Reference Recording: Wagner's Der Ring des Nibelungen

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The Ultimate Classical Music Guide by Dave Hurwitz

Күн бұрын

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@maximisaev6974 8 ай бұрын

Hands down, without exception, a "Reference Recording" that will still be highly regarded long after all of us currently alive have kicked the bucket. I can't think of a single studio recording where so much effort, time, and money went into providing us the listening public a recording that can rightly be called a work of the highest cultural significance. Between Solti's Ring and Dorati's Haydn, Decca had in the past what they lack now; vision combined with marketing expertise.

@martinbynion1589 8 ай бұрын

Glad to see someone mention the complete Dorati Haydn. Possibly even more iconic than the Ring, and what opened the floodgates to the brilliance and sheer depth of the Haydn symphonies.

@maximisaev6974 8 ай бұрын

I heartily agree. There are many wonderful recordings, including Haydn recordings out there, but how many over the last 50 years can rightfully be labeled as groundbreaking, setting an outstanding performance standard, and being of enduring cultural significance? Dorati's Haydn is definitely one of those. There isn't a week that goes by when I'm not playing at least one of the symphonies from Decca's box set. Take care!@@martinbynion1589

@dennischiapello7243 8 ай бұрын

Culshaw went to great lengths to follow Wagner's most outlandish specifications for the orchestra. ALL the harps, ALL the anvils, authentic alpenhorns, and on and on. So the sonics were not merely great in themselves, but they were applied to sounds that one would rarely be able to hear in other recordings, let alone any opera house. It truly is a complete realization of Wagner's intentions, and thus it seems destined to remain the reference recording for, well, all time.

@ER1CwC 8 ай бұрын

He also had a preference for sticking singers at the back. Nilsson was really frustrated by it. If memory serves me right, he told her that each orchestra member playing those specialized parts was a soloist who ought to be heard, and she effectively responded: are people going to buy the set because of an anvil or because of me? Got to love her wit.

@67Parsifal 8 ай бұрын

@@ER1CwCShe came round in the end.

@ER1CwC 8 ай бұрын

@@67Parsifal She said she was happier with the CD release because Decca ended up bringing the voices back up, i.e., negating Culshaw’s preference.

@bbailey7818 8 ай бұрын

@ER1CwC Decca could justify it with Wagner but they also did it with Italian opera c.1960-61. Listen to the (first) Rigoletto with Sutherland. It's a disaster sonically.

@stephenmiller9791 8 ай бұрын

The singers are past it and the orchestra is too loud. Try the Fürtwangler Ring from 1953 in Rome or any of the Knappertsbusch versions from the 1950s. They leave Solti trailing in their wake.

@DanielGreineder 8 ай бұрын

Great piece and a balanced account of Solti's Ring. In the past 30 years, it has gone from being near-definitive, to much-maligned and recently back again in critical opinion. The great strengths of Solti's Ring are all-round consistency and the VPO.

@coinneachrussell1116 8 ай бұрын

Great video Dave! I first heard this recording when I was 17 (about 3 years ago), and it absolutely blew me away. It’s what made me fall in love with the Ring Cycle.

@robertjamesstove 8 ай бұрын

One of the earliest birthday gifts which I received in my childhood was the Solti *Walküre*. On LP, of course, in those days; moreover, my copy was already secondhand when my parents bought it (rural New South Wales was not exactly over-endowed with record stores), so there was a fair amount of surface noise. But the periodic clicks and pops didn't matter in the slightest. From the moment the stylus hit the groove at the beginning of Side 1, I was hooked.

@vinylarchaeologist 8 ай бұрын

I can heartily recommend John Culshaw‘s book „Ring Resounding“ for a first-hand behind-the-scenes look into making this Ring recording. It‘s a marvellous book for those interested in classical recordings in general and gives you an idea about how crazy and risky (and expensive!) of an endeavour this recording was.

@davidaltschuler9687 8 ай бұрын

Culshaw was an engaging writer who also did a lot of fiction. It shows here. That self-aggrandizing story of how he fooled Szell in the studio during a Tchaikovsky Sym. #4 finale session does not pass the smell test. Szell had one of the best ears ever and Culshaw must be suspected of having a personal grudge to claim that he played Szell for such a sucker. IMHO.

@vinylarchaeologist 8 ай бұрын

@@davidaltschuler9687 Interesting.

@ftumschk 8 ай бұрын

@@davidaltschuler9687 ... szmell test, surely :)

@langsamwozzeck 8 ай бұрын

Every normal person: "Yes, of course, it's Solti's Ring, how could it be anything else?" Insane Wagner fans: "You uncultured swine, only a bootleg reel-to-reel tape recorded from Bayreuth radio broadcasts in 1934 conducted by Elmendorff capture the spiritual luminosity of the work, with the possible exception of that most treasured of Wagner recordings, Kirsten Flagstad singing "Siegmund! Sieh auf mich!" in the shower in 1941"

@nir0bateman 8 ай бұрын

I will settle for the 1955 Decca recorded Bayreuth cycle under Keilberth.

@robertjamesstove 8 ай бұрын

@langsamwozzeck, if I could give your comment two likes instead of just one, I would.

@MrJdaniel1371 8 ай бұрын

Ha ha, (but listen to Flagstad's Immolation Scene with Furtwangler and the Philharmonia (now on Warner/EMI) to hear a "nobility" and "epic" quality that eludes the often hasty Solti and the frigid, automaton-esque Nilsson. That said, the very latest remastering of the Solti Ring (that "gramps," fails to mention), is an astonishing leap in sound quality. Nothing wrong with at least investigating the vocal artistry of pre- WWII era, is there?

@petterw5318 8 ай бұрын

If I remember it correctly, the Bayreuth broadcasts from the 1950s and 1960s didn't circulate in acceptable sound until the end of the 1970s, when the owner of the Melodram label "borrowed" the original tapes from the Bavarian Radio and published them in Yugoslavia to avoid legal repercusions.

@gavingriffiths2633 8 ай бұрын

I remember listening to the Solti 'Das Rheingold' for the first time - people forget how astonishing the sonics were for the time. That first rumble as the prelude begins.....

@morrigambist 8 ай бұрын

And the storm in Rheingold leading up to the stroke which creates the rainbow bridge (ff!) was showing off every kind of sound system when it was first issued.

@spitfire3280 5 ай бұрын

I look forward to these recordings so much. Thanks Dave!

@stephenschroth3616 8 ай бұрын

I suspected that you would identify me Solti as the reference recording. I have the Solti, the Karajan, and the Bohm. I find Karajan's interpretation fascinating and illuminating and I probably reach for the Bohm most often. But it's really impossible to discuss any Ring cycle without mentioning the Solti.

@stevemcclue5759 8 ай бұрын

I always loved the documentary of the making of Solti's Gotterdammerung. Where Brunnhilde calls for Grane, they bring on a horse, much to Nilsson's surprise! And Solti flailing away on the podium, trousers falling down: he's at the polar opposite to Richard Strauss conducting.

@s.k.angyal3768 8 ай бұрын

I agree with you; Solti, Böhm, Karajan, all of them are great achievements in their own right, but if I want to listen to the story (Libretto)… German is my my first language btw, I have to say in Karajans version I can really hear and understand everything (Wortdeutlichkeit). Just saying. All in all Solti really did it, no question about it production wise!

@eddihaskell 8 ай бұрын

There was a poll of British Classical Music Listeners on BBC Radio Channel 3 on the greatest recording ever made and the Solti Ring won by a wide margin.

@bbailey7818 8 ай бұрын

The Götterdämmerung is amazing, one of the greatest recordings ever made. We're lucky the "Golden Ring" video focused on the making of it.

@eddypauly22 8 ай бұрын

I had a good laugh while I listened to this. I remember getting the 'ring' in the early 1970's and being blown away with the listening experience . Then in the 80's I got the CD's which were an even better sound but then I tried a digital release that did 'not match' the sound of the earlier versions. Go figure !

@timmckay6367 8 ай бұрын

I have it on the single bluray with the full libretto book. I never imagined the whole Ring on one disk!!

@sjc1204 8 ай бұрын

I think it's time I read "Ring Resounding" because I found the documentary "Wagner The Golden Ring (2007)" to be really interesting. I was hoping you would have discussed the latest of many remastered releases of Solti. I stream them via TIDAL and don't own them but I am so impressed by the fidelity.

@jbbevan 8 ай бұрын

Well, heads up: Ring Resounding is mostly about the recording of Das Rheingold where "The Golden Ring" was a video about Götterdämmerung. They are not redundant.

@rogerwebb7501 3 ай бұрын

@@jbbevanNot quite true....Ring Resounding is about the recording of the complete tetralogy. For a wider view of the great Decca producer's life I recommend his autobiographical 'Putting the record straight' and for a good introduction to the Ring, Culshaw's insightful 'Reflections on Wagner's Ring' (Viking Press, NY 1975). You're correct that Ring Resounding is about recording Götterdammerung....this is my number one wish for a 'director's cut' version. Three hours of film were shot...much of it footage of some of the most famous Wagner singers of the period, over two hours of which ended up on the cutting-room floor! I still see Humphrey Burton (the original director) at the occasional concert...so if that lost film is still usable......

@jbbevan 3 ай бұрын

@@rogerwebb7501 I have all three books and have read them...some time ago. The story in Ring Resounding that "stuck" was the one about returning to record the last few orchestral bars of Rheingold after most of the players were smashed from celebrating what they thought was the end.

@rogerwebb7501 3 ай бұрын

@@jbbevan Yes, the horn section had the greatest difficulty playing the opening E flat intro. of Rheingold, so they did the final take late at night after Culshaw had arranged a little party with sufficient wine to 'relax' the horn players. Interestingly the take used for that section is still not that great....considering it is the 'best' one! I played it to a brass player colleague (ex CBSO) and he wasn't impressed - adding that he couldn't understand why they didn't do another take!! BTW, I made the pilgrimage to the Sofiensäle a little while ago where the Solti Ring was made (and many other Decca recordings)...well worth a visit now that it's restored to its former glory. It's now a 'boutique' hotel, health club and café, but the main hall is as seen in the 'Golden Ring' film.

@frankcastle_8513 8 ай бұрын

Hey Uncle Dave!!!! Love seeing you well. Love the content!!!!

@DavesClassicalGuide 8 ай бұрын

Ditto! Hope you're doing great!

@michelangelomulieri5134 8 ай бұрын

The keilberth’s ring on testament has, in my opinion, the greatest vocal cast ever. Nevertheless, this solti’s one is a reference recording!

@jbbevan 8 ай бұрын

Those who complain about Hotter's Solti Walküre need to hear the Keilberth. I don't find that much difference. Hotter had a manner of delivery that didn't change much over the years.

@jaykauffman4775 8 ай бұрын

Listening to the current version on Apple Music via lossless and the sound is stupendous. Still the best combination of voices, orchestra and conductor. And the care that went into every session. Although Culshaw had intermittent mishaps with vocal/orchestral balance eg the dreadful 1960 Tristan in the Ring he got the balances exactly right. A joy to hear

@UlfilasNZ 8 ай бұрын

The reference recording of reference recordings, perhaps? No matter whether you care for it or not.

@DavesClassicalGuide 8 ай бұрын

They are all "whether you care for it or not." That's what a reference recording is.

@eddihaskell 3 ай бұрын

I need some advice. I would like to puchase a Ring Cycle with superb sound -- I am orchestra oriented. I have to be honest, I really don't care that much who the singers are -- I have a preference for Jessye Norman but that is because I am a graduate of the University of Michigan where she studied -- and honestly, I don't care. I would like clarity and up-front sound. The only modern Ring recordings I have are Barenboim's Ring (I am not big on all the set knocking around -- and the "distance"of the singers) with the exception of the Solti Siegfried- and Siegfried is my least favorite Ring Opera. I have heard good recommendations for the Dresden/Janowski Studio Ring from 1983 which does sound good in KZbin videos. Any reommendations? Should I just buy the remainder of the Solti Rings? Note, I am not buying the modern Thieleman Ring as someone recommended.

@cillyede 8 ай бұрын

Ten minutes ago I got me this box set in London (!😅). Danke für die Emphehlung. 🙏 Watching your channel is making me sleeping in the parks one day. 🇩🇪😂😅😂

@kellyrichardson3665 8 ай бұрын

No surprise, indeed! I'm sure I have two copies, different packagings, but I missed that HUGE one...are there hubcaps inside that box?!!!

@DavesClassicalGuide 8 ай бұрын

Yes. Two for each Valkyrie. You know where they fit.

@martinbynion1589 8 ай бұрын

Cut my teeth on this set on vinyl and still have those discs. Finding it a bit more approachable on CD, away from the psychobabble created more recently by the anti-digital freaks. Also have several mono sets from Bayreuth in the early 1650s and the Karajan set and enjoy them too. However, returning to the Solti is like going home to Mom after a rough time out in the wilds and cuddling up for a big hug! 🙂🙂🙂

@DavesClassicalGuide 8 ай бұрын

Bayreuth in the 1650s eh? Sorry, but it's a wonderful typo.

@rogerwebb7501 3 ай бұрын

@@DavesClassicalGuideIf you haven't heard Monteverdi's Parsifal you haven't lived!

@bksherm 8 ай бұрын

David Thanks for doing these, wondering if you could do Strauss' Alpine Symphony. Thank You

@DavesClassicalGuide 8 ай бұрын

There is no reference recording for that work.

@DavidJohnson-of3vh 8 ай бұрын

Thank you, Dave. I have a mix of Solti/HvK on lp and Janowski/Staatskapelle Dresden on cd. I like them all, as you seem to.

@episodesglow 8 ай бұрын

I've never heard Bohm, is it more exciting than Solti?

@DavesClassicalGuide 8 ай бұрын

I think so.

@jbbevan 8 ай бұрын

I have Böhm among others. I also heard a live Bayreuth broadcast of that same production the same year that it was recorded. Siegfried got booed off the stage. Stay with the Reference Recording.

@rogerwebb7501 2 ай бұрын

@@jbbevanIn view of our discussion of Culshaw's 'Ring Resounding' you may recall that he slated the Böhm Ring, as he was present at the perfs that year (he didn't produce the Philips recording) we have to believe him when he said it was terrible.....but! my ears tell me a different story! I actually think the Böhm is a very exciting listen - especially Die Walküre...James King's Siegmund is thrilling as is Rysanek's Sieglinde and Nilsson peerless as usual! I've listened to many Bayreuth 'live' Rings over the years (including this years!) and rate the Böhm highly...along with the Keilberth '55 - and for a beginner I'd also recommend the Boulez on DVD along with the Levine/Met....but not either as just sound recordings. My recommendation, if one only wanted one on CD, would be Solti still...... especially in view of the bargains available S/H on eBay!

@jgesselberty 8 ай бұрын

First got this on LP in a subscription with Time/Life. Sumptuos slipcased editions, and including Culshaw's "The Ring Resounding", George Bernard Shaw's "Ther Perfect Wagnerite" and an additional book of the history of the productions of the past.

@bbailey7818 8 ай бұрын

Back when Time Life promoted classics. Remember those "sound sheets" floppy 33s that came with their ads in the mail?

@ER1CwC 8 ай бұрын

Does anyone have any inside scoops on the Legge-Angel EMI Ring that never came to be? Nilsson wrote about how she had been contracted to do it, but eventually grew impatient and asked to be released from it.

@jbbevan 8 ай бұрын

They did record Nilsson & Hotter in the Walküdre Act 2 Duet, but I think that's all that was recorded.

@ER1CwC 8 ай бұрын

@@jbbevan I think that was intended as a try out, sort of like the Solti Walkure discs with Flagstad. I wonder why Legge wasn’t able to pull the full project off. I think that was the experience though that caused Nilsson to never sign exclusive contracts again, even though she loved recording with Legge.

@jensguldalrasmussen6446 8 ай бұрын

Legge in the 1950s seems to have been more occupied by the budding Rossini-rennaissance than with Wagner...leading to his most unforgiveable, cardinal sin of omission: not to have recorded a complete Ring with Klemperer, while he (Klemperer) still could have dealt with the physical challenges of such an entreprise. Check out Klemperer's Flying Dutchman and his EMI recordings of Wagner ouvertures and bleeding chunks from the Ring, and you will know what I mean!