Treviso Or Minrathous? Which City Should You Save? [CC]

[@ShotgunsAndSalt]

I save Treviso in my canon. When the decision is first given to me we get all the information my Rook can make the decision on: so far we know Treviso has no standing army and the crows are its only defence, while with Minrathous we know that it does it has a standing army, an active resistance movement, a guard and their templars. From my perspective by going to Treviso I'm protecting the group with the least backup, who needs every last person willing to help they can get, and trying to defend the innocent people just living their lives as well. To me, and my Rook, that seems like the most obvious decision.

[@TeroTheShortOne]

Minrathous has a panopticon with magic laser beams. It really should have been fine for taking on the dragon at least.

[@sanddanglotka]

Had the same reasoning

[@carole5648]

same

[@NorthernIndra]

My first Rook saved Treviso, and while it was a easy in-character choice (he was a dutiful Crow, and not about to abandon his House and his Talon), it was a fairly easy choice out of game too: I understood the choice on offer to be "save people of Treviso vs. thwarting a coup in Minrathous", and.... with the context of the Lucerni disbanded, Dorian lacking any allies in the Magisterium, the Archon and the Divine being silent, my question was "is it at all possible to thwart a Venatori take over? or would it be just a delay, at the cost of Treviso's population and economy?" A Tevinter taken over by the Venatori becomes an existential threat to all its neighbours, yes - but not immediately, not until they manage to deal with the Antaam. Meanwhile, let's face it: Venatori arose a decade ago. They are not only still around, they seem to be more powerful in Tevinter than they were during DAI. The resistance, while not entirely futile, was demonstrably incapable of keeping Venatori in check so far. Even if they thwart this specific attempt at an outright take over, they will fail sooner or later. On the other hand, Treviso will just straight up die if the dragon isn't chased away, and unlike Minrathous, they don't have a standing army of mages - or a flying citadel with laser canons.

[@Knight1029]

I am not gonna be able to watch this video because of spoilers, so, here a comment for the algorithm. I do love the choice and the drama involved.

[@samanthajospaulding6699]

Treveso, no matter who i romance. Minrathous suuuucccckkkkksssss.

[@nerd-jock]

I'm playing a shadow dragon on my first run, so saving Minrathous was a very easy choice, as he's a VERY loyal person. He feels guilty about it, but he knows he would make the same decision every time. I love the dialogue you get from Neve, after: "A lot of people are alive - a lot of people have a chance - thanks to us."

[@benswallow4985]

What was insane tho for my canon first play through was a Crow, yet saved Minrathous, due to the fact that as a character who, in my head canon, knew the Venatori are ruthless as he was an Tevinter born elf who runaway. The interaction with the Crows, especially Jacobus, will comment initially about that decision then when we help as much as possible - it was incredibly immersive

[@willowparker-ct3pq]

I chose to save Treviso in my first run, and while I want to do a second run to see the alternative, I’m pretty sure Treviso will end up being my canon, for one reason: Rook puts people first. That’s why they’re in trouble with their faction at the beginning of the game. Every faction backstory is some variation of, “Rook chose to save innocent people, even though it meant botching the mission.” So, in my reading, that is a core aspect of the role BioWare is asking players to inhabit with Rook. Now, I can see an argument for playing a Rook who regretted the decision they made in their backstory, and resolved to act more pragmatically moving forward. Indeed, given the significance of regret as a theme in Veilguard, I do think that would be very fitting. In that case, choosing Minrathous makes perfect sense. But personally, I chose to play a Rook who stuck to her humanist convictions, and to me that meant she would obviously save the unguarded city under active occupation, rather than the one with the standing army and active group of resistance fighters.

[@porshMeh]

I saved Minranthous my first go round and saved Treviso as a crow my 2nd play through,the missions when you save minranthous is more fun in my personal opinion,even when you save treviso you don’t really get to see the city get better which I didn’t like

[@noreehix5714]

It was honestly a tough choice. Treviso has no standing army and it being smaller they have a lot to lose. With Miranthous slaves are used in blood rituals, the shadow dragons get k*lled and displayed. The Venatori are not only starting a coup but taking power for themselves. My canon choice is Treviso because of what Lucanis said that it would hurt the people there and poison the water and mess up the infrastructure.

[@LatinaVixen91]

Exactly Treviso politically makes sense

[@jeremiahkisimba5938]

I love this game

[@ChroniclesofNoria]

Same!!! 🙂‍↕️🙂‍↕️

[@LeNimph]

Treviso is definitely my canon choice. Idk of it's because my career in public service but I just can't let the common man suffer like that. Also the blight is genuinely terrifying to me, though admittedly not as scary as it used to be in the series, the idea of letting hundreds get blighted like that is something I can't handle without guilt. Also I feel so called out, it wasn't my intention to start that discourse 😂

[@GarethOfByzantium]

Just finished it! Also love it, despite its shortcomings.

[@insomnia3454]

Minrathous because neve really made me love it 😭 also the missions and everything are better

[@maosomniatrix]

I did both. Personally I like the rainy atmosphere on minrathous more hence why 2/3 playthroughs I chose this option. But if it fits the rook backstory or romance I might go trevso again whenever I start a fourth xD

[@MarikaStarflower]

For me personally it would always be Minrathous, but since I roleplay my characters and some of them are not like me at all for them it will vary. I saved Treviso on my second run and I liked it fine, Minrathous just feels more right. And I really like Viper.)

[@eebee8052]

my 1st rook (mourn watch mage) decided to save treviso, mainly from that economical point of view. my 2nd rook (grey warden, qunari warrior) went with saving minrathous, definitely would prioritize pushing back against the venatori with the shadow dragons as the backstory i wrote up for him has origins from once being a slave. i do appreciate how grey warden rook actually gives advice on how to slow down the blight in the canals to teia and viago too, as they'd have the best experience.

[@MononokeLynn]

My headcannon is saving Minrathous. Tevintor doesnt really care outside the magisterium, so all it has is the shadow dragons. Treviso has a king who has an army, and it also has the crows.

[@TeroTheShortOne]

Antiva *doesn't* have an army, though. They only have the Crows.

[@jizamkizam9611]

I saved Minrathous. I felt like it would be way worse for the Venatori to take over and give the gods easier access to whatever military and magical might the city has. While I do feel bad for what happens to Treviso, most all the major players in the Crows survive and the gods don't really gain any magical or military advantages considering it was just a merchant city. Also just from a player standpoint, I love the visual changes Treviso gets when compared to what happens to Minrathous

[@サザランドアンドリュー]

My first Rook was a Shadow Dragon, so I chose Minrathous to prevent a Venatori takeover. My second Rook was a Grey Warden, and saving Treviso seemed like a more logical choice for him as the city couldn't defend against the blight. The final act also made me think that saving Minrathous might be a waste of time.

[@angiep2229]

Okay I'm gonna try not to send you a zillion comments! I find your comparison interesting between Minrathous and Treviso. To me, I see them as basically equally important. You're right about the Shadow Dragons being great resistance fighters against the Venatori. And I actually feel that the Antivan Crows have been filling a similar role, opposing the Antaam. This is a newer situation for Antiva, and in the past, I would not have seen the Crows as heroes (anti-heroes?). The recent development with the Antaam occupation changes it to me and, to me, puts both cities in similar equations, where the differences are so complicated and nuanced, where I can't really weigh them out myself.

[@CharLynnWiegel]

I saved Treviso because it gave me more of the feeling ( lucanis and the crows to) that I would feel worse if it fell and I liked the people better. Neve didn't argue the case well enough for me to care. Plus lucanis had a funeral to go to

[@Gggly2513]

I’m still on my first playthrough and chose to save minrathous for much of the reasons you shared; both choices end in devastation and innocent lives lost, but at least I can keep some of the resistance alive and they can help the innocents. And as it turns out you can still help a blighted Treviso a good bit- not enough to completely cure it (at least as far as I’ve made it through) but enough to be a part of that city’s own resistance group and make a change, even a small one. The most difficult part of the decision for me was the blighted canals- the amount of people that would affect is disastrous. I still don’t feel comfortable with chosing it- and I shouldn’t feel comfortable, as the game says in many of its themes, tough decisions SHOULD be tough and make you uncomfortable, because the moment you become comfortable with sacrificing others is the moment you’ve lost. It’s really interesting to hear your insights on possible motivations for saving treviso as well. This decision is made even more difficult because any of the reasons to chose one city could also apply to the other, albeit in different ways. It’s not so simple as big picture vs small picture, rebels vs common man, politics vs personhood. Because it all overlaps. That one comment you mentioned about the shadow dragons having more casualties than the crows meaning that minrathous is objectively the better choice, and the realization that people aren’t looking at the implications of thinking that way really stuck with me. I’ve seen a lot of arguments for either city but none of them feel… compassionate (? Not the perfect word but I can’t find a better one) enough about the value and cost of ALL lives during war/crisis, not just fighters and not just civilians. It’s way more nuanced than it appears at first glance, and honestly makes it harder to choose. Because you’re not just saying “x saves more lives than y so it’s better” but you’re having to consider the long term effects of saving one person over another. Which is not an easy decision to make, nor does it make one feel very good about oneself, even when lives are saved. Been really loving ur exploration of veilguard! There are a few videos I’ve had to hold off on since I’m not yet finished, but I love your approach with considering the themes in their greater contexts. It’s not just a fantasy story, but a story about people and how they survive and fight back, and that is relevant to all of us, magic or no. Thanks!

[@ReadandFindOut]

This was such a hard decision for me! I went back and forth about it for like five minutes just sitting there. On my first play through I saved Minrathous, as I was playing an Elven Shadow Dragon so I felt like those stakes felt very real for my Rook (Ariadra). I also thought that Minrathous was a larger city so it had the potential to impact more people overall. I'm on my second play through now and plan to save Treviso. This time I'm playing a Qunari Antivan Crow named Sihu. I'm still not sure which one feels right, both have such a big impact!

[@Icipher353]

I couldn't decide which to save so I flipped a coin to decide. My Shadow Dragon Rook ended up saving Treviso and boy was Neve pissed! 🤣

[@theWizofRoz]

It was a hard choice, but as a shadow dragon I thought it made sense to save the people of Treviso. Rook made a decision to free slaves in a doomed mission, so of course they would be there to save the everyday person they fight for in the first place. There is no right answer but for my Rook, it was about saving people

[@inaka6645]

I saved Treviso on my 1st playthrough. It was an incredibly hard decision for me. I had to leave my desk and walk away to think. In the end i made a decision not on what i the player knew but on what my Rook knew. My Rook was a Veiljumper and seeing what the blight and gods did to D'meta's Crossing really shook her. She didn't want anyone else to have to experience that and would do everything in her power to stop it. She also didn't fully understand the threat of the Venatori and the way Neve and Lucanis explain why each city needed help, Treviso appeared to have the more urgent need. She was hoping she could save both, naive as that was. On my 2nd playthrough it was actually just as tough a choice, even from a role-playing perspective. She is a Mourn Watcher, so understands the threat of the Venatori alot more, being more studied and experiancing them. However she still picked Treviso again for the innocents and not wanting the water blighted. The Mourn watch are responsible for "maintaining the balance between the living and the dead" and she felt that balance would be jeopardised should Treviso fall to blight. My 3rd playthrough i will be creating a character specifically to save Minrathous. I love this choice no matter how painful it is.

[@ract46]

I don't have a canonical playthrough yet. But I have to agree with your points on the choice. I don't seen either as a wrong or right choice. It is very much about what is the more important to Rook; saving the people or saving those fighting against a fascist regime.

[@nicolem3951]

I see alot of people saying they will save Treviso because they want to romance Lucanis and is the only way to romance him and as he is one of the most popular romance options it makes sense that this is the most popular option. But I dont agree with some opinions like saying only the people of Treviso suffer loses, Minrathous is a much bigger city and when Rook dont help them you can see people on the streets also saying people died by the dragon attack and lost their homes. People getting executed and stabbed by the Venatori (and harassed). They say they stick with Treviso because they prefer the common people but in Docktown we see the "common people" also on the streets and is alot of people, people act like Minrathous are just Magisters. I dont see how fighting against a group of slavers and mage supremacy and that uses people on sacrifices isnt sticking with the commom people too. Also the work of the Shadow Dragons that get almost completely destroyed is literaly fighting for the "common people" and theyre maybe the only chance that Minrathous have to change this. Also they just got attacked by an invasion of demons before too. Other people say because Minrathous have slavers they will let the city get destroyed, but theyre not thinking about the enslaved people themselves too that and that this slavers are not the most part of the population, but it feels like some people think if the people of the city is already suffering than they wont care to suffer even more. Also another thing people say is like: "Oh, I dont care if the Venatori takes control, I can save them later". But isnt like the life of all the people dead (and theres alot) and hanging on the streets will comeback, or a group known to enslave people and sacrifice them in blood magic rituals being in the power of the maybe most powerful city of Thedas people wont suffer or die. Is really hard saying which option is worst. Is like comparing Blight vs Sacrifices, Torture, Slavery etc. Another point too is if you see the map of Minrathous after it gets destroyed it also shows its also blighted, maybe not as bad as Antiva but theres also blight there. The Venatori is like the most powerful blood cultist and definitely will get even more power and make even more people suffer. Were giving to them the biggest city with "big Guns" to be used against their own population. And although Treviso is defenseless is a smaller city and we cant compare in numbers which side suffered more loses. Because even though Antiva looks like it lost more people, but because is a smaller city, not like Minrathous that is the capital of Tevinter and probably one of the biggest if not the biggest city of Thedas, it looks much more worse but is easy to not be seen in such a big city when people are getting killed and disappearing. Like if a city of 10k of population lose 5k of people it looks much worst than if a city of 50k loses the same amount. Also giving much more power to the Venatori and the gods with all these blood magic it have probably consequences much bigger too than we can see. Maybe some people just wants to give hope to a city like Minrathous that never have seen hope and that even some players thinks isnt worth saving anymore. Also, gameplay perspective if you choose to save Minrathous you get to quests that will help the city that you wouldnt get by saving Treviso. I felt saving Minrathous we lose less content and less faction points (maybe because when we save Treviso the Shadow Dragons are almost completely gone while the Crows are still good)

[@GarethOfByzantium]

I saved Treviso because I was romancing Lucanis.

[@angiep2229]

I'm so excited to see your video about this! When I first finished, I was looking for reviews and was just getting tons of results where people are losing their minds because it's "woke." Where the hell have they been? Dragon Age has ALWAYS been like that? I think this must be the same people who only recently realized "The Boys" is not centrist, and think that Green Day is "suddenly" political. SMH. I'm also in my 2nd playthrough, and I also totally plan to play all the romances (and I'll play as part of each faction). I romanced Lucanis in my first playthrough, and saved Treviso. This one, I saved Minrathous and am trying to romance Neve (but the game says I"m romancing Davrin somehow??? He needs to wait his turn!). One thing I noticed is that when I saved Treviso, the people of Minrathous were fairly understanding that I had made an impossible choice. But in my current playthrough, I saved Minrathous. Several people in Treviso keep telling my Rook that everything is my fault! I swear I did not see this resentment when I'd made the other choice. I do have some criticisms of the game, but overall I really loved it, and it totally made me cry. I'm going to stop before my comment turns into a novel, but there's a good chance I'll be commenting again later. :)

[@user-my7zl8ol6b]

It was a tough choice, but I saved Minrathous in my first canon playthrough, whitch even more crazy considering that my Rook was an elf Veil Jumper and quit kind-hearted one. The Venatori & Blighted Gods' menace for whole Thedas was such present in this game that my Rook tried everything to... well, "minimize the damage" as someone could say. By the end of the game, I realized that it was almost pointless and I felt very bad for Treviso.

[@sonply]

I saved Treviso first, then Minrathous on the second run. I actually liked the story better on the second run. Both cities have a fighting chance that way(we also get more Dorian, that's important). Saving Treviso is a bit more tragic, looking at what happens to Minrathous and, more specifically, the Shadow Dragons in that choice. On my next runs I'll probably decide based on who my Rook is, so thanks for the video!

[@ALtheuncommonicedragon8360]

I really appreciate all your thoughts & analysis as I think it picks apart motivations & inclinations players can have in making this choice. I thought of it as larger sociological threat vs a more small scale but more devastating ecological threat But I think as great as your video is it also hammers in to me how badly Lucanis romance was written & implemented. Cause I realized that on my third playthrough and second romance Lucanis playthrough I didn’t even try to factor in any of this cause I knew there was no other choice I could make that would let me go that route. My first romance Lucanis playthrough was as a crow so it made role play sense to save treviso. But second playthrough I saved minrauthous in moment just cause I did treviso on other playthrough. Made up a reason later it was cause my elf veil jumper was more concerned on impact of venatori controlled tevinter would have on elven population. By time I did my third playthrough I realized I had done the double dragon fight, a much further point in story with no real character justification on why I saved treviso over minrauthous. The Lucanis route romance ends up burying & washing away any of the nuances of that choice for me as a player cause it defines that entire route by that choice.

[@sorchaazuragaming4765]

I chose to save Treviso for my first two play throughs, because I thought that Minrathous could handle it better. Even though the magisters are heavily corrupt, at least some of them would be smart enough to fight back, and lessen the damage. The thought of blight in all of Treviso’s water supply was just chilling to me. I’m on my third play through now, and this will be the one where I switch. I am not looking forward to Lucanis’s reaction. The poor guy has been through enough, and I’m gonna destroy him ☹️

[@Dicyroller]

I was playing a Crow. My city is occupied by an invading force that treats our people badly. We have been trying to figure out how this happened. We failed the city once I was not about to do it again.

[@galilea723]

This choice made learn something about myself. First playthrough I was playing as a Shadow Dragon so I save Minrathus (not the only reason but was a big one) Seeing Treviso blighted was socking sure but didn't faced me much. Second playthrough I save Treviso... and this is when I learn something The aftermath of blighted Minrathus... the police state and the desisdents hanging on the streets made me really uncomfortable. I guess it was too real for me. Hated have to go back there to do Neve's quest of whatever. I guess my brain handle better the fantastic violence of Treviso (fantasy venice gets magical cancer) to the more realistic violence of Minrathus. Food for tought for those that say this game doesn't has dark stuff in it...

[@Keeli129]

Will alway save Treviso since it has been confirmed that if i do not i can not romance Lucanis. So yep not thinking hard on it any more.

[@shiv43402]

Im on my second run too and each time I saved Treviso. The first time, I wasn't romancing Neve or Lucanis, I chose Treviso because they were talking about blight in the water that would poison the water and I thought that was awful. Also I didn't care for a venatori coup cause I am the hero here of course i'm going to save the day and beat them all 😅. For the second playthrough its only because I want to romance Lucanis, but next I will choose Minrathous just to try and see the differences. But if I were to choose à canon I think I would always choose Treviso because of the innocent dying from the water...

[@ChroniclesofNoria]

I keep alternating but right now my thoughts are definitely inclining more towards saving Treviso. It makes me feel absolutely TERRIBLE for Ashur though 😖😖

[@MissNWilson]

I think ultimately I would save Treviso in my canon story. I cannot justify to myself condemning a whole population of innocents to the slow, horrible death of the Blight. But I will say I love the intense weight of this choice in the game. It's a decision that haunts you no matter what you choose. Veilguard definitely makes you feel the stakes presented in the narrative.

[@PhoenixRizing25]

I chose to save Treviso in my first playthrough. Part of the reason was that Lucanis was my romance choice but the slavery in Teventer was a big factor as well. In either case civilians are at risk. In my canon playthrough it will probably still be Treviso, although I will save Minrathous at least once to try it both ways.

[@ChroniclesofNoria]

I might also settle on Treviso as my canon but will also try to save Minrathous a couple of times too 😖😖

[@skyrider13001]

In my first play through I saved Treviso initially to romance Lucanis, but ended up with Darvin and his baby griffin. I loved Neve’s character and I really appreciated how deeply she cared for her home and the people of Minrathous, so when the Shadow Dragons were killed along with her home being destroyed, I could really see how my decision messed Neve up on a deep level. I actually enjoyed the l journey of slowly rebuilding her trust in me. However with that being said, on my second play through I will be saving Trevios again and committing to the Lucanis romance lol. When I do a third run i’ll pick Minrathous to really see the change between the two cites.

[@abracadaverous]

I saved Treviso on my first run and thought the state of Minrathous was terrible. Then I saved Minrathous on the second run, and the state of Treviso was shocking by contrast. At least Minrathous stays Minrathous if it's destroyed, but Treviso becomes one huge festering carbuncle. It seems Minrathous is more resistant to infection.

[@mattphoenix4702]

From a pragmatic point of view, saving Minrathous is the best choice. Every country in Thedas is based on a real-world empire. Ferelden is England. Orlais is France. Kirkwall and the Free Marches are the Palatinate. Nevarre is Egypt. Par Volen is the First Caliphate, and The Qun is Islam. Rivain is the Caribbean during the golden age of piracy. Treviso is essentially Venice. Minrathous is Rome. Just like its real-world counterpart, Tevinter is in slow decline, its borders being encroached on, its military might waning, and barbarians at the gate. Objectively though it is still incredibly wealthy, its internal policing sufficient to keep the Venatori in check, and its army has been successful so far in keeping the Qunari in check. While Treviso may be a nice place, in terms of importance it’s just… it’s not important really. If Minrathous falls, so too does the best line of defense in Thedas against the Qunari. Treviso just does not have the same level of importance as Minrathous does. It’s Rome against Venice basically.

[@veraalves6874]

In my first run, I saved Minrathous, because I was focused on the political side of things. People would die regardless, but saving the place that favored my goals seemed wiser. Upon replay and seeing other people talk about the choice, I noticed that I sounded like Solas lol. "People die all the time. It's what they do". Both cities will eventually rise from the Blight, but the civilian casualties are so greater in Treviso. Definitely an interesting decision they picked for the player to make. For me it goes beyond "what's the new world status" and more "What you, the player, values more under desperate times". I believe a Telltale's Tales from the Borderlands dev once said, very freely paraphrasing here "Right and wrong decisions aren't very interesting for the player, but questioning their morals is. If they ping-pong around the choices, they'll leave thinking about how it challenged their views, and if they stuck with something no matter what, they'll feel that despite everything, what they believed was true to them".

[@nicolem3951]

I deleted my comment. I thought when youve said you was on your second playthrough it meant you had finished the first already. Maybe because english isnt my first language I didnt understood it right

[@ChroniclesofNoria]

No offense taken. I realized after I responded that it’s possible that you must have misunderstood me. I’m running 3 playthroughs at the same time so I can catch most of the slight differences in the game. But because I’m doing them in batches, I’m furthest along in my first playthrough where I just finished defeating the blighted dragons (and saved Minrathous) In my second playthrough, I’ve picked up all the members of the Veilguard. Trying to sort out all the companion and region requests before I head to the Wetlands and then do Weisshaupt (I saved Treviso in this one). My third playthrough, I’m just about to pick up Lucanis (haven’t decided which city I would save yet). Because I’m really enjoying the game, I want to fully get everything it has to offer as many times as possible. Thank you for deleting the comment. And I do agree with a lot of your points that people also do not consider what the loss of the Shadow Dragons would mean for the slaves they’re trying to free in Minrathous, especially because slavery for them is the default. It’s a good point and something else to consider. I don’t know if you have your comment saved somewhere else (I tend to type it in a notes app first before pasting on KZbin because KZbin keeps glitching for me and my comments disappear after I’ve hit post). If you do have the comment somewhere or can remember most of it, it would be nice if you can edit out the spoilery bits and then repost because I think your points are very good one that can add to the conversation. Thank you once again ☺️

[@nicolem3951]

Thank you alot. I really didnt wanted to give spoilers to you and ruin your experience. I really like your videos and the discussions here in your chanel. Next time I will take more care, because also maybe other people in the comments havent finished yet too ❤

[@ChroniclesofNoria]

@nicolem3951 thank you so much for understanding ❤️🤗🤗. And I’m glad you enjoy my videos 🥰

[@The_Babe]

I chose Minrathous because while I care about Treviso, they are currently occupied, so I figured that the blight would end up screwing over the Antaam there lol