Let's talk mouse weight, feet and hard mouse pads for aiming | feat. SKYPAD Glass Pad 3.0

What a difference pad, feet and weight make to aim... definitely more to explore on this topic, so after talking with a friend (Code0r), I wanted to get this conversation going a bit more.
So if you can comment below, answers these questions and let us know your experience!
Current Mouse:
Current Pad:
Current Feet: (Default or other?)
Your weight preference:
And what do you think the ideal balance would be? As in, control/speed pad, control/speed feet, light/medium/heavy mouse?
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[@mattiasgray]

something ive never seen been spoken about, is the height of the desk and chair, and how that drastically effects control and friction for aim.

[@tigerwalms]

It's one of the most important things, but also very difficult to get right without the correct (usually expensive) equipment. i.e. your seat height, arm height and desk height all have to be correct for you, which is very difficult if all 3 in your setup aren't individually height adjustable.

[@LLyric_]

Wdym never talked about... lmfao its talked about ALL the time.

[@mattiasgray]

@@LLyric_ ok bozo, I guess I’m not as educated as you

[@mattiasgray]

@@tigerwalms true, being able to adjust the hight of your desk is a game changer, I am fortunate enough to get my hands on one, and I fully recommend everyone to get one if they can afford it🙌

[@LLyric_]

​@@mattiasgrayim not a bozo for your misinformation lil bro

[@R3TR0J4N]

Mouse cable resistance, table height, monitor distance, arm rest height, chair height, mouse grip. It's wild how all small factors contribute to performance

[@murilotheodoro5025]

One thing that no one mentions with ultra light mice is the fact that the mouse buttons have to be light as well, otherwise you have to apply more force to click and because the buttons are angled you actually end up moving the mouse. I've had a lot of unintended drags on files I meant to click when trying out the HSK Pro Ace

[@ktg_2castle960]

I’ve been telling my gaming buddy about this though. For awhile I’ve loved that there is so much modulation we can do to customize our interface with the system AND it is dependent on the person hand size, shape, dexterity etc.. the fact that we have feet mice and pad to change makes it truly an endless rabbit hole. We need a way to test mice feet much like the tilt test. Install and tilt. Or just put them in like a rock and use a force gauge lol

[@rixxy5334]

Ye I used to use light weight mice with mud pads and aftermarket feet but I got curious about ye skypad so got one. I didn’t really like it at first and gave up but I tried it a year later with a 75g mouse with tiger arcs and was aiming way better than the mudpad and light mice. Then once I got used to glass I tried lightweight mouse with tiger arcs and skypad and I’ve never felt more control before. It’s like unlocking your full potential cause there’s such little friction fighting against you. It’s the closest to what I think 0g mice would be like but the issue with this is all of us are so used to having friction to fight against that we’ve lowered our skill potential and just got used to it and adapted.

[@DavidDrury90]

After all these years and years, one thing I think Zy might agree with is when you find that perfect setup, there's a "feeling" you get. Something deep in your gut, where it almost feels like you have been using that equipment for years and you instinctively know where you'll end up on flicks and how that equipment will react to precision movements. There's just an indescribable but universally understood feeling when you happen upon "your" setup

[@liturgies]

@@thomasernst3771 Wow bro well said. I feel the same way

[@mellowmoony]

I've found the optimal weight for me to be around 70g, which often helps with the build quality of the mice too. And they work well with "standard" cloth mousepads

[@realevermore]

ULX + Padsmith Empress + xraypad obsidian dots. Had no issues getting used to it and Optimum has a video regarding about this topic with Glasspads and the process of it ;)

[@3xplosiv0]

Fingertip grip I'm assuming haha

[@imFurbs]

The Obsidian dots were such a game changer for glass pads in my opinion. And now the Obsidian pro dots collab with skypad are awesome too. Offers very similar performance as the original obsidians they just last so much longer. Also, which Empress pad do you have? The Speed or Balanced? Thinking about trying padsmith out.

[@bcn_clips]

CS2 also allows to correct aim with strafe keys. But you have to factor in the inaccuracy while moving and need to counter-strafe at the correct moment again.

[@dohnuts4405]

I love the weight of the Stormbreaker, the shape of the DAV3, Tiger ice feet, and a glass pad.

[@Mak0rFN]

Yo RJN, awesome video man, have been waiting for this video for a while. Currently bored while camping and this 9 min video has come in clutch. Love the content and keep it up man❤

[@RocketJumpNinja]

Hahaha thanks Mako, glad I could help, and hope the rest of the camping trip is more entertaining! HAVE FUN!

[@Mak0rFN]

@@RocketJumpNinja no way the trip could be more entertaining than this awesome masterpiece of a vid, been talking to dad heaps about this vid. Appreciate the reply, Have a good one man!

[@RocketJumpNinja]

@@Mak0rFN Hah thanks! Glad it got you guys talking too!

[@3xplosiv0]

Grip style absolutely affects this as well! When I claw (which is my preferred style) with my x2h mini or starlight medium, I prefer a slower mousepad and don't like anything faster than a hayate otsu. BUT I've been grinding fingertip grip with a starlight small (and now Optimum Zeromouse) for about 2 months and I've found that I still play super well on a skypad because I have so much more fine control over the ultralight mouse and I am also not pressing into the pad whatsoever. All this to say, in my experience with fingertip, I still feel like I can play consistently on a skypad with a 25g mouse without overshooting, whereas I put my x2h mini on the skypad and tried it for a few games and it felt terrible. Pretty consistent with what you outlined in this video. So it's mouse weight, mouse feet, mousepad, AND grip style that all plays into this I guess. I think everyone in the hobby eventually just finds their favorite shape/mouse and then works everything else around that.

[@lazykun_]

how do you feel about fingertip grip on cloth mousepad? I got my zerounouse for a week and i'm using the saturn and it feels like sunshine I overshoot. Isn't worst with a skypad?

[@3xplosiv0]

@@lazykun_ I enjoy fingertip on cloth mousepads but I wouldn't go anythign slower than an artisan zero or LGG saturn, personally. Skypad i think just takes the most practice to get used to, but once you've nailed it - it feels second to none. But because I have to wear a sleeve (sticky skin) and constantly have to wipe down the skypad, I still prefer the hayate otsu. It's the perfect mixture of speed and control (for me)

[@user-jb8gp9dy5w]

Few years ago I was memed into thinking that Lighter=Better and bought an ultralight mouse believing its the ultimate and only right way of playing fps. I fully dedicated to this idea but never achieved any good results with it, couldnt do anything with my shaky aim no matter what mousepads I used. Just recently picked my old heavy Roccat and just started obliterating every one instantly, it didnt even took me any time to get used to it. My shaky aim gone. Dont believe anyone who sells you some formula of perfect mouse only use what you feel comfortable with. Sometimes Heavier=Better, if you have essential tremor for example you better find something heavy couse the extra weight will filter out all the unwanted micro movement of your hand.

[@ElysionYT]

skypad gang

[@UpgradeLemonade]

I've found the same RJN , I fingertip grip and while yes lower weight feels better and lower initial friction on mousepads for small micro adjustments is better. I do need more control than a pure typical glass pad can offer. Which is why I stick to cloth pads. I think anyone can learn to use a Skypad with ultra light mice and low friction skates. But I'd rather have some built in control by default without sacrificing more weight in my mouse.

[@tigerwalms]

I went on a quite obsessive 3 year journey of trying to find the perfect mouse, weight and pad combo for me. My biggest advice from it all would be that, before anything else, you should decide what you want your 360cm to be before going any further. Your cm distance will dictate your mouse aim type (which will dictate what percentage of arm, wrist or finger you use), and thus dictate your body comfort. So I found that when getting lighter mouse, I had to lower the sensitivity to compensate, which means I would go to full arm aim, which I did not enjoy. Essentially what I'm saying is I don't feel the weight itself matters (within reason), it just needs to be the correct weight for you to control at your preferred 360cm. So to start with don't worry about accuracy, just get a feel for your preferred turn speed, then adjust the mouse shape, weight, pad and skates to allow for the max accuracy at that 360.

[@GRiMS2K]

what pad and mice did u end up with in the end tho?

[@tigerwalms]

After going through about 20 pads I settled on the Saturn Pro XSoft, all my Artisans now sit in the cupboard. It's both comfortable and my performance on it is statistically better. Again tho, it's all connected, so when RJN talks about glass pads in this vid I understand what he is saying, but I found glass feet on a cloth pad was better than slow feet on a glass pad. It's a fascinating subject tho, I could write a 20 page essay and talk for days at the things I believe from my findings. @@GRiMS2K

[@tigerwalms]

@@GRiMS2K The pad I ended up with was the Saturn Pro. The mouse is the Vaxee XE Wireless. Skates are the Superglides glass skates V1, but I do keep the middle sensor skate that came on the mouse, which is very important. I'll use 32.5cm to 37cm 360 depending on game.

[@GRiMS2K]

Oh hi, thanks for the reply! glad to hear u found something nice@@tigerwalms

[@incediumignis]

personally i am a friction freak, i have xtrfy m42 and a basic cloth mousepad, ive removed the mouse feet, sanded down the bottom and then sanded the cloth pad to make it fluffy, this gives a lot more control over my mouse and my aim and because the mouse is so lightweight i still dont need any pressure to start accelerating deccelerating the mouse.

[@Matt-wc7bl]

You could do some simple calculations between the same mouse feet and different pads to find any pad's coefficient of kinetic and static friction, but that would not account for the softness of a pad and how much that impacts speed, or how much the speed of a pad varies with climate. The materials to do this would be inexpensive. Except for the mice and pads. force of friction = weight * friction coefficient , force applied (stopped by friction) / weight = friction coefficient

[@scotty_teee4226]

One thing that I have personally noticed is that my preferences can change slightly, game to game. In Apex I like to play on fast pads like glass or the Artisan Raiden OG. I find it helps me with the freedom of the fine recoil control and the change of direction when tracking someone that is strafing very quickly. More control in these situations hinders me. Change to a similar game, like call of duty, I can happily use a slightly more control based pad, as the strafing and recoil adjustments aren't on the same level as apex. A tac shooter, or game where you want cross-hair placement and single shot weapons more, more control again can be a benifit. I middle ground can be OK for all but I believe you need to dial in the perfect combo, per game. I still believe that anyone's highest potential would be the least weight and friction as possible, but with a shape that perfectly compliments them. I still think more shapes need to be explored, and shapes that aren't the norm. Extremes of pen like, to closer to a flat hand laid out. And the wildest one that I thought would be something glove like that has sensors in the fingertips that interact with a pad, kind of like the pen with a tablet. I personally enjoy the journey of experimentation with mice and mouse pads and I have had more of both of those than I like to admit, but I think everyone would learn a lot from doing so

[@abdullahzalzala2594]

For me who recently gotten a skyped and been using it for the past couple months, I've always struggled with cloth pads cause I found that the friction of my hand and mouse were getting in the way even with lighter mice, And the idea of aiming with my bear hands/ no friction has always stuck with me. I find the Sky pad to be amazing on how consistent it feels all around and after just a little while I was able to adjust, flicks and tracking feels snappy and fast, also as crazy as it sounds it feels controlled to me! I am maining the x2 right now, waiting on the ULX to arrive as I really want to feel how it is with these lighter mice! The idea with aiming like a pen or with no friction has always made sense to mee as I would be in full control of my mouse movements.

[@rolfathan]

As someone who prefers heavy mice, I find this fascinating.

[@green8923]

Personally, I would go for light mice with more control in the feet/pad (medium to heavyish). Taking into account things like static friction, inertia, and "stopping power", having a light mouse means I have have less inertia, meaning I'm less likely to over-aim, while also being able to spring into action and do micro movements easier without the weight factoring in. Having the extra control on the mousefeet/pad means I would get lots of extra stopping power. That's what works best with my mouse sensitivity anyway.

[@RitzyBusiness]

I've been using hard pads since the early 2000s, at this point they feel the same as a good cloth pad. I personally prefer them, but the delta of performance shouldn't be significant between options. You build up that control without even thinking about it. I think I still prefer lighter mice on it but am not bothered by heavier mice because the pad doesn't get in the way like it might on some others.

[@monk_cs2]

the 90g zowie divina mice are perfect for me. Any lighter just feels shakey. Using gsr 2. Long time cs player.

[@LordJammin]

I've found that I naturally have very good arm control, so my setup is always as fast as possible with minimal friction and a light mouse. The more I've been able to reduce textures, the more natural my mouse movement felt. After that I just chased down the fastest pads I could find. Slick mouse skates helped reduce friction and scraping once I got to glass mousepads. On cloth I use glass skates though. My main setup is the Razer Viper Mini SE w/ tiger ice and wraith cosmic glass v2 (speed surface). I'm retrying my Finalmouse tenz with pulsar superglide skates on an artisan raiden mid to determine if I get a ULX small currently. The raiden also always sits on top of my glass pad to keep dust and hair off of the glass pad.

[@dimwillow7113]

Dream would be MZ1 at 29 gram or something. For me low weight means less wrist strain, thats the main reason lower weight is better for me. But i also think its more fun because it feels the mice is working with you instead of against you. Switching target with a light mice and fast pad like Hien is a lot of fun and feels effortless. Im not gonna pretend going lighter have increased my aim but it hasnt made it worse so its a win because of less wrist strain and more fun.

[@ariathyf144]

That would be my pref aswell, I'm noticing the huge benefits of lighter mice on control surface for years. Flicking in zig-zag motion become faster but also very accurate to stop. I'll love to have the MZ1 at sub 50g and I don't mind compromize on build quality in the areas where heavy use don't affect.. The faster you move the more heavy weight induce movement lags and smooth out micro details of movements.

[@JeffWaynee]

I prefer a smaller ambi mouse that weighs around 70-80g. So I use a G305 with a AAA lithium with fingertip grip.

[@FallenSleep]

I main a sandblasted glasspad I had made since shipping killed my options back in the day, and while it took me little time to adjust I do think that slower skates are better. I for one use uhmw tape on top of Btl skates on a 50g GPX with either 34.6 or 41cm. Another thing to keep in mind for consistency is using a sleeve to prevent sweat and have a simmilar friction all around, as well as trynna get a big sized pad (50*50 ie) so you can place it on the edge and not really worry about comfort when moving up and down. For controlling it I also believe that a big part of it comes from your fingers and your wrist/palm which is why I don't recommend sleeves that are simmilar to gloves or cover the palm. Also theres a new 2.0mm control glass pad in the works with prototypes being sent to reviewers by laonda and thewhale, might wanna send him a dm on X since it might lead you to some new discoveries, as always thanks for exploring new avenues towards the goal of improving aim/consistency

[@Alexandra-Rex]

That sound of the mouse moving over the pad is like nails on a chalk board.

[@kerricklogan3801]

I play Quake, CS, Apex, Overwatch, Hunt: Showdown, Battlefield, speedrun Acid Spy, and dabble in OSU with mouse. Ive found that I really love the weight and glide of the Razer Viper V2 Pro with stock feet on the Razer Gigantus V2. I know, it sounds like a fanboy comment, but I have over 70 mice and over 50 pads, plus many many many mouse feet. Currently, Im using the XM1 RGB on the Gigantus V2, using Tiger skates made for the Rival 110 (I think?). All in all, I still prefer the Razer combo, but Im finding that the extra control from the XM1 combo is treating me equally well. I cant say one is better, as I can put out numbers quite similar to one another. But the difference is effort put into mousing. The XM1 combo requires more effort, and thus, I would assume longevity/consistency of performance is not there. I had a thought that perhaps we need to think about where effort is put; Do you want to put effort into controlling the mouse or put effort into mousing in general?

[@cadezierer8433]

I've only gone lighter and lighter over the years with less and less friction. I personally feel that I would aim best with a mouse that didn't weigh anything at all. Moving my hand with little to no resistance just makes the most sense to my brain and has helped my aim improve a bunch. Just gotta stay relaxed and it's no problem

[@SebiX-fp2ux]

I personally don't find glass pads or fast pads in general too fast for fps games. I do play cs2 and overwatch (mainly Widowmaker) and I love that I have 100% of freedom with my movement. The main issue is that the glass pads will scratch your mouse skates very fast (in like a week or 2 in my case). They have become so thin that they are worse to use on any other pads. And I am not feeling it to replace my mouse skates every 2 or 3 weeks. This is my main reason I am holding back from glass pads, but overall if you want almost friction lesson experience, this is your best pick I would say.

[@Katze822228]

I think it just depends on what you're used to. A couple years ago I used to play on a super slow mud pad with slow stock feet and a 90g mouse and that's what I aimed best with. I eventually had to get a new pad. I got a pad that was still slow but a lot faster than my previous pad. Initially I hated that pad, it was way too fast for me, it felt as if my crosshar got repulsed by the enemies, like reverse aim assist. But I stuck with that pad because I didn't want to get a new one and after about half a year I got fully used to it and aimed better than on my old pad. I started to like the faster feel and I then tried a cordura pad, a sub 60g mouse and later switched to the skypad 3. That's what I use now and I aim the best I've ever aimed on it. On faster pads you do need to manually stop the mouse at the end of a flick and that takes some time to learn if you never needed to do that before. I learned to do that on the cordura pad so the transition to glass wasn't that hard. If I went back to a super slow setup I'm sure I could relearn to aim well on that if I gave it a couple weeks. But the reason why I personally prefer a faster glide and light mouse now is that it makes aiming effortless and more fun. On the super slow setup I used to get exhasted if I aimed too much and even sometimes got wrist pain. With the lighter mouse on the skypad I don't feel any exhaustion from aiming. After learning to aim on a fast setup I don't feel like the extra control slower pads have is much of a benefit to me anymore. Maybe flicking becomes a tiny bit easier but tracking becomes more difficult. So as long as flicking and tracking is important, I don't feel the need to have control from my mousepad anymore. But If you want more control, I agree with what you've recommended in the past. A slower pad/mouse feet and a light mouse is the way to go. Playing with a heavy mouse on a fast pad is pretty bad, stopping the mouse after a flick becomes a lot harder so what that means in practice for me is that my aim becomes a lot slower. On a slow pad + light mouse you can still aim fast but on a fast pad with a heavy mouse that's not really possible.

[@artins90]

This is true for me as well, I just switched to a 56g mouse from a 71g one and I am overshooting all the time. It feels terrible and I don't think it's a matter of getting used to the new weight, I have been using it for 3 weeks and there are no signs of improvement. I am starting to think that a certain amount of friction is needed to ensure accuracy and my current mousepad-mouse weight combination must be below that.

[@Falcon-du6mh]

You tried lowering your sens?

[@artins90]

@@Falcon-du6mh Yes I did but that's not the problem. I can move the right distance just like with the old mouse and I am accurate, the problem is stopping at the right spot when moving the mouse quickly. Slow tracking and slow aiming are not an issue, quick turning or flick shots are the issue.

[@SparrowNiner]

@@artins90 Try putting more hand/finger contact with the mousepad for more stopping power

[@NeonMako]

Light mouse + control pad has always been the way. But then I'm a CS player, control pads have always been the way for me XD

[@mynameisjeff3940]

The game changer with my sky pad was I can increase the control on the pad by gripping my mouse lower so my fingers contact the pad and give me more friction and control. It’s also variable because I can reduce the pressure on my fingers to the pad for more or less control as I see fit. I use the x2 mini.

[@shiion6711]

I think there’re 4 things that effect your movement/aim 1. Weight of the mouse 2. Speed of the mouse feet 3. Speed of the mousepad and 4. In game sen/mouse dpi To balance this I find that having one the most control, one having the most speed and the other two having a balance between those is the best so for example I use a ulx(speed), a very low sens(control), lgg Saturn and corepad(balance) or you use a very high sens(speed), a zys damage(control), normal sens and tiger ice(balance) *I would recommend cutting a thin mouse pad to use it as mouse feet for glass pad

[@quakeplusplus]

You can adjust the levels of control with the type of sleeve/glove you're using. A lot of control issues with glass come from unstable forearm due to too low friction.

[@DJFITME]

Been playing for year on skypad 26cm sens valo,cs,overwatch now the finals. Different Mouse that i have used has been between 52-75g. To me skypad is must for high sens because micro corrections are easy there is no tug,slow pads make me miss a lot small adjustments but skypad fixed that.

[@sammyule]

I play cs. Have for 10 years. At this point I am using a g502 wireless with glass feet on a hard Logitech mousepad (g6 I think) at 800 dpi (2.1 in-game) this has been an incredible setup for me. I have learned to use my pinky as a brake on the mousepad to stop moving. The mouse having almost no friction makes flicks and small adjustments really easy with a bit of practice. I never feel like I am fighting my mousepad when making tiny sub mm adjustments. But I do wonder what a super light mouse would feel like. I have never tried.

[@rahu1066]

g903 (110g), SapphireSkates, Plastic Hard Pad. I aim better using a near 0% friction setup with a heavier mouse. Compensating control using my hand/thumb/fingers to make contact with the pad creating stopping power/friction when needed.

[@gamist8166]

My shidenkai's coming in today and excited to try it. I solved the hardpad sorta problems with the vancer ice, and now I hope to be getting the more robust 'vancer ice' pretty much. Maybe you'll have good luck w/ a glass infused cloth pad

[@AmiciCherno]

I think I find the best experience using my SkyPAD 2.0 as a lifelong high sens user (about a 6cm/360° equivalent currently), so I just make sure my mouse feet are arranged to allow me sufficient stopping power without increasing kinetic friction too much and I mostly play on about 1/4th to 1/3rd of my mousepad (not the XL version). My current difficulties with my setup is that my mouse is one of the only mice on the market that can support a tight enough grip on the mouse to counteract my sweat issues (tried multiple mice and multiple types of griptape, even sandpaper) and with that issue, since my mouse is old (G300s), comes an old mouse sensor that has difficulty tracking over sweat spots on the glass pad and a mouse cable instead of being wireless, but beside those issues, I love my mouse to death and it serves me well. With a high sens I am able to flick accurately and maintain a great deal of stopping power using the friction of my fingers against the mousepad as well as the strength within my own hand muscles to both start and stop a quick and concise flick. My mouse is 83g and the feet I use are UHMW discs from McMaster-Carr (can elaborate if necessary), and use my mouse without the stock feet applied and the rims for those feet are ground down to level the surface, replacing them with the UHMW discs in a symmetrical arrangement of 6 on each side with one in the middle at the bottom of the mouse. One difference in my mouse that might take effect within the way I flick is the fact that the sensor is in a medial positioning if you hold the mouse in the right hand, this means the sensor is more focused in the point between your thumb and your pointer finger (I would say, going straight through it would probably hit right at my pointer finger's first knuckle; being the knuckle closest to the palm).

[@omegaPhix]

Wow, my average sense is like 7-8 times slower

[@AmiciCherno]

I should add, I do play Quake Live as well, so everything I’m using here is use quickly and accurately for the examples.

[@dtester]

Some people don't know how heavier mice with adjustable weights were a thing back in the day. Heavy mice are not that crazy with good glide on a hard pad with good feet. Hard pads were the only good pads at the peak of the heavy mice era. I noticed that lighter mice got popular around the same time quality soft pads started to become an option.

[@gxmcdg]

People could to manufacture a feet with the material of the fabric mats around so people that doesnt like cleaning them could get the feets and use them with hard mouse pads. It would also be better for dealing with the wearing off: it doesnt matter how much and how well you keep washing your mat, there will be some wearing off on it. That would happen on the feet from now on, that we would simply to replace from time to time.

[@michaelschwarz5907]

i got a superglide about 2 weeks ago and use a x2h with tiger ice v2s on it. it just takes a bit of time because the static and dynamic friction are basically the same. there are lists for aim trainers that help with the adjustment. by now, I've beaten most of my tracking scores, while static stayed roughly the same. and i do think you can absolutely use it in tac shooters. this stability while holding an angle sounds like a myth to me now, because you can absolutely point the mouse at the same spot😅 what is probably a lot better are the small micro adjustments you constantly have to make to your crosshair placement. they are just faster and more accurate, given you got used to the glass pads friction. as for comfort, i think the only downside is you have to wear a sleeve, which i wear even on a cloth pad, due to high humidity here. i think glass and a light weight mouse is the way to go, but it needs a lot of dedication first to get used to it and 2nd to train the precision needed. Glass has no chill and will always show your flaws, but the skill ceiling seems to be a loy higher as well in terms of the sheer speed of small adjustments and when tracking.

[@TorsionTestis]

What we actually want is a mousepad/skate with high control but should glide while moving.

[@ArchOfficial]

So a surface combination with a very aggressive friction curve? Something like Velcro maybe?

[@n00kie]

G-Wolves Hati S, Fnatic Jet and Pulsar Superglide is my secret.

[@ViberzRL]

What a weird video for YT to suggest to me rn. Grip your floor with your toes to prep yourself for the set up I have rn: Pad: Artisan Shidenkai V2 Skates: Glass Superglides V2 Mouse: Basilisk V3 Pro (112g) Sens: 13cm I was on a hein Xsoft with year old V1 glass skates, they were feeling real sluggish/ moisture was hurting me but the control helped me ignore it. I also wanted to get a faster pad with more rigidity as I’m a VERY tense player. I really wanted to get obsidian skates for the shidenkai but they don’t do Basilisk V3 pro skates and the dots won’t fit at the back by a mm and a bit - so I turned my eyes to a psychopathic idea. I wanted to stay clear of glass pads tho but found the Skidenkai so I did some research and couldn’t find a thing in cloth x glass pads mixed with glass skates - so I wanted to be the poor sod who tests a cloth x glass pad with glass skates to see how it functions because “fuck it, we ball”. I’m loving it so far but I’ve only had one 10 hour sesh on it so I’m still in the “break in” phase on the skates and pad, just waiting to see if they both find a consistent wear in or if the 2 hardnesses will just ruin each other more and more over time - only time will tell. I was thinking of getting a lighter mouse but dreading the switch because I’ve never liked the smaller “non ~super~ ergo” mice as they’ve always felt too small and awkward for my hand (I’m 6’5 with wide/ chunky palms). Although I still wanted to get a lighter mouse but with decent size so I set my eyes on the large ULX (for when it comes out) but now I recon I’ll see what mouse suits my hand size best as I don’t intend on staying on the Basilisk unless this absurd combo feels immaculate for some reason. Didn’t mean to waffle this much but I’m intrigued to hear anyone’s ops on the experiment?

[@JtwasLuck]

Lighter the better for sure, ever since getting the zeromouse, I honestly can't back to the Razer SE, hell even the ULX is too heavy. Stock 29g and 24g with a small battery mod, aiming truly feels effortless. As for control pads, I've been using control pads for over a decade, everything from the QcK Heavy to the Zowie GSR, Gamesense Radar, Vaxee PA Black. Though this year is when I've swapped to a hybrid pad, the Artisan Otsu XSoft. This pad is insane, I never thought a "fast" pad could have this amount of control but wow you honestly get the best of both worlds here. On top of that the softness allows you to tailor the glide in some situations where you want even more control. For me I'll take a balanced pad and a light AF mouse. There is no such thing as too light for a mouse. If you have trouble controlling your mouse because its "too light", that's a skill issue. I can go back to a 60g mouse just fine but why would I? Light mice are insanely comfortable and allows you do flicks even faster.

[@ursdubel3585]

I got my endgame mouse, its a HTS+ with Kailh 8.0s a 500mAh battery and additional weight of 30 g making it exactly 85 g (I used sticky weight mechnics use to balance out car wheels) and i play it on a Artisan Zero mid. I normally don't like the Kailh 8.0s on lighter mice but i they work very good with "heavier" mice. Love it

[@cablair]

Decided to go back to more of a speed pad. Had my hyper x extended for 3 years and now I've gone back to the mz1 with the lower back. Massive improvement in flicks and tracking on all games

[@eizooo]

My current setup: Pulsar Superglide + Atlantis mini 4k + obsidians pros. I would only possibly swap it for The whale glaze + pulsar x2h mini + obsidians pro. Just for a bit more control and different mouse shape more suitable for claw. And that is it. I would never go for skypad, specially for you who likes mud pads. Skypad is arguably the fastest glasspad out there. Biggest pros for glasspad compared to cloth: how consistent it is, and how easy it is to clean. Con: eat skates really fast and therefore you need to constantly change skates, but I fix this with the obsidian pros. Biggest con which for me is a big nono for cloth pads: how impacted they are to humidity and how long it takes to clean them and have always the same glide. I've never had a cloth pad that glides the same way on day 1 and day 15, even after washing them.

[@eirin099]

the balance of the dynamic/static friction and the games/type of aiming you have to do is also pretty important ex soldier 76 head tracking vs close-mid range tracking in apex and flicking to heads in cs vs meatshots in tf2, certain combos make certain things straight up easier and other things harder its pretty interesting. no matter how much i practice i cant change directions rapidly enough to aim as well as id like with a mouse with high static skates/heavy mouse(without tensing) whereas too low static skates will make me unable to stay consistent outside of aimtrainers/short flicks(again unless i tense).

[@granttcg]

Was using the ULX and Artisan Zero X-Soft for about 2 weeks then recently switched to the Pulsar Xlite V3 eS and The Empress Glass pad and my tracking for apex has by far been the best I’ve played in the last 4 years. Also set all new kovaaks records.

[@TheDC-ks3tw]

I think another reason may also be why some mice feel differently than others is how you hold the mouse makes the sensor rotation different. You can change this by downloading raw mouse accel and only using there sensor rotation. This is something verrrrrrrrrrrrrry few people talk about. Can you get use to it? Yes but it does also take a few to adapt to it instead you could change it.

[@imFurbs]

Please do a update video trying out the Skypad with the Xraypad x Skypad collab obsidian pro mouse feet. They are optimized for glass mousepads, and offer more control and durability. Even the original Xraypad obsidians were super good for the skypad. Curious to hear your opnion on lightweight mouse with those feet and skypad.

[@MightyAims]

For me, I want the fastest of all three worlds. Lightest mouse, right now I have the HTS+ 4k, fastest feet, obsidian dots and jade dots, and fastest pad, skypad 3.0 xl

[@kee2484]

Your should check out the obsidian skates for glass

[@TheCatvsduck]

i agree with the heavier mice on glasspads thing. i have a glasspad but haven't switched to a heavier mouse yet (currently use 60g mice) but i the heaviest mouse i would use would be around 75g. also this might sound dumb but i've heard many people on the internet say they moved to a higher sensitivity when they switched to glasspad and that's what i did too when i got it. Went from 27cm/360 to 19cm. I think with a glass pad you can pull a higher sensitivity because the static friction is so low. It helped me with overaiming my targets weirdly enough. Lastly people have been hyping up xraypad obsidian skates for glasspads so they should be good but to anyone reading this don't buy xraypad obsidian PRO skates. i bought those and they were trash. the normal obsidians are red and the new pro ones (that xraypad made in collaboration with skypad) are black.

[@khan2048]

A light mouse with slow pad would be easier to stop than a heavy one on the same pad due to less inertia. So scientifically speaking, using that combo should be a win-win combo. Yet, the smoothest tracking aimer I've known (hauntr) uses a heavier mouse on a skypad. And from the rumors I had also heard that a heavier mouse on a skypad would make your tracking smoother opposed, while the opposite would make it "snappy".

[@dtloveless]

So something like: High weight, speed skates, speed pad Low weight, speed skates, control pad

[@kee2484]

No weight laser mousepad that tracks your hand 🙌

[@not4export]

With time I noticed lighter mice give me struggle with unstable aim. Aim with them can be very good but sometime it can be bad. Which is almost not a thing for me on a heavier mice. I think it depends on body/mind condition. If I am kinda shaky, heavier mouse would be better for me. Interestingly biggest improvement with lighter mice for me is not aim itself, but that my hand is less lazy with them for some flicks, especially ones with low chances of success, like some almost 180 degree air rocket attempts. I don't know about you, but I tend to just not take these kinds of shots a lot of time. It's like "aaah, whatever" :D Lighter mice give me this airy feel of... well lightness. I tend to move hand a lot more with them and try more attempts at crazy shots.

[@lnbabz]

Well, imo light mice on a speed pad with no restrictions does give you the ultimate highest potential for aim but also error. If you are cracked at aiming the light mouse and glasspad will give you the most freedom to aim.

[@joshdeconcentrated2674]

I use a 30g 3d printed mouse and your pad was too slow. still enjoying my glass pad. honestly it comes down to preference

[@ArchOfficial]

That friction testing is going to be skewed a bit by static and dynamic friction not being the same. I don't know which is more important, but I would assume heavier mice will have a more aggressive curve, while lighter mice have less difference between them. The actual difference while moving might be low, but it seems appreciably high when the mouse is static ie: pixel aim.

[@DaveAlkema]

I have a very small surface area to work with. Basically I sit on my couch and use my TV as a monitor, and have my mousepad draped across my arm rest. My main pad is the Artisan Raiden Xsoft, and I prefer mice in the 40-50g weight range. My current main is the 39g WLMouse Beast X, with my backup being the Razer Viper Mini SE. I play with a 21cm 360.

[@omegaPhix]

Ergonomically terrible

[@J.J._777_]

How long did you try each setup? There's always going to be a bias towards the current setup because of muscle memory. It takes a long time for muscle memory to adjust to new parameters. The KZbinr "optimum" spent 30 days using a glass pad with a compression sleeve, and he eventually came to prefer it after initially struggling with it.

[@RocketJumpNinja]

I've used hard pads in the past for months, this time around I put at least a month in and I just couldn't adapt to it. Personal preference, I guess, but yeah not for me. Control pad + light mouse all the way.

[@x6xk1LLx9x]

I've used a logitech g440 (hard pad) and a superlight for years now, specifically because it feels like an air hockey table. I tried slicker and slicker cloth pads until I tried this setup and haven't felt the need for much else

[@939Productions]

I'm not a good aimer in any sence of the word but when it comes to frition and control I noticed that i use my palm to increase or decrease frition or to anker my hand completely. Therefore i like smoother mouse pads with low friction.

[@StaySic4Ever]

Weight wise, I never chased the extreme with hole shell, I dislike those and we've seen many new mice with full shell and very light so there's that. I though about it, is so called some weight good as in so that you can feel that you're holding something with what you aim with. Though imagine if you only needed to move your hand and no mouse weight in it, pretending your hand is mid palm sensor and skates on fingertips and back of your palm. Basically the least possible kinetic energy to move around and control. I tried some stuff and feels liberating it's like using your mouse grip on your pad without holding a mouse and aim like that, sans that weight. So that is where I would say yeah, I'd like the mouse to be as light as possible. Still shape and full shell no hole priority. As for Skypad I've been using it for quite some time now and it's a learning curve kinda. I got used to it to tame a bit of control I wanted, I didn't want to change my sens though. I wouldn't also use a different mouse to compensate, so then I guess depending on person, tune sens and/or skates to find what works. Currently using Zowie GTF-X it adds that tiny bit of control while it's fast. So for me personally med-high sens, faster pad and as light mouse sure. I like my sens, liked going lower weight and with it if ever needed I can add a bit of control either with skates I guess, if I'd use glasspad for example or use near as fast clothpad with similar speed. Basically light mouse, fast pad and use sens you like and tune it with skates if you like the sens and pad.

[@user-dx8ms4yb2p]

Hi RJN. I love your reviews and the shape of the MZ1 for gaming. I just received my MZ1 wireless yesterday. My first MZ1, which was wired, had disconnect issues after a while which I wrote off as normal wire issues. Unfortunately, after less than a day of use, my MZ1 wireless has scroll wheel issues. Scrolls in the forward direction will either misinput or do the opposite input in atleast 1/3 scrolls. The same is true for the down direction. I firmly believe you should switch manufacturers, especially after seeing reddit posts about the mice. Xtrfy is simply not cut out for the job.

[@RocketJumpNinja]

That's sad to hear. So the way it works, I designed the mouse shape for Xtrfy, Xtrfy then got everything sorted and found the best factories that they could to make these things (this is standard for most companies, they don't actually have their own factories, way too expensive). My copies have been great, but yeah a lot sell and so there are bound to be defective copies (again, every company has these issues, so even if I did make mice for other brands, we'd still run into the same issues, it's just the nature of reality, nothing is perfect). So ... if you can contact support and get help from them, that'd be great! Give them a chance to resolve the issue for you. Let me know how it goes!

[@peleh1]

The balance is called hayate otsu, there you go. 😊

[@n8rz]

Feet and weight will always interest me

[@NaruC55]

Current Mouse: Asus ROG Harpe Ace Aimlab (for palm and relax claw grip, endgame mouse for me, 19x10 cm hand, arm aiming for big movement and wrist aim to micro adjust) Current Pad: AxGamingPunk (balanced cloth pad with soft cushion for comfort and stopping power potential) Current Feet: Tiger ice V2 (for maximum glide and ptfe skates are always the safest choice) Your weight preference: 55g or below would be ideal And what do you think the ideal balance would be? As in, control/speed pad, control/speed feet, light/medium/heavy mouse? - From these combination, it's going to be control or speed cloth pad + speed feet + light weight mouse, so you can move or stop your mice as desired without something holding you back - For mice, ambidextrous shape is the best because ergonomic mice have tilting grip that makes your wrist rotates outward and can be hurt at the bottom corner of your palm Yet again, Shape is still king. Good shape mice make you want to use them over and over again.

[@Poppaai]

My opinion is that a lighter mouse is in principle better, but it also shows much better which part of aiming you are bad at. A heavier mouse also gives you more self-confidence because you are less likely to jitter it really depends on the type of game! If I have to focus on 1 corner in counterstrike, I prefer to do so with a slightly heavier mouse than an ultra-light one that shoots in all directions with the slightest movement

[@anickname6960]

Very interesting idea. Never thought about friction and weight as being similar in the effect it has on aim (as long as you don't lift your mouse). I personally use a mountain makalu and a logitech mx518 legendary. And I aim pretty well with both of them, there really is not much of a difference even if the mountain is much much lighter than the logitech. The reason for that is that I palm grip and have pretty large hands, and the mx518 shape fits my hand so perfectly it feels like an absolute glove, so I aim really well with it even if its very heavy by today's standards. I would like to have a mouse with a similar shape that's lighter, but I really could not find one yet that feels that "right". About the friction: I have a pretty hard cloth pad, but I play mostly movement shooters with a long time to kill. I have friends who are very strong in counterstrike though and all of them use soft mouse pads, one even stacks two on top of each other, something some counterstrike pros do as well, I think having a higher resistance while aiming helps with microadjusting, something that is not done much in movement shooters but done a lot in games like counterstrike.

[@PapaJuan]

Right now, my favorite combo is using Jade skates from XrayPad on a Artisan Zero (mid). I like the feel of fast skates on a consistent control pad. I would recommend trying XrayPad Obsidians on a glass pad. Plus, they are red, and that looks cool.

[@kunalshrivastava6398]

Lamzu Atlantis OG V2 4K, included PTFE full size skates on a cordura microfiber pad. That is what I am most consistent with. Glass feet slow down. Superglide V2 are good for some type of games, not so good for others. I loved the beast x/finalmouse shapes but the Atlantis takes the crown for claw grippers.

[@MeowTow]

Make a MZ1 Pro without the RGB/holes please. Thanks.

[@Gungrave123]

we will not rest till we get the coveted 1 gram gaming mouse!

[@aversiveac6459]

You should check out clips of snowi using the skypad and M1k combination. I find it hard to imagine having such good control and smoothness in aiming with such a light weight mouse and low friction set up. I wish i could aim close to that!

[@tsunika26]

Perfect mouse for me in would be a Rival 310 that weighs 40 grams, the Rival 310 shape is just by far the mouse I have aimed the best with at its weight, only reason I have a different mouse is the weight, I am thinking of getting an Aerox 5 soon to see if it is as good as the 310 for me.

[@StirlingAims]

I love skypad, been using my 2.0 xl for 2 years now

[@cs16300]

The SkyPad 3.0 is a great pad for me personally. I don't like fabric pads because the condition changes depending on the humidity, so I've been using only hard pads or glass pads since IceMat pads. The pad is wide and has low resistance, so you can move quickly... I prefer a small, lightweight mouse that I can hold with my fingers, and this pad works well with that. (mz1 mouse) However, the mouse paw grinds like fine sandpaper on the glass surface and creates residue. This is a little annoying. (But I prefer this fine surface among glass pads.) So I solved it by attaching a special circle for the yuppie pad to the mouse foot, but if you use something like breaking, it will also grind, so I recommend the control version. In winter, my hands are so chilly that my whole body is shivering, but it's okay if I keep them warm... As for the noise problem, it was hard to reduce the noise decibel with glass or aluminum pads. And lastly, I think the price is expensive.

[@matttan4404]

I 3D printed a shell for my Viper V2 Pro, with stock internals at 30g total. I think that its the perfect weight for me because of the shape. I think the control is still very good for me.

[@Saltylenses]

90° edges, light 800dpi and hardpad for quake, sodtpads for newer games

[@josephsavage2576]

Personally, I found great success using 80g mice and faster speed pads. I am currently using the Fnatic Dash and a Steelseries Prime Wireless for the past few years. I have tried lighter mice on different pads but my aim always felt off. If I have anything under 65g, then I would miss shots consistently as the weight helped with the stopping power. I have tired the GPX and the DAV3, but the weight and shape have always turn me off after using them for a week or so. I went back to Steelseries everytime. I know they aren't the most popular brand nor are they the esports darling they were years ago, but I like them.

[@WindingDreams]

So it's a question of friction versus inertia.. Imagine dragging something light along the ground or dragging something heavy on a slip and slide. I think light + friction gives you more control. Atleast that's how I made it make sense in my own head.

[@HellSpawnRulerOfHell]

I want no weight and no friction I use a modified FK2 with G305 internals (~52 Grams) on a Shidenkai V2

[@aw93927]

I believe you could eventually get used to the skypad enough that you can go lighter with your mouse, but it could take a while. Started using Skypad 1.0 and Viper Ultimate two years ago, and switched both pad and mouse last year to newest versions (ViperV2Pro,Skypad3.0, and recently TigerIceV2). Was not the easiest transition as the 3.0 is way smoother but now a year later I feel comfortable on it. Ordered a ULX so we’ll see how long that takes to get used to 😅

[@Serectos]

for me is how much space i can have my arm rest on the table, i play high and low sense in different game and i can say i like speed more but then its up to my arm movement to be able to track. the worst feeling i get when im tracking is when you feel that more resistance stoppage when its going fast then slower on the mouse pad

[@ktg_2castle960]

I have a zaunkoenig m2k on a skypad. 23g on skypad 2.0

[@Aryzon13]

What about the fingertip only mice like M2K and HSK? They are quite different from the norm. Maybe glass + fingertip mouse is the way to go due to supposed higher precision of using only your fingers.

[@QrayzHD]

As a fingertip player who owns a HSK+ i do not believe smaller mice are the way, i think bigger mice offer more control as the feet are spread out over a larger surface, but i accept it could also be because i have much more experience using bigger mice.

[@janmagtoast]

The moment I switched to a gpx superlight after having only used 100g+ mmo rpg mice I felt like lighter was obviously better but since having to switch to an old mice for a few days I noticed how much smoother heavier mice are. I still feel like my aim overall was better on the gpx but damn my tracking was butter

[@oakmen4604]

I currently cut weight by wrapping my hand in a trash bag. I then vigorously workout my hand to speed up cutting water weight. Then, I'm ready to game. I'm also considering talking to the doctors and have unnecessary weight cut out from my hand. Only recommended for the most serious of gamers. 😂

[@dustin_echoes]

Ah yes feet, my favorite topic.

[@Rivilant]

While yes its techically easier to aim with a more controlled pad, the consistency with glass pads is just unbeatable. I cant handle getting dead spots on cloth it drives me insane

[@anonapache]

i would love you to test the full lineup of the pulsar mousepads, especially the fast variant.