SC44 vs F125! Tier 4 Faceoff

[@glemanimations3758]

My favorite Tier 4 passenger locomotive is the MP54AC. I like it because it is currently the most powerful diesel-electric locomotive in North America, it gets up to speed in a jiffy, and their electric motors are louder than their diesel engines, making a pretty interesting sound on full throttle. I really hope we see this locomotive in the United States someday.

[@GamingRailfanner]

Problem is, no one is ordering them and I think MPI stopped making them as GO Transit also stopped ordering them.

[@LouisianaRailProductions]

I’ve always loved the look of the F125. I wish they would’ve gotten more widespread across the country.

[@TrainTrackTrav]

Same here. The F125s look fantastic and sound amazing in person. They had some teething issues, but now that they've been sorted out, they seem to be really good units. Thanks for watching!

[@aklnarslan8756]

Hi LLP channel Ömer friend, greetings from İZMİR greater metropolitan city, 🇹🇷 TÜRKİYE. l also liked F125 power car. My favorite Locomotive GE GENESlS P42 in all the World

[@RajaRhodes]

I live in Dallas, apparently the Trinity railway express here, who runs ex-GO transit EMD and Bombardier equipment that’s similar to Metrolinks equipment, is interested in F125s, or SC44s. May get them here in Texas.

[@railfanryan]

It's an unpopular opinion but I really like the F125s. Especially the ones with the K3 backup horns.

[@amtrak_121]

THANK YOU!!!!! Amtrak should've picked the F125 over the ugly Charger! They could've at least gone with a locomotive that looked a bit more attractive! Just slap the F125 shell onto the SC-44 and that would've been enough! My expectations are like ankle-high here!

[@dennisthebrony2022]

When the F125 Accelerates, the propulsion motors almost sound like a DB Class 101 Electric Locomotive!

[@AstonPeart]

What that

[@DesertHighIron]

F125 wins for me and it’s not even close. Aside from the horns the chargers look and sound ridiculous. The F125 is a very powerful and bassy sounding loco and call me crazy but I truly do not mind the K2 horn. The F125 also seems to have better acceleration than the chargers. The F125 has wound up being a pretty good loco after all the problems they had in the beginning

[@addicz2]

Nah. I see why companies buy Siemens varians. They looks more modern.

[@packr72]

The F125 is junk, no one except Metrolink bought them for a reason

[@addicz2]

@@packr72 Ah yes. A week ago its breaking down again

[@R262SubwayCar1]

SC-44 Is Better

[@mrvwbug4423]

The F125 accelerates better because it has 300 more hp and is geared for a 25mph lower top speed in Metrolink spec (100mph vs 125mph for the Charger).

[@westfieldplayz]

10:12 The F125’s have a very powerful engine. My headphones were shaking when that Bass was heard.

[@Davis9754]

i definitely like the F125’s more (but not as much as the f59’s) and i really want to see them in a trinity railway express livery! i don’t know how i feel about the SC44’s. they kind of feel a little overrated imo. i never really liked the mp36’s because to me they look like obese f59phi wannabe’s.

[@garykcs5532]

Another outstanding video as usual. I choose the first locomotive just because I was able to see it in person just a couple weeks ago and I felt that that low come out of looked a lot nicer as far as a passenger locomotive and it felt powerful standing next to it. Can't wait to see your next videos.

[@TrainTrackTrav]

Thanks Gary! Lots of people love the Chargers. I think the look kinda funny, but they sure do sound cool. Videos from the SoCal trip are next to be edited. Keep cool up there, see you in September!

[@addicz2]

@@TrainTrackTrav Well. I am watching American trains because of Charger. Never though its rival is so not good looking. Even Amtrak old locos way better on designs than this EMD

[@amtrak_121]

The F125. It looks like it actually belongs in america, and it 50 times more attractive. Plus it actually has a higher power output (the F125 has a max output of 4700 HP, whereas the SC-44 can only generate 4400 HP), and higher fuel capacity. These deserve a chance to pull intercity trains!

[@dennisthebrony2022]

I wish that some railroads here could also use the MPI MP54AC locomotives as well, that would be LEGIT COOL!! I also wonder what Metrolink's SECOND YOUNGEST locomotive fleet (The MP36PH-3Cs) would look like in a new paint scheme as well!! I would be excited to see them repainted!!

[@Southern_California_Railfanner]

That locomotive has too much horsepower for down here and not many would like it plus metrolink can’t service them prob and Amtrak they don’t have the required max amount of speed.

[@GamingRailfanner]

⁠@sebastianfloyd9705um, the word CEM doesn't translate into engine types, CEM means Crash Energy Management not what type of engine it is.

[@terrellhoward5231]

I like them both, but I would have loved to see more commuter agencies take another look at the F125s, I really would love to see that girl in the MARC livery in Maryland.

[@railtechadventurer207]

I like the Chargers more, although they unfortunately have had problems running at times on different routes. Something that would be wonderful to see for passenger trains with Tier 4 locomotives would be if any Genesis locomotives were converted to a special Tier 4 variant that GE had never made before. The MP36PH locomotives that are used for Caltrain, MARC and Metrolink should also be converted to some Tier 4 variant for use on Amtrak's California sponsored trains when those commuter train agencies are ready to replace them. In addition, I think it's also time for Amtrak to get something built by Alstom that is Tier 4 compliant, something based on the Traxx locomotives in Europe. On the other hand though, it would be nice to DMU's that are Tier 4 compliant for both Amtrak trains, especially for their services in California, the Midwest and Washington which would even be useful for more trains on the timetable, and services with additional coaches.

[@Mcnibbus]

Small correction on the f125s they dont have 4000 they are actually more powerful than the chargers at 4700. No idea why you need almost 5000 horsepower in a commuter/sprinter styled loco but caterpillar is gonna caterpillar i guess

[@mrvwbug4423]

Metrolink has some steep grades on some lines. Also gives them better acceleration so they can compete a little better in terms of performance vs EMUs or electric locomotives. It also matters when they do get to really open the taps and run at their top speed (something F125s don't get to do, but Brightline runs their chargers at 125mph on a daily basis). These still only have about 60% of the power output of an electric locomotive, the ACS-64s that Amtrak uses in the northeast have 8600hp.

[@The_Lincoln_Penny]

05:12 The quad turbochargers of the QSK95 sound so sweet !!!!!!

[@Southern_California_Railfanner]

Siemens model looks good but the f125 puts out 4700 horsepower instead of 4000

[@mrvwbug4423]

It ends up kinda a wash, the F125s in service are all geared for 100mph and never see more than 79mph in service. the SC-44s are geared for 125mph and might see 110mph on some midwestern and eastern routes (no Amtrak routes outside the NEC run at 125mph), ALC-42s have been tested on the NEC and had little trouble doing 125mph and the SCB-40s do 125mph on Brightline on a daily basis, but Brightline operates theirs in pairs at all times like an American version of the Uk class 43 HST. Brightline derated theirs because of always running in pairs and to better handle the Florida heat in summer.

[@GoofyAhUsername]

Ive always loved the f125 more, it sounds soo bassy and cool instead of quieter like the Sc-44

[@leewashington5208]

It's unfortunate that the F125's didn't turn out to be better locomotives. I would of love if another commuter railroad would gave them a chance. Siemans have an iron grip on passenger locomotive sales. EMD has to take another loss.

[@TrainTrackTrav]

Amen to that! The teething issues that Metrolink had with theirs really put a damper on things and on EMD's reputation. Hopefully another commuter company goes after them in the future.

[@jmream2618]

@@TrainTrackTravif the F125 is a EMD why is it powered with a caterpillar diesel

[@TrainTrackTrav]

@@jmream2618 For a few reasons. Mainly because none of the EMD two-stroke prime movers at the time were able to meet the tier 4 exhaust regulations. Since EMD is technically owned by Caterpillar, it only made sense for them to use the CAT C175 as the prime mover for the F125s.

[@TEMPLE7D]

I was actually hearing now the SC44s are having issues while the F125s run well lol.

[@LCPotato]

@@TEMPLE7D As someone who spots near the Surfline I can confirm this. Loads of SCs are having issues to the point of multiple cancellations and even when the F125 do have some issues, it’s not too bad compared to the other engines

[@TEMPLE7D]

Love how those C175 V20 engines sound! So bossy!

[@AstonPeart]

Which loco

[@TEMPLE7D]

@ The Caterpillar C175 inside of the F125. The SC44 uses a Cummins QSK-95 V16 engine.

[@SamutheHamu]

I think the SC44 wins this round because the F125 has a cat engine.

[@dennisthebrony2022]

The F125 AC Traction Motors have a VERY LOW PITCH, compared to the SC44 AC Traction Motors!

[@Trains21]

Based on appearance alone I would go with the Siemens model. Good comparison bro.

[@jmream2618]

I wish Amtrak had F125s

[@TrainTrackTrav]

Me too. An ALC-42/F125 consist would be amazing!

[@princejamerson1]

I always prefer the EMD F125 Metrolink locomotives because they are far better than the charger locomotives, it is much better than the overly chunky F59s back in Metrolink

[@TrainTrackTrav]

Yeppers! The F125s just have something about them that makes them a joy to be around. When one is idling in a station, they have a presence that can't be ignored. That being said, I miss the F59s like crazy. Lots of great memories of them from when I was a kid.

[@Lucrativecris]

The F59s were bad ass

[@princejamerson1]

@@LucrativecrisI love the F59s from both Metrolink and Amtrak when I was growing up, it’s sad to see the Metrolink F59s go while SCAX 856, 861, 868 and 873 are still around today

[@陳茂坤-l4t]

很漂亮的客運火車，但不知速度如何？！🥰🤩🥰

[@LACMTA_Metrolink]

125

[@murdelabop]

My favorite is the Charger with the Brightline style nose.

[@TrainTrackTrav]

Oh yes, good choice! A classy yet modern streamlined design.

[@AstonPeart]

F125 is the best metrolink loco

[@anthonywarrener1881]

Both are great locomotives! It is interesting that Amtrak have chosen two types of Chargers for all their diesel,operations. The MBTA in Boston are surely looking for some new diesel locos, and one can only hope they will try out a EMD 125 !

[@nolantherailfan5048]

The F125's aren't very reliable

[@mrvwbug4423]

Rumor has it MBTA is quickly electrifying its lines and will buy 2nd hand ACS-64s off Amtrak as the Airo sets enter service on the NEC.

[@AmtrakFan6905]

I definitely like the SC44s way better because of there K5LAs and smooth and fast shape. I just don’t like the F125s pointy headlights and the windows just look strange. Also the F125s have extremely loud K2s that can easily blow anyone’s ears out

[@Chasesworld1058]

The f125 in so great 😃 and your

[@Lucrativecris]

They gotta make these tier 4 locos smallers

[@mrvwbug4423]

The Charger and F125 are both designed to meet the loading gauge for Penn Station in NYC, that is why they're not that tall. That was done specifically to try to sell to Amtrak who listed meeting Penn station loading gauge as a hard requirement for all their new locomotives. Of course Siemens won the contract and EMD has only had one customer for the F125 ever. Sit them next to a GE P42 and you'll see they're about the same size as the P42s.

[@kenneth6382]

EMD has a 4700HP CAT V20 sir, HUGE miss. The C175/20. Cummins offers 4000 or 4400 horses to Siemens. EMD only 4700HP is offered.

[@TrainTrackTrav]

I'm glad you commented this. The C175-20 does indeed produce 4,700 horse power *at the shaft.* However, the F125 only puts 4,000 horses to the rail. Unlike diesel lomotives in the UK for example, American locomotives are HP rated at the rail, rather than at the shaft. Since we rate locomotive horse power at the rail, that's the number I put down.

[@kenneth6382]

@@TrainTrackTrav Cool, same applies to Cummins.

[@g-manonthego6678]

don't forget: both the Charger and the F125's prime movers are 4-stroke and are turbocharged. Additionally, they use alternating current traction motors.

[@nuc9901]

SC44 is quiet, silky smooth. The F125 is not. I haven't heard a Caterpillar C175-20 in person but I have heard a C175-16 bellowing - horrible. I don't think there is any real difference between 4400 and 4700 HP in commuter service. And I would really like to see facts and data on MTBF for both units.

[@mrvwbug4423]

The C175-16 is what powers the British class 68s, which are considered the best sounding of pretty much any modern generation diesel locomotive. Downside is Stadler put a fairly loud exhaust on them so the 68s are quite loud while they do sound amazing.

[@sixfifty_sebb]

caltrain should’ve bought sc44’s to replace some f40’s but it’s too late now.

[@mrvwbug4423]

Caltrain is switching to electric, Stadler KISS double decker EMUs will be replacing their diesel fleet.

[@kerryvinci5287]

Leave it to California to ruin anything with an engine! The Metro Link F59 with the 710 engine were Best!! But of these I like The F125 over the Cummins complex engines.

[@mrvwbug4423]

The tier 4 emission requirement was federal not CARB.

[@anthonyhunt701]

SC-44s… problematic now. Can’t handle the Midwest winters…

[@TrainTrackTrav]

Yep, all the electronics they have don't like the cold, and those massive radiator intakes they have probably work a little too well in harsh conditions like that.

[@aklnarslan8756]

F125 better than SC44 because its PURE BLOOD American

[@TrainTrackTrav]

Apart from the Geman trucks and Spanish body shell, yes!

[@addicz2]

Ah yes. Break down again

[@mrvwbug4423]

EMD has used Siemens traction motors for years. The Charger uses a US built Cummins engine

[@mrvwbug4423]

@@TrainTrackTravDoes CAF make the F125 carbody? If so I'm amazed they haven't all cracked and fallen apart

[@aklnarslan8756]

@@mrvwbug4423 Thanks for info