Russian Cases: the Genitive Case of Modifiers

[@jordandwsmith]

You have no idea how helpful this is for my intermediate Russian class.

[@russiangrammar]

That's just what my hope is for this channel. Thanks for commenting!

[@chadbailey7038]

You pack a lot of info in only a few mins! Спасибо 🙏🏾

[@russiangrammar]

Спасибо, рад помочь!

[@thornton]

2:30 would it not be хоро́шего even without the spelling rule? Does it not have a soft ending?

[@russiangrammar]

Ш is an exception among Russian consonants: it's always pronounced as a hard (unpalatalized) consonant, no matter what letter follows. So while the 5- and 7-letter spelling rules make it look like a soft stem in forms like хорошего, хороший, etc., it's really a hard stem: we see this in the feminine nominative form хорошая. Note also the -ого spelling in words like большо́го, where (because of stress) the 5-letter spelling rule doesn't apply. ))

[@thornton]

@@russiangrammar Many thanks for taking the time to reply to this.

[@Asma-ep9bx]

Plz keep up , ur expectations r very simple yet understandable .. excellent

[@robert_wigh]

1:47 Why is the genitive singular form of русский русского and not русскего? The к in русский is soft because of the following и, when shouldn’t we use е in the -его ending to avoid making the к hard?

[@russiangrammar]

Consider how other forms of русск- also start with о (русского, русскому, русском)... the ending -ий is spelled that way because of the 7-letter spelling rule: never write ы after г, к, х, ш, щ, ч, ж. Instead, write и. So yes, к is pronounced soft before и, but hard before а, о, and у, and that can lead to otherwise unexpected alternations: soft к sound in русский, русским, etc., but hard к sound in русского, русскому, русском.

[@robert_wigh]

Russian grammar Ok, so you’re saying that if we would write русскего instead of русского in genitive singular for neuter and masculine nouns, that would lead to the nominative singular form for masculine nouns automatically turning into русскый (because -ый -> -его), which violates the 7-letter spelling rule. That’s the only connection I can make between -его and the 7-letter spelling rule. I am right, or have I misunderstood your reply?

[@russiangrammar]

Careful: we write русский because of the 7-letter rule (и instead of ы after к, and 6 others). The choice of -его/-ого has to do with the 5-letter rule, which doesn't involve к, г, or х. It's OK to have unstressed о after к, г, х; but not after ш, щ, ч, ж, ц - for example, нет хоро́шего (5-letter rule!) большо́го русского словаря. It's helpful to memorize a little phrase like that to serve as a mental reference point.

[@robert_wigh]

Russian grammar Yes, I know русский should be written with an и instead of an ы, I only wrote ‘русскый’ to demonstrate my idea. So, no, I did not understand correctly. So, русского has an -ого ending and not an -его ending simply because it does not need it, the 5-spelling rule does not effect the verb root русск- and thus it does not have an -его ending. The -его ending is only used because of the 5-letter spelling rule, right? Have I gotten it?

[@thornton]

@@russiangrammarFirst, thanks for all these great videos. Minimally edited, with maximal examples. Fantastic. When you say "the ending -ий is spelled that way because of the 7-letter spelling rule:", I infer that all Russian adjectives are really -ый and that -ий is used only when the preceding letter is included in the 7-letter rule. But this is not the case, eg после́дний. This word is free to take -ый, isn't it? So some words can naturally be -ий and decline as such, eg, -его. In the case of русского, how could one have anticipated that the ending is a product of the spelling rule, and to therefore decline against the ending? Can there never be real -гий, -кий, etc?

[@ericg3064]

You make my life so much easier

[@stephenfowler9752]

I am working with an teacher of Russian in St. Petersburg via Zoom. She is fantastic but I genuinely appreciate being able to get your very insightful, concise lessons. At one time I found a series of lessons that were available for a fee. Now I can't find them. Are they still available?

[@egyptianplanner]

Stunning videos So Simple and Clear Super explanation Thanks a lot

[@brycebray9149]

Could you recommend a good site to test myself on the cases for nouns, adjectives and other modifiers?

[@russiangrammar]

+Bryce Bray There are lots of options out there.. While I'm not affiliated with these sites & haven't gone through them thoroughly, here are several that look helpful: www.russianforfree.com/exercises.php learnrussian.rt.com (has tests keyed to their free lessons) www.practicerussian.com/Home.aspx (check the 'tests' menu)

[@Nissan-Erugurando]

Доброго времени Вам! К сожалению, в словах ЧЬЕГО/ ЧЬЕЙ редуцирование "Ь", которое очень часто происходит, приводит к недопонимаю. Я, как-то, не понял, когда мне задали вопрос ... В машине лежали два ящика с инструментами, полностью одинаковые. Я попросил товарища принести из этих ящиков большую отвёртку. - Принеси мне, пожалуйста, большую крестовую отвёртку! - А с чего? ( он хотел спросить с чЬего, я сказал именно "чего". И я воспринял его ответ как "А с какой это стати?"). - Как с чего? Я просто тебя попросил, вот и всё... - Да нет.. .С чьего? - А, да с любого! То есть, я его ответ воспринял как " а почему я должен тебе принести эту отвёртку?! Иди и сам возьми!"

[@sapientiayu5597]

I’ve got a question on что+ adjective. And I still get no clue. Do you happen to know why Что нового uses genitive case? I assume there might be some grammar rules hidden.

[@russiangrammar]

The genitive is often used for a quantity or portion of something, so perhaps there's an implied amount of... news? experiences? and the questioner wants to know what part of that is new or interesting. We see this in similar expressions: -Что интересного? What's interesting?/Anything interesting? -Что в этом плохого? What's bad about (literally, "in") that? -Что хорошего в них? What's good about them? Spanish speakers might be reminded of Qué hay de nuevo? In informal styles you can also hear что in the genitive: А чего интересного-то? It's a subtle issue and sometimes you can also hear что новое. For a really detailed look, google "Анья Манкила что нового" for a paper on this (in Russian) she gave at a conference a few years back. Спасибо за интересный вопрос!

[@jamesh625]

What is the etymological reason for -его/-ого being pronounced as -ево/-ово?

[@russiangrammar]

It has to do with historical sound changes. Linguists have suggested this reconstruction: first, г [g] in these endings weakened and came to be pronounced as a fricative [γ] (like modern Russian х, but with vocal cords vibrating; you can hear this change of [g] to [γ] more broadly in southern Russian dialects). This created the sequence of two vowels 'oo,' but perhaps since doubled vowels aren't common in Russian, the [v] sound developed in between them. Спасибо за интересный вопрос!

[@jamesh625]

@@russiangrammar Neat! I wonder why it wasn't "corrected" during the spelling reforms.

[@alfonsmelenhorst9672]

​@@russiangrammar In Polish it is still pronounced as g (polskiego)

[@spongebobsquarepants4137]

how do you type in russian?

[@russiangrammar]

+Spongebob Squarepants On a Mac, open Keyboard in System Preferences; click the Input Sources tab, then the plus at bottom left. On Windows.. best to google something like "type Cyrillic Windows" for your system, or this page may help: windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-8/add-language-keyboard

[@spongebobsquarepants4137]

+Russian grammar спасибо

[@medinecharyyeva9313]

you said ogo is for words ending with hard stems and ego for soft stems, but all the words ending are exactly the same

[@russiangrammar]

Do you mean that the endings sound similar? It's true that unstressed vowels aren't pronounced very distinctly, especially in quick speech; so when endings aren't stressed (which is often the case), they may sound very similar. This can happen with other endings too: the adjectives in но́вая виза and но́вое окно are very close in a stream of quick speech. It's still important to spell them correctly, though. :)

[@theoward2097]

So... Isn't русский a soft stem because it ends with ий.... Why is it ого. I mean if синий turns to его, what about русский.. Same endng

[@russiangrammar]

Because of endings like русского, русском, it's best to think of русский as essentially a hard stem. The -ий ending of русский is explained by the 7-letter spelling rule: after г к х ш щ ч ж ц, we write и instead of ы. So: новый/genitive нового, but русский/русского, тихий/тихого, etc. This video on adjective endings and spelling rules might be helpful: kzbin.info/www/bejne/ioSnYmt5qsume9k :)

[@theoward2097]

@@russiangrammar thanks so much! So happy you replied to me!

[@mobarkalwahishi3323]

thank you so much

[@cmanpatrick]

Руский has a soft ending. the к followed by the И makes a soft sound. I'm confused why you give it a hard ending in genitive.

[@russiangrammar]

The stem of русский is essentially a hard stem (ending in a hard consonant): that's why we have forms like русского, русская, русскую, etc. But we spell русский (and русским, русских, русскими) with и because of the 7-letter spelling rule: instead of ы, write и after these 7 letters: к г х ш щ ч ж. This also explains хорошая but хороший. There's more about the 7-letter rule here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/hInGk6xvqc52ftk - and check this playlist for videos about 2 other spelling rules and a dopey mnemonic for remembering the letters: kzbin.info/aero/PLrIkLgUgjNHcpDC9GvYU0C9EW-9vpAz7w

[@cmanpatrick]

@@russiangrammar ok thankyou. i love your lessons by the way. The spelling rules are so funny because some of them interact to change the outcome. and I'm getting a good instinctual understanding for most of it. But now i'm trying to delve into the weeds of genitive etc. Anyway thankyou.

[@russiangrammar]

Пожалуйста! :)

[@月湧く]

0:50 masculine -ый 2:00 feminine -ой

[@russiangrammar]

Just to make sure it's clear: masculine singular forms like новый become нового in the genitive; feminine singular forms like новая become новой in the genitive. :)

[@ienjoysandwiches]

do you offer personal tutoring?

[@russiangrammar]

I'm afraid not, but feel free to subscribe to my newsletter for tips, and announcements about an online course I'm working on... tips4russian.com ))

[@ienjoysandwiches]

I will check it out, thanks. You have a gift.

[@jamesh625]

@@russiangrammar I couldn't find a link to subscribe to the newsletter. :( Could you post it here please?

[@BenGB-vx2wb]

The quirk of "v" vs "г" happens also with some words like сегодня 😅

[@russiangrammar]

Yes, since сегодня is just the genitive forms of сей and день, literally, "of this day." Сей is archaic these days, but still found embedded in some words and expressions like сегодня, до сих пор (still, up til now), по сей день (to this day), and сейчас.

[@BenGB-vx2wb]

@@russiangrammar brilliant

[@abdelazizhassan5516]

excellent lessons , thank you

[@ghirmaiyy]

Too many rules to memories. Is it worth my time? No.

[@russiangrammar]

Learning Russian as an adult does require some work; for those planning a brief trip to Russia, and who just need a few phrases, it's probably not worth it. But most who are serious about this expressive and subtle language (and its rich culture) find it very worthwhile. :)

[@ienjoysandwiches]

russian for strong of heart not weak in mind