So I Guess I'm Making a 4D Game Now... - 4D Golf Devlog #1

This is the first of a new Devlog series about the development of my untitled 4D game. More details to come in the next video.
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[@epos.nephilo]

This guy has no limit to how crazy his game development can get.

[@notnintendo]

fr bro

[@JeffV2V2]

fr bro

[@Kirbman]

br fro

[@watermelongaming3698]

rb ofr

[@devmmmdoesstuff6429]

orb rf

[@RonuPlays]

The translucent projection onto the camera plane is GENIUS. I've seen so many explanations about 4D space, but only now has it really clicked for me. The "slice" method does tell you how it works on a theoretical level, but cutting out the middleman by projecting 4D to a 2D camera (instead of taking a 3D slice) makes it sooo much more intuitive.

[@brine_909]

@person it's the second one and yes you can directly project 4d onto a 2d camera, it's still pretty similar to the 3d slice example if you think about it but you actually get full control of a camera in 4d with 4 of the 6 degrees of motion

[@mryodak]

@person He does slice. But he also projects. And it's pretty cool cause you see more information about a 4d oject than from just a slice.

[@mryodak]

@person it's possible for a diffirent eye. Our eyes take light projections through a 2d hole. But a 360 lidar reads an information from around it. An x-ray takes a cumulaive 3d data about the object. A scanner takes information from the whole space. So if we change an eye for something that can take that information it would be possible.

[@preferablygeneric]

"... why dont we just render it anyway?" Was a thought i had when i was first introduced to 4D space concepts, and im glad someone out there can put it to practice

[@rz2374]

@person No, it is physically impossible to actually see a 4d scene, so instead we can project it onto a 2D plane so we can see part of it.

[@ionic7777]

Hyper mini-golf sounds like a pretty fun idea! Even if the game isn’t going to be huge, I’m sure it will still be really fun

[@Sylfa]

Just add a simultaneous multiplayer option like other crazy mini golf games and you will have a decent shot at getting some youtube traction with it. And since it's not a story based game it should mostly just assist sales.

[@jennycotan7080]

This can be called "How would it be like if a great dimensional wizard/witch who lives between dimensions plays golf".

[@seagull7488]

I can just imagine mark, bob and wayde playing it rn lmao

[@Wulfstrex]

@@Sylfa The Steam-page currently says both Shared/Splitscreen PVP as well as Remote Play Together

[@Ditocoaf]

"I don't really want another multi-year project right now, so this will probably be a relatively short and minimalist game that I just spend a couple months on and release". A tale as old as indie games, haha. I'm looking forward to seeing the amazing thing this becomes over the next year or two! Or, if you're someone who can actually pull off a "quick side project", I'll be impressed by that as well.

[@Sinistar1983]

A tale as old as time. Nothing ever ends that simply. I remember thinking my first project was gonna be like that

[@comparatorclock]

actually it is possible for this to be one of those things where it starts as a side project but is updated over a longer period of time with many updates.

[@davilimalol4612]

Lol, here we are 15 months later, but he's getting there now and the game looks awesome so cool

[@Wulfstrex]

It will be 21 months from this video to the release

[@mothebad]

You called it, can't wait for the release!

[@carykh]

i can't wait to play golf in a 4D universe! They aren't golfballs, they're golfhyperspheres.

[@CodeParade]

The ball is a 600-cell 😉

[@bobi9928]

Well i ilike hypercubes!

[@DisKorruptd]

ah yes, playing with hyper balls

[@eboshidori7748]

theyre still "balls" because theyre part of the series of "n-balls" (n-dimensional filled-in sphere-analogues) so still golfballs :-)

[@themeowhogsmeowkitten4178]

Hello

[@Hlebuw3k]

YES! FINALLY! Someone made the sliding part of the 4th dimension! I was saying this for so long, if a 3d person holds a 4d hypersphere, its just going to slide out! Same in this game with sliding along 4d walls

[@ArtamisBot]

Oh I didn't think about it like that... it's basically impossible for a 3d object to cup a 4d object... You'd just be balancing it like a ball on a plane even if you could move through the 4th dimension

[@ArtamisBot]

Also balancing a 4d ball on a flat 3d box in 4d space actually sounds like a good game idea.

[@ArtamisBot]

You could play with just twin thumbsticks

[@vladilima]

Holy shit this is blowing my mind

[@0v_x0]

@@ArtamisBot There's a mind bending puzzle game in that line of thinking.

[@Кровушки]

Imagine playing catch or hide-and-seek in this, it would be hilarious

[@RawPeds]

It can be a great idea for a 4D game.

[@ptyzix]

4D prop-hunt will be crasy

[@aubreykarnes795]

I rememberthe good old days molded world at war prop hunt.

[@TETANUS.]

"Hah! I found you!" *hider proceeds to morph into a wall and dissappears*

[@LittleDemonInside]

For the next game CodeParade makes: "So yeah, I wanted to take a breather try something simple for my next game: using non-euclidean geometry in a 4D world, nothing too out there. Should take me about half a year or so; see you then." But seriously man, great job so far! I look forward to seeing the progress on this one. 4D minigolf is such a cool idea!

[@AimFri]

"Im thinking about a quantum tunneling shooter, maybe with some gravity loop theory spread onto bullet kinetics. Nothing too crazy."

[@timothymclean]

Combining his 4D and non-euclidean engines into one brain-bensing spacial nightmare would either be easy or exponentially harder, depending on how compatible the math is and whether that f*ks up either component's UX.

[@k-marketmuotiala4801]

Nah it's just gonna be straight up 5d next

[@rtyzxc]

Give me a game in spherical 4D space

[@snekback.]

@@k-marketmuotiala4801 5+1D projected onto a 2D camera sound like a nightmare

[@giantisopod]

This is something I always wanted to explore. I also never understood why all "4D" games use this roundabout slicing method instead of just projecting the 4D space onto a 2D plane like we do in 3D games. For some reason people have a misguided way of thinking about this subject. Almost every time someone uses the flatlander analogy they say something like "The flatlander sees 2D objects, whereas we see 3D objects", which always bothers me, because - as you correctly stated in this video - the flatlander really sees 1D objects and we see 2D objects. We can't see the backside of things, we can't see through walls etc. So we already do not see the whole 3D shape. This isn't even something specific to higher dimensions, we experience this every day in our life. But seeing a 2D image is not the same as seeing 2D slices of our world. Taking a 3D slice of a 4D world and then projecting that onto a 2D screen is so unnatural, I don't think one can build any intuition from that. If we had to interact with a 3D world in that way, we would be just as confused.

[@jetison333]

I kind of get it, as 3d slices is exactly how you, a human with 3d eyeballs would perceive a 4 dimensional space, but it doesn't help that much with understanding it.

[@_KingRaz]

@@jetison333 we don't really have 3D eyeballs though. We see via our retinas which are 2D. We just see 2 2D images at once from slightly different angles so our brains can interpret depth. Projecting a 4D world onto a 3D slice would only help us to understand it if it were in VR, so each eye could see something slightly different to perceive depth. When it's on a screen, from a 1 point perspective, it makes much more sense to see a 2D image because... screens are inherently 2D.

[@farrankhawaja9856]

You are literally wrong. This game uses the exact same slicing method as 4D miner so y’all have no idea what you’re talking about.

[@VagabondTE]

I had a realization. This engine uses "sliding" through the other dimensions when you encounter a wall. But I've always envisioned that you would be able to see and phase through objects. Then it hit me, It would be BOTH. In the same way that the third dimensions adds pitch and yall, the fourth dimension would add phasing and sliding. And objects would be a combination of both.

[@swanclipper]

yaw*

[@lateoclock4281]

This is a very cool idea, thanks for sharing!

[@Adam-zt4cn]

The new degrees of freedom are usually called "reeling" and "twirling". Reeling changes which direction you are facing, similar to yaw. Twirling is similar to roll, as it doesn't change where you are facing, however twirling doesn't make you "fall over" like rolling would, because it doesn't change which direction is "up".

[@jetison333]

@@Adam-zt4cn twirling really hates my brain. fun fact, you can switch which directions are left and right by twirling. So you can't just tell a four dimensional being to turn left, you also have to tell them another direction to orient themselves towards.

[@ultrio325]

FINALLY, someone made a 4D game where you have all the info

[@dillbourne]

The huge enormous mind bending moment of moving the camera in the other two planes is glorious.

[@Ivan_1791]

5D game next?

[@Ric3cir121]

6D next

[@Ivan_1791]

@@Ric3cir121 69D next? 😳

[@Epsilon3141]

I think he will prove the string theory and bring us to the 11th dimension of the univy

[@hxgonic]

There has been 2d and 3d games, 4d games being developed and even a 1d game demo. What if someone were to make a 0d game

[@Ric3cir121]

@@hxgonic how should i play it?

[@Alienturnedhuman]

Fez wasn't a 2D slice of the 3D world, it was a projection of the 3D world into a 2D plane. If it was a slice then the puzzles wouldn't have been solvable as it relied on the projection bringing areas far away in 3D being made much closer.

[@swaggerdagger8976]

Bro's gonna break the fabric of the universe just to make this

[@thesamastic]

I think that mini golf is a extremely unique gameplay mechanic to have in 4D and would absolutely be a perfect way to introduce the concept of 4D space. Brilliant idea.

[@angledcoathanger]

The idea of playing around in 4d space is so exciting. From the demo, it looks like you've implemented it really well. Psyched to see what you come up with!

[@TherealLaserdog]

Says he isn't going to implement slices and then just reimplemebt slices 🙄

[@angledcoathanger]

@@TherealLaserdog Yeah it did look a bit slicey, pretty much right after he said that as well 😂

[@somebodyelse9130]

@@angledcoathanger His game looks pretty different from the games he brought up. He wanted to avoid making the 3D equivalent of Fez, and he succeeded in my opinion.

[@farrankhawaja9856]

@Sebastian well you’re “opinion” is wrong. He used the exact same method as 4D miner and all other games.

[@gmopotato2790]

I have literally had this idea and you beat me to it. It makes so much sense! It's just like 3D glasses- instead of seeing a 2D picture and trying to imagine 3D, you see several 2D pictures and your brain automatically understands it as 3D. Except in this case, it's 4D! Rotations are still kinda tough for me to wrap my head around, but isometrically and orthographically just sliding a 3D slice through with transparent edges in the fourth dimension has helped me understand 4D SO much better.

[@Anonymous-df8it]

Ok here me out. Use math to predict what the 4d space would look like to a 3d camera, and then see that 3d image by using 3d glasses.

[@JakeFace0]

Minigolf is a cool idea but since normal minigolf is in 2 dimensions the gameplay in this game will be in a mundane 3 dimensions. I feel like this version of minigolf would be better represented as a golfball floating in a 3D volume. I think a fundamentally 3D game would better suit going into higher dimensions

[@JeffV2V2]

I don't know I think it could be fine as is, but I agree.

[@1224chrisng]

it's kinda interesting, bc. that means you can graph the position in (w,x,y) 3d space, so I imagine that you can put a little cube with an outline of the golf course in the GUI as the minimap

[@columbus8myhw]

Mini golf isn't (extrinsic) 2 dimensions if you want to include hills. It would only be 2 dimensions if it were flat.

[@jasonyesmarc309]

Idk what kind of minigolf you've been playing that is strictly 2D in movement complexity. I've seen a lot of minigolf places where you gotta aim jumps and travel vertical sections, and then there are digital minigolf games have you do all sorts of whacky 3D antics as well.

[@rouvey]

Maybe an idea would be some kind of space shooter or plane flying simulator? Though these are already not easy to control in 3 dimensions and you probably would have to provide controls for the 4 extra rotation axes as well. Maybe someone else could also build something like this on top of the open source engine that will hopefully be released together with this game.

[@SillierPutty]

"It's very early in development right now, so I could end up doing something completely different." I'm glad that they kept with the mini golf idea.

[@jem5636]

Oh wow. I love the shadow feature, I haven't seen that before in any style of game where the play-field is working in a higher dimension than what the camera can see. And the 4d golf game sounds really fun.

[@Gameatronic9000]

gonna be honest, so much of this little demo made it into the game in the end. honestly i really love how such a good idea it was to become such a strong foundation, and genuinely impressed how smooth this concept can fade into completed idea, at least on the level of presentation. its certainty cleaned up a ton with the game.

[@willphoenix5464]

2:22 Wait a second In the book Flatland, isn't there an ever-present fog that essentially does this? It helps the Flatlanders distinguish between shapes without needed to touch!

[@Anonymous-df8it]

Did they need an ever-present fog though? Just give all of your creatures two eyes lol.

[@willphoenix5464]

@@Anonymous-df8it Iirc all of the flatland shapes were cyclopes. And the women were lined with a mouth and an eye at one end so probably not a lot of room for them to have two eyes.

[@Anonymous-df8it]

@@willphoenix5464 Couldn't they add a second eye on the other side of the mouth?

[@lunafoxfire]

That transparency idea is genius! It makes things so much more understandable and really does the best job I've ever seen of really expanding your FOV into the 4th dimension

[@lnterest-ing]

"i'll probably just spend a couple months on this, i dont want it to be as big as hyperbolica"

[@WhatsDown]

Thinking the same thing

[@Wulfstrex]

What do you mean 21 months are more than a couple? xD

[@ArtamisBot]

So the problem with making a 4d game is that pretty much every other 4d game project flopped... or wasn't 4d enough... I'm excited to see you give it a go tho.

[@Tubeytime]

It takes a great designer as well as an understanding of 4D to make a good 4D game. I think people are interested in the concept but are still waiting for that premiere 4D experience with all the bells and whistles like Portal did for the non-euclidean genre

[@ArtamisBot]

@@Tubeytime agreed, but the issue is that a 4d game with that much polish would be too hard on the mind, a lot of non-euclidean and recursive space games are already a mind-fuck as it is. Just having two correlated slices of 3d space to navigate (eg. time travel puzzles like the recent portal game) are hard enough too...

[@Tubeytime]

@@ArtamisBot Maybe it's too late for us, but kids might be able to pick it up pretty quick. Either way, a good designer would know better than to throw the player in the deep end right away, they would gradually increase the complexity of their puzzles while only teaching one important concept at a time. I personally think the shadows are already a massive step in the right direction.

[@ArtamisBot]

@@Tubeytime yeah when he said "I'll project it down" I was shocked that no-one else had considered implementing basic 4d shadows as a quality of life. If there is one thing this game needs to be remembered for... this simple innovation is it. Dude just blew my mind with: I'll just use normal shadows but in 4d

[@thomaskaldahl196]

Yes!! I've been wanting to see a 4D game with semi-transparent projections since I was in high school :D

[@Avalonians_]

So if I understand correctly, when you walk into a wall, you "push" yourself into that 4th dimension, and the golf ball behave the same way. That means the golfing "area" is now 3d, right ?

[@CodeParade]

Yes, all "surfaces" in 4D are topologically 3D.

[@CaptainWizard3000]

So you could have hills that “look” flat? (Sorry if this is a dumb question, I’m still trying to wrap my head around this)

[@SSM24_]

@@CaptainWizard3000 Yeah. One of the scenes in 4D Toys explores this idea - there's an object that looks completely flat from any particular 3D slice, but it's actually a ramp that slopes into the 4th dimension, and hyperspheres will roll down it.

[@rtyzxc]

@@CodeParade So for the golf example, if we for simplicity, assume that the course is flat in Y/gravity axis, then it's like a 3D maze without gravity? You can only launch the ball along the plane of the two visible axis, but if the walls are not perpendicular, then it can bounce and travel in the "third" invisible axis of this gravityless 3D maze.

[@rtyzxc]

@@CodeParade This also makes me wonder how it would feel like if you had the 1st 2nd and 4th axis visible, while the gravity axis would be the invisible one. You'd have this 3D maze until you run into hills, then things would start morphing. Could be difficult for the camera view.

[@jem5636]

I've been following the 4d miner development, so I had an idea of what you might be going for, but I can not *explain* my excitement when you started talking about the slice method and want to go beyond it.

[@SawtoothWaves]

enjoyed this over tea from my nemo mug! cant wait to play 4d minigolf or whatever becomes of this >:D

[@aprilschauer2545]

Super neat! This is still using slices, basically the same as 4D miner I think. But the transparency innovation makes it a lot closer to a volumetric view. In true volumetric view you’d have the 4D stuff projected to a volumetric plane (a 3D display) and have that projected to the screen (a 2D display). Your display would be a cube or rectangular prism and the center coordinate is the “middle” of the screen, and there are up/down and the four relative horizontal directions: left right ana and kata. I *think* what you’re doing amounts to taking that volumetric view and squishing it along one of the horizontal directions, so actually this is very close to volumetric without requiring the user to be able to parse a 3D plane of information. So actually yeah this is really cool! What might also be neat is to then blueshift things to your ana and redshift things to your kata. Or make the game stereoscopic and *only* display geometry to your ana in one eye and geometry to your kata in the other eye (have the user cross their eyes or use a VR headset). I wonder if this method works well with lots of geometry or if it gets confusing. Anyway I’m looking forward to it!

[@serse8455]

As an (almost) mathematician, slicing is the way I think about higher dimensions, except for rare occasions. Your concept for the game is super cool, can't wait to play it!

[@solsystem1342]

I think using color to represent "height" above the slice (bluer) and below the slice (red) could be a good idea. To allow people to see more easily how moving through the other two axis will change things.

[@SpencerTwiddy]

When you had to move around in the 4th dimension to even be able to see the hole, that was so cool!

[@hanniffydinn6019]

Marble madness in 4D would be interesting! 🤯🤯🤯😎😎😎😎

[@TrailMix324]

this man has explained visualizing a 4d space... with actual visuals... I CANT EXPLAIN HOW COOL I FIND THE CONCEPT OF EVEN BEING ABLE TO DEMONSTRATE VIEWING A 4D SPACE IN REAL TIME. AND HES USING IT TO PLAY MINIGOLF I- i love this world and how far we've come

[@brianfhunter]

The transparency was absolute Genius!!! The entire 4D thing still is very hard to understand, but this is by far the best way to visualize in a immersive way. Amazing work!!

[@charlotte1924]

The faded projection thing is an excellent idea, it provides vital context to the object you're looking at meaning you don't have to scroll through the entire slice. Can't wait to see where this goes!

[@Exilum]

The "shadow" projection is pure genius. It actually works very well, might even be be something you could work with. I could see a world in which you could control in the 4 dimensions at once. It could be interesting to see whether that can be done. We are used to projecting 2D controls onto 3D movement, I wonder if it'd be possible to project unified 3D controls into 4d space. Maybe using a hand tracker or something like that.

[@oreon7907]

This is a masterpiece just for the incredibly good way you find out to make a new point of view of the 4th dimension

[@Traayblox]

You are really just making games for all my favorite math subjects.

[@CelestialProotDIY]

Typically 4th Dimensional worlds are seen as incredibly complex and strange. While they certainly are in some ways, I think this provides an amazing example of what seeing in 4-D would probably actually be like. This makes more sense than how I've seen it in many other situations, and I honestly appreciate the simplicity of it. Thank you for expanding my imagination, this is awesome.

[@BlueberryCats_]

This is honestly the best way to render 4d i’ve every seen, it’s trippy and wouldn’t really work on high def objects, but it gets the point across

[@MelodicaDude]

A 4D minigolf game where it's partially a puzzle game about finding the hole on a 4D object would be super neat. Excited to see what you can do with it.

[@abellematheux7632]

A golf game is a good idea. Level by level games that use the geometry of the game to make it interactive is exactly what Hyperbolica was missing.

[@JonaCorrea]

This is the best implementation of 4d I've ever seen. Just seeing the 3d shadow of the "sphere floating" it's demonstrating the potential of this approach. Great work. Looking forward to the next one

[@AstroSamDev]

Really interesting video! I've seen many implementations but yours seems the most intuitive, and I especially like the 3D shadows cast by the 4D objects

[@stm7810]

Thanks for the flat lander explanation, this makes so much more sense than the usual slice explanation.

[@glitchy9613]

3:50 I noticed here on the right that because you essentially have a 4d cone all of its cross sections are 3d conics!

[@kummer45]

This man can simply create beauty with his codes. This is a complete game changer on EVERYTHING.

[@SemiHypercube]

Guess it's hard to get a first person view of 4D because our minds literally cannot comprehend it completely, so you have to make some adjustments for it to make sense I'm fascinated by this kind of stuff, I mean "hypercube" is literally in my name lol

[@polychoron]

I love you. You're achieving everything I ever wanted to achieve, & you're laying the groundwork for my own game to be perceived as almost mundane. I'm tired of being the most bizarre game maker, on other timeliness. I think I came back to the past to start over, with a more simple, at one with the universe vibe. Thank you for easing my transition into becoming a creator. In my first worlds, I never noticed your games. I have to give my retrocausal life travel some meaning, to make it worth all the suffering... discovering new creators who are building the stepping stones I will use to reach my own goals is one such worthwhile meaning. Thanx again.

[@niceowl]

More devlogs? Please, they are always fun to watch

[@totoshampoin]

YES! When I play 4D Toys, I always turn on the wireframes! It just makes things so much easier to keep track of!

[@Poly_0000]

YES! GOD YES! I never liked the slicing method.

[@eatfruitsalad345]

video games are like a crazy perfect mechanism by which to explore 4d space. love what you're doing, bringing these concepts to a larger audience so it can be further expanded upon

[@enderwiggins8248]

You’re a legend, an icon, and you are the moment

[@Limofeus]

Really cool, having projections of what is near you in 4th dimension is probably the best way to visualise 4d space!

[@iamsushi1056]

This was the first video in my home feed today and it made me so happy!

[@nodustollens9183]

I didn’t know it until now, but this is exactly how I like to imagine 4D space when I am thinking about it’s mechanics, really looking forward to hearing and seeing more!

[@windums560]

I played the demo of 4D Miner. It was hard to control but I liked the idea

[@ehmeh6462]

What would really add to how players understand how they move in 4d space is to show a recap of the player's ball but from the third dimension so you can see the player/ball phase in and out of view

[@PeterNerlich]

...yes. yes. YES. I was kind of thinking about this in the back of my mind while watching your hyperbolica devlogs, and I'm super hyped to see where you end up with this, even if you just work on it a short period of time. I guess my main thought about why I want true 4d games to be a thing has always been that people going blind also develop amazing navigation and space comprehension abilities from their other senses, and people with a lot of exposure or even growing up with 4d games should be able to quickly get an intuition for 4d space itself, just as we are able to comprehend 3d space from our 2d vision

When you slided by the wall and it just made sense... can't wait for the golf game to be released.

[@famitory]

I've always wanted to see a game that used a camera projection that covered a complete view of everything around you, might work well for a 4Dgame since it sort of gives you a "3D" camera

[@GogiTavadze]

So it's like Quake 3 with cg_fov set to 360 🧐 Never tried it, sound very fun. I've found a video "Breaking the FOV limit in Quake"

[@Bozitico]

That might not be possible. Remember, we can't see a whole 3D object at once, and I think the people in the 4th dimension have 3D cameras, and 3D paper too. If we made those in real life, it might be hard to see everything going on. You may have to move around it in order to see each thing in the game.

[@redtachyon2718]

I've been thinking about this on and off for the last year, without the skill to actually implement any of it! It's so awesome to see a proper visualization of this and not sketches on pieces of A4. Your work is awesome, and I'm constantly inspired by your videos! Edit: Wow, the comment section is full of similar discussion!

[@sirnonamederechte6169]

Wow it looks amazing! So much potantial for the gaming scene.

[@MuteSpectre]

I've thought about a 4D game that worked using opacity for so long I'm so glad to see someone actually doing it!

[@ghb323]

he managed to bend space, now he can add another dimension.

[@Pootez]

I've been thinking about this implementation with transparent projection. Glad to see someone actually working on such an experience!

[@bikutoso]

could moving the 4d rotation into the nearest predefined point be useful for some games? it would help the player get around by guiding them in the right direction

[@ristopaasivirta9770]

Probably a button to reset the extra rotation to identity orientation could be a great start. That way players can muscle memorize which movements got them where.

[@EzraBradford]

Could be really helpful. I found 4D Miner a lot more accessible once I learned the camera reset keys. They let me keep oriented and keep track of where I'd come from. This also suggests to me a slightly different idea: what about moving your view between predefined entire camera views, like in some of the Myst-style games? You get to animate moving through a full-dimensional environment, but you can make sure the player always has good camera angles to see the actual game elements.

[@potato4dawin1]

Nice implementation of viewing more distant objects in the 4th dimension. This way we can actually visualize what it would be like to have a 3D object offsets in the 4th dimension or even some 4D objects

[@firebeardlongfellow5295]

Oh good lord my brain can't handle this. Extremely impressive!

[@zarnox3071]

Another way to view 4d stuff is with a 3d retina/camera, which usually requires using wireframes to prevent obscuring things when then projecting it onto a 2d retina/camera to show on the screen. There's a 4d maze game that uses this method, and with two views for stereoscopic vision, allowing the viewer to perceive depth in the wireframes, it works quite well.

[@truppelito]

Ok, the shadow idea is genius

[@Frewition]

Love the concept of projecting a "shadow" into the vision space

[@fejfo6559]

I've had the idea of a 4D plat former with a 3D camera, you can then freely "move" around in your 3D "view". Something like that might be even closer to how a 4D creature would experience the world, being able to do think like look inside a 3D room.

[@Me-da-Ghost]

I was just thinking about that! It would be so difficult to actually navigate around tho

[@arabidllama]

Maybe you can put dimensional spin on the ball, in later stages? The idea of the ball travelling more actively through 4d space is really interesting!

[@Deyzze]

whole year passed, but he made it

[@thegaspatthegateway]

sbsbdbd genius finally visualizating what a 4D space looks like intuitively

[@ArtamisBot]

I hope that you are remembered as being the innovator who finally put two and two together: 4d shadows is f*cking brilliant for playability.

[@gazehound]

That compass is very cool, and so are the transparent hints. Best 4d mechanics I've seen

[@SlickMcClick]

Just imagining a 4d space makes my head hurt. Imagine if it was hyperbolic 4d as well! 🤪

[@captaineflowchapka5535]

hyperbolic 4D time cristal (something that moove front and back in time)

[@great2456]

In 4d it's possible to have 2 hyperbolic dimensions and 2 spherical dimensions.

[@captaineflowchapka5535]

@@great2456 yes YES

[@thegaspatthegateway]

yall would see a super-dimensional Eldritch Ancient deity and jump right into its mouth i respect it

[@captaineflowchapka5535]

@@thegaspatthegateway nah i would have tea time imagine it like a bacteria talking to us so much insight ,and so much trauma

[@carsextendedwarranty]

imagine the people living in 4D like " I can visualize the 5th Dimension!"

[@ultimagnum3511]

Why would they be surprised from being able to visualize a lower dimension?

[@carsextendedwarranty]

@@ultimagnum3511 lemme just change that there

[@Anonymous-df8it]

@@carsextendedwarranty What was the original 'lower' dimension?

[@carsextendedwarranty]

@@Anonymous-df8it 3D

[@Handelsbilanzdefizit]

I think, there's even a much more intuitive way for 4D-games. It's not so much about "presentation of 4D", the secret is the "leveldesign to explore 4D".

[@hxgonic]

This seems so cool, i really like the idea too of putting these kinds of things on VR, as it tends to make it more life like and grasping onto the concept seems easier

[@0v_x0]

I would get an Oculus quest just for this game if I could afford one. I wonder if they're cheap on eBay.

[@StickNik]

That projection idea is gold, hope to see the potential of this wringed out in the future, by you and/or others using the open-source engine.

[@editdotexe]

I really like the dimensional shadow system, 4D Miner is quite frustrating because the spider hide just slightly out of view in another dimension and this helps a lot.

[@awfuldynne]

Because the hyperspiders just run straight toward you without any pathfinding AI, running away from them for a bit (like, almost any distance if they're close enough to attack) coaxes them farther into your 3D slice. I'm expecting Mashpoe to implement hyperspider AI eventually, at which point this comment may be rendered incorrect. "Make the hyperspider approach you again" still has a good chance of making them put their bodies into your 3D slice considering the game imbalance that would be introduced by having hostile wildlife _strategically_ staying out of your field of view while your ability to track them is limited to clumsily rotating your 3D slice and hoping you guessed the right direction.

[@editdotexe]

@@awfuldynne Oh yeah I know why it's doing it, and like you say it's a bit weird since AI that makes them more visible to the player would be them acting even more stupid then going in a straight line. AI that is actively hiding from the player sounds cool, but even more painful. If I remember correctly he has an item in the game that lets you see items and mobs that aren't currently in your slice, but the dimensional shadow in this video seems like a much better way to have it and makes sense not to need an item for it.

[@Fruitabat]

I love this The two compasses spheres immediately reminded me of how two 3D spheres are a double cover of a 4D sphere (or hypersphere), which makes a lot of sense Makes me wonder how much algebraic topology (or other high level geometry topics) would help in developing a 4D game

[@syntaxerror831]

Had to happen. Thank you.

[@garyjaffe2802]

Oh my god your brain is awesome. thank you so much for your work. your contributions are on the edge of explorations.

[@ImJustDigital]

“I don’t want a multi-year project” 💀💀💀💀💀💀💀

[@NubNublet]

really proves the whole thing about "the only limitations of what you can code are what your brain comes up with"

[@adon155]

“dont want to start another multi year project” clueless

[@Wulfstrex]

Not really multi-year, but 1 year and 9 months

[@Chloedasher]

The 4d miner explanation is still the best explanation for 4d, all the other ones are really had to grasp

[@TomtheMagician21]

NO WAY!!! Have you seen games with a volumetric display such as "Moena" and "4D blocks"? I think the 3D screen is really cool as well as things from 4D miner but I really enjoyed Hyperbolica. 👍

[@Sequencer37]

Moena was actually displayed as one of the examples :P

[@HaydenTheEeeeeeeeevilEukaryote]

to show the full 4D world, you can also use color gradients. For example, the more red something gets the farther along one axis it is, and the more violet something is, the farther it is in the other direction additionally, brightness and saturation can be messed with, and like you already have, so can opacity. Additionally, something 4d miner’s 4d glasses do is it messes with size the farther 4Dward an object is relative to you ive been wanting a truly 4d game for a while, one where you can still see the whole world, so im glad someone’s making this

[@ostkaka0]

Looks really promising. Makes me wonder if playing in 4d could eventually rewire the brain making 4d less disorienting and actually somewhat natural. I'd however like to see more verticality, a flat 4d game is just a 3d game.

[@Toogzoog]

Hyperbolica was a weird and intriguing experience, and I'm stoked to see you're still exploring extradimensional shenanigans for video games.

[@VagabondTE]

FINALLY somebody used *OPACITY* to see the fourth dimension! I've been wondering about this for so long. Tho, I pictured something slightly different. Projecting the shadow of the scene is brilliant.. but.. What if everything in the world was mostly transparent? Wouldn't that be the true 4th dimensional vision? Could there be several degrees of vision slices in the same way that you're Vision has a range? It doesn't need to go on forever. Because your eyes don't. Just a short range up and down the fourth dimensional slider. It would just be overlapping transparent worlds. I see it like this: A wall that stays in the same place for farther than your fourth dimensional vision will reach will look and act like a solid wall to you. But if the wall didn't exist for a few slices then you would be able to see through it partially. And my thinking is, that you would be able to pass through the object. Just incredibly slowly. Think of it like walking through a marshmallow. The wall is soft because it exists less where you can see through it. The more transparent it is, the faster you walk through it. The wall has a "hole". An opaque 4th dimensional object would be its normal weight. But the more transparent it is the heavier and harder it would be to move. Because you're only touching the corner. Does that make sence? An incredibly simple maze with a key to find would be a phenomenal game that wouldn't be a ton of extra design work. And it could be randomized. Could Ray tracing provide a unique solution?