Communication & Confrontation in Your Group - RPG Philosophy

[@thomasrhoads4316]

I would watch a staged podcast that was just Seth and Seth's persona's playing RPGs together. That would be gold.

[@macoppy6571]

This would make for an incredible engagement piece. Perfect for a major holiday, with lots of sponsors and product demos weaved in. The amount of effort and time required necessitates substantial compensation for Seth.

[@szymonsokolinski9907]

@@macoppy6571 *Seths

[@macoppy6571]

@@szymonsokolinski9907 If an actor gets three credits in a single feature, does that actor get paid triple, or does the studio save 2/3 on the performance budget? I smell Dr. Strangelove callbacks.

[@TeranceCrosby]

This should at least be a full Christmas special 🤣

[@shinrafugitives3880]

"No. You can't have an effigy of a twelve-headed half-dragon bebilith"

[@quarkinjapan]

Plot twist: Todd is the only one who can't see dead people

[@SSkorkowsky]

This is now canon.

[@tartytart7560]

Todd, the accident wasn't your fault. Anyone could have knocked that d4 onto the floor...

[@davidbrennan660]

Epic weapon grade Todd.

[@xionkuriyama5697]

@@SSkorkowsky I am here for the deepening lore of the Seth Skorkowsky Demonstration Skit Cinematic Universe.

[@gothmissstress]

@@SSkorkowsky hahaha

[@punishedwhispers1218]

When Kevin appeared that was like a jumpscare, man was so foreign to my mind he must've been a mythos entity

[@Lcirex]

Poor Kevin and his amazing Patrick Warburton voice.

[@Nezzeraj]

Haha I came here to post this exact same thing.

[@drakinkoren]

I wonder if he does his own theme tune...

[@justinmichael6987]

Kevin's staff. The staff for Kevin. The staff intended for Kevin.

[@MrChupacabra555]

They ignore Kevin so much its like his very first appearance or something......^_^

[@DarthMalnu]

"Okay, we've got dice, character sheets, drinks, chips. Why do I still feel like we're missing something?......... KEVIN!!!"

[@larsdahl5528]

Perhaps there is a false assumption? kzbin.info/www/bejne/j2TKhWyhpdNoh9E

[@stephenblevins3829]

Nice.

[@TalonBrush]

Oh my god, that was great, darth!

[@imreadydoctor]

If it makes you feel any better, I forgot my reading glasses.

[@nrgspike]

"Kevin is not real, his moaning can't ruin your game" - Todd, probably.

[@jasonnewell7036]

Gold! Absolute gold! Todd not knowing who Kevin is was hilarious.

[@MrChupacabra555]

Kind of like poor Milton in "The Suicide Squad" ^_^

[@jesternario]

Well, to be fair, I didn't know who was either.

[@gregvs.theworld451]

@@jesternario It's Kevin! Here's been there for like three years! C'mon, you know Kevin.

[@TalonBrush]

Don't let my players know this, but I actually have one player in my group that I once forgot existed.

[@Kevin-us4gj]

Seriously though, who is Kevin?

[@mrmaster9801]

This video could be easily renamed "Mature communication between adults: how to handle it" and it would still make perfect sense. Nice video, Seth 👍🏻.

[@flightlessbird2281]

Can we get a one-shot campaign of Seth and his alt-seths....please

[@michaelcottle6270]

I love this idea, but I hate to think how much work that would be for Seth. Writing and performing 4 (or 5 if we include Kevin) parts.

[@Triumph263]

@@michaelcottle6270 Like being a DM running a campaign with several DMPC's and no players where the DMPC's are themselves controlling one PC each. I see *no* potential for confusion there.

[@Bramandin]

Soulds like a huge time investment for Seth, but if I was a millionaire I'd sponsor this event. ^^

[@stephenblevins3829]

He's already done this. Well, sort of. The video where he does the skit about the Edgelord is pretty close to what you want. Comedy gold!

[@The_Custos]

Seth isn't real, Kevin is the real one.

[@stephensimpson881]

The one time I've seen GM intervention work is when there's a new player at the table and the rest of the group has been together for a long time. I've seen players feel, fairly legitimately, like they would be going up against a "united front" and felt that they needed the GM to act as something of an icebreaker. In a couple of cases, I've seen (or been) the GM basically saying "hey guys, it looks to me like you're just kinda ignoring the New Guy and leaving them out. If you don't want them in the group, let's have that talk, but otherwise, it would be a good idea to try to actively include them more". And it usually worked. But that's a pretty specific type of situation.

[@jaketionary2543]

I'm thinking Todd isn't crazy; he's just the only one who made his save to not be charmed by "Kevin". Think about it: Kevin is after more magic items and wants to direct the party "just climb the walls," straight into danger. Next thing you know, Seth is missing, Kevin is GMing, and Todd is the only one who notices!

[@haytdotexe]

That bit where Todd says Kevin to himself is hilarious.

[@gothmissstress]

Yeah super hilarious

[@matts3012]

As sad as it is that we’ll never see Kevin again, Seth did not say he left the game. He is still there, waiting for his turn to talk.

[@azraelle6232]

He's got a really low initiative roll. Really low.

[@Starman1976]

I'm in this comment, and I don't like it.

[@DariaRodiak]

Just at the right time! Yesterday I just had a talk with our Pathfinder group about communication and it felt much better afterwards. Communications is key! I just sent them this video because I think you just said the right things. Thank you so much for your content. I enjoy and appreciate it very much!

[@SSkorkowsky]

Hope your group's communication improves after yesterday's talk.

[@DariaRodiak]

@@SSkorkowsky I feel like it already improved within the last two days :)

[@artofthegenre6087]

I think my favorite thing about this video is the sigh after the game session by the DM. That is REAL! It’s exhausting

[@kaihimura3897]

This upload comes at a great time! A couple of friends of mine are having trouble at their virtual table. I posted this video in our general TTRPG Discord. Hopefully they will use your guidance to evolve into more robust players, and generally, people. On a personal note: It has been definitely awkward being that guy who brings up any issues at the table. However I can confidently say that my co-players and I are even closer than we were before. Not only knowing that a meeting area is *actually* safe to be vulnerable/honest but also that you'll be genuinely listened to is core for long lasting friendships and cohesive teamwork, at least in my personal opinion. Keep up the great work, Seth!

[@tuomasronnberg5244]

I like to think that Kevin has been here all these years right from the beginning, but stuck behind the camera.

[@NisGaarde]

Kevin was actually my top pick for Dweebles' real name until today.

[@marcclement6597]

Some people are keeping records, better watch out Seth.

[@girlbuu9403]

There are three... two and a half kinds of people that always resort to asking the GM to speak on their behalf. 1: Introverts who avoid confrontation either out of fear of other people getting angry or fear of their own poor oration skills. 2: Snakes in the grass who are more interested in trying to get other players 'in trouble' than actually resolving the issue. 3: People unsure of themselves and are looking for validation from the GM before they pursue these complaints. I count this as a half as this is a pretty human thing. They want to make sure that their issue is valid and they aren't blowing it out of proportion. They might also talk to the other players about something the GM is doing before confronting the GM about it, just to make sure they aren't exaggerating the problem. I am #3. I learned a long time ago to stop saying "Can you talk to them for me" and start asking "Am I wrong to feel like they are being jerks?" I want a third party to make sure I am not making a mountain out of a molehill.

[@skreppeknekker]

This should be a compulsory training video for every workplace environment

[@JOAG]

I like how you can take a serious topic and present it with a healthy amount of humor, so that it no longer seems so inevitable)) way to go, Seth))

[@Fuzzy_Barbarian]

I feel bad for being thankful Kevin isn't going to be around anymore. I instantly saw him as the Poochie of the group.

[@kevinbaird6705]

Words hurt.

[@thebolas000]

The bit at the end made me think of "Poochie returned to his home planet."

[@franzgriffle6063]

Kevin has been in like every episode since… what are you talking about?

[@erichobbs4042]

After the opening, I really really wanted to finally hear Dweebles full story of the Turtle in the hat. But now I see that it's actually better if we all never hear it. Any actual story will pale in comparison to the epic tales we have all made up in our own heads.

[@jakphannak817]

Okay, time to go to bed. (Seth posts a new video) Yeah, think i can stay awake for 13:18 more.

[@KoDaMoJo]

You need to put, "Who the hell is Kevin" on some merch

[@danabbott7836]

I think there can be a middle ground. Sometimes players will feel attacked if confronted by another player, but not if the problem is brought up by an impartial third party. this is not to say the GM should try and fix things alone, but they can be very helpful in introducing the problem and then letting the two players work it out.

[@Edheldui]

In that case you're just throwing the gm under the bus and trying to avoid any kind of blame. The gm is just another player in an asymmetrical game, not a babysitter. The gm's ONLY role is to present the fictional world, and check that the rules of the game are followed, that's it.

[@JdJdR]

That sketch was awesome! Still my best ever is PEANUT HEAD AND THE BONESAW!

[@erikmattsen4317]

Defiantly need to add the "Seriously, who the hell is Kevin?" T-shirt to the store.

[@jajsem1109]

"Who the hell is Kevin?" Is it Dorkness rising reference? :D Anyway, here is my like.

[@Daiqatana]

Kevin's Brock Samson voice is great.

[@-Thunder-Warrior-]

"Kevin died on the way back to his home planet."

[@KahnShawnery]

My players are all in their post-40's. We had a player in a campaign take issue with how another player was role-playing. She misinterpreted his actions and took things personally. But what made it worse was that she sat on that for a year. When she finally told me it was a 2-hour session where she complained and demanded I kick my best friend out, someone I've been playing with for over 30 years. I didn't like the demanding, but to be political I said I would be more observant and intercede if I saw him doing any of the actions she accused him of. They never manifested, but she got angrier and angrier. She was my wife's best friend since childhood and even she said the player was over-reacting, misunderstanding and overall being a brat. I could not tell my friend what was going on because he was not doing anything she accused him of. She eventually rage-quit the campaign in a glorious rant on Facebook.

[@mortagon1451]

Over 30 years of Game mastering and this has never happened to me, but I've experienced unhappy players just bottling up their frustrations until they leave the game as a result, instead of trying to talk to the group. Most players have had no issues communicating their frustrations openly and respectfully at the table however.

[@richmcgee434]

Same here - although "communicating their frustrations openly and respectfully at the table" has occasionally looked more like "throwing dice and/or pizza at each other" in my experience. Although to be fair, there were some out-of-game infidelity issues involved with the pizza incident, and we were all much younger then. There was also the one guy who stole the GM's cat rather than talk to him about the way he was mistreating the animal. Still scratching my head about that one as to who was in the wrong. Both of them, maybe?

[@LordVader1094]

@@richmcgee434 Wtf kinda groups you got lmao

[@Zebulyon159]

This was perfect, it really helped me be able to process my emotions regarding my own experiences of this.

[@notoriouswhitemoth]

When I ask the GM to talk to another player about something in my behalf, it's because they've given me reason to believe they'll be more receptive if it's coming from them rather than me.

[@SeanLaMontagne]

You know why this video is so important? Because I still see comments of young DMs and Players recommending you use in-game mechanics to "punish" their friends for perceived slights.

[@FuriousJorge]

Amazing. It's like every single one of your videos is pulled right out of my gaming group!

[@jessesisk5866]

[Squinting Fry]

[@alexadre2142]

Seth, those transition screens with players at a table all dressed like they are in a 1920 coc game, are nice and apreciated.

[@RagabashBinBash]

Slay the dragon before he enters your village - talk to each other! Widsom +1

[@jesternario]

Man. I had no idea Kevin was so cool.

[@HoplooWare]

Okay, it is clear that Seth is some kind of changeling or shifter or mimic with the amount of voices he's able to do perfectly

[@sentient_sword]

This is good stuff. I think MANY issues that crop up in role playing games are actually social problems.

[@SteveWhipp]

This is one of the reasons, if given a choice, I prefer to DM for players that know each other before the game starts. Typically, there's fewer (but not zero) player/player issues then.

[@dutch6857]

"Nah, we're never gonna see Kevin again..." Man! The gang really don't take well to tattle-tales. (And since we know that Dweebles is the stone-cold BAMF of the group, we can guess that his asking about Kevin was a red herring to deflect suspicion)

[@nickmanzo8459]

God, I’ve had this happen a lot. One guy wanted to play an anachronistic Greaser character in Faerun, another time, a player had brought in a magic item from a different game into mine without telling me, another time my brother’s character was being targeted for being proactive… it’s hard to deal with all the squabbles of adults.

[@SquirrelGamez]

Holy shit a new character, and he gets a name right away! Also, the bottom line here I feel is the GM should be a mediator, not a messenger.

[@MikJ132]

Video idea: How to get wildly different PCs to work together. For example, say I have a Cop and a Rockerboy who led riots in the same Cyberpunk party. Or a detective and a bootlegger in the same CoC party. Short of banning PvP, banning certain roles or the GM forcing them to work together, what steps can be taken to ensure they at least play together without ripping their throats out, literally or figuratively? I don't want them to 100% cooperate, they should be distrustful of each other if it makes sense for the story (PC rivalry is fine. In fact, that could be the video topic: how to handle rival PCs) Many thanks for your videos, Seth! Got me into tabletop when there was nothing to do in the pandemic

[@SSkorkowsky]

Providing the campaign doesn't have a pre-determined theme (such as, "You're all pirates," or, "You're all in a travelling circus together") there's a few methods. PC Organizations, such as they all belong to a club or guild, which means these wildly different characters have this shared connection. I'm a big fan of Investigator Organizations in Call of Cthulhu. Shared backstory. Before one was a Rockerboy and the other a Cop, they grew up together, or served time or were in the military together, or something that bonded them despite their lives going separate directions. Traveller uses this, where each PC has a shared backstory experience with at least 2 other PCs. Shared or intertwined goal. If this is going to be a campaign with a long-running story, then you introduce it early as to why they should work together to reach their goals (eliminate a shared threat, assist a shared friend, both are framed for some crime and have to prove their innocence, one wants to find the badguy to arrest them while the other wants to reclaim some item the badguys has, etc.). Once the goal is achieved, if the campaign is still going with these characters, either a new goal should be introduced or the players will need to take an active role in deciding why they're still adventuring together despite their differences. Bringing them together for the initial shared goal is easy. But after that it's often best that the players help determine why they're still together.

[@MikJ132]

@@SSkorkowsky Thanks a lot for the insight and rapid response, Seth!

[@ConaRikan2]

The Adventures of Kevin: Finding a Gaming Group

[@johanneskaiser8188]

The most awkward situations are when some players are clearly the GM's favourites (players more so than characters) and it is *really* difficult to try and bring that up as an un-favourite. In a particular example in a group of 7, 3 players would constantly interact between themselves and the world, hogging all the time and mostly excluding everyone else. Those were also the most powerful characters by quite a margin (some of that due to the GM permitting some homebrew stuff he later admitted he probably shouldn't have as well as outright buffs handed out to them, to the point where one of them got an instant-buff that made her suddenly as powerful in combat as the rest of the group combined plus some utility, offset by a minor narrative debuff that was cured via magical amulet 30 real-time minutes later). We other 3 players felt very weird and out of place; and mind you, we are not total introverts, we just were very much not in the "inner circle". But yeah, trying to bring this up was something we never managed. Fortunately, the campaign ended before the unhappiness reached the event horizon.

[@joeykonyha2414]

The Gang got retconned and I was there to see it.

[@pietrayday9915]

I can see why grown-up players would do this: in a way, like many similar "meta" problems in the RPG group, the idea has been bundled into decades of the baggage of the game-master being described in well-meaning advice and rule-books as the group's "referee" and "organizer" - and, sadly, a lot of workplaces are run that way, too, with the manager being tasked with refereeing employee conflicts because the workplace culture works on the assumption that employees can't be trusted to sort out their own problems - and some families operate on this sort of authoritarian structure, where the "head of the household" is expected to keep the entire family in order, and make decrees that will be the "final word" on these little conflicts! And naturally, it can carry over into role-playing groups that operate the same way, until breaking apart, and sending players with assertiveness problems to your group to carry on the cycle, with the encouragement of game writers who talk about your role as if managing player conflicts for them is a normal part of your job! That is, I think this sort of thing becomes a sort of "learned helplessness", reinforced by certain management styles, and encouraged by some gaming books and advice. It doesn't help that a lot of gamers -especially older ones - have a stereotypical gamer's awkward social skills, and play that socially-awkward role to the hilt! Of course, I think most of us take the description of "referee" to mean that GMs are there to make a final decision on interpretation of the rules, rather than to act like some sort of translator and diplomat between players who cannot or will not communicate directly, but that's a bit beside the point: well-meaning game writers tend to saddle GMs with a whole lot of responsibilities over the game, from buying snacks to providing scheduling and transportation solutions for everyone to shouldering most of the responsibility for entertaining the group to fixing broken rules to playing a game of Diplomats & Therapists with hostile group members! When that runs head-long against bad social habits among players....

[@cpnpayne]

Kevin sounds like an insecure Brock Samson

[@Warriormon87]

I like how he created a new character, and then pretended Kevin has always been a part of the gaming group; for the guy who feels like he is ignored.

[@Incrediblefatslug]

Kevin has been here the whole time and they don't pay him any mind

[@RockOfLions]

Yeah, makes you think that they really do ignore Kevin and probably would if he brought up how he felt about being completely ignored.

[@ryanb7186]

Kevin has been my favorite cast member since the very beginning.

[@jccusell]

Seth should start a youtube serie just with the guys chattering and doing soft sketches. Could listen for hours to that stuff.

[@scuffedwizard]

Woke up just in time for some good old RPG Philosophy.

[@sterlingmason3971]

But what about the turtle with the hat?!?!? (this is prolly low-key the funniest long-running gag you're pulling, Seth!)

[@kylethoren1949]

Glad to see him featured. I've been a fan of Kevin's for several years.

[@franzgriffle6063]

Kevin is a great, so glad he was finally the focus of an episode. He always has the funniest things to say, he’s just so quiet sometimes.

[@xionkuriyama5697]

The whole mindset of Gamemaster-As-Dictator is a major contributing factor to this and so many other issues.

[@xionkuriyama5697]

@@DabroodThompson imo thats kind of an extension of the issue i mentioned, but yeah, it's a problem for sure. i don't think it's intentional so much as like, a subconscious bias or smth

[@RockOfLions]

That only goes for Dungeon Masters

[@4_am]

The real magic was the freinds we made along the way

[@SingeScorcher]

Definitely good stuff to keep in mind. Thankfully the closest my group gets to this is asking one another to if they think someone else was enjoying their time, or asking another to gauge how someone else is feeling. I.E. our DM knows one player in the group less than the others do, so he'll often ask me if that player's enjoying a particular aspect of the game b/c I know his reactions better. Or if I notice someone at the table acting negatively to my roleplay, I might ask some of the others if I was over-stepping or if they noticed a reaction so I can actually talk/apologize to that person with us becoming less likely to argue. The key really is to talk to each other and solve problems within the group as a group.

[@trippymartian8847]

Great video and topic to cover! I’ve made this mistake before on the side of the player.

[@mzaa6787]

Finally! Another Kevin episode!

[@kevinbaird6705]

Agreed.

[@WaveShock007]

When a new player has a name and you don't. I see you Dweebles. I'm watching you.

[@Lilyclu]

Aw, Mike came around to actually wanting to stick around to listen to stories. :) The skit subplots are the best. Great video! I've found myself asking the DM or being asked about other players as the DM before, food for thought.

[@BentWaterZ]

Ah man, i remember calling for an intermediary one time in a game group. I was the Referee, and my friends Girlfriend (with whom I was acquainted but not actual friends with) would regularly make strange attempts to bond by “jokingly/ all in good humor” take a jab at a characteristic of my personal lifestyle. This went on for a few years and while it didn’t initially bother me, it did wane on me, it definitely bothered members of the group. In spite of myself and other people around dropping subtle hints that what she was doing wasn’t funny, she wouldn’t get a hint. After one session, i decided to explain to my friend “Look, i am aware that she feels like this is a way to bond and all, but I feel like i am going to just openly chew her out about it if she does it one more time. I am done hearing it, it wasn’t funny then and it isn’t funny now.” I asked him to relay that message so I wouldn’t make a scene during the next session. That was a situation where an intermediary was appropriate for myself. Going out of my way to communicate with her “could” have been done, but it wasn’t really something that i ever really lost sleep about, or even thought about much tbh. I only really thought about it because I mentally decided to call her out in front of the group as it happened. “Did she ever stop?” Yeah

[@kirishima2370]

I've been GMing for years and I never get ANY of the treasure

[@kevinbaird6705]

Todd... I've been here the whole time.

[@pedropeixe1077]

Every day I hear "Hello internet! Seth Skorkowsky" is a good day

[@txbluesguy]

This is called Minnesota nice (passive-aggressive).

[@Caitlin_TheGreat]

As things like this are often disregarded as _not part of TTRPGs,_ it does come up as a concern a whole lot. Just basic interpersonal communication skills -- they aren't entirely common and they certainly aren't taught in public school... at least not in the US. I try never to be a middleman. If someone comes to me and asks me to talk to someone else on their behalf, I'll either facilitate the people talking to each other and step back (in an example like the video, I'd broach the subject while _everyone_ was at the table and hand it off so Kevin wasn't using me as an authority figure). Or, I will refrain from agreeing at all and instead talk to the person as a sort of "devil's advocate" while also encouraging them to speak to the others directly. Because my personal philosophy is that 1. Problems almost never just go away on their own and you need to address them directly. 2. If you rely on someone else to solve it for you, you might not get the result you want. And 3. It's way better to just be upfront and direct with people because for me that has always mitigated "drama" and misunderstandings that come from indirectness or relying on passing messages through someone else. A good 90% or more of instances of people saying they have some problem with their gaming group or GM or a certain player come down to "talk to the person." Just some good ol' communication does wonders. And keep in mind, I say this as an introvert with his own fair share of social anxiety. I am way more comfortable if I know where I stand with people than if I'm trying to guess based on rumors and hints and third-hand information.

[@larshoffmann7]

Great advice! Given the RPG contract the GM does however have a leadership role (as he is most invested) also outside the game universe. He can help mediate a difficult conversation between the players. I recommend leading an evaluation of the game and of the meta-game. What do you think works best? What could improve it most? and hearing all. Then the Kevin during the meta-game evaluation can voice that him being listened to would help the most. Perhaps a video about evaluating?

[@the_epipan]

00:21 You have no idea how much I empathized with that gesture after the players left. Planning a campaign is tremendous fun and even more exciting because of all the possibilities and possible scenes that you imagine could happen, but running the campaign... is a lot of work and tons of stress because you have the responsibility of making sure that everyone has a good time and manage each person's brightness time so that no one is overshadowed or bored, but you also want it to be a good story, wanting to follow the rules so that everything works well but at the same time having the pressure not to slow down or pause the flow of the narrative/events. You know that the entire session and the continuation of the campaign depends on you, but at the same time if the players abandon the campaign it also get cancelled. I go through a lot of stress before each gaming session and when it's over I breathe a sigh of relief... and although several times I usually feel good with how all turns out, on several other occasions I start thinking about everything that has happened and I get disappointed or reproach myself because some things I could have done them better if I had more time without having to improvise at some point. Especially on occasions when I have to generate places and characters on the spot, in the moment. This has made me like web forum campaigns, with posts every 1 to 3 days, which allows each person to be quite narrative and detailed in their posts about their character's actions and expressions, but running campaigns like this becomes much more slow... also, you have to constantly check the website to post your participation, which is like constantly maintaining that responsibility instead of just placing it on a single specific day. And of course, you lose the adrenaline of the flow of events, the immediacy of the response that keeps things alive. Many times these campaigns end up cooling down until they are abandoned. And the solo rpg is quite like writing a book.

[@felixecho]

This is what I like about your stuff, Seth. You treat your audience more like peers, lots of other KZbin DMs seem to want to be authorities.

[@jasonshortt7]

Man, I'm bum'd that Kevin isn't having as much fun as he can be. I really feel Kevin has added so much to this channel, right from the start. We need more Kevin.

[@ennuideblase7888]

I'll do whatever I can.

[@LordVader1094]

I was not prepared for a new character especially with such a magnificent beard and Patrick Warburton voice

[@roberthill5805]

Been playing for about 15ish years and I have had this happen in my game and there have and haven't been legit points to their complaints. It tends to be easiest for them to air the complaints to you to have it laid out then have them do the same with the players at issue. Most of my groups now have nearly complete trust in one another to the point where I can edit digital sheets without them worrying of me metagaming or screwing the sheet up, or people can straight up tell each other what's up.

[@duncanmartin3104]

Thanks for discussing this! Always nice to have thought this through prior to an issue coming up so we have an idea of how to steer through it.

[@charlotteschaefers5129]

Amazingly well presented. That’s why you are the content winner, Seth!

[@kazuhirosamadesu5650]

Something similar that happened in my group is, I had a player complain that he couldn't really roleplay because he couldn't get a word in and therefore his he couldn't use his background. It was really difficult to tell him that he just needed to speak up more because no one was talking over him. Hell it was their first campaign so there was tons of silence. Good times

[@RockOfLions]

As GM I find there are times when everyone is very spontaneous with comments and ideas and times when I need to say "Susie, Is that what you're going to do too?" Because she hasn't said a thing the entire time and I want to know that she's on board and engaged

[@Malefic7m]

Thank you, Seth, and I really wish these kind of videos had been available when we where young. On the other hand I find that youngsters today are much better at social and interpersonal dynamics, maybe because we are more involved with them, but I think it's mainly because they have rich access to verbal communication from non-authoritan athority persons, combined with the older generations involvement in hobby-activities, like sport, roleplaying, etc.

[@somagai467]

Ive finally stopped DMing due to my players. One player will antagonize npcs and then complain when the npc calls for guards or tries to defend itself. One player acts like they have nothing better to do and holds up games. One players solution to everything is smashing everything in sight and poopsocking whenever possible. Last player i feel bad for because she is just now getting into tabletop games and is missing out due to the other folks at the table. Maybe i just need a break.

[@larsdahl5528]

I think you need to use your "How to end a campaign gracefully" skill. Then start a new campaign, with two semi-new concepts: (1) Leave the three first players behind, and find some new players, to replace them, who match your last player. (2) Pick a more role-play-focused RPG system. I mean: You have gathered some "How not to do" knowledge. Now try again while avoiding those pitfalls.

[@1217BC]

I love that Kevin sounds like Patrick Warburton! Hope to see more of him in future

[@johnkim6445]

Great video. Thank you for taking this on and I think your advice is spot on. Also, I like that you threw in that aspect that a GM is not some sort of authority figure over the players outside of the context of game mechanics -- but in fact is their peer. This should be common sense, but I think some GMs get a bit carried away, which can lead into socially destructive territory. It is tough though. I do recall one incident a couple years back where a player approached me to complain about another player (both were relatively new players to my rotating campaign game) and joined at the same time. At first, they got along fine and they seemed to be almost a team within the team, so I was surprised when one of them later approached me about issues they were having with the other player. I felt that it was his responsibility to approach the other player and work it out and suggested that he do so by just explaining his feelings. But not all players are confident enough to do that. The complaining player said he would do so and I didn't hear anything more about it; so assumed it had been worked out. I'm not sure if the complaining player ever did, but eventually that player just up and quit a few months later. And several months after that, I finally ended up removing the other player in question -- the very first time that I had ever done this in decades of gaming. In hindsight, I felt that I should have interceded, not as an authority figure, by as a facilitator, perhaps by scheduling an airing out session prior to that session's game, not calling anyone out in particular, but just letting anyone bring out any grievances, thoughts, suggestions, or ideas. I do regret not doing anything at the time, because it led to someone having bad enough feelings that they just quit, and it quite likely allowed the others player's negative tendencies to go unchecked and escalate to the point where he had to go. One can never be certain, but had I interceded by just facilitating a group session, it might have changed that outcome for both. Hindsight is 20/20 but on retrospect, I felt I could have done better; so lesson learned.

[@Pile_of_carbon]

Set is so freaking good at dialogue between his personas I sometimes forget it's all the same dude.

[@KageRyuu6]

"Seriously who the hell is Kevin?" That is the question is it not? And are we not all Kevin at some point in time? Also, "mostly useless treasure" is by far the worst, if all you find is wizard stuff and you don't even have one, feels bad. That's why I prefer "dungeon shops", rarely a literal shop mind you but being able to exchange freshly acquired gold for useful goods helps reduce unwanted and unused gear.

[@samuelbroad11]

how have you run a dungeon shop? I'm thinking a Tinker (aka Parick rothfus) type itinerant , known and protected by cultural standards, a semi-fey type folklore npc.

[@zsheets7483]

Kevin, being played by Kronk, is somehow the most forgettable one in the cast.

[@owenf5222]

Most 'RPG group issues' really have nothing to do with RPGs. They're just normal social issues that happen to be occurring within the context of an RPG group. Plenty of people make the mistake of trying to use the game to solve problems that need to be dealt with on the social level, not the game level and this is a good example of that. (getting the DM involved in a dispute he had nothing to do with because he's 'in charge' in the game) Whenever some kind of drama starts emerging in your RPG group, it's a good idea to take a step back and see if this is a game problem that needs a game solution, or an interpersonal problem that needs to be solved without mixing it up with the game. 90% of the time, it's the latter.

[@FlutesLoot]

I felt this one in my soul. I've experienced players getting mad at me for refusing to address their problems with other players.

[@gendor5199]

The Kevin bit definitely got me smiling, that was a turn I did not expect and it was great! I do also like the video, it certainly brings up good points and I can see myself a bit in these roles. Whenever I usually have a problem I tend to try to reach out to people I feel most comfortable with to first establish "Is this just me or..." and if it ends up being just me, then I take it from there, either take it further or I just leave the group like Kevin if everyone else is enjoying it the way it is.

[@avollant]

I hope we’ll see Kevin again… he could be the Kenny (South Park) of this group.

[@magma1lord]

Hey Seth, love the video. Do you have any advice on removing people from your group. I had to remove two players because of many reasons. And it always feels as if I'm the most terrible person in the world. I have taken the approach of fully listing my reasons for why. I did discuss it with the others in the group beforehand how I felt.

[@SSkorkowsky]

I feel ya. Booting a player, especially a long-time player or a friend, kills me. This entire channel came about due to me processing my feelings after booting a long-time (9 years) player and good friend (The original RPG Social Contract was the video that started all of this, and that was from me organizing my thoughts on why that player needed to go). I've booted a few players over the years. Some I handled well. Others I handled terribly (like, I could have written the book on what not to do.). The thing is, I can't tell you how to do it because every relationship is different and no single thing is best for every situation. But I can say that you need to get it over with. If you're wanting to preserve the friendship you should do face-to-face (unless they have said they want an email so they can process their thoughts, which I've had a player request before when concerning criticisms). It's often best to talk about it and see what went wrong. Sometimes you can learn something you also need to improve on in the future. Simply waiting and hoping they'll get the hint and leave on their own never goes well (Believe me, I've tried). You run the risk of other players leaving before the problem player does. If you're unhappy, then chances are that other players are unhappy. It could be that your ability to run the game is suffering because of the problem player. You did the best thing by talking with the rest of the group first. Often other players feel the same way, and that can help take the sting out because you know that booting a player is best for everyone in the remaining group. Also it's good to have the whole group united on why it happened. I, the GM, booting a player is one thing. We, the table, booting a player is different. It's much easier if you know the rest of the group supports you. Of course, if there's a pretty obvious reason why you booted them, like they threw a temper tantrum or some dramatic scene, then it's probably pretty clear to all that the player isn't returning before you announce it. If it's a death of a thousand cuts where there's not explosive moment, but an endless list of things that is making you and the other players miserable, then the booted player might not be expecting it. It might just be that you have a conflict of personalities or what you want in gaming doesn't mesh. Very often this has been discussed with them before. But once the decision to boot them has been made, the time for appeals or argument is over. You don't need to debate them. You don't need to argue it. Simply state that it's not working and why. You probably don't need to list every single thing, just the highlights and that the result is that you are unable to play with them. Much easier said than done. I know. Hopefully your games improve now that the 2 players are gone.

[@magma1lord]

@@SSkorkowsky Thank you for your reply. This gave a lot of insight. and made me feel a lot better.

[@goadfang]

Dude, I swear you're psychic. Thanks, this is the video I needed right now.

[@originaluddite]

Determining if someone is just venting is one of the first things to do, in many aspects of life, not just gaming. It can be tricky however, since a lot of people who are venting, aren't always ready do admit that's all it is.

[@Erdnase23]

So what do you do, as GM, if the other player(s) ignore the person who has voiced their concerns directly to them?

[@SSkorkowsky]

Case-by-case, depending on factors such as what the bad behavior is and the personalities of the person(s) involved, but the GM, and possibly the upset player or even the rest of the group, should discuss it with them. This might be between sessions, an email, phone call, one-on-one or all together as a group (again, all case-by-case). Maybe they continued the bad behavior because they didn't understand it is an actual problem. Maybe they thought they fixed it but didn't. Maybe they're a jerk. Time to find out. But if a behavior issue has been discussed, yet continues, then it needs revisiting, and in a way that might work where the first attempt failed. Something has to change. Doing nothing mostly ensures that the games start becoming less fun for one or more players until people drop out or the whole group falls apart.

[@B00Radl33]

It took me until the last minute, but I figured it out! Another accent from venture bros!!!! 😁😁😁

[@SSkorkowsky]

Go Team Venture.

[@penguinpanda00]

Ahahahah great Patrick Warburton impression

[@derekburge5294]

Yes, goddammit, yes! The GM isn't some sort of babysitter or therapist or social arbitrator!

[@richmcgee434]

That is exactly what many people think GMs are when they drop off their terrible, terrible children for D&D organized play nights at the FLGS.