Requested quick and dirty subframe removal explanation 2011 Ford Escape

[@wiwo3194]

I thought I would circle back around after getting my own subframe swap completed last week. A few highlights: First of all, your guidance/video and answers to my other questions in this string were exactly what I needed. Appreciate all of that. My son and I used it as a reference a couple times during the process. Here's what stands out from our experience doing this job: 1. It really WAS NOT all that hard. From all the fear-mongering that shops I'd checked with to do the job, I'd originally expected it to be twice as difficult/time consuming. I believe that the total number of fasteners that have to be disconnected is 25-30 (not counting lug nuts) and that includes the exhaust system and the two underbody brackets (one cross-car, one front/back that holds front motor mount). 2. I planned ahead with new lower A-arms and sway bar links. I felt like it was a good investment, knowing that the old ones had probably 80K miles on them, and I had to take the old ones off anyway. It was money well spent. Knowing the old parts were getting tossed certainly reduced the stress level when taking the links and ball joints apart. The links came loose fairly easily. The ball joints required pickle-fork and BFH, but again, they weren't being re-used so there was no need to be delicate with them. 3. Three tools were absolute game-changers versus what I might have experienced doing a job like this 10 years ago. First one is the 1/2" 20V impact. It made quick work of the big high torque fasteners. Second is my smaller impact chucked with a 3/8" or 1/4" drive bit for smaller fasteners. It's amazing how much time we saved not having to swing ratchets/wrenches to remove/reinstall fasteners (still have to final torque them with real tools though!). Final lifesaver was (in my opinion) KROIL. This penetrating lube is the best stuff I've ever used (and I've gone through most of the other options with various success). I pulled the vehicle in several days ahead, hit (almost) everything with this penetrating lube and then let it sit outside until it was time to pull it in and get to work. The results could not have been more pleasing. 4. The only item that wound up being a bit of a PITA was getting the rack loose from the column right where you broke yours loose. First off, the pinch bolt for this was the ONLY fastener that didn't get KROIL (oversight). The only way I was able to get good access without swivel sockets and lots of extensions to break it loose was actually laying on top of the engine compartment, reaching down between the back of the engine and the firewall and coming down at it from above with the smaller battery powered impact gun directly to a 6-point socket. The bolt came out, but on reassembly we discovered that it had taken the threads out of the pinch coupling on the column u-joint (the bolt looked REALLY bad-rusted/rolled/rounded threads where it stuck out the far side of the column u-joint assembly). Wound up pausing the project until the next morning so I could get a longer grade-8 bolt/nut and through-bolt it. That one little fastener was really the only big "Oh crap" in the whole operation (the stress level compounded by the fact that it affected a pretty big safety item called STEERING). I have some pictures. Would have posted to show how bad my old subframe was. Suffice to say you could see through it on the passenger side. It was lucky I found it before it broke. In closing, I just want to say thanks. Your initial video and this "quick and dirty" were really the inspiration/reassurance I needed to feel like we had a shot at doing this. When it was done, my son and I were both commenting that even though we were doing this on the floor with the vehicle on jackstands, we've endured tougher car repair projects than this one turned out to be. Any project that happens in our garage that doesn't involve torches, taps, slide hammers and air chisels (along with bleeding, bruises and cursing) is regarded as "one of the easy ones". While I felt lucky to have my son at my side for this one, it felt great to save a huge chunk of $ doing this ourselves in the garage. Now, if Santa would just bring that pole barn with a hoist. Kudos, and THANKS for all the great info.

[@unorthodoxridez]

I totally agree with everything that you said! One of my main goals is to try and show people the hidden tricks of the trade, especially if a project seems complex but can definitely be tackled. I love how you said you torqued things too, that's a big deal on final install imo. Seriously you're why the channel keeps going. I know we've been saying it for awhile, but the video quality should be drastically improving very soon. Along with some more in depth repair/customization videos. Thanks for watching and being a great role model for your son! -Jason

[@JimLambier]

I'm preparing myself for this job and appreciate both your advice and assessment of how difficult the job will be. I do have a couple of questions/concerns. I'm trying to figure out how to attack removing the steering column. You mentioned accessing it from the top. Do you have the 4 or 6 cylinder model? Do I need to worry about supporting the weight of he engine/trans when the subframe is removed?

[@unorthodoxridez]

@@JimLambier 6cyl here I went through the wheel well. And no you don't have to support it.

[@JimLambier]

I want to thank you for all of the videos that you made on this topic. With these as guidance, I was finally able to get the job done was nice weather arrived. I did the job by myself on my driveway using jack stands. A few comments for any other DIYer planning this job: The biggest issues that I had centred around the fact that I had the AWD and the PTU sticks out the rear and made pulling and replacing the subframe much more difficult. I simply could not manage to get the subframe past the PTU. Eventually, I gave up on the idea and removed the two bolts holding the steering rack. I was then able to fish the steering rack out the wheel well. After this was out of the way, removing the subframe was much easier. When I put the frame back, I reversed the process. It wasn't too difficult and I was even able to check torque. I also had removed the control arms to make it lighter and easier to maneuver. The other thing that you did but didn't specifically mention was loosening the bolt and two nuts that attach the trans mount to the subframe. It was necessary to be able to easily slide it into its bracket. When it came time to install the bolt that attached the large metal donut to this mount, I spent a huge amount of time trying to do this front the bottom or through a wheel well. Eventually, I realized that the best way was to stand on a small step stool and reach from the top. I'm tall, but I still needed the step stool. The last big time waster for me was the difficulty I had in reattaching the steering coupler to the rack. For the longest time, I simply could not slide it back on. Eventually, I realized that when I had originally hammered it off the shaft, I had peened the end of the coupling. To fix it required a few minutes with a rotary tool in order to remove the burrs. This would have been much much easier to inspect and repair before having put the rack/frame back in place.

[@unorthodoxridez]

Thanks for the comment, I didn't loosen the trans mount bracket on the engine, I just tipped the subframe slightly.

[@wiwo3194]

Thank you, sir! I really appreciate the follow-up video for this operation. I also have the V6 (2010). Short of some ugly surprise (probably those rear control arm bolts), this does indeed look doable, even laying on the ground. Since I have a little time, I think I will start by jacking it up and spending some quality time hitting everything hard with the Kroil and letting it soak for a week or so... Thanks again for this!

[@unorthodoxridez]

Absolutely and any time. I do wish to produce higher quality videos so look for that in the future 23 has been one for the books so far. I'm almost done with the car and will do a full recap in a week or so.

[@bobbyray9825]

THank you. Saved me some heartburn and busted knuckles.

[@unorthodoxridez]

That's honestly my main goal

[@JimLambier]

This morning, I received a call from my daughter who was driving her mom's 2011 Escape. She had just turned a corner after being at a stop light and according to her "the wheel was making a sound" and she wasn't sure if she should drive home. We have auto club membership so I got her to get it towed home. When the flatbed arrived, the vehicle only had three wheels on it. Yep, the subframe had cracked in the same spot that your mom's did. The wheel had turned so much that the CV joint has pulled apart. In order to lift the car, the tow driver had to remove the wheel and jam in a piece of wood to act as a brace. I'm up in Canada and a quick check of pricing looks like the subframe will be at least $1000. I'm now debating if I want to do this repair on my driveway in the winter and spend that much on an old car. I really appreciate you letting us know that it is possible to do with just jack stands and what to watch out for. Do you have an estimate of how much time you figure it would take to do the job for a DIYer on their driveway?

[@unorthodoxridez]

I would say it would be under 2000 cad. I appreciate the shout out and I'm glad everyone got home safe.

[@adammatson9885]

Thank you for posting this. My question is: does the engine and/or transmission need to be supported somehow during this?

[@unorthodoxridez]

It does not but you can if you want to.

[@wiwo3194]

One question - why did you choose to drop the rack out instead of disconnecting it from the subframe and letting it stay with the vehicle? From here that LOOKS like less fasteners to remove, but I'm probably missing something since you seem to have this figured out pretty well. Thanks!

[@unorthodoxridez]

It's super easy to leave it on just a steering shaft bolt and two tie rod nuts. This is a manual rack, therefore no power steering lines or electrical connections crazy easy to swap once on the floor.

[@wiwo3194]

@@unorthodoxridez So, I lied, that was NOT the last question... Regarding the rear lower control arm bolts with the captured nut. I appreciate the caution you are throwing out there to people as I have had exactly that issue (captured nut breaking loose) when doing lower control arms on a Pontica Vibe. I was forced (as you stated) to cut an access hole in the body mount to get wrench access to hold the nut. It was NOT a good time. So the question: After heating it up, are you going after it with an impact or a bar to take it loose? I'm so paranoid about issue with that captured nut that I'm looking for any "been there done that" advice I can get. Thanks!

[@unorthodoxridez]

@@wiwo3194 anytime and I get the paranoia lol it's well warranted... I usually get them pretty hot almost red hot let it cool down for a couple seconds and then feel it out with a 1/2" impact. So far so good and I've done many.

[@MarkTarquini]

When you say "lock the steering wheel" what do you mean? Do you mean turn the wheel inside the vehicle so won't move?

[@unorthodoxridez]

Honestly I use a bunch of big zip ties through the steering wheel, then around the shifter.

[@MarkTarquini]

@@unorthodoxridez haha. Brilliant! My sob story is I took my 2012 in for an alignment check and got the shock news that this cradle rotted and cracked. So I am going to attempt the swap myself. I have OEM repair manuals but your videos is a great supplement.

[@unorthodoxridez]

@MarkTarquini thank you, you can totally do it.

[@unorthodoxridez]

@@MarkTarquini thank you! If you need any additional advice feel free to comment.

[@MarkTarquini]

@@unorthodoxridez I'm stuck removing the front half of the drive shaft. It won't release from the front where the six torx bolts were. I've tried hammering it and when I pulled the shaft it likely came out of the bearing housing. I feel like this is the final death blow.

[@user-nx4rz9ld9o]

How do you get to the steering shaft?

[@unorthodoxridez]

From the driver wheel well

[@user-nx4rz9ld9o]

How did you take off the exhaust?

[@unorthodoxridez]

There are six nuts connecting it to the converters and the cat back exhaust