HOP 38 Super vs 9mm +P+

[@richardjohnson4238]

Now...on a serious note. Look what you've done? Now I want a 38 Super. Thanks Howard.

[@jeremye6516]

Call in, stop by or check hop on the web

[@franciscochiriboga2268]

Me too!

[@easyfiveOsink]

Tempting, very tempting!

[@PhillipFelix-kw3zi]

Lol, I know. It is a classic

[@Wedgetail96]

For those commenting that these were particularly hot 38Super loads, they are actually true to its original potential. The standard 130gr load back around 1929 for this caliber was traveling at 1300fps. Great to see an ammo manufacturer loading to its true specs rather than loaded down. It is similar to the 10mm in that it is often sold with greatly reduced load offerings. Great video HR 👍🏻

[@hrfunk]

Thank you!

[@timclaus8313]

Now compare a 38 Super to a SAAMI recognized 9mm load like a 9mm or 9mm+P, and the advantage is fairly substantial. The added velocity of the 38 Super pretty much ensures expansion. Regularly see the Super compared to a 9mm+P+, but no manufacturer I know of approves the 9mm+P+ for their pistols.

[@josegonsales4110]

​Good point . @timclaus8313

[@Grodd70]

I think the .38 Super is a cartridge that really needs to make a come back. The 1911 isn't going anywhere soon and for people that may want a different cartridge than a .45, the .38 just makes sense. Yes, there is 9mm (and no diss on it love the cartridge) but where 9mm shines is in the capacity category...a 1911 single stack is just not its thing in my opinion but a .38 Super is just perfect. Thank you for shooting, and wow great shooting :)

[@hrfunk]

You’re welcome. Thanks for watching!

[@rickgower8214]

I've always felt that the .38 Super was the most underappreciated cartridge ever . It has so much to offer .

[@hrfunk]

Yes it does. Thanks for watching!

[@ms.annthrope415]

People don't realize that the .38 super was developed out of the .38 auto to penetrate auto bodies during the 1920s-1930s years of Bonnie and Clyde and Machine Gun Kelly and John Dillinger. It could shoot a 130 grain bullet at close to 1,300 feet per second. It had accuracy problems at first due to head spacing issues. But that was rectified and in the 1980s and 1990s the .38 super was the cartridge for IPSC as it met Major caliber in a 9mm size pistol without thr girth of. 45 ACP. It has strong potential to be a strong defensive round but hell to find in a gun store.

[@hrfunk]

That’s why I was so happy to find out HOP is loading it.

[@The_Conspiracy_Analyst]

@@ms.annthrope415 Two things. One, just get a 9mm parabellum barrel for your .38 super gun to swap in when you can't find .38 super ammo. Two: how can there be "headspacing" issues from a semi-rimmed cartridge? That's the whole point of having the rim.

[@876mpr]

I really like .38 Super as well and feel that a 124 at 1300+ is plenty of power. As a bonus, the pistols aren’t ugly.

[@mikerbikex6656]

Good morning Chief. I am an old-school fan of the 38 Super cartridge and currently own a Colt 1911 Competition. Yes, the ammo is a little hard to find and pricey. I also own a Sig in 357 Sig. Of those two, the 38 Super is more fun to shoot. The recoil is light and my accuracy is as good as it gets (for me), especially for quick follow-up shots. Your video was extremely well done and fair. Now, I need to visit the House of Payne! Thanks for the work that you do.

[@hrfunk]

You're welcome and thanks for watching

[@rtaggs8178]

I just bought some .38 Super ammo the 115 gr variety and it was around 13.00 dollars for 20 rounds, I forgot that HR Funk had a discount code for 10 percent.

[@karsonbranham3900]

Way cool! I recently got ahold of a tisas stakeout in .38 S/A and 9 mm. Excited to try it out, it sure looks and feels like a top shelf 1911!

[@lyricaldistributionsupport3280]

Used to run a couple of 38 Super race guns for IPSC Open division before switching to Production and Production optics. For the 38 Super the competition load I used was a 124gr conical at around 1450-1500fps. Stout loads but made the compensator very effective. This video was a good trip down memory lane. Thank you for the video.

[@hrfunk]

My pleasure. Thanks for watching!

[@johnsheetz6639]

Handgun magazines loved them back in the 80s. Because they could be super hard or super soft

[@joecarlson6428]

Very good video. I like the transparent and systematic approach you use in testing firearms and ammunition.

[@hrfunk]

Thank you Joe!

[@sgtmajtrapp3391]

The .38 Super has been one of my favorite defense calibers for some time own two both 1911 guns had others. I use hot Buffalo BORE AMMO IN JHP loads.

[@PhillipFelix-kw3zi]

What do you think about the commander sized 38super?

[@hrfunk]

@PhillipFelix-kw3zi Generally, I like the Commander size pistols. In the Super, however, I hate to give up any of its velocity.

[@PhillipFelix-kw3zi]

@@hrfunk indeed, it will be for conceal carry. My full size 1911A1 45acp tends to get in the way whilst I'm working. I like the 9mm and do carry them but the 38super is a better option from what I have read about it.

[@randyadams03]

I'm with you. My favorite historical pistol is my 1956 Romanian TT33-C in 7.62x25, with good ammunition. Just fun. Your 38 super loads are crazy . I need some 762x25 86gr surplus @ 1600ish fps !!! Thanks Hr

[@mineplow1000]

Didn't read down far enough before posting my yap.

[@LeonWick526]

The FBI used to use 1911's in .38 Super. I think it was one of the pistols that killed John Dillinger.

[@chrischiampo7647]

Going Out on a Limb and Sayin 38 Super For The Win 😀❤️😎

[@AMX86]

I regularly shoot 38super, 130 grain. It's a good accurate cartridge, easy recoil in the 1911 pistol.

[@davidkachel]

Howard, you may wish to explore what competitive shooters are doing with the .38 Super. They all reload, of course, and among other things, have discovered they can use thicker 9x21 brass to get even spicier loads, without risk of blowing up their guns. .38 Super, like the .44 Special, is really a reloader's cartridge, because of both the expense of factory ammunition and the tendency for factory ammo to be substantially weakened, the HOP ammunition being an obvious exception.

[@hrfunk]

For several years, the only ammunition I've fired in .38 Super was (were) my handloads. The HOP loads are slightly hotter than mine (I get about 1350 fps with a 124 grain XTP), but their accuracy is superior to what I've been able to achieve. I really like thier loads.

[@seanoneil277]

I was going to comment above saying similarly about competitive shooters. One guy in my region went to .38 Super a few years ago for a few of his pistols/divisions, he was telling me he enjoys it and apparently in USPSA there's a small advantage to running it -- I don't know, I run 9mm exclusively in Carry Optics, and don't look at other divisions' info, limits, requirements etc. He raved about how much he enjoys shooting it, though.

[@hrfunk]

I like it for a different reason. It’s just a cool old time cartridge!

[@davidkachel]

@@hrfunk Says, the cool old time cop! ;-)

[@timclaus8313]

@@hrfunk And really fun to shoot out of a 1911.

[@normanpersing2475]

Well done! Just bought a Colt Gold Cup Trophy in 38 Super. Excited to get to the range with it!

[@troyspurling1910]

Cool video! Impressed with the HOP ammo! I am a fan and owner of a 38 Super. I'm also a fan of 357 Sig. I think those two are the closest comparison to each other. They are both more powerful than 9mm and both not quite the power of 357 Mag. And yes, both are expensive.

[@sgtmajtrapp3391]

Yes sir Troy I'm with you on both all are 1911 pistols. Colt engraved 5" so called BBQ GUN, DAN WESSON LW Commander 4.25 these in .38 Super and a SIG 1911 Nightmare Carry Commander .357 SIG.

[@SierraBravo347]

One of my coworkers was born in Mexico, and became a U.S. Citizen 20 years ago, said that the .38 Super was Very prolific in Mexico, because they weren't allowed to have 9x19 because that's what the Military used. I've never verified that myself, but that was his account.

[@hrfunk]

That coincides with what I’ve always heard.

[@tomcurran8470]

I understand that this was the case in much of South America. I posted a comment about this. I'd have to research which countries this applies to. BTW, I believe MX only has one gun store controlled by the government.

[@kevinward8915]

That is true

[@vzhojh3845]

I’m Mexican and I approve this message.

[@Patrick_Hayes]

This is the exact comparison I was looking for. Thank you!

[@hrfunk]

You’re welcome. Thanks for watching!

[@HSmith-uk9hl]

Excellent video; one of your best. I like the .38 Super and load for it. The cartridge got a huge boost some years back when IPSC - and maybe others - wouldn't allow 9mm to make major due to over pressures and guns being damaged. To keep the high capacity magazines, many went to .38 Super that could make major safely. They now make the "Super Competition" cases for .38 Super that are rimless and work very well. The most impressive part of your video? The accuracy of your 1911 .38 Super. Better keep that one.

[@hrfunk]

Thank you! I really like that cartridge/pistol combo.

[@seanoneil277]

Thanks H. Smith. That's the advantage I'd heard about but didn't fully understand, in IPSC/USPSA. So it gets Major power factor without going to 10mm/.40/.45? More controllable pistol yet Major power factor. That's the advantage, if you're into the gaming side of it. Thank you.

[@paulman1970]

Thanks for the video. I have a Rock Island Armory 1911 in .38 Super, which I have not yet fired. I'll have to get a hold of some of that brand of ammo.

[@danbyers8462]

Wow! Better than advertised performance! Great video HR. Have been intending to get some of their ammo and now convinced this is ammo to get into.

[@hrfunk]

I've been quite impressed by their products. If you give them a call, they can tell you about the Manager's Special they are running. I've never heard of anything like it.

[@danbyers8462]

@@hrfunk thanks much HR!

[@MrThomass281]

I used to load 158 grain semi-wadcutters in .38 Super. Now I only go up to 147 grains on my 38 Super loads.

[@hrfunk]

Cool. What kind of velocities were you getting with them?

[@MrThomass281]

@hrfunk Around 1,000 fps. It was loads listed in an old Lyman manual using Unique powder. I sized them down to .356.

[@hrfunk]

@@MrThomass281 That sounds like a good load. You were beating +P .38 Special ballistics by around 100 fps.

[@johne1653]

Great presentation! I think of the 38 Super in Thompson SMG, although very rare. That HOP 38 Super ammo is hot stuff. The 38 super is more like 357 Sig then a 9MM. I carry Federal 9MM BPLE ammo. It had a good reputation for stopping problems. I believe it was the duty ammo for the IL State Police at one time. And, it way cheaper than Gold Dots or HST ammo. A grail gun would be a Colt Commander in Satin Nickel in 38 Super.

[@ronolson2024]

Looks like the 40 S&W, the Sig 357, & the 38 Super are closely matched. So ammo price & availability would most likely be the deciding factor as to which one you would purchase and shoot.

[@hrfunk]

I accept that the .38 Super is typically going to cost more. I shoot it becuase I like it. Thanks for watching ron!

[@mr.goldenrod291]

A Colt 1911 in 38 Super was one of those guns I should have purchased 30 years ago. The negative information about its accuracy prevented me from buying one. Because it’s a semi-rimmed cartridge and headspaces on the rim (versus the case mouth), was the reason given for the inaccuracy. As your video demonstrates, in the proper gun, it’s capable of fantastic accuracy.

[@hrfunk]

Some of the newer manufactured pistols headspace on the case mouth. I believe mine uses the older method and headspaces on the rim. The accuracy in this vide is some of the better performance I've seen from it.

[@TacticalTerry]

If you still want to dip into the 38 Super waters, RIA has a nice 1911 offering that won't break the bank. I am not a very good shooter, but the one that I had borrowed could shoot a whole magazine worth of ammo within a nickel at 7 yards (shooting standing vs down at the bench)

[@robertmakowski7808]

@@TacticalTerry Colt was the only company that used headspaced on the case rim barrels...all others used headspaced on the case mouth barrels... Colt finally came around in 1990 and switched...and for some reason never even acknowledged it... I have a couple of newly manufactured Colts and they are extremely accurate...

[@chrism5086]

My recent cartridge of interest has been the. 357 sig. Something that appears roughly on par with the .38 Super on paper, now that I watched your video. Just got all my ammo delivered for my new Glock 32 and I'm excited.

[@kevinrichardson8859]

357sig velocities and energy EASILY surpasses 38 super!!

[@geofftimm2291]

@@kevinrichardson8859 If it's fully loaded, the SIG load by SIG drives a 124 gr HP at around 1500 fps. Other sources have lower velocity.

[@kevinrichardson8859]

@@geofftimm2291 even higher...underwood 125 grains routinely get 1550 fps from Glock 31s..confirming my comment about 357sig performance surpassing 38super ballistics

[@hrfunk]

Perhaps, but the 357 Sig will never enjoy the mystique of the .38 Super.

[@chrism5086]

@@hrfunk Very true. I'd say that .357 Sig was never given a fair shake from the beginning. It's a very underrated cartridge

[@neiljonielunas5069]

Glad to see you shooting the Davidsons Metro again. I bought mine after seeing your review some years back. Mine has never seen a factory load. I have a good supply of Federal 115 Hi Shok bullets, and run them hot. The desert Jacks hate it. I’ll have to chronograph it this spring.

[@hrfunk]

Thanks Neil. My handloads with a 124 grain Hornday XTP run right around 1350 fps. There's a lot to lioke about this old cartridge!

[@PabloSniper]

Your test is wonderful! Congratulations! Can I make a request ? Could you make a chronograph comparison, using 38 Special, 38 Super and 357 Magnum ammunition, using a 357 revolver?

[@hrfunk]

I could, but there’s a lot of data available for the .38 Special and the .357 Magnum. If you search for that data, you can compare it to the .38 Super results I recorded in this video.

[@PabloSniper]

@@hrfunk But in this case, I would like to see the performance of that caliber (38 super) in a revolver. I did this in a video here on my channel. But I didn't have a chronograph to measure. kzbin.info/www/bejne/ppCug2d6lruJitU

[@rtaggs8178]

Got some House of Payne .38 Super 115 gr at a very good price. I was a little disappointed that they did not have any 124 gr in stock. Feel good already about finding a good defensive load in .38 Super.

[@hrfunk]

In case you couldn't tell, I really like that ammo! I think you will be quite happy with it.

[@donaldday1281]

Had a colt 1911 with a compensator, all tricked out for competition. Loved it absolutely loved it. Great round.

[@jeremye6516]

If you’re a fan of 38super in 1911 you’ll love it out of the tanfoglio defiant. Hard to get firearm but hop seems to be obtaining hard to get firearms.

[@hrfunk]

They actually have something similar (but made in the USA). I might see if they will loan it to me for a review. Stay tuned!

[@paulscountry456]

Good length barrel really helps that 38 super was impressive with 357 sig energy.

[@JJ_SDWR]

Wow, what a photo on the left, did you time it perfectly to capture the combustion of the cartridge before it came out of the muzzle?

[@hrfunk]

Nope, I just got lucky! If you look closely at the photo on the right, you'll see it there too (just not as obvious).

[@toddschutter6535]

Happy to hear that HOP is producing 38 super ammo! I just took delivery of a good supply of Underwood 38 super defense loads. As soon as work allows, I'm going to get to the range and try them in my Kimber Target 1911. FYI, 38 super +P, as it is officially called these days, is considered a "semi-rimmed" cartridge. Underwood is using 38 "Super Comp" cases, that eliminates the very slight rim. This aids in feeding and reliability and is supposed to work in weapons chambered for 38 Super +P. I fired some Super Comp rounds through my pistol last fall and they worked fine. We'll see how these Underwood loads do. I'm going to have to try the HOP loads. Good to have choices. Also, if you are looking for less expensive practice loads, AIM Surplus usually has PPU rounds in stock. Not the hottest loads, but good for plinking and a good source of brass.

[@hrfunk]

Thanks Todd!

[@mattnw42]

Some guns might need a slight extractor adjustment.

[@albertojuarez8324]

My old man has an old colt combat commander in 38 super it was the first pistol I ever shot now that I’m old enough to buy my own guns I bought my first 38 super I love this caliber

[@zogger5281]

Interesting. I was always interested in the 38 Super. Unfortunately, HOP will not ship to NY.

[@hrfunk]

Too bad. Sounds like it's time for a road trip to Ohio!

[@zogger5281]

@@hrfunk LOL!

[@libra7624]

They got some good loads, not watered down but some good ratings exceeding that 500 ft/lbs mark

[@derekmorrow1040]

Really appreciate this information; it's hard to come by currently. I've been very interested in .38 Super, ever since I learned of it from our police chief who carried one (Novak-perfected Government model) in uniform. He was a pretty legendary lawman and shooter, so no one really had any room to question his choice. Anyway, I hate that it's fallen out of favor in terms of availability of both guns and ammunition, considering its stellar performance characteristics. I'd love to have one.

[@hrfunk]

I really like the .38 Super it’s one of those old “gun guy” cartridges like the .44 Special and the 30 06. Men who knew a thing or two about stopping bad guys selected firearms chambered for cartridges like these for a reason. Thanks for watching!

[@dalejenkins5102]

Plus p + review , I'm a 38super guy really like the round in the 1911 platform. I kinda always thought it to run hotter than the 9mm . And your right crowding in on a 357 magnum load .

[@hrfunk]

I like it too. It's a great all time cartridge!

[@martyinthecounty]

I like the super. Since i have 2 glock 10mm i swapped out my kimber 10mm barrel and mags to a cdnn sig 38 super barrel and carry underwood in it. Now ill get house of pain ammo. Informative vid . Thank you.

[@hrfunk]

My pleasure Marty!

[@mikereinhardt4807]

Considering the groups you achieved I would say both rounds are tack drivers. Well done and very entertaining!...

[@maxmccain8950]

Our local agency just switched from a Winchester Ranger 124 +p to a Speer Gold Dot 124 +p+. I’ll have to talk to a couple buddies of mine to find out why but I’m sure cost and availability had something to do with it. It’s kind of ironic that they went from a 40 to a 9 for less recoil and controllability but now they’re right back to where they started. Thanks for another great video sir. Be careful not to fall into the u tube trap. So many of my favorite channels have been deleted. They’re falling right and left, just what u tube wants.

[@hrfunk]

I'm trying my best to navigate the ever changing youtube seas! Thanks for watching Max!

[@mitchellross2400]

Hi. I wondered what brand of 1911 handgun you used to test the 38 Super ammo? Does HOP munitions have 38 Super hardball? A year ago I paid $60 for 50 Winchester 38 Super silver tip hollow points (both the bullet and the case are nickel plated, producing a round resembling a silver bullet like The Lone Ranger's!). Are HOP's hollow points in the same price ballpark? Julian Hatcher compared the 38 Super to the 9mm in his "Textbook of Pistols and Revolvers". He found that the 9mm could penetrate 8 one inch pine boards, while the 38 Super could penetrate 14. (I suppose 9mm has come a long way since 1929!). Thanks!

[@hrfunk]

My pleasure Mitch! That .38 Super Silvertip load has always been expensive, but it was one of the few descent defensive loads out there. I would rate the HOP Munitions loads in this cartridge to be as good if not better (it's definitely hotter). For in depth info on their ammo, I would suggest giving them a call. The phone number is on their website, and they are good folks to talk to.

[@mitchellross2400]

@@hrfunk OK. Thanks! P.S. Can you relate what brand of 1911 that was that you tested the 38 Super ammo with?

[@hrfunk]

@@mitchellross2400 it's an American Classic II produced by Metro Arms (PI).

[@mitchellross2400]

@@hrfunk OK. Thanks! P.S. HOP is no doubt a pun referring to "The House of Pain" in H. G. Wells' science fiction story "The Island of Dr. Moreau", where the doctor performed experiments with humans and animals, turning them into "Leopard Man" and other combinations of humans and animals. Charles Laughton played the original Dr. Moreau in the film, followed by Burt Lancaster in a later version. Wells also wrote "The War of The Worlds". Interesting, when Dr. Moreau tried to keep his mandate going about "The Law" as a way of maintaining order, the half human, half animal creatures rebelled after a while. They didn't like the experiments being conducted in the lab. There was Bela Lugosi, of "Dracula" fame, speaking the words "The law, no more!" The creatures rebelled to the demise of the doctor. (I love a happy ending, don't you?)

[@hrfunk]

I am a big fan of classic literature (to include Wells). In this instance, however, Payne is the HOP owner’s last name. Any association with the good doctor and his island is purely coincidental.

[@PhillipFelix-kw3zi]

I have wanted a 38super since I was a kid, 54 today and thinking of building my own.

[@hrfunk]

There are a few good factory versions out there.

[@411DL]

Nice presentation. I was really hoping by now the Springfield Prodigy would release in .38 Super. I'd like a double stack 1911 in my collection, just not in the missionary position of calibers. I wonder if your improvement of accuracy might be due to your gun running better with .355 rounds versus .356 or .357.

[@hrfunk]

Not sure, but I think all the ammo I’ve used have .355-.356” bullets.

[@robertmakowski7808]

....also...if you like to practice a lot with a 1911 in .38 Super and don't reload...just have a 9mm barrel fitted to the gun... Blast away with cheap 9mm and switch back to .38 Super when things get serious...

[@mountainhobo]

Curious, since the modern .38 Super headspaces on the case mouth, why hasn't a fully rimless version replaced the semi-rimmed one?

[@hrfunk]

I don't know, but there are rimless .38 Super cases on the market for handloaders.

[@bernardconeghen]

more than likely because of older fire arms out there

[@mosriteminioncause7741]

With the right set up this cartridge (.38 super) has taken many competitions in both the IPSC and USPSA sports shooting completions and is becoming a sought after gun in 1911 and Tanfoglio style platforms. It has suffered in the past from bad press. But this IS a highly accurate, controllable, and fairly powerful round. (and the124 grn. compares with the 125 grn. .357 sig)

[@tomcurran8470]

Great vid, gun, and caliber. I understand that the 38 Super was popular in South America because they had a ban for civilians having military ammo, and 38 Super was not military. See another comment about Mexico. Wasn't the 38 Auto rhe same as the 38 Super and was rhe first cartridge John M. Browning chambered in the 1911? KZbin had a warning for a vid for a guy changing nipples on black powder revolvers! Duelist1954 says any modification vids on even BP guns are banned by YT. He makes two versions, one for YT and one for Rumble.

[@brianmoore1164]

I love the 38 Super and find it to be very versatile. In warm defensive clothes the Super brings plenty to the table. It can be found with excellent top quality hollowpoints flying at very effective velocity. In fun day on the range clothes it has very tame recoil and makes a good introduction to centerfire round for newer shooters. Much like a 357 magnum wheelgun, it has whatever you want when you want it.

[@hrfunk]

I would agree with that. Also, like the mighty 357 it has a cool history.

[@tearlach61]

On the 115 grain group, you got better as you went along, the last 6 shots was that ragged hole. I have a 38 super and it is one of my carry guns. It shoots great. I do handload and when you handload your costs come way down into 9mm territory as long as you recover your brass, and as long as you can find components primers being the big one these days.

[@franciscochiriboga2268]

Apparently HOP load their ammunition quite hot. Right after watching this video, an old one from Paul Harrell popped up, comparing the 38 Super to the 357 Sig; the former shot from a 1911 Colt pistol, and the latter from a Glock 31. The 38 Super was a Remington 130 grain +P load; it’s average velocity was 1182 fps, while the 357 Sig was also a Remington load, 125 grains, with an average velocity of 1436 fps. The HOP load is right up there with the 357 Sig. The question is: is the HOP load an exceptionally powerful one, or is the Remington load, +P at that, an exceptionally weak one? Btw, I like very much your presentations.

[@hrfunk]

Thank you! I suspect the Remington load is meant to allow a “safety margin” in case it’s loaded in older/more fragile pistols.

[@jonesclantd]

Very illustrative video. I'm always tickled by the optimism of the 9mm Luger crowd to believe that cartridge can do anything or be anything. Hell, I've heard plenty of similar comparisons of 9mm +P to .357 Sig. Oh to be young and naïve again. Semper Fi

[@hrfunk]

Semper Fi Paul!

[@Tatiana7.62]

I didn't know this caliber... 1920's you said? Now I never understood anything about ballistics and why choosing load or another. Does it really matter?

[@hrfunk]

That all depends upon the type of performance you're expecting. The .38 Super has a higher velocity and greater energy than the standard 9X19mm cartridge. It also has a flatter trajectory. The net result is a cartridge that is capable of better performance (all else being equal) at a greater range.

[@Tatiana7.62]

@@hrfunk did the military ever consider the 38 super instead of the 9mm??

[@hrfunk]

@@Tatiana7.62 Not that I know of. It was however used by federal law enforcement officers in the late 1920s and 30s.

[@geofftimm2291]

@@Tatiana7.62 Back around 1900 the US Army was evaluating .38 caliber semi-autos, but then demanded a .45 caliber for "stopping power." Look up "Forgotten Weapons" on KZbin and see his video on 1911 history.

[@Tatiana7.62]

Thanks for your answers !

[@charlesgroves3096]

I don't think that I've ever seen a 1911 shoot that tight. None of mine will do that. Good video.

[@hrfunk]

A good 1911 is capable of very good accuracy. I have some others that are more accurate than the one in the video.

[@danoneill2846]

yep

[@toddgillison7210]

You could definitely see how much snap the Super had over the 9. Very good groups Chief!! Thanks for the video. Have a great, safe week!!😎🍻

[@hrfunk]

Thanks Todd!

[@larkinoo]

I can see why Paul Harrell likes the .38 Super so well in his 1911 platform. I am impressed now as well. Like you said Howard it is at .357 Magnum velocities and power in a semi-auto [ uh, not to be confused with a ' fully semi automatic ' gun :-} ] and in an inherently accurate platform like the 1911 and 10 rounds in the clip......uh, er, I mean the ' box magazine ', it is a formidable handgun, especially being able to reload with a handy second clip. Uh, oh there I go again........I mean ' box magazine ' !! :-} :-}

[@Paladin1873]

Over the years there have been lots of claims and speculation that the Browning Hi Powers are not strong enough to handle +P and +P+ loads unless heavy recoil springs and buffers are installed. Even then, some complain the slides are not up to the task. I suspect, but cannot prove, this is more likely to be the case with older pistols, particularly those of wartime vintage or ones that have seen hard service use. As a result I tend to baby mine (though not the newer clones). What has been your experience?

[@hrfunk]

I tend to stick with standard pressure ammo in mine for the same reasons. The few I fired in the video didn't cause any problems, but I would not feed them a steady diet of the hot stuff.

[@johnherr3579]

I never had a problem with my High Power that I got in the early 70s. It survived a lot of Finnish Lapua surplus that was pretty stout and some of the high pressure original Supervel hollow point ammo. I do think they were pushing the envelope when they chambered it in 40 S+W.

[@TietLung]

Many times the newest latest and greatest firearms are just historic guns that someone reskinned to look new. When guns like Glocks came out there was really nothing new about it. They used a Browning designed system running a round that's a little older than the 45 acp. The newest thing was polymer frames, which had been done several years before. Striker fired guns go as far back as the late 1800s. So most all the "new" stuff, is really just old stuff with a shiny new look. I myself do prefer the classic looks and materials though. Theres something about steel and wood that just feels amazing in the hand.

[@AlexandruNicolin]

I think the main limiting factor on pistol loads is the fact that for most models the feed ramp is cut into the chamber, thus leaving a portion of the case unsupported. Probably with a fully supported chamber and case head most pistol cartridges could be pushed to way higher pressures. I wonder how a 9x19 mm loaded to 50,000 PSI would perform.

[@hrfunk]

I suspect recoil could become a factor.

[@cliffhouser9138]

Thanks for another great informative video. Amazing shooting!!!

[@hrfunk]

You're welcome Cliff. Thanks for watching!

[@iaidagger8278]

Good morning Sir as a fan of the 1911 Government Model in38 super caliber and due to legal restrictions in my Country Argentina, I would like to Knowles hoy the 130grains FMJ compares to the 124gr and 147gr FMJ in 9mm caliber, in special in the stopping power area-metropolitana and penetration,we are allowed only to use FMJ ammo for self defence in pistols. I should be very pleased with your experiencia inútil!! Thank you very much!!

[@hrfunk]

Thank you. I do not have any 130 grain FMJ ammo. If I get some, I will test it.

[@iaidagger8278]

@@hrfunk You are welcome Sir!!

[@chrissanchez9935]

Sir, Thank You for the informative video. I wonder if handloaded .38 Super ammunition be a good defensive load using Speer Gold Dot 124-gr bullets (Product No. 3998).

[@hrfunk]

So long as it functions well in your handgun, I think it would be a great choice.

[@chrissanchez9935]

@@hrfunkThank You. 🙏

[@andreawhalen4142]

Great vids Hr, keep em coming brother.

[@hrfunk]

Thanks, will do!

[@johnshepherd9676]

HOP might have either used a commander to test velocity or shot at 7 yards maybe both. Chronographs readings may also differ because of elevation and ambient temperature.

[@Mk-uh4jo]

I am quite impressed with this company! I had a question about shooting this fairly HOT ammo in the partially unsupported chamber barrel of my recently acquired Astra A-80 in 38 Super +P pistol made in the mid-"80s". I filled out their contact portion on the website on Sunday PM, and got a call back from the President of the company next day! I was thanked even for my small order as I was only trying it out and was assured they use only NEW components, including the brass, and these are not re-manufactured and I would be fine. I call that Great customer service, and I greatly appreciate that service!

[@hrfunk]

That’s the kind of people they are. Welcome to the HOP family.

[@ElainesDomain]

Good to see Mr Tack again. Good video.

[@AjackLee4]

I think the thinking is that rack grade basic 38 super is on par with +P and +P+ 9mm, I think that holds true. However that's not apples to apples so I appreciate your video, not many people test ammunition at it's optimum performance :)

[@kentuckyboy541]

Like you I love the 1911 platform. I've always thought of getting a .38 super. This makes me even more interested. Its just the cost and availability that has kept me from it.

[@hrfunk]

Be sure to watch my video coming out Saturday morning.

[@bernardconeghen]

look around for a used rock island 1911 38 super I got one for 299 former owner gave it up over feeding issues problem was bad magazines and I found out mine came with a ramped barrel, added a full guide rod shoots great I own four 1911s and one witness 17 round all 38 super

[@mario90030]

Great video I have 3 colt 38 super in my collection and I love it

[@allencox3782]

I always have a off center when someone is shooting next to me! I think I loose that shot concentration! Also I have a Kimber 1911 38 Super!

[@tearlach61]

Follow-up thought. Most 38 Super factory does not load to the cartridges full potential. I have a 124 grain load that does in excess of 1300 fps out of a 4.25" barrel and this ammo you were shooting was shooting quite in excess of that out of a 5". Nice to see a cartridge manufacturer loading a cartridge up to its full potential.

[@hrfunk]

I was so excited when I found out HOP was loading this cartridge. I hope they sell a bunch of it so they keep it in their line.

[@karsonbranham3900]

That was some expert gun control on display there! Well done sir!

[@hrfunk]

Thanks Karson!

[@nikos6220]

Nice energy levels, that is close to 357 Sig territory. Plus due to the cartridge dimensions you would have the same number of rounds as a 9x19

[@hrfunk]

Yes, but it is typically not loaded in double column magazines. The 38 Super uses a semi-rimmed cartridge and it doesn't always play nice with too many others.

[@nikos6220]

@@hrfunk thx. shame. There is another oddball you could look into - 9x21

[@hrfunk]

@@nikos6220 I wouldn't mind trying that one, or the 9X23, or the .356 TSW, or the 9mm Largo. The problem with all of them is the availbility of pistols and the ammo itself. At least I can find the 38 Super. Still, there's just somethingf cool about these hot-loaded mid-bore auto cartridges.

[@nikos6220]

@@hrfunk the story of the 9x21 is even more fun. It is the European and Latin American version of stupid regulation driven cartridge creation. In several countries you are not allowed to use 9x19 because it is a military cartridge 🤦. So basically the 360 Buckhammer of the 9mm world

[@PPISAFETY]

The .38 Super is a fine cartridge. But, I can see where the idea comes from that it is now little more than a 9mm +P. That is because that is how it is loaded by the major manufacturers. You may get 50 fps extra over a 9mm +P if you are lucky, often less. It is a good thing that you can go to some smaller makers who are willing to load their product to levels that allow the .38 Super to reach its full potential. Of course, there is also handloading. The HOP cartridges look pretty good. If you like that level of performance, you might also take a look at the .357 SIG. Factory ammo price is about the same as .38 Super, and I get 1,400 fps plus all day long from my SIG P226 with 125 grain bullets. And, I can readily buy Speer Gold Dots or Federal HST rounds should I want to use my SIG as a carry gun, loaded with something from a major manufacturer. This has its advantages. The .357 SIG is also a lot of fun to shoot. It is my "guilty pleasure" round of choice. Having said that, my SIG, as you said in another comment, will never have the mystique of Prohibition era coppers using the .38 Super to shoot at bank robbers through car doors!

[@hrfunk]

Thanks Brother Tom! If I’m completely honest, I think the history of the .38!Super is what I find most appealing. Bonnie & Clyde, John Dillinger, Lester Gillis, Earl Swagger. The list goes on and on. What can I say? I’m a hopeless romantic.

[@PPISAFETY]

@@hrfunk Back in the 90's I had a gig working live-in estate security on a built in 1742 plantation in Virginia. On the third floor there was a massive library full of mostly fiction, including all the Stephen Hunter books, with a very comfortable overstuffed chair to sit and read them in. I remember one about Earl Swagger, and some confusion about the wound left in a murder between the .38 Super and the .30 Carbine. I'm going to have to go back and "read" these novels again, this time listening to them with my Audible subscription. I think reading that book was the first time the .38 Super was really on my radar other than as an IPSC round. Thanks for jogging my memory and helping me plan my next audiobook purchases. PS, I just finished listening to W.E.B. Griffin's The Corps series. With audiobooks, I tend to visualize people from real life as characters. You are who I think of as the character Jack (NMI) Stecker. Cheers.

[@hrfunk]

I’m not familiar with those books or the character, but I hope he’s a good guy. On another note, I’m a big fan of audiobooks. I have several Stephen Hunter books that I enjoy listening too. At present, I’d say he’s my favorite author. By the way, if you get another security gig like that, and you need a flunky, let me know!

[@ryanranard5187]

A few companies load their 115s in 9mm to 1400fps and their 124s to 1300 fps like Underwood, Buffalo Bore, etc. I’ve seen velocity tests from these out of 5” barrels and often times the fps exceeds what was advertised as well.

[@hrfunk]

It’s certainly possible to hot rod various cartridges, the thing I like about the .38 Super is that it reaches those higher velocities within its normal operating parameters.

[@MarkSmith-vy3tq]

I've a .38 super. Never had to shoot anybody with it, and it has a tad more kick to it than a 9mm. It's like my 3rd go to (and it's ready) behind my .45 and .40. I wouldn't trade it for the world.

[@donpage4707]

I did not know the Browning Hi Power had a 5” barrel.

[@hrfunk]

Oops. 4 5/8". I must have been channeling a 1911.

[@2Aknight762]

UNDERWOOD and Buffalo Bore loads 9mm +P+ to the same specs as your Super loads. Their advertised velocities are usually a little lower than actual results.

[@The_Conspiracy_Analyst]

This is the same thing as "my 383 stroker can smoke any big block!!" type of thing. Yeah, it won't be doing it for long before it grenades

[@guardianminifarm8005]

Good stuff. Good old offering. Nice old 1911. I am impressed.

[@hrfunk]

Stay tuned. That pistol will be making another appearance soon.

[@wheeler71]

Good job 👍 👍 your post & test met /exceeded my expectations 👍 be well - persevere ⭐🔫🇺🇲

[@elsanch8675]

Beautiful pistol and nice shooting. I got my 1st 38 Super recently, Colt. Did I miss when you mentioned which pistol you’re using?

[@hrfunk]

Maybe. If I remember correctly, I was using my Iver Johnson pistol in this video.

[@elsanch8675]

Thank you

[@timclaus8313]

A 38 Super is a 9mm on steroids. Without over-stressing the pistol with over pressure loads, the bullets really cook out of the barrel.

[@BrokenBarBox]

Excellent video. I was just curious if you looked at any of the spent brass for signs of excessive pressure? Also, my factory magazines only hold 9 rounds and you mentioned having 10 round magazines. Are your magazines factory or aftermarket? Thank you for the outstanding content

[@hrfunk]

I did check the cases and there were no pressure signs. The magazines I was using were CMC Shooting Star 10-rounders.

[@BrokenBarBox]

@@hrfunk thank you Sir

[@johnherr3579]

Good morning HR. Nice to see 38 Super ammo loaded to it's potential. Lots of it is held to low pressure in deference to the old 38 acp pistols. Did you ever fire any of the original Supervel ammo made by Lee Jurras? That was some pretty hot stuff.

[@hrfunk]

I think I shot a little bit of that ammo years ago, but it was for a different cartridge. Maybe it was .38 Special. I don't remember much about the experience.

[@johnherr3579]

@@hrfunk I don't think they had 38 Super. I was using 9 mm with a 110 or 115 gr. HP. High velocities and I definitely remember the cratered primers.

[@balancedfordaylight1]

Curious the old corbon +P ammo I think tends to get higher velocities than the federal +P+

[@hrfunk]

It might. It's been a long time since I saw any velocity figures for that ammo.

[@amack1996]

Thanks for the discount code and impressive shooting! I think you can now consider your 38 super a very accurate 1911 in your collection!

[@Mk-uh4jo]

What is the discount code I can not find it. Is it worth waiting for?

[@hrfunk]

For which sponsor?

[@doranmaxwell1755]

38 super is one of my favorites. Don't currently own one tho.

[@hrfunk]

You really need to remedy that deficiency!

[@doranmaxwell1755]

@@hrfunk LOl... sell me yours! My friends all accuse me of being evil for making them buy guns...

[@hrfunk]

@@doranmaxwell1755 Ha, ha! Forgive me if I hold onto mine for a bit longer.

[@doranmaxwell1755]

@@hrfunk If I didn't like you? No way would I forgive you!

[@geofftimm2291]

History of the 9mm or .35 caliber handgun round. At the end of the 19th Century, the Great John M. Browning, designed the first powerful semi-automatic pistols. Caliber designations were invented by the British, and then the advertising department took over. Despite the bullet size being .356 inch, or 9mm, it was called the .38 Automatic Colt Pistol, because Colts paid the bills, and the fixed cartridge versions, infinite versions, of the paper cartridges of the .36 “Navy” Colt percussion revolver, had been called “38 Caliber.” After much experimentation with the Colt automatic pistols of the day, the ballistics were roughly; a 130 gr jacketed bullet, at 1,175 fps, giving 398 foot pounds of energy. In European specifications this round was called 9x23SR. Over in Europe, they preferred less energetic rounds, firing low velocity light weight bullets around 9mm and zippy .30 caliber or 7.65 rounds at high or low velocity. The Kaiser’s German Army was looking at an assortment of semi-auto pistols to replace their ancient revolver. They loved the complex engineering of the Luger Pistol, with it’s watch-like fitting and fancy toggle action, so like the beloved Maxim machine gun. Then they looked over at the US of A, gasped and demanded the .30 Luger round be enlarged. The company, not wanting to spend an unnecessary Mark, just opened the case neck as much as possible, and the 9x19mm Luger round was born! Essentially, a shorter version of the 38 ACP with a lighter loading for effete Euro semi-males. The 9mm was originally loaded with a 124 gr jacketed bullet, at 1100 fps, giving 333 foot pounds. Meanwhile, back on the good side of the Atlantic, the US Army decided they needed a much bigger pistol round, because in the US of A, bigger is always better, and the .45 ACP was standardized. Colt’s having spent much money on advertising .38 caliber handguns, and given the robust 1911 pistol, decided to expand the market and souped up the .38 ACP with more velocity, and called it the .38 Super Colt Automatic Pistol, and they marketing department sold a lot. The Super was the same as the .38 ACP, but with more velocity, a 130 gr jacketed bullet at 1280 fps for 473 foot pounds of energy. 😁

[@hrfunk]

I was familiar with most of that info Geoff, but I don't think I ever knew about the genesis of the 9mmParabellum.

[@YellowHammer26]

👍👍thanks for the test. That was some really good shooting.

[@hrfunk]

Thanks Lance!

[@ethankaryadi37]

Idk if anyone has told you this, but you give off some real strong Paul Harrell vibes. Also, can you please do a video on conceal carrying with a suit jacket? Thanks.

[@hrfunk]

Thanks! I hear that occasionally and take it as quite a compliment. I don’t wear suit jackets too often, but I’ll see what I can come up with.

[@poppinc8145]

TISAŞ has recently released 1911s chambered in .38 Super called the _Regulator_ (5 inch barrel) and _Desperado_ (4.25 inch). You may consider them for future reviews too since there's not many new pistols coming out for the round. IDK if you're in touch with 'SDS Imports' or know a gunstore who can lend you guns to review.

[@hrfunk]

I know they unveiled them at the Shot Show, but I’ve never seen either one of them. I’d love to review one or the other, but I’m not sure they are being imported as of yet.

[@poppinc8145]

@@hrfunk They are being imported, that's why they were at Shot Show. At least one person on KZbin has recently uploaded a YT Short. SDS Imports tends to have a rep on AR15 forum and the guns began shipping to stores a few months ago.

[@thomaswhite2802]

Love a good tack drive

[@Tadicuslegion78]

There's a Sportsmans warehouse in my area that carries 38 super consistently, but never any pistols

[@hrfunk]

That's the reverse of what I see around here. Usually the ammo is nowhere to be found (and expensive if you do). For years I handloaded this cartridge, but now that components are ridiculously expensive, I'm happy to have a good source for factory ammo.

[@greybeard277]

Nice shooting there. Thanks.

[@granddad-mv5ef]

While watching you shoot the accuracy tests, it appeared that it had a significant recoil. After the chrono test there was no doubt---that stuff is HOT! And very obviously accurate, which raised the question in my mind, is the HOP ammo just that much better than whatever you were previously shooting? Think to try some myself.

[@hrfunk]

Most of my previous shooting with this pistol has been with my handloads. The HOP loads surpass my handloads by about 30 fps, and they also achieve better accuracy.

[@jeremye6516]

I think maybe hop used a different chronograph but I talked to them and they used an ivers johnson 1911 and a RIA 1911 in testing.

[@The_Conspiracy_Analyst]

I hope that Browning Hi-Power wasn't one of the aluminum framed versions

[@hrfunk]

It is and it survived.

[@bernardconeghen]

FBI agents in the 1930s preferred the 38 super for its ability to go through the heavy steel car bodies once the 357 came out the popularity of 38 super fell out of favor as far as police were concerned the revolver was king if anyone wants a high capacity the 17 round tanfoglio witness is avalable but has a new importer check the internet PS great video I have 4 1911 and one witness in 38 super enjoy