Slavoj Zizek - Is Jordan Peterson the real Postmodernist?

[@iwouldprefernotto49]

If you want to get Zizek's 'I WOULD PREFER NOT TO' t-shirt you can do so here: i-would-prefer-not-to.com

[@estradiolvalerate8925]

The real postmodernists were the friends we made along the way.

[@jibbdaorange3831]

Ha

[@mrginge143]

10/10

[@Jinx-iw6zb]

The real postmodernist is the one piece.

[@OpticShadow360]

Jreg is our leader

[@estradiolvalerate8925]

@@OpticShadow360 Back off he's mine :)

[@kitsune776]

I've yet see a comment section where people actually talk about what zezek has said

[@ChuckPalomo]

That would actually require effort, and let's be honest, most people, myself included, have nothing of value to add to an intellectual debate. Plus it's hard to disagree with most of his points because he never goes into details, only the broad strokes, so you can't really nitpick, and even if you did you would just be missing the core of the issue. That's why I always end up leaving his videos with a sense of passive agreement.

[@smhsophie]

because the sniff are funny

[@matthewshoemaker2211]

I think this is a symptom of the largely empty posturing and theatricsr which Noam Chomsky criticised him for

[@Andres-nn5it]

@@ChuckPalomo I agree. In these types of talks and conferences driven by qna that are pressed by time there's no room for details that can really be delved into or taken apart. However, I definitely think there is some room for discussion. I also think that his lectures are definitely the place to go for in depth ideas (also his books)

[@dargkkast6469]

Aha! I see this comment without my ideological glasses and all i see is "comply and submit"

[@amemename]

This guy must have had a hard time not touching his face during coronavirus.

[@zach99998]

Touching face Corolla virus

[@vinster9165]

Top 100 comments

[@itali5517]

Shame on you he touchs his face ALL the time because he got stoiaphthosis after trying to save his kids that died in a car crash.

[@vinster9165]

Marcelo Italiano Peixoto I got the coronavirus just looking at the guy

[@johan5512]

Haha exactly

[@lukeharrison4650]

I couldn't think of a better person to be called "Slavoj Zizek"

[@liltito1519]

its pronounced as zhizhek btw

[@primo4915]

Why

[@MouAresounTaPneusta]

?

[@PhatEpics]

Man like Zizek. Always a treat. Perhaps philosophers should be more prominent in our society, and less of a luxury but more a necessity. A philosopher for every corner of society, bringing moral issues to the forefront and keeping the leaders in check.

[@truthseeker1871]

philosopher? Where? You've got to be fair with me. I'll take you on any day of the week but I have to be able to understand you. I think the people who say they understand Zizek are lying to him.

[@daves-c8919]

n0j0ke Journalism theoretically keeps society and leadership in check. Philosophers should be the ones to guide us to a better life.

[@Volkbrecht]

Idk. Not a lot of philosophers out there who have a clue what they are talking about. The ones that are actually good usually do highly paid corporate or political work instead of public talks. That's the problem with philosophy. You can't be smart in a vacuum, you have to bog down and get deeply into the facts if you want to get things actually right instead of just offering something that sounds like a plausible explaination. Theories about the nature of truth and thinking only come into play at the very edge of our understanding, and even then only maybe.

[@truthseeker1871]

volkbrecht, good for you. You caught up with them. The handwaver Peterson and the nosewiper zizek are two good examples of crap slingers posing as philosophers. A lot of young boobs have been ripped off by these con artists posing as gurus.

[@truthseeker1871]

good point. so maybe we should allow all kinds of crapslingers to pose as philosophers so as to dumb down young people even further than they already are.

[@Yzjoshuwave]

I have no idea whether I agree with many of Zizek’s positions, but he is an undeniably fascinating character.

[@user-nc9pc3gr4c]

Hi is an idiot that says nothing but acts like he is saying the most amazing things.

[@MusicaDelCaribe]

@@user-nc9pc3gr4c ironic since that's peterson..

[@user-nc9pc3gr4c]

@@MusicaDelCaribe No, Peterson has an array of liberal intellectuals that agree with him and debate him. Nobody knows what this guy is trying to say. He is just the Atheist type that all the lazy thinkers gravitate towards

[@cbp117]

@@user-nc9pc3gr4c how is he an idiot? Clarify urself cause in ur opinion Jordan does not? XD did u see the slavoj vs Jordan debate? Most people no matter who u like knows slavoj gave Jordan some real work too do about a lot of things..

[@user-nc9pc3gr4c]

@@cbp117 I already clarified myself. This guy is a babbling idiot. Jordan is a very clear minded and well respected intellectual. And Jordan makes alot of sense when he speaks. I saw the debate and this babbling idiot made no sense.

[@erikpaterson1404]

Sometimes it's best just to read Žižeks books. But after you've watched a few of his videos it's the only voice you hear when you're reading them

[@CB-vx1fu]

if I were to what you recommend to start with?

[@PhatEpics]

This is true. I cannot unhear him when reading his work

[@thegoldensealion9463]

Man fuck you now I’ll be reading it like that

[@dlow364]

I quite like this guy and he definitely has interesting things to say, but man is he hard to listen to at times

[@u7angbe]

Rick wud demolish him

[@TechnocraticBushman]

Funny coincidence, in Shakespeare'splays, the moral was often delivered by the fool.

[@TechnocraticBushman]

@@u7angbe agreed. Total nuclear intelectual anal destruction with mom fingerbanging and tittyfiddling. That's basically the essence of discussion,especially among the wise.

[@DJWESG1]

Canadian innit

[@truthseeker1871]

He's hard to listen to ALL THE TIME. Where I come from you don't wipe your snotbox every five seconds while you're addressing an audience. He's impressing somebody. I don't know who. Definitely not me.

[@dionbridger5944]

Zizek makes a good point that those who considers themselves instruments of God's will can excuse themselves of anything; but you do not need to believe in a literal God for that to happen. We can be lazy and just point to Lenin, who acted as the agent of "history". All the same, it's a valid criticism that many people who LARP as traditionalist or conservative do not take their own stated values seriously. It applies to progressives as well. It's like wearing a sports team's uniform to show support, even though you don't play for the team.

[@dionbridger5944]

@Veni Vidi Bitchy I'm unclear what you're referring to exactly, but I can say this - humans are not "goodness machines", nor are we "logic machines". We are fundamentally a species of tribal apes, who are adapted to survive in the wilderness in tightly knit groups. The modern world creates a dislocation between our instincts which worked in the evolutionary environment, and the environment we now actually find ourselves in, and it's very difficult to bridge that gap by pure strength of a "logical" system.

[@dionbridger5944]

@Veni Vidi Bitchy Well, that is true. Though I would say, underneath apparent "logic" you usually find faith of some form, whether it's faith in God or Marx.

[@michaelneufeld4515]

@@dionbridger5944 this is very reductive thinking. Sure, we're bands of tribal apes, but we also split the atom and developed quantum computing. We are capable of being better, evolving.

[@dionbridger5944]

@@michaelneufeld4515 A vanishingly small percentage of people are involved in either of those things.

[@michaelneufeld4515]

@@dionbridger5944 Sure but we're all elevated by it, no? Isn't that what it means to be human

[@petergleave3198]

I like zizeck. He's a true ideas man. He disagrees with peterson on some points, but -rightly- knows that this is not an excuse to throw him out completely. I'm the same. On peterson and on others. I disagree with an aspect but will acknowledge where they make sense.

[@meatrobot7464]

I love how he drops in Eastern European dad jokes as if they're the foundation of his world view!

[@LeonY50]

The value of the victory is determined by the value of your opponent. Much respect for both Mr. Zizek and Mr. Peterson. As a Chinese citizen, which is an identity my government is currently trying really hard to erase from our society, I cannot overstate how much I appreciate this type of talks\conversations\debates.

[@superiguana1]

LMAO WHAT

[@sams8502]

You sir have taken the Red pill.

[@vladislavstezhko1864]

Russian here. I agree with you 100%. American people (and I blame no one) just do not understand how fortunate they are to have such an amazing culture and political system.

[@rmac8378]

@@vladislavstezhko1864 american political system is amazing? Have you seen the homelessness there?

[@vladislavstezhko1864]

@@rmac8378 I am from Russia!!! Compared with my country, the political system of the US is truly wonderful!

[@buteverybodycallsmegiorgio]

Timotheé Chalemet posed a good question!

[@martin8313]

he was made so nervous by the knife sharpening remark 😭

[@juniormakovsky9206]

He was just fondling a peach in his hand

[@maxkho00]

It was a genuinely good question. The answer to which is "yes, the left could learn that their ideology doesn't work". Zizek's answer is unsatisfactory: sure, modernity doesn't allow the stable existence of arbitrary transcendental values, but that is exactly why JP has become so popular ─ he has grounded these transcendental values in actual reality by erasing the distinction between the symbolic, traditionally understood to be "abstract", and the literal, traditionally understood to be "real". Well, technically, Jung did that a long time ago, but JP popularised this interpretation of the world, and it has clearly worked: his insights have genuinely helped millions of people to improve their lives. Why? Well, because these symbols are ACTUALLY grounded in objective reality. Religion isn't "useful fiction"; it's a cultural interpretation of an actual, existing transcendental reality. That's what the left can learn from the success of JP. And Zizek's characterisation of evil as being more spiritual than good is also misleading: it might _feel_ more meaningful at the time, but since a society based on evil is trivially unstable, all the perceived meaning will ultimately amount not nothing once society ─ and with it everything that makes evil meaningful ─ inevitably collapses. So you can really only be evil if you don't care that everything you do is ultimately meaningless. This makes it closely related to hedonism, which is also predicated on a disregard for the fact that one's actions are meaningless. The distinction that Zizek makes between hedonism and evil is very superficial, and in fact almost entirely irrelevant in this context given that postmodernism seeks to undermine notions of objective/ultimate meaning ─ which evil doesn't provide ─ not notions of personal meaning ─ which is the only thing that evil can provide.

[@corbinmarkey466]

I'm beginning to really enjoy Zizek, not only for his school of thought, but for all the high quality comments his videos produce. Definitely a more fun crowd than the Peterson types.

[@shanky1751]

All the Peterson fans say is libtard, lefty, SJW, facts and logic don't care about your feelings, it's getting a bit boring now

[@MrElectronix808]

Vladimir Lenin I believe you’re mixing the Peterson types up with the Ben Shapiro types in my opinion.

[@alexandruchristianapostol975]

@@MrElectronix808 they share the same audience as far as Im concerned

[@MrElectronix808]

Alexandru Christian Apostol in what way would you say?

[@Montenegrin1728]

@@alexandruchristianapostol975 the true jordan peterson fans is found in the biblical series comments. every ones in search for the truth, so you would find a quality crowd. His political and psychological themed videos is where you find the ben shapiro fans who are the boring types

[@rileylynch3200]

Don't be a bully, he is beautiful in his own way.

[@CosmicReapzZ]

You're allowed your criticism of society, this man deserves the same. When you no longer criticize and just gobble everything an ideologue spits it is nothing more than ideology, remain objective.

[@Quinceps]

@@CosmicReapzZ OK, but these guys are just expressing disgust at him as a person, not really criticizing any idea. Also, Peterson is more of an ideologue, telling you what to do.

[@UnMecQuiSaitLire]

I quite agree with you, despite he look pretty destroy and full of nervous tics he has an aura, a kind of ethos. I thing this kind of abstract beauty besides ugliness really become concrete once painted by a master with oil and so on x) i would see him kind of painted like on that typical portait of Beethoven

[@josephvanwyk2088]

CAN We please have ANOTHER Jordan Peterson vs Slavoj Zizek 2 hour debate please !!!

[@dirkmaes3786]

Last time that happened the patron saint of personal responsibility ended up in rehab...

[@Hypnopotimus27]

@@dirkmaes3786 From whatever he caught off Slavoj

[@parsasajedi2620]

@@dirkmaes3786 Richtig Sigmund! and thank god no one else has ever ended up in rehab. Just the big bad wolves.

[@paulmg6031]

The last one was so badly organised. I think JP has got bigger plans now anyway rather than debating with this guy

[@steviegreenthumb4720]

@@Hypnopotimus27 ...do you think rehab and the hospital is the same thing?

[@fromeveryting29]

What I got from Peterson was: - Be rational and take responsibility - Responsibility brings meaning to life - christianity and religion can be completely deconstructed and explained as evolutionary psychology Very valuable lessons, which led me to almost the oposite of his politics, which I find misguided, ignorant and irrational. Which contributed to me devoting a lot of my life to animal rights and going into the humanities in uni, which has brought me meaning, friendships, jobs, community, self respect and hopefully my influence makes the world a slightly better place to be born, no matter what body one is born into. I asked myself "what is MOST important in the world, today? What is the BEST thing I can spend my time doing?". The answer was clear. So, thanks, in a way, Peterson..

[@ChazinSthl]

I think Dr. Peterson would be happy to hear that you have found meaning in your life. I don’t think he would be upset that you happen to disagree with him. If anything, Peterson respects diversity of thought. His opinions are his own and he makes a pretty damn good case for why he thinks what he does. He’s not an ideologue. He’s smarter than what most people give him credit for. He understands the complexity of the world.

[@NoName-xc6cg]

I doubt that Jordan Peterson thinks that religion can be deconstructed in a way which you describe

[@davidd854]

@@ChazinSthl I don't agree with you. I don't think Peterson wants the people who listen to him to think for themselves, I think he wants them to think like him and that he tries (or at least tried) to scare them into thinking like him. 'O you don't want to accept the concepts I present to you? Do you want to go to metaphorical HELL?' In that sense I think he's an ideologue as well, although he created his own ideology. So maybe that just makes him a thinker, those guys always agree vehemently with themselves. But I don't like the way he sells his stories. It seems sometimes that Peterson's philosophy is a way of reconciling Christianity with Nietzsche's critique of it, namely that it is a negation of the will or something like that. In that Peterson is trying to show that Christianity is in fact compatible with the will to power, as some sort of practical philosophy to climb the hierarchies of society. There may be some truth to it but I think it's a pretty perverse way of looking at a religion you deem to have value.

[@ProfessorTurnipAlpha]

Broke: "We live in a society." Woke: "We live in a modern era."

[@OompaLoompaFu]

Joke: "What do you get when you cross a mentally ill loner with a society that abandons him and treats him like trash? ... You get what you f**kin' deserve!"

[@harryf2705]

@@OompaLoompaFu But wait are they also drug infested? In that case they’re treated like heroes.

[@jacobvanveit3437]

OompaLoompaFu sounds like you’re echoing a little bit of incel tension?

[@OompaLoompaFu]

@@jacobvanveit3437 just quoting "Joker". Sarcastically adding to the structute of "broke, woke... joke". Is Joker an incel hero? Sure. It's a movie that appeals to whiny entitled Whites. Where do you stand in relation to them?

[@jacobvanveit3437]

OompaLoompaFu interesting! Didn’t realize it was a joker Joke. You bring up a valid point here. The joker could easily be an Incel! I will regard that movie now with a new light, having come to the conclusion that he very much could be an incel. Wasn’t really a narrative in the movie, but it is also creeping in the background somewhat. I wouldn’t necessarily point that him being white had anything to do with an incel nature, as there are many examples of incels being other nationalities. I would concede however, that minorities have a thicker skin when it comes to cultural differences and I’d say the norm, from the majority, would dictate an incel’s call to action, which in this case, the joker being a dysfunctional human against social norms, broke its rules and showed his true nature. His nature had been brewing for lifetime of failures and was ultimately a failure of his upbringing and environment. Parenting is so important! I try my hardest to be a role model for my kids. Cheers!

[@yototrash]

We need to bring Zizek in Serbia as soon as possible to start a public debate

[@hazelmuds]

why specifically serbia?

[@zlatkobrnovic8166]

Yeah

[@MrChet407]

You need some fuckin AR15s courtesy of the USA

[@ΠαύλοςΚ-θ9ζ]

We need to clone Zizek and distribute him everywhere

[@yototrash]

@@hazelmuds Because I am from Serbia... haha, I can't speak for other places, but I can see that we need him here :)

[@bleachwolf6936]

Man I can see the despair of men in Peterson's eyes... In Zezek's IDK he's playing darts

[@tristandesade8635]

ZIZEK IS A BRILLIANT CLOWN WHO'S MAIN MOTIVATION FOR RUNNING AROUND THE WORLD IS FINANCING COCAIN HABBIT. HE IS BRILLIANT CAUSE HE MAKES DEEP OBSERVATIONS, BUT CLOWN CAUSE HE IS UNABLE TO MAKE CLEAR SYSTEM OUT OF THEM.

[@kuylerray3295]

@@tristandesade8635 Are you telling me I can do drugs, and just spout deep shit in front of audiences for a living? Ahhhh an ounce of weed and all the time in the world to ramble.

[@alexandersantana24]

And so on and so on... Overrated guy

[@bleachwolf6936]

@@alexandersantana24 you know, I really think he's the smartest guy on the planet. But he's definitely stupid. And so on.

[@Hoonters-goona-Hoont]

@@kuylerray3295 Ever heard of Alan Watts?

[@Joshua-eb3fz]

The idea of symbolism in stories is that its grounded in generations of human experience. The problem with post modernism is that your personal "truth" has to function in the real world and withstand the consequences of the real world. Hedonism and self truth will always lead to more authoritarianism because internal truth requires external validation. Its too weak to stand on its own.

[@FeelMetalMan]

nice point

[@Woodside235]

Kind of reminds me how the mentality that promotes "treating everyone with respect and equality" paradoxically results in narcissism, in many cases.

[@raymondmaglaris4149]

thats a very good way to put it

[@vinayseth1114]

@@cokecan6169 Not really. Storytelling also evolves with time, and throws light on the era one lives in.

[@piccoloatburgerking]

Can't say i agree. Personal truths are only a smaller version of cultural truths and there are many of them flying around the world. What you believe to be true based on your and your generational experiences may be a complete falsehood and a subject of ridicule even to a culture that has a different internal mechanism. If there can be more than one truths on a cultural scale, there can be more truths on a personal scale. Morals are mostly subjective because of that very reason. Hedonism with objective restrains and balance does not lead to authoritarianism, the desire to control and shun it out of a perceived moral (hence subjective) truth does. Hedonism practiced with caution is an act of real appreciation of pleasure and life.

[@misterprofessor5038]

"You cannot say: 'I follow this because it is tradition.' That is the definition of modernity" I love this so much. It describes JP and his fans so well. None of his fans actually care about his biblical talk beyond it being a framing device to intellectualize their problems. They are all secular minded people. Adopting religion for the sake of following tradition would only create an illusion of morality.

[@HFTYKCK]

Projecting reality much

[@baldendoboriqua6391]

You shouldn’t generalize his fanbase like that. Based on the way that you wrote that comment it’s obvious that you have a biased view on JP. He never tries to teach anything in those lectures, he’s just sharing his interpretation on the psychology behind the stories in the Bible. Most of it is spot on as well! I agree that some people may do what you claim but certainly not ALL.

[@DakanFluff]

​@@baldendoboriqua6391 "He never tries to teach anything in those lectures, he’s just sharing his interpretation on the psychology behind the stories in the Bible" This is a naive way of looking at things. You're stripping away responsibility from his actions by implying that he has no ideology behind his words and that he is just there to discuss and share views on things that are subjective.

[@mathiashnsen183]

MAN! Do you know how many people who listens carefully to Jordan Peterson? Do you know how many people who have turned their lives around listening to him? He is saying stuff like: "Clean your room, because the world is a mess." A lot of people today are nosediving into som kind of meaningless oblivion because of the left-wing postmodern, nihilistic, feminist, marxist agenda, that every possible meaning agenda these days is of equal value, but at the same time, there is none. It really destroys people when we organize our societies after these principles. He is not saying anything to just give people a intellectual explanation of their pains and problems.

[@baldendoboriqua6391]

@@DakanFluff most people go to his venues just to get the opportunity to see him speak in person. It’s like a concert. You are assigning an arbitrary “responsiblity” to his lectures. Dr. Peterson doesn’t owe us anything. I wasn’t “implying” anything, if you actually watch and pay attention to his lectures for more than 20 minutes; you’ll hear one of his many verbal disclaimers, saying exactly what I just said.

[@emmanueloluga9770]

I came to the same conclusion Zizek stated in this video when I first got introduced to JP 2 years ago without any prior exposure to casual intellectual discourse. I was both appalled and amused that JP was so oblivious to the fact that he was also a living embodiment to the which he so critiqued in many aspects of his views, almost to allude to the Jungian element of a person failing to confront their shadow. Fast forward to today after having being exposed to more diverse povs and ideas, I wholeheartedly believe JP is a postmodernist in the fashion Zizek described in the video linked below of a person embodying and living out an idea they do not expressly uphold externally. kzbin.info/www/bejne/q2WxepmDmJiipLs

[@eyebrid]

I mostly agree, but it really seems to me that JBP is not so oblivious to being a postmodernist, but rather pretends not to be one as a devil's advocate strategy in bad faith. In a debate with Sam Harris he started with a critique of postmodernism which Sam agreed with but JBP immediately became defensive against dismissing it, saying "now just wait a minute, we need to give the devil his dues because I think there's something of value there." When arguing for religious dogma, he devalues facts by painting them as empty objects by asking "where is the value located [in Elvis's guitar]?" Sam brought the conversation back to reality by acknowledging it's a given that people infer value, but dogma doesn't replace facts, reason, and empathy, and that the complete analogy is that people can fight over his previous example of Elton John's glass of water but Elton John was never here [on this stage]. Peterson seems to be motivated by some deep seeded resentment that may be rooted in disbelief of personal agency, likely facilitated by a grift easily believed by conservatives lacking critical thinking with a penchant for being unscrupulous.

[@casualobserver2380]

Must be good coke in Slovenia.

[@zach99998]

uhh lol or bad coke

[@erksp7961]

You would think that, but he actually has never tried it if I remember correctly

[@vinster9165]

Either that or he has a perpetually runny nose

[@brendaortiz9185]

Vin Smith it’s got to be a tic of some kind

[@vinster9165]

Brenda Ortiz I got corona just looking at him

[@zzzzzaaaa9999]

Where do you find them?! This is one of the greatest clips ever! I love this channel!

[@cnseref1328]

People tend to forget that Peterson is a psychologist. His ideas are mainly psychoanalytic. Which means that when he makes a criticism, he looks at the unconscious drives that lead that person or ideology. And yes, postmodernism is a way of thinking that denies “meaning” and structures in any form. Well, this is “postmodern” part. And “neo-marxism” in Peterson’s mind includes a new religion - either in form of belief in historical dialectic or ideal of socialist utopia. So, Peterson means that even though this “postmodern neo-marxists” reject a set of values (which Peterson says “hierarchies”), hypocritically, they deify another ideology. Peterson wishes to create a structure of meaning. Look at the title of his first book: Maps of Meaning. His concern is the lack of “order” in today’s existentialist needs. In the process, postmodernism seems to the enemy of his point of view - in which he surely is not wrong. Zizek is a psychoanalyst too, but he is rather lacanian while Peterson is jungian. World perspectives are really different.

[@DJWESG1]

he is wrong.

[@cnseref1328]

Wes G If you say so!

[@DJWESG1]

@@cnseref1328 that I did

[@cnseref1328]

Wes G Good for you.

[@personeater2664]

cnseref Peterson is not a very good Psychologist. His ideas are largely refuted, especially as they begin to closely align with his politics.

[@1800JimmyG]

its extra fun to enjoy both thinkers

[@ricardoequiz7559]

Guy sounds like Transilvania Donald Duck 😁😂

[@andrespena2382]

hahahha you made my day with your comment Ricardo, thank you.

[@HegemonicMarxism]

Lol, I'm from Transilvania and I can confirm that's exactly how we talk 😂

[@robertclarkguitar]

Suffering succotash that's good coke!

[@donnaforrest2315]

Omg!! That’s freaking hilarious!!! Hahahhahahahah hahahahaha hahahahaha. HUGE BELLY LAUGH! Omg! I have to pee

[@ciri151]

So now we have kermit the frog and donald duck. Someone get them together

[@iv7796]

I love how Zizek fans start to clap yet dont even know what they are clapping for

[@MsMattmatt24]

I think you kindda missed the point of the video 😂 But yeah, clapping, so funny! Lol lololol.

[@iv7796]

@@MsMattmatt24 is there ever a point?

[@MsMattmatt24]

@@iv7796 I don't know. If you are a postmodern you will argue that the point is relative to the interpreter. But I am not a postmodern. You tell me 😉

[@javadshr67]

They clapped because he somehow took Peterson's argument down.

[@iv7796]

@@javadshr67 "somehow"...

[@richardthompson5436]

Peterson was a naive Liberal, and now he is a naive Conservative, without fundamentally changing himself at all.

[@ChickVicious237]

It's interesting to see the term "postmodernist" so often given to people we don't agree with.

[@jmdr7522]

Is that a real, unedited photo of peterson in the thumbnail?

[@iwouldprefernotto49]

Yes

[@WABRECORDS]

Of course it isn't hahahahaha

[@WABRECORDS]

Oh, searched google and it actually is.

[@HaIsKuL]

It is. It's from his Facebook when his daughter practiced her makeup on him.

[@jmdr7522]

He looks like a clown. Fits him pretty well I’d say.

[@jagkanlagapasta]

This is actually the first real criticism I've heard of Peterson ideas.

[@aramkaizer7903]

I completely disagree. He's speaking complete nonsense. I have absolutely no idea what he's talking about. He's not making any coherent points. "Evil is more spiritual than good" "Conservatives are Post-Modernists" Complete babble. The only valid thing he might have said is that political correctness could not equate to hedonism. But even that is arguably incorrect and is kind of an irrelevant point to make.

[@tdb517]

@@aramkaizer7903 Jordan Peterson sucks tho. Zizek's too good for him

[@austinmistretta8373]

You might also check out the article by Nathan Robinson in Current Affairs. Not a facile hit piece (like the one in NYT) by any stretch. I found it a potent and well thought-out critique.

[@aramkaizer7903]

@@tdb517 How much Jordan Peterson have you watched?

[@tdb517]

@@aramkaizer7903 A lot. Really a lot. As long as he talks about psychology it's very interesting, on almost any other topic he's clueless. Did you watch him debate Sam Harris?

[@giorgigudiashvili4876]

5:08 Good point, doesn't exactly do justice to Dostoyevsky, but still a fair observation

[@emill9540]

Hello. While it is a good point indeed, I also agree that it doesn't do justice to Dostojevskij. I listened to Petersson's lecture on existentialism, where he states that Dostojevskij's genius is partly found in his ability to let different characters portray various strong arguments, which are then being battled, more or less, during the book. So, it might be unfair to say Dostojevskij supported all of them, himself.

[@giorgigudiashvili4876]

@@emill9540 I remember that very lecture of Peterson ))

[@pontus4685]

I think Zizek gets it wrong though with Dostoyevsky if there isn't some further thought-chain I'm not seeing. The message in Crime and Punishment is exactly what Zizek is talking about god. We judge ourselves in terms with other people, and capability to ascend this comes with the pursue of some higher cause. In Raskolnikov's case, the god was Napoleon and other dictators he was admiring and when he abandoned this vision/god of his, he became again vulnerable to judgement of the society and other people.

[@emill9540]

Interersting! But: abandoned? Can you extend your thoughts, I'm most compelled to enjoy them! Indeed, Raskolnikov considered Napoleon to be above the judgement of others, perhaps godlike as such! Raskolnikov himself, seemed to posses the idea that his limits were only due to cowardice, and did he merely dare to... : would he evolve into a Napoleon! Then it was through his gods, that he was permitted to do harm, as an act of higher cause; of elevation above the herd, above the herd animal man, towards godlike omnipotence? Edit: godly->godlike

[@peraelawey]

I see where he is coming from but I interpret it very differently. When Dostoevsky says “then everything is permitted” he means that there are not consequences for one’s actions (e.g murdering and not feeling the least of remorse). Just the basics of morality.

[@GKViddingHD]

"Donald Trump is an obscene postmodern abomination and so on and so on" (waves hand dismissively)

[@marcinkryczka7044]

Looks like he is constantly making sure there is no cocaine left under his nose

[@vinster9165]

Marcin Kryczka shaking hands with him you get a palm full of snot and runny nose juices

[@viktoriyarts]

😂

[@Vojife]

It's clearly either OCD or Tourette's. He can't control it.

[@lilithmotherofmonsters6055]

@@Vojife could potentially be autistic stimming as well.

[@richardfeynman9341]

@@Vojife he got Bells palsy in his right side.

[@slybuster]

"I represent God, therefore everything is permitted" and "If there is no God, then everything is permitted" aren't mutually exclusive statements. The concept of something being God-willed is nebulous; therefore asserting oneself as an agent, regardless of what actions are being justified, is an open game. This is a very easy argument to make and doesn't require much thought; it's almost lazy. However, it's a philosophically arguable position that morality is phenomenological and thematic over time; moving into a post-religious society may therefore represent a destabilization of normative ethics once embodied within an institution (i.e. a church). For someone with metaphysical sensitivities that accept the idea of a universal ethic, someone who situates the materialist aspect of the argument within institutions (with regard to them being fallible representatives that attempt to embody meta-ethical principles), the idea that the removal, or usurpation, of that institution is representative of a widening abyss makes perfect sense. An assertion of conceptual ownership of God and/or God-willed doesn't negate that aspect of the void being alluded to by Dostoevsky (and Peterson).

[@ChuckPalomo]

Yeah, I think Dostoevsky even criticized that very notion which Zizek alludes to with The Grand Inquisitor, where he presents the very institution that regulates morality as morally bankrupt by necessity. His implied answer (or at least I think that's what Alyosha's character was supposed to represent in the book) to the apparent contradiction resided, as you said, in the belief in a higher level of ethics that's universal and above the more materialistic aspects, and is therefore incorruptible and eternal, no matter what institutions, whether religious or secular, embody morality in a given historic period. So basically the question of morality resides in each individual's personal relationship with God, it's up to us to uncover the underlying truth of the universe. It's not really a good answer but at least it avoids the problem posed by those 2 statements.

[@lawd_sele]

If Socrates talked like this, I get why they had him killed...

[@jernejpirih6320]

I m actually proud to be Slovenian for once... Lol

[@modestoney1577]

why?

[@Matthe9256]

Why?

[@scotttatertot69]

Man, his criticisms of Peterson are absolutely spot on

[@Jake-gx6hm]

A criticism of Jordan I can respect.

[@goofboopi]

No you're the postmodernist, No YOU"RE the postmodernist. Children, you're all authentic, shush now and dream of reality.

[@jdci75]

That poor mic has probably contracted coronavirus now.

[@Black_pearl_adrift]

Hes had the virus for years before anyone could discover it 😅

[@blueseugene6569]

Cocain is a hell of drugs

[@jdci75]

@@blueseugene6569 🤣

[@DoughBoy45]

Ha. No. That mic is now addicted to cocaine.

[@marioeduardoflores7577]

@@Black_pearl_adrift yes its called colombian flu or cocaine addiction.

[@avinashprasadfilms]

We live in a society

[@ThePhreakass]

Top 10 heel turns in WWE

[@machinicassemblage]

comrades, zizek is our only hope…

[@robertmyers6488]

Hope for what?

[@Nicoladen1]

I feel like alot of people think JP is defending the idea of there being a godly being rather than the idea of there being an intrinsic transcending value in the individual which to acknowledge and harness is the intention of the religious scriptures.

[@marcusonesimus3400]

Nicoladen What on earth is 'intrinsic transcending value' unless God, a personal Being of supreme intelligence, has created us and assigned such value to us? What 'religious scriptures' do you have in mind? One must distinguish between the Word of God, which is the Bible, and counterfeits of all kinds. But the specificity of Biblical revelation is a scandal which many do not wish to accept. Why should Israel receive the revelation and not China? After all, China is more populous. How is it that there is only one Son of God? But the Bible explains these issues clearly.

[@The80sWolf_]

I belive that because of the hegemony of liberalism, the majority is stuck in idealistic solutions, and it's postmodern af. Be it liberal proggresives or libertarians, even the western left is stuck in it.

[@osamabinobama4954]

Lets expand this thinking, is the individual searching for a idealistic solution postmodern? Are people who search for a meaning trying to cling to the past when its already been disintegrated? (Nietzsche: God is dead quote). What is the way forward if not to fall back on old ideas of race, IQ, conspiracies, or hyper liberal ideals? All this is super confusing tbh, been struggling with it for years.

[@The80sWolf_]

@@osamabinobama4954 I see it as we are raised in a individualistic ideology, so that is why we only see individualistic solutions. Also so much that in need of collective solutions, it's still because of like "self interest" and to safeguard to still be a liberal individual. If that explains anything?

[@simone9781]

@@osamabinobama4954 The solution is just to do what you can do well,and that's it. Learn a trade,maybe. Most people in the past didn't even had an education and started working at 14 years old. Perhaps they were happier back then,nowdays our generation has the opportunity to do ANYTHING ad yet they're constantly dissatisfied,makes you think about missed oppurtunities. Also,it is a lie that wealth=happiness. People nedd a purpose in their life.

[@neilhaughey6869]

@@osamabinobama4954 When Nietzsche said God is dead, we killed him, what makes anyone think that rather than having no God, he wasn't replaced with something else to worship instead? It amazes me more people don't ask that question. This is core to the modern fantasy of a world without belief, everyone believes in something and denying they don't is perhaps an even greater delusion than our forebears many of which understood the perverseness of the church.

[@The80sWolf_]

@@RuggedEgde Thats idealism, and the "sacrifice their child" argument is a stupid strawman argument.

[@ChielusMaximus]

I don't think JP's "solution" to the current times is either simple nor does it offer the kind of naive, fundamentalist, post-modern ideals as Zizek claims. It's more about walking the path of the buddha and less so about goosestepping with the boys. To claim otherwise would be to fundamentally misunderstand everything JP has been saying.

[@Simon53188]

One of the few men that have challenged JP and succeeded, very intelligent. Zizek is very straight talking. Truly fascinating to listen to.

[@JohnRenfrow]

LMAO, you can get a sense of the intellect of some in the crowd at @ 2:05. Zizek is getting ready to start his argument, hasn't made any actual points yet, but starts off saying Peterson's definition "is an obvious nonsense"...and people started clapping lololol. Even Zizek gives a look like, "you idiots, I haven't said anything of substance yet." I disagree with a lot of what Zizek says but I appreciate that he makes an effort to form a logical position instead of calling everything "racist" and deciding only by emotion. I can respect anyone who makes a good faith attempt at that.

[@rapisode1]

No they agree because they know that the terms are being misused.

[@zhiyako4032]

A lot of people amidst this "online medium" forget the virtue of respecting one another, and they start acting like total clowns when they disrespect great people online. You could never do that face to face. And it shows the stupidity with which these people act when the "curtains are closed". For some of the followers of Slavoj Zizek and Jordan Peterson, what the hell is wrong with you lot? You guys are disrespecting these two figures as if you're better than them yourselves. They have worked like crazy to get to where they are, and they're trying more than you, in the least, to make the world a better place with all that they've been able to accumulate. The disrespect is ugly, and idiotic.

[@roarblast7332]

I recommend leaving the narcissists alone. The attention seekers. The validation seekers. Everyone knows healing is out there. They have to choose to seek it. Arguing, fighting, or even paying attention to these people is going to drain you of Energy that could be put to better use somewhere else, or on someone else.

[@martinzarathustra8604]

Honestly, most people don't understand either of these guys. They are punching way above where most people react, think, and believe. Peterson is better at reaching that group than Zizek, but Zizek is a trained philosopher, and philosophy is much harder for average people to understand. Both of them require an intermediate level background in philosophy/psychology/history and political science to even just get what they are talking about, let alone really understand what the disagreements are.

[@zhiyako4032]

@@martinzarathustra8604 Yes that's part of the problem. People simultaneously misunderstand them and follow them like tribal leaders, and this partly explains the reasons of their behavior. An obvious example is what the channel owner decided to put on the thumbnail, all as an attempt to mock Peterson. The same thing happens with some of Peterson's followers and it's all contrary to what the two are actually attempting to teach. If you've seen their debate, you must've noticed the reactions of the listeners. They weren't there to learn, they were there to see who's gonna win, and that seems more like a tribal warfare rather than an intellectual discourse.

[@zhiyako4032]

@@roarblast7332 You're correct, the more I focus on these people, the more mentally drained I'll really feel.

[@manuelmanzanero5057]

Take disrespect and trolling out of the equation, and 95% of YT and social media activity and content will magically evaporate. Social media are the group therapy of the 21st century. It is the main barrier to prevent the resentful, the sick and the brainwashed ones from overcoming their own cowardice and turning into real monsters.

[@sam-pf5cs]

This channel always has the best thumbnails istg

[@williamshakemilk2192]

So much jargon in these comments, who wants to type out all of this shit?

[@Aganilsson]

The idea that Dostojevsky said in some books that without God everything would be permitted, was not originally taught by Dostojevsjy but by Fichte. That was an idea wich some intellectuals was debated in the first half of the 19th century. I more think that Dostojevsky was debating this idea than expressing a view. He himself told that his main purpose was to make an objective view of the time he was living in.

[@davidd854]

Yes, isn't this what the protagonist in 'Crime and Punishment' says? Is that where it comes from? I mean that doesn't necessarily mean that Doestoevsky believed it himself.

[@AllThatsLeft24]

​@@davidd854I could be wrong as I haven't watched peterson in ages but doesn't he interpret it as without God everything is permissible? Because he himself is an atheist who choses to act as if God exists.

[@davidd854]

@@AllThatsLeft24 No I don't think that's correct. I don't think Peterson sees himself as an atheist although I think he mostly spreads a sort of intellectualized idea of God. I feel like his focus on God as important for your life is mostly in order to reduce (mainly your own) suffering. Suffering seems to be what scares him the most.

[@AllThatsLeft24]

@@davidd854 I know he doesnt think of himself as one. Im saying he is an aithest. I watched some of his stuff again. And he says he thinks we have a hierarchy of values and at the top is divine. And he says we use fiction to understand this and God is the ultimate main character or something like that i forget the exact wording. That means he doesnt think God is real. He also said in a debate with Sam Harris that he acts as if god exists which also means he doesnt think god is real or atleast hes not sure. Alex Oconnor has a great video about Peterson and he discusses this in the first few minutes. I would recommend watching that

[@davidd854]

@@AllThatsLeft24 I'm not watching the video, I suggest you type out the most important points. For the rest, you say: He says he acts is if god exists --> he doesn't think god is real god is decribed through fiction and god plays a role in this fiction--> he doesn't think god is real Neither of those arguments are valid. He answered himself that to the question whether he believes in god his answer would be 40 hours long. Which is the length of time of his Maps of Meaning series on youtube. In his Maps of Meaning book Peterson disginguishes between something like mutually perceptible truth ('objective', material, scientific) and something like ethical truth, which is like a truth about how you should live your life. I think his thought on God focuses on this second domain. I'm not sure if this worldview is fitting for a healthy person but that's how he describes it I think. I'm not really aware of Alex Oconnor but I think he's an arguing atheist and those guys usually try to show that god does not exist somewhere in this material world. So if that's the case it does not apply to Peterson's description of God, and also not to that of the Catholic church.

[@Danny71891]

First the Joker thumbnails and now this one. They keep getting funnier and funnier.

[@catatafish22]

I like Slavoj Zizek, but all he ever does is assert wild ideas and jump from one thing to another without any segue's, and never really backs up any of his claims with evidence. It seems like he's just making random observations and jumping from one point to another, nothing he ever says has any uniformity and only amounts to baseless claims.

[@sovarose2030]

That's a very clever note, thanks for mentioning it

[@joshuabyrne2220]

This is simply true, the most egregious claim is calling Donald trump a post modern president and the not at all explaining why this is the case. That couldn’t be more wrong, especially when compared to Bernie sanders like he did in the video. Donald trump, like him or not, is in support of the grand American narrative, he’s done nothing but promote the values which America has stood for since its inception, to then call him a postmodern president literally makes no sense in anyway. In fact, Donald Trump would, if anything, be a president of modernity, not post modernity. Zizek is incredibly bright but he’s far too pompous and has no desire to backup particular points of his.

[@hosung6936]

I don't agree with Zizek on many things, but the claim that he always makes empty or incoherent ideas is simply absurd. You quickly see a unifying theme in his claim when you read through his books, which is actually a source of criticism in academia (e.g. Terry Eagleton). The subject as a lack, and ideology as an incoherent but necessary distortion, etc. such ideas are extremely well-argued and back up with substantive theoretical materials. Watching a 9min clip and judging his whole apparatus to be unfounded is simply lazy. And before you compare with Peterson fanboys "you don't understand him!", Peterson NEVER published any articles or books on his so-called postmodern neo-marxism (12 rules is a joke, and maps of meaning is at best psychological metatheory). So interpreting his philosophical disputes are just good as any other in terms of academic validation. Zizek on the other hand published an immense amount of books and articles, which you actually need to engage in order to make a valid statement about his claims. Also, there's an introductory book written on his idea, so you can just read that to get a basic sense of integrity.

[@andrzejkarolak3766]

Well yes, but it is enough to make you think if he's right or wrong which is good. I was always more on the right side, but I like to listen to rational leftist, to conquer my beliefs, because sometimes their opinion sounds right even without explanation and then it is on me to prove them wrong or change my mind.

[@MrAlnMir]

I read Zizek's remark about Trump being a postmodernist not as a reference to his popularized set of beliefs but a comment about what Trump is actually doing, what trump represents in his actions.

[@sabrielguindon148]

No jokes, I really like when he says "EH". It's an affirmative "EH" he's not retracting himself to think like other talkers when they go "hum..." every two words. He puts himself foward "EH" and comes out even stronger with his formulated thought.

[@sugarfree1894]

Wow, all those people in one room!

[@theodorearaujo971]

Excellent point about God. Christopher Hitchens used to say there are good people and there are bad people, but if you want to make good people do bad things religion is required. An Atheist is much more optimistic than the delusional apocalyptic idealists (which included Hegel) because we believe that all morality has been designed by man without reference to the supernatural. Question: If you do not believe in God or the super consciousness Hegel utilized, how can you refer to yourself as Hegelian?

[@connorqb1241]

Being a liberal is the most selfdestructing thing. Being liberal and accepting to people and ideas that are not liberal and accepting towards you and others.

[@Fake_Robot]

Peterson went to Christian outlets to talk about his so-called “conversion” to Christianity. He didn’t really discuss the miracle of Christ or his salvation or anything. It was so insane and so quintessentially postmodern. It was all “well what this AKSHUALLY means is…” and “this is why you should…” and then he started tearing up. It’s beyond me why people would look to him for guidance.

[@vladislavstezhko1864]

Why not to look for him as a guidance?

[@Fake_Robot]

@@vladislavstezhko1864 He had a religious conversion based on his own strange system of reasoning, all this fussy Jungian deconstruction of what Christianity is. There was nothing in there about the gospel. For someone who attends church but is losing interest, especially due to embarrassment over the contradictions of religiom and science, which is probably most Christians at this point, Peterson provides a new pseudointellectual means of justifying religious practice which is really a postmodern revision of Christianity that makes one more a follower of Peterson than of Christ. I’m not against Christianity whatsoever but I know some true believers and I know cynical opportunists.

[@vladislavstezhko1864]

@@Fake_Robot I can't get get why it is pseudointellectual, given that it is pretty sophisticated and useful. Also, do you mean that either one needs to be a fundamentalist or not call himself a christian?

[@Fake_Robot]

@@vladislavstezhko1864 You’ll have to point me to what is sophisticated about Peterson’s religious views and why that sophistication makes it a genuine intellectual pursuit.

[@anthonybrett]

The funny thing was, Peterson and Zizek agreed with each other more then debated. I find they both send the same message, just in different ways.

[@jmw-be6fl]

I think it is because they are both Essentially Hegelians. Marxism and modern pyschology(Freud,Jung ect) All based their ideas on what Hegel wrote. Take Peterson's idea of Chaos vs Order. You can see similar ideas in hegals writing www.thefreedictionary.com/Hegelian%20dialectic#:~:text=Hegelian%20dialectic%20an%20interpretive%20method%2C%20originally%20used%20to,a%20third%20proposition%20%28synthesis%29.%20Also%20called%20Hegelian%20triad.

[@anthonybrett]

@Paul Gauthier I disagree with that, I would say it's the foundations that are the same, its just the details that are different. For example, Zizek considers himself a Christian atheist. Both men have an underpinned core which believes in the importance of religious teaching. You cant get much more foundational than that. I'm not religious by the way, but I certainly agree with Zizek and Petersons view, which are very similar when read to any depth.

[@thinkculture6106]

Jordan Peterson actually has a very conflicted relationship to postmodernism. His critique, I think, gets a number of things correct. Things that Zizek I think basically just.. isn't aware that Jordan says or talks about, actually. But, yeah, Jordan is unaware of the extent to which his own thinking is CERTAINLY indebted to the Counter-Enlightement/postmodern philosophical tradition. He'd benefit a lot from some more engagement with certain figures. But, I think Zizek would benefit from a more serious engagement with Jordan and some of the issues he raises, actually. Two of my first videos were actually on the subject of Peterson's relationship to postmodernism. I highly recommend anybody check them out if they're interested in the philosophical claims. I did one defending Peterson, on what he gets right in his critique. And then another on what he gets wrong about it (including his acknowledged indebtedness).

[@darkthorpocomicknight7891]

Zizek knows Jung very well which is why he's puzzled. Jameson a big Marxist actually uses Jung in his theories - and they are AGAINST deconstruction. But JP thinks all these people are pomos. Some are but not all.

[@danduntz9112]

Anyone who thinks that Dr. Peterson is a post-modernist, has never listened to a single lecture. People dislike him because he speaks truth. Truth that violates people’s illusions about themselves.

[@josippetkovic389]

I think that Zizek misses the point that when Peterson refers to God he thinks of idea of morality, to move towards greater good rather than a God as a person or something that walked on earth etc. Just look how careful he is when he puts his arguments out.

[@sepidehsoleimani5637]

In one of interviews the interviewer asked jbp if he really believed in god and he tried to deflect the question but the interviewer asked precisely if he believed in the physical resurrection of Jesus Christ and forced him to answer as yes or no. Peterson answered yes. He tries to avoid those questions because he can't scientifically answer but if he really meant morality at least I think that he could do it without god or at least Christianity. I wish I had the link to the video, all I remember is that it was through webcam and Peterson was answering from his house.

[@Quinceps]

Peterson is in rehab from drugs. You can't believe anything he says now. Even my poor grammar is more reliable.

[@andrzejkarolak3766]

I don't think he missed that. When he says about god he mentions transcendent value not a person of god.

[@Brakvash]

You may be opponents, Slavoj - but what I like about both you and Jordan is you aren't enemies. That's a big thing when everyone wants their political/ideological opponent to be your enemy.

[@sacredgeometry]

Holy mental gymnastics Slavoj!

[@jezebulls]

So many videos on Jordan Peterson, must be his hero

[@granitbajraktari1600]

Because people keep asking him? Should he ignore the questions?

[@thebiowatchlist]

Real quick = Postmodernism -> Baudrillard -> there is an object reality. It exists. Through the sheer physical law that two entities cannot simultaneously occupy the same space, all individual consciousness is limited in first person data to that which it is capable of perceiving in the first person. No other entity can experience this exact same set of data in the first person. Therefore, collective understanding must be assembled through shared first hand data (second hand data) and our understanding of reality is through this simulated reality or second, third, fourth...hand data and this is filtered through that one unique consciousness which only an individual can possess. The end result is that there is an objective reality and then there is what we are able to perceive first hand (our piece of this) and then there is the simulation - a collection of multiple other tiers of data shared and acquired through many means. When we make decisions and form an understanding of the world based on this simulation and bring it into our first hand experience we are actually infecting the most clear experience of reality with subsequently less clear versions that come through less reliable sources essentially allowing the simulation to 'paint over,' the most clear version of our existence. Through this process people can be pulled out of their objective reality or clearest version into less clear or 'true,' simulations of reality (think of the simulation as simulated meaning). That is the basis of postmodernism. What that has to do with capitalism, marxism, socialism, politics, republicans, democrats, feminists, lgbt and all that other stuff I will never know other than Postmodernism is a small philosophical body of work in intellectual circles and the political folks of the day decided that they wanted to use it as their great big buggaboo. The fact that Marx came along before modernism, let along postmodernism, should inform you as to the charlatans on the left and right who are trying to pull the wool over your eyes.

[@lucasmartin4127]

While you do seem to have an understanding of Baudrillard's work, your take is also incredible reductive of the scope of postmodernism, to the point that you conflate it with a constructivist epistemology. The point of postmodernism is not to say that each person interacts with reality in an individualized way, which would be more of kantian postulate. Postmodernism, as a philosophical field, treats truth as a historically-constructed process, which is heavily influenced by the process of domination and social change. If you remember Baudrillard's work, you'll see that is only in late stage capitalism that the true separation between the original and the sign exists, where the mass production of commodities and the loss of overarching meanings permeate reality. My point being that Baudrillard takes lots of inspiration from the subfields of Marxism that were so popular in the 60s. TL;DR: Postmodernism is not a niche philosophical position that only proposes a new way to understand the world around us, but also a heavily political stand that is built on historical and Marxist categories of domination, capitalism, and knowledge. Also, Baudrillard is not the only postmodernist author, so I would recommend that you familiarize yourself with the work of Foucault on the genealogy of knowledge, it's great stuff. CCK Philosophy on KZbin too, incredible postmodernist channel.

[@TeaParty1776]

> pull the wool over your eyes. Engels father made lot of money with cotten because its cheaper than wool.

[@Diogenes_von_Sinope]

close your eyes, and imagine silvester the cat speaking.

[@melphillips1608]

Often Zizek talks in circles. But not in this segment. I 💯 agree . This is beyond ‘left or right’.

[@UWillSee83]

Hedonism might not be evil, but it is truly meaningless.

[@jimijamesmarshall2328]

Hedonism, in it's primal form, leads to breeding and interbreeding between and within cultures. Every culture, invasive or not, used it throughout history. Not meaningless at all, you can see the results everywhere today.

[@jeff2209]

@@jimijamesmarshall2328 thats good for animals. In humans hedonism leads to dysfunctional relationships, and divorce. It is evil.

[@zikebucan1785]

Hedonism is a luxury, it always existed but only elites throughout history have been able to live it at the expense of the masses, it’s not good or bad but rather a thing of sustainability

[@jeff2209]

@@zikebucan1785 ok commie

[@zikebucan1785]

Jeff your momma is good

[@euStiuMaiBine]

People here start to show who hate more JP or who is smarter that JP. Even Slavoj said that he appreciates something in what Peterson talk about and he disagrees with anothers ideas. And this is how it should be. No one is perfect. Critics and discussions should be, this is more important. These guys respect each other even when they have different opinions.

[@lukecronquist6003]

Zizek will be looked back on as one of the greatest thinkers of his time

[@johnphilly2479]

Unlikely

[@TeaParty1776]

Trump, too.

[@johnphilly2479]

@igor šajinović actually it's based more on whether or not they can form a coherent thought, and whether or not said thought has any practical bearing in reality, zizeck, it seems to me, is somewhat scatter brained as he defends his worship of an outdated idea that has killed more people than it has helped, but ya know, time will tell.

[@marcusonesimus3400]

@@TeaParty1776 You're speaking ironically, I hope. By nature he's a feeler, not a thinker. As for the philosophers: (1st Corinthians 1:20-21) 'Where is the wise man? Where is the scribe? Where is the debater of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world? For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not come to know God, God was well-pleased through the foolishness of the message preached to save those who believe.'

[@TeaParty1776]

@@marcusonesimus3400 > By nature he's a feeler, not a thinker. Is your post evidence? In one ,presumably unintended sense, you are correct. Man feels automatically, ie, naturally, but thinks volitionally. You have volitionally chosen evasion. The Bible is the product of your ideal, the unfocused mind.

[@letthegoodtimesroll352]

I really like to listen to more Zizek videos, but kinda hard to follow his speaking pattern/snorts

[@MrZeusOlympie]

I'm fascinated of how much this youtube channel tries so hard to destroy peterson but just end up having comments about the way Zizek talks

[@TommyGunz327]

Zizek is consistently incorrect

[@eaziplay9523]

I've listened to this guy for quite a bit now & he reminds of an ideas type of figure. "There are my ideas and beliefs and then there are yours, but my ideas and beliefs are better".. He seems quite the intellect in ways..... In one hand he has a set of rules he bides by, but then switches in the moment and with a slight of hand convinces you that what he says is true, and everyone believes his word. This is cleverly done due to his large pockets of big words that confuses those he speaks to, and what do most do when confused and ashamed to show weak intelligent, you nod and cheer and carry on. Anyone who laughs and geers at what Jordan Peterson has to say, are surely the ones that feel threatened. This guy is a jokester and a puppet, and truly mixed up, and Jordan Peterson has proven this.

[@gregrubio8722]

I've been looking for a comment that didn't promote this video. I dont know enough about this guy to agree with you entirely, nor have I heard Petersons opinions on him. However, I can appreciate that this guy doesn't completely discredit Peterson in this video. He does show him a small amount of respect for the quality of his research.. Not that showing respect makes this guys opinions true. Either way, its brave of you to post your comment with all of the other comments being in support of this video. And I'm surprised you havent been bombarded with threats and hatef6comments in retaliation 😂. 👍

[@eaziplay9523]

@NM 22 I think the word "Amazingly" is best suited in this context, rather than amazing. Also and I'm quoting you, (Everything you said was completely wrong). First off, the word "was" should be replaced with (is) and instead of using the word "everything", as this implies that everything i say is wrong. You're probably best to pick out the points you believe to be "wrong", and maybe lay down a reason for why you think they are wrong.......You also state, and I quote, "Peterson is a f##king hack". Once again, maybe a reason why you believe "Professor Peterson" is a hack, as judging by your comment on one of the most intellectuals of our time, you probably watched some uneducated fool on KZbin try to debunk Professor Peterson......I say "Professor Peterson" as he is a professor and an intellect that has written numerous amounts of papers and books on the topics he discusses that has changed the minds of millions, and all for the good. (what have you done) So from here, maybe you would be best picking up one of he's books or one of he's masterfully research papers and try giving it a read. Just to finish off here, if you haven't anything constructive to say, and back it up with some fat, keep your useless comments to yourself....

[@magnolia2415]

@@eaziplay9523 dude you sound lame as fuck lol. no hate tho you just sound like a smartass here. read more mate

[@SetMeFree]

You have to put in work to listen to this man.

[@NobuhikuObayashi]

Only some of us....

[@m_alcoves]

Thumbnails on these videos always crack me up

[@makeucry27]

These two have to actually research eacother and have a debate

[@joarhannes3592]

they had a debate

[@Ezratal]

@@joarhannes3592 Tarzan is aware of that. What he means is that in their previous debate they were (and continue to be) so unfamiliar with each other that they argued past each other. A much more interesting, and substantive debate could be had if they actually developed some familiarity witih one another.

[@chanceydubbz3831]

@@Ezratal yeah I honestly had a hard time listening to it. I really like both of them, though. For different reasons. I guess I am a living contradiction.

[@ThomasBrasser1]

dude

[@gorantsar]

@@chanceydubbz3831 I agree entirely.

[@JD-jl4yy]

The only god here is the god-tier thumbnail.

[@kristupaskmitas5440]

there are times when Zizek is worth listening, but this one is not the case. he simply does not know the real arguments of Peterson, he just did not try to understand. I say that cause its ugly to listen how that kind of smart and sophisticated thinker can be so plain and distorting the real stuff Peterson is talking about

[@kristupaskmitas5440]

@@treeoflife5643 did you listened to Petersons lectures? the prententious comment of yours suggest that you did NOT, and that kind of banal simplistic style of commenting and criticizing IS the easy solution

[@kristupaskmitas5440]

@@treeoflife5643 I am attacking not you, but just your arrogant comment. And thats all - I am not going to play those useless games there, because you just trying to manipulate, and your rhetoric shows that you see yourself as "above the all", and i just dont buy it

[@treeoflife5643]

Kristupas Kmitas I apologise if I have upset you, it was not my intention. I have deleted my comments out of respect. I am not arrogant just interested.

[@darkthorpocomicknight7891]

Listened to JP - its just speculative nonsense like Jung explains Stalin and Hitler and pomo feminist/queers are carrying on the legacy of Hitler-Mao-Hitler. He likes using Hitler a lot. Are there some left-wing fascists? Sure. Right-wing fascists too. But you don't need a "theory" to analyze or even combat them - you just work against such trends but JP's weird Hegelian conspiracy theory they MUST be working together is not helpful. I just ignore that stuff honestly its unproductive junk anyway

[@kristupaskmitas5440]

@@darkthorpocomicknight7891 sounds like you just saw some memes about JP, rather than his own academic stuff

[@rt0035]

I like Zizek. I disagree with him quite a bit, but I respect him. Although, his constant ticks make me very anxious, and I’m sure I’m not alone in this.

[@xavierpaquin]

2:40 sorry but that was too funny lol

[@clacclackerson3678]

Nauseating, actually.

[@itsshowtime6412]

I believe some great points were made about Today's political environment, where left is unable to do self criticism and Trump points out a lot of the toxicity we see Today, but also conveniently leaves out that he is actually a postmodernist leader himself. In the end, when people try to do what's good, and I strongly believe they are, because I do believe in moral values, then the biggest threats to humanity are the lack of knowledge, truth, debate, freedom of X (speech, information...). It's why I strongly believe that Vivek Ramaswamy would be a better leader than any other candidate in either party. If he isn't, then I will be fine with that, as will Vivek be, but it's important we see and share facts in open discussions. Media is corrupt and many believe the Internet solves this, but we should all know by now that Google of all companies is the most corrupt one to date. Sorry for jumping to so many topics at once, but in the end it all relates. Let the truth come out and let the people see and share the truth and that's the only way forward for our wold. - ps I'm Belgian, not American

[@clacclackerson3678]

I thought I could get through it by closing my eyes, but the audio turned out to be stomach-turning as well. Guess I'll just have to read a transcript.

[@ileiad]

"We live in a society"

[@somebodyonce5976]

"we live in a society" - Slavoj Zizek

[@ssallons7930]

hedonism isn't evil but it sure does dig a hole through society for evil to crawl through.

[@tabbycrumch3062]

i love him but why is it that he says we must use self reflection first, but then in the debate he criticizes Peterson's "set your house in order" thing? Aren't they basically the same thing?

[@PVC22]

If there is a glaring issue in the way in which you conduct yourself politically, it is prudent of you to correct it - It also harkens to the idea that you can only change what you can control, it's very basic really... A simple analogy would be when a sports team loses a match, they should look at what they did wrong rather than complain about the referee.. It's just general smuggery to not fix your own issues, it's shooting yourself in the foot. Can you comprehend that?

[@tabbycrumch3062]

@@PVC22 you realize that i wasnt asking what he meant, right shithead? i asked why he states that he disagrees with Peterson, yet subscribes to the idea regardless lol. fucking internet pseuds. your comment is from 15 minutes ago bud, we know you liked your own

[@tabbycrumch3062]

@@PVC22 sorry, had to come back to this. its like got strawman'd and im not even arguing with anyone LMAO. like your reply literally doesnt answer my question you dumbass

[@PVC22]

@@tabbycrumch3062 yes it does answer your question - Zizek talks about how the left should act when faced with the rise of Trumpian figures while still disagreeing with Peterson - You can disagree with Peterson while still recommending how the left should move forward - it's really not complex, i don't know what you are confused about really...

[@tabbycrumch3062]

@@PVC22 Ok. I'll explain it for you. Peterson says you must use self reflection in order to "set your house in order." In response to this, Zizek says fuck that. You need to change the WORLD. He then goes on in THE VIDEO we are commenting on, saying that self reflection is an important tool for leftists? Do you understand my question now? It wasn't "What did Zizek mean when he said this." (Which btw is what the first fella answered, to which your response identically explains it.) I am asking WHY he says what he says here, AFTER having said what he did to Peterson. I feel like my brain is melting

[@-delilahlin-1598]

Measure the performance. Look from far, close, not-so-close, and through time.

[@Pllayer064]

ok

[@diegofnu]

Seems like Zizek is really struggling to disagree with Peterson.

[@hiddeluchtenbelt6440]

diegofnu Well, they have a fundamentally different worldview and background, with only some parallels. He even admitted he tried to be extra amiable to Peterson’s positions as he was actually speaking to his audience, and wanted to engage with them to demonstrate there are also leftist alternatives to the frustrations and alienation that drove them to Peterson in the first place

[@sd5309]

All The Left has now is juxtapozed waffle.

[@diegofnu]

@Flightof2Owls nahh... he didnt pay atetntion to that question, nobody did. It was the "blablabal Jordan Peterson blablabla" questrion he was adressing.

[@diegofnu]

@Flightof2Owls I think he does.

[@diegofnu]

@Flightof2Owls Say that for a third time. It will stick better.

[@somtimesieat2411]

8:02 HOLY SHIT GUYS HE SAID THE LINE HE DID THE THING

[@cherrypieconsumer4982]

Lol

[@felixweinlinger]

6:36 Zizek: German philosipher Sigmund Freud Austrian music intseifies

[@maple2524]

Neither German, Austrian nor Czech; Freud was a Jew.

[@felixweinlinger]

@@maple2524 you can be an austrian and a jew at the same time, nationality, ethnicty and religion are not the same thing

[@tristan5546]

Short answer no

[@CreatureOfGoddess]

Is there a way to listen to this dudes lectures, that doesn't sound like Sylvester the Cat?

[@jiggajigjones8210]

Haha nope.

[@carlomariamizzi8387]

wasn't zizek the one that, actually during the debate with Peterson, said that his oppenent's statement about "needing to fix your own house before you try and fix the whole society" was fundamentally wrong? now he's stating that if we want to properly address a problem in our society we should first start with self-criticism? Please explain to me, I might have missed some points

[@superiguana1]

Keeping an ordered life is entirely different from developing a healthy self-awareness/critical perspective re yourself and the world around you. You're actually demonstrating a failure to accomplish the latter (as of yet) in this case, so nice job!

[@carlomariamizzi8387]

@@superiguana1 nonono. Strawman here. Peterson's point was exactly that, before attempting to change "the outside" we should "know the inside". Thus the "fix your own house" parallel. Zizek here is saying the exact same thing

[@superiguana1]

@@carlomariamizzi8387 That still requires a necessary differentiation between developing class consciousness, which is Zizek's proposal, and developing a healthy individual identity/habits, which is Peterson's proposal.

[@stephenkane1074]

I could listen to Slavoj for a few hours .... but my bag of coke is staying in my pocket.