Replacing the Korg Kronos?

[@eugenephillips481]

As a classical pianist, thank…you…for…talking…about….escapement!! You are literally one of the ONLY reviewers (outside of Ed Diaz) to talk about this piano specific mechanism. People who don’t understand real acoustic pianos don’t understand this one concept is the difference for genuine piano keybed feel. You get it!!! I applaud you!!!

[@darrickkeels6387]

Yes the PHA-50 is a great keybed. My classical chops are terrible though. I could probably learn to get through Chopin's Nocturne op.9 No.2 in about 6 months. 😄😄

[@JHS56247]

I want to Thank Mr. Darrick Keels for an incredible review where you explain the work flow between Keyboard and computer, and the practicality of using the MPC One in live performances in the different churches you are invited to. I did not know a person can record into Ableton software to then transfer to the MPC One, that is stellar information. I find myself in the same situation of soon becoming a traveling musician. Since I cannot pick up and travel with my Roland Fantom 88 every week to church because it is too big, your advice and information is great. Thank you for the many helpful videos you produce. Blessings.

[@darrickkeels6387]

Well thank you for watching!!

[@thepianocoverman1800]

I wish I had your knowledge in my brain to be able to do what you do. I am just getting started on this stuff as a hobby and I realize that you have probably been doing this full time for years. Great video and very informative.

[@Phant0mK16]

Not to mention that the 16 Audio and Midi in/out works with all DAWs. Also you can use the integrated sequencer as you are using Ableton by triggering different paterns and groups via the Pads on the Fantom 🙌🏽

[@ottomanbeatsofficial]

How do you guys save your projects to back them up, like if your using a DAW? Do you convert the melodies in to audio file first?

[@johnathanshuey7776]

Thanks for this video! Great setup and I enjoy the passion in your voice! You are doing something you are created to do!! I also work for a church and create our own tracks for worship. I started sequencing contemporary tracks for church back in 2003. I had a Yamaha Motif and a Korg Triton Studio. The original Motif did not have the polyphony… The Korg sounded fine but didn’t have the contemporary sound. Then in 2004, I got the Motif ES and it worked out so great, I still use the ES to sequence my worship tracks. I’m looking for updated sounds with the same workflow. Hopefully Korg releases a Kronos replacement within 2022! Also looking at a Fantom 7 and the Kurzweil K2700. Keep making music!!

[@JuanitoGT502]

I never replaced my KORG KRONOS X 73 is the best and now I planing to get the Yamaha Montage 7

[@KarlRKaiser]

After intensive research, I've decided to buy the same instrument.

[@hificomics]

Darrick, love all your vids! Very thorough with useful criticisms and info. Now, let's hope Korg has a Kronos 3 someday soon :)

[@mississippimeatloaf1637]

The original Yamaha motif, Korg Triton and Roland Fantom S will always be my favorites, those are the boards that set the standard for today's boards

[@ablesam]

More like foundations for the workstation concept. Not standards. Standards would be the FANTOM X/G sequencer, Roland sampler, Korg hardware and Yamaha's very optimized AWM2 sound engine.

[@mississippimeatloaf1637]

@@ablesam which the Yamaha motif, Korg Triton and Roland Fantom S all had, I've played all kinds of workstations and keyboards over the past 40 years and it doesn't get any better than those three in my humble opinion, foundations for the workstation concept would be boards like the Korg T series, and the Yamaha DX1

[@ablesam]

@@mississippimeatloaf1637 I was talking about the foundations for the modern workstation boards. The M1 and JV1000 were the first workstation boards. They didn't have proper sampling or sampling at all. I was talking about the modern line of keyboards. The Fantom-S brought the sampling and advanced sequencing capabilities to Roland. The Motif pretty much had everything at launch and the Triton beat both Roland and Yamaha to it by doing it first. So they were the foundation on which their future boards continued. The best of Fantom was the Fantom-G. The best of the Motif was the Motif-XF. The best of the Triton ended up in M3, since Kronos and Nautilus are based on the OASYS platform. My personal favourites from these are the Motif-XF, Fantom-X and the M3.

[@mississippimeatloaf1637]

@@ablesam those were your favorites, personally the ones I named were my favorites, and you are incorrect, the very first workstation was the mini moog

[@ablesam]

@@mississippimeatloaf1637 Favourites I understand. But how is the Mini Moog the first workstation? The definition of a workstation is this, a musical instrument combining a keyboard, a synthesizer engine, a sequencer and a sampling engine. That is the definition of a workstation. The Mini Moog was the first monophonic synthesizer that had a keyboard and was affordable and portable. Its not a workstation. The first workstation was from Korg, its called the M1. That had a sequencer and tone generation engine. Then when sampling became more famous, they introduced the Korg Triton which had sampling capabilities. The Mini Moog is not a workstation since it only has an analogue tone generation engine without a sequencer.

[@malcolmgregoire1019]

I have been a Korg user since the mid-nineties and now with Kronos and Wavestate, I pretty much have what I need as I am not a professional. I would like to explore the better interface of the Fantom, but my funds are limited being on a fixed retirement income. I can keep dreaming though.

[@madness8556]

You have a great set up buddy. Enjoy! 👍👍

[@amb13nt59]

Love my Kronos, though I can imagine, for a pianist (which I’m not), the keybed is definitely lacking.

[@Nighthawkclips]

The Kronos on the verge of being a vintage piece of gear I’m keeping mines😎

[@darrickkeels6387]

I am certainly keeping mine

[@Nighthawkclips]

@@darrickkeels6387 smart man

[@robson969]

Hi, as always an excellent lesson. Congratulations !!! I have a Yamaha Montage 7 and Kornos2 73 that I don't sell for nothing. Even though Kronos is an old keyboard, it serves me very well, even more expanding with 14 Kapro boards. I'm thinking of replacing the montage 7 by Roland fantom7, there have been many interesting updates for Fantom, nothing comes out on yamaha, the question remains is Yamaha preparing any new release to replace the montage?

[@darrickkeels6387]

Those Kapro expansions are the best expansions I've ever heard on a hardware keyboard. Truly really good stuff!

[@robson969]

@@darrickkeels6387 In terms of sound and I could only choose one, which do you consider to be the best, Montage or Fantom?

[@darrickkeels6387]

@@robson969 If I was only grading based on sounds, it would have to be the Yamaha. To my ear Yamaha makes the best "real instrument" samples overall. What I mean by real instruments is, ensemble strings, solo strings like violins and cellos. If I need a saxophone, flute, acoustic or electrical guitar the Montage is really hard to beat. Also I am proficient enough using the AWM-2 sound engine to create "synth like" sounds that come very close to some of Roland's signature sounds if need be. It's easier for me to recreate a synth strings patch that sounds close to the classic Roland Jupiter 8 than to try fixing a saxophone, flute or cello on the Fantom.

[@Roddis]

Have you tried the Kronos LS-88. I have it and it's amazing

[@darrickkeels6387]

No I haven't but I hear it's magnificent. It has to be lol! It's a Kronos

[@descargamusicalny]

Nice video. Can you make a video explaining your live set with the mpc one please, I might look into getting an mpc one if it can do live track clip launching.

[@darrickkeels6387]

Hmm...I may do that.

[@rullirosandi3281]

@@darrickkeels6387waiting …😀

[@cadoanduong2990]

I still don't understand why Roland doesn't support DAWs other than Logic and Ableton???

[@darrickkeels6387]

The companies like Image-Line (FL-Studios), AVID (Protools), Fender (Presonus Studio One), etc have to allow Roland access to their proprietary source code in order for Roland to do what they did with Ableton Live and Apple's Logic Pro and MainStage. Also there are licensing fees that have to be paid as well. It is not in Yamaha's best interest to "help" Roland in any way. They are probably working on an immersive DAW integration system for their own keyboard(s). My guess is that which ever keyboard replaces the Montage will have such integration with Cubase because they are both Yamaha. AVID and Image Line either told Roland "no" or their licensing fees were too high and Roland didn't want to give up the profit margin. In short giving someone your access code is like a chef giving out their secret recipe. Roland could take what they learn and develop their own DAW and put you out of business or take marketshare from you. So there is risk involved for most companies. Getting companies to share their secrets and intellectual property isn't cheap or easy.

[@cadoanduong2990]

@@darrickkeels6387 Thank you very much for the very complete and detailed answer. So, what do you think when Arturia, Behringer, Native Instruments, Akai, Novation, Mackie...can do that?

[@darrickkeels6387]

@@cadoanduong2990 I'm not sure what you mean. When they can do what?

[@cadoanduong2990]

@@darrickkeels6387 I mean why can't Roland support other DAWs but while Arturia, Behringer, Native Instrument can

[@darrickkeels6387]

@@cadoanduong2990 You can use the Roland Fantom with any DAW. A DAW is controlled through MIDI commands. The uniqueness of the Fantom is that when controlling Ableton, Logic or MainStage it shows up on the Fantom's screen. It looks like a condensed version of the DAW. This greatly reduces the amount of time you have to look the computer screen. It moves you from just having "generic" controls that have to be learned and sometimes memorized. It feels like you are simply working with hardware.

[@akibe7608]

+Darrick Keels. Of ALL of the hardware boards available, which have the best patches overall? I'm only talking about the quality and quantity of the patches.

[@darrickkeels6387]

To me it is a tie between the Yamaha Montage and the Korg Kronos.

[@akibe7608]

@@darrickkeels6387 So, I was able to get a Jupiter-80 off of Reverb and it sounds GREAT. I'm strictly a live player, and UI and sounds are pretty much all I care about. SOmeone told me "The Roland Fantom has all the Jupiter 80 sounds and a lot more.' Do you know that to be true?

[@ST-ry7lr]

Why didn't you just buy a Fantom 8 instead of the Fantom 7? It has the exact same keyboard as the RD2000.

[@thomjohn98]

Hi.. First off.. Thank you Darrick for taking the time to make this video, very informative.. Please keep up the great work.. Here is what I am currently using a Roland Fantom 08, Yamaha MODX7, and a Nord Electro 2 Seventy Three for live use.. In the past few years I've owned and used: Korg Kronos 88, Korg Krome 73, Korg OASYS 73, Roland Fantom X8, Roland FA-08, Kurzweil PC3K7, Kawai MP7, and a Nautilus 88.. I too wasn't impressed with the Korgs at all, they didn't play well with other gear or DAWs.. I am using Cubase Studio 5 and the way I wanted the Korgs to work was impossible so they had to go.. Now using the Fantom - 08 very nice keyboard, has great sounds and it is fairly light at 33 pounds for a weighted action 88.. It combined with the Yamaha MODX7 is a great combination for live use, and am constantly getting compliments for the sound of the saxes and strings on the Yamaha.. Now the Nord needs to leave the group and am looking to trade it for a Roland FA-07 and that should complete my live rig..

[@darrickkeels6387]

Sounds like a great setup!

[@akibe7608]

+Darrick Keels Have you done any videos comparing software to hardware?

[@darrickkeels6387]

Not yet. It's coming

[@JoseVGavila]

Good selection of keyboards!. I think you made a good choice 👍 Mine is the Montage, but I am not an advanced player and it is more than I need

[@IMakeBeats]

Hey 👋🏾 @Darrick Keels, I can honestly say after owning my Kronos2 for a short time, (2yrs) it isn’t a very easy workstation to use. It is like a college course. I only use it as a sound module. But I can also say that the sounds are hard to match on other keyboards 🎹. Great video as always. Who know I may end up putting up for sale and get something more user friendly since I only use it as a sound module 🤷🏾

[@darrickkeels6387]

I mix VSTs and hardware sounds when laying down tracks. Like you, I use a LOT of Native Instruments sounds, which in my opinion sound much better than the Kronos or Roland. So for me in the studio workflow becomes more important than sounds. Also I find that proper composition, EQ, compression, and overall mixing has a much bigger affect on the outcome than which keyboard sounds I use. I can have the greatest grand piano sound but if it is taking up too much of the frequency spectrum in a mix or has too much (or too little) reverb, it will sound awful in the context of its song. Always good to see you on my channel Sir!

[@IMakeBeats]

@@darrickkeels6387 you and I spoke about my situation, I’m trying to slowly get my mind back on KZbin and not on life itself! Hard but certain people on KZbin I will stop by for sure and you are one of them.

[@darrickkeels6387]

@@IMakeBeats Can't wait to see you back.

[@Mroneflo]

@@darrickkeels6387 Thanks Darrick! That means alot that you stop by and watch my videos as well. I'm working on another sponsered video for this Friday or Saturday so fingers crossed! lol Apricate the encouragement!

[@liothomasart]

No way on earth I'll replace my Kronos. A beast. It's just a keeper. Just adding a Kurzweil for the VAST engine on top of that and you set.

[@DNGMaestro]

Seems like you’re a fan of old school, outdated, inintuitive UI’s my friend.

[@matthewgaines10]

@@DNGMaestro I guess I’m a fan of “unintuitive” UIs too. Go figure. I’m probably a more a fan of tactile feel more than anything.

[@0megalul309]

@@DNGMaestro fan of good sound

[@evolution227]

100% correct , Kronos is still head and shoulders above everything else. Nothing sounds like it. The only board I’ve ever experienced where I could say it has no weaknesses. Workflow in exchange for the sound and versatility of the Kronos ??? Never Just a phenomenal board. It just keeps on giving.

[@youngmo77]

@@DNGMaestro Really ? Especially when your very latest technology is still years behind Kurzweil, substantially stole the very outdated tech AND are still years behind ? But go ahead...

[@robson969]

Congratulations on the video. Have you tested the jupiter 8 and Juno 106 expansion for the Fantom 0? Did you manage to analyze if the output sounds the same as physical keyboards?

[@darrickkeels6387]

I haven't actually.

[@MichaelDaniels241]

From a KORG Sales Specialist I Begged for the CuE List from Korg, and they took it away from my Kronos II and you speak of what I have been saying, They need a UPDATE ...

[@darrickkeels6387]

I think Korg rested on their success with the Kronos and that was a mistake. When the Kronos launched it was way ahead of its competition but the music landscape has changed. The motherboard and processor in the Kronos was "old" when it launched. A company must keep innovating. Kurzweil used to be a major player. Not anymore. And now they lack the revenue to engage in advanced research and development. So when they launch new products like the K2700 it feels dated at launch. The audio interface in the K2700 is 2 in 2 out. The Fantom is 32 out and 6 in. The Montage is 34 out and 6 in. The user interface that houses VAST feels like a system from the 90's. In this cellphone, laptop and iPad age it's no longer acceptable to be overly complicated to use. No one reads a manual on how to operate an iPad even though it is very powerful. It's powerful and intuitive. Just creating a great sounding, "powerful" keyboard will not bring sales. Korg will get left behind in this sector if their next move isn't a big one.

[@andreafox7267]

Very neat setup. Sounds like a great combination of keyboards especially as you’ve got it for music production and live performance.

[@joehenthompson2023]

Great video. I really liked how you base you choice of equipment according to your workflow. Not to mention the simplicity of your rig and the power to get the job done quicker and more efficiently. Great stuff.

[@darrickkeels6387]

Thank you for watching!

[@lbamusic]

Truly interesting! Tremendously helpful vid....about to buy another keyboard and was wondering about different keybed feels..thanks much!

[@taggartjs]

Ok, trying this again. I had a great comment but I clicked off KZbin and lost it before I could send it. Yes, I’m an idiot. LOL Anyway, I bought a Kronos 2 last year, mainly for live performances. Love, love, love the Setlist, sequencer, and audio tracks for backing parts. Plus, the sounds are awesome. Loved Korg since I bought my DW-6000 back in the day. However, I played two shows with it and just about broke my back and got a hernia. I’m 57 and I ain’t got time for that…literally! LOL So now she’s my “studio queen” and I’ve gone back to my FA-07 for live stuff. My workflow now is to sequence in Digital Performer then export the MIDI files into Auria Pro on my iPad and use that live. Plus, I make a backup MP3 file, just in case. Music on the left, click on the right. No muss, no fuss. Love your videos, Darrick! I’m always learning something from each one!

[@darrickkeels6387]

Sounds like a great setup!

[@Eighty8Music]

also a piano player/synth/keyboard player here, so much helpful info, thanks! Currently use Juno DS88 as controller using logic, but sounds aren't great when using live. Was considering Korg Nautilus, would be interesting to hear your thoughts on this minor Kronos replacement. Same keybed and sounds. Less controls.

[@madness8556]

Derrick well done with the video. You forgot to mention the fact that it takes almost 3 minutes for the Korg Kronos to boot up! This is potentially disastrous for live performance! It stopped me from buying a Kronos back in 2011 and I got a Kurzweil PC361 instead that takes a fraction of that time to boot up. This is despite the fact that I was a long time Korg fanboy, having owned over a dozen Korg instruments over more than 25 years. Korg are no longer the only kids in town when it comes to hardware workstation type instruments and they really need to be much more competitive in this regard.

[@williamshaneblyth]

well said

[@AShreddedFate]

I remember discovering Kurzweil in high school through Dream Theater's Jordan Ruddess, apparently it's still the case that you'd have to go to them if you want the top notch reliability.

[@aronnelson9849]

The PC361 is great, but the Kronos is still better and easier to program. I use a UPS live and for over a decade the boot time has not been a problem. I do agree it's a long time though. As for studio - it's hard to compete with plugins now.

[@keneokpareke1753]

Agreed. The PHA-50 keys on the RD2000 are untouchable. Also, the Fantom's UI and DAW integration are second to none IMO.

[@MarianoPerez]

I have a motif xs8, and a korg m3m. I have the option of getting a used korg kronos 88, or a modx 8 plus, or a fantom 08. I mainly want as many patches and ability to layer patches to sketch songs or get inspired. Which would you recommend? I'm also thinking f it save the cash and get the rd88 and save at least 600 to 800 bucks. The rd88 has a nice action pha4, which is nice and would also work for synth sounds.

[@Waynyce]

Why not add software instead of another keyboard. There’s some great apps for iPad designed for live performance.

[@MarianoPerez]

@Waynyce performance wise, software falls quite short when it comes to response. These companies do a really good job on velocity and response. I tried vsl pianos and I just couldn't get the piano to sou d right. I ended up with a fantom 8 that I got at really good deal.

[@naveenjedia7445]

Please make a video on How you use (fantom, montage, kronos ) all three keyboards in your live performance. And please explain. Which keyboard is best for which situation . How to use all three keyboards in a live performance

[@darrickkeels6387]

I may do that in the future

[@naveenjedia7445]

@@darrickkeels6387 I am waiting for that . very excited

[@naveenjedia7445]

@@darrickkeels6387 and please explain us. Which sounds are best in Fantom and Which type of sounds are good in montage. And kronos

[@naveenjedia7445]

@@darrickkeels6387 personally what do you think. What sounds you like to play from montage ,fantom, kronos when you perform with all this three keyboards in live which type of sounds you play from which keyboard ?.

[@nilsj1324]

You realize I just bought a Kronos 2 based on the things you have said about it in previous videos. I hope you will keep giving tips and such on it in the future.

[@darrickkeels6387]

It's a great keyboard! I still have mine for sure!

[@AllanLobo]

TR rec and the pattern sequencer of the Fantom did it for me 😂 it's absolutely fantastic and easy

[@mrmister7355]

Use to be a gear head, but now I’m using what you are using the fantom 6, Mpc x, and ableton. As for Mpc keys 61 you already have it Mpc plus fantom. You can use Mpc and spread it across the fantom keys.

[@oldschoollee]

16 stereo or 32 mono outputs over USB would take away any cons I have for Kronos and Nautlus.

[@darrickkeels6387]

My major con for the Kronos is how difficult it is to use. The manuals add up to 1170 pages. I went through the entire thing. But now that I have more work musically, I don't have that kind of time. Things need to vee intuitive for me to use them.

[@benwelchmusic]

I rarely play my Kronos as well, but rather than replace it I would use it as the play out at venues keyboard and not worry about the wear and tear. Now I use a Medeli akx10 on top and an 88 key Privia that is less than 30lb and very portable with a good enough action to feel like a piano. The Medeli is lightweight too. And it can load all the vsts you want as sound fonts. Plus you can hook up mic or guitar with effects and costs only about $700 and I got the Privia used for only $100 so for less than 1k I have a lightweight portable setup like yours and then just use Cubasis on iPad as daw with forScore as your sheet music pdf viewer with page turns synced to the backing track wave file in landscape mode for my old eyes to see. You can even name the registrations on the Medeli which makes it like scenes on the Kronos.

[@williamshaneblyth]

same setup no more kronos for me

[@bsdguy]

The Ableton like control of playback on the Phantom is sweet.

[@darrickkeels6387]

Indeed it is

[@SunlightOfTheSpirit]

Hey Darrick, I have a love/hate thing going on with the Fantom. I love the key bed on the 8. I hate the fact I can’t use the audio interface on the Fantom in Ableton without the audio doubling. Any idea man? I want to keep it but this does my nut in.

[@darrickkeels6387]

Strange I never get audio doubling when I use it with Ableton. I wonder why that's the case for you. Do you have another audio interface that you can use with Ableton so that you you can test where the problem lies?

[@SunlightOfTheSpirit]

@@darrickkeels6387 it’s the routing. I have an original RME Babyface, not the pro one. The TotalMix software allows me to turn direct monitoring off in the software so I only get the Ableton master. Seems I can’t turn local off on the Fantom without it turning all the sound off. I’m stumped.

[@SunlightOfTheSpirit]

@@darrickkeels6387 do you use a separate audio interface for the output? I think this solves it but I want to use the Fantom as input and output.

[@darrickkeels6387]

@@SunlightOfTheSpirit No I don't use a separate output. My laptop is connected to the rest of my studio via the Fantom.

[@Vangelismusic1]

Just wondering would an arranger be easier for you to do your job faster or easier? have you ever considered that?

[@darrickkeels6387]

Arrangers can be quite a bit of fun. I own one. But it rarely gets played because I simply have no need for a bunch of preset styles that follow my chord changes.

[@dvamateur]

Fantom 8 seems to combine these two keyboards into one.

[@darrickkeels6387]

In many ways yes. They have the same keybed and operate in much the same ways. The RD-2000 does have far more editing parameters for its Supernatual Acoustic Pianos and EP's than the Fantom though. You cannot edit the string resonance, damper noise, hammer noise etc on the Fantom's or Fantom-0's SuperNatural Acoustic Pianos. But pretty much the Fantom is superior in most aspects.

[@dvamateur]

@@darrickkeels6387 I see, so the Fantom is not a fully programable instrument? That's good to know. I've been eyeing the Fantom 8 for way too long now, but now, learning this, hmmm... I'll be eyeing a little longer I guess. :) 🙂

[@ablesam]

@@dvamateur It's just the supernatural pianos on FANTOM and F-0 that cant be edited. The V.Piano on the FANTOM is the same and has all the editing parameters from the RD-2000.

[@dvamateur]

​@@ablesam Well, there are other options. The Korg Nautilus 88-key version seems to have more key travel than the RD-2000/Fantom 8. One other keyboard I'd like to try is the Kurzweil K2700, but they don't have it in any of the music stores yet, at least not where I live.

[@18yearsoldnot]

@@ablesam v-piano has just been updated on the rd-2000 and one of the KZbinrs I swear said that it was exclusive to the rd-2000 😂. Do you know what’s going on?

[@markferreri5814]

I have a Fantom 7 and a Kronos 88 key. As most, my preference as to which to use teeters on what I’m playing. Although I do have Logic, my go-to DAW is Cubase. I wish they allowed the Fantom to integrate with them, but being affiliated with Yamaha, it will probably never happen. I also utilize an Integra 7 rompler and my Arturia V Collection a lot in the studio. I’m not a ‘live’ performer though.

[@darrickkeels6387]

I have the Arturia V collection as well. It is awesome!

[@xp50player]

I’m sure the RD-2000 is a better MIDI controller, but I kept my RD-800. It’s less complicated, easy to read color display and the PHA4 Concert keybed is pretty much just as good, without the wood-trimmed sides of the PHA-50.

[@yamahamotifxs]

I also have a Fantom 7, and it's a great instrument, but unfortunately it lacks more important things for me, which have not been added in an operational update to date. I understand that Fantom is a synthesizer and not a Music Workstation, but since it was named Fantom, everyone expected a modern Music Workstation that kept its old features and added extra features like Model Expansion, V-Piano, and Virtual Tonehell organ engine. I think that user arpeggios should be a basic thing in such a synthesizer. I used self-made arpeggios in many songs. Here, Step Record and TR-REC would also be suitable for this, but it cannot be set to a keyboard. The question of polyphony is not even better solved on Kronos. The Kronos is old, but it was a good solution that the 9 motors got separate polyphony. 256 polyphony would be just a dream, because it is not more than 128, and I think that PCM and VA engine in a Zen-Core system is not the best decision, because the use of polyphony is common. I'm currently a Fantom 7 and a Nautilus 7 user, and I've noticed that I've been playing the Fantom 7 a lot less lately. DAW integration is the future, but I still prefer a traditional built-in sequencer. The Fantom sequencer is good, but unfortunately some things cannot be implemented because it requires a Linear sequencer and I don't want to use it with a DAW. I still have faith in Roland to finally fulfill the wishes of many in a new update. Personally, I'd like user arpeggios and a bit more SuperNatural sound, but if that doesn't happen I'll be looking forward to the Montage M announcement. If you offer what I want, I will sell the Fantom. Yamaha's only weakness for me was the lack of Virtual Analog and a decent organ engine. I chose Fantom for one thing, and that is voice programming. You can program great sounds with it, and Nautilus is just like that. I've programmed a lot of sounds, mostly with the AL-1 engine, which I think is great.

[@darrickkeels6387]

According to Roland, it is a workstation. It even says it somewhere in the manual. I personally think Roland should have called it something else besides "Fantom." They stuck with the name and decided to try redefining the title "workstation." It just ended up with a lot of people buying it and waiting for updates to "fix" it. Now they are angry because the fixes aren't coming. I don't have a crystal ball but I don't think Roland is going to turn the Fantom into a "traditional workstation." Meaning, I don't think it will be an all-in-one solution. I wouldn't say DAW integration is the "future;" I'd say it's the present. There is even a DAWless movement afoot amongst certain "beatmakers" and producers, who are leaving their DAWs. But that involves people who buy small drum machines, little inexpensive synths, and such. They aren't the $4000 workstation buying type in general. That means there is a small subgroup of people that have been using DAWs and are moving away from them lol! DAWS however have really replaced the workstation in the professional segment and it has been that way for well over a decade now. Most people buying workstations these days are live performers. But even amongst live performers, as you get younger people playing in churches, bars, restaurants, etc the number of musicians using traditional workstations goes down even further. If Roland wants to be a viable brand in the next 10-20 years they had to make a change their loyal but older customers would not like. I grew up using keyboards like the M1, Roland XP80, Motif, Triton ,etc. My son's first introduction to production is on FL Studio. He has a small Native Instruments MIDI controller. When I had him use my Kronos, he was completely lost and absolutely could did not enjoy the experience. He would ask questions like "Where can I see all of my audio tracks at once so that I can trim them and line them up?" "Does it have a pitch correction plugin of any kind?" "How do I 'undo' several times?" My answer to most of his questions were "no." He's 13. Right now, to him the names Roland and Korg just mean "old people stuff" LOL! If that mindset prevails the brands we know and love will be obsolete unless they appeal to a younger audience.

[@yamahamotifxs]

@@darrickkeels6387 I think that, from this point of view, a cheaper controller keyboard with which the DAW works perfectly is more worthwhile among young people. If this is the direction, then in the coming years it will be more worthwhile to buy a stage design synthesizer, because there will always be a demand for it. I'm not a professional musician, I only use Fantom 7 and Nautilus 73 and my Access Virus TI2 synthesizer at home. I have also used Roland XP60, Korg Trtion, Korg Triton Extreme, Yamaha Motif XS, Motif XF, MODX8 and now Fantom 7 and Nautilus. I was never a fan of Korg after I sold the Korg Triton Extreme. I loved that very much. The Korg M3 was a disappointment, the Oasys is very expensive. The factory sounds of the Korg Kronos sounded very weak to me compared to the Motif XS and XF, although I only looked at them briefly, but I didn't like the PCM sounds. Now that I have a Roland Fantom synthesizer, I bought it primarily for sound programming. I have already programmed at least 700 sounds. I create the sounds with Zenology PRO and load them into Fantom. This is a great thing. I shared my work in the Fantom Facebook group. Why did I buy Nautilus if I didn't like Kronos? Because among the 9 sound engines there is a great Polysix, an MS-20, and my favorite is the AL-1 engine, which I think is better than the Zen-Core VA. It was a bit more difficult to learn to program, but you can make very good sounds with it. I have already made at least 200 sounds with the AL-1. I shared one in the Nautilus Facebook group and many people liked it. So I wasn't a Kronos fan until now, but the Nautilus is also a cheaper Kronos. and I have to admit that I was wrong about Kronos. It's a good instrument, but it really takes a lot of learning. Until now, I mainly programmed sounds, I just started using the sequencer, but the fact is that Fantom is much simpler. The advantage of Fantom is the modern control surface, the much better touch display, which results in much easier navigation, the Model Expansion, although it is part of the Zen-Core engine, which only got a new GUI, which Jupiter 8, Juno 106, JX8p, and SH-101 highlighted the main features, but in an extremely spectacular way, and their sound is great. I don't like N/Zyme that much. The downside of Nautilus is the extremely slow start-up time and the lack of RAM. It's frustrating that if I want to load a Kapro or a KORG library like Legendary Strings, I can't make most of the factory pianos inactive when loading to make room for it.

[@GospelMusic4Life]

Great video as always. Trying to hone in on what I want to use going forward. You can find yourself looking at a lot of keyboards and software and not actually getting anything done. 😃 It probably is good for people to upgrade to newer tech and dump any old stuff while you can get a good price on them. I wonder if the Kronos will maintain any value as a “vintage keyboard” some years from now.

[@darrickkeels6387]

Ah yes...the age old analysis paralysis. Let me say this. Anything I can produce with Ableton Live and the Fantom, I can produce with Ableton Live and the Kronos. On the Kronos it will take me longer usually but I can get the job done. What works for me certainly will not work for everyone. I can objectively state that the Fantom has more advanced integration with Ableton and Logic. But I cannot objectively say it's "better" for studio work than the Kronos. That's a matter of personal preference. The best thing (in my opinion) a musician can do is learn the gear they have and figure out how to make it work for them.

[@geoffk777]

Thanks very much for this. At first, I was wondering why you didn't just replace the RD-2000 with a Fantom 8 (which as the same PHA-50 action). But if you gig with the RD-2000 and also need a lighter action for organ, than it makes sense. I don't really do either, so I just replaced my RD-2000 outright with a Fantom-8. I've thought about getting an MPC, but I'm not a hip-hop player and don't really need a lot of clip capability, and I'm happy using my computer for DAW and sampling work (i..e with Ableton and Kontakt--which I have a fair number of libraries for). I think that you're absolutely right that DAW/computer integration is really more important now than internal workstation capabilities, which hurts the Kronos. Yamaha realized this with the Montage, which is barely a workstation at all in the traditional sense. Of course, Korg has stopped selling the Kronos now, so I expect that the replacement will have good DAW integration (and, hopefully, a much faster boot time!) I also agree about the Roland and Korg actions. Non-pianists often complain that the Roland action is too heavy, but to me, it feels great. There's nothing wrong with the Kronos action, but it just doesn't connect in the same way. Good Luck with your music and channel and God Bless.

[@darrickkeels6387]

Always good to see you on the channel my friend!

[@geoffk777]

@@darrickkeels6387 Yep, Thanks a lot for your help with my Fantom problem. The replacement is working out great so far and all of the SuperNatural expansions now work well.

[@John-lv6uj]

My friend. I own the Yamaha Montage, New Roland Fantom, Roli 49 Rise, MPC-X, MPC 61 Work Station Nice but it still needs work, KORG KRONOS 2 is still Better than Any of the NEW Roland Fantoms Keyboards. The sounds on the Korg Kronos 2 are better. Yamaha Montage sounds are just as great and some GREATER. Korg Kronos 2 is STILL A BEAST after over 10 years KORG KRONOS 2 is still being compared to 2023 NEW Work Stations they are still one of the best. Look at the Price if you don’t believe me. Korg Kronos 2 is still going for TOP PRICE $2,500-$3,500

[@-Anthony.C-]

Hello ! Question 😄 : I've to choose between an used Kronos and the new Nautilus for the same price. According to you, what is the best alternative ?

[@darrickkeels6387]

I'd get a Kronos used honestly over a brand new Nautilus. But that is because I like the controls on the Kronos. I use the sliders quite a bit. The Nautilus stripping down all of the controls really hinders my live playing scenario.

[@-Anthony.C-]

@@darrickkeels6387 Thank you very much for your opinion! All these controllers are very nice and contribute to the sublime design of the Kronos compared to the Nautilus. That said, I'm not sure I'll use them as much as you do. Personally, I will only use the keyboard at home and never for live performance. The Nautilus operating system seems simpler and more modern. Finally, what bothers me the most is the absence of the aftertouch on the Nautilus 😠 but I wonder if it's not a gadget I don't need 😁 Ps : i'm french, my English is probably torture to read.

[@thegoldenamerican]

I can tell that the Roland Fantom is your new bestie:) I have been a Yamaha keyboardist for more than 20 plus years….Classic Motif and the MODX. I love the MODX but it can’t compete with the Fantom as far as computer integration in Logic Pro X. Unfortunately, I cannot record all 16 audio tracks into Logic but only 10, in the MODX.:( ……And being that most of songs have at least 16 tracks of instruments…the MODX, has left me in a pickle…So, because of your videos about the Fantom, prompted me to take the plunge & order one. After 2 months plus….on back order, my new Fantom arrives tomorrow:)

[@darrickkeels6387]

Yes the MODX only allows 10 simultaneous audio tracks to be recorded into a DAW. Of course you can always record the first 10 and then do a second recording to record the other channels. The Kronos however gives you only one stereo track. So when there are 16 stereo tracks, I would have to record 16 times as opposed to one time with the Fantom or Montage. The fact is the Kronos is simply not optimized to work with DAWs. It's a fairly "closed" system in that regard.

[@synthesist3003]

Great review video, I thought you were one of those who would never change the Kronos, but you are using what is best for your workflow which is very acceptable. I still use the korg kronos and will be using it for a pretty long time. I use the wavestate and korg prologue too, and record these two synths into the Kronos sequencer which is my main sequencer right now. I was Logic too but prefer to get away from the computer because I spend the whole day sitting in front of one all day at work. That’s my workflow and it is ok for me 🤷‍♂️

[@madness8556]

I have Logic and I use to often prefer using the excellent on board sequencer in my long gone Korg Triton Classic because it was so intuitive to use and kept me away from the computer,

[@michaelaurelius8507]

@@madness8556 me too. I use my Triton extreme a LOT for sequencing and jamming. Though I do use Logic and I love it, the immediacy of having everything in front of you with the TRITON, OASYS, KRONOS, etc is truly irreplaceable to me.

[@madness8556]

@@michaelaurelius8507 well said. Korg really nailed linear hardware workstation sequencers but they have fallen behind with regards to the more Ableton like loop based sequencing options that have become so popular. Roland Fantom seems to have nailed this although at the expense of omitting proper linear based sequencing. I also had a Korg T3EX which I absolutely loved and milked it to its fullest potential using only its low resolution 8 track sequencer and limited 16 note polyphony.

[@michaelaurelius8507]

@@madness8556 I remember the T-Series! I remember playing a T1 years ago and that sound was phenomenal! Even to this day I still remember how incredible it sounded. I completely understand the limitations even at the time I played one and it truly was an M1 on steroids with 88 keys. But for what it was and still is, and that sound, it really does stand the test of time and does what it was made for incredibly well even to this day.

[@jithinjoseph1057]

Which is good in terms of sound quality? Fantom Or kronos.? Workflow I will stick with roland.. Your video makes sense👍... Thankz darrick

[@darrickkeels6387]

Sound quality wise I think it really just comes down to personal preference. Decades ago there were definitive leaders. But now with the advanced technology in sampling and modeling, they all sound "premium" but different. Just like currently, when it comes to DAW integration with Ableton, Logic and MainStage, Roland is the leader. But a time is coming where they will all probably have deep integration. Or maybe a time is coming in which there will be no difference between DAWs and "hardware." The new MPC Keys 61 comes with 4GB of RAM, 32GB of expandable SSD storage, a Quad-Core processor, Bluetooth, WIFI, and Ethernet. Internally it's constructed just like a laptop. With it comes a lot of the pros and cons of an actual computer. So who knows what a keyboard will even be in 20 years? 😄

[@jithinjoseph1057]

@@darrickkeels6387 I am just watching the newly launched beast akai mpc 61...i am blown away... No korg no roland and no yamaha.. 😄

[@Culture_of_Ghosts]

Darrick, in your view do you think there will be a successor to the Kronos 2 eventually?

[@darrickkeels6387]

I do believe so. Especially because the Fantoms are selling very well, while the Nautilus has not enjoyed the same success. I don't see Korg exiting the segment.

[@김주현-i1s]

I hope Korg to release another new work station.

[@darrickkeels6387]

As do I

[@tuneunleashed]

Why? so you could tell the world you have a Korg Kronos 3 without using all of its features?

[@DojoOfCool]

Excellent video as always and your explanation why your Kronos is a "bench" player now and Fantom is in your starting lineup makes a lot of sense. Your videos and talking to you in DMs was part of what influenced me to get my Kronos and for totally different reason I have moved over to a Nord Stage3. For me like so many I had all these big dreams of what I was going to do with the Kronos. Take the time for it's big learning curve and do a lot of media composition, which it would of been great for. Reality hit I'm old, I mainly just want to play and record a little that I can do with my computer. The Kronos I got tired of everything I want to do involved a menu dive. Yes if I learned more about the programing the Kronos I could of made lists and such, but never did. So an opportunity to play out came up and I needed something smaller, lighter, and easier to get to the sounds I wanted. That led me to the Nord Stage 3 HP76 and have really been happy with that decision. Not only that I like the sound of the sampled piano and instrument more than modeled sounds. Plus no menu diving except of selecting a instrument all the controls are right there in front of me no menu diving. Also the fact I can change/add sounds from the Nord library for free and make samples is another benefit. So like you I've "benched" my Kronos, but for opposite reason for simplifying things.

[@darrickkeels6387]

I'd be the first to say the Korg Kronos is not for everyone. To say it is less than user friendly would be an understatement. I honestly feel there are a lot of Kronos owners out there that just like having it because they feel it gives them "bragging rights." But if you ask them how to assign a knob to open a filter on the PolySix engine while simultaneously closing a filter in the AL-1 sound engine, they have no idea. Or how to control which direction the horn on the rotary speaker simulation will face when it stops spinning. How about putting a gate on a vocal mic input to cut out background noise? The majority of Kronos users do not NEED all of the "power" the Kronos has to offer. And if they were called upon access it they wouldn't even know how. The MOD-7 engine works nothing like the MS-20 and the MS-20 does not work like the AL-1 sound engine. Essentially mastering a Kronos is equivalent to mastering 9 different keyboards with different interfaces, polyphony, and required background knowledge. I personally love it but it was like taking a college class to truly master it. Not everyone has the time or patience for a college class. I always say my most fun keyboard is my Nord Stage 3. My most powerful is my Kronos but it is the least fun. My Nord is my least "powerful." What ever keyboard works best for you is the one to have! Always good to see you on my little channel Toortog!

[@tuneunleashed]

I the Yamaha Montage 8 loved it for 3 days hated it for the rest of the year...traded it with a Nord Stage 3 best decision I've ever made by far...I have buyers remorse at times but definitely dont need another board for the rest of my life until it dies

[@hailey0675]

Excellent explanation thank you very much for sharing your workflow, and teaching us!

[@anthonylascano2378]

It isn't a question of power, but a question of sonic pallete

[@drtolgaege]

As a Yamaha montage, Nord stage, Yamaha mx49! And several other hardware synths etc. user, it is better to go with your old synths and move to Apple silicon MacBook ( best budget model is MacBook Air with 16 gig ram), get keyscape and Logic pro x I am doing that.

[@joonglegamer9898]

This has me wondering if I should sell my Yamaha montage and swap it for a Roland Fantom. The thing is, me and Montage never got to be real good friends over the last year or so because I feel the workflow of the Montage is just too complex for me. Even my Korg Wavestate is SO much easier to make new sounds with, the Yamaha is a beast but I end up never using it. I got a smaller Roland JD-Xi hooked up to an old Yamaha HS-6 "organ" with 3 keybeds and its magically pre-assigned to midi 1 (upper keybed) 2 (lower keybed) 3 the foot pedals (analog midi 3 of the JD-Xi) so everything just integrates so nicely, and the sequencer which is "insta workable" is so nice on the Roland, would you say it's the same for Fantom? Would my prefered workflow fit better with it?

[@darrickkeels6387]

In my opinion the interface and workflow of the Fantom is the best on the market. The fact that the sequencer has a piano roll makes editing a breeze. But there are things I really like about the Montage as well. But my Fantom has earned its spot at the center of my studio rig.

[@joonglegamer9898]

@@darrickkeels6387 Thanks Darrick, I think I need to try out the Fantom one day and feel it for myself, because the cheaper cheerier (but quite powerful little sister) JD-Xi surprised me with the ease of "composing" just roll-and-go, with montage this is , well - rocket science. I kind of want a montage with the recording ease of the Roland Jd-Xi, the Fantom seems to have the same idea with its 16-sequencer buttons layout.

[@joonglegamer9898]

@@darrickkeels6387 I found my Replacement Darrick! Akai MPC Key 61, ordered it straight away when I saw it. :)

[@tonylancer7367]

I can sense a slight sadness as you talk about your Kronos, considering how much you invested time in it and how you loved it, it's now a distant friend whom to talk to from time to time. 😅 To be fair though, it's a great sound module even for a studio. I would guess the new thing now would be how flexible the board is in relation to DAWs, iPhone/iPads and other external gear without crippling you too much, and to me as an Ableton boy, the Fantom really does it for me. I really do wonder what is cooking in those Japanese garages at Korg and Yamaha. By the way, you also won't let go of that RD-2000 because of V-Piano and that keybed, lol.

[@darrickkeels6387]

The Kronos manual I have is 1170 pages of reading. I've spent so much time reading through that thing over the years. Even on lunch breaks at work lol! It took a lot of time to really master it's features and understand its architecture so that I could best utilize its power. But the interface is dated. And the way the RAM is mounted on to the motherboard has caused some reliability problems for many users who move it all the time. (not me though) It's still an awesome keyboard with amazing capabilities and I still use it. But it is simply no longer my main go to. And yes the RD-2000 will stay. I love the keybed and the MIDI interface for controlling other hardware or soft synths. So it works very well live. Workflow becomes extremely important when getting tracks done is literally your job. I simply no longer have the time to read through pages and pages of manuals and fight with gear to implement workarounds that are simply not necessary on more modern equipment. The MPC Key 61 may become my main studio hub but we'll see after I run it through it's paces.

[@tonylancer7367]

@@darrickkeels6387 Even on lunch breaks? Oh my word. 🤣 That's an intense dedication that should not go to waste, Korg should really listen, 1000+ pages is a no from all of us. About the AKAI, it certainly looks interesting. Haven't had time to watch videos on it, but I hear "it's a workstation". I would think that those are dying but maybe this is a new different type of workstations (that syncs with DAWs?)

[@darrickkeels6387]

@@tonylancer7367 It syncs with a DAW for sure. But it also works great in standalone. My MPC One allows me to record in a linear fashion as well as a patterned workflow. It has a piano roll with pinch to zoom functionality. Officially it allows you to record 8 audio tracks but in actuality you can add your audio to the pads and not use up any of the dedicated audio tracks. It has multiple levels of "undo" unlike the Kronos, Fantom, Nautilus, or Montage which only allow you to undo one step back. The sampler blows any traditional workstation sampler out of the water. Nothing comes close. It has an auto multisampling mode which takes the tedious work of creating multisamples upon itself. I rave about the sequencer in one of my videos where I hook it up to my Montage. Coming from Motifs, Tritons, and Fantoms, the MPC is simply way better than all of those units in the sequencing and sampling department. What it lacked was the "meat and potatoes" sounds I need like Grand Pianos, EP's, Electric Basses, Guitars etc. Now with the new MPC Key 61 they have created plug-ins to cover such sounds onboard. This takes the MPC out of the "beatmaking" world and competes directly with the Fantoms and Montages of the world. Having the ability to connect an audio interface to increase your outputs to up to 32 analog outs, a sampler with time stretching, fast chopping, effects like vocal pitch correction, 4 gigs of RAM, a 32 GB of memory for storage, a slot to add your own SSD internally of whatever size, XLRs with phantom power, over 6000 presets all housed in a modern user interface...yeah this could really be a gamechanger. I rarely use that word. Ever since owning the MPC One I've said the big 3 really need to take notes from Akai. Because aside from the New Fantom, every other user interface feels like working with cranks and levers by comparison.

[@shaan4vocal]

Very Informative as always🙏

[@bsdguy]

What laptop are using? Is it from Audio Labs?

[@darrickkeels6387]

No just an MSI gaming computer. I don't game but liked the specs

[@bsdguy]

@@darrickkeels6387 Thanks for the feedback. I'm glad to see the keyboards companies step up their game. The Eric Persings and the Jamal Hartwells of the world are pushing the limits of computer based instruments. I see a convergence on the way...Right now, Roland is leading the keyboard pack.

[@briannicepianoworship8944]

Never liked the Korg Kronos particularly because of the aforementioned keybed. Yamaha has always been better in that department. But now in 2022, we are approaching options that surpass Both offerings. This is a new age in hardware.

[@joehenthompson2023]

I notice you use a MSI computer. I would be interested to know the reason for your choice. Would you consider using a M1 Mac computer? I have a very old i5 quad core pc laptop. Not the greatest lol, but it gets things I need to get done for now. Again I love your videos. Your experience and insights that no one talks about, when it comes to pros and cons, you personally encountered in your equipment in real life situations.

[@darrickkeels6387]

My MSI computer works very well. It has a fast SSD, I7 processor, and 16gb of RAM. It runs my plug-ins flawlessly. I performed a stress test the other day by running 107 tracks at the same time. It had no issues. But an M1 Mac is far more powerful. Those are wonderful machines. I typically stay away from MAC only because when you upgrade your OS often times some of your plug-ins are no longer compatible. As a person that plays for a living I value stability over power.

[@scottlimanowski925]

Darrick your videos are an excellent source of information. I want to know how u afford all these keyboards. You not only have one of the most powerful workstation keyboards but almost all of them but more power to u. You would probably laugh at my workstation it’s an fa06 but it lets me layer and split sounds really fast for less than $900. I saw your mpc akai video too. Im torn right now between the Roland fantom or akai 61. Thanks for the informative videos

[@darrickkeels6387]

I would never laugh at someone's keyboard. Let alone a powerful workstation like the FA06. In many ways the FA is more "powerful" than the new Fantom-0. Regardless it's an amazing machine. The Akai MPC Key 61 excels in the music production department due to its powerful 128-track sequencer and full-featured sampler. But the Fantom-0 really excels in live playing applications and DAW integration with Ableton, Logic and Mainstage. So you will need to decide what you are looking for out of your keyboard.

[@williamshaneblyth]

Kronos on stage is a giant pain in ass. Its crashed on average once a month takes a whole song to boot. I have a battery backup and Power supply box to smooth out issues at gigs and it still was a pain. I now use a Mac that doesnt crash and boots in 25 seconds into the software used so why is the Kronos such a dog. I have a Modx as a main board cause it never has an issue and i can use some of its sounds if or when needed if the computer did die.

[@sapinit4322]

Recently I couldn´t find some crazy salsa trumpet, guess where I found it? No, not in Kontakt, but in the Kronos. Keeper for me, but I understand that for some live scenarios the Yamaha is much more reliable. I use my Kronos in the studio only and ModX for live (rarely, it´s not my job to play live). Having said that, it would be great to see some serious hardware update for Kronos, the booting time, display, audio interface quality is simply outdated. Nautilus failed in my opinion. Workstation without aftertouch is a joke. What a shame.

[@darrickkeels6387]

I am definitely keeping the Kronos. It's not going anywhere. Its just no longer my "main keyboard."

[@freddyperezmusicentertainment]

I understand, I think Kronos was the pioneer Keyboard to set up, the out the box options, that are found today on these newer boards. But the technology side of it is outdated . This is why you are departing from the beast. Great video, thank you !!!!

[@ablesam]

Nautilus has succeeded the Kronos, not a failure at all. The improved UI makes it much better for the user to use it in a live scenario and just better overall. And because it's cheaper, more people are buying it. The only people who hate the Nautilus are Kronos users and people who wanted a new workstation from Korg and didn't get it. From a sales and logical POV, Nautilus is doing good despite the supply chain issue Korg are facing.

[@musicmix9259]

It looks like you need an arranger( e.g. Genos , Pa4x) for the live performances, not a workstation. It provides flexibility and direct control all in one keyboard.

[@darrickkeels6387]

No because I create all of my own tracks including vocals. Using "styles" that play predetermined loops based off of the chords I play is not very useful to me. I have an arranger and it gets played maybe twice a year just for fun.

[@rossmunroe6330]

Man this is the exact setup I'm looking to build now! I got the MPC ONE looking to get the Fantom 6 and the Arturia MKII. Arturia controller compatibility with Analog Lab is insane!

[@rossmunroe6330]

well I'm bouncing between the Fantom 06 or the 6

[@darrickkeels6387]

@@rossmunroe6330 what's making you consider the Fantom rather than the Fantom-0?

[@rossmunroe6330]

@@darrickkeels6387 The ADSR section and the TR buttons. I can do without but it just adds to the look and the convince to editing. I was looking at the FA 06 but the sequencer isn't as good as the Fantom series or 0 series.

[@darrickkeels6387]

@@rossmunroe6330Ah yes. The Fantom is certainly an improvement over the the FA series

[@rossmunroe6330]

@@darrickkeels6387 Yes, I also feel the Fantom has a lot more to offer than the 0 series. A lot of key features from ins and outs to patches, seamless switch to DAW ctrl etc. I know the 0 offers the same things but the Fantom gives that with extra slots and more little features. For me personally this board is the perfect workstation. For those getting into standalone gear and etc such as myself. It cover my basic needs and I can grow with it. If I want to get into oscillators and etc. it's there.

[@BeatBoii]

bruh the title and the thumbnail had me scared because i just got the korg kronos and its my first workstation keyboard so i thought i mad a bad purchase.

[@darrickkeels6387]

I still have and use my Kronos. It’s a great keyboard!

[@88mokeyz8k]

DK! Great video. Yamaha tried to incorporate something similar with the Montage/MODX, (Live Sets) with Cubas/Nuendo. IT IS NOWHERE NEAR as intuitive as with the Fantom /Ableton in the Studio or Live. You Really maximize the very most out of your keyboards and your Gear. Roland really steps up the Game with DAW Integrations with Ableton. Fantom W/F is fast!

[@darrickkeels6387]

Yeah Roland did a great job of creating a keyboard that can fit into an ecosystem. Rather than trying to make a keyboard that can do "everything" they really focused on something that plays nice with others.

[@Bashanvibe]

You know what I want the Kronos but for the price point I think it’s best to get 0 series. 8 for the studio and 6 for stage. My wife will be pissed because I already have a G6 and FA and MODX with MO6 but I take MODX and FA now because it’s light weight!!!

[@matthewgaines10]

Korg has been silent for quite some time in the workstation space. Kronos is a beast but they are resting on reputation. You know your needs better than anyone else. Enjoy. Tactile feel for the win. Roland did a great job with DAW integration.

[@darrickkeels6387]

I believe they are working on something else and it isn't ready yet. But yes the Kronos was miles ahead of its competition when it launched about 11 years ago. Since that time other manufacturers have closed the gap in the areas that really matter to a very broad audience.

[@EverettDudgeon138]

@@darrickkeels6387 I also think the pandemic hit Korg hard. Lots of announcements like the Wavestate SE or Drumlogue never ended up going into production because of supply chain issues. They are also now having a huge back order for current instruments which they can't meet and are now discontinuing stuff without notice (for example the Prologue)

[@ablesam]

@@darrickkeels6387 Korg sent a few boards to their EOL stage without notice at all. Kronos, Grandstage, the orange Vox Continental, Prologue, PA4X series and KingKorg.

[@jordanking7711]

I hope that Korg releases a new workstation considering that they've recently discontinued the Kronos/Kronos 2.

[@darrickkeels6387]

It'll be interesting to see if they move away from the classic workstation concept. The market for that kind of product is shrinking, though still very much alive.

[@jordanking7711]

@@darrickkeels6387 I hope they don't myself. Don't turn into a Yamaha or a Roland. No offence intended Derrick considering you have a Fantom. Roland or Yamaha keyboards now either don't even have a traditional sequencer anymore that we're used to or they're more synthesizers and performance keyboards rather than workstations. They my say they are, but they're not.. And also, there are still some people that either can not or don't want to use a DAW on their computer for song creation and find doing it on the keyboard more convenient like the Kronos/Kronos 2 or M3 did. Also I hope that the next Korg workstation still has the Setlist mode, because that is what I think set the Kronos apart from other keyboards. Others may have tried, but its not quite the same. Again my apologies and no offence intended Derrick. Well that and the 9 separate engines of the Kronos/Kronos 2.

[@tuneunleashed]

@@darrickkeels6387 Indeed it is shrinking! 2011 days are over. People aren't into expensive synths cause they keep releasing the same exact product just like Roland's Jupiter-X and the New Juno-X its the same product...different case...

[@Solomon_King_]

Darrick, could you please do a video about the PA5X? In particular it's sound engine. I recently emailed KORG, as I was suspicious that they are still using the tired 15 year old 44.1k/16bit KRONOS/Oasis sound engine, within their new flagship arranger. Unsurprisingly they hesitated to answer and then fed me a bullsh!t line about "Their engineers could not find that information". So basically they are reselling 15 year old tech with a facelift at flagship prices. I mean, the old KRONOS engine has always been GOOD ENOUGH for live performance, but let's be honest, the recording quality is mediocre, amateur and even bordering on cheesy sounding. I know sound preference is subjective, but I really feel like 96k/24 bit should be the standard today for a flagship. Yes, some people can hear the aliasing of lower sample rates and it sounds trashy. This is besides the fact that KORG sample libraries are low quality compared to their competition. A good hard look at this, in a public forum would light a fire under KORG to stop giving us garbage like the NAUTILUS. Someone mentioned in a forum that the KORG of today is not the same as the KORG 15 years ago. Apparently according to people on that forum, the visionary owner passed away and KORG is now in the hands of investors that love profit and know nothing of the love of being a musician. I do not know if this is true, but if so could be doom of KORG. Like honestly, who asked for the NAUTILUS, literally no one.

[@darrickkeels6387]

I will not be getting a PA5X because I don't have a need for arranger keyboards. I believe the Kronos is capable of sending out a digital signal through S/PDIF at 48kHz and can do the same through its USB B port. The Fanton is capable of 24-bit 96kHz across 16-stereo channels. The Montage is capable of 192kHz. So yes Korg has been behind. And nobody really asked for a Nautilus. I think it's just a hold over product until a proper Kronos replacement is complete. It doesn't really rival the MODX or Fantom-0 because it is more expensive than those boards but oddly enough is scarce on the controls. I saw no need for a Nautilus personally. And if I were in the market for a new workstation keyboard today, I'd buy a Fantom. There is no guarantee I'll even buy the new "Kronos." It all really depends on what it is, how it functions, and how much it cost.

[@Solomon_King_]

@@darrickkeels6387 It is not so much that I am worried about the PA5X as I also have no need for an arranger. However, I am worried that KORG is going to make the same mistake with the next flagship workstation, all the clues are pointing in that direction. Yes, in 2010 it was for sure the beez kneez, but in 2022 we need a worthy successor to carry the torch! One could even argue this is way overdue. I am worried they are going to sell us another panel redesign, claiming it is an upgrade, when it is really just a facelift. Also, as primarily a studio musician, I want something that will proudly hold its own inside of a final mix and the KRONOS all though powerful as a stage keyboard, leaves allot to be desired for recording quality. Which is my main characteristic for which I am judging it.

[@darrickkeels6387]

@@Solomon_King_ I share your sentiment. I don't have much faith that Korg will release something mind-blowing. I really could see them recycling a bunch of stuff. Maybe taking some stuff from the OP-Six and possibly the Wavestate. I could see the same sound engines from the Kronos with a few different things added here and there etc. Back in 2011 the "sound engines" was a big deal. No one else (Yamaha, Roland, or Kurzweil) had anything remotely like that. However, now the Fantom has N'Zyme, V-Piano, Supernatual Acoustic Piano, SuperNatural Acoustic, Supernatual Electric Pianos, Virtual Tonewheel, and "regular" Zencore. An "engine" is a plugin. The new Akai MPC Key 61 has 25 "plugins." Fabric XL, Hype, Mellotron, etc. I am not arguing that the Akai is sonically better. Just saying having "sound engines" in your hardware is more of the norm now. The Kronos really needs to improve its DAW integration. If they don't they certainly need a better user interface. They need VST quality level sounds and the ease of operation that VSTs have. They need 128-MIDI tracks, at least 16 audio tracks, they need things like a vocal doubler, harmonizer and pitch correction for vocalists. They need an easy way to launch clips like Ableton Live for live performances with backing tracks. They need both linear and pattern based recording. They need XLR inputs with phantom power. XLR balanced outputs. The keyboard should be capable of 192kHz at 24-bit. Maybe even 32-bit float. Basically a complete overhaul to even compete. Many of the features I mentioned are already on other keyboards. Roland has tight DAW integration for Ableton, Logic and MainStage. The Montage is capable of 192kHz sample rates. The Nautilus already has 16 audio tracks. The Akai already has a 128-track sequencer, XLR inputs, vocal pitch correction, vocal doubler and harmonizer. The Fantom (and the Akai) have clip launching for live performances. The Fantom has XLR outputs. The Akai and Fantom even have CV/Gate connectivity. If Korg comes out with another super difficult to use keyboard with the same old 16 track sequencer, etc, it will not do well in this market. They waited too long resting on the fact that the Kronos was/is the most powerful workstation on the market. Yes in most ways it os more "powerful" than a Fantom. But Fantom sells far far better. This is due to the modern interface and an overall easier to use machine. I guess we will see what Korg does next.

[@wireguy123]

Great info and back story...Main live rig Electro5d bottom & MODX6 up top. that being said I just boaght a Korg Nautilus to use in studio. Very nice...cheaper keybed, smaller display fantastic sounds and heavy AF.

[@darrickkeels6387]

I believe the keybed on the Nautilus is the same as the Kronos aside from the aftertouch. It definitely feels premium to me.

[@rossdonald5026]

Interesting..... for many years, I've found Roland sounds to be second rate by comparison to Korg. Has something changed?

[@darrickkeels6387]

Sounds are truly a matter of personal preference. You can find just as many people who believe Rolands sound better than Korgs. Same thing happens with acoustic pianos. Does a Steinway sound "better" than a Yamaha? Depends on who you ask really. If Jordan Rudess plays a Korg it sounds amazing. Likewise if he plays a Roland...it sounds amazing. Because he's amazing. Instruments rarely make a musician sound good. It's the other way around. But to answer your question yes something has changed. The technological advances in computers. Roland's products being newer than Korg's have taken advantage of the technology that's available today. In 2011 the Kronos was more advanced than any other hardware keyboard. Yes there were people who might have preferred the sound of another brand but there was simply no way to declare another brand to be more powerful. But now truly most professionals who do production work use a DAW. Even a musician like Jordan Rudess who uses the Kronos live, mainly uses VSTs in the studio. Me personally I find that proper eq, compression, effects, mix levels, mastering etc has a greater effect on the final product than the brand I use. Roland's connectivity (XLRs with phantom power, 16 stereo audio outs via USB, more external device USB ports etc) make it objectively better than the Kronos when connecting it to other gear in my studio. The DAW integration with Ableton is second to none in the Fantom. With the Kronos I'd have to spend time mapping controls and necessarily more time looking at the computer screen. Overall out of the box personally I prefer Korg's sounds over Roland's in general. But after editing a sound and placing it properly in a mix by taking genre, song, and overall composition into account, almost anyone would have a hard time pinpointing which brand I used for which sounds. Most importantly, my clients cannot tell the difference at all. When they hear a piano sample, they just hear a "piano." Whether or not it sounds good or second rate to them is going to depend on how skillfully it is played, how well it is mixed, and what PA system it's coming out of. And as a professional I spend more time making music for others than myself. I still use the Kronos live and in studio. It's just not my main keyboard anymore. It's outdated user interface and audio interface simply slows me down. When I have two hours to work on backing tracks, I'll get more done and easier using the Roland. But technically I could achieve the final result with either keyboard.

[@valentino1870]

There are lots of variables to decide a keyboard 😂😂😂

[@Google_Was_My_Idea_nr.1]

Roland: newer software. Korg: doesn't need a Kronos 3, rather a new type of monster workstation thats decades ahead of all others. Something special for (gig) musicians.

[@markferreri5814]

Yes, that would a major CA smile on my face. My biggest problem (as I’m sure others have with the Kronos 2) is the interface software. A new particle generator engine would be nice, or some other newer tech, but the software is what’s dated. I love the Fantom software and even the easy-to-use iPad interface for my Integra 7. To see an all new big brother to the Nautilus with the goals of the Kronos ‘everything’ workstation with a modern interface would be a dream.

[@tuneunleashed]

Basically the Korg Nautilus....its has everything the Korg Kronos 2 has except the hands on layout the Kronos has but....it has a better UI right....so its a bargain.

[@Waynyce]

Wellll feel free to pass that Kronos on my way my brother 😁

[@gabialex24]

Your hand is hypnotizing

[@darrickkeels6387]

😄

[@freddyperezmusicentertainment]

Great video ! Thank you !!

[@alphasxsignal]

Nice info

[@cyberfennek]

All i need is a Jupiter 80

[@darrickkeels6387]

I love that keyboard! They are really hard to find now on the used market. People who have them want to keep them

[@cyberfennek]

I played on one a few years ago in an instrument shop but it is closed now it was called 4sound everything is online now over here

[@josenunez313]

So... we got a Roland keyboard review and the reason is that you are now using 2 keyboards instead of 1. I mean, if you sell your kronos to buy 2 keyboards to upgrade your music production and live performances, It seems fair, but conserve the kronos and get 2 new keyboards is something not many of us can do. Anyways, good videos, but replacing 1 KB for 2 for the keybed reason is just personal, not like sustancial or huge reason to consider for the rest.

[@jp4751]

I somewhat disagree with some of the fellow viewers. As much as we say we want a new workstation, most will not really use the sequencer to its full potential. 16 Midi tracks is nothing compared to Unlimited on some DAWs. I think a workstation with 128 tracks and a big screen would be something I would use over a DAW, but the DAW workflow, speed, and ease of use make it hard to choose a workstation as a way to create when at home or in the studio. The Fantom G kind of had 128 tracks with some limitations as to how the midi in those tracks was used. I would actually rather see some rack versions of some of these boards so we have a choice between the board or rack module. I think the wave of the future is something more like what Roland did with the Fantom 6/7/8 and 0 series. I think the 0 series is very compelling where you get a board with a lot, or most of the sounds with DAW integration. You are getting something in between a midi controller and workstation at a cheaper price point than a full workstation. And, If the implementation is good with DAW control, it will give you the benefits of your DAW, while you feel like you are creating on a workstation. Korg would have a slam dunk with a Kronos "0" series where they implement the great sounds, 9 engines, etc, and give the user good DAW implementation at the $1500 or so price point. They could probably skip the sequencer because that sequencer was pretty much ported over from the Oasis which is why people complained about no piano roll and how the M3 had a better sequencer than the Kronos even though it was older and cheaper.

[@darrickkeels6387]

I wonder why companies have stopped making rack modules .

[@tuneunleashed]

@@darrickkeels6387 the Roland Integra-7 is still available 10 years later but the reasons why its because software plugins are literally portable rack modules and you could get every single sound through a software computer.

[@darrickkeels6387]

@@tuneunleashed Ah yes! That makes perfect sense.

[@tommy53204]

What kind of sequences do you need "128 tracks"..? Are you doing full blown digital symphonies..? Ive never needed more than 16... Korg Oasys did it best with 16 internal and 16 external imo... That's more than most people would ever need for most music... I agree that the future is rack units with software implementation... We are seeing some of that with the analog synth companies... I'm a fan of hardware synths over software... The workflow is more difficult but to me that's not necessarily a bad thing... Software has made things too easy and that's why music these days sounds so similar... With hardware it was more difficult and that resulted in a broader spectrum of end results... There is A LOT of room for improvements when it comes to workstations and hardware in general... As it stands right now korg has took it the furthest...

[@jp4751]

@@tuneunleashed True, But if that is the case, you could argue the same exact reasoning for the keyboard version. Why even make the keyboard version, just have the VST and let people use a midi controller. I think the best of both worlds is something hybrid. It is nice to be able to lay down a basic idea on hardware and then clean up and arrange on software. I have used this workflow before where you sync hardware to a daw and record the midi. In the past the downside was once you arrange, then you had to track out the audio, and depending on how many inputs you had determined the number of passes you had to do. I think Roland was onto something with he MV8000/8800. It was hardware, BUT had a VGA out. You could do your business on the unit, but you had your work on a monitor and could do your editing on a big screen. I always wanted the MPC to have a VGA out. Eventually, now we do. First the Renaissance came out and then eventually the Live/One/X versions where you had a hardware unit but have a monitor display that you can also work with. I do think Korg has pushed it the farthest. At this point I would either want a hybrid like the Fantom Series, or something like a "Miko/Neko" where it has the potential for full DAW onboard. As far as the racks are concerned, I don't really need the full keyboard versions if you already have a midi controller or other workstation boards, but then again...you could argue if it is mainly for studio/home work, use VST.

[@Vangelismusic1]

3,210 dollars for an RD-2000 for me is crazy expensive, buying the re-invented wheel is not for me, I wonder how many pianos they can come out every year? and although Roland has the best keyboard actions they are notorious for failing and you need to constantly repair the keys, I hope they changed that concept, we will see in the future once they start going bad.

[@darrickkeels6387]

I've never heard of Roland being anymore notorious for failing keybeds more than any other brand. And with all of the RD-2000 Facebook groups I am in I haven't heard of a major wave of RD-2000's needing keybed repairs. It's been out since 2017 and there are still no widespread problems. Of course after say 10 or 15 years people will start reporting problems but at that point it's probably simply due to age and wear and tear.

[@Vangelismusic1]

@@darrickkeels6387 Anyhow, I don't want to make this into a big deal but I can name a few that did have many problems with keybeds and they are the XV-88 and RD-600 and all of the RD series pianos, but then again who knows maybe the new models improved and got better?

[@Spidouz]

I’m just wait for the Kronos to be release as part of the Korg Collection plugins… it’s pretty vintage by now. Just slap a MacMini M4 on a Akai MPC Keys 61, install all my soft and I won’t need to ever think about a “workstation keyboard” anymore. I can’t go back to medium quality sounds once you tasted the best of the best… my MacBook Pro Max has 64GB ram and 8TB ssd with 7TB of the best plugins and libraries on earth… no Kronos, Montage or Fantôme will ever match that, sorry… not sorry!

[@musicbycandlelightmbc3225]

Roland Fantom 7 $6,000 inc/taxes dollars CAD. Ouch!

[@darrickkeels6387]

They are indeed expensive

[@jaybeetdown]

Don't get rid of it just store it away, one day, you'll miss it and you can just break it out instead of re-buying it!

[@darrickkeels6387]

Oh it's definitely staying. It's just not my main keyboard for studio work anymore.

[@jaybeetdown]

@@darrickkeels6387 I know you've been seeing the new MPC KEY61. I'm interested in your opinion on that.

[@darrickkeels6387]

@@jaybeetdown Indeed I have been taking a look at the info that is available. I think it may officially launch tomorrow.

[@williamshaneblyth]

fantom note dropouts. no thanks

[@r.g.jansen708]

I recently ditched the Kronos because it's probably in the long term a pain in the ass to maintain because it's essentially a computer... But actually I always hated the workflow. Sampling etc is overcomplicated. A major redesign of the interface and more user friendly... Then yes, I would buy a Kronos (3? ) Again. At the moment I am happy with the Roland Fantom-7.

[@darrickkeels6387]

I agree sampling in the Kronos is overly complicated. It can be done but it can be a bit of a chore.

[@caryjnicolo5740]

Once you get the sampling down on Kronos, it's actually pretty easy to do multi-samples, assing to different keys, or sequencers. You just need to deep dive into the Kronos.

[@jp4751]

Darrick, I gotta watch this and see where you are heading and then come back and comment. Please do not let me down by not bringing out your trusty ink pen that you use as a pointer when pointing out features.🤣🤣

[@darrickkeels6387]

No ink pen in this one my friend! 😂😂😂

[@jp4751]

@@darrickkeels6387 I am deeply saddened that only your hand was used! I have a Kronos 2, but I haven't really explored it much as far as the sequencer and sampler. I still have my old Fantom XR in my rack and every once in a while I get the lust to pick up a newer one. Out of Korg, Yamaha, and Roland, I think Roland has the easier sequencers to use. I also think they are the most "Neutral" sounding as far as genres.

[@darrickkeels6387]

@@jp4751 Roland did a great job on the sequencer in the Fantom and Fantom-0. I believe if the added traditional linear recording and the ability to record audio tracks it would be a more complete “workstation.” But it’s probably not worth the time and money to them. Because even if they did those things they would still fall short of what you can do in a DAW. I still use my Kronos. I use it more live than in studio though. But, we’ll see how long that lasts. Lots of Kronos owners have boot up issues. Sometimes the keyboard just won’t start up. I’ve never had the issue yet. What most people do is open it up and reseat the RAM because it comes out of place because of how it is mounted on the motherboard. I would hate to have that happen at a show when I am being paid. So I never gig with the Korg alone.

[@jp4751]

@@darrickkeels6387 I totally understand not gigging just the Kronos. Something like a MoDX is probably good for a backul plan because it is lightweight. As far as sequencers, I have used the onboards of Korg with the Karma when I used to have one and with the Motif XS.I have never had a Roland workstation, back in the day I already had the Korg Karma so I got the Fantom rack instead. I do remember trying out the Fantom X6 sequencer in Guitar Center back in the day and was impressed that it was very easy to use. I can definetly see why you would want to do your Church gigs with a sequencer that has a live set where you can trigger sections on a grid. Ironically I know that when you use Ableton Live, that's one of the main features that makes it what it is, but the first thing I do when I boot up live is switch to arrangement view.🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@michaelaurelius8507]

The platform existed from the OASYS so make that 2005, NOT 2011.

[@darrickkeels6387]

Yes very true but there are some very important ways in which the Kronos differs from the Oasys. The Oasys did not have a Setlist Mode, Seamless Sound Transitions, 8 velocity zones per oscillator, SGX Sound Engine, EP-1 Sound Engine, an SSD (Oasys had a spinning hard drive), the Kronos came with 12GB of samples versus 1GB on the Oasys, the Kronos could process effects much better without reducing polyphony, 24 bit audio recording vs 16 bit, etc. So yes the Kronos platform was certainly derived from the Oasys but I think it differs in enough ways to put it in a category of its own.

[@michaelaurelius8507]

@@darrickkeels6387 I know. I have an OASYS and I’ve used the KRONOS extensively for years, but never owned one. Doesn’t mean that the platform started with the KRONOS. It started with the OASYS and there’s still NOTHING on the market today that compares with 9 synth engines, 16 tracks of audio AND MIDI, and 16 parts multitimbral. Fantom is close, but not quite there. Montage doesn’t even count, because it’s nowhere near a full blown workstation with a pattern sequencer, and no individual program mode.

[@michaelaurelius8507]

I strongly suggest you make that timeline correction.

[@darrickkeels6387]

​@@michaelaurelius8507 I honestly think it is irrelevant. I used the word "platform" loosely when referring to the Kronos. (Technically the platform is Linux) The Kronos launched in 2011. That was my point. And the video is about why I replaced the Kronos 2 with the Roland Fantom for my studio work. It's not a history lesson and its not about the Oasys honestly.

[@michaelaurelius8507]

@@darrickkeels6387 I understand your point.

[@caryjnicolo5740]

Not many peole can afford a $7,000 set up wth the RD2000 and Fantom 7.... Why even have a Fantom7 if you're not using the sampling??? I would settle on a RD-800 and Kronos2...

[@darrickkeels6387]

Many people have several keyboards. I am in Facebook groups and lots of people have gear rigs that far exceed $7000. And there are several reasons why I have a Fantom 7. I like the DAW integration with the DAW I use as I explained in the video. I like the virtual tonewheel organ, V-Piano sound engine for live use. I like the Roland synth leads, pads, synth strings and a host of other sounds. When I play 80's covers in my band many of the Roland presets match the sounds on the albums. I appreciate the advanced hardware like pitch bend, mod wheels as well as the joystick. The build quality makes it road worthy. The sequencer is fast and fluid and I can capture ideas very quickly and with the integration further develop my ideas using a DAW. I could go on...but in short their are several reasons I feel the Fantom is a great keyboard. Not using the sampler is no reason to ditch the entire keyboard.

[@geoffk777]

@@darrickkeels6387 " lots of people have gear rigs that far exceed $7000." Sadly, I can verify that this is definitely true ;(. On the other hand, price out a new Grand Piano from a major maker and then get back to me on costs...

[@darrickkeels6387]

@@geoffk777 😄😄😄! A Grand Piano!

[@jp4751]

Darrick, I have seen a MPC Keys demo on KZbin. Please get your talking points together, I know you will come through😅😅😅

[@darrickkeels6387]

I may or may not already own one😄😄

[@jp4751]

@@darrickkeels6387 Watching a demo now with Andy Mac, and it seems like a good workflow.

[@TheRsmith0118]

LoL. When I grow up I will get either 😂

[@darrickkeels6387]

Trust me. Gear does not make me a better musician.

[@XPJV]

Just don't buy junk, and there'll be no need to replace it!

[@darrickkeels6387]

The Kronos is not junk by any means.

[@XPJV]

@@darrickkeels6387, In my opinion Korg brand is way overpriced. Based on what it can do. Don't strictly judge me, this is only my opinion.

[@darrickkeels6387]

@@XPJV I am not judging you. But I think most musicians, even those that do not prefer the Kronos, wouldn't call it junk. Everything gets old. The Yamaha DX7 was groundbreaking in its day but now virtually no one gigs with a DX7. But that doesn't mean it's junk because it was replaced. It's old technology incapable of being a powerhouse in today's musical landscape.

[@WilliamCamilleri]

the kronos is for plonkers

[@darrickkeels6387]

Not sure what a plonker is. But I must be one because I still use the Kronos 😄😄😄

[@tommy53204]

Upgrade from the Oasys??? Try scaled down more affordable downgrade... Oasys is still the best workstation ever made... Period... You either know or you don't know... And most people have no idea...

[@darrickkeels6387]

Maybe you missed the asterisk in which I corrected it and noted the M3 and the Triton. And yes the Oasys was a monster but seeing the Kronos as an upgrade is not that far off the truth. The Kronos launched with the SGX sound engine which included not only sampled pianos but those were married to modeling aspects so things like string resonance, hammer noise, damper resonance etc were included. This was not present on the Oasys. Many would argue that a piano sound is the most important sound on a keyboard. The Kronos and Kronos 2 had the Oasys beat when they were launched in that aspect. Furthermore the Kronos had the EP-1 sound engine which was not present on the Oasys either. I believe those engines became available for the Oasys but it didn't come with them. The Kronos came with 12GB of samples and the Oasys 1GB. The Kronos has 8 velocity zones per oscillator while the Oasys only had 4. While the HD-1, AL-1, STR-1, and MS-20EX had less polyphony on the Kronos. The CX3 and PolySix had more polyphony on the Kronos but more importantly the the effects did not reduce the polyphony on the Kronos nearly as much as it did on the Oasys. So in practice the Kronos did a better job of handling polyphony. The Kronos has seamless sound transitions not the Oasys. The Kronos has a Setlist Mode, which is a main feature for live players. That is absent on the Oasys. The Kronos has a solid state hard drive and the Oasys a spinning drive which is slower and certainly more prone to failure. And though the Kronos has a smaller screen it's and upgraded touchview screen with a higher resolution. The Oasys does have a better build quality, more outputs and inputs and the original came with a bigger hard drive (though the Kronos 2 has a 60GB SSD HD vs 40GB spinning hard drive in the Oasys). But there are a LOT of improvements that were made in the Kronos that were never in the Oasys. A better hard drive, setlist mode, seamless sound transitions, EP-1, SGX (and SGX-2) sound engines and so on, all at a cheaper price are all certainly reasons why a person could see the Kronos as an upgrade. The Oasys is certainly not objectively better in every way.

[@tommy53204]

@@darrickkeels6387 it's an upgrade in the ways you stated... But the Oasys is the better sounding synth... There have been side by side professional comparisons done with the shared sounds and there isn't much argument on it... Other than the sound quality the inputs and outputs are the biggest thing for me... The Oasys has 8 individual outputs plus the mains and you can install the adat option... This is VERY important and all workstations should have those options... And you can run 2 stereo rack synths into the Oasys and route them internally... The akai mpc x did 8 outputs and 2 stereo ins which is close to being as good in design... But no adat and no 8 individual while maintaining the main outputs... That allows you to record 8 separate outputs into the daw all at once and separate things appropriately to be further adjusted... These are the things that make the Oasys number one of all time imo...

[@darrickkeels6387]

@@tommy53204 I even think stating that the Oasys is a better sounding synth is probably confirmation bias. They have 100% identical A/D and D/A converters. All of the modeled synths are exactly the same. Meaning they use the exact same algorithms to produce the sounds. This means the PolySix, MS-20EX, AL-1, CX-3, and STR-1 sound engines are exactly the same all the way down to the fundamental binary code that makes up everything digital. The same applies to the MOD-7 as well. The Kronos records audio in 24 Bit vs 16 Bit in its predecessor. Even the Pulses Per Quarter Note in the resolution is higher in the sequencer at 480. (Can't remember the Oasys number but I know it was not 480) So I'm not really sure how the Oasys objectively sounds better. Yes it has more outputs and that may be important to some but it is certainly not an open and shut case that the Oasys is better. In some ways yes. In many ways it's not. And if the Kronos was a downgrade I highly doubt Jordan Rudess would have opted to switch to the Kronos from the Oasys whenever he went on tour. Just like he hasn't switched to the Nautilus from the Kronos just because it is newer. I personally try avoiding statements like "XYZ keyboard is the best keyboard on the planet." Best to whom? Best for what? Calling the Oasys the best workstation EVER made is a bit of a stretch because I pointed out several ways in which the Kronos is superior. That's all I am saying. 🙂

[@tommy53204]

@@darrickkeels6387 the Kronos is an updated cheaper version of the Oasys... They are mostly the same with the exceptions we have stated... You correctly admitted that the build quality is not as good as the Oasys... To suggest that other aspects of the quality of the synth are not as good is not a stretch... Especially considering people have put together side by side comparisons of the shared sounds and there is very little disagreement about the results... It would be like 2 cars with the same stated specs racing each other... One of their specs will probably end up out performing the other's... Probably the one with the better over all build... Not necessarily but that's usually how it goes... The outputs and inputs is a huge thing... The adat out is also huge... If your recording a sequence into a daw from a workstation, having less than 8 outputs is oftentimes a compromise... Anyone recording a sequence that will involve vocals into a daw just stereo left and right is going to have a lower ceiling as far as end results... Korg understood that and thats why the Oasys had a total of 10 outputs... To this day I personally have the Oasys as the number 1 workstation... The Kronos is very nice and I'm not trying to put it down... To me it's the 2nd best workstation to date... But the Oasys was the final near perfected version of the Triton... The Triton being probably the most influential workstation synth in music history... Korg took everything they learned from the previous versions and made the Oasys with no expense spared largely because they had a grudge match going back and forth with yamaha... The Oasys (imo) won that war so after that they went back to basics focusing on workstations that were more affordable... As far as Jordan Rudess goes I doubt he even was scratching the surface with what the Oasys is capable of... I've never seen anyone with it set up to its full potential... So I'm sure the Kronos is just as good for his needs... And I'm sure he got a nice deal with Korg that works out good both ways to have made that switch... Surly you know that's largely how those things work......

[@darrickkeels6387]

@@tommy53204 You are free to personally believe it is number 1. We all have our personal subjective feelings. But objectively speaking I pointed out ways it is not better. People can subjectively say the Oasys sounds better. But objectively the DACs and ADCs are exactly the same producing the EXACT same sound. Objectively the modeled sound engines are exactly the same all the way down to the ones and zeros of binary code. It's math. That's not subject to opinion. The Kronos has 8 velocity layers for every oscillator versus 4 in the Oasys. 8 is more than 4 which equates double the control over dynamic range. That isn't subject to someone's ear. It's math. The Kronos had two more sound engines and 96 more combinations at launch. That's more than what the Oasys offered. You can't simply ignore all the ways the Kronos is superior in what it offers and say having more outputs is the most important aspect. Maybe to someone else having the Setlist is the most important feature or having Seamless Sound Transitions or having more efficient processing to reduce voice stealing due to effects. I am a stickler about facts and opinions. Opinions are not facts. Someone can feel the Jupiter 8 was the best synthesizer ever made and that it sounds better than everything else. But that is nothing more than a personal subjective opinion. That's what I think of your accessment of the Oasys. You have to be able to acknowledge how someone could at least hold a different opinion based on actual facts. You are calling it a downgrade but I listed several things that are an upgrade. They may not be a big deal to you but they are to someone.

[@Pvargas98]

I wont replace my kronos anyway

[@darrickkeels6387]

No need to. The Kronos is a very capable machine.