Seven Valley Railway. 926 Repton, struggling to leave Bridgenorth ,23rd September 2017

[@robjacobs5199]

am amazed how these steam trains can be kept in such immaculate condition after all these years. It goes to show how much dedication is put into it. Congratulations to all involved.

[@mickcarson8504]

Yep. And then they destroy them from overloading the old girls to the bones.

[@hornbytrainsets]

@@mickcarson8504 Yeah but their jobs were a lot more demanding when they were in revenue service. These heritage runs are probably nothing, all slow and sedate

[@cr10001]

@@mickcarson8504 That's not overload, it's lack of adhesion. Everything slips at that spot.

[@michaelwebber8631]

I was at Bridgnorth a few weeks ago where the drivers seemed to have the drain cocks open forever. So much so one couldn't see the engine leave the station, there was just a huge cloud of steam. The railway tracks are completely dripping with cylinder oil. I was always taught to open them, then shut them. Open for too long & the lubricating cylinder oil is jet washed out of the cylinders. Not good for lubrication, & certainly no good for traction on the rails.

[@jennieanderson971]

I always loved trains when I was little... I listened to them chugging along in the night 🚂 They always had such a sad , yet comforting sound. It always amazed me at just how long I could hear them running on through the night ,still love that “train song “ in the night...🌜

[@bigkiwimike]

She certainly stopped on dead centre. Sometimes even the best engines will do this. Look at the position of the driving wheels before she moved. Because the video stops too soon, we can’t see how big the train is, but the engine is not slipping excessively. The driver is just letting her walk out of the station at the speed she wants to.

[@robertdblack7179]

Thats fabulous control. I've seen Repton spin alot and in sectacular style too. Great filming too!

[@philclarke3203]

Thanks

[@markturner4219]

It is obvious that the driver has not been able to fully release the train brake for some reason. I have watched Repton's class mate Cheltenham here on the Watercress line pull away smoothly and accelerate quickly on an uphill gradient without a hint of slipping pretty much every time. These loco's were Europe's most powerful 4-4-0's and the only UK 4-4-0 class with a class 5 power classification.

[@dankerthanclanker]

There's also an incline on the way out of Bridgnorth, too.

[@iankemp1131]

@@dankerthanclanker Watercress line is 1 in 80 and 1 in 60!

[@cr10001]

This particular spot seems to be extremely slippery, just search 'Bridgnorth - slipping'. There are videos of West Countries, and a King, slipping on starting here, and a Manor slipping its way all round the yard.

[@pjd7325]

The climb out of Bridgnorth station is 1in100. The situation was the locomotive had stuck in top dead centre. To correct it the driver set back slightly then carried on. Damp rails caused by the steam from the drain cocks made it a slippery departure. Sanders were turned on and it gained traction.

[@nigelterry9299]

Looks like the driver has found the dead spot. Only solution is to back up and have another go. The track is always oily here and the Schools is enormously powerful for a 4-4-0. Look how she strides away on clean rails.

[@CullenRick]

Good skills from that driver. Proper control of a light loco and heavy train.

[@rogercantwell3622]

That's a pretty good piece of driving. It's one of the hardest engines to start. Factor of adhesion below 4, so struggles on anything other than a clean dry rail.

[@richarddavis7778]

I know nothing about steam locomotives but that seems to be a very credible expert opinion. Contrast it with a singularly nasty comment by an earlier reviewer who is presumably an armchair expert. It seems to me that enthusiasts devote many hours to restoring and operating these beautiful machines for our pleasure and deserve our unqualified respect and gratitude.

[@984francis]

@@richarddavis7778 YES! Well said that man.

[@markturner4219]

Richard Davis I am afraid your confidence is misplaced. Mr Cantwell's comment is bollocks. The reason why the loco is struggling to start is that the train brakes are binding having not been fully released by the vacuum brake apparatus. These locos were very sure footed and designed specifically to work on the steeply graded Hastings line. They were the only 4-4-0's to have a class 5 power rating.

[@Rosie6857]

There is nothing wrong with Roger Cantwell's remarks - they are true and appropriate. You say the brakes are binding but there is no evidence of that whatsoever. The reason the loco appeared unable to move was because the visible crank was nearly on rear dead centre. If you look carefully you will see that it is just *behind* dead centre yet steam is issuing from the leaky rear cylinder gland showing that the regulator is open but the force is actually opposing forward motion. This is due to the "lead" on the valves whereby the inlet opens a little before dead centre to provide a cushioning effect when running. All that is necessary to do is to set back a short distance and have another go, which is what the driver eventually did. This sort of thing seems more of a problem with 3-cyl locos than with 2-cyl ones, strangely, and has happened many time both in preservation and in the steam era. The slipping is another matter entirely and these are slippy engines with only 42 tons on the driving wheels out of a total of 67 tons. You have to be delicate with the regulator - you can't just yank it full open from the off as I have seen with lesser 4-4-0's (L, D1, E1) on the Oxted line.

[@iankemp1131]

@@Rosie6857 Fair points, yet the Schools never had a reputation for slipping when they handled 12 coaches on the Bournemouth Belle, expresses over the hilly Portsmouth and Hastings lines, or Kent Coast expresses in their later years where Bricklayers Arms drivers often preferred them to Bulleid Pacifics. A 4-4-0, having no trailing axle, should still be quite surefooted on starting.

[@Kolomna5D49]

Perhaps a bit unfortunate needing to back up a little, but the wheel slip seems controlled - no violent lurching. Bridgnorth is often tricky to get away from.

[@richierex]

he didnt use the sanders until 3 minutes. Schools Class worked brilliantly at NYMR and its twisty and hilly, the last place they were designed for

[@nigelmitchell351]

A beautiful engine, the aesthetics of which are spoilt only by its modified tender. In my humble opinion.

[@edwinholland6149]

No struggle dead centre, hence setting back then nicely controlled start. Schools were light footed due to their relatively low axle loadings but very powerful for their size and great performers once rolling.

[@47606odin]

how do you get stuck in 'dead centre' on a 3 cylinder loco?

[@markturner4219]

Schools class has a very high axle loading. Higher than all the GWR 4-6-0's except the Kings, and massively higher than the BB/WC pacifics. It is obvious that the driver has not been able to fully release the train brake for some reason. I have watched Repton's class mate Cheltenham here on the Watercress line pull away smoothly and accelerate quickly on an uphill gradient without a hint of slipping pretty much every time. These loco's were Europe's most powerful 4-4-0's and the only UK 4-4-0 class with a class 5 power classification.

[@chrisberry1074]

Was there myself and really enjoyed the event. Excellent video

[@philclarke3203]

Thanks Chris

[@Edyth_Hedd]

I know the engine crew thinks the slippage reflects badly on their skill, but it really is fun to watch. Such a pretty little locomotive!

[@philclarke3203]

Yes it is fun to watch and willing it on

[@RockyRailroadProductions_B0SS]

No video of a 4-4-0 has ever made me this anxious before. Beautiful shot though!

[@kellyashfordtrains2642]

City of Truro struggled to get out of Bridgnorth in 1991, yet she moved straight away. Severn Valley Railway Magic is what I would call it.

[@9005067]

a beautiful loco in excellent shape

[@nicko7054]

Great video. I was there filming the same departure . I think maybe a glimpse of me around 3.17

[@philclarke3203]

Thanks Nick

[@geoffmoore4454]

My late uncle drove that engine when he was at southern region

[@PhilPage227]

Excellent video Phil, looking forward to seeing it at Bury.

[@geoffmorris1769]

Saw it this morning with City of Wells and Union of South Africa. Fantastic.

[@IroncladInSteam4007]

Lest we forget this is the most powerful 4-4-0 class in Britain and it’s still struggling

[@HenrysAdventures]

Great video Phil.

[@philclarke3203]

@@HenrysAdventures thanks Henry 👍

[@darekstar]

Edward: "Iv done it, were off! Iv done it, Were off!"

[@philclarke3203]

And so he did ,in the end

[@ronrandall8783]

It was fine once the driver found how to work the sanders.

[@c2757]

Severn Valley Railway. Phil Clarke, struggling to spell Bridgnorth ,23rd September 2017, (Sorry - couldn't resist).

[@philclarke3203]

Haha. Thanks, wish I had a pound for every time I have been corrected! It's one of those words I can never remember which is right spelling :-)

[@Stefan_Boerjesson]

That driver knew the job as the wheel slip was really soft, controlled. Well done.

[@philclarke3203]

Definitely 👍

[@jonsmith4669]

Thats what I call a Choo Choo, clean lines, immaculate and powerful, a work of art.

[@MaxxD86]

That’s the same loco that went to the USA hence why it has a higher tender than the others. Love that wheel slip

[@timratnett4243]

It was not 926 struggling , it was the driver. The schools were built to work over the Hastings line. They had to start away from numerous steep locations.

[@MK.5198]

loathe to call that a struggle. Kept good control of it the whole time.

[@Hugofreddie]

These engines were built for fast work on light lines . So were prone to slippage but once they got moving were amazing

[@markturner4219]

No they weren't They have one of the highest axle loadings in the history of UK steam. They were built as 4-4-0's due to short turntables on the Hastings route for which they originally designed. Bullied light pacifics were built for working light lines.

[@Hugofreddie]

@@markturner4219 indeed perhaps I should have worded it as lines with restrictions as the hastings line which had a tight loading guage as well as short turntables hence the round topped firebox instead of the belplair planned.They were renowned from new as "needing careful handling when starting " (they slip)Eastleighs words not mine as with an axle load of 21 tonnes they were extremely powerful and were the only 4-4-0 to be rated to 5p

[@charliemoir5591]

Same thing happened 363 days earlier than this with flying Scotsman...

[@steventhornton4716]

Would the wheel slip not indicate that theres too much weight behind the loco I'm sure the Renton used to pull much shorter trains?!

[@welsh_Witch]

@@steventhornton4716 no wheelsip is down to multiple factors like weather, loco condition and weight of the train

[@steventhornton4716]

But how did it explode like that over pressure in the boiler or something?

[@vishwajitpawar4076]

How much coal is required to overcome 1,10,100,1000miles? If diesel burner is provided to run steam engine, then how much diesel is required for same distance?pl inform. Thanks.

[@tracynation239]

1 pound of coal + 1 gallon of water will move 1 ton of freight 1 mile.(Ton miles). ♡ T.E.N.

[@Rosie6857]

A typical figure for an express steam-era train is about 35 lb per mile though it could be more if the route is a bit mountainous or the coal is poor stuff. An oil-fired steam loco doesn't use diesel, it uses thick black bottom-of-the- barrel stuff sometimes known as Bunker oil. The amount used is about three-quarters of the weight of coal.

[@paulnash7630]

Repton looks in amazing condition Phil, got there eventually. .

[@hornbytrainsets]

Why did it have to roll back at the beginning? I thought the crank pins were offset by ninety degrees to ensure that wouldn't be necessary?

[@highdownmartin]

120 degrees

[@haroldpearson6025]

Yes but it's still possible to have one crank on dead center and there will not be enough power to take it over DC. The driver will then "set back" taking up the free slack in the couplings.

[@johndavies5826]

I don't understand why it took the driver so long to realise he needed to use the sanders.

[@ldb281]

not surprised with that load on, beginning to feel for the old girl.

[@VulcanBomberxm655]

Theres a few videos of a few engines struggling out of Bridgenorth, i think it's a up hill on a bend departure, which is never good.

[@tracynation239]

Premium Video, Great Loco. ♡ T.E.N.

[@e-mananimates2274]

Beautiful! An engine fit for Sodor! The livery and shape are not unlike Henry's!

[@thestolenmhrproperty2102]

Lazerjet fooled me!!!!!! 😡😡😡 It doesn't sound like breathing at all!!!!!!! 😡😡😡😡😡😡😡😡😡😡😡😡😡😡😡

[@errolkim1334]

Saw it in sheen the other night

[@mikesanders5433]

Great vid. Thanks!

[@smokey32323]

Excellent throttle control!!!!!!!!

[@ivortomana]

Very nice steam locomotive !

[@will_levitt926]

I agree, Repton is a beauty

[@johnjephcote7636]

operate the sanders as you back the engine onto its train....

[@SimonTog]

Very good Phil :)

[@philclarke3203]

Thanks Simon

[@terryhutchinson6503]

Nice bit of driving that.

[@andrewheale4738]

Passengers had to many cream teas.

[@markdullaghan847]

Would experienced drivers back in the day struggle like this ?

[@robertwilloughby8050]

It could catch out even experienced drivers - the Schools were fantastic machines, but slipping was their vice, even giants like Driver Hooker (more famous with his work with Merchant Navy and West Country/Battle of Britain pacifics) could be made to look foolish at times.

[@sydneymartin6941]

@@robertwilloughby8050 Hi Not the experienced drivers No They would make sure they operated the sand before stopping there so they would be standing on sand and thus prevent slipping

[@andrewmedina]

*Severn not Seven!

[@F1lbertf0x]

And there should be no 'E' in Bridgnorth either.

[@TrainsBoatsPlanes]

Great video

[@dvddale111]

Severn Valley, isn't it?

[@will_levitt926]

Yup

[@daro2262]

Oil the tracks & a lot more steel to how much it will before the thing is on it's way to the moon. The crew can always jump ship before she goes up

[@mattseymour8637]

They are prone to slipping and light on their wheels. What was the reason though?

[@1701_FyldeFlyer]

Crap driver that's all.

[@jma7930]

Due to the large driving wheels it means it does not have much weight on them meaning it slips easier

[@richierex]

@@jma7930 it has the same weight on the wheels, no matter what the size. big wheels affect the "gearing"

[@Rosie6857]

They have only two driving axles with a combined weight of 42 tons on them which is rather low for a loco of their power. A 4-6-0 of the same power would have typically 56 tons so it would be less prone to slipping.

[@richardgrant5105]

Good driver, stop the maniac fireman putting more coal on , though !

[@djmpvae27091978]

A 4-4-0 is an American Wild West locomotive ( U.P.R.R. & C.P.R.R. )

[@977chrisv]

@Tabourba THe wheel arrangement is called "American" like "Pacific"" Mikado " etc. Nothing to do with country of manufacture

[@paullangford8179]

Why aren't they using sand at the beginning? It seems to be OK later on.

[@ScaniaVabis580]

It was stopped dead centre so starting off again was never going to be straightforward, he still should have used the sanders after he managed to roll it back

[@47606odin]

@@ScaniaVabis580 you can't stop dead centre on a 3 cylinder loco

[@ScaniaVabis580]

@@47606odin well it appears dead centre, two cylinders of which are pretty much useless... The third cylinder (not dead center) would not have been able to move the loco and train combined

[@47606odin]

@@ScaniaVabis580 really? on a standard 3 cylinder loco such as this, with one piston at the limit of its stroke, the other 2 are still under power. the cylinders are 120 degrees apart, so always at least 2 cylinders pushing. the issue will be dead weight from a standing start combined with drag on the wheels due to curvature and gradient. squeeze the coaches together, then effectively lift one at a time which is what the driver did. he done an excellent job. could have just opened the regulator more and spun the wheels i suppose

[@ScaniaVabis580]

@@47606odin i have known sir keith park and scotty do exactly the same as this, both are 3 cylinder Locomotives.

[@de-de4401]

Ale cudny parowóz!

[@wernerdanler2742]

Why is he venting all that steam before trying to get going?

[@RobertdMacGregor]

Cylinder Cocks, ejects condensed steam/water from the cylinders to prevent hydraulic damage to the cylinders

[@haroldpearson6025]

​@@RobertdMacGregor Also the driver can use the drain cocks to change the torque aspects of the way the power is delivered to the wheels.

[@raisagorbachov]

Wheel spin says the driver needed to apply sand

[@grayman999]

Repton losing her feet again a regular event on the Bank up to Gothland NYMR!

[@tomhouseman9483]

only when driven wrong

[@Gary-cvr23]

The group of voulnteers im with at the nymr call her slippy repton beacuse shes known for slipping even on flat track or light engine

[@paulcaswell2813]

Bridgnorth is hardly 4-4-0 territory to be honest!

[@cr10001]

I'd love to know how many carriages she was hauling.

[@railfreightdrivergallagherGBRf]

8

[@cr10001]

@@railfreightdrivergallagherGBRf Thanks! Eight is a pretty good load in that location, it seems to be a notorious spot for slipping.

[@railfreightdrivergallagherGBRf]

@@cr10001 1 in 66 from the platform end. Can be tricky yes.

[@cr10001]

@@railfreightdrivergallagherGBRf Thanks again! That's useful information. I in 66 is, again, a quite stiff gradient to start on, though it isn't visually obvious in the videos.

[@pradipkarmakar4829]

Which country

[@philclarke3203]

England, UK

[@pradipkarmakar4829]

@@philclarke3203 , I am indian but I love England and English culture

[@1701_FyldeFlyer]

These must be the drivers from the NYMR because they do exactly the same and have it struggling out of Grosmont.

[@bobcornford3637]

No sanding.... no traction.... simple.

[@RobertdMacGregor]

stopped dead center. traction had nout to do with it

[@enquirer1956]

Wasnt this engine overhauls not that long ago? It cannot pull more than 7 coaches unaided. On the NYMR it couldnt get out of Grosmont a few times and needed a shove from another loco. Last time it stalled just over the crossing. Very funny to watch but with all the wheelslip, you'd expect the driver to release some sand!

[@AndreiTupolev]

Nothing is allowed more than seven coaches unaided on the NYMR, except perhaps Tornado which might be allowed eight. Anyway, Tornado made a pretty slippy departure from there in the recent gala, it's a very tricky station to get away from with the gradient and the curve.

[@dominiquedescottes8314]

C'est avec nostalgie que je regarde cette vidéo A savoir que l'Angleterre et La Belgique ont étés des precusseur,des innovateurs,et qu'aujourd'hui ils sont par mis les moins valeureux....

[@popcorncolonel726]

Come ooonnn! Come oonn! Come on! Come on! Come on! We’re going to town! We’re going to town! We’re going to town

[@AndreiTupolev]

I wonder if that was the same driver as on Taw Valley here,who had exactly the same issue? kzbin.info/www/bejne/n3zdg4Goea1od7c

[@cr10001]

'Everybody' has that issue at this spot, apparently. Even a 'King' kzbin.info/www/bejne/npDLhIRvf8R2ers with just eight on. Taw Valley in that video had ten on - heavy load.

[@ZalMoxis]

4-4-0 that's a big load for a little engine....

[@paulcaswell2813]

Little in physical size only. The 'Schools' packed a heck of a punch in actual fact!

[@matmotor7572]

Its Thomas..... Howdy, nice meeting you love.

[@ianjones4116]

Driver to Fireman ' do you think anyone noticed'? Lol. Driver ' we are low on steam pressure' Fireman replies ' we weren't, ya bloody idiot, you just wasted it all, trying to go backwards with brake on' lol Drive ' knew we should have took the Western ' (Diesel) Nice vid Pete. Shows it's not as easy as it looks, driving. My Dad would have howled at that . Take care mate . 👍😎🐢

[@philclarke3203]

Great 'conversation' Ian! thanks

[@tunefultonyjohnson4100]

Is this what's called "letting off steam...." ?? :)

[@sretensaric4426]

Ok super, super...

[@brianpacos4072]

Think of how much less tractive force thete would be without that massive guy in the cab...

[@struck2soon]

Forgot the 'L' plates?

[@1701_FyldeFlyer]

They never use sand for some reason.

[@984francis]

It was stuck so he set back. Correct thing to do. He controlled the slipping beautifully. What's your point?

[@Bigaid]

he did towards the end of the video

[@jma7930]

@@1701_FyldeFlyer actually what he did is correct as other have said. putting san down can cause drag on the coaches

[@grahammoizer4388]

Known on the Moors railway as 'RECTUM'

[@grahammoizer4388]

@@will_levitt926 Yes. I know.

[@pasoundman]

Severn Valley rather than Seven of course. Nice engine.

[@ernestoguevara8930]

Forgot where the sander lever was! sorry. And most of the other important controls!

[@frankanddanasnyder3272]

Needs more traction wheels..

[@markturner4219]

No - the driver just needs to release the train brake fully. ;-)

[@robertotrezza8077]

Capricho

[@bonkeydollocks1879]

No wonder diesels took over

[@davidantoniocamposbarros7528]

Wrong

[@bonkeydollocks1879]

@@davidantoniocamposbarros7528 in your opinion maybe

[@mattyrallye]

Dead centre I'd say.

[@billcobbett9259]

but with cranks spaced at 90° or more one side will always be able to push or pull, surely?

[@47606odin]

@@billcobbett9259 3 cylinders not two

[@adamwoodward2003]

Dead centre

[@47606odin]

not on a 3 cylinder loco

[@ericc4438]

be a good time for a little sand

[@v8pilot]

If the fat guy stood on the engine's footplate instead of on the tender, the engine would have enough grip to get started.

[@nymrfootage]

The so called 'fat guy' is the guy who overhauled the loco and if you ever get the opportunity to meet him, you'll find he ain't so fat!

[@jonsnell4751]

Pity about the driver!

[@mickcarson8504]

Doesn't that indicate to you that the train has too many overloaded cars, or is it the first time the driver/s have experienced this? Overloaded trains struggles the locomotives towards an early death, and that also means early replacement of both locomotive components, worn out wheels and tracks. Dont they know this? And they call themselves engineers? LMAO! 🤣

[@garthhentley8870]

What utter drivel.

[@ianjeffery6744]

What a miserable display of bad driving and firing. These engines used to pull out of Tonbridge, from a standing start at the platform, and get up the bank to High Brooms with no trouble at all (and a full head of steam). The Schools were not prone to slipping, though Bulleid's Pacifics, alas, were!

[@AndreiTupolev]

Probably one of the SVR's drivers who'd probably never set foot on one before, you have to remember that they don't have the chance for long periods of familiarisation if they arrive a day or two before

[@Steve14ps]

I assume you have fired and driven locos yourself

[@ScaniaVabis580]

It was stopped dead centre so starting off again was never going to be straightforward, he still should have used the sanders after he managed to roll it back

[@richardgrant5105]

How the hell can it be a bad driver if the wheels are slipping on the rail ??

[@vaneiderosendo9381]

ian jeffery

[@ces4399]

Big Boy nor Challenger wouldn't do that. Those English twins are wimpy.

[@markwaldron1679]

They're not twins there 4 cylinder locomotives. No disrespect but they look so much nicer

[@catman351]

Mark Waldron Beauty contests don’t move freight.

[@dankerthanclanker]

"An engine designed to move a shitzillion tons of freight would have started the train easier" No shit, Sherlock. Now put it on a fast stop start service.