Season of Discovery: IS SOD DYING?!?!?

It would seem that the 25 to 40 grind from phase 1 to phase 2 was what killed the game more then anything.
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#WorldofWarcraft #classic #SoD
0:00 Introduction
0:45 Like, Comment, & Subscribe
0:58 THE DATA ANALYSIS
4:25 My Thoughts
6:57 Conclusion

[@GingerDRan]

yea i spent so much time grinding gold in phase 2, made me feel the burnout extra hard when the rest of the player base was making 1000s of gold a day at the phase 3 launch. wasted my time made me not ever want to invest time into a phase ever again

[@Kaghoegaming]

Yeah I feel for you there, I camped and farmed ghost mushrooms and made a few thousand, but it felt bad cause of p3 launch and how inflated the economy became

[@zobo1978]

Just dont hold gold, hold mats. At least if they inflate gold with incursion type gold print you will still benefit from mats price increase massively

[@OMGiTzSpAnKy]

Just an fyi.. Even if incursions were never a thing, you still wasted your time if you weren't investing into items... WoW has inflation literally built into the game and we were going to generate more gold each phase regardless... Look at Classic Era where a flask was 1,000g before SoD came out.... There was no incursions in that version.. If you expected raw gold to hold value in any version of WoW, then that's hilarious.

[@chrisbalcu4033]

Gold drind burn out is strictly your bad decision. The burnout is real but the reason is stupid

[@constantinefa8794]

Imagine people like me farming WSG on multiple characters only to have our efforts invalidated with 1.1k rep per day xD Fuck SoD

[@TexasCoffeeBeans]

I left in the middle of P2. Too much gate keeping and interviews to run gnomer despite pre BIS gear.

[@neoikake]

We had People do 50 dps in some raids. That is why...

[@TexasCoffeeBeans]

@@neoikake Neither did they have prebis or were willing to be MT.

[@Scottysaweet]

@@TexasCoffeeBeans It should be called Season 1 of discovery because thats all it really was or will be

[@DankHillCometh]

@@neoikake who cares, stop treating a game as a job.

[@Whydyoudothis]

I’ve noticed a heavy decline in the summoner network and items available on the AH Also the lack of guild mates across a few guilds just not logging in anymore

[@Kaghoegaming]

Yeah I can definitely see that, my guild is quite dead day to day

[@chinesefood3165]

Nothing to do in phase 3. No real new pvp content, excursions are mid tier content at best, and raid is clearance in less than an hour and gear is trash

[@blitzme99]

most of my guild are raid logging only.

[@user-fj4tg5fc2f]

Kahoe do you know if ironforge pro is correcting the numbers to reflect 3 day vs 7 day lockout?

[@zdubzz1280]

Moving to 20 man was a mistake. Killed so many guilds and alt friendly play styles

[@Kaghoegaming]

Yeah I thought it was going to be good to get ready for phase 4 and MC being 20man, but it seems it has hurt way more

[@zometthecomet]

It killed us as well

[@paradopx8618]

Making it 20 man AND harder for the transition + incursions made almost everyone I know quit

[@kwingie85]

True and because it is weekly

[@Zalen88]

My guild cannot fill a 20m with all guidlies. Much of that is from people getting pissed about gear for whatever reason and bailing, or they just stop logging in. We cannot maintain a steady roster of healers. So, if Ony, BWL, AQ40, and Naxx stay 40m, I think it will destroy most guilds, and the need to pug will be enormous for most of the others.

[@_Travey]

I had no urge to play when phase 3 came out. WoW hasn’t been scratching that itch 😢

[@xXTheMustXx]

Incursion fucked it up totally.

[@MikeyPaper]

Scratch your balls instead.

[@Darth.]

My two cents (just my opinion)... I left SoD towards the end of Phase 2, for hardcore vanilla. Now I'm playing other games in the meantime. Before SoD launched I was talking with one of my buddies who also played (and quit) about my concerns as the leaks were coming out with epic gear at lvl 25. Gear that completely defeats the purpose of getting any quest gear or almost all dungeon gear as well from 25-40 does not feel good. It also trivializes the open world, nothing felt dangerous after phase 1 if you were in a zone at your level, it gave this feeling like it was more of a chore "just to level up" and get to the end of phase raid (felt like retail). A lot of the Rune abilities were also just way too overpowered, using barely any mana/resource and doing way more damage/ faster cooldowns made other "normal" abilities feel weak. Don't get me wrong BFD was a great first timer raid, even though the mechanics weren't that crazy I still think they should've been toned down, especially with Kelris, after all it is just a lvl 25 raid. To me a lvl 25 raid is meant to introduce players into how raiding works, what mechanics to look out for, and how to utilize different classes strengths to overcome it. I could go either way with people wanting other people to have consumes but when it turns into thousands upon thousands of people spamming 7/7 DPS full consumes, and buff.... seems a little unnecessary for a lvl 25 raid. I never comment on videos and this is getting to be a bit long. So I'm just gonna wrap it up. All in all, I'm glad they took the chances that they did. I hope they learn from what went right and more importantly what went wrong with SoD. I had an amazing time in Phase 1, hopefully the next Season is something that is a whole different direction. I would love to see something like what OSRS does next season with players voting on what content they should bring to the game. But with ideas from themselves and also the player base. Hopefully they can learn from the data, and opinions on what the players want but also know what their vision for what classic plus is. The Vanilla world is great, just needs a few extra sprinkles here and there

[@Kaghoegaming]

Thank you for sharing your experiences and why you quit! Do you think you’d come back ever? If phase 4 is a banger or has a new raid

[@soulhammer]

You are absolutely on point. Blizzard is incapable of understanding why people like the Classic design philosophy so they will simply change it more and more to resemble retail with time. It's not that noticeable in phase 1 but the writing was always on the wall. It's why the game is now condensed once again into what are essentially retail activities while the world is not only dead; it's pointless to engage with.

[@TheTatekei]

My Take: this phase is over. people are done with ST, now theyre ready for p4. and since its not here yet.... theyre not logging in. This phase realistically is a 4 week phase.

[@Kaghoegaming]

Yeah for the first time my guild isn’t even raiding weekly, people are just on a break

[@Zalen88]

the gear sucks in ST. It seems like they realized too late that the BFD gear was too good, so they tried to tone down in Gnomer and now ST.

[@zobo1978]

They didnt tone it down in gnomer xd but yeah examples like dagger of willing sacrifice being lvl 60 pre raid bis lvl… at 25

[@hcliff2100]

I agree. You go in there and get almost everything you need in 3 runs. You don’t need full bis because the raid is that easy you can clear it in incursion gear anyway So outside of chasing the couple epics the raid feels pretty meaningless to a lot of people

[@bluburryyumyum1367]

The game is fuckin boring.

[@legiontdlegion4648]

phase 3 killed my guild, we were 10 irl friends who raided, and the raid went to 20 man, and we tried to play with another guild. But was not the same.

[@Kaghoegaming]

I hate to hear that :(

[@chrisc92346]

Sad seeing it dip, I’m having a lot of fun. Raiding weekly and enjoying the pvp. I hope this doesn’t discourage them from classic +

[@idkidgaf]

Classic+ is pure copium. The devs couldn’t even get SoD or Cata pre patch right, the team is tiny. Where is all this supposed classic+ content meant to magically appear from?

[@Aurelian57]

No it's not. Peak on Crusader Strike is still crazy busy around the clock.

[@Kaghoegaming]

yeah i know i play there!

[@ikesulzberger7904]

peak busy around the clock? interesting!

[@AmongRevenants]

After locking Lava Lash for the weekend and killing off the realm. Blizz reopened Lava Lash yesterday and it's still unlocked as a low pop server. Any idea why blizz screwed Lava Lash over?

[@kevino2435]

Im on lava lash. they locked it and gave free transfers, like chaos bolt, but the comments under this news on the WoW forums was full of people saying they like their low population server, and that’s it’s hard to replicate RP experience on a PvP server. It seems enough people said something and blizzard let them continue with it

[@Kaghoegaming]

Probably because of its RP status. It definitely gets ruined with pvp on

[@hotlikesauce]

the damage is done though, LL is a laughably dead server now. this shit decision on the devs side made me & a few friends finally unsub.

[@generalsdragons6952]

They Killed my server CB, I went to LL and then to CS. I just don't fell the urge to log into a mega server, can't stand it. I have to be on a small medium server, I re-rolled on Deviate Delight era with some people.

[@solar9610]

@@kevino2435 You need an RP community, to RP, lmfao - whoever said 'we like our server low' was an absolute fucking test-tube baby, fucking lab-grown brain to have to be that fucking dumb. "I LOVE WATCHING MY SERVER DIE, IT'S SO TIGHTLY-KNIT. I LOVE WATCHING THE MAJORITY OF MY SERVER SLOWLY LEAVE BECAUSE THEY CAN'T FIND AN ACTIVE RP COMMUNITY."

[@mitchconner2021]

Idk if you played much of cata pre launch but the server im on is Booming dungeon finder for like lvl 35 characters takes like 3 minutes tops. Think people are just taking a break from SOD for a bit most people have done everything for phase 3.

[@Ardell_Drelzexian]

How many of the people doing the raid actually log in more than once a week now? actual guild numbers are way lower on non raid days/times

[@Kaghoegaming]

If I didn’t make videos daily I wouldn’t be

[@Owakan]

A lot of people are having fun goldmaking, grinding and farming for the rare and epics. They totally destroyed everything with the Nightmare Incursions, it's the only thing that makes sense doing, and it's boring as fuck, you even have the addon to do everything for you. The incursions gives you the quickest way to level up, gives you full gear and the most consistant goldfarm in the game, so everyhing else in the game does just not make sense anymore

[@OMGiTzSpAnKy]

My guy... These gold farms you are talking about are literally increasing in their value every day because of these incursions you cry about... The emerald gear only gives you 6 pieces of gear out of 17 slots so wtf you mean "full gear"? If you find incursions so boring then fing level normally.. It's literally only an extra few hours...

[@joelt5994]

@@OMGiTzSpAnKyno one likes incursions and they are the reason why many stopped

[@TuxthaPenguin]

Hey there Kaghoe - first off thanks for keeping up with your grind - i love your videos and appreciate your soft spoken style. I came back to WoW after being a beta/original release player who quit after wrath and SoD has been amazingly fun. Phase 1 and Phase 2 both captured the fun i had as a teenager and as we approached OG raids I thought my enjoyment would grow in SoD but it has slowly been dying and the main reason for me is the following; The transition to 20 man raiding caused so many random issues with my old guild and with all the new people our raid days changed making it so i couldnt attend. I didn't want to leave the guild i loved but I wanted to raid and with the release of ST it has been impossible to PUG, not necesarily based on difficulty but simply finding that many heads at the hours I play has been impossible. On top of that they opened server transfers for like 30 seconds and my server is slowly dying, theres barely ANYONE on the lfg bulletin board. I still like SoD and i will still play but i have slowed tremendously.

[@YellowBoltTC]

People are playing cata then they will be playing mop remix. It’s blizzards plan to create hype and fomo to push people to the live client gradually and to show off that it’s not bad at all. So everyone will be buying and playing war within

[@Kaghoegaming]

Wow is at its best when it has the most players.

[@hansthienpont5328]

Never

[@warrhoop]

I think one of the huge reasons so many have left the game was that most guilds were set up and built to do the 10 man raids, and some even built to do more using alts to do the the raids several times. Now you throw in the 20 man raid, and not that is not fun and great, however it caused a lot of guilds to have to merge with other guilds and those that did not would just be forced to quit as they could no longer progress in the game. And yes, some loss to the alts as there was less time to run 2 or 3 alts and keep them leveled and geared as there was before, especially with the much shorter leveling time for phase 2 as compared to phase 1. The guild i was in for example, 4 core members left for another guild leaving us with only 10 solid raiders, so instead of trying to recruit 5 or 6 more raiders looking for a new home or inviting a few puggers till we filled the spot, it just sort of eviscerated a very strong 10 man raid group that now not only does not exist, but most of them no longer even play sod.

[@Kaghoegaming]

Damn that’s wild, thank you for sharing! I hate when people do that shit, causes so many issues

[@discz3048]

There are a few reasons why there is a massive dip in these numbers. In my opinion, the two biggest reasons are 1) the banning of GDKPS - this cut a large portion of the raid teams out of the game and those teams were not replaced. These Ironforge numbers are based on characters participating in raids. When there are far fewer raids, there will be much less participation. The only reason I raided much less is because of the sudden dip in raid teams. 2) the change from 10 to 20 raids. This you talked about.

[@Kaghoegaming]

That is a great point that I forgot about from phase 1 to 2

[@27Zangle]

I loved the idea of SoD but becoming so powerful at such a lower got boring fast. I liked the quick leveling in a classic setting. They really need to tune the rune abilities to in line with what damage would have been done if the abilities were released in real vanilla setting. No reason to have something critting for 2-3k when it should be critting for maybe 600 max at level 50. That is just crazy! Also, it sucks for those of us who have a life and didn't play day one of the last phase while all the people who did made thousands of gold per character.

[@Kaghoegaming]

i hated your last point so much it was such a blunder

[@daltonnelson94]

Blizzard should give everyone all the previous phases runes at the start of P4. That way we could play our alts that fell behind

[@Kaghoegaming]

Would be interesting, cause that’s most of the new content that did brings and most of the runes only take like 10mins to get

[@daltonnelson94]

@@KaghoegamingStop the cap. The runes take longer than 10 minutes to get. For example, doing the dark rider rune on 5 alts was a pain.

[@Kaghoegaming]

Yeah that’s an outlier, most are quite fast I promise. I do think those runes should be BoA after the phase is over

[@EdwinHeida]

We log on for raids mostly now. We grinded incursions in the first weekend and got our chars to 50. Did we actually like it? Yes and no. Part of why I enjoy classic/SoD is the questing, is the more casual nature of it all. On the topic of 20 man raids: We are a small guild. We like it that way and were doing fine with 10 man raids. Pug a few sometimes, it was fine. The choice to suddenly go for a 20 man raid was a poor decision. I mean you can expect a 10 man raid if Blizzard did the same for phase 1 and 2, right? We were lucky because we met a similar small guild in phase 2, we spoke to see if we could work together, and thankfully that seems to have worked out well. But many guilds weren't so lucky. I am very skeptical about phase 4.

[@Kaghoegaming]

I think phase 4 will be as popular as phase 1 especially if there’s a new raid

[@Trezan]

Problem with SoD for me currently, is farming gear that will be irrelevant when level 60 is released. I believe when the end game content will be released, the player base will return.

[@TheQuickleaf]

Even if the numbers are low now, well they will spike up in insane amount like they have when a new phase starts. And let's be honest the last phase for lvl 60 will make even more people play again. Another side point is that for example, I play on lone wolf EU and I have to say there is a large amount of people still playing this kinda "dead phase" atm

[@Kaghoegaming]

I certainly hope that is the case

[@jaredheine4076]

I did BFD about 6 times in P1. Haven’t done Gnomeragan or Sunken Temple at all, though I’m still on daily doing my thing. So I don’t know if those numbers mean anything. Thanks for your vids Kaghoe.

[@stank8460]

If you don't raid what else is there to do in sod? Pvp?

[@somerandomname146]

I don't think it's dead, retail had season 4 come out and Cata is around the corner. P4 will see alot of ppl return

[@Kaghoegaming]

I certainly hope so

[@solar9610]

.......You do understand Cata will take quite a few people from P4, as will Retail Season 4 because it's not like we're that fucking distant from retail with P3. For that matter, have you seen the early feedback for P4? It's fucking DISMAL, dude. You expect everyone to suddenly decide they're no longer invested in Catacylsm and waste three months of that characters progression for a half-assed season that will last less than 4? How many fucking lobotomies have you had?

[@McBillyBoy]

Its because phases are taking way to long, we live in a fast past world these days and people are loosing interest

[@ToHonorKnowledge]

Also, i do find it kind of funny how history is repeating itself. People who love classic say part of why they don’t like retail is how fast you level. There’s no more exploring no more journey etc etc but then those same players promote how fast you could reach level cap in phase 1. You’re asking blizzard to make retail, again.

[@Naeinsengimnida]

Phase 1, 1-25 takes as much time as in 2005 but not on retail. The comparison is not the right one. 40-50 bracket is the problem here.

[@fc6827]

Today was my first time logging on to my server and not seeing a bunch of "LFM " This really feels bad

[@Hifcrea]

Phase 3 has been great as far as I’m concerned. ST is a great raid. Been loving the idea of getting every one suited up to tackle level cap finally and good old MC ony and BWL. Finally being able to chase epic looking tier sets is gonna be another huge benefit. We’re all adults now. Cheesing a phase for 2-3 weeks then taking a break and refreshing yourself for the next content is totally fine

[@Nick-nz4lb]

they announced Cata, they have MOP ascension practically coming out, and war within. also, people aren't raiding anymore on 10 different alts and raid isnt on a 3 day lockout like they were in phase 1-2. people are going to leave or take a break and once 60 comes out there's going to be a huge spike again and then another dip. happens every game and every patch. doesn't mean game is dying idk why people are over exaggerating it and a lot of people are just waiting for lvl 60 too

[@andrewmays4385]

still getting 5-6 layers on living flame during peak

[@LewReviews]

This game has always been about the people guild members you like playing with. To then get us all making guilds calling old friends to get a guild together to then say oh actually now you need 20 people. It was hard enough getting a few people to come back nevermind another ten people it was obvious that it would destroy the game to anyone....

[@Kaghoegaming]

It’s tough to say if that was the single cause, because the total count seems to be exactly half of what it was

[@LewReviews]

@@Kaghoegaming in my case we merged are guild but in the end 5 of the people just stopped playing because it did not feel the same its all about the feels i suppose with allot of people. i kept playing and i raid log still but i am just playing to see how 60 is really at this point i have lost most of my interest

[@REOFIRE36]

Yeah the 20 man decimated my irl group of people…. I mean we were already getting burnt out running gnomer every 3 days. Near the end of phase 2 we pug more people than ever for our runs… phase 3 saw 3-5 of our guildies leveling slow because they hated incursions. I got to 50 did 3 weeks of st runs… and idk im cooked. Maybe i’ll pick it back up for phase 4 but I doubt it.

[@Kaghoegaming]

Yeah my guild has fallen apart as well, if I didn’t make videos daily for you guys i wouldn’t log in

[@mitchconner2021]

Idk if its dying but with Cata pre launch and retail having a new phase I think people are just taking a break. For most classes prebis and bis really are not that far off so it wont really matter going into phase 4 if you have full bis or not.

[@solar9610]

Cata just released AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAND SoD is even deader.

[@ajudmeister]

Would love to see 40 man raids in super easy mode (zug zug pugs) and 10 man in heroic mode (guild runs). You would serve both the casuals who just want to experience the raids, the bosses and be part of a big group for an epic adventure, and the hard core players in 10 man for the challenge, the parsing and the chance of much higher (better) loot drops

[@Kaghoegaming]

Would be very interesting to see heroic in classic

[@chrisreece8564]

I've just having some fun playing classes and alts I've never played before right now. I really have no interest in sunken temple (especially with 20 man) and am mostly looking forward to the next phase(s). Being able to AOE lvl with a hunter and mage to 50 in ZF was amazingly fast and decent gold as well. On Lone Wolf, there's some pretty good open world PVP if you're into it at all. I definitely am not having as much fun as phase 1/2 though.

[@goldeneye9859]

My classic toon got shipped to tbc and deleted from era. I still don’t understand why blizzard for rid of the era clone. So I’m using sod to get a new era toon when they close the server and ship him to era. In the process I’m having fun with the new system, while going slow and not getting too invested. I have no plans to raid in any phase, nor do I care about gold. My only goal is to try some new things they added while leveling at my pace, and most importantly having fun. Once I get my toon back on era I’ll feel pretty good. I’m still mad he got deleted he had some good gear.

[@Kaghoegaming]

Well that’s one to play, however I think sod toons will have a separate server

[@burtonkevin32]

It’s also summer so the dads have families…less gaming time

[@Kaghoegaming]

True true

[@billm5555]

20 man raids killed our guild

[@Kaghoegaming]

Hate to hear that

[@mikeg8743]

Guild died. 270 ppl in guild maybe 7 on a night. I pvp to get rewards and am finding enjoyment in that.

[@Kaghoegaming]

thats crazy that many people are gone

[@ThePlotting]

For me it wasn't the 25-40 that was an issue but the launch of Phase 3 where everyone seemed to already be max level and the economy destroyed on day 1; just completely turned me off and I've not been back since. It was such an utter train wreck.

[@Kaghoegaming]

Yeah incursions were too strong

[@WeMakeMontages]

I’ve never seen Blizzard fumble something so hard. They really rather push Cata classic than SOD. Theres so many QOL features they should have added but didn’t listen to anyone. I can go on & on about this. Hopefully phase 4 is actually fun & that all of this is some precursor to Classic+

[@Kaghoegaming]

That’s my hope

[@cavebear3379]

It was great at first but now it feels to much like retail for me. Their is no struggle anymore power lvl through incursions earn mass gold need fgear score app tracking logs for raids considering going back to HC.

[@Kaghoegaming]

Hardcore is quite awesome

[@Scottysaweet]

It should be called Season 1 of discovery because thats all it really was or will be

[@Kaghoegaming]

Why?

[@matercheff]

Took a two week break now I’m back it’s been fun

[@Valafar.]

I used to play classic in 04 with an old man who died right after nax came out....can't help but feel like he won

[@Kaghoegaming]

That’s so sad :(

[@ikesulzberger7904]

on my oceanic server I've gone from finding groups to not finding groups 😂 it's dead af

[@Kaghoegaming]

Sorry to hear that

[@AlphaSmoke100]

this phase suckkkkkkks hyped as fuck for mc and ony next phase

[@kolpants]

i loved sod. but not being able to get into raids in the previous phase killed it for me. you're either meta class or nothing at all. The only thing that i could do was farm stuff, but competing with bot farmers didn't help either. so i stopped all together after running lowbies through dungeons.

[@Kaghoegaming]

Yeah people meta whored the hell out of it

[@ToHonorKnowledge]

Idk if I’d say dying as much as I’d say easing into it’s normal player base. But also things like the new Warcraft logs addon will make the raiding environment much much more toxic and probably drive people away

[@user-ob7kw4fn1w]

I miss the days when there was hype around hardcore.

[@sneakaway56]

That was population not raids cleared going from 10 to 20 man wouldn't change the population at all. If it stayed balanced p2 and p3 would both would be the 325k.

[@k1ller1nc]

I think that the phases are to long and going from 10 to 20 man is where its going wrong. I'm enjoying it but a lot of my friends and guildies are playing other games now waiting phase 4.

[@zometthecomet]

10 man is the best way! Expecting us to have a life, job, wife , kids and have time for 20 man content that spans hours is stupid

[@mrklene8379]

My server died lava lash US was a small server till blizzard closed it off. People fled like rats from a sinking ship. Now the server is a ghost town.

[@Kaghoegaming]

sorry to hear that! Hope you found a new home!

[@dabastx]

this phase was a disaster from launch so i’m not shocked people either quit sod or are waiting for p4

[@Kaghoegaming]

yeah not the best launch

[@whiskeytangotv1758]

It's like they are trying to kill their own product double raid requirements to 20 and changed the lockout to a week. Then phase 3 felt like nothing to do if you don't want to pvp once incursions are done for gear or rep and same with WO and cataclysm pre patch less peeps are playing

[@Kaghoegaming]

I don’t think many are even playing cata prepatch

[@Jes1975]

Min maxing has killed WoW. Once you take the mystery out of the game it changes into a job. The charm of this game was not knowing everything, when you know everything about the game it gets boring. Min max, boosting, to much gold in the economy are all death blows for MMO’s imo. ✌️❤️

[@Kaghoegaming]

Yeah they had to inflate the economy because of phase 1 failures completely ruining it, but yeah min maxing everything does strain the casual community a lot.

[@brianwilliams9997]

I tend to subscribe for one month of a phase.

[@Kaghoegaming]

That’s one way to do it, the first month is always a banger

[@Landro81ify]

The 20man change is one thing , but there is so much things happening now with blizzard games... D4 : New season soon , Retail : Dark heart and soon Pandamonium event ... then after that there will be pre patch and The war within. I guess the people is divided 🙂

[@ClauneckGames]

When you make the game for casual but the end game (raid) for try hard you get this. Low numbers of raid for later phases. P1 was great because nobody was gatekeeping the raid. Now you need pots, consumes,WB,BiS,enchant catnip and hope your class is doing good atm. Make raid easier and give more loot!! Why waste 40-50g for no loot. Suck but from my 3 50s I only done ST twice. Raid size is not the issue.

[@Ultravis66]

This! Its not so much that its a 20 man, but you need to go in with 50 gold or more in consumes, go out to some remote island to buy 2 consumes specific to ST. Fly out to felwood for songflower, go get DMF buff in a raid when its in enemy territory, And afk in BB until someone drops world buff. Its too damn much!!!

[@RichSmithson]

@@Ultravis66and the most important thing of all. Your record on Warcraft logs 😂

[@Ultravis66]

@@RichSmithson You are not wrong, BUT, the key to good warcraft logs is getting all the stupid buffs I mentioned above more than anything. I have raided ST on 3 toons, My parses are all 70-99% and its all about the consumes and world buffs.

[@Shockdoctor_OG]

I mean several other versions of the game came out to be fair.

[@Kaghoegaming]

Yeah that’s a huge talking point

[@lonehorntoad7319]

They just killed my server.....not happy.

[@Kaghoegaming]

I’m sorry :(

[@hcliff2100]

I think the huge nerfs was a mistake. The raid is so easy to clear so there was no prog which made gearing redundant. and the only real gear people want from ST are the few epics which will easily be replaced next phase so doing ST sort of feels meaningless.

[@jotunhammer]

eu wild growth feels like 50% now

[@Kaghoegaming]

Is that the most popular EU one?

[@jotunhammer]

@@Kaghoegaming no i think living flame was more

[@zantsmith4257]

Yes. Question answered litterally have servers being locked because no one is playing on them and giving free transfers off. Yeah it's dying. 20m was a mistake

[@Kaghoegaming]

hard to say if it was all the 20 to 10 man swap

[@bigbigzubra]

20 man, making the raids significantly harder and longer (so much trash), BFD was perfect. Idk what they were thinking with Gnomer/ST. Incursions. The constant hot fixes. Completely clueless on what to do with PVP. Gold sinks. Banning people for buying gold in a seasonal realm. The list goes on and on. Had no intentions of playing Cata, now I’m playing that over SOD.

[@Kaghoegaming]

Very interesting, only part I disagree with is buying gold, they should ban you for that.

[@zometthecomet]

This😂 10 man is the best

[@RichSmithson]

I haven’t liked anything since phase 1. Man it’s sad I wanted to play right through but this isn’t fun anymore.

[@GokuIRL]

This retention is pretty normal for WoW

[@Kaghoegaming]

Just wild to see because so many people played the launch

[@davidabfox]

It’s not 200,000 Les people. Much less alts and stuff

[@aylenn1574]

alts take way more effort now than p1, a lot of people are geared up on their mains and just raid logging and there's a lot of crossover with cata classic and/or other games as they don't need to play sod as much with their main well geared and probably even an alt or 2 geared gnomer was the big burn out, it wasn't as much fun and way more punishing than BFD & ST and with all the added stuff it's just a lot more time now to keep alts super current for raid unless you don't min max I went from 12 alts in p1 to 6 in p2 to 1-2 now depending on the week lol

[@shortcrypto7490]

10 man raiding was great - 20 man killed my guild

[@Macncheesee]

20 man killed my guild. Not to mention how HARD the raid is

[@Kaghoegaming]

Sorry it caused this for you, I feared this would be a popular occurrence

[@SirTomo1]

The raid is stupidly easy, you can clear it in level 40 gear, you just need the 20 people to show up.

[@Naeinsengimnida]

@@SirTomo1 Not for casuals. Now wipe your sweat and leave them alone

[@SirTomo1]

@@Naeinsengimnida :O I've only been playing 1.5 months, I only played for an hour or so after work lol, I think I'm pretty casual :P

[@WesleyHughston]

Besides peak times , nobody is on hardly except the summon bots. The only place you really find any life is at the incursions. People are done with this phase, it's pretty obvious they screwed up. ST is a slog and only the parsing Andys arw really running it. The gear in ST is such a minimal upgrade that there isn't much hype. People are also burnt out on ZF/Maura farming. If they miss the mark again they will keep taking exponential drops in players and we will end up with 2 or 3 servers. Cata will grab people come launch, and I doubt we will ever see those original numbers come back.

[@Kaghoegaming]

If any phase would do it, it would be phase 4

[@kileNoe]

I know season 3 was enough for me to jump ship and go back to dragonflight. Havnt played retail in 2 years, but I love dragonflight. It's amazing

[@burntmoney6586]

I don’t think it’s dying at all, people are taking breaks or playing cata. A lot of my guild is taking a break until phase4. People in my guild just want 60 and the real raids and PvP

[@sipiwitswalter]

Of course it is. It was fun at first but one raid a xpac is pointless. Everybody clears it in 1 week. Then 2 months of nothing but alts

[@Kaghoegaming]

End game could be awesome

[@Josepwns00]

I just did a raid that was +1 mind you didn't know it was just going my buddy, anyway 2 epics dropped for my hunter rolled 94 & 96 ... didn't get cause I won a blue in the beginning of the raid lol ... couldn't complain but before in other raids I could win more than one item now I can't lol

[@liongazelle735]

Nightmare incursion ruined it for me

[@collectiblesnrandomstuff544]

I quit in season 2 because it’s was just boring after a while , having fun in Cata along with the 20 friends I convinced to also quit sod and play Cata instead. We are doing rgbs and can’t wait for cata raids

[@TardBuckwater]

I skipped all of P2. Iam currently really enjoying P3. Just give yourself a break from the game and you won't get burned out.

[@rubenloza1920]

Yeah I think SoD is dying. Yes, it will see spikes when new phases hit.. but I think the this is my daily driver game for the masses is kind of over. Truth is you made a seasonal game and broke it up into separate seasons itself. I get it. But that is not how seasonal games work. I think SoD was/is a great experiment they just have to adapt it to a seasonal environment. Chop out gold caps and sinks. Increase lock out speeds. Also, for the love of god PICK ONE RAID SIZE and run with it all the way though so you do not have to have a social crisis at some halfway point.

[@Kaghoegaming]

Yeah I think they should’ve saved 20 man for end game

[@TheLazySpoiledKitty]

Its not dying... People overexagurate things and over analyse it. Players went to Cata Classic and there is little to do aside from leveling alts or farming gold if that's your thing. As for the raiding scene Gatekeeping and parses have a bit to do with it in terms of pupularity of ST - people cannot get into the raid.... And how can you improve your parses if you cannot get in ? I get it... And i do like to parse a bit but people need to be more forgiving towards non-sweaty players. As a RL myself if the people do what is asked of them + do mechanics ? That is all i could ask for personally. :)

[@Kaghoegaming]

I was just looking at the numbers and sharing my experience, I think phase 4 will be awesome

[@plantseeker5829]

Well said!! Super hard to get in raid without guild. All they care about is xp and gear ..how you get them if you cant get inv to the raids😂😂

[@TheLazySpoiledKitty]

@@plantseeker5829 even funnier is when you show them your logs from your Main and they wont take your alt because it has no logs xD cringe AF those types of RL'ers

[@plantseeker5829]

@@TheLazySpoiledKitty 😂🤣so cringeeeee😬

[@Thewannabeheroes]

The community killing it off themselves. I got 5 lv50s but i raid on 1, with my own guild, why? because you just cant get into a Pug unless you are a desired class with good parses and now i see an addon being released that shows mouseover parses, lol RIP to a good amount of the player base

[@jasonmorgan27]

L MFFFFFFF A O!!! I have NEVER seen one raid die due to enrage mechanics, not ONE. People wipe because they are fing stupid players, this is why GDKP's are total cancer. Cant tell you how many times on wotlk server I have wiped with groups full of 6K geared people. They buy their gear and then put ZERO effort into learning the raid. Your are right, these elite tools are killing themselves and this game

[@Naeinsengimnida]

@@jasonmorgan27 The stupid players you're talking about are probably 90% of the playerbase... which is also the main chunk of Blizzard's income. Let me define you a casual : it's comes from the word *OCCASIONAL*, how do you expect the average player to be good at something they play occasionally ?

[@jasonmorgan27]

@@Naeinsengimnida Look at the big brain on Brad. People like you in this world will always come up with excuses to make up for your lack of planning and work ethic. This phase has been out 6 months. Even if you only played 5-6 hours a week you should be full bis and understand all mechanics of every fight by now, youtube is amazing I hear. If that is too hard for you then you are playing the wrong game or should never be playing at all. GDKP's are total black cancer for everyone involved and give NO ONE any sense of accomplishment or satisfaction.

[@user-jn2ov2yh5o]

Yes Sod is dying because of the DEVS!!!! they keep fucking over the players with server shutdowns, forcing transfers, breaking up guilds, disrespecting players time and poor game play decisions.

[@Kaghoegaming]

I mean they can’t help it if servers die though?

[@user-jn2ov2yh5o]

@@Kaghoegaming seems the common feedback was the servers were not dying, felt fine, lava lash felt fine to me.

[@karolnie212]

We just chillin and raid logging with guild, simply nothing to do this phase, i hope they bring some real amount od content next phase, if they add only 1 stupid event and 1 boring 20 man we gonna see next raid logging phase.

[@DifferentNow]

St is too hard for casual players, thats the first thing that ppl dont like about sod right now.

[@Kaghoegaming]

even with all the nerfs?

[@DifferentNow]

@@Kaghoegaming Yeah! i wil try again but hoping for some cool raids next phase

[@clauschristensen5356]

Lower the difficulty and requrement for the stupid raids, players Who want to be sweaty min maxing are always getting their way Even tho they only count for 1-5% of the real playerbase. Us real dads dont have 3 hours for raids and endless grinds. Remove and make Things compact so we dont get this feeling of wasting time on content we did 18 years ago. Take BFD raids. Perfect combo - 10 man, puggable, and 30 min to get great loot.

[@Nick-gp1pt]

Gnomer gatekeep did it for me

[@alfredosarmiento7576]

logs and gate keeping will slowly kill off all versions of wow. Make the game unattractive. Also Cata + panda are going to make the numbers come down.

[@TheRampage1337]

Tbh been raid logging a lot more … I’m already done with all my PvP rep… and lvling alts just boring

[@Edacuatica]

I quit. I am happy. RIPgame.

[@Kaghoegaming]

well there are always other games

[@Mortal209]

I quit playing P2 because of how awful they made things. I tried to enjoy the game, I truly did. The whole thing is revolving around raiding instead of the entire Discovery part of the game. They had a chance to make something great and fucked it. P1 was good, it was interesting and they were really bringing things into perspective. However, they had things locked behind raiding content and had people doing GDKPs and bragging about it with botting being at an all-time high. I come back for P2 and I'm enjoying it a bit, I just wish they had made AoE better instead of "Okay only these Classes will be meta for this stuff with this gear and these runes". I can't be doing that anymore. SoD was supposed to be something different and new but instead they just made it into a botched version of a private server and kept screwing certain classes over or giving an advantage to certain factions for certain runes. I just can't be bothered to play anymore and I'm having more fun in Cata Pre Patch right now than I was in SoD - that says something because Pre Patch is broken to hell and so many things still aren't right and are in fact broken.

[@RichSmithson]

Casuals moved on and the community is to blame. The parsing stuff got absolutely ridiculous in the end. WOW can’t grow because the addicts playing it scare off anyone new.

[@Kaghoegaming]

Ehhh still a lot of casuals, but yeah the gatekeeping is insane

[@andrew2616]

No SoD isn’t dying, It is losing players but a lot of the player base in P1 has 3-4 alts and now its just impossible to have more than 2 alts. I guess you could but keeping everything up to current content level is very taxing on time. Ultimately, 20 mans and WB/consumes mindset has completely killed the end game content and it’s only going to get worse at 60 with everything being released. WB/consumes have always been the Bain of classic and still is to this day in Era.

[@arcc4]

Classic has already proven that the whole, "40/20 mans are too big" is a bunch of BS. It's just the bandwagon people jump on when the player base shrinks and groups/guilds can't maintain a solid roster. ST being 20 man or a weekly lockout isn't the problem. It's that its the only content. There has to be something to do in between larger/longer raid lockouts that smaller groups can do and with a decent frequency. This not only keeps players engaged and enjoying being able to use their characters they are gearing on something other than the raid that gives the gear, but its the kind of content that allows onboarding for gearing alts. Had incursions been 10-man raid content with 3 bosses that rotated daily it would have made phase 3 a banger. Instead it was just a leveling/gold printing infinite quest hub where people doing rotations of the same activity over and over and over.

[@Kaghoegaming]

The leap from level up dungeons being 10 man and now 20 is what really fucked up a lot of people

[@arcc4]

@@Kaghoegaming I'm sorry, but that's just a horribly ignorant take. All of WoW's best success during Vanilla->Wraith and Classic had 40 man raids. The pinnacle raid size is not the issue and not some massive barrier to playing that people want to pretend it is. However, the reason larger raid sizes weren't a problem then was because there was an abundance of relevant 5/10 man content to do between the weekly lockouts. SoD P3 doesn't have this. By transitioning to just one bigger less frequent raid they've basically cut raiding activity in half. There was no new PvP event or rep to grind and the outside PvE content is just a glorified quest hub. There just isn't anything to do.

[@Kaghoegaming]

I meant from a level up dungeon pov and non 60 phaseal content, from that window, I love 40 man raids and think they are some the best most iconic raids we’ve had

[@newspin2477]

Personally... I'm done unless WoW does something about the Archon addon. I know it's just a game and characters are just virtual avatars, but it's a kind of civil liberties violation in my eyes. Hard to explain.. don't really need to explain... that's how I feel. Done.

[@Kaghoegaming]

Haha check out todays video, it’s all about it

[@davidcoleman9705]

People have been playing wow for 15 years or more . Burnt out lol . I wonder why

[@Kaghoegaming]

Kinda crazy to think about

[@stikkontakt4]

I feel like phase 3 has been heaps better than phase 2. Sure the incursions was a miss but everything else has been good. All classes are needed again, the raid is more fun and the gatekeeping is gone with its 20 man size, the honor grind for gear is more meaningful and there is an incentive to run the regular dungeons for offerings etc. I don't know why people are hating.

[@smoothierip5693]

There is no content. 1 raid is all we get each phase..

[@RichSmithson]

Imagine if they had re done dungeons instead of stupid incursions and pvp events.