Romancing SaGa Speedruns Are Incredibly Broken

[@DoctorSwellman]

Thanks for watching. Shoutouts to the random voiceover issue at 6:34 lmao

[@InfernalRamblings]

You were just talking quietly to lure us in. ;) Also just gotta say your production value has leveled up quite nicely. This was a fun and breezy watch.

[@jeremysawa7075]

I would have rather seen the EVO game. :(

[@geoffkannenberg6167]

Editing quality is superb these days, my guy. Loving the direction the channel has taken the past couple of years

[@donovon95]

I thought my headphones broke lol its not that bad

[@raymondcannon2141]

I thought a guest was going to come in.

[@BAIGAMING]

8:15 One thing I learned over the years from playing many different JRPGs is that although it looks like games might be copying each other, it's not actually copying, they both probably got the sound effects from the same source/library - especially if they're games from the same publisher then they're sharing resources between the developer teams. I've seen this happen even with textures in old games, completely different games would use the same stock pictures library to turn into textures. One thing I learned from programming and working is that you don't necessarily have to "recreate the wheel" so to speak... Great work on your video! It's perfectly normal to not know what you're doing when playing Romancing Saga - I've played some for dozens of hours and still don't know, they're very tricky games with a lot of nuance. But seriously, great job explaining all of these speedrun tricks, you have a great way to conveying all these difficult glitches and tricks. 13:30 Yeah don't worry about using English names. Old games are so tricky to explain because before developers/publishers announced their official English names, we'd often make our own translation based on how it sounds. Like in the original Fire Emblem we called a character Lawrence, but when he appeared in the mobile gatches and Awakening DLC's it turns out he's actually Lorenz. Same with Diadora, it's actually Deidre.

[@ThePerfectKiosk]

Moral of the story: put a checksum on your save buffers.

[@user-q0czvby6f]

They did; the catch is that it is only 2 Byte long which is abysmal in today's standard. The right pane in 17:00 explains how the runner bypassed the checksum while overwriting a game save file incompletely from another save data.

[@InfernalRamblings]

As a game programmer I have to admire my forebears in the 16-bit era (and earlier) who did all of this in assembly. Assembly programming does not have any of the guardrails and safety features that modern programming languages do, so with any small bug or miscalculation you can easily overwrite/corrupt memory. Especially so if you're trying to write code that runs at a high framerate on the CPUs of the day. One of the things I love about speedrunning is how runners find a use for memory corruption like this. Usually corrupting memory is your fast pass to a crash or other unplayable state. But speedrunners finesse it so that at the least the end of the game is still functional. Shoutouts to all the speedrun pioneers who find and refine such techniques.

[@FOcaseal7]

Seconding this. Hell, fascination with the fault-lines where games break, especially ones that featured prominently online like Megaman 2 and LoZ-OOT speedruns, got me into game programming in the first place!

[@bottinator22]

A few modern programming languages and the games made in them don't have these guardrails, and still can have bugs from indexing things like arrays out of bounds

[@FF2Guy]

Not surprised that Romancing SaGa was so broken. It was basically released as an unfinished game. A lot of content was dropped due to memory limitations. All this was later added back in and then some for the rerelease Minstrel Song for PS2

[@SirFuzzi]

I just wish Minstrel Song's presentation weren't so... erratic and drugged up. It was equal parts a KPop music video, Microsoft PowerPoint, and a spreadsheet simulator. Damned if the music doesn't absolutely rip, though.

[@Abyssoft]

Your editing levels up with every video, the text reveals behind the graphics was a nice touch that I'll need to "borrow" 👀

[@darmanitanDW]

Romancing SaGa 3 was a game I got into about two months ago, and it totally hooked me in, to the point I did three full playthroughs in a row. Highly recommend.

[@shytendeakatamanoir9740]

All of the SaGa games are great. Scarlet Grace is also very good, with a fantastic battle system, and the Frontier Remaster is also fantastic. And we should have RS remaster this year, so I am quite hype for this too.

[@Conan_the_Based]

Nice. I'm glad to see other connoisseurs enjoying it even today. RS3 has always been my favorite game from when I first discovered it back in '99 or '00. I even muddled my way through with an unfinished english patch several times, long before it finally received a proper fan-translation.

[@ShredBorges]

@@Conan_the_Based You're a man of culture aswell, I see. One day long time ago in my childhood, I feel asleep grinding gold in RS1 to cheese the Icy Sword early in the playthrough. My brother found it weird that the battle music was playing for like 20 min and went to our room just to find me like holding the SNES controller even in my sleep lmao.

[@Galanthos]

That's perfect. Romancing SaGa's glitches being so weird that no one really knows how they work is just so quintessentially SaGa. Like, if the actual intentional game mechanics are going to be opaque and incomprehensible, what chance could we possibly have with the glitches?

[@Jrdotan]

This is my favorite jrpg franchise and seeing it getting some attention is really cool Also, i wouldnt consider E.V.O search for the eden obscure, its pretty popular with Snes fans But the first game in the E.V.O series (theory of eden) is definitively obscure as hell and its a damn great game with a score made by the same composer who made the soundtrack for the Dragon quest games (Koichi sugiyama) Its a hell of a great and completely unknown game

[@Dancarnate]

I have never actually played a SaGa game, I have covered some of the music before but have never actually played them unless you count the Final Fantasy Legend games. Great video, love seeing RPG speedrun content.

[@1beatcher]

"Don't blame me I'm just lazy." - DoctorSwellman 2022

[@shytendeakatamanoir9740]

0:33 To be fair that's the usual SaGa experience.

[@erie3936]

Romancing SaGa 3 is so broken I accidentally broke the game on accident. I was playing around in special commander mode, ..., I have 2 seven star swords.

[@EdwardoFE]

The SaGa series is a great example of a game “broken” in fun ways.

[@ShuriBear]

Sick to actually feature the Japanese speedrun community. I think the western speedrun world abandons this side of the community way too often. Great vid bud!

[@lhfirex]

Even just playing RS3 normally feels like you can break the game by learning how its systems work for sparking skills. Sneak deep into the demon castle early and unlock some skills way above what you'd get from normal battles, and then do it again in the fire fortress, and you can tear through so much of the game. It winds up being really fun getting into this game because of the freedom you have to build characters. Plus, you can get some purely silly characters like a snowman and a lobster to join your party. Aside from glitches, I think most players prefer Katarina as a main in the game because she's got the most flexibility with her skill potential.

[@Conan_the_Based]

There's nothing silly about Snowman and Boston (Lobster). Snowman is invulnerable to fire and ice, and is a great shield at the head of Tri-Anchor or Desert Lance with li'l old Parry tech. Boston's basic punch grows as his KungFu rank grows. He almost doesn't need techs. (Don't mind me. I could talk Romancing SaGa 3 all day xD )

[@joncliffmckinley5868]

@@Conan_the_Based yessssss, Boston is a fucking monster with a little water magic and kung-fu training

[@Gerkola]

11/10 man I love your stuff. I promise if you keep going you'll be going viral! Take care!

[@landalin2102]

As always another very thorough and informative video. It's really cool to hear speedrunners talk about different runs and their various mechanics. Take my like again

[@sigurdtheblue]

I love your audio design. I recognize so much of the music and you used the fantastic Yu-Gi-Oh Forbidden Memories fusion sound.

[@WannabeMarysue]

12:58 oh, I wish I too could get lost in the desert and transform into sabin from final fantasy vi...

[@darkchiron]

Speaking of Saga 3 using Chrono Trigger sounds, isn't it using alot of sprites and map layouts from Final Fantasy 6? I swear some of those places look EXACTLY like places in FF6.

[@KawaiiKaabii1993]

that's cuz the sprite artwork was done by Kazuko Shibuya you can look at an interview section of FF Dot the pixel art of final fantasy artbook

[@givecamichips]

SaGa games always excel at two things: Absolute baller premises and confusing everyone who hasn’t played them yet. Also notable is their techniques to prevent spamming the A button as a viable tactic. These things don’t really apply to Final Fantasy Legend III, though.

[@The_Real_DCT]

Yeah but I think that's due to SaGa 3/FF Legends 3 was done by a totally different team or studio

[@dotgone]

But FFL3 asked the question, 'Would it be easier to Kill God if we just equipped our time traveling stealth fighter airship with nuclear missiles, blew the roof of his tower open, and then rained nuclear hellfire on him? And the answer was yes, so it gets a pass.

[@alleng2845]

Just tweeted you but I’ll say it here too. Thanks for the content, doc! You’re 100% as talented as any other speed running history creator, and I can’t wait to see you start getting your play buttons, mate! Cheers!

[@gaminggoddess85]

The Romancing SaGa gacha uses the Chrono Trigger menu sounds too. Even though I never played the SNES SaGas (because, well, English speakers sorta couldn't until recently) hearing the sounds there weirdly still make me nostalgic for them.

[@AurionSkydragon]

Wonderful video! I'm grateful to see SaGa speedrunning receive more awareness outside of Japan. Thank you for making it!

[@knightsurda]

Romancing saga is a game I wish I could like, but its just too convoluted for me to understand. Which is kinda ironic considering I played the hell out of Saga frontier remastered to the point where most of my characters are stupidly overpowered lol

[@Weremole]

The game designers modern games are more streamlined versions of the SaGa formula. Alliance Alive does have a linear plot but none of the systems are obscured. It's also written by the author of Suikoden. It's a very cute game.

[@CayKatre]

2:50 That was very smooth. Good job.

[@Lady_Moonsong]

Thank you for choosing the correct series from the poll!

[@arkturiamordio]

potion seller references always make me laugh, good job

[@givecamichips]

If anyone wants some RPG related laughs, check out the Romancing Saga Minstrel Song redesigns. Everyone went from pretty normal fantasy designs to full on fashionista mode. Special shoutouts to Albert (Please at least check his out), and Hawke, whose redesign was so incongruous and funny that they haven't even put it in their gatcha game.

[@givecamichips]

I hope if they make a RS1 SNES remake someday they give the option to use Minstrel Song redesigns. They already have sprites for 80% of them through RS Re:Universe.

[@OwGash]

good to see people cover this hidden gem

[@TheZettaiRyouiki]

I love Romancing SaGa 2. Great video!

[@mashtonish]

Absolutely love SaGa and it's cool to see streamers I follow featured. Also, it's totally "Wood" and not "Ward" ;)

[@crystalfgc5919]

Potion seller, i require your strongest potions

[@FarelTheGiraffe]

I am quite knowledgeable on the SaGa series, and like what you put together here. Good job :)

[@Captain_Dark]

"Don't blame me, I'm just lazy." Soooo blame....you?

[@sagacious03]

Great analysis video! Thanks for uploading!

[@PaintyMainy]

One day Alundra video. One day... Good stuff as always.

[@DFE-wu9lq]

The reason why the Arakes glitch occurs might be caused by the cutscene that happens when you die with a certain character in the party.

[@ArcNeoMasato]

This actually has me really curious about the normal "SaGa" games on the GameBoy, or "Final Fantasy Legends" to the western plebs.

[@danielelbow]

Romancing SaGa 3 is a wild game, I can't believe I slept on it for so long

[@FrosHandle]

stopped by to say........love ya Doc keep up these spicy videos my guy

[@LarkanElRegresado]

3:53 Nice Terranigma music º-º

[@Lovuschka]

"Memory Destruction Glitch" What. Am. I. Hearing?

[@bb97979]

I gotta give it to you, that like and sub plug was pretty funny. You got me mate.

[@rjsmangitruns]

Another banger. Doc don't miss!

[@user-q0czvby6f]

>Apparently nobody knows how Lady-Luck bug works. And I thought this bug was found during 20th century...

[@bakerboy8910]

Need...more...EARTHBOUND CONTENT! Jk bro, always appreciate any *crap you put out. *Crap was also slang for cool in the 90s...go figure

[@annyonny1224]

Wherefore thou hath made thine videoeth that pertaineth to the hastening of the playing of the vidya, that thine videoeth hath not grueling beggary unto thine children who art thine viewership, therein, and whereas all of the children of Susan art guilty of the sin of the failing of doing so, so say I unto ye this day: I pray thee, come and lie with me to taketh me to wife; or if thou wilst not liest with me, I pray thee, takest me to manservant then; and lo, whatsoever thout mayest will for to be it so, of these peradventures whereof I have spake, behold, mine heart shalt rejoice eternal.

[@ICountFrom0]

Yer gonna have to give in see how bad evo can be. What's the WORST that can happen?

[@cray-seacoral]

I've been waiting for someone to talk about Romancing SaGa ever since I played 2 when it went on sale on the Switch eshop. Still haven't beaten it though, stopped at the final emperor and said that was good enough for me. 😅

[@Julmara]

very nice video i wonder if there a glitches other than the tech glitch for tales of symphonia

[@betterinsodapop]

"Ignoring that EVO exists." :'(

[@DoctorSwellman]

In the Swellman cinematic universe, anything is possible, even a triumphant return when it is least expected 👀

[@poohbear01x48]

I didn’t even run Saga1 and I somehow ended up subscribed!

[@RydioRC]

This appeared to me as i finished playing a marathon of RS2, RS3 and SaGa Scarlet Grace lol

[@reesewhittington6778]

2:52 Dear god, that sounds abominable!

[@camwyn256]

The dead Saban run was my favorite

[@BlueserStream]

THE YOU TUBE MAN SAID THE HECK SPEECH WHAT

[@lugubriousgrabber2494]

I just need some video documentation on smt 1 and 2 speedrunning i gotta get it

[@DoctorSwellman]

I’ve thought about looking into SMT/Persona runs in the future!

[@KimParkkinen]

@@DoctorSwellman As someone who has spent A LOT of time watching SMT/Persona speedruns, this gets me excited if it were to happen!

[@JD-xz1mx]

You could have stopped at "Romancing SaGa GAMES are amazing".

[@TheHateradePress]

Wait... Why ignore that EVO exists?

[@bluespaceman7937]

Oh wow, this is interesting. And unusual.

[@thegaymingavenger]

There's a character named Sif and that's really all I need to want it 😂

[@novelezra]

Romancing SaGa?! I barely know her!

[@Exalted-Beleth]

Am I the only one that ALWAYS reads this game title as Romancing Salsa? I swear to God I can't be the only one.

[@1HomuLeo1]

No that's surprisingly common, lol

[@dethaddr]

One thing I do hope is all these players that do these speed runs.... I totally hope they beat the game normally at least once so they can enjoy the whole game slowly before they set about not seeing anything but the credits. There's no real EXP gained if there's no journey to the ending!

[@diribigal]

This is a really minor nitpick, but I really like watching your videos (just became a patron) and this is always a little jarring: I'm not expecting perfect Japanese pronunciation, but if you could take the time to study how the vowels sound (or just put things like "sangorou" into Google translate to hear the Japanese), it would really improve the flow of your videos for me/anyone else who knows some Japanese. (If you happen to know Spanish, pretending it's Spanish rather than English would make a huge difference.)

[@DoctorSwellman]

I’m learning more with each vid, appreciate the feedback!

[@jprec5174]

Now speed run SaGa scarlet grace!

[@Siinory]

ROMANCING SAGA GETS SO LOVE! PECK YEAH!! Ouch yeah starting with RS2 wasn't indeed the best decision, RS3 is more beginner friendly. Speedrun wise I know someone who ran RS3 and I think on the English patch

[@clarafedde8674]

I bought saga frontier and suikoden ones(still have it today). It took me almost forever to beat frontier...well lute I didn't for 15 years. Apparently how to beat it was extremely simple and I had to load my old save just to win. I love the story, but the battle system(based on ff2) sucks. Great vid. Very awesome.

[@joncliffmckinley5868]

The battle system for Saga Frontier sucks? Could you elaborate?

[@clarafedde8674]

@@joncliffmckinley5868 obviously you never played it. So go ahead. Play it. I would never spoil the fun for you.

[@wolfcaliburRX]

I can't find SaGa on gamepass, did they remove it?

[@leftysheppey]

12:19 Does that look like the Frost Spell from breath of fire on GBA to anybody else? Since DrSwellman talked about stealing sounds, why not assets too? Lol

[@ultimatecalibur]

I think that was just a standard SFC/SNES effect technique used in a massive number of games (including RPGs) around that time. No need to steal when that was more or less part of the hardware.

[@leftysheppey]

@@ultimatecalibur fair enough haha

[@hicknopunk]

Why not start with the earlier saga games on the gameboy?🤔

[@benjaminjwilson6694]

I only played saga frontier

[@Guitar-Dog]

Never heard of Romancing SaGa, what is it? Gonna find out after I watch this vid

[@The_Real_DCT]

Romancing SaGa is the SNES installments of the SaGa series which started over here as Final fantasy legends 1-3 on Game boy which in turn is somewhat based on the original FF2 as the SaGa series builds off the system from it. There's a HD remaster of Romancing SaGa 2 and 3 for most platforms and a recent HD remaster of PS1's SaGa Frontier and they also re-released the original three Gameboy SaGa's as Final fantasy legends Collection of SaGa. Just be for warned, SaGa games can be hard to get into with how odd the system is, for example in Romancing SaGa you don't have levels instead you level up skills with weapons as you use them, eventually you will meet a requirement to learn a new skill with said weapon and the more you use it the stronger you are with it's weapon type, and it's non linearity. Other SaGa's use Race instead of classes or jobs and each race powers up differently like Monsters can only grow eating other monster's after a battle but they can de-evolve if they eat meat from certain other monster's based on a hidden tier list. Robots grow based on gear, Mystics grow various ways based on which SaGa you are playing as they changed it from SaGa 1 to 2 to SaGa Frontier

[@JudgedMentalMusic]

Try Ys next

[@mineraljunction]

omg please do an alundra video tho...

[@tonycrimes]

great video, sad its not alundra tho

[@DoctorSwellman]

Maybe one day you’ll see it featured here!

[@tonycrimes]

@@DoctorSwellman i would say that I'd sub to make sure I dont miss it, but i'm already subbed! love the content

[@SaberKittyZero]

What's the point in answering in polls if you're just going to ignore the results?

[@DoctorSwellman]

For science, or something like that

[@akiradkcn]

Honestly, I dont even know why EOV was on the list

[@chiefavagef0x837]

Idc you're using the English names on purpose you're wrong! W. R. O. N. G. WRONG!!!!! I'm just joking for some reason I just really like makin' fun of the ppl who get P/O'd over the smallest shit lol it's just funny to me especially since I was like that as a teenager I feel like I do have some right to but I'm sure someone will disagree lol

[@NerevarineKing]

RS1 was so rushed and unfinished

[@Torqegood]

Man this kinda sucks since Evo is pretty neat.

[@MCStuck1]

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