Self Rescue After Loss of Footing, 8 Scenarios

[@robertwilliamson6958]

I have not realized, how unsafe it is to be hunting with nothing but the lineman’s belt and a normal tether, if some part of my platform system was to fail. Until I just watched this video. Looks like I need to learn some things on self recovery and practice them, rappelling, certainly incorporate a lifeline in case of a platform failure. And being to high to reach the top stick or next climbing aid down the tree. This is the best, and most useful saddle system video I think I’ve ever watched.

[@jrbtc]

Yet just about everyone is sold a tether and lineman's belt. I use neither.

[@frankpurciful7926]

I started repelling as a safer way to come down in the dark. I've come to realize that it's the only safeway to get down period. I come down slow and remove my sticks with no worries. John, I think this video should be a must watch for anyone thinking about getting into saddle hunting. Thank you so much for your great videos

[@jrbtc]

Thanks, Frank. The only way the information will spread is from organic word of mouth, friends helping friends stay safe. There is plenty of resistance to anything that goes against the norm. If you posted a link to this video in the largest Saddle Hunting Facebook group, you would probably get kicked out, like I did. Ok, now, you were intuitive enough to figure out that rappel is the best way out of a tree. I predict that as you get more comfortable on a rope, you're also going to figure out that a rope is the best way to get up in a tree. And even when you're on your sticks, you'll want to have your lifeline on and your slack minimized. I have given you tools to help.

[@Toby458]

@@jrbtc why did they kick you out??? Seems like every saddle hunter could benefit from this information.

[@jrbtc]

@Toby458 i prefer to focus on facts and things I can provide of substance and value and not to speculate as to why other people do what they do. After all, it could be a number of things: ignorance, arrogance, or a commercial interest. For example, it's no secret that I don't need climbing sticks to climb safely. That message is not popular with someone who sells them. No problem though. Information will find its receptive audience: Friends help their friends. Cheers

[@ThomasShue]

Best info I have found in my new journey into saddle hunting

[@jrbtc]

That's appreciated. We buy a saddle and all this gear but typically don't give adequate thought to what to do when something goes wrong. It's important to do so.

[@Toby458]

The method I've used, in practice, to break the friction hitch, is to tie another friction hitch, with a carabiner, above the hitch that you are attached to. Then loop the tag end of your rope through the carabiner on your bridge and back up through the carabiner on the top hitch. Then you can pull down on the tag end of the rope to lift yourself up. This gives you the mechanical advantage of a pulley system, so pulling yourself up is relatively easy. Although it would be slow getting down with this method, you could basically work yourself down the tree by alternating between both hitches. Loading one hitch while loosening the other until you reached the ground. Just another way to self rescue, in addition to your methods. Great videos BTW! I really enjoy your channel!

[@jrbtc]

@Toby458 that's a great comment. My fear is that the average person who finds themselves in this situation is simply unprepared. And that's why I've spent so much time working on friction hitches which we can break under load.

[@JayN4GO]

Thanks man! I dunno how you don’t have more subs

[@johniswild]

I had this situation many times over the last year. Before that; I climbed with 2 short ropes: one for a foot ascender and one for my harness. Three times I called my spouse to rescue me with a ladder or long rope. Like you, I have more rope than I need now. Thank you. More tools in my bag!

[@tomjenni1555]

Thanks! Just had a tree stick v bracket snap on me....very exciting. I made it down safely but wish I had thought through some options BEFORE that happened.

[@jrbtc]

Wow. Glad u are safe. Yes, i am always on a low slack rope that will get me to ground. My footing is always considered optional and unreliable.

[@Amer-yl4gb]

Even if you dont have munter or the redundant bridge, you can make a butterfly knot with a big loop to put your foot through it and unload the friction hold. Or (harder to do), just use side of your feet (ball area) to pinch over the knot and climp up.

[@jrbtc]

@Amer-yl4gb yes, exactly. Unfortunately, most of the saddle hunters don't even know how to tie a butterfly. And most of them never think about getting in this situation.

[@morgantroutster]

Thanks John, I was hoping that somebody would provide some of these self-rescue ideas on youtube. Very helpful. I'm hoping that a video on self-rescue when you've been inverted will soon be posted by someone in our community. I've read some of the ideas posted in some threads in our community, but seeing them done on video is better. Again thanks, your commitment to safety and helping others to be safe while climbing is excellent. Kevin

[@nelsonlangub3086]

Excellent options just in case. I've included extra gear as well to be able to get out of these situations, and using tethers and line man's belt, I now always include a rappel system, every climb.

[@AequitasSaints]

My goodness. The wealth of knowledge that you have is absolutely insane. I wish I could take a hands on course with you. I would pay good money for it too. If you're ever in Wisconsin left me know I would love to practice with you and buy you a beer, bourbon or whatever you want. You've earned it! Wow!

[@jrbtc]

Appreciate that sincerely. I only ask that if it helps you, or is of value to others, that you share it. Unfortunately, there are going to be more accidents. Falls obviously, but at least those hunters should know the risk of not being tied in. But the average saddle hunter is not even aware that getting stuck on a tether is a real possibility.

[@doesleapfarm]

Great information, thank you

[@johnwolbrecht1898]

OUTSTANDING! Very helpful. Thank you for going to the effort of making and posting this video, this could save someone's life.

[@jrbtc]

That's appreciated. We'll never know who or how many we save by putting them on the safe road, but we do it cuz it's the right thing to do ... it's what brothers and sisters would do.

[@The_Fit_ness_monster]

Great stuff as usual John🤘🤘

[@kennethrogers1129]

for my safety I am using the jrb cinch after I climb to hunting position , and set my ring of steps, or a horizontal tree limb. unless I like the position of my climbing rope. But often I want to adjust my position and setting a jrb cinch gives that variability. and I'm always tied in, I either transfer with redundant bridge or just add a carabiner, then remove my climbing rope, so I'm always on the tree. Example would be wanting to be on the other side of the tree , without my climbing rope wrapped around it.

[@pfriedman88]

Great video. My first year repelling and this is fantastic information. I appreciate it

[@jrbtc]

Appreciate that. U stay tied in safe.

[@pfriedman88]

Thank you. I tied a redundant bridge on my saddle today and also made my own secondary linesman rope that doubles as a second tether. So I’ll have two lifelines as you refer to them up top, one connected to my bridge and the other to my redundant bridge. I have two young daughters, can’t be too safe up there!

[@jhillyt]

Thank you sir. Great info!

[@jrbtc]

We'll never know about the accidents or injuries we help prevent, but we know it's happening. Cheers and be safe.

[@jhillyt]

@@jrbtc Any chance you could elaborate on one of the options you showed, the one where you had both the rappel device and the ropeman above it? Iiked that look as I sometimes struggle transitioning into my rappel setup...

[@jrbtc]

@@jhillyt that was scenario 8. I was on a tether and a mechanical Ascender when i hypothetically lost my footing. 1: affix rappel rope on tree. 2: connect to your rappel rope with your bridge. 3: form or affix a footloop on the rappel rope. 4: step up putting weight on your foot. While standing, slide the friction hitch on your rappel rope up as high as possible so that as you sit, you are loading it and no longer loading the mechanical ascender. 5. Load the rappel device and rappel. Note: I always have a friction hedge above my repel device, and my repel device is typically a munter. If you're using a mechanical rappel device instead, this is all still possible, it's just a matter of coordinating the load transfer onto the mechanical rappel device. If this does not answer your question, it might be best to take up the discussion elsewhere. Feel free to post in the JRB Tree Climbing Facebook group.

[@zacharyriley2501]

I have added the second bridge and use it while hunting. I have found it really helps to even out the pressure. Carry a spare short tether rope for that reason.

[@zacharyriley2501]

Only for that reason not for climbing

[@carlwydrzynski3578]

I've actually had to transfer from a rappel rope to a tether before. It sucked. I think my rappel rope was stuck and I was trying to loosen it or something. Which I would of thought about tieing a foot loop. Great video

[@wm6117]

It'd be interesting to see a list of Johns recommended self-rescue devices... I carry a Linesmans rope, Kong Duck, and will be adding a Prussic loop cord... For times like the Hitch climbing self rescue I did yesterday :D

[@jrbtc]

It's a tough call in terms of what to bring. In 15 yrs, i have never actually needed anything, however, i typically have a spare carabiner, a length of cord, a web sling and a knife.

[@averageoutdoorsman9342]

A different set of numbers 🤣🤣🤣🤣 This is great information on a serious note. Thank you. Also you said the sacoffold knot would work as well as the noose knot, I would kindly advise against it. I've had scaffold knots bind up to the point of needing a marlin spike to undo. Good luck and safe hunting.

[@jrbtc]

I was at a saddle hunters meet up event recently and had a gentleman who is more than double my weight ( and not as tall) execute a rope climb using my setup. Things that were relatively easy for me were not easy for him. But we worked it out and learned our lessons in a safe and well supervised setting. It's important that we know our limits, and don't try to exceed them on a climb. Cheers

[@qb7384]

What if you harness has a belay loop close to waste.Could you just carry a extra carabiner and use a 30 ft tether instead of the typical 8-9 ft. Tie a munter and release the hitch(distal) and slowly come down? Thanks

[@jrbtc]

It sounds feasible but you would need to fully answer that yourself based on your analysis. Think about what happened to get you in this position. Was the extra carabiner already on your belay loop? Or do you need to put it on? Might you have dropped it? Might it be out of reach. And the Distel is a very reliable hitch, but you won't release it under load and so make sure you have a means to get weight on your feet. Some Kind of footloop.

[@qb7384]

Wouldn’t a simple extra tether with a larger pursik for a foot hold work?

[@jrbtc]

There are other ways to get weight on our feet. But we also need to get down. I prefer solutions that don't require anything extra. We want solutions that have our escape solution built into the main system. Instead of 2 tethers, just carry a lifeline. For example, what if your one stick popped off at the moment you were attaching your pack to the tree. You dropped your pack or fell out of reach of it. Or forgot to put your extra tether in the pack.

[@lizzleyt]

What about stick climbers who don’t have a rappel rope?

[@jrbtc]

Viewers need to draw their own conclusions. As stated, I would never climb without a line to ground, and prepared and ready for rappel. If you or anyone are not in that situation, I would recommend you need either a rappel rope and plan or a different plan which accomplishes the same result. I would offer one, but I'm simply not aware of a robust alternative solution.

[@Jb429421]

Your safety videos are very much appreciated 👍. Thanks for the time and effort!

[@bradbaillargeon3248]

Another tip don’t try to be all fancy with the one sticks and climbing ropes keep it simple the more complicated the more chance of tragedy.

[@bradbaillargeon3248]

Sorry but this video is not correct. I had my platform hit the ground as I was leaning to the side and I immediately dropped straight up and down. Everytime I tried to put my knees against the tree like in this video they slipped straight down. Everytime I tried to climb the tree to press them against the tree they slipped down. Not a single thing worked. His knots and ropes are good but trust me your saddle will be high up on your ass with your straps crushing your leg arteries. Anything you practice do it straight up and down with your body pressed against the tree because that is how will end up. You will be doing everything one handed as your struggling with the other hand to relieve tension on your leg straps. Learn these knots very well cuz you will not see them being tied as you will be against the tree or you will be tying them above your head. By the time you get done struggling to relieve the tension and try to be like he was with his knees in the video you will be exhausted then the real panic will set in believe me this is from experience. I would have been dead if my wife didn’t come out of the house while I was practicing it got real very quick no joke. You want to practice this do it for real with someone there and something to stand on if you need to after a short amount of time. When you go vertical it’s a whole new world of hell after leaning all comfortable on a platform. My advice have a suspension relief rope like mentioned on this video and a cell phone handy to call for help. I had neither with me and got real lucky!

[@jrbtc]

It sounds like your saddle rode up on you. I can't speculate any further because I don't know the details of your setup. I can tell you that in my saddle, when I have my leg straps nice and tight like they're supposed to be, it's impossible for my saddle to ride up. And as demonstrated, my tie in point is always over my head, so I never get so close to the tree that I can't push off it as demonstrated. Be careful please.

[@mikefinch5624]

At first glance and viewing, this seems quite revolutionary. I agree with another commenter that your sub and like numbers seem way low. I found you doing search for drt vs. srt and wow am I glad I did. I'm all of a sudden realizing that it may not cost me $1K to get started climbing trees any more. Headed to your website now eager to learn. My dad might very seriously be interested in this saddle hunting concept. I will def be introducing him to your method. You're clearly an idealist and humble about your contribution, but honestly who knows, your system literally could make traditional DRT/SRT obsolete. That could be financially fantastic for you if you trademark your system, but it could also open you up to persecution by all these company's selling devices for multiple hundreds of dollars. Your system could really upset the applecart in other words. Just watch your six. 🙂

[@jrbtc]

Thx. If information is worth sharing, it will be shared. I don't measure success based on number of subscribers. I measure success by the number of people I have helped. By their appreciation. Knowing that over time, we are going to prevent some accidents. I don't have a store and don't sell anything, but I am happy to share where I got mine or where you can get it. I can't even tell you how many have asked me why I didn't protect my original knots as intellectual property. I tell them that although that might be possible, its completely counter to my strategy which is about sharing. Knots have always been a gift to the creative common and although a few have broken that tradition, I have no plans to.