Soaking Bicycle Chain in Degreaser: BEWARE of the consequences

In order to clean chain of grime and grit, one of my friends soaked his Shimano HG chain in degreaser overnight as suggest on one of the You Tube channels - and the surface of the chain went from silver to black and the links were frozen. What was going on? We decided to test this out. - and the surface of the chain went from silver to black and the links were virtually unmovable, i.e. frozen links. What was going on?
We decided to put this to the test. We had left over fragments of bicycle chain after we had shortened for the chain to fit the bike which included: Shimano CN-HG93, SRAM PC931, KMC X9 and an inexpensive Zonkie 1/2 x 3/32. After careful examination to be sure we weren't dealing with fake chains, we soaked segments of each new chain in Distilled Gum Turpentine overnight in a plastic, metal and glass container. We then repeated the same process using Finish Line Citrus Degreaser. These were our results:
To eliminate the fact that the packing grease was the problem, we sprayed segments of each chain with Simple Green then immediately scrubbed, washed with soap and water, rinsed and dried. We then soaked the segments in either Turpentine or Citrus Degreaser. The results were the same!
The changes to the chains were most prominent with the Shimano chain but some pitting was noted with the SRAM. This included -- The discoloration to the chain could not be removed by acetone, scrapping or sanding. We felt that a chain left overnight in Turpentine or Citrus degreaser degrade metal itself. We also noted that most of the Shimano chain had a stiff link (links).
We did note minimal discoloration of the chain at 6 hours but the most prominent effects were seen at 8-12 hours. Whether this will happen with all degreasing solvents is unknown.
We have not used Gasoline or Kerosene because of the environmental and health hazards of such products. In my opinion, as seen here, leaving the chain soaking in degreaser (including Simple Green) can corrode and pit the metal. Therefore, keep soaking time to minutes rather then hours.
But take this as a cautionary tale and if you soak bicycle chains for hours or overnight in any solvent , you do so at your own risk. By the way, has anybody read the manufacturers insert that comes with your chain.
Under no circumstances should a chain be soaked in degreaser. If left for too long, the cleaning solution can corrode the metal and cause cracks.
Use cleaning solutions or degreasers that are especially designed for bicycles, and avoid harsh chemical cleaners.

[@motionstudio77]

Interesting experiment, thanks for sharing these useful tips again

[@tony10speed]

You're Welcome. Also visit our KZbin home site at: kzbin.info Regards and safe cycling, Tony

[@Tomzzzzzz]

I just had an interesting (and unfortunate) experience with my brand new Shimano XT (CN-8100) 12 spd chain. I used a 3-bath method for degreasing and re-lubing the chain. The three baths were: (1) Park Tool Chain Brite and then (2) 91% isopropyl alcohol and then (3) Rock n Roll Extreme lube (blue) wax based lube. Each bath lasted no more than 2-3 minutes where I put the chain in a jar with the solution and agitated it. I then removed the chain, wiped it down and placed it in next solution. Afterward I noticed that the chain links had blackened as in your video but ONLY on the drive side (the links with lettering on them). The links on the other side of the chain did not change color. Additionally, I noticed that about 6 links in the chain had become tight and wouldn't bend with ease. Going forward I am not going to use this approach on a new chain. I will just use Rock n Roll Extreme to both clean and lube. Rock n Roll Extreme contains both a solvent and wax, so you clean and lube at the same time. I've used that product many times in the past on other chains without issue. I learned my lesson!

[@tony10speed]

Wow, that's quite a story. All I can figure is that the coating on the outer plates of the chain must be different than the inner plates and reacted with the Chain Brite. Did you notice any discoloration after the Chain Brite and before the isopropyl alcohol? Did you wash and rinse the Chain Brite off before putting it in the isopropryl alcohol? It's possible that the residual Chain Brite combined with the isopropyl could be the culpret, but I'm not sure. Sticking with the Rock n Roll sounds like the best idea. Thanks for your observations and comment. Regards, Tony

[@trackie1957]

I noticed the variety of container materials. I would stick with glass or plastic containers and avoid metal to eliminate the chance of galvanic activity. Soaking a chain, especially one that is well cared for, is not more effective than a quick clean. It’s much more important to remove as much lubricant as possible after you oil your chain, and to do it frequently. The chain will stay cleaner than every other rider’s and will last longer without ever having to remove it from your bike.

[@tony10speed]

I agree. Removing the excess surface lubricant will prevent grime and grit build up on the chain and prolong its life. Thanks for the comment. Also visit our KZbin home site at: kzbin.info Regards and safe cycling, Tony

[@briand6386]

KMC: Never use acidic or alkaline cleaners (rust remover). These will damage the chain and in extreme cases can lead to breakage. Never use aggressive degreasers - these will loosen the factory applied grease from the pins. This allows dirt to penetrate and drastically reduces the service life of your chain! Furthermore, these agents are harmful to the environment. Chain cleaners also often contain solvents that can damage your chain. Clean the chain with a dry cloth. Important: also clean the sprockets, chainrings and shifting rollers. To remove dirt or sand, use a brush. If the chain is very dirty, lukewarm water with detergent or a cloth soaked in thin oil will help.

[@tony10speed]

You make some good points about the need to avoid aggressive cleaners although some will disagree with you on the use of bike specific degreasers and Simple Green if used briefly and with care. Lenard Zinn, author of "The Art of Road Bike Maintenance" suggests removing chain packing wax which is there to prevent rust and corrosion and will interfere with applied lubricants. See our video based on his suggestions and that of other bicycle mechanics: kzbin.info/www/bejne/Y4fHfXavasiFmdE If you have references to the contrary on either of the above, please let us know so we can all be educated. Thanks for your input and safe cycling, Tony

[@papalegba6796]

@@tony10speed chains do not come with packing wax for a start. Also, not following manufacturers recommended practice when installing their equipment will result in you being fired if it is your job in most instances. So if KMC say do not remove packing GREASE (not "wax" as you state) , then do not do it. However, bicycle mechanics are laughably unregulated, so they can say or do pretty much anything they want with zero repercussions. Dry

[@tony10speed]

I agree with many of your comments, however, what works for you may not for others. Keeping an open mind is what leads to discussions such that you can communicate your feelings and opinions and understand why others hold theirs. Some well known mechanics would disagree with your comments on waxing chains and not removing packing wax. These discussions are interesting and the exchange of ideas leads to progress. Thank you for your comments. Regards, Tony

[@papalegba6796]

@@tony10speed this is why I pointed out the unregulated nature of bike mechanics. I will also point out the lack of technical data sheets for pretty much all fancy expensive bike lubes. Best practice for industrial chain lubrication methods is set in stone for employees, there is a set way of doing things & if you do not follow it you are endangering both people & equipment. There are many years of scientific research into the subject, dedicated testing facilities that must be officially accredited, the list goes on. But none of this applies to cycling, it is totally rogue & anybody can claim anything with zero evidence. Do you not see a problem here? Because it is glaring to me.

[@sylvainmichaud2262]

Personally, I don't remove the original lubing but had a drop of light lubricant at each link every few rides and wipping clean after each ride. The thinking behind it being that the original lube will simply be _displaced_ while still having a lubed chain. It's a bit messy after the first few rides, that's all. Use of agressive solvents attack the plating on the chains. Most chain manufacturers recommend to NOT attemp to remove the original lubricant. I'm not into the ultrasonic cleaning, Crock-Pot waxing trend. All this stuff is far more expensive than to properly mainting and instaling new chain at the proper frequency. Cycling has always been a sport where a bunch of people are into stupid trend to make them feel as if they'd belong to an _elite_ group. Remember the drilling of brake levers to make them lighter ?

[@tony10speed]

I think most mechanic would agree that the manufactures have led us astray with the idea of leaving the packing grease, and my expert, Lennard Zinn (Zinn and the Art of Road Bike Maintenance) in one of his blogs would agree. The packing grease is there to protect the chain from corrosion and rust during storage. Not only will it pickup grit and grime from the road (it's very sticky), it may interfere with the bike lubricant you use. People may disagree, but this is what the recent data shows. Are there trends in bicycle maintenance and repair, you bet. That's why careful analysis and research is required and will continue to be so. This is also what makes bicycle maintenance and repair fun. Regards and thanks for your comment, Tony

[@sidshel4428]

hi great video. I clean my chains much like you do with the two tooth brushes. I think I learnt that from one of your earlier videos. in order to be able to use the degreaser more then once i.e keeping it fairly cleanish. I do a cleaning in dish soap with the brushes . rinse in hot water, dry the chain because water dilutes the degreaser . then soak in the degreaser for an hour or so. rinse with more dish soap , hot water final rinse and dry before lubing. this method works for me. it does take time to dry the chain so I was running two chains alternating between the two. otherwise a little heat on the stove works. one problem I came across is when I was using sunlight detergent all was ok. Palmolive turned my chain dark much like the chains in this video. It was a shimano with the shinny coating . its no longer shinny. and this is the more expensive option to buy with the shinny coating. I have to agree with you that soaking for long periods of time is not a good idea. no more then an hour should do it. I know that if there is any dirt still lingering around the pins and id of the rollers then after a bike ride the lube will turn black. and stay black no matter how many times one wipes it with a rag. my chains do not show any signs like this. so I think in line with what you are saying its no use soaking for too long and over night is for sure a no no . thanks take care

[@tony10speed]

Have no idea what's with the Palmolive soap but will look into it. Sounds like you're doing a terrific job (a little over-kill for me in terms of washing but if it works for you that what counts). Most of the black that shows up as you ride, at least in my experience, is not the residual dirt around the pins and bushings but rather residual chain lube which quickly picks up dirt and grime. I apply chain lubricant, work it in by turning the crank (and chain) backward, let it sit overnight, the (before I put it in the car to take to my ride start), wipe down the surface thoroughly to prevent the grime and grease build up. Thanks for sharing your cleaning procedure and your thoughts/ideas. Regards and safe cycling, Tony

[@tony10speed]

P.S. There a a number of products of Palmolive on the market. What kind of Palmolive soap were you using so I can take a closer look?

[@sidshel4428]

the original green soap. @@tony10speed

[@sidshel4428]

thanks for the tips . I agree totally apply work it in and let it dry over night and a final wipe down. even though most claim it will dry enough in 3 hours longer is better. Just wondering you said my washing is a little over kill. in what way would you recommend making it more stream lined and shorter thanks again @@tony10speed

[@tony10speed]

It just seemed like a lot of steps involved in washing, degreasing, washing again. But if it works for you, don't change it. I'll look into the Palmolive. Regards, Tony@@sidshel4428

[@patricklaenen3468]

Hi Tony! Great video again 👍 I ride 2 chains on my bike, swapping them every +/-500km so they wear out equally with my cassette. (Better then first riding one chain to the end of it’s lifetime and then putting a new one on the same cassette) Anyway, when taking the chain from my bike I degrease it, clean it and rinse thoroughly. Then I wax it and leave it to hang until the next exchange. I noticed with my shimano chain that rust is forming on some parts… The chain is well dried - I guess - and hangs in a dry place or I put it in a plastic box covered with some more wax. The last method seems to be the worst when it comes to rusting. What would you suggest to be the best method to store a cleaned chain for a longer period until you are gonna out it on the bike?

[@tony10speed]

Sounds like your method of degreasing, washing and drying every 500km is a little overkill according to Squirt: kzbin.info/www/bejne/d2nTfaSZophprrM However, I think the main problem may be that the chain is retaining moisture after washing/drying before applying the Squirt. Dry the chain with a hair drier and then hang it up for 24-48 hours (in a dry place - not your basement or garage) to thoroughly dry. Then apply the Squirt. That's my guess anyway. Let me know how you make out. Regards, Tony

[@returnofthenative]

Chain is not made from virgin steel, it is made from all the scrap we send to China, therefore it is full of impurities that react with each other & the chemical solutions they have been immersed in. In my experience, degreaser is only good for removing anodizing. Softens it a treat to a wipe off state in minutes, but be careful its vicious & comes in regular & industrial strength. Has anyone tried oven cleaner on new chain preservative grease?

[@tdgdbs1]

I've been using diesel; few hours of soaking was all needed, and diesel doesn't evaporate as quickly as other medium. First Team!

[@tony10speed]

Yes, First Team! However, I personally refrain from using diesel because of environmental and health concerns. See: www.epa.gov/dera/learn-about-impacts-diesel-exhaust-and-diesel-emissions-reduction-act-dera#:~:text=Environment%20%2D%20Emissions%20from%20diesel%20engines,%2C%20produce%2C%20meat%20and%20fish Regards, Tony

[@dv270salto7]

I've soaked a shimano 10 speed chain from my Roubaix in appx. 75% Kroger dish liquid (ersatz "Dawn") overnight. Virtually all the oils and crud came off and the chain did not discolor. A good rinse in HOT water and all was good....

[@tony10speed]

Thanks for the comment. Did you also scrub the chain before or after soaking overnight?

[@dv270salto7]

Hey Tony! Thanks for the reply. No scrubbing.All I did was soak, then vigorously shake the container with the chain and detergent, take the chain out and give it a a serious rinse of hot water. All the grime gone, squeaky clean!! Soaked in silicon lube, dried off and back on the bike

[@tony10speed]

Will definitely give it a try. Thank you for sharing.@@dv270salto7

[@dv270salto7]

@@tony10speed No need to thank lil' ol' me , Thank YOU for all your video help lessons! I'm gonna go to Wally's and get that oil filter wrench for sure....

[@unclefreddy2009]

I’m assuming Tony is talking about this from Shimano’s 11 speed insert: Clean the chain with an appropriate chain cleaner regularly. Never use alkali based or acid based solvents, such as rust cleaners. If those solvent be used chain might break and cause serious injury.

[@tony10speed]

That is correct! Does this apply to solvents such a turpentine, mineral spirits, citrus degreaser? Can anyone answer this for us?

[@johnshannon]

@@tony10speed A chemist on bikeforums named Stuart Black (cyccommute on forums) cleans a new chain with a 30 second shake (mineral spirits) in a wide mouth gatorade bottle, if he is still using this method.

[@neutronpcxt372]

@@tony10speed Non polar non conductive (without salts obviously) solvents will work just fine, which includes turpentine, mineral spirits, and high concentration citrus degreases. However, note that most consumer facing citrus cleaners include water as the main solvent and sodium hydroxide as a high pH additives, which means that you wouldn't want to stick your bike chain in for a long period of time. You can use it for chain cleaning if it's done quickly, with a water rinse and then an alcohol bath afterwards.

[@tony10speed]

Turpentine (ph 8.8), mineral spirits (ph 7.0) and high concentration citrus degreaser (ph not available) all turn Shimano chain black if soaked overnight. I think the Shimano chain manufacturers insert is referring to strong agents such as rust remover which can be strongly acidic (ph 0-3). Simple Green has a ph of 8.5 to 9.0 meaning dipping but NOT soaking as per manufacturers insert. Simple Green will also turn the chain black if you soak over night but a quick clean with Simple Green does not affect the chain. The bottom line, don't soak the chain with any solvent but just clean and rinse, at least that's my conclusion. Thanks for your input, Tony@@neutronpcxt372

[@neutronpcxt372]

Essentially, you want to avoid relatively strong acid/bases as they can cause metals like steel to oxidize very quickly, and hence rust after exposure. For cleaning a chain of its factory lubricant, you ideally want a non polar solvent like mineral spirits, hexane, ethyl acetate, and then a volatile solvent that is miscible and somewhat hygroscopic like acetone/alcohols to get rid of the solvent used afterwards.

[@StayInTheWord]

Very interesting. I’ve been thinking about waxing my chain and would like to know the very best way to clean it. My research continues. Also…No, I haven’t read the insert from Shimano. Would you mind sharing what it says?

[@tony10speed]

I am not an expert on waxing a chain, however, some videos describe the use of Gasoline and Kerosine. These substances are dangerous to our environment and pose a health hazard. There are some excellent videos on cleaning with an ultrasonic cleaner that may be of interest to you (and may be the best way to clean a chain for waxing). If you do soak a chain, do it for minutes not hours and try your best to use an environmentally safe product. As to the Manufacturers insert for the Shimano chain, lets just give it another week to see if any has read it or looked it up on the internet, then I'll pin the results. Thanks and safe cycling, Tony

[@dpstrial]

"oz cycle" has some good videos on cleaning and waxing chains.

[@tony10speed]

@@dpstrial Yes. However, I myself would stay away from Gasoline, Kerosene and similar petroleum products he uses because of the environmental hazards and health risks. But I'll leave that up to you. Thanks for your comment, Tony

[@dpstrial]

@@tony10speed I clean my chain with normal bike cleaner and then lubricate it with Squirt (or a wet lube in winter). I don't want the bother of melting wax in a pot. I change my chain every year anyway. Regards.

[@tony10speed]

@@dpstrial Appreciate your comment and insight. Regards and safe cycling, Tony

[@JoeLercio]

I had this problem this morning. I bought a used bike and the seller thought it was a good idea to fully grease the chain. To remove the thick layer of grease I used a mineral degreaser, but only for less than a minute, the shimano chain became black. Hopefully I cleaned the cogs and rings with only cloth

[@tony10speed]

I could not reproduce the effect using Phil's grease on a Shimano chain and soaking it in mineral spirits. It must have been the type of grease used. Did the black wipe off the chain??

[@JoeLercio]

​​@@tony10speedit was a nasty tick black grease, a common one most people have at home. After soaking the inner links became opaque black, the outer links opaque metallic grey; on the inner cylinders some rusty spots appeared

[@JoeLercio]

I broke the chain so I replaced it 😢, anyway I will try with some of the specific grease to see what happens.

[@tony10speed]

Clean with something like Simple Green but do not soak. Then wash and dry. Apply only bicycle specific lubricant as directed on the label. Let me know how you make out. Regards and safe cycling, Tony@@JoeLercio

[@mrbubble185]

The blackening looks like what phosphoric acid does to steel.

[@tony10speed]

It does but the degreasers (including Simple Green) do not contain phosphoric acid although the reaction with the chain may have some similarities. Thanks and safe cycling, Tony

[@niteriderband4713]

Why would you leave anything in degreaser more than minutes? I would never do that.

[@tony10speed]

Agree although it's surprising how many KZbin videos suggest soaking a chain overnight (for what ever reason). Regards and safe cycling, Tony

[@babyblue8302]

@@tony10speed Don't you suggest that in another video? This one: "Don't Remove Bicycle Chain Packing Grease? Another Myth Debunked!" You say to soak the chain in turpentine overnight...

[@tony10speed]

Soaking overnight "was" the practice. But Shimano and a few other manufacturers have changed the formulation of the coating of their chains and soaking in any degreaser or turpentine product will destroy the surface coating. Parts and products change and we must change our practices accordingly.@@babyblue8302

[@slodziak222222]

Kmc and Shimano are from one plant

[@tony10speed]

It is true that KMC supplies bicycle chains to Shimano, although there are slight differences in manufacturing of each chain. See: bicycleuniverse.com/kmc-chains-vs-shimano/ However, the Izumi family in Taiwan still operates manufacturing plant for bicycle chains and other products: www.izumichain.com/about-us#:~:text=Today%2C%20Izumi%20remains%20family%20owned,all%20made%20entirely%20in%20Japan. Izumi makes there own chains under the Izumi name and appear to make some of the high end Shimano chains: www.izumichain.com/chain-technology Although you can interchange KMC and Shimano chains, because of subtle differences in structure and ramping of the chains, many mechanics suggest using the same chain as manufacturer of the rest of the drivetrain. Although individual claim it makes no difference and other swear by one or the other, I'm with the school of using the best high end chain as that of your drivetrain to get the best performance out of your bike. But that's a personal choice. Thanks for the comment and safe cycling, Tony