Extended Thoughts on Persona 5 Royal - Trash or Treasure?

[@sebastian2456]

I personally think Persona 5 Royal's ending is just as good as vanilla's. They both are trying to say different things. Persona 5 vanilla ends with themes of freedom and going your own way so it ends with you and your friends freely driving choosing your own course it's a perfect ending honestly. Persona 5 Royal's is just as good though at portraying its cor themes. Maruki's whole reason for doing the things he did was to avoid conflict and sorrow taking the easy way out instead of trying to organically fix his problems. Joker and the Phantom Thieves agree that you must fight reality head on and not avoid your problems. That's why despite leaving your best friends behind and going back to his home which might not accept him Joker still smiles ready to brave the challenges of life. They both represent the major themes of their stories in equally amazing ways but that's just my opinion. Also I think Akechi coming back as a faint image wasn't foreshadowing him surviving it's just Joker remembering the promise he made with Akechi when he challenged him at least that's what I got when reading the scene in the Thieves Den where it describes Joker leaving "With a promise in his heart"

[@liamclarke91]

I'd say Maruki's outfit is pretty fitting. A gaudy messiah complex poorly hidden underneath a simple cloak.

[@liamclarke91]

(The cloak represents humility)

[@princecharming8125]

I wouldn't let Maruki change the world. Why? The people majority can't even obey, the parents, governments, the law enforcement, cold day in hell before I give society an ideal world. Give some people the ideal world but certainly not everyone

[@HovektheArtist]

Plus it looks like Dios stand ZA WORUDO

[@ki11aqueen5]

@@princecharming8125 why not everyone? If it's not effecting anyone, and everyone's happy, who cares?

[@ultima1033]

Calling it right now, Jose is a velvet room attendant in training. He's got the trademark yellow eyes. The person who sent him on his mission is most likely either Igor or lavenza. His boss fight may have been easy because he hasn't earned the same power as his siblings yet. Which Is probably why he relied on using items for elemental damage. His whole egg theme he has going on may be because he's a newborn who hasn't grown into his role yet. ....Or maybe not. Just a theory I had in the back of my head. Also Atlus, love your games, but you and your shitty DLC practices can go straight to the shadow world. Seriously, 15 bucks for a single character costume pack? For literally 5 dollars less, I can get the persona bundle and break the game in half!

[@TrashorTreasure]

This is one of the best comments I've received yet! 😂

[@Kafka_Garezerra]

I'm just going to corect you on the part of who sent him. The real boss of Igor and the attendants is Philemon, the Blue Butterfly that usually apears in the beginning of the games, so probably is he who sent Jose

[@sahajpreetsingh6035]

Might also hint at a future canon Femc option because till now male attendants have only been available with female route.

[@fesyuki-kun2332]

& to top it all of maybe it will involve the p3 cast when you ask him who sent you he implies that she's a female so igor is out of the question (unless igor was a she from the beginning) & that question was asked in the very first day when you visit momentos so no it isn't lavenza because she was cut in half by yaldaboth so it's either Margret, Elizabeth or just the p6 attendant but if it is Elizabeth maybe making sure that erabes is killed for real to save makoto (door-kun) & let him free that would be amazing because here's the thing atlus made a lot of models with the p5 engine & i don't think the spinoffs are just the prim reason for it but at the same time lower my expectations

[@sorenduscai]

I agree with this theory the most. I feel a P3 connection.

[@averytubestudios]

7:13 Akechi is assumed to have the Wild Card too. I'm assuming he doesn't use it because Atlus thought that having 2 Wild Card users would be downright broken. (Edit: Persona 5 Royal is one of the best games of all time. No. Questions. Asked. While I have not played the game in English as of me writing this, I have watched all the cutscenes in English, and love them. Also, the ending made me cry. On par with Mother 3's ending.)

[@Anon_wulf]

That and pretty much what Futaba said about him in Shido's palace. Robin Hood represents his lies while Loki represents his hate. Would have been interesting to fight him if he had as many as Joker though

[@hammieli1875]

I like to think that Akechi’s wild card ability gives him access to two Personas. Similar to how Joker gains more power with social links, Akechi does too, but he only had one who was Joker, giving birth to Robin Hood (who is literally Joker).

[@LunaticFullMoon]

This is pretty much confirmed in Q2. When you first meet the twins in that game (which happens before you meet the FeMC from P3), they offhandedly mention that they feel like there's another wild card within the group, not being aware that it's Akechi due to the fact that they lost their memories when Yaldabaoth split Lavenza. The only reason Akechi doesn't use more than one Persona at once is likely because of his lone wolf nature. I doubt he'd bother making negotiations with shadows like Joker does.

[@averytubestudios]

Full Moon I mainly skipped over that scene in PQ2. But yeah. He’s one.

[@averytubestudios]

Isaiah Winfrey Fighting a mandatory boss with 12 Personas? No thank you.

[@hammieli1875]

My favourite thing is how Jose requests a fight to learn about Venting and the last thing Maruki does is a fistfight to vent.

[@churchofmagic3733]

If you’re OP enough Jose just gets a beatdown

[@sophiafortyfour]

Appreciate your take on the game! I felt similarly about it all and the ending in particular. All in all I think Royal was worth it!

[@MikeySmash13]

I do hope Jose is around more. I liked him. He’s always saying “good job” and it made me feel motivated with life lol

[@TheObbster]

To me, I take Sumire's farewell as a sign of her maturing. She knows you'll meet again, so doesn't treat it as a bigger deal than it should be. Also, while I agree she would've been really cool earlier on, I just don't think she'd really fit in those palaces. She'd be thrown to the background, which is fine and dandy, but she doesn't get her true awakening until the final palace. It would've been pointless. Despite Sumire being very late game to even date, I felt I got to see her enough through the game, to make the late romance worth it, and a real payoff. Also it only makes sense for her character considering if you could date "Kasumi", you'd be dating someone who you don't actually know.

[@TrashorTreasure]

All fair points. It was a challenge all around for ATLUS to smoothly weave "Kasumi" into the existing story, but for the most part they've succeeded.

[@yurikuki]

The Persona 5 Royal hit me deeply. I had a similar situation where all my friends had to go their separate ways to fulfill our dreams and goals. It's bittersweet but it doesn't mean we can't see each other again.

[@EscaVODS]

The only question now is how Atlus will top this for the eventual P6. I just hope it doesn't take almost a decade again to come out like the huge gap between P4 and P5.

[@advmx3]

We always think that, but I think Atlus will move the opposite direction from 5 in the style. For now we will see Persona 3 and 4 remakes, that's for sure.

[@jacksonarley3030]

Well, there is Re Fantasy to look forward to.

[@SangKi23]

Personally i would’ve preferred Atlus to take the development in a ‘slowly but sure’ manner. Don’t want what happened to Pokemon (Game Freak) making half assed games to keep the fans entertained but decreasing the quality.

[@haroldallaberg6359]

it absolutely will take a decade again. remember, the Persona director took his core team to work on RE:Fantasy. so Persona 6 likely isn't even being worked on right now.

[@imsmart799]

@@haroldallaberg6359 Im excited to see persona 6, after playing the 3rd semester

[@JoshuaT2001]

This was explained by levenza in the seen you showed maruki became the God of control because the wishes of the people went to the phantom thevies but they wanted maruki’s reality so he gained that power so your pass the torch joke was kinda what happened

[@tokiri5680]

I also have so much to say about the new added content, but I have no idea where to start. So I just say that I loved every minute of the game and the ending (both good and bad) where quite thought provoking that kept me rethinking of the story for weeks. Its probably the first Persona game where I felt sympathatic and tragic towards the antagonist, especially bcz the game makes him extremely likeable at the beginning, which is the reason why I started to tear up at the fist fight. Royal is definetly my all time favourite game so far.

[@ssj4galactus]

If anyones having trouble with the okumura fight. Just turn the game to merciless, the damage triples there youll basically down an entire group of robots in 1 or 2 turns

[@thefinalskarm1754]

Yeah it's a bit stupid that Merciless somehow makes it easier than hard.

[@ssj4galactus]

@@thefinalskarm1754 merciless on new game plus is broken man. Legit you can 3 shot kamoshida, madarame and kaneshiro boss fights. Hell with ryuujis insta kill i got 99 before the sae palace and it made the game too easy

[@chronomasakari]

The game's difficulty peaks there and pretty much rolls down a cliff. Okumura fight is doable with the right preparation at the standard level on normal difficulty, it's just such a surprising spike because you faceroll the entire game (except maybe Kamoshida's) before and after that fight. It's basically like they tried to incorporate a single dark souls boss in that you're expected to get steamrolled until you figure out how to beat the boss.

[@alfie4234]

I actually found the Shido vs Joker one to one battle really badass and satisfying since Shido is the reason why Joker is in this mess.

[@nookami6246]

Of course it’s trash, I mean, it’s got a high score and it’s popular! Jokes aside, it’s a great game! In Kasumi’s thieves outfit you can see her thighs!

[@fagitocumaeda]

19:14 me when i saw him 😂😭😭

[@madquack6449]

3:23 thank you! For telling me I'm not the only one who thinks that part is bullshit. (I had to turn the difficulty down from hard to easy. Almost safe only reason I didn't the only reason because there is no going back from that and even then I only beat it By dumb luck. After that, I turned back up the hard and never had a problem like that.) I have asked what were they thinking? By the way to I freaking love this game.

[@HeyItsAmber99]

It sucked but i beat it on Normal mode pretty easily, it was just time consuming. I had a Bugs with Mapsiodyne though, so maybe thats why i had an okay time with it. Come to think of it, that means simple preparation goes miles. Also, Merciless may boost health but it also tremendously boosts "Weak" Hits, it might make the fight actually easier.

[@grimmghost337]

Hooray! More people understand! My friend and I did a run and it was a bit tedious but I hated both of those fights. I honestly thought it was just him and I

[@coreymckee4844]

Yeah nope.. P5R ending wasn't a tease for strikers. P5S is its own story. Sumire isnt even part of it since Royal is not even mentioned in the story since it takes place after the original game..

[@GameMaster-ig8oo]

I am so baffled as to why people keep saying Persona 5 Royal is not canon to P5 Scramble. Yes, the promotions said Scramble is a sequel to P5, but I took that as both P5 and P5R. It doesn't make sense for Persona 3 FES and Persona 4 Golden to be canon and not Persona 5 Royal.

[@hammieli1875]

I don’t mind not having Akechi or Sumire cause they’re not REALLY part of the Phantom Thieves, but I feel like they should’ve at least referenced the third semester or something.

[@richardvanderpluym8520]

@@hammieli1875 Apparently the third semester is sort of indirectly referenced by Morgana at some point in Scramble, although I haven't seen it myself.

[@Anon_wulf]

Even though I definitely agree that Sumire should have been included in the game more and even added to the party alot sooner, Atlus did a pretty solid job for her inclusion as it is. She became my new favorite in this game and I like how her phantom thief outfit is similar to Joker since she looks up to him so much and they added a dance/gymnast aesthetic to it for her own personal flair. I am still disappointed and bitter about the end for the quick goodbye with her despite everything that's happened. It only makes me imagine how much better she would have been if implemented in the game more Also great extended thoughts video. There's not many reviews that cover the third semester content(understandably) especially to this extent so I'm glad I got to watch this

[@TrashorTreasure]

Oh definitely. She's still an amazing character, regardless of coming into the party so late. Glad you enjoyed the video anyway! Thank you for the comment!

[@thephantomgamingbros.6329]

Question: I know you’re eventually gonna do Scramble; but since there’s confirmation on an English release, are you gonna have to stick with the Japanese version?

[@TrashorTreasure]

I'd rather not stick with the Japanese version, personally, since we already know localisation is still being planned and I wouldn't know what was happening anyway. I just hope it doesn't take a great deal of time to do so, especially given the world's circumstances right now.

[@VitaminM97]

Bro your take on this game was spot on. Honestly probably the best experience I've had with a video game in a long time. Will say though Sumire broke my heart in the ending, especially since I romanced her on my first run 😭

[@TrashorTreasure]

Thanks very much! It really is saddening, isn't it. It's like "I thought we had something!!"

[@MrBig23435]

Trash or Treasure? I saw it this way. I was bummed out that I wasn’t able to get a proper goodbye from her, but you saved her, and you gave her the strength to stand on her two feet. Plus you romance a girl that already had a goal and dream, and her dream is to be a champion gymnast. That’s something you can’t change, all you can do is support her.

[@soullessone3797]

PatDawg spot on comment

[@Jabodie]

Personally I saw it as confidence you would see each other again. It's a cavalier goodbye because she has every intention of seeing you again. There's no need for a dramatic goodbye.

[@kamatari1220]

@your explanation for why Sae can't understand Morgana- my only issue with their plan was how did Akechi understand Morgana in the first place, having not seen him in the Metaverse? I've read about it some but it still doesn't make sense

[@Dayadvance3]

I love your long videos they're very entertaining and I hope you keep doing them eventually when we get Persona 5 scrambled because I would like to see your deep & Long thoughts about this game to when it comes to the West.

[@TrashorTreasure]

Thanks a lot! And depends on how deep or heavy the plot is for Scramble. We shall see. :)

[@s-wo8781]

2:06 I don't see how that's a stretch at all. It's simple. You had to have heard Morgana speak in order to hear me. Easy peasy. That's exactly what we saw with each character that's met Morgana.

[@antoniohumberto5510]

S-wo except Akechi

[@ElNeroDiablo]

@@antoniohumberto5510 Remember that Akechi had been spying on the Phantom Thieves probably as early as Kamoshida. He was able to hear Morgana during his snooping on them at the TV studio prior to them targeting Kaneshiro, and it was Akechi who Madarame was referring to with "The black mask" before Madarame's defeat. It was Akechi that killed Okumura and he had photographic evidence of the Thieves coming out of Okumura's Palace that he used to blackmail them in to joining up. It was probably Akechi who was roaming the Metaverse for the Palaces of those whose abuse of power were being covered up and eventually traced back to Shido (it was Shido who had Kobayakawa pamper Kamoshida, pressure Makoto in to finding out who the Thieves were, and had Akechi silence Kobayakawa to prevent him from spilling the beans whilst the Thieves were in Hawaii. it's not a big stretch to have Shido being the one behind ever villain to face before him) to monitor them and make sure they didn't try to rat out Shido, and in the process came across the Thieves during their adventures in Kamoshida's Palace where he heard Morgana speak for the first time. Hell, Akechi was doing Shido's dirty work in the Metaverse in the months prior to Joker moving to Tokyo, probably with the help of Wakaba's Cognitive Psience work that Shido and his cronies stole before killing her off to cover their tracks, so depending on how long Morgana was roaming the Metaverse prior to Joker's arrival Akechi could easily have overheard Morgana then.

[@DeadMasterJoe]

Also the reason Morgana turns into a helicopter is because of the star Jose gave them

[@wcamicase_gaming]

Shadow Okumura is actually easier on Merciless mode. Still an absolute disaster of a fight. EDIT: Also, yes the shadow is the Persona. We've seen that in Persona 4 and with Futaba in Persona 5.

[@Krysta1Rose]

Sumire should have been available from Shidos palace. The fact she WANTS to come and help take him down was enough for me and she would have been able to fill Akechis missing spot. Atlus wrote her in too little too late and its such a waste.

[@guythomas8263]

All persona are shadows btw. Play Persona 4

[@gaminghistory101]

Maruki is just Heaven Ascended DIO. Prove me wrong.

[@jethawk1172]

Some of my thoughts on the I just finished the game last night. I’m meh it was sad but not sad lol if that makes sense. It’s cause I was only waiting for the 3rd semester and if you played through the vanilla version twice like I did it’s not all that interesting till you get to the 3rd semester. The new layer of mementos is something that you go through entirely because of the story it’s not something that you go through of your own will. Like once you explore that again because of the story part that’s it that’s all of mementos. I feel the beginning of the 3rd semester to the saving sumire part is the best part of the game for me. Cause it’s new stuff just flying at you. After that it’s kinda all easy tbh. If you have maxed out most of the confidants you are pretty op and I was playing on merciless the whole time. I didn’t feel much of a challenge tbh cause most of the enemies your just ripping through with no effort getting chunks of exp for free. Once you find the treasure path(which you can do as early as possible) you have one whole month to do basically nothing 😂 sure you could max out the compendium, finish up confidants in which you have already seen through in vanilla persona 5. But that’s going to just make you even more broken and not leave much of a challenge. I just found myself passing along the days sitting here like uh so is this it I just have to wait? Final boss was gorgeous as ever and I really liked the things added here and there in the ending like everyone saying what they are going to be doing. As for the ending itself, it was better than vanilla cause it leaves a lot more open but I don’t like the goodbye with kasumi. It didn’t have much of an impact at all. Love the ending theme and seeing how everyone is doing a month after joker leaves. Nice touch. 8/10 for the third semester! The third semester should’ve actually been a third semester and not one month of content. Cause besides the new palace and that extra area of mementos which you explore entirely during the story, there isn’t much for the third semester. It should’ve been much more.

[@marjbon5008]

As much as I love Kasumi (She best girl) and I romance her myself I honestly don't get what else you wanted from her in the ending, people in Japan don't really do hugs in public even as a couple. But yeah the game was great overall 100% worth it and I honestly don't think this is the last time we will see Akechi, which is great because he was a good character.

[@psionichelmsman]

Incidentally, Jose might be a future replacement for Igor. While the English VA is still kicking, the Japanese VA for Igor passed away, even the "true" Igor has a new voice between versions. They said that they don't want to use him again out of respect for that VA.

[@PathBeyondTheDark]

The middle bit of the final palace was my favorite part, partially because it does the best job of conveying Maruki's frame of mind out of all the puzzles but also because it explores people's potential to inadvertently cause their own suffering due to the cruelties of the world, even in situations where your intentions are noble. It subtly highlights what Maruki later emphasizes in one of his monologs : that no matter what you do, or how painfully you strive toward it, the world may still beat you down. For example you can confront the bully harassing your friend, do the right thing yet still be punished for it severely physically as well as ultimately doing your friend no good or you could try to find help elsewhere but in doing so arrive to your friends aid too late. No matter what you do suffering is out of your control, you cannot avoid it as long as you are active in anyway and that provides further ambiguity to his actions.

[@afoninja121]

The ending got me as well, but they absolutely could have had a best of both worlds where they had their road trip, but along the way they dropped off members at their own destinations. Seems like a huge wasted moment. While I get what you're saying, about the message of how life can be, keep in mind thsse people faced life and death together and made sacrifices for eachother. There is no way they wouldn't have a better good bye for eachother than that. They should have done something better than what they did. ESPECIALLY SUMIRE. I didn't like this ending at all.

[@jorgerascon1212]

People complaining about the okumuro boss are basically saying is to hard. It honestly just sounds like there saying i suck at the game. Okumuro boss fight was so freaking fun and challenging and the time limit just added to the tendency which made it more enjoyable.

[@iker-jk2096]

Hey man, thanks for the review, it was very good. But one thing, when it comes to play the rest of P1 some day i would recommend you to do some things because this game is a little strange. (i will do this Spoiler free) As you should already know, he game have a very high encounter ratio, but you can use a skill named Estoma, it lowers it. The game have a very bad storytelling, and doesn't show you almost anything about the cast, but you can see about the cast (even the protagonist) when you talk to them when you enter a room (there's different dialogues in each room, and they can change after story events) and there's also side events around all the City (some of them also change if you go there after story events). This also helps when it comes to the story. I know that you probably don't like to use guides, but is always recomendable to use a guide to get the good game because this game have a very bad way to block it and also use a guide to recruit a character named Reiji in the normal route (the SEBEC route)if you didn't, he is only in that route and help a lot when it comes to the villain. Also, if you want you can patch the original OST to the PSP version, meanwhile the PSP OST is very good, the atmosphere of the original do wonders for the game. I know that you already played the game, but this helps a lot to the game.

[@TrashorTreasure]

Thanks very much, man! I appreciate the tips. I did have a persona on Mark equipped with Estoma, although it only marginally helped as I was going through the game, as I left the grinding until the final dungeon in the SEBEC route. I would've taken Reiji with me too (even though I personally wanted Elly), but I took Brown at the beginning of the game without realising that would lock out the other recruitable characters. I don't plan on doing that specific route again, but it's a shame that Reiji's not available in the Snow Queen storyline. Oh well. Maybe if I decide to do a Let's Play or something.

[@iker-jk2096]

@@TrashorTreasure Yeah, that's 1 of the 2 biggest problems of this game. 1 being that the game have a very bad story telling that makes the player work a lot more to see the characters personalities and development (this is fixed in the manga) and the other being that for a game so experimental it doesn't really explains a lot. That makes very hard to have the best experience out of the game meanwhile trying to go completly blind and without asking others

[@BMTats]

@@iker-jk2096 I wouldn't call it bad storytelling it's there for the player to interact with or you can choose to skip it. I could say the same that Persona 3, 4, and 5 having problems with over explaining and reaffirming stuff that was already explained and dragging themselves out way longer than needed to be. At the end of the day it's all about preferences.

[@iker-jk2096]

@@BMTats it's bad when the game only show you like 1 moment for a character and doesn't show you any of the personalities and development.

[@sinisterblackfox9385]

Me personally I just really like joker and kasumi relationship I mean you can tell she was supposed to be his girlfriend even they personas go together it just the ending was sad on that part I just wish she have more time with joker

[@gemgem396]

I don’t know if anyone else feels this way, but I feel that Maruki is a much more interesting and satisfying than Yalddy

[@9aracna.]

Meow

[@phillemon7664]

About your Maruki’s shadow question, you can’t have a shadow and Persona at the same time as your Persona is your shadow. Overall I liked the video, good work. Edit: Jose’s Star is how Morgana was able to transform into the helicopter aswell. It’s never directly stated but the Morgana’s comment of not knowing he could do that was an allusion towards that.

[@liamclarke91]

Someone not being able to have a Shadow and Persona at the same time reminds me of how they say Persona users can't have palaces. I'm sure if that one is actually true or just Morgana guessing and presenting it as fact.

[@TrashorTreasure]

Thanks a lot! Yeah, I figured as much. I did catch the scene as well where Jose's Star fades away after Mona becomes a helicopter, it just still comes rather conveniently at the last minute.

[@psionichelmsman]

Sadly, Maruki's English VA passed away earlier this year. May he rest in peace.

[@nintendosega100]

I feel like Scramble is more of a sequel to the original P5, but I believe they left the details of the previous game vague enough where either the original or royal can fit.

[@RafikiafReKo]

When the shadow merges with the ego it forms a persona, come on, haven't this been mentioned like allot in this series

[@jasonwarnecke1560]

I've heard rumors that with P6 is they want to reconnect all the Personas games back together. As recent ones have very little to show that they are in fact all in the same world. So some of the changes and the new ending feeling like a cliffhanger could be to lead into 6.

[@MrFrankcap]

Where did you hear or read this? I follow persona closely but never saw anything. Would be amazing though.

[@Motivatedragon]

Persona 5 royal and 'trash' do not belong in the same sentence

[@spydersoup8447]

This is just out of curiosity since I'm surprised you never talked about this and I've seen a guy who really hated it, but in your opinion, did you hate the bit where after the Phantom Thieves explored Shido's Palace for the first time, a point in the story where everyone has completely turned against the Phantom Thieves and they need help as much help as they can from people who still believe in them, Kasumi comes into Lablanc and offers to help then with this fight, but they turn her down because Shido is more dangerous than ever and that they think is much wiser to leave her out of the mess and that they're the ones who brought this upon themselves and therefore, they should be the ones to deal with Shido, even though they do appreciate her offer, despite the fact that they've seen her as a strong Persona user, twice and that, like I said, this is at a point in the story where they need as much help as they can. I get his hatred for this as even I think it makes no sense, but I feel that the reason for this is because Atlus is just worried that if they were to have her join the Phantom Thieves during the Shido arc and even having it be like the 'Having Akechi be a temporary member of the Phantom Thieves just for one Palace' kinda thing here and that even though it wouldn't really change the story all that much and they can easily come up with ways to go around it so that the story remains the same, people will hate it anyways all because it wasn't part of the orignal story, much like a similar scenario in Persona 3 Portable in the female route where whenever you max out Shinjiro's Social Link every time, then during 10/4, instead of dying like in the orignal game, he'll instead be put into a coma and be in the hospital. I actually don't mind this being an opinion in the game and I especially don't mind it being exclusive in the female route either, I just don't like that it's forced to happen whenever you max out the Social Link regardless and that I feel that there should be another way to max out the Social Link. But my thoughts of this isn't really the main point, the main point is despite the fact that they came up with pretty clever ways to go around it to make sure the story remains the same as before, people still hated it regardless because of how "it ruins the story and character developments" (Even though it really didn't because they came up with ways to still have the characters go through their developments, as I mentioned) and how "It goes against the game's main theme" (That I do kinda get, but there have been people who were put into a coma and hospitalized, but never woke up from it, as this has tragically happened to the creator of RWBY, Monty Oum. So, it still kinda fits the game's theme, even if it personally doesn't really work for me, one of the reasons why I wish they'd made it a completely optional thing instead of a forced thing that happens whenever you max out the Social Link). So, in your opinion, with the scene in Royal, do you think they should've let Kasumi join the Phantom Thieves to help them fight Shido? Or do you think if they let her, it would ruin the Shido arc and so, it's a good thing they didn't? Aside from the guy I saw, a lot of people I've seen actually seem perfectly fine with this and didn't really care about it at all, even those obsessed with Kasumi.

[@TrashorTreasure]

My apologies for taking a while to reply to this. From what I recall, wasn't Kasumi the one that turned down the Phantom Thieves offer? Either way, I would've very much liked to have her during Shido's Palace, as that would've been a fine enough point to bring in a new party member and give Kasumi more to do than just one dungeon, but with what we have now, I'm not gonna lose sleep over it.

[@spydersoup8447]

@@TrashorTreasure OK. Also, like I said, Kasumi had offered to help, but they turned her offer down. It wasn't the other way around. I'll forgive you for thinking this since I imagine your memory being a bit hazy on the full details of a game, like one guy I've posted a reply to about what I think of a certain part from when he did a LP of Persona 5 Strikers.

[@GameMaster-ig8oo]

First. This is a surprise.

[@jacktwelve1710]

Your last surprise you might say

[@mythriljojo]

Am I the only one who thought the Okumura fight became easy after using Marakunda? Yeah, the boss kicked my ass a few times but that's because I wasn't playing optimally and using the right skills.

[@tallflipkick]

Did you know Merciless is technically the easiest difficulty in Persona 5 Royal (no pun intended as you'll read soon). The creators too confirmed it as although yes the enemies hit hard. You hit even harder and the game rewards you for being smart. It gives you triple the amount of Technical and Weakness damage (what i meant by no pun) so if you increased the difficulty to Merciless and got technical or weakness damage on them. They'd die. Or unless you're like me in NG+ and had Izanagi-No-Okami and break the game. Fucking 1 shot Almighty kill to all foes + Victory Cry. Here's the guy who informed me about it kzbin.info/www/bejne/i4moh6WVirqri9E

[@warm-heartedreaction6191]

i also like original ending better

[@thejonbrownshow8470]

I'd like to think shadow maruki would of looked like that gollum thing in his security level portrait. Before you see the real one(wished we actually got to see him and be voiced in the usual distorted shadow way, plus compared to the shido teases, I could probably buy joker and kasumi not recognizing his shadow as him judging by the portrait)

[@David-gt3gd]

Persona boss: *is hard and requieres thought and abuse of mechanics* Persona fans: "thIS fiGhT SuCKs" Now, I do understand it's different from the usual 'pick whatever and end the battle' and maybe the previous battles showed an easier difficulty, but that doesn't mean the fights in a vacuum are bad. The PQ2 bosses specially don't requiere grinding, they ask of you that you attempt the battles multiple times for you to understand what mechanics to use, same as Okumura. Probably shouldn't try SMT if you feel this is unfair.

[@JadenOmega]

Truth be told, I heard all if the awful rumors about Okumura's palace expecting it to be awful the boss fight and all, but the palace actually wasn't that bad to me, and the Shido fight was just awesome. MY favorite change to the original bosses. In fact it's Shido and Maruki that're my favorite boss fights even though the Maruki fight went on aliiiiittle too long in my opinion.

[@macalloway1]

Here’ are the real questions. A big one is why didn’t sumirewish for her sister to come back in her altered reality or why didn’t maruki just bring her sister back so she would feel guilty.Why does joker see through marukis reality alterations for the other phantom thieves but doesn’t automatically see through akechis resurrection?especially sense unlike the other phantom thieves who had people brought back joker remembers that akechi is dead. And sumire also notices all the alterations to reality except the ones to herself. Pretty sure they don’t explain that

[@WritingGeekNL]

Maruki essentially was the successor of Yalda, because he awakened his higher potential powers only after the Phantom Thieves defeated Yalda. But Maruki is definitely one of my favourite video game antagonists, since he genuinely acts as an antithesis to the player’s thesis of free will. The game asked you to fight for justice and free will, to then later add: But what would you do if you could give up free will to gain eternal happiness? But whereas Maruki is an amazing addition.... Kasumi irritates ne constantly. But at least we have the power to friendzone her ass, lol.

[@KirbyChan]

Wait, you comment about Haru entering the Metaverse the first time still doesn't make sense. Morgana doesn't have a phone, therefore he doesn't have the app. He can go into the Metaverse himself without it, sure, but does that draw people in too just like the Nav? That's never really explained, or if it is, I completely missed it.

[@yurikuki]

I really hope Atlus adds more story DLC for Royal like Jose stuff.

[@Earthquaker]

Morgana expended the last of the wishing star’s power to become a helicopter in the end, they explain it in the cutscene where it happens. Just for the record. On that note Jose is probably a hint to where Persona 6 may be going, potentially the next velvet room attendant?

[@spydersoup8447]

You explaining what the game's new ending means, that happened to me when I was leaving primary school, I managed to become friends and get along with the many students there, but my primary school friends lived around a suburb which is pretty far away drive from where I actually live, which meant that once I left primary school completely and about to enter high school which was near where I live, I never saw my primary school friends again, not even a run in in any of the shopping centers. It's sad to say goodbye to the friends you've had a big bond with, only to end up leaving them completely never to be seen again, so, yeah, the new ending in Royal is one that I can relate to.

[@rushryan7]

Really enjoyed Maruki's palace and the philosophical ideas he brought to the table. And the music! God it was amazing. Akechi's dickheadedness was great as well, honestly made me like him more.

[@joepo6522]

My take on the situation with Maruki having a palace is that a person being in their own palace doesn’t harm it at all. Futaba’s palace came down not because the shadow became a persona, but because her distorted desire ended just as normal. With that, I think that it’s Maruki’s Persona ruling the palace rather than him, as with the person themself not directly ruling it, but their shadow

[@kuriboy9572]

Good thing I saw this before fighting Lavenza. Now I can fight her with somewhat confidence

[@holy9781]

We did okumuras palace the same way lmao and took a few times smh.worst boss ever.i almost switched to easy lmao.i hated it

[@carsontetric3018]

Just going off my thoughts: I believe you have to witness something cognition altering to hear Morgana.

[@Alibaba-he7ro]

For both Okumura and Shido I used pretty cheap tactics to beat them. For Okumura I switched from hard to merciless, which triples weak point damage. This made it much easier to kill the robots all at once. For Shido I had the persona Arahabaki on hand, which reflects physical attacks and has the skill that reflects magic attacks (either tetrakarn or makarakarn, I don’t remember which) and I just used all of Shido’s attacks against him

[@zdude0127]

Makarakarn is the magic reflect. Tetrakarn is physical.

[@benleow1914]

I like how akechi final sence is him getting squash in the morgana helicopter

[@JoshuaT2001]

I may be late to this but the levenza battle is hell even on SAFE difficulty

[@MikulOnIce85]

One thing I want to ask here: did Royal have the guts to acknowledge that Akechi was the one that killed futaba's mother unlink the base game? I was so let down that Futaba didn't get to confront him for how he ruined her life the way Ann and Yusuke got to.

[@PathBeyondTheDark]

It was admitted in the original game, albeit not explicitly. Futaba and Haru do give him the cold shoulder in the third semester, albeit it's never brought up and you are just left to notice yourself. In addition they still act the same in the scene following the fight in Shido's palace which is not only a shame, but continues to feel inappropriate and not just out of character, but completely ignorant of the human condition in general.

[@tiago64sp59]

Actually, Morgana doesn’t need the app to enter the metaverse.

[@نونيم-ي4ح]

Maruki is one of my favorite antagonists in any game,they really did an incredible job with him

[@ReadyEddie760]

I really enjoy this review! Its like you took my thoughts out of my mouth but i suck at explaining stuff like this haha i really enjoy P5 but P5R was just more emotionally invested on my part.

[@TrashorTreasure]

Thanks very much, man! Glad you enjoy the video and the game. :)

[@cchris_]

if you have to have been in the metaverse AND hear morgana speak, how did akechi hear him back in the tv station?

[@zdude0127]

Keep in mind that Akechi was using the Metaverse for 2 years before the rest of the Phantom Thieves. I would think it isn't a stretch that Akechi may have had some sort of encounter with Morgana during that time.

[@tigerishrumble7976]

But then how did Akechi hear the talk about pancakes since he didn’t see or hear Morgana talk? If i remember correctly, he didn’t see or hear Morgana talk until Okumura’s Palace.

[@TrashorTreasure]

Shadow Madarame and Kaneshiro mention an intruder wearing a black mask to the Phantom Thieves, and since we already know Akechi was spying on the Phantom Thieves, he must've heard Morgana speak during those particular infiltrations. Granted, you never see him sneaking him around their Palaces. This is just an assumption.

[@cjandrewsno]

Trash or Treasure? True but that would also mean that Akechi knows who their next target would be which I find unlikely

[@jjfarmer16]

Could someone tell me how many stamps you need in order to fight Jose? Haven't been able to find it anywhere-

[@Sora-sl8lj]

I think it's about 125 stamps needed to fight Jose

[@MrFrankcap]

I'm not sure if anyone has explained this to you (or if you'll see this) but they explain why Maruki becomes a god, basically. First of all, Maruki's palace doesn't have a shadow because shadows become personas. Just like in P4, every "dungeon" is like a P5 palace and when the characters accept their shadows, they disappear into personas. That's why Morgana explains the characters can't have a palace, because their shadows are with them. Maruki becomes a god because of this: the holy grail isn't an "ancient god" he was created by humanity because of their desire to be controlled. This is also why society's desire powers him up more and more. When he's defeated, that role is given to the phantom thieves, because they now become the "image" society takes as their protectors. But the characters aren't narcissistic and most importantly, they ALL spoke to Maruki in private and opened up about their feelings, which means THEY rely on him. This reliance is what instead passes the role to Maruki, who isn't a narcissist but doesn't rely on anyone else and WANTS the power for himself.

[@TrashorTreasure]

Thank you for clarifying this. I’m not sure about the first bit with Maruki’s shadow, as he never actually met his shadow, it just went straight to being a Persona. However, the way you described Maruki becoming a god makes more sense than it did in the actual game, so thank you for that.

[@MrFrankcap]

@@TrashorTreasure Some characters don't need to meet their shadows to get their personas. For example: Yu Narukami from P4 gets his persona in a moment where he's just trying to defend his friend. (Similar to Ren in P5) and it is pretty much implied that everyone who is awake during the dark hour in P3, can summon their persona if they use the Evoker (the gun) I believe Maruki's situation is similar, in that he probably had the potential to summon his persona from the traumatic experience he had with his girlfriend (If I recall, in order to be awake during the dark hour you had to have suffered in some way) He's talking to her at the hospital when he realizes he had that power. And basing it off of Akechi's case, perhaps certain people have certain other powers depending on their will or personalities. For example: the protagonists have the power of the wildcard. Akechi does as well, but he can also turn people psychotic. Strega from P3 doesn't need evokers to summon theirs. We don't see the game from Maruki's perspective, but his power is similar to "the universe Arcana" which is the power Makoto Yuki (protagonist from P3) gets in the end. Which is the power to bend reality the way he desires. He uses that power to become the seal, basically. And it's important to point out that no one remembers what happened, JUST like Maruki's power, until they see the pink petals and remember their promise to meet at the rooftop.

[@TrashorTreasure]

If that’s the case, it’s an interesting way to tie it in to Persona 3, though I still wish we could’ve seen a little more of Maruki’s past to get some further clarity.

[@MrFrankcap]

Trash or Treasure? I agree with this. I think it falls into the same situation as Akechi's. We don't know much about his past, but we know enough to understand the motivations of why they do what they do and why they became who they are when we meet them. From what I've seen in terms of interviews and rumors + the general treatment of P5, it's clear that they have long term plans for the franchise and want to make more story focused, sequel-like games, the like of P5 Scramble. (They developer spoke about a sequel and adding characters from Royal.)

[@XWingToast]

Going by how its always been, Scramble should come after Royal. While it may not talk about royal, they will find a way to throw more info and an explanation in another spin-off, like P4A and P4AU, in which Marie was only talked about in the latter

[@TrashorTreasure]

Agreed. They've been jumping the gun a couple of times already when it comes to P5 side stuff. Dancing In Starlight has a lesser variety of tracks, compared to P3 and 4's tunes from FES and Golden, and Persona Q2 doesn't include Kasumi.

[@XWingToast]

@@TrashorTreasure yeah. My opinion Scramble is fine with its release, I'm meh on how soon PQ2 came out, and persona dancing should be the always last spin-off in the foreseeable future (like P3D and P4D I'd say are fine with their release even though it may not be the last spin-offs in those series, but P5 only had the base game to go off of, which was horrible)

[@cliffturbo2146]

I always find it amazing how much patient people have when beating a turn-based games like SMT on hard mode. I retired doing the Madarame boss fight.

[@random1237]

p5r is pretty easy on hard mode with all the changes and regular p5 wasn't that hard to begin with.

[@cliffturbo2146]

@@random1237 Perhaps I need to try harder then.

[@boomprower]

This video is so good.

[@TrashorTreasure]

Thanks a lot! Really appreciate it. :)

[@masarumina4973]

Is p5 scramble trash or treasure

[@matthewleisure6710]

Regarding the beginning bit about Sae not hear Morgana, if you need to hear Morgana speak in the metaverse to hear him in the real world, then how did Akechi hear him when they were at the tv station? As far as I’m aware, the game never says that they met before that.

[@phillemon7664]

Akechi was infiltrating Kaneshiro’s and presumably Madarame’s palace to gain intel on the Phantom Thieves as the shadows mention the “black mask” foreshadowing his reveal.

[@ssj4galactus]

Akechi was probably watching the whole okumura fight. And the cutscene before the fight morgana and haru had a speech so maybe its that?

[@devanthibodaux3413]

Akechi also bears the pancakes statement from Mona so I think he has been watching the team since the beginning. I don’t think it necessarily needs to show it though for it to be possible.

[@skillsles]

Both games are treasures.

[@taku-ruki]

The mona chopper was only a thing because Maruki his palace. He is able to become a bus because the people think cats are busses, he litterally says so. That chopper comment is kinda stupid because you say you beat the game X amount of times and they say this pretty clearly.

[@TrashorTreasure]

That last needless sentence aside, yes, I am aware Mona mentions the general public thinks of cats as buses (in fact I show this in my review of the original Persona 5), but that's mainly to act as a reference to My Neighbor Totoro. Where in Japanese media do cats turn into helicopters, and why would the general public portray cats that way?

[@taku-ruki]

@@TrashorTreasure I meant no offence, btw, and I dont know if it is actually based on real Japanese conception of cats. but it is in the game. The game states this as an in game fact that this is the case thus it happens. as for the chopper it is purely based on Mona believing himself that he can do it, since he believe it to be true it works. It is really that simple. now that brings its own can of worms like "why dont they believe they can just delete the boss and make it happen" or stuff like that but that is just can of worms that would have no bottom.

[@TrashorTreasure]

Fair enough, although no matter if it was Morgana simply believing hard enough, or something else I may have missed, I personally think the idea of the Mona Copter came in too suddenly and conveniently for plot purposes. It’s a cool scene, but I would’ve liked to have been introduced to the Copter a bit earlier.

[@taku-ruki]

@@TrashorTreasure i agree. It did come out of nowhere in the most ideal time for them. Perhaps they could have made the bossroom inaccesible on foot or something and then made mona transform or maybe Jose his ability to change mementos allowed this to happen a bit earlier during the Maruki mementos part.

[@TrashorTreasure]

That would've been a good idea. Jose's already altering Mementos as is, so it wouldn't have been too far fetched.

[@gamermasterL]

sai eh lol. sigh.

[@Vintagesonic1]

Great video, my man!

[@TrashorTreasure]

Thank you very much!

[@powwowken2760]

Personally, I was hoping Royal would've done a smoother job of incorporating Kasumi into the main plot and not just as a side character for 90% of the game, Kasumi and Maruki are both great, but Kasumi is NOT a new phantom thief, she has no bearing on anything until the third semester, I thought she would've been woven in better, maybe her and Joker having a duo investigation, or at least something to make her relevant before third semester. Maruki being in the shadows until third semester was perfect, but Kasumi desperately needed more interaction with the Thieves prior to third semester. Also they really should've tweaked things like some of the confidant hangouts, why is Makotos entire confidant still about some irrelevant other girl and her crappy bf when it starts out so strong with her learning to enjoy herself at the arcade? Why doesn't Ann's focus more on Shiho or Ann herself and instead spends all that time focused on random model girl, also it's always bugged me that Ann's idea of being 'strong like Shiho' is, being super more prettier than other people, while Shiho is struggling through blood, sweat and tears with physical therapy after almost dying.... it makes her come off extremely petty to me, but that may just be me. To sum it up, I want confidant hangouts to be about, you know, the actual people I'm hanging out with. I love what was changed but I was left wishing they had been a little more bold with the story and character changes, it honestly felt more like a DLC then being a truly new game, no regrets buying it though, more Persona is always welcome As a final note, they made Okumoras boss fight worse, don't know how that was possible, but my god they managed it, those stupid effing green robots wasted 25 of 30 minutes before they just stopped re-spawning for no reason, and I only beat the boss fight because Robo-Haru immediately self destructed when I had 20 or so seconds left... I was even over-leveled to boot, what ass

[@unknownredacted3513]

I generally agree with everything but your POV on Ann's confidant is where I disagree Ann's confidant focuses on her "wanting to get stronger", that way she will be more of an assistance to the PTs. Initially, that is what Joker and Ann are doing however with the dialogue choices and what Ann said, it shows she isn't pulling that much effort into it and still sees it as a game. This fact is more expressed when we see the model and unlike before, the model isn't having any of Ann's shit and dislikes Ann for thinking modeling as some sort of hobby or game (which is kinda true). This situation gives Ann motivation, something that after Kamoshida she didn't have any more of (she still wanted to help others just not to the same intensity as Kamoshida's case) This leads into my second problem. Ann doesn't see Shiho working on her physical condition as "strong" or "powerful". She sees Shiho strong for still wanting be a better and "stronger" person. She isn't comparing the two situation themselves just how both want to be stronger people at the end of the day. But that's my thoughts. Again agree with everything else just not Ann's confidant

[@jinatlas8674]

Yey another P5 vid complaining about Okumura again.... The fight was so easy I won first try. Not even a hassle. I didn't even need to try.

[@raidoukuzonoha883]

Will u cover the shin megami tensei series

[@TrashorTreasure]

Possibly. I wouldn't know where to start, haha! I do have the first Digital Devil Saga, but it's the PS3 port which sadly runs incredibly slowly. I hear Nocturne is a really good one too, but it's crazy hard!

[@persona6featuringdantefrom474]

Trash or Treasure? It depends but smt nocturne or smt 4 are best to start with

[@raidoukuzonoha883]

Trash or Treasure? In nocturne just buff and debuff are your main sources to victory that’s pretty much smt in a nutshell

[@xiniti8185]

P5 taking some inspiration from P4.

[@BitchChill]

Saying bye to the P5 cast is gonna hurt for me

[@karmakitsune]

23:34 Scramble is only after Vanilla P5 and has no mention of Royal since Scramble was developed before Royal