Shin Megami Tensei V: Vengeance is Special

[@Tony4You]

Join the discord: discord.gg/UTUg98gAaW Leave any thoughts and suggestions for future vids here!

[@nicholasnajibi3082]

You said you played video games for the story and the characters…. That is such a problem and makes you really bad for the sport as holding story in video games as a point of contention to a score is fucking wrong. There are no good stories in video games. I’ve been a gamer for over 40 years… so I’m not hating. It’s just the truth through all my experience. if you really think that the writing in video game stories is high tier, then I don’t know how to help you. You won’t be able to yourself. Imagine giving a video game a bad score because of its story and not its gameplay. 😂😂😂😂

[@JaredConnell]

​@nicholasnajibi3082 there are plenty of games with great stories and characters. I don't care how good the gameplay is, if the story is boring and the characters feel fake then I don't care to finish it.

[@cynicalkiwi9366]

Yoko's comment on vehicles elevated this game to another level

[@benkai343434]

It's like I'd really walked into an r/fuckcars spergfit. Truly she's the most accurate Chaos rep we've had in a long, long time.

[@RollingBobbyJones]

Its not only that, the fact that she is usually very cold on human life then cars get her heated is hilarious

[@valletas]

@@cynicalkiwi9366 and when you try to call out her argument for being dumb she acts like you are the one being an asshole

[@nr2676]

This is probably the best Atlus rerelease, because actually FIXED most of problems of original game.

[@UltimateRex95]

Persona 3 FES and Reload,Persona 4 Golden,and Persona 5 Royal

[@TerminaBroTheFirst]

​@@UltimateRex95 Aw hell nah dude. P4G made the game way too easy with the shuffle time mechanic. Don't know about the rest thougj

[@UltimateRex95]

@@TerminaBroTheFirstIts not about how easy the game is its about the new stuff that was added in their re-release of games P4G and P5R got a lot of stuff that makes people prefer those more than the original and if the game feels too easy for you then you can always up the difficulty to you style

[@UltimateRex95]

@@TerminaBroTheFirst I don’t have a lot to say about P3 FES since I haven’t played that version

[@UltimateRex95]

@@TerminaBroTheFirst But Persona 3 definitely has the most Atlus re-releases first P3 FES,then Portable,then Portable on PS4(I would’ve preferred FES) then Reload

[@ChloeKatiePuppy]

Vengeance is officially one of my favorite games. I LOVED it.

[@DragonKingX78]

I have been enjoying the game, on my 4th play through.

[@sniggelbob]

One thing that bugged me a lot was that there are a lot of subtle differences between this game and the original and trying to find information on those differences has been a nightmare with the new way Google works. But that's not the games fault, the game is great. Google sucks though

[@ninonysoft6865]

Dude same. I was trying to google the Aogami locations for Vengence and kept getting hit with the OG locations.

[@corey2232]

Wdym? What changed with Google that made it so difficult to find info?

[@ninonysoft6865]

@@corey2232 its just google being bad. I literally type vengence, do the thing where i put +vengeance and it still shows me og smt5

[@sniggelbob]

@@corey2232 First you get ai generated info that's often wrong, especially with the confusion between the two games. Then all the sponsored responses that are only tangentially related, and then you can start trying to find a real answer.

[@charleschavira3414]

Google search sucks so bad now is there a good alternative to actually searching things?

[@somenteapenasberaldo]

Honestly I agree with everything in the video, and one thing I'd like to say was a major step-forward in accessibility in SMT VV that almost no one talked about (besides the multiplatform release) were the new languages added in the release English isn't my mother tongue but by now I am proficient or at least enough to go by, my little brother on the other hand isn't. Still, he loves these types of games, I've even played the entirety of the original Persona 4 with him translating everything he didn't fully comprehend. With the release of P3R and SMT VV with support for portuguese, he honest to god said "Now I can play without needing your help" and I've never felt that happy It's a small thing in the end but if it helps more people be able to play I think it deserves merit

[@yujihori]

Yeah man, and honestly the translation fucking slaps, I laughed hard reading some of the dialogues and messages on persona 3 reload, they really tried to localize it as best as possible

[@corey2232]

If this was Elden Ring, people would insult anyone asking for more accessibility & tell your brother to git gud at English 😅

[@Fermin-hw5pd]

They also translated the UI, at least on my language, because in the og everything outside the text was left in english, pretty good

[@Skallva]

It still feels so odd to be playing a jRPG in my native language. Really glad that Vengeance confirmed this is now the norm, after P3R being the first instance of a PL localisation, and I'm really hoping it sets a precedent for other companies that maybe there is a market worth paying attention to. And also other regions! The more language barriers get broken, the better!

[@SirVakari]

@@Skallva Siemka. Chcesz wiedzieć, gdzie znaleźć Mimanów?

[@kazuMT]

THEY FINALLY DID IT! THEY MADE THE STORY PASSABLE! LETS FUCKING GOOOO

[@alsaiduq4363]

Yuzuru is a character 🎉

[@rudysmith1552]

It works for the story they’re telling I will never buy these games for the story.

[@Tony4You]

No wonder they took the original off the store front.

[@Fermin-hw5pd]

​@@alsaiduq4363Miyazu is a character 🎉

[@therealjaystone2344]

The story still suck but better

[@hisdudeness1835]

What I love even more is that Vengeance retroactively improves Canon of Creation as well. While the story is unchanged in that one, the new side quests, QoL and the demon haunt are there. And if you play CoC after playing Vengeance you have the added character development and info in mind. That makes the development of the CoC story better. CoV is definitely the better story but with both canons being part of the game everything just feels more fleshed out and complete.

[@cloverraven]

Vengeance first really worked for me

[@Frank_Erz]

Vengeance makes SMTV no longer feel incomplete.

[@Mangk89]

Finally a shin megami tensei with a soul

[@goobertgum]

i can remember the characters names now

[@BigKlingy]

Me too.

[@kaiserwave5977]

Oh lord in heaven hear my prayers and answer!!! 🙏

[@3redstreeter256]

🗣️🗣️ 🔥🔥

[@xetsuma]

He's lamentin', grealty.

[@klaus.sfc01official30]

Memestema vengance

[@sarinman5315]

What a great quote

[@abhigyanpal3695]

You referring to YHVH?

[@franciscor390]

After reading the issues the dev team had creating SMTV this improvement makes sense. I remember reading that the dev team had never worked with the Unreal Engine 4 and on the top of that many had to learn it alone in their homes during covid. And the main coding of Unreal Engine is in English on the top of that. So development of this entry really suffered, they basically had to release an unfinished product.

[@bubbletea_]

i do think the nocturne endings meant a bit more than smt v's original endings because in nocturne, you got to hear each character's departing words and hopes for the world you're creating and even have their own music (plus you actually talked to these characters). vengeance was better than i was expecting. good game.

[@therealjaystone2344]

3’s chaos ending was the reason why it became canon

[@FreakGeSt]

@@therealjaystone2344 *True Demon ending

[@Pystoria]

"I'm not difficult to please, but I am difficult to impress, and I was very impressed by this game" are exactly my thoughts as well!

[@gottesurteil3201]

I'm usually a lawfig but I love Yoko, best chaos route character since Walter.

[@ltb1345]

Hoy!

[@AntonioLucas91]

ah yes, a man of culture as well

[@stevenolson3977]

Speaking of Demon Haunt dialogue, I received a quest from Clotho by talking to her in the haunt. I wonder what other demons might give quests. The haunt adds a ton of flavor and is another chance to farm essences.

[@gottesurteil3201]

Idunn gives you one too.

[@Delmworks]

I think Yoshitsune does as well but only in canon of creation

[@gottesurteil3201]

@@Delmworks correct, it is creation only.

[@ricardorunos9782]

Fionn has one too, but it just leads to one of those moon phase minigames. The Fates’ quest gives you an infinite-use spyglass, forgot what Idunn’s gave, and starting Yoshitsune’s kicks off a questline ending with Masakado.

[@gottesurteil3201]

@@ricardorunos9782 Idunn gives you the Thor & Odin dual attack.

[@chaincat33]

my single favourite change about vengeance is the guest characters. Yoko and Tao being there adds actual weight to the events I felt, especially since in the original, Tao's death was supposed to be the motivating factor behind the true ending (at least, I can only assume it was). Vengeance also more or less directly calls out the original true ending in many ways, largely in line with the biggest issues it had. The story isn't the best, I'm not asking it to be, but it's not actively dissonant with itself anymore at least

[@ltb1345]

I'm glad Atlus is sticking to their guns and continuing to counter/challenge the themes of the original game in mainline SMT re-release and direct sequels. That in itself is a core part of the series.

[@Antasma1]

In what way?

[@TheSpaceking12]

"How Nintendo fans feel about rpgs" dude that's just a twitter vocal minority. The second biggest Nintendo series is Pokemon, a turn based rpg. And in japan. RPGs on switch routinely top the charts. Two of the flagship ip of Switch are fire emblem and xenoblade, which have sold quite well and reviewed great on the platform. It is almost mandatory to have a switch port to sell well there, the sole exceptions being the souls games. SMT5 itself did very well on the switch, selling 1.1 million copies. Far out pacing smt4's 600k back on 3ds to be the biggest mainline game.

[@valletas]

Honestly pokemon is kinda like an turn based epg for people who hate the genre Dont get me wrong i love rpgs and i love pokemon in fact if this was a few years back i would have a ethan pfp instead of jack frost because i liked pokemon way more back then But the vast majority of people who play the games dont really touch on any other turn based rpg franchise at least from my personal experience Everyone i met that played the games has pokemon as their sole rpg game

[@Son.Ren.]

I honestly enjoyed smt 5 vengeance more than persona 3 reload

[@McLovin-Chan]

Same. Characters might not be as good, but the gameplay is the best I’ve had in any turn based RPG. Peak

[@MILDMONSTER1234]

Inb4 “persona 3 demake”

[@therealjaystone2344]

Hope smt3 remake wouldn’t be butchered

[@ltb1345]

I haven't even gotten Reload yet. I'm waiting for it to go at least 40% off on Steam. SMTV V, on the other hand, I got literally right when it came out, and don't regret it in the slightest.

[@therealjaystone2344]

@@ltb1345 make that 50% since it happen often

[@Neonlight3934]

1:33 there is 2 reasons for this. In Japan JRPGs traditionally are played on console and the Switch is dominant. Being able to take this game anywhere means most Japanese costumers would basically only be able to play it on the switch anyway. So from their perspective they aren't losing on sales. The second reason is that almost the entire series also was Nintendo exclusive or original. Think about it, every mainline SMT game except Nocturne came out in a Nintendo system and Nocturne only didn't because by their own words they severely overestimated the PS2 power. As a side note, I got the Nintendo Switch of this game to play on the train and transfer bonus and there is a performance jump pretty notizable in that version too. Which means part of it isn't actually the hardware, but optimization which is honestly fuck up thinking about it.

[@frostneedle]

Agreed. I have a Switch, PS5, and PC. While I do agree that PC is the master race, the temptation to constantly upgrade is so intense that it convinced me to switch to console. My lifestyle also does not permit me to sit on the sofa too long to enjoy quality powergaming sessions. In the end, my Switch is the one that is getting the most use out of the three. I'll buy the PS5 version of SMTV someday when it goes on sale.

[@Antasma1]

I don’t understand that PS2 reasoning. Anyway, I had a feeling it would have optimization issues since it was clear the original game was in development hell

[@valletas]

I played both on the switch as well honestly havent noticed any performace differences I think the regular smt 5 already ran pretty well there were some frame drops here and there but its an turn based rpg anyway so it didnt matter

[@SapphireFGC]

Makes me wonder how smt 3 on gc would work. While stronger than ps2, the disc size wouldn't work unless atlus used multi discs. Xbox sounds perfect but Microsoft isn't big in the jp market. Last curious how the game/story will be different if they consider using other consoles. (Different irl smt story's lol)

[@FreirProfile]

"I felt more like a piece of wood given godlike powers and a few questionnaires on what flavor of ice cream i would want the world to eat after i became the god of it" One like for you sire ;)

[@dzigayu4944]

Pleasantly surprised with how much SMT VV improved the game. High hope for how Persona 6 and future Megami Tensei projects will do.

[@alsaiduq4363]

Rare Shin megami tensei V W.

[@Tony4You]

They finally did it

[@GanonAutumn777]

They turned a game i used to be lukewarm about into my second favorite megaten game 🤩🤩🤩

[@yolinhoz1724]

no jokes, the best thing they did was removing the stupid map obstruction thing from the abscesses. makes navigation a LOT more bearable.

[@Fermin-hw5pd]

I personally liked the abscesses before, they bothered you before but now, they are kinda there, I do them because I know I need the miracles, but I bet new players don't see the point sometimes

[@kakizakichannel]

We went from Shin Megami Tensei L to Shin Megami Tensei W

[@100Servings]

Next we get SMT: Full Body, and Tao has a wiener.

[@ltb1345]

@@100Servings Aw hell naw.

[@someclevername8167]

@@ltb1345some people may be into that

[@100Servings]

@@someclevername8167 I like my love interests in video games like I like my sandwich: without a penis on it.

[@dgayle2348]

SMT IV had one of the best environmental atmosphere I've experienced in a game. Felt like Metro series mixed with Pokemon.

[@nr2676]

And Silent Hill

[@UnifiedGod777]

YEAAA A TONY VIDEO! seriously though, I'm glad to hear your opinions on this game.

[@adambowser5783]

Perfect timing with the video Tony! I just finished the game yesterday (got the law ending) and it improves upon the original in every way possible. Easily a Top 3 Megaten game for me!

[@Tony4You]

law for life!

[@Sticky_the_DJ]

Was waiting for your video on this! Yeah Vengeance was amazing. Really fleshed out the story and characters for me. It was nice to get to know the thoughts and struggles of the characters more. Great! Also I felt the "white sandy" was actually SALT since that was a story arc being told as well, so it gave this impression that the large amounts of white sand is actually salt from remnants of the old world people, but that is my head canon. This game was great.

[@zerochill4096]

Probably my favorite change to Vengeance that was inconspicuously left out of this video is how the Aogami essences are now obtainable through special landmarks on the map that reappear over time rather than being relegated to a 1-time loot point that turns into getting found by Demon Negotiators. This small change makes being able to customize your Nahobino build feel so much better as now you don't need to worry about removing certain skills if you ever want to revisit it without issue for whatever reason

[@jeezycreezy4220]

One of the changes I enjoyed was that in the Vengance route, you alignment actually mattered. Law aligned players get locked into Tao's ending and chaos aligned players get locked into Yoko's ending. Neutral players get to choose which one they want. I also really liked both new endings.

[@FreakGeSt]

I think if you go neutral, you lock into Law after Qaditsu battle, so for Chaos, you need to go straight into Chaos and don't even think in neutrality.

[@jeezycreezy4220]

@@FreakGeSt I went neutral on my first run. When you get to the throne both Tao and Yoko try to sway you to their side and you get a choice of whos hand to take, leading to their respective endings. The final alignment lock doesn't actually occur until you reach the throne itself.

[@valletas]

​@@FreakGeStthe aligment lock happens in the throne of creation Shame honestly i really like when smt games have long segments after the aligment split

[@piemoul]

Vengeance feels like playing a complete smt 1-3 to me personally

[@edwinpritom6336]

When this game's rerelease made me prioritize it over Elden Ring Shadow of the Erdtree, I knew it was an excellent rerelease. Regardless, these are two amazing updates to two amazing games.

[@eyoshinthemaximum]

Yoko and her ending are def my favorite parts of the story. It feels right to take her hand at the beginning and then again at the end, and also the final battle on her route is awesome, and her unique skill you can use after entering the Empyrean is very useful. I also just like her character, she’s edgy, but underneath that she’s one of if not the kindest character in the story to you the player, respecting you and your decisions and even trying to see from your pov no matter if what you did is in line with her ideology or opposed. Also the end of the 3rd area and the final boss battle is peak cinema, the ending specifically is the most shonen crap you’ll ever see in SMT and even rivals the level of anime action bs in other Atlus series, but it is absolutely peak and one of the coolest moments in the whole game, if not all of Atlus’ portfolio

[@amirgarcia547]

SMTV Vegeance might be my new favorite Atlus rerelease. Being that while previous ones added some substantial new content and great QoL improvements, they felt far from necessary. Even with Persona 5 Royal, as much as I adored it, being that the bulk of the new content was at the end of the game while the main one is left mostly intact. Whereas with Vengeance, it not only both keeps the original story route for preservation, but adds a brand new one that fixed plenty of the original’s issue by giving a much more compelling story and fleshing out the characters way more than the original did. It’s crazy to me that Miyazu’s biggest role in the OG game was an optional quest you could only do when getting the true ending, while here she two brand new quests that are greatly integrated into the main story. And that’s not to mention how much more developed Yuzuru, Tao and Dazai are as well. And so overall if you were a fan of the original, this’s more than worth coming back to. And if not, then it just might change your opinion of it.

[@ltb1345]

You can actually do Miyazu's quest in the original game without going for the true ending. I did the entire Egypt quest chain and got the Chaos ending.

[@littlebabyman8494]

Ah, I see the problem.

[@X_Blake]

Great vid Tony. Loved playing Vengeance. It was a breath of fresh air and a vast improvement of the Canon of Creation.

[@100Servings]

I agree completely. Your complaints are legitimate, but would add two other issues: Level scaling was garbage. It had to be there because it was an open world game, but I hate it, and it's contrary to SMT's core design. That leads into the other problem: It was open world for no reason. There just wasn't enough to fill the whole world, leaving it feeling empty and artificial. I prefer hub worlds, like Deus Ex, Persona games, and SMT 3. They give you what you need and that's it. From what I've read, Vengeance fixed all this, and I'm glad. I wish it wouldn't have taken seven years to make the game that we actually wanted, but here we are. Great work, Tony. Looking forward to all these new demons getting videos!

[@axellycan5070]

I feel very similar here! Nocturne saved the portrayal of the vast wasteland deserts to the overworld and battle screens, while leaving the explorable areas as easier spaces for them to design/develop for, giving a lot more visual variety.

[@therealjaystone2344]

Open area and world are two different words

[@amirgarcia547]

SMTV is more “open zone” than entirely open world, since you have four segmented overworlds to travel in that are pretty spacious but ultimately linear. My main issue is that the later areas were very tedious and annoying to navigate in, especially if you’re going for all the collectibles and Miman, which Vengeance singlehandedly fixes with the magatsu rails.

[@therealjaystone2344]

@@amirgarcia547 most of them time I don’t use them to find mimans when knowing exact where to find accord to the map. Better than traveling on foot from the vanilla.

[@100Servings]

@@therealjaystone2344 That was one of my other issues: you start with all the movement abilities you were going to get. Getting a glide, grappling hook, slide, or climb ability would have made the world so much more fulfilling to explore. The rails kind of fixed that.

[@kenbone5604]

I was wondering when a new video would be out and one just popped out

[@Tony4You]

Sorry for the slow uploads lol, we will be picking it up soon hopefully

[@Ray-Zide]

Isn't Yakumo the neutral rep? Tao even leaves you if you pick neutral

[@jaketheberge1970]

Yeah he's neutral. But that's more in Canon Of Creation isn't it? I'm still playing through Canon Of Vengeance but I hear that there is only Chaos and Law endings for it.

[@dylendye7410]

Tao as the goddess who is supposed to help the god who wins the fight create his ideal world leaves just because in neutral ending you chose to destroy her purpouse and the way of the world

[@Phase02Innis]

Yup Yakumo is the neutral rep. I was confused by Tony saying Tao was the neutral rep, due to her leaving you on the neutral path.

[@ltb1345]

Tony forgot about Yakumo lol.

[@Fermin-hw5pd]

Surprisingly, he is

[@Gokuvsnaruto22]

This was a great video! Definitely got me hyped to play Vengeance.

[@Andy-sj4ip]

YOO Tony just dropped with another banger. This game is the best rerelease they ever did. And O.M.G!!! They actually managed to make the alignments/endings balanced between them with pros and cons. Holy Shit!! Like the last time that happened was with Strange Journey, looks like Atlus really listened to your rant about how alignments and biases recently had been until that point.

[@jerry3115]

while I agree with basically all the points in this video, it is worth mentioning that, in my opinion, the game still feels kinda held back by the original. For example, the characters are developed much better, but they still eventually do the same stuff for the most part. Without getting into spoilers, I would have loved to see some of the characters, especially Dazai and Miyazu, turn out a bit different in the new story. Also, the story drops off a bit near the end, as the fourth area is very similar to the original game (not a good thing) and the endings are still very similar to the ones in the base game. Again in this area I would have loved to see bigger departures from the original. Regardless, Vengeance is a million times better than the original game, and it makes me very optimistic for what Atlus has up their sleeve next. P.S: Paraselene Blur is the coolest shit ever

[@amirgarcia547]

I couldn’t really see Dazai turn out any different, since the point of his character is that he decided to have full and blind belief in god due to not having the self-confidence to think for himself. It’s meant as a foil to Yuzuru, who does think for himself but is solely focused on helping others to the point where he neglects his own wants/needs. If anything, his actions make a lot more sense here than in CoC due to him being brainwashed by Mastema, while in CoC he just monologues to himself out of nowhere after seeing Nahobino pummel Abdiel.

[@jerry3115]

@@amirgarcia547 they could have written him losing faith in law after seeing what mastema did to him and the others

[@shinyanakagawa8241]

@@jerry3115 No because Mastema literally brainwashed and bestowed his power to him right after he unsalted Dazai. At that point, Dazai's mind has already been corrupted by Mastema's power and by following and assisting Abdiel raiding Arioch's castle only further strengthen his resolve to kill anyone who tries to reach and take the throne.

[@jerry3115]

@@shinyanakagawa8241 they could have easily written it where mastema didn't brainwash him or better yet left him in the salt and you had to rescue him yourself later

[@shinyanakagawa8241]

@@jerry3115 Then it would defeat the purpose of both Dazai and Mastema's characters. Right now you wanted both of them to do something that will break the narrative of the entire story. There is no point in dragging out Dazai's character arc when he is going to turn edgy anyway. The only complain I kinda agree with is that they should give us the glimpse of Abdiel and Dazai's troop raiding the demon king castle.

[@Blupblub]

I bought this game yesterday and I have 14 hours on it so far. I’m addicted ong because despite having 100+ hours on the original, everything felt so new and it was just so fun seeing the extra interactions added with demons too. Update: Just got Matador and Daisoujou

[@doteianima6370]

LET'S GOO

[@ViktarTheBarbarian]

I just don't understand how Atlas expects SMT games to sell well when they put out such a flawed initial release and follow it up with what the actual vision of the game was intended to be. Who in their right mind is going to buy the first edition of SMT6 when it comes out?

[@doteianima6370]

Well, the thing Is they never intended to release smt 5 in that way lmao, It was in development hell and at some point they have to force them out even if they are yucky to make up losses, think ff15 for example or i Guess more recently concord, atlus does abuse rereleases but for smt 5 the original version which never meant to be so clunky

[@alanlight2715]

I was kind of meh on V even though I was really hyped about it but now I LOVE vengeance. It's one of my favorite SMT games and games in general now

[@gscollect]

This may be a hot take but I tend to play games for the gameplay.

[@PriestOfTheHelix]

I find it hilarious that the secret ending of SMT V was such complete garbage that Vengeance basically said "fuck it, no neutral ending at all." I'm not even going to try and sugarcoat it, the secret ending of SMTV sucked. It wasn't well written and both Nuwa and Yakumo are assholes.

[@MILDMONSTER1234]

Imagine killing off all the demons in the universe after becoming Amabies 3rd fan and helping her

[@diogenesfromsinope]

Ngl I thought they were going to finally try to write a True Law ending in V, but then we get this instead lmao. Vanilla SMT V's writing made me truly question if there were really writers aboard the development team lmao.

[@doteianima6370]

Idk, i like It, a single universe where lucifer's dream realizes, and a world without demons nor gods to create conflict and start a new cycle, it can be Sad since u played with demons for the entire game and have to Say goodbye, but its needed to have zero conflict imo.

[@ronalby5957]

Now if golden sun can somehow make it onto the PlayStation platform, I will buy what ever game Camelot throws at me moving forward

[@rvfiasco]

Yea, I agree with everything you said about the OG. It was fun. I definitely will check out the improvements in Vengeance whenever I get my Steam Deck. Baby Steps. I sold my Switch and ended up homeless. Working on getting my life back on track. Thanks for the heads up!

[@mmpsp693]

As soon as I'm finished with Persona 3 Reload... oh wait, as soon as I'm finished with Episode Aigis... oh wait, as soon as I'm finish with Like a Dragon 8... oh wait, as soon as I'm finished with ReFantazio I'll play SMTVV!

[@DragonKingX78]

If I had any complaints it would be hated item carrying restrictions. I think you should have 99 limit for all items and up to 10 for each demon essence. Also quests that give specific items, that once you have them, they should give you balms, incense, macca, etc. Finally, wish there were more types of terrain like arctic tundra, swamps, under water, volcanoes, etc.

[@krispy_kornflake]

no intro jokes? it's truly special

[@keeysOST]

Now that it's on sale, I can finally play it.

[@anibal5845]

I'll probably still get it on Switch, I love the portability and want a physical copy.

[@catlady4110]

Got in target on sale today

[@BillNyeTheBountyGuy]

Saving anywhere and no-level scaling changed the whole game for me. Those two fixes alone are worth the entry fee.

[@jacem134]

I didn't hate the story in the original. It was moreso the way the characters were used that I had a problem with. I went Law my first playthrough despite not liking Dazai's personality change all that much. I did like the original neutral route thematically. Fighting Tsukuyomi right before the throne made the most sense, your character's friend and Aogami's brother. You both want to make a world to better humanity but you have different means. Also Tsukuyomi's theme slaps harder than the other two Nahobinos. Of course, the twist in Vengeance where you fuse with Koshimizu is cool, but I wish they didn't reveal the new form in trailers. Vengeance still has a way better story though.

[@roy4173]

Question, I've been playing the canon of creation because I thought there would be easter eggs in Vengeance that I wouldn't get otherwise. Should I be playing Vengeance instead as my first play through? If I'm not missing anything, I'd rather just play the better version.

[@TheLostSheep578]

Damn, he mistook Tao for being neutral when the actual neutral representative is Yakomo and Nuwa.

[@nunyabusiness8000]

Girl wtf is you talking about? Tao is not the neutral alignment rep.

[@eazybuxafew]

Can’t even lie, I’ve got a switch lite just for turn based RPGs. Pokémon, SMT III, SMT V, Paper Mario, Bravely Default 2, Cyber Sleuth & Hackers Memory, Dragon Quest XI. Played the crap out of them ALL on my switch lite. But where I can I’ve replayed them at higher quality and had a much better time playing them on PS4/5 Vengeance just came in today for PS5! And it looks and plays sooooo much better!!!

[@lanthelancer]

Did they finally add Victory Cry as a skill?

[@tespenkr9924]

I've put over 150 hours in the new game. The Vengeance story alone is great. The PC port makes modding easy, the new Periaphs give you extra options in combat and an excuse to use curtain demons. Also, replacing Chiyoda with Shinjuku was great. Yoko, Mastema, and the Qadistu are great at forcing the characters into new situations that the original never did.

[@omegaweapon116]

I'm getting close to the end of the game and I don't see that crappy, labyrinth dungeon with the fans blowing you everywhere. Thank god they took that out

[@RemLasher77]

The Night version of Lilith gets replaced by the new version that was introduced Vengeance.

[@pichugirl6]

If there's any criticism I have with Vengeance it's mainly the new Demi-Fiend side quest where, until the problem gets fix, it's sorta hard to look up a guide for the location of the Fiend fights. Without spoiling too much for folks, certain fiends got different locations when playing the Vengeance story, forcing you to check different and newer areas.

[@ThoseTentacle]

Can i play Vengeance route without finishing original story?

[@DSoulA3]

I'm really happy about this. Thanks T4Y. Wasn't on the fence, just can't get it right now. Glad to know it'll be worth it when I finally play. c:

[@RedEyesBlackKnight]

I really wish i could just upgrade my copy of smt5 instead of buying a whole new game. Ill probably get it eventually since it does look great, but only after it goes down in price.

[@Miyakolover]

10:18 To this day I haven't seen any convincing argument against characters like Marie from Persona 4. But other than that, great video.

[@deezee8216]

I'm glad I held off on getting this on Switch. I loved all the SMT games I've played but hearing all the complaints of V put me off getting it right away. Got Vengeance on Steam and I'm loving it. PC is my primary platform btw. With P3 remake and SMT5V Atlus has been keeping me good lately.

[@NieRNornNA]

I'm tempted to buy this on Steam already because I want to play it so bad. However, I'd just like to confirm one final thing: Is Khoryu/Huan Long a good support? He's my favorite demon/monster after I looked up the roster (Based on looks alone lol) and I'm unable to see any actual guides on what team to build around him.

[@basurama555]

Yoko's the one of the few remaster girls that I like, along along with Dante and Raidou.

[@deanoor9391]

Im so glad they fixed the game in part where its heavily needed. Im more excited to see Tony4Veng3nce talk about it

[@rantaray6212]

Thank you atlus for the early beta back in 2021 now we have a complete game

[@Kitsune10060]

I've only ran into 1 bug on steam, and that was during the Cannon of Creation, a couple bosses didn't spawn in for some weird reason, so I had to completely restart. My Cannon of Vengeance runs have been pretty problem free, not counting the times i forgot to make sure i had light and dark covered on, and thusly got 1 shot >.>

[@Fermin-hw5pd]

I got a bug also, sometimes when you warp into an area and inspect stuff with your navigator, the text doesn't come up, you can still click and get the item, but there's no dialogue, the box is empty

[@matmil5]

I don't care if the story is good, I am not paying 60 dollars for the game I already own.

[@Charagodslayer666]

Exactly how I feel.

[@doteianima6370]

Completely different experience, worth 60 if Ur a smt nerd, buy on discount of u arent

[@Daniel_Coffman]

I'm curious how much Vengeance improves its version of the original scenario alone. Though I am sure that it's largely only the gameplay that improves on that front.

[@JadenRockz99]

Agrat got added into the game so it instantly made the game 10/10. Every SMT moving forward needs the Agrat factor or I am not buying it (I will still buy SMT VI).

[@adityawidarma3803]

Tao is the character that do nothing but takes L repeatedly (even in Vangeance)

[@roycrowley2674]

Now, a remaster of digital devil saga 1 and 2 and a radio return at some point

[@deviantknight7009]

Loved the new Vasuki and Odin fights :D. Also that Beelze battle music is AMAZING

[@snakekingblues3017]

Kool a game were i can just play it while doing or watching something else

[@luistrejo3326]

11:25 Could you do a lore video of the Qadištu, later please?

[@jeremydavidson1420]

i got to admit tony4you ever since i found your videos i was hooked on your smt mythology videos. and like you i too was disapointment with smt v plain and ever since vengence came out i feel it really improved smt v and i am glad its on multiple platforms ps my version is on the ps4 and the qaditsu demons with agrat being my favorite in terms of combat and design. so thank you tony for all your hard work.

[@FreakGeSt]

I finished yesterday, the first SMT I ever finish, because it has all, story, gameplay, exploration, QoL, challenging enough but not BS, etc. Btw, I for what I saw about the OG law ending, I dissagreed is the best, but the new Law ending in Vengeance, I can say that's a much better ending in my opinion, Tao and Yoko really are a very convincing in her paths, sad there's not new neutral, specially when you see Tao and Yoko frienship really well develop but there's not option both can agreed with their believes have good and bad sides.

[@n1kq396]

Question: If I want to play SMTVV, do you recommend to start canon of vengeance skipping canon of creation entirely?

[@vanilla8956]

If you already know you want to play both do Creation first. If you think you'll want to move on to another game after the credits roll than play Vengeance

[@james22022]

If picked up, is it a better idea to do the original story before doing the new story line? Would playing the Vengeance path make the originals just that bad to experience?

[@hisdudeness1835]

I think both stories enhance each other. While some characters and story beats are better in the Vengeance story, some work better in the Creation story. Or you get informed about something happening off-screen but in the original creation story that happened with you there. Doesn't matter which story you play first, the other one might fill some gaps. I think Vengeance stands on its own much better though.

[@vermilionot]

SMT V Vengeance is my introduction to SMT Franchise. My very first JRPG was Persona 5 (Royal wasn't an option as it hasn't launched yet) and Persona games for me are the best games I have ever played & my favourite games. I knew nothing about SMT besides the fact that it's a more dungeon crawling focused game & predecessor for Persona games. As a Persona fan - I greatly enjoy SMT V: Vengeance & agree that CoC (storywise) is fucking ASS. Please don't tell me that is a "standard" for older games too... Although what I love the most about SMT V is the variety in combat that is just superior to Persona games. It offers a layer of complexity & flexibility of the main character and party members that I didn't even think was missing in Persona (until I played SMT game). I have SO MUCH MORE control over my own skills, ressistances & demons skills... And as a last note, Law ending makes much more sense in Vengeance (I hated the Law alignment for CoC & for majority of the game was Neutral / Chaos aligned) - I picked TN for CoC only to unlock the superboss for Vengeance (only recently beaten it). I wish there was a Neutral option for Vengeance. Love your videos :)

[@bwillsskates2638]

I’ve only played nocturne and that was only about 2 hours MAYBE. I got through the hospital, saved the game and then kept playing persona 4 & 5 and now I’m addicted to Metaphor. Question is, is this game as good as or better than metaphor? lol because it costs 20 bucks more

[@hatsuneblacktrousers]

as it turns out, the best way to deal with neutral bias is to remove neutral entirely. then again true neutral already kinda sucked in vanilla 5, it's quite literally the same as undertale genocide. but i kinda forgot what regular neutral is like tbh

[@b.h.4249]

As far as I remember, humanity in the neutral ending was left independent from God and demons which also meant that they'd have to fight off demons for eternity.

[@ltb1345]

Holy BASED!

[@FreakGeSt]

Kinda sad because that means Tao and Yoko never go to an agreedment, they haved a good friendship.

[@renren47618]

I think that True Neutral was amazing but the issue was that for reaching it you need to befriend demons True Neutral = You sacrifice all demons for the sake of a world for mankind which represents Neutral's main thing that is putting humanity above the demons Law = Upholding YHVH's Law but with Nahobino Chaos = A world ruled by the gods, essentially making them our world politicians but with godlike powers Neutral = Survival of the fittest Base SMT V endings were all great but with a shitty story and poor presentation which made them look bad, i could see how someone could prefer some of these endings over another without any of them being overwhelmingly better than the other True Neutral would've been better if to achieve it you should engage with questlines where humans are being attacked/threatned by demons and especially some of them being Quests with Yakumo/Nuwa respectively, this would emphatize how demons are harmful for humans.

[@Jeff-tt7wj]

A year from now…..”I’m glad to say Shin Megami Teansei V Vengeance Gold Edition fixed every problem I had with Shin Megami Tensei V Vengeance”.

[@vanilla8956]

I would like to hear your thoughts on this Tony. I understand you weren't dissapointed but I know you're a Law guy. I really was dissapointed by the Chaos route because even after the credits I was completely confused what the Qadištu even wanted. Spoilers below. They say they want to bring back the old world before Marduk took the throne, but don't describe what that world was like in any clear detail. Yet Samael says the Qadištu aren't even from this world and that he summoned them from a different multiverse. So are they not even talking about this world at all? Yoko stresses that the world will be one of equality, but this genuinely doesn't make sense because law is required for equality. One can disagree with the Creator's implementation of equality, but a world of Chaos would not be equal. Look at the side quest where a human who got stuck in Da'at was powerless to do anything but accept being eaten alive by Andras, or just compare my level 4 preta to my level 99 Beelzebub and ask how lawlessness will create equality between these disparities. The game doesn't answer this at all. Likewise, Yoko says that we should not be allowed to claim the throne because it will be unfair, yet without any comment suggesting she changed her mind, she guides us to the throne and we claim it. She says the throne is hidden now so it won't be discovered again, but we have the power to simply destroy the throne like Yakumo wanted, why wouldn't she prefer that? Yoko indicates after the credits that you and her destroyed the multiverse, but in new game plus, Mastema tells you your previous playthrough happened in a different multiverse, and basically confirms that Yoko is completely wrong for believing that. But if so, why does she want that anyway and why wasn't it ever brought up before? This next one isn't a plot hole but just something that really bothered me. We spend the entire 4th act of the game with Tao by our side, and then my character betrays her at the very last moment without my input. I understand why you were against letting us choose our ending regardless of alignment, and I agreed, but this feels like an exception. Tao is not a zealot of tyrannical law and order, she says repeatedly that she supports you regardless of what you want to make the next world. She protects us and helps us through thick and thin for a long, long time and even puts her personal opinions and disagreements with us behind her to support us. (like if you choose to support Adramelech) And then my character just abandons her at the last minute because of my alignment. Despite disagreeing with Tao a lot, I genuinely preferred her over the person who stabbed me in the back and got Aogami killed, especially since as shown in Canon of Creation, she will support you even if you want to make a world of Chaos, despite her Law alignment. I'm hoping that I'm just confused, so I would really would like to know your thoughts on the matter to help me enjoy this more, because all of this keeps this game from being a 10/10 in my eyes.

[@hisdudeness1835]

A World of Chaos is basically a return to the void before creation and then creating the world in a way where no one deity gets to decide the rules. Yes, it end up unfair yet again but a fresh start sounds like a more promising solution to Yoko than trying to repair a broken world. It's basically just Tao and Yoko both acknowledging how flawed the current world is but both of them go for a different solution. Make the world a better place but stick with established rules or start from scratch. The Qadistu don't really have any ideology behind their actions. They just serve/worship Tiamat and are mad at Marduk for slaying her. They're solely focused on vengeance and don't really care about the state of the world.

[@vanilla8956]

@@hisdudeness1835 I see what you mean, I guess I was overcomplicating it. I was seeing it as presented by Lilith, the worship of Tiamat as the true God, and I was really interested in that, but then we killed her and just went on without her, so I was stuck in my thinking. "Huh, didn't you lose your Goddess? Isn't this a loss?" But you've helped me enjoy it better. I still think that even if he doesn't sit on the throne, the Nahobino that created this world is still going to functionally be its top dog, but that would bother Yoko more than it would bother me lol.

[@renren47618]

Yeah, the Chaos alligment makes no sense in this game, the MC has ZERO reasons to side with Yoko Hiromine here. I think that it would've been better if they alligment split happened earlier, Yoko could betray the Qadistu after they try to kill you then she would go against them, still Yoko would want to use the power of Tiamat to her own thing and later if you alligned more with her you would have some sort of dialogue where the MC chooses to trust her vision and help her, Yoko would wish the same as she does in the main game which is resetting everything and creating a free world but she would go more for the route of "creating a world without ruiling God/gods where humans and demons would find their own way to live in peace" Tao would go against the MC because she would personally oppose the idea of ending everything like that. In the final area if you were sided with Yoko your mission would be to defeat the Bethel Members who would join in Taito to defeat the threat of Tiamat and the Nahobino who Abdiel would've ordered to kill if he showed up If you sided with Tao you would be in Taito to stop Tiamat (and Yoko) but you would end up fighting Bethel because they're there and want you dead A detail i forgot to mention is that the alligment split would happen shortly after Nahobino fuses with Tsukuyomi then he would meet with his alligment rep At the end Law's final bosses would've been the same and Aogami wouldn't come back(but there would be a scene where Aogami appears spiritually to support Nahobino to get him back to battle) and Chaos would be: Tao > Mastema > Mastema laughs and says that he has the power to control demons and while they were fighting he managed to get control of Tiamat> Mastema would fuse/join with Tiamat and you would fight against her, Nahobino would get a flashy move alongside Yoko In Law's ending Lucifer would mention that by using the Throne there would be higher chances of the Mandala System returning but that is not a given, in Chaos ending he would affirm that Yoko would get completely rid of the Mandala System Honestly i'm still not sure if what i suggested is much better, but i'm still thinking if there could be a better way to make siding with Yoko more reasonable without changing too much her final goal(unduing the Bull God), i actually think that something like the True Neutral from the Vanilla SMT V but with humans and demons living together in a world without a ruiling God, fate or anything like that would probably be best different ending for her and it would make both Law and Chaos great outcomes Law = A perfect world but where there is still a ruiling God who would guide mankind and probably set the universal rules and etc. But with Nahobino trying to actively make people happy Chaos = Bonds ending from SMT IV Apocalypse + True Neutral (No God and Demons living with Humans normally) but with the aspect of everyone being sacrificed for the birth of this new world

[@vanilla8956]

@@renren47618 I like your idea a lot. I would like to add that it would be cool if you had a design change depending on alignment in Tsukibino form. Like the normal blue scythe blade for law but a red one for Chaos.

[@hisdudeness1835]

@@vanilla8956 I don't think Nahobino would be the top dog in that ending. If he creates a world without a ruler that includes him not being one as well.

[@mr.monkey1914]

I just bought the game recently and chose canon of creation on accident, can't waif to finish my first playthrough so i can play vengeance

[@lualjigo]

You have my like even if just for the bloodborne comment

[@yphoenix5957]

Feeling like "a piece of plywood with godly powers" is definitely what I felt like while playing base SMTV. Playing hardcore, you get so powerful that every character with a pulse became a roadblock, blocking my godly decree were I went, "FUCK YOU AND YOUR REASON!!" and went on my way. The story for OG SMTV was so uninteresting I chose Nuetral ending just to watch Yakumo die with his hypocrisy. So glad Vengeance let me see these characters in a different light! _Channel thy Chaotic Will._

[@Reyframe0]

Great video! I enjoyed vengeance a lot.

[@SirVakari]

I played it as my first SMT. The atmosphere and mood are so bizzare. The only thing I feel after finishing it is how much I wish it was something more... I want more high-quality content, better quests, a more sensible plot, and decisions that actually make a difference. Every scene that gave me choice to say something in this distorted-slowmo moments, despite the somewhat messy plot , totally captivated me more than any other game.

[@SirVakari]

I hate it for not being better, it's great!

[@Junpeidaman190]

Bro, you are describing the Canon of vengeance lmao

[@dngrtegaijin4680]

Can you make a video explaining the endings? Specifically Yoko’s. Is her ending just them destroying all worlds so the cycle ends and creating a new world from that destruction?

[@dotv2359]

I hope they give Soul Hackers 2 this amount of love. That game has so much going for it but the dungeon crawling is so bare bones. I don't want to have to wait 25 years for another Devil Summoner game-