Should Christians follow the Old Testament Law?

Original Video: • Torah Tuesday - Tattoo...
You can read more about Christians' relationship with the Old Testament law in Dr. Imes' book, Bearing God's Name: Why Sinai Still Matters (IVP 2019).
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[@ringthembells143]

Following scripture faithfully this way actually requires more of us than just looking at it like a rulebook. Thank you so much for this awesome insight

[@EddieSiwy]

The law was given to show us that we're sinners [21] Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law. [22] But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe. Galatians 3 : 21-22

[@patrickpierce4752]

Matt. 5:20 has me leaning hard against following a Pharisaic approach, obsessing over the written verbage only to miss the broader heart-changing point. Christ then goes straight in vs. 21 and onward to a series of examples as to how to interpret the bigger picture application of the Law. The Torah isn't a minimum obligations manual. It's a living "Tree of Life for those who take hold of it." It's not static or dead.

[@Raccoon_Mama.]

Question: please explain how "evangelicals" "christians" whatever you want to label them.....how do they rationalize Trump? A man who has broken EVERY commandment. I cannot get a single person who considers themselves a Christian to answer/explain it. PS- Laws are LAWS. It is, indeed, the final word.

[@CarmenJoyImesPhD]

I am just as baffled as you are. The only way I can explain it is to say that many Christians think that he supports individual freedom, which would support the freedoms of Christians to gather for worship -- a protection of religious liberties.

[@notofthischurch2822]

Those who profess Jesus but vote for a thief to rule over their house are convenient Christians. Rallying behind a law-breaking failed insurrectionist to serve as head over the country he sought to overthrow says more about his political and financial supporters than him. It says that they have a vision for the country whereby they seek only to kill and destroy. They only use Christianity as their shield and mace to beat an afraid electorate into submission. History proves that neither Jesus nor Christianity needs any secular ally. From 325 AD, following the promulgation of the Edict of Milan, which advocated religious tolerance, Christianity was established among all the other existing world religions. Today, all that's familiar to the world is Christianity (Acts 5:34-39). So, don't be moved by their "freedom" claims, religious or otherwise. There is no loyalty among thieves. Freedom is what they intend to deny and deprive. Too much freedom leads to demands for openness and justice. We now have a party and a polity who've had enough of both. I've never seen so many people who, in the name of Jesus, are so hellbent on going to hell in their deference and loyalty to serving a wanna-be dictator. There's only one LORD, and His name is Jesus. We should remember that America is founded as a "nation of laws." It is a divine settlement, given it testifies that we serve no man. Whether king or despot, as a nation of laws, we reject them all under the auspice that in our house, we will serve the LORD.

[@jeremiahmatos6009]

@@CarmenJoyImesPhDwhat are you talking about? We have all sinned and fallen short of God’s glory. Please be baffled enough to say that next time somebody poses the question of a politician that is also a sinner.

[@hamhead2765]

But isn't Trump the chosen one? The son of man? 😅

[@johnsonc8]

Tim Alberta’s book (the kingdom, the power and the glory) addresses this. Highly recommended. An evangelical himself, he traces the marriage of evangelicals and nationalism back to the Carter presidency. Easy read too.

[@mayaportland8805]

If you're talking about God's law, it should be followed exactly what you are talking about 😮 Isn't that the cause of Eve's sin ? She didn't follow Exactly the words of God.

[@danielcoetzee5793]

Adam and Eve wasn't given the Law (ten Commandments). They were given one simple prohibition "Do not eat from the tree in the middle of the Garden namely the Tree of the Knowledge of good and evil". They were not given the Ten Commandments to keep. And the One Prohibition was never given to Eve by God, she received it from her husband, Adam, not from God. She disbelieved her husband and disobeyed Adam, not God. The sin of disobedience and disbelief of God was that of Adam, not of Eve. Adam heard it from God direct and Adam should have believed and obeyed God. Instead he listened to his wife and to the devil and doubted the Word of God. That was the test. And Adam failed it. Then he blamed his wife. But it is all on him, no one else.

[@CarmenJoyImesPhD]

You're right that Eve got it second hand. The Bible places the blame squarely on both Adam and Eve. Both transgressed the command of God. Both man and woman were told to rule the earth and subdue it (Gen. 1:26). Both were responsible to guard and keep the garden. The problem is not that Adam listened to his wife, but that his wife had set aside the command of God.

[@homemadetheology]

Your statement "how can I live that faithfully in my context" what would be your biblical proof for that. I am not sure that I can see that in Scripture.

[@JosiahTheSiah]

Read and compare Exodus 21:2-11, and Deuteronomy 15:12-18. Note the similarities and differences. Then note that the narrative context has changed, and a very good explanation for this is that the laws given in specific contexts are preserved for posterity as wisdom literature, not as legal requirements. Because otherwise you would have two contradictory requirements.

[@CarmenJoyImesPhD]

Paul gives a good example of this in 1 Corinthians 9:9. He's applying the Old Testament law about oxen to pastoral ministry by considering the point of or principle behind the law.

[@homemadetheology]

@@JosiahTheSiah I must be slow, can you further clarify, when I read both passages I see the same, except Exodus has more detail than Deuteronomy. Just because the wife and the children of the slave are not mentioned in Deuteronomy does that mean that the statue set in Exodus no longer applies? I am confused.

[@JosiahTheSiah]

@@homemadetheology read again! They are very similar, but with some key differences. If you are having trouble, try diagramming it.

[@homemadetheology]

@@CarmenJoyImesPhD Got ya! I see it. Thank you!

[@justinbennett9998]

One, i repeat ONE being EVER told god "i can bring them law and order".... Thats all i have to say here. Enjoy.

[@danielcoetzee5793]

We are not Israelites. We are not Children of Abraham by blood offspring. We are children of Abraham by faith. And we are justified by faith in Christ, not by obedience to the LAW. The LAW was given to Abraham's descendants as part of God's peculiar Covenant which God made with Abraham and his descendants. For the most part, we are "heathen", not Hebrews, and therefore not included in this covenant of circumcision. But even people of the LAW and the Covenant and the Circumcision are justified by faith in Christ, and not by the LAW. The Law is of no good to them if they have not faith in Christ, for the Law justifies no one. Only Christ does. The LAW ("Ten Commandments" et all) were not given to us that are not Hebrews. The LAW is NOT God's Universal Law as is supposed by many people. The LAW was not given to Adam in the Garden of Eden. Neither was the LAW given to any one in the pre-flood world or the post-flood world. Enoch wasn't given the Law, neither was Noah or any of the people who perished in the Great Flood. Neither was the Law given to Abraham, Isaac or Jacob or Lot and his wife. The Law was given to Moses to give to the Hebrews after He lead them out of slavery in Egypt. Neither was the Law given to any of the nations of Moses's time or any other time after from Moses until Christ or afterwards. And Christ certainly did not give us the Law when He came to give us God's Word and God's Salvation and God's gift of eternal life and to give us His Spirit. Christians are given God's Spirit, NOT the Law or the Ten Commandments ! Christians serve God willingly in the spirit through the Holy Spirit, not through obedience by force of the Law. If we were under the Law, then we would still be under condemnation by it. But we are not. "There is therefore no condemnation for them that are in Christ" because they are not under the Law, but under GRACE !!

[@CarmenJoyImesPhD]

Thanks for your comments! No, we are not "under" the Law, but it is still God's gift to train us in carrying out our mission as his people. I wrote a book about it, called "Bearing God's Name: Why Sinai Still Matters." No one ever got saved by obeying the law -- not the ancient Israelites and no one today. The law was always a matter of mission.

[@Andrea-hf8hl]

Romans 6:1-2 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin that grace may abound? Certainly not! How shall we who died to sin live any longer in it?

[@OsopherPhil]

@CarmenJoyImesPhD @Raccoon_Mama. Hmm I know we are all on different wave lengths & or levels …. I would like to know more about these “laws or LAWS” in whatever way one prefers to put it, can one and or both of ya’ll please establish clear and concisely to those of us who are not Privy to what laws you speak of? I Genuinely would love to hear both perspectives! Thanks for taking the time to read and reply! P.s. any and all are welcome to respond to the ??’s that have arise!!! feel free to share any value or input you know will help the ones that are open & ready to receive!!

[@CarmenJoyImesPhD]

I've written more extensively about this in 'Bearing God's Name: Why Sinai Still Matters' if you're interested. If you don't want to buy the book, it's available through many libraries and I've done dozens of podcast interviews about the ideas in the book. Blessings!

[@robertlamb4254]

In MY context? That sounds like a self-serving loophole.

[@CarmenJoyImesPhD]

I can see how it might sound that way. People could certainly use this to get out of obeying commands they don't like. But that's not how I mean it! I'm following Paul's example when he says that the law about not muzzling an ox (which could not apply literally to Paul) should be applied to paying pastors. If we consider the principle underlying a law, we can better assess how to live out that same principle in a different cultural context. It doesn't mean that our current culture is king, but only that it's the context in which we seek to live out radical faithfulness to God.

[@zackmeaders6199]

Always funny watching religious people talk about which one of their fan fictions is canon😂

[@mayflower5359]

Seriously? Get over yourself.

[@ringthembells143]

You’re talking to a sister in Christ here. Also you’re talking to one of the top scholars in the entire world. She is dedicated her life to study in God‘s word and offers her life as a sacrifice to others to help them grow closer to our father and Jesus. Even if you disagree with her on certain points Stepping on here like a keyboard warrior showing disrespect only reveals the hurt that is inside your heart. if you don’t like the content, please feel free to keep scrolling. But no matter where you go choose to follow Jesus and to maybe ACTUALLY love others as you would yourself. This fulfills all of the law and the prophets.