SAUCONY KINVARA PRO REVIEW - WHAT IS A SUPER TRAINER?! BEST PLATED RUNNING SHOE OF 2023? - EDDBUD

[@wonkydonkey7899]

This shoe was accidentally released on Amazon for a few hours with 30% off in the US before the sale was discontinued. I known many people were able to snag a pair. 😮

[@SteevWho]

Think everyone was expecting a Nike Invincible ride, from Saucony, with a giant wedge of PB+. What they gave everyone was not that. You will probably see these on discount within the first three months. They cant hit them all out of the park. Thanks as always.

[@EDDBUD]

It’s going to be loved by lots of people though. I constantly get told the zoom fly is a good shoe but couldn’t get on with it at all!

[@theinconsequentialrunner]

So many good things in this video. Great to see Beast make an appearance. Most importantly - such a good call Ed on holding off on a fast review to make sure you are providing an accurate review, and for that, I thank you good Sir. Reviews where someone runs a handful of k's (let's say 30k total) and reviews the shoe right out of the box (and really that's the scope of the review) does no shoe any justice and indeed perpetuates the idea that "it has to be perfect out of the box or it's going back" school of thinking. Danger is, shoe manufacturers become a slave to this and we get shoes that are great out of the box, but as a predictable consequence, don't last or fall out of form really quickly. Plenty of examples of those over the last year. Righto, stepping off my soapbox now.

[@EDDBUD]

Yeah got to at least mull over the thoughts for a bit on each shoe. Sometimes you don’t need loads of miles. But the shoe needed some break in time

[@jamestremblett1875]

If there are plenty of examples can you supply us with one? I've never owned a pair of vaporflys or alphaflys, but I generally find modern shoes to be amazingly durable. I've put over 500 km on two different pairs of Speed 3's and they still feel great. I also have a pair of invincible 3's with well over 800km on them and feel really nice still too. I'm a very slight person so maybe I don't put much strain on my shoes, I don't know.

[@Cellularsurfer]

I was able to snag a pair for $127 USD on amazon. Great Review ED. Now I am hungry for a "Sandwich" lol. I just ran 7 miles today in them and you cant go very fast but the ride is incredible. Soft bounce with a firm rolling sensation. I feel I don't have to work as hard as I did in my NB SC Trainer V1 and much lighter too. It's going to be hard to reach for my Triumph 20 now that I have this in my rotation.

[@EDDBUD]

Enjoying it more as I use it more

[@mitchelpenn8464]

Agree with your review. As a heavier runner this shoe is the perfect combination of support and cushioning. Softer than triumph and shift.

[@EDDBUD]

Whenever I do a review I try and think of other runners and people who can benefit from the shoe

[@Trailrunner1978]

I run half of my runs lately in the Kinvara 12 and 13. Love them. Very minimalist and natural.

[@leendeen8745]

I’m with you, also liking ASICS Noosa Tri 14 for similar reasons…

[@laurainthehaute918]

Appreciate the thorough, patient review. I will pass this one by and glad you spared me the cash!

[@TheHutchRuns]

There just seem to be a lot of shoes out there that cost the same and have a better ride, in fact there are too many shoes, thank god for people like you Edd!

[@EDDBUD]

Maybe it’s great for some people. Yes there are lighter shoes but a better ride is subjective.

[@thecaptainchas2820]

Man, as soon as a question would pop up in my head, you would speak to it in the review. Strong voodoo there, Edd. I appreciate the thoughts. This one might be a bit superfluous for me at the moment. Don’t need to add another arm to the bullpen. (⚾️)

[@laurainthehaute918]

But do you have a south-paw? If so, what shoe would be your lefty?⚾️

[@Stevenc1984]

Beast and a bit of outdoor bonus footage, lovely jubbly!

[@EDDBUD]

Oh yes, beast suddenly appeared out of nowhere. She told me she had escaped from the local takeaway!

[@Stevenc1984]

@@EDDBUD That'll please Mr Chin 🤣

[@EDDBUD]

@@Stevenc1984 😎 “What have you done to my kitchen?!”

[@michaelcaricoo]

Appreciate the more in-depth review (given some of the others) of this more controversial shoe

[@EDDBUD]

Gotta go in depth for this type of beast

[@brokenfreddy7676]

Saucony shoes seldom work for me but I accidentally discovered the endorphin shift V2 in the pile of Sauconys that I buy for the insoles..I needed a low drop training shoe and didn't have a shoe to leave at the lake..surprise, the shift worked great and doesn't go flat after 10mi..it immediately made it into my marathon rotation..the hardest shoe to find for me is a long run shoe that doesn't go flat after a few miles..a plus is no plate bite when it gets hot and the miles go up..alphafly are pretty much worn smooth after 100mi so I may give the shift a go at 1/2 marathon race this fall..shows no outsole wear after 1st 40mi..

[@EDDBUD]

You like those pwrrun plus insoles. They hit the spot!

[@angelvargasvlogs]

Man, I just got these shoes and I loooooove them!!!!

[@EDDBUD]

Glad they are working for you

[@jmac13131]

Completely off topic but I know how you like the Vomero 16 with the exception of the lacing system. I’ve discovered there is a cheat code of sorts if you prefer a regular lacing system. Under the 3 barrel loops in the middle, are holes (albeit very tight) on the back side that I think are punched for regular lacing. It is a bit difficult to maneuver but once I got the laces through it makes getting a good lockdown so much easier. Before the switch I would try to cinch them only to have them loosen again before tying them. A game changer for me as I hated that lacing system.

[@EDDBUD]

Pretty much liked the shoe aside from the perhaps overtly padded tongue. But good info none the less 👍🏼👊

[@jmac13131]

Reason I discovered it was because I was swapping the laces out with the Puma Forever Run Nitro. The laces on both of those shoes are very similar (as are the shoes as well). Was only doing it for a color swap since the Vomero is a pretty bland shoe in the looks department. Now I have a fresher look and a better lockdown 😊.

[@kalifraven]

At 11.39 Beast the beautiful Black cat came to weight an opinion on the new Saucony. He didn't say Yae or Nae yet though" I don't think it would be for me.The The Saucony Speed 2 for tempo runs or the Ride for a mid easy runs and would considered the Triumph for a longer run but think the New Balance 1080 is a bit more responsive then the Triumph. Thank you for your fun reviews and cool music suggestions.Too many running videos have electrinic hip hop Chip monk singing now.Most of the culture lost it's appreciation for bands members really playing Instruments. Kalif🏃‍♀️🌙

[@EDDBUD]

Some great music still out there, just needs some searching. I try and incorporate some music in there that will at least provide some vibe or feel. The speed series does the business for most things, though i try and show some empathy for various runner builds as i am a bean pole really!

[@kalifraven]

@@EDDBUD Yes Understand. Me too as I'm 6ft 4 inches and weigh about 175 lbs which is light and thin for a tall guy.I don't run alot of miles,maybe about 45 to 50 a week and aim for a sub 1:30: half Marathon which is respectable for a guy 58 years old now and the tricky thing is I can feel it takes a little longer to recover from training now then it did 15 years,ago but if I can still at least run a sub 21 minute 5k when I'm in my 70s I'll be happy. Many of my buddies I grew up with are in bad health now and can't even jog a mile so I feel blessed and to have so many wonderful new shoes and technology is an exciting time to stay motivated. And it's better to be a bean pole man then have alot of muscle 💪 but poor heart health. We are the happy lucky ones.Thank you for all the awesome videos. Kalif.

[@EDDBUD]

@@kalifraven My dad is now 80, he doesnt run but walks most days, he still manages to do 3 or 4 music gigs a month too, pays to keep in shape always!

[@kalifraven]

@@EDDBUD Yes ,Both exercises and music keeps the spirit youthful 🏃‍♀️🎸🎵

[@mikefetters6674]

I think the heavier runner comment was dead on the money with this shoe. I’m around 200lb and am really enjoying this show so far. Great amount of stability but still offers cushion and some spring off the front. Plus my wide feet can squeeze into it.

[@EDDBUD]

I try and put myself in the feet of other runners. If that makes sense.

[@alanpelosi2955]

Hi eddbud 👊, saucony have a amazing line up ( i use triumph and speed ) , looks to me there experimenting with this shoe maybe just a one off ??? I don't think I'll go down that road off the pro especially when I have deviate 2 , strung , speed 3 , novablast 3 incredible shoes of me

[@EDDBUD]

Perhaps if you don’t need the more stable base then the speed 3 hits the spot

[@alanpelosi2955]

Hi ed , more in the lines off puma foreverrun ( brilliant shoe ) ???

[@optimusbitchprime]

Should start to come out 1/8. Worth noting not in this colour. Agree with you on the heavier runner appeal.

[@EDDBUD]

More resilient. Gotta have some empathy and thought for all on reviews

[@insomniaforever6444]

Maybe next year they replace the PWRRUN with PWRRUN+. A PWRRUN PB and PWRRUN+ combo might make for a lighter, more responsive high stack trainer to compete with the Asics Superblast/ New Balance SC Trainer if that is the target market they want to go after and it would still differentiate the shoe from the Triumph line which is all PWRRUN+. And they could even increase the stack height due to the lighter PWRRUN+ foam. But seriously, I think there are almost too many choices and a lot of these shoes are just overkill with clever marketing trying to convince everyone they need this for a specific purpose. I'm quite content with my Speed 3s.

[@EDDBUD]

I think that’s the natural way of things. Quite a lot of shoes evolve over time

[@jamesd2205]

Love the stuff edd!

[@EDDBUD]

Thanks for the support

[@JoshL84]

Once they start to get over 11oz in 11.5. I have to stay away. Add in humid summer runs and the moisture starts to add up in the shoe and weight goes up even more.

[@EDDBUD]

Yeah the zoom fly 5 in my size was 335 or something. The invincible though was even more but a different use case for that.

[@MichaelRaymond-mk3co]

I prefer the Triumph 20 over Kinvara Pro. I find the Kinvara Pro very stiff and hard to break in.

[@EDDBUD]

It wasn’t their best of 2023

[@donalmctavish2127]

Reminds me of those giant shoes the Spice Girls used to wear. Seems well put together unlike some of Nikes efforts, but a bit expensive at £200. Just seems like they've fired out a pointless shoe because people will buy it. Saucony need to sort out their grip as it really lets them down.

[@Feanaro5503]

My musical interlude is that I heard the Spice Girls at work today on the overhead speakers that play some awful Sirius channel.

[@EDDBUD]

The primex is the true spice girl shoe

[@EDDBUD]

The primex is the true spice girl shoe

[@penthousedog5292]

​@@EDDBUDyou can say that again

[@OSUCarol]

Can Pwrrn+ be easily rubberized? I think the Pwrrn got used partially for stability and partially so there's *some* resemblance to the Kinvara. I'd guess any weight-savings from swapping out the foam would be lost by the time you add a layer of rubber, but it feels bizarre to not have a rubber layer on what looks like a possible long run shoe, and given the price. Definitely, though, I think that Pwrrn+ and PB would be a much softer, nicer tandem! But perhaps best yet to just have both the Speed and Triumph in rotation. 😉

[@EDDBUD]

Will be interested to see how people take to these

[@EDDBUD]

Will be interested to see how people take to these

[@outerheaven8797]

Appreciate the review Edd, yeah I am someone who thought the Zoom Fly 4 was OK tbh. Its totally compatible with my midfoot striking style. Yeah it's not perfect, there's other shoes with more stability thru corners, but that doesn't mean I'm going to bin it and never use it. Used sparingly in a rotation, it's alright. The Saucony Kinvara Pro might be a shoe to consider getting in the future. That outsole tho...looks like its made of foam... if that was the case why the hell would u want it lol 😂

[@EDDBUD]

Yeah it’s pretty much foam down there though it’s pretty tough.

[@TimGrose]

Seemingly going to be £200 here in the UK but not out yet but I see on sale in US for $127. Err ? As I like the Speed 3 not sure why need a lot heavier shoe for a lot more (well if £200 is right) ?

[@OSUCarol]

Fair points-I know the buzz was "democratizing innovation," but if that's the aim, why does it cost more than the Speed?!

[@robin29991]

@TimGrose I won' t bother personally. These super trainers are just not needed imo. I got the Asics Superblast and very underwhelmed because it's so bulky and wide. These shoes must be enormous in your size Tim.

[@TimGrose]

@@robin29991 yeah which is largely why see little point as well. Also there is the fact that have bought lots of carbon racers so struggling to see a need to spend nearly as much again on shoes a good 50g heavier at least for just what actual purpose.

[@robin29991]

@@TimGrose Same. My 'super trainer' I've been doing moderate and Longruns in is an old 500k+ Alphafly. It's lost some responsiveness but still feels great.

[@EDDBUD]

The us discount is a big error by the sounds of it. Someone will get told off!

[@willydiaz1417]

Edd! i wanted to see this one!

[@EDDBUD]

Hope you enjoy it!

[@LeftyChannelVLR]

I don't know why Saucony isn't being clear on this shoe. It seems clearly a "super" daily trainer for those needing more stability. They should call it a stable super daily trainer. I think that is why there is a lot of Powerun in the midsole, it's firmer and more stable, but enough cushioning for the heavier runners. I love that you noticed these traits and recommended as such for runners.

[@EDDBUD]

A good shoe for some isn’t necessary the shoe I need. Gotta try and place yourself into the needs of others.

[@davidh5429]

​@@EDDBUDPretty sure Saucony had this one employee that kept on nagging everyone at the design office that he had this "brilliant" shoe idea and they let him design it just to get him to shut up.

[@junglisttt]

Always watch always like your vids man! So good👊 What happend to the Torin 7s? Where they that awful? 😅

[@EDDBUD]

No they are great just haven’t had a chance to review them yet. Coming soon

[@rogerrichards8048]

I guess if the lower midsole material has to double up as the outsole then you need a firmer & denser foam. 🤔

[@EDDBUD]

Yeah it seems to work though with some good grip

[@PabloPerez-nd7se]

Think I’ll just buy another pair of Speed 2s

[@EDDBUD]

Probably a good move if you don’t need a more resilient midsole with some extra firmness.

[@PabloPerez-nd7se]

@@EDDBUD Or that naff, cheap outsole

[@Mfitzy]

I’m about 195lbs and doing a 50 mile road ultra soon. Was hoping these might be good for a heavier guy doing a longer race. Anyone have any thoughts?

[@EDDBUD]

Yes more firm and less unstable. Could work well

[@i.p2088]

Heavier than the Boston 12? Harder midsole (heel) then Boston 12? I love the feel of the Triumph 20.. 😂

[@EDDBUD]

Haven’t tried that Boston 12 yet

[@karls8989]

yea think i will pass. just ordered the triumph 21 since puma did not have the optimus prime magnify nitro 2 in my size since it was sold out. will wait from the prime strung x2 which just looks insane but faster than my boston 12 which sings

[@EDDBUD]

The strung 2 is top of my list

[@chinitopogi7511]

How would you compare this to the Adidas Boston 12, in terms of fit in the midsole, outsole, and pacing (easy, tempo, fartlek). which is better too. appreciate your response.

[@EDDBUD]

Not tried the Boston 12 as yet. Many a heavier shoe of this mould in my size

[@tinysafari1851]

Since there is a hope that someone from Saucony reads this comment Saucony states that they gladly accept returns of UNWORN merchandise within 30 days. This policy raises a valid concern. If you're uncertain about the shoes how can you decide if it is right for you? Change the policy to allow the customers to return WORN shoes for 30 days, if we don't like it then allow the customer to send them back. If this was their policy I would gladly try them without the worry of potential regrets and ending up with another pair of low-performing shoes in my running closet. It's understandable to hesitate when shoes average around 200 Earth credits and you're not certain the shoe is right for you. They will be a pass for me, but please do a 100-mile review.

[@richardhooley6352]

😂

[@jesusm..]

It's a Nay for me. Looking for a companion of the Invincible for long runs. What shoe do you use for long runs, Edd?

[@EDDBUD]

It’s more for the zoom fly crew

[@kophotography895]

Mr Ed Bud I feel you were too generous in your scoring on this shoe, if you look back at the Kinvara series you will see why. I used to like them, they changed the compound and after that die hard fans started to leave them. Say no more

[@EDDBUD]

I haven’t tried any of those so coming at it from a fresh perspective.

[@kophotography895]

Viewer spot: Watch 👀 past the black screen at the end of the video for more out take info...by Mr Ed Bud

[@EDDBUD]

Some Marvel style post credit stuff!

[@wonkydonkey7899]

This shoe’s got pwrrun plus, and they’re the insoles.

[@EDDBUD]

Yes I did mention that in the video

[@EDDBUD]

Yes I did mention that in the video

[@alexandrosvalkanos8131]

Kinvara pro or speed 3? For all around shoes? I run about 60klm per week and between 4:30 - 5:15

[@EDDBUD]

Speed 3 is less rigid and more fun

[@chinitopogi7511]

Do you have an idea on the release date of Endorphin Speed 4?

[@EDDBUD]

Nothing concrete on this less than concrete shoe as yet

[@martinmcgrath1985]

How can you rate a £200 shoe so highly on value

[@EDDBUD]

Because value is about what you get for the money. The shoe is constructed well and of good build quality. It fits well and has some potential longevity.

[@karls8989]

ed how would you describe the propulsion of the shoe?

[@EDDBUD]

Good at pace, though its one of those pendulum momentum like shoes

[@irritablearchitect]

I'm absolutely murder on outsoles in the forefoot. Probably have to pass...unfortunately.

[@garrett_driscoll]

How different is the shoe feel from the Kinvara 14?

[@EDDBUD]

Haven’t tried the Kinvara 14 sadly

[@richardrendell9363]

Hello edd

[@EDDBUD]

Silver

[@richardrendell9363]

If its at £200 it's a Nay from me

[@thespecialone7632]

200 earth credits

[@cwalker1569]

Nice review. What is your thoughts for us runners of size?

[@EDDBUD]

Yes it a good shoe for the heavier built runner. Many bigger built runners love boost, zoom fly 5 and this type of more resilient midsole. Many horses for many courses.

[@cwalker1569]

@@EDDBUD thanks sir. The NB SC Trainer 1 was very accommodating for me. The V2 appears to not be as much. Looking for a different trainer

[@Eirikkinserdal]

Is it possible to buy this insole as a standalone item? 😅

[@EDDBUD]

Not sure but I have heard of many buying sale shoes just for the insoles!

[@shohibwijaya7904]

how far does it take to break in?

[@EDDBUD]

It felt better after 15 or so miles

[@shohibwijaya7904]

@@EDDBUD thanks!

[@haon2205]

How good is the 3/4 plate is it responsive?

[@EDDBUD]

It’s certainly rigid.

[@thespecialone7632]

You have a softer heal without the plate back there

[@patrickvanderwal6324]

A mystery why it is called Kinvara. It has nothing in common with the normal Kinvaras. Also, why Pro? What's Pro about it? Very confusing shoe. Nay for me.

[@EDDBUD]

Well the bottom side of the shoe is Kinvara like. But the rest is quite different.

[@cheekster777]

Hi

[@EDDBUD]

Gold

[@Onlyifyshoes_23]

I bought the shoes at #Onlyify

[@thespecialone7632]

i hate suede and exposed foam, it's a nay from me

[@EDDBUD]

Suede good. Exposed foam not so much

[@kophotography895]

Let me get this right £200 for a shoe that 2 years ago was £78....👀

[@EDDBUD]

It’s not the same shoe. Different tech and profile and foam

[@louidaiv2387]

Disappointing midsole 😞

[@Huxley555]

Midsole?

[@EDDBUD]

Bronze

[@Huxley555]

Ah well 😅

[@jdsright2point954]

Is anyone else tired of these high stack heights?

[@EDDBUD]

Nah they are good for lots of purposes. I try and look beyond the stack. Is it a good shoe? That’s all that matters

[@amandawalker4510]

Talk is , its like a tempus on steroids... a super trainer

[@EDDBUD]

It’s very like the zoom fly 5 or Boston ( recent ) shoes.

[@michaelr.8402]

Suede @Running Shoes. NO, please!🙄

[@EDDBUD]

Your missing out!

[@fionaburns4210]

dentist

[@EDDBUD]

What about them?

[@Chunkyfunk01]

No interest in this shoe, but if I see a new EddBud video then I watch the EddBud video 🫡

[@EDDBUD]

It’s always appreciated