Sinclair C5 | Retro Commute

[@iana6713]

1985 meets the present day with a Sinclair C5 outside Starbucks! I love how instantly recognisable these things are, especially with that "Morning, Sir Clive!" to illustrate the point.

[@RetroWorkshop]

Yes - that passer by was on the ball!

[@leeosborne3793]

"Morning, Sir Clive!" had me in stitches. :)

[@mikesunboxing]

great video, loved it

[@patchcomputers]

Great Video and review of the C5! RIP Sir Clive

[@underneonloneliness2]

It doesn’t look old fashioned. It still looks modern and being electric it makes it even more modern.

[@ukdashcamguy500]

It looked old fashioned to me when it was released, in fact it looked bloody stupid. But now seeing one only last week, it looks quite cool and modern.

[@underneonloneliness2]

@@ukdashcamguy500 I’d quite happily see those on the roads instead of annoying cyclists.

[@hawthornselitelevel1220]

I got one and people not old enough to remember it think it's new! I decided to give mine a power boost with a 2000 watt/53 v battery upgrade, it now odes 35 mph! It looks totally different to most other models as it's been reskinned in carbon vinyl wrap

[@dommidavros2211]

Main issue with this thing is it was way too slow and the battery range was really bad!! Nowadays you can get electric bikes that do 50mph and have a range of 40 miles! Apart from novelty value, this thing doesn't have much to offer!

[@jamesthecat]

​@@dommidavros2211That's a bike, though. When you consider many 'hoverboard' owners have to get 'cart' kits (because of balance/stability/terrain issues), this looks like a much more comfortable and easier proposition! And after all, what is a 'super manouverable' three-wheel mobility scooter if not this, with a different ride height?!

[@soundtracks_shop]

RIP, Sir Clive.

[@elliot8595]

I used to own one of these when I was13 years old, loved it.

[@DownhillAllTheWay]

The C5 - 40 years ahead of the game! Did you notice the pedestrian at 10:50 - "'Morning, Sir Clive!"

[@agranero6]

Now every time I see a C5 I can't stop remembering the end of Micro Men.

[@RetroWorkshop]

With the Jean Michel Jarre soundtrack, being overtaken by the juggernauts. 😉

[@wmoule]

RIP Clive Sinclair.

[@ryanzanemurray-wood4105]

inspirational

[@simiushugenot8253]

A super tribute to one of Britain's greatest treasures. I was brought up on all Sinclair products (a fine collection of which I still have) and it is thanks to him, that I have a successful career in computing. At the time of his C5, the oil and motor companies were far too strong and he, unfortunately, did not really stand a chance. Sinclair was just 40 years too early, which we all now see as lost time and chances for the environment, with the race to more electric vehicles from companies that "shunned" him. Shame on our societies and governments. Individuals, such as he, do not come a long that often and should be paid more heed. Thank you and I look forward to seeing more videos on Sinclair :-)

[@RetroWorkshop]

Sinclair certainly produced some varied products. Investigating those that didn’t succeed in the market is interesting interesting.

[@WolvesInferno]

Brilliant video. I had a good laugh when that other chap said 'Morning sir Clive! It's a pity the C5 did not have A - a longer range and B - protection from rainy weather.

[@RetroWorkshop]

Thanks! It has a few significant flaws but is a great concept and good fun.

[@jamesthecat]

I believe they did have 'rain jackets' available (unfortunately you just wear them, and front part attaches to the fairing and covers the whole of the top and sides (and your arms and hands), sometimes they turn up on eBay!

[@keithpayne8943]

Great video. Thanks

[@numberonesuperman]

Really enjoyable thanks 😊

[@DaveFiggley]

RIP Sir Clive. He must specifically have had Milton Keynes in his mind when he came up with the C5 concept. LOL at those robots wandering around. I've thoroughly enjoyed this great series. Thanks. P.S. The Lucas electrics on my '67 Bonneville are equally temperamental.

[@RetroWorkshop]

RIP Sir Clive. You still provide a great deal of enjoyment from your inventions even if some weren’t a success.

[@JamesMossR33]

What a great series, which I found after Sir Clive's sad passing bringing these great machines to mind again (and Dave @ EEVblog restarting his resto). I remember them when they were released...but living on a farm made owning one really impractical, if I could have afforded one! Thanks.

[@RetroWorkshop]

Yes I was pleased to see Dave hadn't forgotten about his C5. I watched his video last night. Let's hope he doesn't get bored and forget about it again!

[@TheLegoflims]

The left hand side indicator on mine flashes constantly, It's the temperature alarm but after some testing with a digital thermometer there's not reason for it to be on, pretty sure I've got high resistance in the wires to the sensor and that's what eventually trips it. I ended up keeping the digital meter connected and kept it in the second battery nook

[@FKAS8410]

Very cool!!

[@wordsmith52]

If worried about rain, just fit a lightweight roof/windshield using light (coat hanger) gauge wire. Fit a light plastic screen using thin plexiglass etc and bin liner gauge plastic for the roof. A bit of careful / clever fixing would mean you can push the 'roof' material back in concertina fashion like a convertible automobile when weather is dry. A bit of DIY knowhow needed probably. 4 small LED lights mounted on top of the roof at the four corners of the vehicle will improve safety as well. Total cost of materials probably less than 10 GBP.

[@hawthornselitelevel1220]

Brilliant idea. I recently fashioned something similar to that for my e scooter ( it has a detachable seat) has the leds on the roof!

[@mercster]

When yer driving this, anytime you come up on a bike, you need to yell "Get the HELL OUT OF THE WAY!" to assert your dominance.

[@mercster]

"Dead pigeon."

[@ez5211]

Great video mate! RIP Sir Clive🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿

[@RetroWorkshop]

For links to products and websites mentioned in the video, see the video description. Many thanks to everyone who sponsored my retro commute - we raised over £400 for TNMOC!

[@cos1e]

Have a look for a mothercare urban detour pushchair as the front wheel is metal and should fit if I remember right.

[@mikewilson4847]

Very interesting. As a Renault TWIZY owner, this was a fascinating piece of history.

[@kessu83]

Love it when they record all of those inventions on a dry day...in the wettest country.

[@TOMORROWSPHERE]

Great video, love your passion. Great to see past tech used in 2020 and see how it functions!

[@huwkelvinmorgan3575]

renault twizy is i believe to be the modern version of the C5

[@RetroWorkshop]

There is a quite a bit more engineering in a Twizy, but similar concept: single person EV.

[@leeosborne3793]

​@@RetroWorkshopThey also cost £10k! In modern terms, that's 10 times the cost of the C5 (£399 in 1985 is equivalent to about £1100 now).

[@IKS-Exploration]

I want one of these looks really amazing thanks for sharing this :D

[@safirahmed]

Sinclair C5 could be the Segway of it's day.

[@migry]

Excellent video and very impressive font used in the graphics!

[@ihspan6892]

Thank you, I really appreciate the effort!

[@robertmarsh1751]

Great series, just bought a C5 as a bit of a preservation project, have watched all your C5 videos with great interest (twice now). I think I work around the corner from you on Maidstone Road. Nice work sir!

[@robertmarsh1751]

@@RetroWorkshop Mines in pretty good condition and complete mechanically wise but the electrics have been tampered with. I’m putting those back to standard to see what does and doesn’t work then going from there. It’s your electronics explanations that interest me most at the moment. Lovely Boarder too btw, got one ourselves called Dexter, a carbon copy of the one in your video.

[@RetroWorkshop]

@@robertmarsh1751 good stuff. Do look at the electrics page on my website to clarify a few details I may have got wrong in the video.

[@robertmarsh1751]

@@RetroWorkshop Hi Dave, with regards to the thermistor, do you know if it’s an NTC or just an on off switch? The wires to mine have been cut and the end of the thermistor itself snipped off. Do you know if I can just join the ends of the 2 cut wires together to bypass the thermistor for now while I try to get it all up and running.

[@RetroWorkshop]

@@robertmarsh1751 EDIT. It is a NLC thermistor. 10k around room temp. 1100 and 900 ohms at alarm and lock out.

[@robertmarsh1751]

@@RetroWorkshop Thanks, I’ll look at by passing it for now.

[@markpirateuk]

Sinclair did sell a weather protection outfit, looks like you need one!

[@Scotty993]

Watching after reading about sir Clive very cool !

[@chathamabs2011]

It's a shame it didn't really succeed. Like a lot of Sir Clive's Inventions, they may be seen commercially as a failure but his vision won't fail. The C5 doesn't seem out of place now but in the day it seemed barmy. Win for Sir Clive. Great video, thanks.

[@RetroWorkshop]

Thanks Keith. The C5 has its drawbacks but it was ahead of its time. I just ordered a new car. It’s got an electric motor in it ;)

[@chathamabs2011]

@@RetroWorkshop That sounds good. A driving instructor friend said they are the way to go, just hoped for a better network of charging points but I'm sure it will all come together.👌

[@leeosborne3793]

I've just written a magazine column about the C5. It was waaaaay ahead of its time. It was let down by the motor and battery tech of the day, but as the video shows, in a city with good cycling infrastructure and traffic calming, they could work brilliantly.

[@rjdavies1982]

Looks great! I know from my experience with my diblasi folding moped that indicators and mirrors may the experience a bit easier!

[@kyle8952]

the C5 front brake is just a bog standard single pivot caliper brake, the worst possible quality one in fact, made of stamped steel. It can very easily be replaced by a better dual pivot brake like a tektro. The only concern is that the reach (distance between top of brake and the rim) is correct. Changing to an aluminium rim is best, steel ones are dangerously slippy in the wet because of how smooth chrome plating is. With an aluminium rim you can use the famous Koop Stop Salmon brake pads. If you want to go even further you could replace the brake cable housing with jagwire's special compressionless brake housing. All of these things and you'll have more braking power than you'll ever, ever need.

[@RetroWorkshop]

Thanks for the advice. I’m not sure I’ve seen an aluminium one in that size though. People I know have had the plastic one cause a blow out on the front tyre as it heated so much. All built to a price! I now have a kit to upgrade the rear brake to a disc brake just need to find time to fit it.

[@georged5420]

Very informative video. I got to admit it looks like a lot of fun. Good job bro!

[@Boopop1024]

Fun video :) What I would say about the "bad weather", is as the saying goes - "there's no such thing as bad weather, just bad clothes". Admittedly you did check the weather report though, so I'd have ended up in the same state on my bike 😅 The main takeaway from active transport commuting is to always have spare clothes at work I think. If I was on a C5 and it was raining I'd be inclined to pedal the whole way just to help keep warm. Shame about the lack of gears though.

[@MrToddy31]

Thanks for posting, really enjoyed the video.

[@donovandelaney3171]

I hope he gives her a radio and GPS too.

[@HPPalmtopTube]

Maybe stack together a large pack of Lithium Polymer batteries used for RC airplanes etc... and you might be able to double or even triple your mileage...

[@RetroWorkshop]

I’ve recently bought a 35AH LiFePo battery and it does about 16 miles and weighs next to nothing. A bit pricey, mind you.

[@HPPalmtopTube]

@@RetroWorkshop If it weighs next to nothing, maybe you could put 2 of them in the C5 ? 32 miles would be awesome :)

[@CarFinanceSimplified]

What a great video - many thanks!

[@ethanevans9268]

Great Video! I also own a Sinclair C5, and have faced the same problems like you with the breaks and the red connector! I’m planning on changing the front blocks in the new year. Keep up the good work, and I look forward to your next videos!

[@Twirlyhead]

I see what you did there swapping the word "brakes" appropriately for "breaks" ;-)

[@JamesPropmaker]

Have you thought about adding more voltage. To help the motor up hills

[@jamesthecat]

Well done!

[@ridgmont61]

Interesting to know if the motor and batteries can be upgraded with more modern components to extend range/speed.

[@RetroWorkshop]

Yes that is quite a common modern upgrade: brushless motor with controller, and LiPo batteries. I’m leaving mine stock for now, but an upgrade to the rear brake is planned.

[@ridgmont61]

@@RetroWorkshop Thanks for the quick reply - it was great to see the scenery around Milton Keynes. I lived and worked around Milton Keynes for 25 years but moved overseas a couple of years ago, it was fun to see familiar sights - thank you.

[@hawthornselitelevel1220]

Worth doing it cost a lot but just converted my C5 with 2000w/52v battery. It does 35 mph! A lot of people think it's some kind of new Tesla e bike, as I recently wrapped it in black carbon film. Looks very stealthy indeed! Range is 40 miles with pedal assist

[@oliverpolden]

Very nice. Did you register it to make it legal or do you fly under the radar?

[@RobFarley74]

I'd love to see a c5 renovated but with scooter suspension, kart differential, and a modern bike motor/battery/speed controller... I still think they look the business! Heck why not have one with a carbon fibre body!? I appreciate this would not technically be retro, but how cool!?

[@RetroWorkshop]

I think the optimal solution is to own more than one C5. Keep one stock, the other with all the mod cons!

[@RobFarley74]

@@RetroWorkshop I just mused the idea to a friend of mine who has a tendency to "make stuff" and he's insisted we get down the pub to discuss this further!!

[@dommidavros2211]

If it had a good range and a decent speed, it might have been alright but sadly without those vital ingredients, it was always destined to fail! I'd love to see someone make adjustments and supe one up but until that happens, the best place for them is a museum! There are far better alternatives out there

[@RetroWorkshop]

There are plenty of C5’s that have been improved with modern brushless motors, lithium batteries and better brakes! Very impressive to see, perhaps more scary to drive!

[@dommidavros2211]

@@RetroWorkshop Cool! I'll have to look around. There is something of a novelty with these things so if you could get one that did 30mph with a range of 50 odd miles it'd be great!

[@RetroWorkshop]

@@dommidavros2211 I’ve got some video with such an example, I just need to get round to editing it. Sometime soon hopefully.

[@rwdplz1]

That style of connector used in the control box makes extremely poor contact with wires, and tend to fail rather quickly over time. They're definitely not intended for use in a dynamic (moving) application like a vehicle. TE Connectivity likely makes a direct replacement that would be more suitable that uses proper terminals. -Automotive wire harness engineer

[@SimonBauer7]

imagine this today with modern brushless electric motors and lithium batteries. more power, less weight

[@aldousrmaximus1775]

Would love to see these in California

[@ro8inmorgan]

I actually still want one haha. It looks so cool

[@RetroWorkshop]

Get one. They are good fun. The prices are quite high at the moment though!

[@BC_26fhj]

It should have been marketed mainly for leisure purposes.

[@GavlarLFC]

Enjoyed the video. I watched it because someone local to me has listed one for sale. £750 for a restored C5 in perfect working order.

[@mattj222]

Better than those crappy E-scooters you see 12 year old riding now days 😂

[@jamesthecat]

Absolutely! It can't be comfortable to stand in that position for long periods (kids won't notice, of course)!

[@DesertBro]

Heh...first thought when looking at the C5 was that it had no roof. In Britain?

[@RetroWorkshop]

Like a bicycle it doesn’t have roof. But on a bike you’re peddling and keep warm where as on the C5 you’re just sitting there getting wet. They made a special poncho thing that went over you and clipped into the C5.

[@mountainbearoutdoors]

A wonderful reminder to todays generation that 36 years ago electric vehicles were already viable.

[@ukdashcamguy500]

way before the c5 our milk was delivered by electric milk carts... Powered by rechargeable batteries... The milk bottles were also reclected when empty and recylcled.

[@johndilloway9762]

@@ukdashcamguy500 A long while before that some of the london taxi's were electric I think 1930's.

[@chrisliddiard725]

Darwin's award anyone? special category, 'candidate mostly likely to '.

[@microcamping9025]

I would like to order a bafang mitteo motor, it starts from 73mm. I'm going to buy a Sinclair C5 in a week

[@RetroWorkshop]

Good luck with your C5. Those motors look powerful!

[@laurensnieuwland4657]

I'm looking into buying one for my daily commute. It's about 6 miles one way, on mostly flat surfaces (yes, I'm Dutch :)), using mostly bicycle lanes. Do you think it would be doable? I'm still really unsure after watching the video.

[@RetroWorkshop]

It is certainly feasible for 6 miles especially if you charge the battery at work. The main downside is it isn’t actually that pleasant especially if it rains.

[@laurensnieuwland4657]

@@RetroWorkshop I'm going to make a way to attach a rain cape to the top to solve the rain issue. However, I don't really have a good spot to leave the battery on the charger at work, so is it possible to maybe get a different battery with a higher capacity?

[@leeosborne3793]

​@@laurensnieuwland4657You could add a second battery to double the range. You had to switch between them manually, but it would solve your problem. Charge them at home overnight.

[@laurensnieuwland4657]

@@leeosborne3793 That might work. Any suggestions battery wise?

[@matthewcoggins7288]

Did it to work and back on one charge???

[@RetroWorkshop]

I gave it a short charge but it did run out of charge about 500m from home. Sadly at the bottom of a hill so I had to push it up the hill.

[@vesavius]

Wouldn't this be illegal on UK roads now, seeing as it has a throttle?

[@RetroWorkshop]

There is no throttle. Just an on and off switch. Why would a throttle make it illegal? Meets the legislation "The Electrically Assisted Pedal Cycles Regulations 1983" which is still valid. A brief summary can be seen here www.gov.uk/electric-bike-rules noting that it basically states it must be pedal assisted (like the C5), max 15.5 MPH and max 250W motor (for tricycle). Also max kerbside weight 60kg from the regs.

[@obg120]

Hi love your vids can you tell me what battery you used for your commute. Thanks Carl.

[@RetroWorkshop]

Hi Carl. It’s a 70AH unit from Halfords and is model HLB678. It is the largest that will fit I think, but you’ll need to strap it down as it is heavy and slides around otherwise.

[@obg120]

@@RetroWorkshop that's great, thanks very much, keep up the good work 👍🏼

[@greenaum]

Nice! Has anyone worked on a regenerative braking controller for the C5? The same way electric cars, and lots of electric bikes, have, whereby when you electronically-brake, the car's motion turns the motor round, generating current, which then tops up the battery. Might be a circuit that's online would be suitable to adapt. Also do you have a spare battery? It's just a standard Yuasa lead-acid type, right? They're not expensive and would be nice to have double the range. You could even wire them both up and use a chunky relay to switch between them, switched from the handlebars, or a switch you'd fit somewhere, so you wouldn't have to get off your arse to swap them over. Buy a couple of 12V digital voltage meters online, like 4 quid each, and have one monitoring each battery. Stick them under the pod with the lights. You'd really get the feel of how the thing works then. I know authenticity is a wonderful thing, but these would all be changes you could swap out if you wanted to, remove them if you wanted a stock C5, but would make using it more practical and fun, you might get into the habit of using it more. And chain a trolley to the back and you could do your shopping!

[@oliverpolden]

I’m not sure regenerative braking would be much benefit since the C5 doesn’t carry a lot of kinetic energy, it’s not that efficient and then you might need some sort of charging circuit. I expect you mostly coast to a stop as well.

[@jamesthecat]

​@@oliverpoldenThat's a good point, but could the pedals be hooked up to a charging input in some way? That would make use of a unique feature, and may be quite productive for those who like to pedal a lot!

[@ASHEN_ONE_GAMES]

I had one as a kid

[@boywithadolphin]

12.30 did you throw the cup in the road? £80 fine for littering.

[@RetroWorkshop]

No, I took it to work and put it in the bin. Why, do you throw your rubbish in the street?

[@NoggintheNod]

You ever been stopped by the Police in Milton Keynes ?

[@RetroWorkshop]

Not yet!

[@ansarafsar6268]

The C5 might come back into fashion in about 20 years time when all cars will be electric, with a more powerful battery.

[@SimonBauer7]

and modern electronics. imagine this with more power...

[@hawthornselitelevel1220]

Just done that to my C5 upgraded with a 2000w brushless motor and 52v battery. It does 35 mph! A lot of people actually think it is some brand new Tesla bike as I recently changed the colour rto matt black!

[@leeosborne3793]

​@@hawthornselitelevel1220Show us, it sounds amazing!

[@donovandelaney3171]

And yet you haven’t moved the mirrors up and haven’t moved the handlebars higher up and have not given her any leg protection.

[@SuPeRbOmBeRmAn4]

did it get you home ? and did you have to recharge whilst you where in work? how many miles on one charge can be gotten?

[@RetroWorkshop]

Yes I got home OK. I gave it a few hours re-charge to top it up when I was at work. Range depends on terrain and size of battery. I have a fairly hefty leisure battery and have never run it flat so don't know the range.

[@SuPeRbOmBeRmAn4]

@@RetroWorkshop ah i read its 20 miles original mileage, but i imagine 30 can be gotten with a hefty battery or more. i think we should all be travelling to work in nike one 2022 concept cars, designed in 2005. 1 or two seaters all electric. i would buy one if they where affordable, and if the top speed was limited to 70mph there be less accidents, less pollution, more room on the motorway. im sure they could fit one with a battery that does 100-150 miles, that would get most everyone to work.

[@oliverpolden]

Nimbus 1 is very appealing

[@Feyyore]

These would be amazing with a new modern e-bike system powering it. So ahead of its time. Right idea, but the tech and opinions were not right for it.

[@XPUKKAX]

Why was the pigeon dead?

[@RetroWorkshop]

I’m not sure. Probably hit by a car on the nearby road. Hopefully it wasn’t a carrier pigeon with an important message.

[@deveronrobinson4322]

Old tech from the 1800s

[@RetroWorkshop]

Not quite that old 😉

[@Boemel]

I want one with lithium battery and proper motor.

[@Boemel]

actually have a 48v 40Ah battery now and 1800w motor

[@heathen-greaser]

Really don't get why you can rent out electric scooters yet if you buy one the police will confiscate them saying how electric scooters arnt allowed to be ridden in public places 🤔

[@aarhusnord]

Reminds me a bit of the Danish "Ellert"/"Mini-el" electric car. This should be the next one for you to test. Greetings from Denmark 🇩🇰 This little Ellert-movie has English subtitles: kzbin.info/www/bejne/l2OUk2eGrbuLq8U

[@RetroWorkshop]

Hello Denmark! Yes that Ellert looks a bit more like a viable one person car. Cover from the rain and more power. But perhaps not as fun!

[@Lysimachus]

10:49 lol

[@hoopshooper9102]

Manna, electric scooter can go faster than that

[@RetroWorkshop]

Yes you are right, but they have to speed limit electric scooters to make them street legal here.

[@Boemel]

@@RetroWorkshop here thegovernment is on full attack mode on anything power by some kind of engine like these scooters or even wheelchairs having a registration and insurance !

[@cerealtiller]

Test rode one when the came out.....it is a terrible design....too low....and not durable.. a Company produced Electric folding Bikes for £400 at that time....they were proven and sensible designs.

[@RetroWorkshop]

I won’t disagree that they are too low, making the rider feeling vulnerable on the road. However their durability has proved rather good despite shortcuts like a plastic gear box. Many machines need only basic maintenance such as new grease, possibly some cheap and still readily available electronic components and a good clean with cif, after 35 years that isn’t bad. A bike is definitely more practical than though.