Renesis / GSLSE 13b Hybrid Engine build - Mazda RX8 plus RX7 Motor combo - Big HP Combo - Vol 7

[@landspeedrotary103]

Kyle’s heard this before so the following is for others that may find the information useful. I’ve tested multiple fully built Turbo Reni MSP motors(non-hybrid) w/Rx8 10:1 rotors on Race E85, anything beyond approx 24psi would cause ridiculous amounts of blow-by and increased detonation, no matter how much timing was pulled. Even at lower boost a 2-Liter catch can would overflow after a few miles and that’s with all healthy side seals and compression. One of the motors had .004” side seal clearance and blow-by/detonation was still a huge problem past ~24psi, another motor with very tight clearance approx .002” didn’t last, side seals expanded from direct contact with exhaust gases which was exacerbated by elevated EMAP. The solution, 9:1 low compression FD rotors and aftermarket side seals. (I’d actually now recommend 9.4:1 rotors as 9:1 is overkill) Results: 554whp on E85, and 625whp on methanol, both were unfinished tunes with lots more to go but TPS failed twice. Motor was pulled for inspection after approx 5k miles of street abuse and countless dyno pulls; all seals, rotors and bearings were flawless. This is all without the exhaust cut-off scraper rings, which I do recommend to be machined into the rotors. The 10:1 rotors are perfect for NA but once boosted, CCP/CCT increases exponentially. The hybrid motor should have a very positive effect on EMAP and extending side seal life, but won’t solve the elevated CCP/CCT issue caused by the 10:1 high compression rotors, or at least won’t solve it for applications beyond ~24psi. As always, big time thanks to @Kyle Mohan Racing for unselfishly putting in the time, effort and cash on this R&D. 🤝🙌

[@jasonskinner1652]

Thanks again Kyle. Appreciate you doing this build for us RX8 owners. We all want to know what can be done to make the renesis a little different and closer to the RX7 without having to afford an REW swap.

[@noname-sd5dt]

Watching with keen interest. Thank you kyle for your efforts in doing this. Everyone who goes hybrid also goes into witness protection.

[@steveodorito]

Can't wait to see the intake and exhaust manifold!

[@justaformer11b95]

I’m really looking forward to the final thoughts on this. I have always wondered why this isn’t done more often; because of the exact reasons stated in the video.

[@filaptop]

Keep it coming... Would like to see outcome of it 😉

[@peterga3658]

good work man

[@bazicoquisreview5696]

How about intake setup? Factory intake manifold? Any modifications recommended for the intake manifold? Thank you.

[@Vipurs]

I’m wondering the same thing. If Kyle keep up with these videos it will be an really good resource when doing a similar build

[@lugnut93]

The timing of the peripheral exhaust port on the housings creates overlap and negates the designs of the stock intake manifold & valving. You would lose low end torque/hp by introducing overlap. The renesis intake is designed for no overlap.

[@arrivendrive6831]

Man I am all ears!!! Really looking forward to the results. I hope it will be a NA build. Brap on.

[@Silverhks]

I'm really looking forward seeing you hammer this

[@oliverscorsim]

Id actually love to see what one of these could do na maybe a semi pp or a monster port with some good d ports for the exhaust pp

[@oliverscorsim]

I'm willing to bet there some good gains using a center iron without that funky exhaust port mixing the exhaust waves

[@adrielaquino521]

Any ideas of what HP numbers could this engine configuration make Naturally aspirated? Whether its stock ecu or adaptronic etc?

[@bennyb.1742]

Stock ECU would never work. The Mazda Trix hybrid road race car made 400+ on low boost with a little turbo. It's got a lot of potential I think, Probably pretty competitive with a well ported REW.

[@stevecarlisle3323]

Kyle, another great Vid. Is it within your power to show use the whole process to evaluate the rotor housings for "grinding", and the equipment and procedure to do that? Thanks

[@ADudesRotary]

Checkout rad potential

[@stevecarlisle3323]

@@ADudesRotary Yes, I have seen that, not enough control to do a good job. There is a shop in Quebec that built a custom unit, that has good results. I was hoping Kyle could explain the grinding machines "Secret Sauce" I t may be confidential.

[@marinaportocaribe]

Let’s say I can add the rx8 center plate or maybe all the plates to my 91 gtu engine, is there any hp gains by doing that? Pretending that intake manifold and port stays the exact same

[@erikwahlstrom7826]

The shared exhaust port eliminates twin scroll Turbo chargers for the setup, which Turbo do you think would be best for 15 pounds of boost?

[@Deanozdirect]

Great video but would it also be possible to semi pp this engine and if so would it make good hp above 260hp

[@wdemetrius76]

I'm very interested in this setup but how hard would it be to create an exhaust manifold? I have been looking forward to what the Vargas Brothers are going to do with that setup.

[@Vipurs]

Me too, elite rotary has a top mount turbo manifold but it’s super expensive and im not sure about the fitment. I’d love to see Kyles exhaust manifold and what the Vargas bros do.

[@DrewDoesWhatever]

What kind of ECU would this need? Can it play well with the stock rx8 one?

[@michaeldragos]

What about intake/ exhaust overlap? Aren't the GSL ports closing way later than the Renesis? I'm curious about the power band for this setup.

[@erikwahlstrom7826]

Can you also show how peak torque is effective by porting or is it just rotor lightening that determines peak torque?

[@mincvinyl]

There are already a few dyno comparisons on the forums. Plenty of written out theory as well. The GSL housings give large bridgeport levels of overlap(assuming stock REN intake ports already) so you should expect a loss in low end torque(greater loss if the REN intake ports are street or bridgeport). Then a very very slight (1-10hp) gain at peak due to the extra exhaust out flow. The dyno's shared mimic this, where the low and mid loss is fairly significant and the top gain is barely noticeable. Of course all dynos on the forums are under different conditions with differently built engines on different types of dynos so nobody will ever agree on anything. I can't really understand why people would try this NA as there are really only negatives to be gained. Cleaning up the exhaust ports on the stock REN would most likely net you any additionally needed flow that the Massive GSLSE ports offer. For turbo the issues you run into are the same as the above. but with the rx8 center plate and side plates you are splitting your exhaust pulses, while also mixing chambers in the center port. Where on a REW you'd be able to do separate single exhaust ports with a twinscroll and not use the bulky RX8 Lower intake. By the end of the build you'd likely spend just as much money anyways.

[@michaeldragos]

@@mincvinyl My exact point, this engine is having the overlap larger than a peripheral intake and exhaust port, but alot of drawbacks on high end. If you want power out of a turbo 13B, use the REW.

[@mincvinyl]

Well for Rx8's I would say turboing a renesis does have its place. By the end of a REW swap you are likely to spend 15-20k where to turbo a Renesis you may only spend 5-7k. However you pretty much limit yourself to 350 responsive HP. Which honestly may be enough for most people, as there is plenty of weight savings to start looking towards. Also considering most RENs likely sit at 170-180hp, hitting 350 is quite the change. Going beyond the 350hp is where you should go REW. So the question really is do you think you'd be comfortable stopping at 350hp or are you the type of person to keep raising the bar? Which build/path do you invest in?

[@michaeldragos]

@@mincvinyl I race my RX8 in hillclimb races (see my channel). I do not think a boosted Reni can survive this kind of racing enough to worth it, so I'll be doing a REW swap soon (I have a Samsonas dog box as well).

[@curls6542]

What is your thoughts on blanking the centre exhaust port with a plate.

[@yadunathhiralall465]

what’s is the expedited hp on n/a application?? pump gas .

[@SilentSamurai8]

I’m wondering too. It’s been asked many times but never really addressed.

[@alexanderwood6739]

Do you have to run an aftermarket ECU? I am sure it would be more adjustable than the OEM, but the more money saved, the better. Lol. Thanks in advance

[@richiebarrow9169]

Im more interested on how long it will last.

[@ADudesRotary]

I've spent a bit of time looking at rotary engine building and find it difficult to identify a setup that will reliably provide 350hp to a Renesis based motor, ie a motor that will last 100,000 miles, with proper servicing. I'm just after a capable road car.

[@JRosariohomestead]

Kyle; can you use ceramic or goopy seals instead of cutting the Renesis rotors for 2mm apex seals?

[@RobbieE56]

Pretty sure he said no in another video. You need the depth.

[@mincvinyl]

With the Pport exhaust you want the 3mm tall apex seals to avoid bending in the center as the apex seal goes over the port.

[@jotenmike]

Do you think, this combo might have a future or is 13b REW still better build with single turbo.

[@therandomrobert1842]

I’ve had all the parts for this build but everyone in the hybrid group on Facebook said rew makes more power currently main reason being the rotors only being able to hold 25 psi reliably unless someone makes custom rx8 rotors

[@therandomrobert1842]

Rew you can run 30+ no problem if your studded

[@jotenmike]

@@therandomrobert1842 Why cant you use REW rotors, arent their same size and everything. Just older tech?

[@therandomrobert1842]

@@jotenmike side seals are different they said they chip the corners off on the exhuast port and intake port primaries n secondaries both have less material for the corner seal to ride on

[@stephenwever]

@@therandomrobert1842 have you seen the blue rx8 landspeed record car its a renesis with rx7 rew rotors it seems to be running just fine but its using powerseals sideseals

[@leighstewart9391]

Can we all please just take a moment to acknowledge the fact he just said that the Renisis Engine had 200,000 Miles on it 🤯🤣.. what premix where they using I could do with a bit 😂

[@KyleMohanRacing]

Over a couple rebuilds parts can rack up the miles, and my references are regarding the rotors and side plates. Obviously 200k is not on a single engine life. There are lots or RX7s and RX8s with high mileage. And some parts may be original but not everything. I think you misunderstood the idea presented. Use old parts to make something useful.

[@joogullae3456]

E6 H U

[@oliverscorsim]

@@KyleMohanRacing I had bought a one owner s4 fc that had 200k on the original engine and it actually had good compression ran great don't know what happened to the car after I sold it but I never got a call saying I sold him junk.

[@caszzxs4104]

I think many wants to know if you’re up to the challenge in making this an alternative to swapping it out for something else. Can you give us 300hp easy and safety from this and make it work? Or is it still better to go with a LSA, LS, or 13b Rew?

[@justaformer11b95]

I’d be willing to bet it’s within reach of the 300 but the powerband is much larger and lower than a traditional 13b. Would probably be great for autocross.

[@caszzxs4104]

@@justaformer11b95 right so I guess I’m looking to see if someone is willing to put kits together (plug and play) to create the alternative (not having to swap to v6, v8, etc). I feel like I just see ppl experimenting and taking it to the extreme instead of making something for the masses and making some money! I love my stock motor and the characteristics but it’s simply under powered as we all know. I think a lot of ppl (including myself) will pay good morning to be able to other a hybrid motor that’s sorted out.

[@justaformer11b95]

@@caszzxs4104 I definitely think there should be a market for it. I’d love to see it.

[@BeaverLakeMotorsports]

Is this setup going to be tested NA before getting boosted? I think that's what people want to see, then go to the moon...

[@therandomrobert1842]

There’s a Bridgeport na hybrid on KZbin making 200 or somethin

[@noname-sd5dt]

That one makes 220rwhp (Malaysia gang). But rotary revs did a stock iron and it got 219rwhp and it was just a clean rebuild with mild factory porting and a tune. The hybrid needed to rev to 9800, the RR renny to 9k. One wheel dyno, one hub dyno. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[@BeaverLakeMotorsports]

@@noname-sd5dt None of those builds make impressive numbers compared to a well built & tuned stock port motor.

[@SilentSamurai8]

@@BeaverLakeMotorsports are there stock port renesis making 220whp?

[@BeaverLakeMotorsports]

@@SilentSamurai8 stock port around 200 and street port in the 220's... hybrid needs to make significantly more than that to make sense.

[@beratarc9087]

Why isn't your car a Hybird?

[@Incognitodemons]

200k miles....what