Roguelikes: How They Can Do Better

A perfect example of a game doing it right :)
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Check out my main content on:
/ propokenoob
TWITCH ARCHIVES CHANNEL! bit.ly/38ZWHUj
SUPPORT ME ON PATREON!
/ propokenoob
Socials:
/ propokenoob
/ propokenoobofficial
Hello! My name is ProPokeNoob. I am a hardmode nuzlocke challenge player, speedrunner, tournament commentator, and charity event organizer. Through randomizers, fitness advice, public speaking, and education, I prove that the impossible is possible :)

[@weaktusk]

Any pushback against the undo button sounds very similar to the pushback when games started including a map instead of forcing you to draw your own

[@ProPokeNoob]

This is an excellent parallel :)

[@MrMrkman98]

Convenience vs. Strategizing. Some people do claim to enjoy games without mini maps or quest markers, and they usually cite that it helps create immersion/forces them to interact with the game world more. "Given the opportunity, players will optimize the fun out of a game." is a phrase I've seen often used to explain why games don't just allow the player to cheat freely. Players are terrible at limiting themselves and creating self imposed rules that feel satisfying. I think this is why some people push back against the idea of an undo button. An undo button is like a math problem you can solve by the guess and check method. While a game that forces you to "waste time" contemplating your choices is a math problem. Some people will feel compelled to use an undo button not as a last resort or as accident forgiveness, but instead use it to push through the game while ignoring the structure of the game system. I do like undo buttons in certain games. Puzzle games especially can be great with an undo button because sometimes the puzzle requires a lot of movement just to get to back to where you are "stuck" in the puzzle and resetting your progress entirely wouldn't be in service of engaging with the puzzle. However, some games like fire emblem have introduced undo mechanics to overall good reception, but it does seem to betray the nature of the game with it being a game where choices are supposed to matter and units can be lost permanently. Having an undo button seems to cheapen that concept. Perhaps the developers understood how many people were reloading saves if one of their units died making that mechanic ultimately useless. I have yet to play this game, but a roguelike with an undo button seems strange on the surface because roguelikes are about repetition and failure. You typically aren't expected to be able to win every run and failure sets you back to the start. Although, with an undo button it creates a different feeling that your actions have less weight because you can always undo them. The idea that "memory does not equate to skill" is a contentious one and games like TFT routinely demonstrate that familiarity with a games mechanics is a part of that games skill ceiling. It also is a (or the) natural progression method most people confront in their lives. The more someone discovers about a game the more they usually get better at it. However, if all knowledge is constantly presented to a player then there is less of a gap that comes with familiarization of a game. Reducing skill gaps. I'm not sure what I'm trying to say exactly, but I think it's an interesting topic.

[@TheDilla]

i think too, there is sooo soo many complex interactions that not having an undo button would be extremely punishing to the player. Even myself after playing this game for like minimum hundred hours, there are times when I don't know how these 4 obscure items are going to interact with this monster passive and the 4 curses I have at the same time.

[@ProPokeNoob]

There is a lot to keep track of. The undo button eases that puzzling and curiosity piece and increases the fun of discovery for me :)

[@thesuomi5026]

make green guy unhittable, shield 3 + heal 3 on Ama, kill knolls, deal with chomp last