Repairing This Old Atari Missile Command Arcade Machine - Completely Dead Survivor Cabinet!

[@Buzzkill-wn7tf]

One of the best classic games ever! I played the hell out of it and anyone who ever played me in University was being farmed for beer money! Can't specifically remember but at around 840K or o score, you get a butt load of free cities. Gives you time to take a break and have a burger, play some pinball and get back to it later. Once in a while a buddy of mine would join me in a marathon. Start with a quarter right at opening of our local arcade. We would switch out once the free cities were awarded. Played all day and night until close. Drove the owner (Jim--great guy) nuts! But we spent a ton on other games too, so no foul. Let us play all night one time after closing up the shop. Times were different back then Great vid...great memories.

[@AvengerII]

Joe is a wise man. He'll almost NEVER be wrong with the diagnosis, "It's broke!" Good business strategy. Keep it short and simple for the customers!

[@LyonsArcade]

In the end it really doesn't matter what's wrong with it, it's Broke

[@AvengerII]

@@LyonsArcade Wise saying, Grasshopper! You studied under Blind Master Po, did you not?

[@markwatson3135]

You’ve got to have a “Come on now, people!” Shirt🙂

[@naytch2003]

September 11th..a day to remember all those innocent souls who perished that day and not just the ones in the planes...

[@MartysRandomStuff]

In an 8 bit system 255 is the largest integer number you can store in one byte (8 bits) (0 to 255 gives 256 numbers). Trying to store a larger number than that in one byte is an error, if it's a variable they never expected to get that big they just didn't program in any error handling so the program crashes or does unexpected stuff. This was back when memory was so expensive that you programed as efficiently as possible to save every bit of space, so no extra bytes for numbers you don't think will ever go over 255 and minimal or no extra code to deal with errors.

[@chrislembke9566]

It gets weirder than just an error. The system will roll over the register count and add 1 to the adjacent register. Depending what's in that next register is how it will corrupt.

[@PlumGurly]

@@chrislembke9566 Well, all you have is the 8-bit accumulator, so it doesn't roll over to another register (that only works with memory address registers and the program counter). It just sets the carry flag and starts over at 0. So you get a truncated rollover.

[@martykopka]

This guy and the comments below cover it. 2 to the power 8 is 256. Each bit (which is on or of via high or low/off current) is either 1 or 0 used to create binary numbers and hence the 256 max value...or if you start from 0 then 255 is max value, hence why both numbers are 'weird'. As the comments below say, once you hit the max number and then 'add' one more either the overfow value spills into another variable or part of code messing that up or rests the currnet variable to 0 and starts over or both.

[@David-ue3vf]

ASCI goes from 00 to FF in the code also. That associates 0-255.

[@PlumGurly]

@@David-ue3vf -- Older machines used their own adaptations of ASCII. Some used a 7-bit ASCII. The alphanumeric characters and the control characters were all in the same places, but every thing else varied.

[@johnbipper4601]

We used to walk the railroad tracks for miles with pockets of quarters to get to the nearest arcade. Good times!

[@viscountalpha]

I 100% agree with starting at the wall. I had a gorf and the ground pin was missing off the plug. Had the 60 cycle hum because the ground was bad. Replaced it and no more hum.

[@jcinsaniac]

It's been MANY years since I rejuvenated a CRT, but since my dad was a TV repairman, I was honored to learn the intricacies of a CRT checker/rejuvenator - My dad also had a tube checker...I put hundreds of pulled tubes in the checker and verified function. As I wax even older, I too want to recapture the machines that fired my imagination as a child. Thanks for the trip down Missile Command lane - one of my favorite games of all time. Cheers!

[@summerlaverdure]

heck yeah, if Joe says it's broke, IT'S BROKE! awesome to see it fixed

[@tjsogmc]

Wow. Missile Command was the ubiquitous game of the 80's along with Pac Man and Galaga. It was literally everywhere. I spend most of my college money on it. ;) Glad to see it got some new life.

[@LyonsArcade]

They always want to work, you just need to help 'em out a little bit :)

[@hestheMaster]

I bet the customer will be soooo happy you got it working again Joe.

[@georgeshelton6281]

So I told myself this, you have to remember that they don't make video arcade game machines like they used to anymore. The new ones, you're going to get more than what you bargain for. The new ones, they spit out these cardboard ticket stubs that you can win prizes with. I've experienced that when I first came over to the East San Jose Tully Road Chuck E. Cheese's Pizza Time Theater.

[@jasonsteverson4609]

Hey Ron!! Can't wait to see you on the infomercial. And if you order now, we'll throw in the magic orange peeler for free!!

[@pezjohnson]

Great video guys. SPOT ON intro, Joe. 😆Email sent for the T-shirt. Thanks for the videos.

[@djmips]

I got that book (Open Circuits) and it is outstanding! It really satisfies the curiosity of what's inside all those eletronic components! Terrific gift.

[@arcadejourney]

A true classic! Loved seeing it!!! I've grown to love the 4600s.

[@LyonsArcade]

You know I like them, just becuase they're old :) To be honest though the picture quality is hard to get nice on them, for my money, just my opinion, out of the early monitors the Wells 4900 is the one. The G07 is very fixable (now that we know what usually fails) but I think the 4900 has a little bit better image. When you see for instance a really nice Robotron or Joust, it's probalby got a 4900 in it...

[@sideburn]

Yay a video game again. I thought Ron was sick for a second though with that voice 😆

[@diddrumdontdrum]

One of my all time favourites. I will own one of these cabinets one day! Thanks for putting up the video. It’s almost a shame there wasn’t more wrong with the board so the we could see you fixing it. I enjoy watching the pcb fixes on the channel.

[@LyonsArcade]

I have fixed some other Missile Command pcb's in the past but yeah this one cooperated :) kzbin.info/www/bejne/bHq4pp6poqmpg6c

[@kbramlett6877]

Missle Command is the only game in history NOT to same "Game Over," but to say "The End." instead

[@LyonsArcade]

I think this one wasn't saying it because it was on freeplay or something...

[@timbaumgart483]

@@LyonsArcade Love this game! Nice job boys. The game only displays "The End" when you don't get a high score.

[@stevenphilcock4178]

Theirs an actual arcade game called "The End" by konami and even it says "game over" LOL

[@BaccarWozat]

RPGs would like to have a word with you.

[@kbramlett6877]

@@LyonsArcade You are correct. I was playing it on MAME in both Free Play and insert coin modes and I only got the "The End" screen when the dip switch was set to Insert Coin.

[@jonathandulchinos1766]

Yo u guys r the best I watch u ron,joe,Joe, your bother Donnie I have so much on your channel

[@ocsrc]

That's a classic. The original days of the early 8 bit arcade games.

[@abcminiuser]

I hope you like the book Ron - I got myself a copy as well. I figured it was easier to look at things already taken apart so you don't have to destroy them yourself :). I'm a SW/EE engineer by trade but always wondered what was inside all the components I was using. - Dean

[@LyonsArcade]

Thank you Dean, we appreciate it! It has a place of distinction on my bookshelf :)

[@elitster]

One of the best parts of my Friday! Thanks!! Saving history one game at a time!

[@LyonsArcade]

Thanks for watching, We appreciate it!

[@WreckDiver99]

Can't lie Ron, you nailed the two games I rarely ever played...because I just couldn't do very well. I did watch people that were accomplished at both these games, and was able to improve on Missile Command, but never defender...

[@allangault9500]

I love watching your channel.

[@LyonsArcade]

Thank you, we appreciate you watching!!!

[@belowmeoff]

That game brings back old memories from the early 80s when I was a teen.😊

[@myfarawaytales]

Wow brings back amazing memories. I had an Atari 2600 at age 12/13. And missile command was a top game. Was living in Edinburgh at the time and not a great time for my family. Fondest memories were of Space Invaders, Pac Man, missile command, maze craze and Pitfall.These games probably saved me from PTSD during that time. I was 100% engrossed. I think I played Defender, star wars and galaxians more in the actual arcades. Now I settle for mame as like that chap, nowhere to put a full sized cabinet. Maybe one day. Thanks guys

[@geeteoh1]

One of my favorite and yet most frustrating games to play. Remember playing it in the early 80s when it came out. You guys can fix anything!!!!!

[@georgeshelton6281]

I never knew the existence of this 1981 Atari 2600 video game. It's called X-Man. It definitely contains adult situations. That's erotic behavior. It was kept secret from me for 3 decades.

[@ray73864]

South Carolina is exactly 12hrs behind me here in the west-coast of Australia :D So right now, I am watching this video at 6.06a, for you it is 6:06pm. The eastern side of Australia (Sydney, etc...) is 2hrs ahead of me.

[@iononsoleggere9065]

Cheers from Italy. You've got a fan from there ❤

[@NivagSwerdna]

I love these videos! Nice to see you un-broke it.

[@LyonsArcade]

We try!

[@theoriginaljrest]

The classic tag line @1:22 & @2:31. Makes me laugh every time; especially the setup of the punch line. You ought to add a laugh track everytime it is said. 😅 Missile Command was a staple at Shakey's Pizza in Elk Grove Village, IL in the 80s.

[@LyonsArcade]

I never had the pleasure of going to a Shakey's but I just recently learned they existed, and there were several in Charlotte where I live, that I have been going inside of for years, not knowing they used to be a place called Shakey's pizza! One is a pawn shop I've been going to for 20 years and the other one that I know of is a car audio place....

[@theoriginaljrest]

@@LyonsArcade As a young teenager in the mid 80s, Shakey's pizza had a beer batter dough and just made the Pepperoni pizza so good but was secondary to the video games. I think Shakey's still exists in California.

[@themegaman91965]

Fortunately, there's an arcade not far from my house that has a treasure trove of refurbished arcade cabinets from the late 1970's, all the way to stuff from the last 10 years, but a nice heavy focus on 80's, 90's, and some early 2000's stuff. I think I'm going to get Missile Command a shot next time I go! Always good to play these with the intent to have fun; that's how I treat these!

[@JohnLaidlaw]

Binary (base 2). A bit is on or off, high or low, 1 or 0. You put 8 of those together you have a byte and the number you can create is between 00000000 to 11111111. If you convert that from binary to decimal (base 10) that is 0 to 255. When they were programming ("8 bit programs"), they assigned the variable to keep track of the level, or cities, or anything as being a one byte. Memory was expensive/scarce so they trimmed down things to the smallest size possible so they could use the rest of the memory for other things, and one byte is as small as you can go. As soon is that byte is supposed to store the next number, 256, then "Houston, we have a problem".

[@David-ue3vf]

ASCI was the code used for almost all the programming of these games back then and that is a base 16 number system. So, you would have 00 to FF (which is 0 - 255 also) in the programming code. The CPU would convert those codes from ASCI to binary. This would be stored in an 8 bit memory that stored in binary. Most of the time, this was in kilo byte size memory back in the 80's. Mega bytes were almost unheard of in computing units. I used to crack these games when I was young and give myself extra lives and such. Finding the hex code associated with a particular thing inside the game was fun for me. You could do "print" commands and all of a sudden you have the whole game code printed out on that beautiful dot matrix printer, with the continuous paper feed. Oh, it was so much fun.

[@tango_doggy]

@@David-ue3vf ASCII is a way of assigning text to numbers. The CPU only receives bits, it doesn't know what they are being used for (letters, numbers, flags, etc.). ASCII was designed for terminals, so it would be strange for a complete ASCII coding to be in any arcade game, although many games used ASCII as a basis for how they arranged letter tiles in their tilesets. Hexadecimal (base 16) is a common shorthand for writing binary (base 2) because it's a multiple of 2. Any base which is a multiple of 2 can act as a shorthand for binary because each digit in the higher base corresponds to a certain number of bits (digits) in base 2. The higher the base, the less digits there will be, although you'll have to add more representations for digits

[@hyperspinfan]

Those are some sexy Ts. Yep, 8-bit registers roll-over to zero when the last bit flips in the stack, making number of cities equal to zip. Asteroids does this too and game resets when number of ships goes over 255. First run boards of Galaga go to Stage zero when you hit 256/0, it even shows stage zero on the screen (but then no more baddies drop and the game just sits there.

[@kenlanier2131]

Ohhhh my! Missile Command was my favorite!

[@LyonsArcade]

You must have liked the torture! Almost impossible to do any good at it :)

[@naytch2003]

Was that your Michael Cole impression?? 😁

[@kenlanier2131]

@@LyonsArcade Yeah I feed quite a few quarters into that machine. Good times. Now I am gonns go watch Donnie finish that bathroom :)

[@boblow2186]

Yep this was a tough game in its day. I went back to defender cause I thought it was easier. Nice job on it. Love the t shirt s. Think shipping will be a killer for me.

[@AndrewTubbiolo]

Summer 1981, Pensacola Florida, I was watching some guy play Missile Command with over 200,000 points built up. He handed me the game, and of course I could not handle it. I'm pretty sure it was Roy Schildt. I saw him 30 years later in a KZbin vid he did in the later 80's and it sure looked like that guy.

[@ZebraChanda]

Probably had cities to burn lol

[@thomasbaleno5822]

Mr. Awesome!

[@ChakatNightspark]

Many Years ago. I used to have a Centipede caberet Machine. This was 20 years ago. Decided to to sell it to give it a new home, So someone else could enjoy it and play it more then I could. Sold it at time for $1,900. But, sold it to someone I kindof know. But, wish I had never sold it, 3 years later. Went to a Party He was Having. Saw what he Did to the Machine. He ripped out everything from inside and just threw it all away. Cut big opening where the Coin Slot Doors were. Placed a Door on it. Then took the Monitor out Replaced the Glass and Put a Fish Tank in it and Painted the Entire thing Neon Green. It Hurt seeing what He Did to that Machine.

[@NotsureOk]

Yep 2:30 am Worth the wait

[@LyonsArcade]

Sweet

[@naytch2003]

It's 5:14am Saturday in New Zealand 😉

[@keithperry8098]

No "The End"? That was the feature video game at the very end of Fast Times at Ridgemont High movie.

[@RS-ls7mm]

Something does seem off. I remember the ending, maybe Terminator 2.

[@SpearM3064]

You only get "The End" if you don't get a high score. You also don't get it if the game is set to Free Play (which this one was).

[@matthewbarry4464]

"Defender and Missile Command are some of the toughest games..." Robotron 2084 has entered the chat. I can say Missile Command is one of the original games that you must have the full size cabinet and track ball to be able to do your best. Any emulation of it doesn't do it justice.

[@LyonsArcade]

As I was saying that, robotron did pop in my head, lol

[@MattMcIrvin]

Sinistar was agonizingly hard.

[@peterharmer6940]

Shhh remember when this come out ball n track was so new gard game from kent ujk Williams had ine in three ways cafe silverdale big love dude ❤

[@PlumGurly]

Okay, 8-bit machines only work with a byte at a time. If you calculate 2 ^ 8 power (2*2*2*2*2*2*2*2), you get 256. So that means you can only have a range of 0-255, which is 256 places. And yes, you can use larger numbers even with that limit. You'd have to assemble them in RAM. Well, the 6502/6507/6510 has no ADD opcode, only ADC (Add with carry). So if you don't want to use the fact that the last number went past 255 as part of the current operation, you would need to do the CLC (clear carry flag) opcode. So if you need a larger range such as 0-65535 (65536 is 16-bit or 64K), you'd take advantage of the carry to use as carry or borrow. So while you could work with longer numbers than the bits, you could, just that it would take more work. For things like memory addressing, that requires 2 registers. There might be a Y and an X for the index registers. They are what drive the address lines on the chip. 256 bytes is not enough memory so the old machines often had 16 address lines. So for an 8-bit computer, you'd need to use 2 instructions to set the low and high memory address registers. The 6507 only had maybe 13 address lines, but for most memory usage, you still needed to use 2 registers. The above is also why old CPUs tended to have special instructions that assumed that the upper register was 0. That was known as Page 0. So you could specify only one register and access the memory faster, as you'd need 2 instructions, not 3. You'd only need to set one of the registers and then do the memory op (load or store) with the Accumulator register. Another thing that people wonder about is how subtraction works. Really, subtraction is just an addition with slightly more work, assuming you use the 2's complement system of storing signed numbers. On an 8-bit machine, 0-255 would be an unsigned number. But for some things, you might have -128 to 127. That sacrifices the upper bit and lets you store negative numbers starting from the maximum on down to where the top bit is no longer set. So to negate a number to the 2's complement, you'd invert all the bits for the 2nd argument and add one to it. At the CPU level, inverters sit at the B argument connections, and the carry-in line into the adder gets thrown. The formula is -A = (!A+1). To negate in circuitry, you take the 74xx adder chip and wire an inverter or XOR channels to the B argument wires of the adders. If one wants to use XOR you can tie the real B lines of the bus to one side of the XOR gates and the outputs to the B lines of the chip. Then tie all the other halves of the XOR gates together, to the carry line, and whatever line makes the selection between add and subtract. I mentioned XOR (exclusive OR) because they can be used as switchable inverters. For each channel, you can use 1 input for the input and the other for a control line. So if the "control line" is 0, the bit is the same as what enters. If the input is 0 and the control line is 0, XORing 0 with 0 is 0 since the input bits are the same. And if the input is 1 and the control line is 0 then the output is still 1 since XORing the input bit of 1 with the control bit of 0 are opposite one another. Now, if the "control line" is 1, then an input of 0 becomes 1 as they are opposite, and an input of 1 would become 0 as they are the same. So if you XOR a group of bits with 0, you get the exact same thing. If you XOR something with itself, you always get 0. If you XOR with all 1's such as 255 on an 8-bit computer, you invert the output.

[@MasatoKay]

Oh man, missle command ate all my quarters

[@ovalteen4404]

One of the authors of that book is a regular on the CuriousMarc channel. Over there they are restoring a lot of historical (not just vintage) stuff, such as the control modules used on the Apollo missions, and an old mostly-mechanical air data computer for 50's and 60's fighter jets. Definitely worth a watch if you have time.

[@ovalteen4404]

Also, re the 256 thing, there's a "Retro Game Mechanics Explained" video that goes into detail about why the Pac Man kill screen happens. I think I've seen a similar one about Donkey Kong.

[@andymouse]

Yep, great channel.

[@MattyEngland]

I want Mr Minge T-shirt 😂

[@andymouse]

Me too.

[@dastardlyman]

missile command is easy . when you get to 810,000 the counter cannot cope and you get A LOT OF BONUS CITIES. i was a chemical engineering student at edinburgh university in 1983 to 1987 . i could not cope with chemical engineeering but i got good at certain 8 bit games. sowhat you do with missile command is you wipe the sky with the ten bullets of base 3 then again with base 1 . that leaves you the middle base to mop up. its easy peasey

[@dastardlyman]

test this out with mame roms . im not lying im old and wrinkly and know. ps your channle is the best thank you from manchester uk. whalley range carlton club - i may be wearing a back to the future tee shirt . .. .

[@LyonsArcade]

Ahhh, that makes sense, I'll give it a try dastardlyman!

[@anthonygiordano6341]

I used to love this game… still do!

[@jeus2884]

They also have a problem with call of duty on some of the stages they only go up to 2:55 because of a still existing programming error with 256 being a logarithmic prime

[@750kv8]

27:13 - This must be closely related to the value range of a byte (8 bits), assuming the level counter etc. uses just a single one. the value range is 0-255, so 256 is an invalid value. On 2 bytes (16 bits), 256 is 1 on the first byte (lowest bit up), and 0 on the second byte (all bits down).

[@glennpoole5036]

Hey guys. You should add an amazon link to the copper tape that you use on your parts page. I'd like to purchase some. Thanks!

[@LyonsArcade]

Good idea! We will soon

[@piratestation69]

If a VS. red tent ever appears, for some strange reason i would love to see ron and donnie play tennis or baseball on it. Who would win? Who would care?

[@LyonsArcade]

We've had a couple of 'em.... - kzbin.info/www/bejne/enKUdnusiKxretE

[@robertlipsett2535]

good job on fixing the game. the monitor looks like it could benefit from a manual degauss though. I think the 4600 in general looks pretty good in general but they are a pain to work on and half the ones I see have that restraining arm that hold the boards in is missing and I have to fabricate something with a shade baffle which a friend gave me a ton of and get used for all types of things I need scrap wood for. waiting to see you take on a real challenge of something like a watchdog vector side of an asteroids.

[@krisreddish3066]

PIng Pong the non video game and Missile Command the video game are the only two games that give me a certain headache when playing at a high skill level. Good at both. Get an odd tension headache in the back of my brain. Feels like a brain cramp. :P I would love to get to work on old arcades though. More my electronics type than newer stuff with ball grid arrays and SMD chips that I need a ton of equipment for. Just me, a multimeter, and a schematic. Sounds fun.

[@Rep2369]

Hey Ronnie (and Joey)! Just curious as to what model rejuvenator you use? Have you done a video of doing one to a tube? (I don't remember seeing one from y'all but my memory isn't that great anymore and I have seen them on other channels). I am curious of your setup and how you do them, very cool to see them used and the magic they can (sometimes lol) produce on an old tube! Thanks again as always for the video and sharing with us, always look forward to your uploads and appreciate the extra work done so we can watch! :)

[@LyonsArcade]

We mess around a little bit with one on the last half of this video: kzbin.info/www/bejne/p3aWc4aDdqdka7M We've got about 6 or 7 different models!

[@Rep2369]

@@LyonsArcade Oh wow, I will check that out. Thanks so much Ronnie! I more than likely saw it and just don't remember it lol. I watch a lot of electronics and arcade repair stuff. I appreciate it! Seems a lot of B&K's seem to be popular with most for rejuvenators. I hadn't seen it done til on here a few years back, and found it REALLY cool! Thank you again my friend! :)

[@PlumGurly]

I saw him use it in one video, and in the one I remember, he didn't bother attempting rejuvenation because of where the short was. I don't know if this hack will be of any use, but I've heard of some grounding the filament wires and applying 2nd anode voltage to the remaining pins. I guess they unpin the 2A from the CRT and tie it to a plastic rod or something. Supposedly, if you have a grid to cathode/filament short, you could possibly burn it loose this way. And yeah, if a CRT is already bad, you really have nothing to lose this way. I once had a monitor with a CRT that had a cathode to grid short. Bapping it did very little. It was still too dark with brightness and contrast turned wide open, and 1-2 colors were still missing. That was the unit I hacked by putting an EGA CRT in a VGA monitor.

[@LITTLE1994]

Great rescue

[@PlumGurly]

I imagine that 8-bit machines were not too handicapped in comparison to the 16-bit machines of the day. For instance, take the i8088. That was a cutdown 8086. It was a 16-bit CPU, but everything was done using an 8-bit bus. So the bus had to make 2 trips for 16-bits, and really, that was 3 trips at least because the address and data lines were also shared. Then on top of that, those same lines were needed for ports and IRQ signaling. Sure, there were separate IRQ/NMI lines to signal the fact of the matter, but the data lines were to tell the CPU which vector to use. So in comparison to a 6502 machine with much less memory, a 1.59 MHz 6502-based machine could do a little more work than an IBM XT at 4.77 MHz. Or, take the TMS9900 as used in the TI-99/4A computer. It is a 16-bit CPU, but the board designers cut down the computer to only use an 8-bit bus. On top of that, the CPU had no registers (besides maybe a program counter). So while the 6502 and I guess, the 6800 could use Page 0 much like "extra registers," the TMS9900 only had Page 0 to use as registers. So they installed SRAM for Page 0 but DRAM for everything else. They made other design decisions that I wondered about. I think it uses the Big Endian storage format instead of the more common Little Endian. And it is byte-addressed despite being 16 bits. As I said in a previous text wall, you could do larger numbers with an 8-bit CPU, but it will take you a while. However, that isn't as bad as you'd think. I mean, in earlier CPUs, the more bits you had, the more latency you need. For instance, try designing a 16-bit CPU using 74xx gates. You can do that. But then, you get to the ALU. Logic operations are truly done in parallel, but additions/subtractions are not. As long as you chain only 2 nibble adders to get 8 bits, you could get some useful speed out of it. But if you used 4, you'd need to drop the clock rate. The reason for that is that although those are "fast" tree adders, chaining them introduces a carry ripple. With 2, you'd need twice the time of 1, and with 4, you'd need 4x the time. Of course, you can mitigate that and make up for some of that lost latency. So if you need 8 bits, you could use 3 nibble adders and some multiplexers. For the upper nibble, you'd let 2 adders work that, getting the carry-in signal from Vcc (+5V) for one and Gnd for the other. As for the Carry-Out for the low nibble, you send that to a multiplexer. So the low nibble carry-out decides which high nibble output goes on the bus. You could scale that to 16 bits, but that starts eating up components. My point is that nowadays, it is possible to get much higher clock rates for 8-bit CPUs than for wider ones. And with the right coding, you don't have as bad a bottleneck as you'd think. Really, if you want older machines to perform better, reworking things to use a 65C02 @ 14 MHz or so would greatly increase things. And if you could disassemble the ROMs, optimize them in assembly using the extra 65C02 instructions, and make new ROMs with the new instructions, you could improve performance more. Or shoot, you could rework a 6502 system to use the '816. Still, that would be more efficient though the code in '816 mode would be a bit awkward/weird. You'd have new instructions and some 16-bit operations. The '816 can use a 24-bit address bus, but the upper 8 bits are carried on the data bus. That increases board complexity unless you intend to limit it to 16 address bits. You'd only be able to use 64K in that case, but that might be worth it for a 6502 with more instructions. There is one other thing to consider. The 6502 and similar used BCD instructions. Those were good to use for high scores and things. You can convert those to ASCII without using division.

[@Solitaire1]

Missile Command was one of those games that I just did not like. Cause it kicked my butt every time I ever played it. Even the Atari 2600 version I had. For whatever reason my brain just could not time my shots with the correct lead from the correct base. thus resulting in a mild dislike for it that lasts to this day. Galaga is affected by the 256 thing. When you pass stage 255 the screen will display "Stage 0", the stage badges disappear, and game play pretty much stops. You can still control your ship and shoot but no enemies will come out to fight. You have to reset the machine to get it playable again. Galaga was my game back then and it wasn't hard for me to get there. Park a bar stool in front of the cabinet and go. A couple of times I would be on stage 255 and told a watching kid that I would give them my game after I finish that stage. It really confused them and I made a big deal about them "breaking" the machine which was fun. I understand that a ROM that corrected the issue was made for Galaga becuase of it appearing in the movie War Games and a tie in contest to get the world record was on in arcades. The local Aladdin's Castle had a Galaga set up with a secondary monitor on top and I asked them about it. The manaager told me about the ROM and that they had to install it in their cabinet so it could be a part of the contest.

[@ocsrc]

Atari was pretty good about safety, especially since it was the 70s and you could have pretty unsafe things making it to market. The fans your brother bought just recently and cleaned, having a giant metal fan that is basically a spinning saw blade, with a wire grill so big you could easily stick your hand in and have it slice your fingers off. People were not dumb. They knew not to stick their fingers in the spinning fan blades. Now the amount of safety built in to everything and the number of warnings are just funny till you realize most young people don't know not to stick their finger in the electrical equipment. When I heard that a property owner renting to college students came in for the move out and all the light bulbs were burnt out and not one of the college students knew how to change a lightbulb Not a clue where to start. That is scary

[@jon759]

"It's broke" I love it 🤣

[@flyguille]

What about the purity problem it shows? It was impacted?

[@chadhartsees]

I think the trigger cancels a missile that's already fired might be a dipswitch setting, or missile can't be shot until the last one exploded. (Or maybe that was 2600 game variations? Or maybe it was a hack kit from GCC?) I know there were also settings for fast/slow trackball and selecting if you have the big or small track ball, which also messes with the speed/how it plays.

[@jumpingeneral]

Hey bro happy Friday ! Great work 🤝. Take care

[@naytch2003]

It's Saturday man come on now 😆

[@LyonsArcade]

Have a good weekend, Thanks for watching!

[@Hounddoggy33]

If you DON'T get a high score you should see "THE END".

[@jasonsteverson4609]

Hey Joe!! No offense to Ron and the way-too-many pinball vids(even tho I learn something new in every one) but, more Arcade vids please!!

[@LyonsArcade]

It takes about 5 times as long to fix a pinball as it does an arcade so that's why there's more videos on them

[@barrylenhart7240]

The game limits you to 10 missiles on the screen at once. Guess that maxes out the computing power of the game. My local Lowes has the correct 1.5 diameter light bulbs for the marquee instead of the 1 inch that doesn't fit in the metal bulb retainers that well. Does any one sell the volcano shaped hex screws used to retain the marquee bracket to the cabinet? My Missile Command is missing one and I would like to rind a correct replacement.

[@AndreSjoberg]

Also, any chance of any repair videos coming up in the future for a Roller Disco pinball? Or other system 1 pinballs? I’ve gotten my hands on a roller disco here in norway for 500 bucks, kind of sort of starts up but loooks like spider chips might be corroded so have to switch to new motherboard and get a harness since someone soldered the harness wires directly to main board, and corrosion from the built in battery that wasn’t replaced by a removable one - got my work cut out for me and could use some inspiration in addition to the other videos I’ve found :)

[@LyonsArcade]

We don't have any System 1 games coming up in the near future unfortunately but we do have a bunch we've already done videos on. Roller disco is very cool!

[@georgeshelton6281]

This was definitely a hard video game to play. I learned that you definitely had to play it with concentration. It's understandable that we didn't have any laser satellites that shot down ICBMs/nuclear warheads just as yet, back then, in 1980.

[@andyauthor2007]

There are 2 world records for this game. The marathon world record is by Victor Sandberg with a score of 103,809,990 and the game lasted 71 hours and 41 minutes. There is a dip switch setting that never awards you a bonus city (you get 6 cities and that's it). This is referred to as "tournament" settings. The world record holder on tournament settings where you are never awarded a bonus city is by Tony Temple with a score of 4,472,570.

[@Robotron2084psn]

Roy Shildt is the true MC champion

[@LyonsArcade]

Roy's pretty great at it

[@AndreSjoberg]

sweeeet, t-shirts, any chance of shipping to Norway?

[@neverknowit11]

Any battery leakage?

[@BaccarWozat]

11:05 Not being a fan of Stevie Wonder, I can't identify the song of his that's playing in the background except I recognize it as his song.

[@patrickradcliffe3837]

10:47 looks like it use a degausse that bottom left look very off color.

[@SpearM3064]

He DID degauss it. The picture tube is just too old for that to completely fix it.

[@simonjandrell5897]

that game was rock hard

[@sideburn]

There’s that movie of that one guy where the board kept randomly resetting and he kept swapping out boards and playing marathons and it kept resetting driving him nuts cuz he couldn’t figure it out 😂

[@keithhallam4073]

High Score (2006) no relation to the recent Netflix doc of the same name

[@sideburn]

@@keithhallam4073 yes that’s the one. Pretty funny. Glad the mystery was finally solved (after the movie came out).

[@BillAnt]

255 is the hex number FF which is what these early machines used for addressing (aka 8-bit). Programmers had to take care of the carry bit once it went over 255 otherwise it would glitch out. In PacMan the issue was the lack of memory and some programming bug.

[@KaPH33n]

8 bits of binary can store the values 0 to 255. 256 requires 9 bits of information. the special programming numbers you are referring to are powers of two. 2, 4, 8, 16, 32, 64, 128, 256...

[@Unrivaledanime]

My favorite game growing up

[@tango_doggy]

Reposting from a reply because I think this is good on its own too: The 256 rollover problem is not specific to binary or computers. Imagine if you were counting from 0 and you could only use 3 digits (like a combination lock where each digit is on a separate spinning cylinder). You would go from 0 to 1 to 2 ... to 99 to 100 to 101.. then finally to 999. If you continued counting normally (without the 3 digit limitation) you would go to 1000, however you only have 3 digits so the 4th digit is ignored and you're back at 0. 8-bit processors like the 6502, which Missile Command runs on, work with 8 bit (bit just means a binary digit) binary numbers. Specifically, they have 8-bit data buses, which means the processor can only receive and send out 8-bit numbers, and an 8-bit ALU which means they can only perform operations on 8-bit numbers. Counting up from 0 in binary (base 2) would look like the following: 0, 1, 10, 11, 100, 101, 110, 111, 1000... The number of digits (bits) goes up exponentially, so 1 digit can hold 2 values (0 and 1), 2 digits can hold 4 values (0 through 3), 3 digits can hold 8 values (0 through 7)... 8 digits can hold 256 values (0 through 255). It is possible to store values in 16-bits (and any arbitrary multiple of 8 bits) using an 8-bit processor although it increases the size of the program and is generally slower and harder to work with

[@swk38]

RJ Mical explains the 256 bug in a video about sinistar

[@ronwade5646]

In 1980 I made a ton of money fixing these things!

[@FUGP72]

How does that monitor NOT have MISSILE COMMAND burn in? That was one of the worst offenders

[@Pauls-World]

Edge connector gets dirty

[@LyonsArcade]

Yes they do

[@Unrivaledanime]

Now I have to find a game to buy

[@Petri547]

Missile Command is a cool arcade game. I've played it in real life. You've got a cold at summer?

[@adenshures6573]

2:25 It's broken, not broke as in no money.

[@LyonsArcade]

Does a broken arcade game make money? Thanks for playing

[@matteogiberti3297]

Damn! The trackball on the right... I prefer it to be on the left and firebuttons on the right otherwise I'm crap playing missile command...

[@NoelRamakers]

First, let me tell you I enjoy all your videos. But is there any way you can put the camera on manual focus while filming gameplay. Even if the focus is not perfect, it wil stay the same and it makes watching it even more enjoyable.

[@LyonsArcade]

Unfortunately Noel I cannot set it on manual focus because I've already recorded the video

[@NoelRamakers]

@@LyonsArcade 🤣I meant for future videos

[@ShawnBernard70]

​@@LyonsArcade❤

[@pajamamar2011]

You'll see "the end" if you don't achieve any of the top high scores.

[@dh-_1011]

Re: the book. I think that’s the book that was done by curious Marc’s guy. There is a vid on his channel about it I think.

[@dh-_1011]

@@abcminiuser Those dudes are scary smart.

[@casstelles]

For those who argue that it's 255 versus 256 do not understand how computing works. Computers start at zero versus a human who starts one due to human presuming that zero has been already established. A computer does not know where to start. So, zero is established on counters. This means that a computer has integer values from 0 to 255, but there are 256 integer values total. So, level one in a game is actually level zero to a computer even though a person calls it level one.

[@jonathandulchinos1766]

And lol can I get t-shirt on your site if u have some left

[@LyonsArcade]

We have a few left if you want to email us we will send you our paypal info if we have your size

[@lurkersmith810]

The reason 256 is a problem with some software is if you're using an 8 bit variable, the highest number you can represent is 255 (1111 1111). 256 is a rollover which would be 1 0000 0000, but you don't have the 9th bit, so you either throw an error (overflow) or you roll it over to 0000 0000 again. The end result depends on the system and software running. I'd imagine if 256 cities = 0 cities, then that's Game Over when the software makes that check, probably when clearing a level. Either that, or it crashes as soon as it detects an overflow, and does a full reboot. Of course, I was a hardware tech, not a programmer, so what do I know?

[@televisionuser7154]

Did your voice change in this video? Or is this a different Joe?

[@lull_the_un]

If you had a pinball machine with five score reels, what happens when your score changes from 90,000 to 100,000? It rolls over to zero and starts counting over again from zero. For the 256 problem the "score reels" only hold two numbers each instead of the ten numbers that a pinball score reel would hold (0-9), that's why the magic numbers are powers of two. For pinball scores, the scores would roll over at powers of 10 (100,000 points - 1,000,000 points - 10,000,000 points) because each of the score reels holds ten digits for that number's place, but the programming scores roll over at powers of 2 (256 - 512 - 1,024) because their "score reels" only hold two digits each. (not to explain the 256 problem, just to help visualize why the magic numbers tend to be powers of 2)

[@DAVIDGREGORYKERR]

I ported Missile Command from the MEMOTECH MTX512 to the AMSTRAD PC1512 in BORLAND TURBO C (Sorry for shouting guys but it is the way it is on the side of the box)

[@CustomGames-wg9gv]

The "256 thing" is also known as the "kill screen".

[@mikebell2112]

Games have 8 bit registers. So 11111111 is 255 (256) then it rolls over to 00000000 (level 0 or 1 again) and the program doesn't know what to do with it. They could get another 8 bits (a byte) involved and go up to 65536 but they probably figure 256 is enough.

[@mikebell2112]

Or they could wrangle another bit from somewhere and get 512. But memory was also precious in those days.

[@mikebell2112]

Oh and if they want to use all 8 bits and get 256 levels they'll make 0 mean level 1 then it will roll over from level 256 to level 1. If it's 255 levels they're not using zero so after level 255 it's level 0 and then it's broke.

[@cheeseparis1]

@@mikebell2112 ... "and then it's broke" made my day !

[@repro7780]

I was pretty decent on Missile Command, but sucked on Defender/Stargate! My best and fave is Tempest; which is the only arcade game that I have.