5922]

I’d like to know how to use my dialogue bouncing from character to Characters.. either in 3rd or first

[@phoebea]

Dialogue should be independent from each character in either POVs. In 1st Person POV, the reader should be experiencing the story/dialogue from the POV of the character experiencing the story. To separate POVs in 1st Person POV, one usually indicates in whose POV the reader will experience at the beginning of each chapter. 1st Person POV Samples: POV Adam "Did you see that?" I said almost losing an arm out the window because Betty drove like a maniac. "The guy standing there is wearing a neon leotard." Betty rolled her eyes so far up into her head I thought she was possessed. "You mean the scarecrow?" She's right again, I should have kept my trap shut. POV Betty "Did you see that?" Adam said pointing out the car window. "The guy standing there is wearing a neon green leotard." "You mean the scarecrow?" I said, wondering how in the world we were related. 3rd Person Limited allows you to choose who's POV you want to write the scene in like in 1st Person POV, without the character's every thought. The samples below are both in 3rd person Limited, however, they are still in the POV of one character at time. To flip between each character's thoughts within the same scene is called "head hopping." 3rd Person Limited (Adam): "Did you see that?" Adam asked as pain radiated up his arm when his elbow hit the partially opened window. "The guy standing there is wearing a neon leotard." Betty rolled her eyes with pursed lips. "You mean the scarecrow?" ***notice how the reader has more insight into Adam's feeling of pain because of the word "radiated." 3rd Person Limited (Betty)" "Did you see that?" Adam said pointing out the open car window. "The guy standing there is wearing a neon leotard." Betty refrained from smacking her head against the steering wheel and rolled her eyes. How were they even related? "You mean the scarecrow?" ***notice how the reader has more insight into Betty's POV because of the word "refrained" and the 'How were they even related?' line. Example of Head Hopping: "Did you see that?" Adam asked as pain radiated up his arm when his elbow hit the partially opened window. "The guy standing there is wearing a neon leotard." Betty refrained from smacking her head against the steering wheel and rolled her eyes. How were they even related? "You mean the scarecrow?" ***it is unclear in whose POV we are viewing this scene because the POV switched from Adam's POV to Betty's POV in the same scene, causing confusion. I hope this helps!

[@justsomegirlwithamustache5370]

@@phoebea thank you so muchh

[@XYouVandal]

I was about to start my first novel, but I decided to watch this video real quick and I am so glad that I did, because I would have already ruined my first novel otherwise. I owe you one! What are you doing later?

[@RSJohnson-Author]

Hi, can you please include examples?

[@Reedsy]

There are examples you can read in the blog post linked in the description!

[@faresmohamedmahmoud3124]

Thank you very munch you are so helpfulll!

[@fiaradical5142]

For some odd reason i just love 3rd person POV. There's just this type of mystery added to the book that i feel can't really be conveyed properly in a 1st person POV.

[@mangaikarthi4283]

he saved my grade

[@marktan127]

You're so cute.

[@RIFLEman888]

You’re so creepy

[@MrJakePaddy]

Probably half your age you creep.

[@marktan127]

@@RIFLEman888 Commenting that someone is cute is creepy?

[@marktan127]

@@MrJakePaddy What's wrong with my comment?

[@MrJakePaddy]

@@marktan127 well she's half your age, so it's creepy. And not being able to recognise that makes you ignorantly creepy.