Shooting .38 Super in .38 Special and .357 Magnum Revolvers

Paul tests .38 super ammo in .38 special and .357 magnum revolvers.
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[@johnreep5798]

“Just because you can put it in there, should you?” True for so many things in life.

[@michaelblacktree]

LOL

[@firestorm8471]

Well it fits dammit !!! 😳

[@justinpennington7682]

@@firestorm8471 its always going to fit .bit will stretch a mile before it rips a inch

[@firestorm8471]

Stretch is good,,,,,,very, very good..😎

[@justinpennington7682]

@@firestorm8471 10lb people come out of that hole . Your 6 0z weiner isn't going to stretch anything

[@pete_351]

Just got off of work and opened a beer. Then suddenly find a shiny new Paul Harrell episode?! What a great day.

[@IRoYaILTY]

Yessir

[@DannLikesFans]

I knew I was missing something!

[@spasticjackson9578]

ditto !

[@ruck27]

Tis

[@Vanilla-Gorilla69]

I'm a .357 owner I've never seen anyone test this and give good evidence on whether or not it's safe to shoot .38super. Was told by a guy at the gun store it was safe. Did some research and it wasn't so cut and dry. Thanks paul for the real info and evidence.

[@ultratec66]

Always learning something, when watching your videos, thank you.

[@williamparker8318]

Thanks again for the education. Cheers

[@lornaburns9600]

I have done this experiment with 32 acp in 32 H&R mag and 327 federal magnum revolvers with no chambering issues but in all 5 guns certain chambers would have soft primer strikes resulting in failure to fire. Also none of the guns would eject the cases. So concluded that why do it ,unreliable and hard to remove cases plus no power advantage, if I wanted a easier shooting round I would use 32 long ammo. Totally agree with Paul. Thanks for another great video.

[@aandyherr817]

You know, I’ve learned a little bit from Paul here over the time I’ve watched his channel. I may not always be on point watching videos daily, but I always get a little excitement when I see older videos come up in recommendation! As always, good content.

[@RickSanchezC--ge6fw]

Paul, your doing GODs work and man I wouldn’t even call it work if you love what your doing! Keep up the videos and educational information. The practical application you provide is phenomenal!

[@thatdamnsamsquanch]

Literally had this the other day at work. A novice gun owner came in looking for .38 special ammo. All we had was some more expensive critical defense. The saw the cheaper box of 38 super and grabbed it up. I had to break it to them that it was the wrong ammo.

[@matthewbeaver5026]

I suppose that's if the had a 38. If it was a 357, maybe? They could have used it.

[@kekeke4467]

This very issue is one of the reasons why ammo is sold behind the counter in my state too many injuries from lack of knowledge (which is different from stupidity).

[@dontworrybout2664]

@@kekeke4467 so you put diapers on everyone because some do not smart things?

[@kekeke4467]

@@dontworrybout2664 not saying I agree with it but that was the reason given

[@michaelkennedy996]

Thanks for reluctantly offering merchandise, love my “Please bear with the gunfire “ hope it helps support the channel

[@Odin31b]

He is the Ultimate Warrior of shooting..

[@cadbane1980]

Best gun channel on KZbin. Period.

[@efreutel]

Superb professional presentation Many thanks! 🙏🙏👍👍🤠

[@LostIn207]

Very interesting, thank you Paul Harrell and team

[@Ryo-sd9rx]

I love watching Paul's videos. He is no actor but he is a scientist and about facts and obviously is passionate about his guns and I understand completely

[@doranmaxwell1755]

absolutely! as a handloader this is a common thing. the sizing die will determine what rounds fit and what ones do not in what handguns

[@buddymullins6424]

I have all those calibers I’ve wondered about that for years. But never tried it because I wasn’t sure good video thanks for the info .

[@jacknelson8601]

What a great video! I really enjoyed it and I am truly impressed with this man ......thanks.

[@tubularfrog]

No stone unturned. Another excellent video from the Boss.

[@liberaceboiithe3rd5]

I have some of my father’s old .38 Super laying around, was curious about this exact question!

[@jameslogan6127]

Truly excellent video. I was mesmerized. As a new shooter…starting 2 years ago early on I accidentally purchased a box of 38 Super thinking it was just another form of 38 Special which I could shoot in my Kimber K6s .357 DASA 3” revolver. I never tried to shoot it but discovered it was a different type ammo than I thought. I’ve still got it as you cannot return ammo. Now I’m curious as to whether it will fit and if it does I might shoot it away at the range as I haven’t figured any other way of getting rid of the stuff. Finally, I’ll say there are many “experts” on KZbin and because I don’t know much myself virtually all of them know more than I do but I do think you’re one of the folks truly deserving of the moniker “Expert.” Thanks so much for all your diligent thoughtful efforts and genuine knowledge that you so willingly share here on KZbin. I know I very much appreciate the things you share and I know I’m a safer shooter because of things I’ve learned watching your videos.

[@reecer6317]

That’s a lot of good information. And we find out Paul has a Blackhawk chambered in 30 carbine. That is a pretty rare gun, I’ve only seen 1 before and that was about 30 years ago.

[@mshort7087]

And it’s the most obscenely loud revolver you have ever shot

[@ericoberlies7537]

I owned one, sold it around 6 or 7 years ago. It was loud with somewhat of a muzzle flash. After a while I began to see it as more of a niche oddity. I didn’t see any point to it. The .357 Magnum is more practical.

[@cal30m1]

I’m surprised you didn’t review the SAAMI specs with regards to the pressure differences between the 3 cartridges. 38 super being 36,500 psi verses 38 special, (standard), being 17,000 psi. Even the father of the 38 Super, the 38 automatic pressures exceed the 38 special +P, but that another video…

[@Keifsanderson]

This. It was my first thought, before even considering whether it would physically fit.

[@matthewbeaver5026]

Where does the 357 fit in with pressure? I would assume quite a bit more than 38 special, about the ballpark of super?

[@silenthahvulon4937]

@@matthewbeaver5026 357 is 35,000 psi. Also, for completeness, 38 special +P is about 20,000.

[@Chilionloppu]

SAAMI specs also tell that 38 Super casings are .384 in diameter with up to -.006 tolerance (.378 in at lowest), and .357 Magnum chamber is .3809 in diameter with up to +.004 tolerance (.3849 in at highest), which explains why only some cartridges fit in some guns. With enough tolerances going around it is no wonder that they fit, and the pressure difference is practically nothing since they are still tested at 30% above standard, and there are always some variation in pressures due to measuring tolerances of the powder.

[@cal30m1]

@@matthewbeaver5026 the maximum pressure for the 357 mag is considerably higher than the 38 Super. However, it’s never a good idea to fire cartridges in a firearm they were not made for. I have not yet been able to confirm this but many years ago I spoke to a Dallas cop who worked there in 1963. They said at least one of the rounds of ammo Lee Oswald had in his 38 special revolver when he shot Officer Tibbet, was a 38 Super…

[@GPgundude]

As always, an excellent informative video!! Thanks for Sharing !!

[@paulmasten5980]

You're the best, Paul. Hands down!

[@MoatenGat]

I have been wondering about that, glad I saw your video first.

[@budgetbuyoutmisc.4916]

Thank you Mr Harrell

[@Zajuts149]

This one of those videos where I start out with just the bare minimum of interest, and as it goes along, I'm just: "Wow! That is interesting!"

[@BUZZKILLJRJR]

Awesome yet again! you answered all questions I didn't know I was going to want to ask, when I watched hahaha!

[@adamallison3685]

Excellent episode Paul

[@kbjerke]

Wow. This has to be one of your most captivating videos ever, Paul! Thank you! *Verrrrry* interesting! And no, I do not plan to try this at home.

[@dufour409]

Thanks Paut, your new jacket fits much better

[@sillybilly44444444]

Another possible explanation for the light primer strikes is that the .30 Super rims are slightly thinner than those on .38 Special/.357 Magnum. This results in the cartridge sitting ever so much deeper in the chamber, which results in the firing pin having to travel that much farther to detonate the primer. Lucky Gunner also noted in his 'Can you fire .32 ACP in revolver' video that, when firing .32 ACP in the revolver, the primers on the .32 ACP ammo would bulge out more than usual due to the reasons mentioned above. Another youtuber named 'Gun Sam Revolver Aficionado' pointed out in one of his videos that, when firing .32 ACP in a revolver, the ammunition would have problems going off when the revolver was pointed in a downwards angle. I wonder if this would also be the case with .38 Super being shot in .357 Magnum revolvers.

[@billlindsay2593]

Standing and applauding. Excellent content and details to show your points in this video.

[@johnnelson3158]

"if you're 50% right, you're 100% wrong" I've always said the same thing but a little differently: "A little knowledge is a very dangerous thing" this one was even more interesting than usual!! 👍🦅🇺🇲🦅

[@mikegoodwin7115]

Bravo paul, on the mark just as usual

[@guinnessman4668]

I never thought of this idea thank you for the education, I did want to know the difference of the super vs the other 2.

[@davidtexas1638]

Thanks Paul

[@allenatkins2263]

That cow keeps saying, NO! That is good enough for me.

[@seanseoltoir]

Another thing to consider with respect to whether it will fit is will the cylinder fully close and rotate... If it *looks* like the cartridge fully seats, but is just slightly proud, in some firearms the tolerances are such that the cylinder will not close and even if it does close, it won't rotate... This can also happen if your primers are not seated perfectly flush to (or below) the base of the cartridge... I've had that happen before... If you look at the SAAMI specs, you will see cartridge and chamber drawings with dimensions... There are some tolerances involved in both, so as Paul has shown here, it is entirely possible to have a combination of firearm and ammo that will work and another combination that will not work... A .357 mag has a chamber base diameter of 0.3809"... A .38 SUPER has cartridge base diameter of 0.384"... That would seem to indicate the the .38 SUPER should not fit in the .357 mag chamber, but if you look on the drawing, you will see that there is a tolerance of -0.006" which means that the cartridge could be as small as 0.378" and still be within the SAAMI specs... Of course, 0.378" is less than the .357 mag's chamber base diameter of 0.3809", so it would fit... End result? IT DEPENDS... :)

[@joecallahan3379]

Straight up information, no BS, thanks man, if i'm looking for good input i watch your videos

[@sylviajones3355]

I've heard rumors about this. Thanks for clearing them up. Can you demonstrate 40 S&W in a 10mm autoloader?

[@harperhellems3648]

Yes!

[@jimhans1]

It works just fine. Fired hundreds of .40S&W ammo out of my 10mm chambered guns.

[@jimvac77]

@@jimhans1 with the stock 10mm barrel? If so, I do not believe you. 40 S&W will not headspace in a 10mm barrel. It may go bang, but if so it's only because your extractor is a hero, while it lasts.

[@jimhans1]

@@jimvac77 yes, factory barrel. And while in theory the cartridge “headspaces” on the case mouth, you measure any auto pistol chamber and then measure the brass, you will see that the extractor is what is doing the work, the chambers are .010-.020” longer than any brass. I’ve shot .40 in it for years, and 10mm with zero issues. Ask any competent gunsmith and they will tell you the same thing. And it’s not just one gun, I have 6 different 10mm semis, they’ve all worked flawless with .40 also.

[@jimvac77]

@@jimhans1 Nope. You are incorrect. Try a plunk test sometime. Headspace isn't a theory. It's real. You keep right on shooting. 40 in your 10mm though as clearly you know better.

[@ajhatti2011]

It’s crazy how a few hundred-thousandths of an inch can make such a difference. That’s pretty neat.

[@pxldsilz6828]

this is something i briefly considered doing, loading up a .357 snub with .38 super in the effort of reducing recoil but still wielding more power than a . 38spl +P. After hearing that light primer strike, however, I've had a change of heart.

[@SmallCaliberArmsReview]

Excellent video Paul! One of my local shops has some .38 super on their shelves but I'd never even thought about trying it, and now I don't need to!

[@gusloader123]

Well done video by Paul Harrell. Never even thought about such a test. What is VERY strange to me is that some brands of ammo will or will not fit into the cylinders of factory .38 Special & .357 Magnum handguns. That was odd. Seems like a couple of ammo makers are not following the SAAMI guidelines for cartridge designs. What was not mentioned / covered in the video ((... at least my senior citizen ears did not hear it if it was mentioned.... )) The .38 Auto-A.C.P. (1900) and .38 Super Auto (1929) are .356 caliber. Thus, they are a hair smaller in diameter than the bullets for a .38 Special or the bullets for a .357 S & W Magnum cartridge. They will go down the barrel, but not as accurately as a .357 slug fully touching the rifling.

[@stonefree1911]

THE WASP NEST ANALOGY WAS PURE GOLD...

[@helidude3502]

38 super did fit and function well in my 357 Taurus revolver years ago. Probably only did that about 6 rounds. That was also when I had less knowledge of firearms and zero knowledge of load data, or why it happened to function in my particular combination. It can be very interesting the combinations of things that work together that weren’t designed to. It must also be stated that a successful combination during one event, may be a failure with catastrophic consequences in a subsequent event. This video is very informative. I will share it as an instructional tool. Thank you

[@sirjhonson8218]

We always shot .38 special from .357 mag. when we targets . Used .357 mag . for side arm while hunting or self defense .

[@oldcountryboy]

Thank you For the knowledge Might come in handy Someday

[@0471jrs]

Great informative video, really like the S&W 686 6"

[@dukehoffman124]

Good one . One I really never cogitated on .

[@iamhe999]

good job Paul

[@ketchman8299]

Well stated and tested.

[@scottstewart5784]

If in SHTF I find a case of 38 super auto, AND if it fits in my Taurus 605 in 357/38 sp, I now know I could use it in a pinch or for barter. I'd test it first of course, and obviously will only load it if I have no 38/357 rounds left. Can't be relied upon.

[@leeashworth9874]

Great video Sir.

[@saltydawg8988]

Completely didn’t see the chronograph at first, and just assumed Paul was shooting at like 100yds away. Given how well I’ve seen this man shoot, I fully believed this until I noticed the faint view of the chrono at about 15yds away. This still leads me to believe that Paul could dream of shooting targets without shooting them, and would wake up to find bullet holes in that target. That’s some Chuck Norris stuff right there.

[@sambolino44]

Sees flyer on second shot; thinks, "Well, that's just him, and yes, it IS annoying."

[@liddell157]

Paul can make watching paint dry interesting.

[@michaelgarcia5689]

Paul is the best.

[@jpscott3378]

PMC 38 super +p does fit in ria m200 38spc. 5 out of 6 fired, 1 ftf due to light primer strike. of the 5 spent casings- none functioned with the extractor, 4 fell out, 1 needed pounded out with a rod and mallet. the ftf extracted without difficulty. accuracy was not notably affected at 10 yards. gun was cleaned and no noticeable damage seen by me or by 2 gunsmiths. my experience via unintended testing, never to be repeated. if extreme circumstances happened in the future it is possible but by far sub optimal

[@MikesGarage96]

Going to the dentist tomorrow for a root canal. I think I’ll wear my Paul Harrell t shirt for good luck 😂. Enjoyed the video!

[@ddselvig]

Good point about the false experts. I've run across them in the past and usually have been able to recognize them. I've even had gunsmiths tell me things that didn't make sense. If something doesn't make sense to me I check it out to the best of my ability to gain my perception of the truth.

[@SwiftTrooper5]

Living here in the People's Republic of California, getting to the range is neither cheap nor easy. Living vicariously through Paul conducting science with his firearms is an enjoyable 30 minutes spent!

[@DaveP326]

This video was very interesting even though I never gave this even a passing thought. One thing I'd like to mention is that every firearm I've ever bought came with a disclaimer that the manufacturer stated that any warranties and/or company liability would be null and void if their firearms were used with ammunition that 1.- has been reloaded, or 2.-that the firearm was not originally chambered for, such as using .38 Super in a firearm chambered for .38 Special, or .357 Magnum. There was no mention of this , other than the part where you said "CAN you do it? Yes, sometimes, but SHOULD you do it?" and left it to the user to decide. I think ALL firearms manufacturere warn against such a practice. I think you should've mentioned that.

[@everettsmith5752]

I had a customer that purchased a Smith PC L frame and later came in complaining about hard extractions. I looked at the gun and seemed ok. I asked if he was shooting hot handloads, he said no and handed me a box of 38 super ammo.

[@bryanst.martin7134]

RE Hornets nest: How successful would a 12 Ga fired in the hole be to kill all of them? Wrong channel.

[@johnbrown4949]

Rip. To they guy that ever breaks in Paul’s house.

[@michigunsanta8680]

I was all like “I hope he doesn’t try shooting 38super out of that 50yr old model 15”!?! 😳😬😅

[@fixedG]

If I were designing a new autoloader cartridge, I'd get rid of the taper on 9mm, make it as long as the .38 Super, make it truly rimless and design it for modern pressures. I think you could push 45,000 PSI or maybe even more in a case that double-stacks easier than .38 Super without being too wide, reloads better than 9mm, has as good a magazine capacity as the best of either, can push higher velocities than either thanks to the larger case and higher pressure and doesn't lose capacity to do so the way .357 Sig does. Nobody would buy it because existing cartridges are so well established but as an academic exercise, I think it makes a great deal of sense.

[@RichardNixion357]

No Pop-Tart Intro, "My Disappointment is immeasurable and my day is ruined." 30 Minute Paul Video: *Are you not Entertained?!*

[@codyhudson3566]

This honestly helped me solve a debate with my father-in-law

[@afhostie]

I can't imagine a scenario in which someone would want to try this, especially since the ammo prices are basically the same between the two

[@SasaMic]

I am shocked at what people come up with and am laughing at your way of explaining things. Paul, you are too funny😀

[@MemorialRifleRange]

If the Shoulder pad Mohawks show up and all I have is a 357 with fitting 38 Super + I'll know to give it a try.

[@TomKeown]

Okay, I never would have even thought about this combination, but after watching this video I was compelled to break out my 357 revolvers and 38 Super ammo to try. So in both my Ruger GP100 and Ruger SP101, my 38 Super loads did fit. The fit was snug, but they did fit and did eject easily. Now my 38 Super loads are handloads, and all using Starline brass. And I wonder if that is the difference. As you mentioned, different manufacturers have different tolerance for cutting the cylinder chambering. But I will also add that different brass has different tolerances. So for example, the brass used for Winchester White Box might be less to spec than the brass used in Winchester's Silvertip ammo. Or it might even be a combination of both factors.

[@maxlutz3674]

The specs state tolerances. Some manufacturers may use tighter tolerances. However the specs for .38 super ensure that a .38 super round fits the chamber of a gun chambered for that caliber. .357 Magnum and .38 super have different diameter specs for brass and chamber. There is some overlap. A different lot of ammo may cause the rounds to not fit anymore. Same goes for the specifc revolver. Just because the ammo fits Paul´s 686 does not mean that it will fit all 686.

[@carlwelte6094]

Very informative!

[@dcstutorial]

This guy is like Bob Ross for guns

[@michaelgriggi1784]

Well done great info

[@treeguyable]

I have a few .357 revolvers, that eject spent brass casings with ease, but the cheap steel/ russian ammo, gets lodged in pretty tight, gotta smack the ejector pretty hard.

[@alienoftheapocalypse2183]

We miss u paul

[@Fudmottin]

Tolerance stacking. It's a thing. And it can really suck. I was surprised this video was so long. I was expecting an emphatic, "no!" for the answer. Welp. Learned something. I was also surprised that a 0.355" bullet would get enough grip on the rifling of a bore made for 0.357" bullets. I'm used to going up a thousandth. For example, lead cast bullets I run 0.358" to get a tighter seal to reduce leading. That works. I've also run 0.356" bullets for 380 ACP down a 9x19mm barrel in 9mm loads. I was looking for hyper velocity and figured I would be safe with this. I did use an expendable pistol for testing. While you can run 380 ACP bullets in 9mm, I would say it's a bad idea. In my test cases, the bullets were so over speed that they exploded on impact. And while the primers looked fine, I may have been over safe pressure too. So all in all, this video was quite surprising to me.

[@9unslin9er]

Did anyone else get extreme anxiety seeing those guns balancing on the deck?

[@DANiELleEfoX]

My S&W Model 10 will load and fire the .38 Super rounds that I've tried but it's hard to eject the casings. Thanks for all the good info

[@garytroutman7790]

Thank you Paul for your work. I appreciate your videos and this topic has been one that I wondered about. I have 2 boxes of Armscore 38 super 130 grain fmj that do “fit” in my Ruger GP 100 and LCR 357. Had the same thoughts. If it was the last of my ammunition after SHTF i would use it and hope for the best. You have confirmed my take on this.

[@wheelietime7062]

You should try it in a Taurus 692 ( 357/ 38sp) and convertible to 9mm with spare cylinder. I think some ruger come with it also.

[@jimmywilliamson8540]

These things are always interesting, I like the idea of weapons like an S&W 460 that Can chamber 460, 454, 45 long, comma 45 schoolfield. But you don't get that kind of compatibility very frequently and as is well known in the rifle world in the rifle world you have to be Sure that what you're shooting is precisely the right size Because of the platter of bullets that are just a little bit too big or just a little bit too small and can cause wild pressure and accuracy problems.

[@dirtydingoringo3121]

Most excellent.

[@RickyJr46]

Methodical myth-busting for the win!

[@markpoore3260]

I have shot .380 out of my 9mm however I had to rack the slide to eject the casing but in a mad max scenario it will work

[@jason-hh6lu]

Paul looked like he was going to just launch the ammo after the 6th time of ‘doesn’t fit!’ 😂👍🏻

[@rumriverpikelake]

Extremely interesting. I have guns in all three of these calibers and never even contemplated this scenario. I won't personally try it - but if "Armageddon" actually shows up it's nice to know there are possible options outside the box. Once again a very well done presentation. Thanks Paul.

[@JR-jv3cd]

Like always, this was interesting and fun. However, I'm struggling with why you would go to such lengths to achieve something that has so many variables and would be expensive to determine. Not to mention the safety, or lack of it. Besides a Mad Max scenario, I just can't see why you'd want to even consider it. Back down to earth, great new jacket Paul!

[@jimyeats]

Because apparently a few people want to know.

[@HDBee]

You should of had some calipers to measure the OD of the cases and ID of the cylinders. Also it would of been interesting to chronograph 38 special in +P and +P+. As some 38 revolvers are rated for it.

[@PaulHarrell]

the .38 special ammo was +P I have never seen .38 special +P+

[@jakedee4117]

Very good information and well presented. I never knew that about moon clips, I always thought the speed load was their designed function.

[@jerrywilson5853]

I missed the begining, did he have that building in his pocket too? as usual, great video

[@rippertrain]

Wow impressive video.

[@LeonSteelpaw]

Just to point out, that survival revolver you might have seen on Forgotten Weapons shouldn't be counted in this, there's a reason the company behind it didn't make many of them

[@MrCarlozan96]

In the future it would be of great interest to talk about the rim’s thickness and what in implies when trying those odd combinations. Great video as always.