SOIL BIOLOGY: Panel with Dr Elaine Ingham & John Kempf | Climate Farmers

[@karinlindquist2192]

John and Elaine agree on far, far more than they disagree with. We need both of them. Fun interview to listen to!

[@xxpowwowbluexx]

Finally these two are talking. John Kempf is simply a genius and has an immense amount of experience and expertise in this subject and countless examples of actual, practical results.

[@kevinbrennan2004]

I'm currently doing a Horticulture course.. first year. That discussion and info on soil science, was amazing. Thankyou.

[@healthesoils]

two of my favourite teachers!

[@OBRfarm]

Loving the new podcast Oliver 🙏🏾

[@MedicallyFit]

Thanks for the upload

[@johnboykin3128]

Grateful for the interesting and entertaining lectures

[@combat309]

Congratulations all of you!

[@yoursoulmatters9600]

I thought this was a discussion that was interesting, yet hard to follow at times. I'm just a gardener although we are talking a lot of food. For example we grew over 150 lb of sweet potatoes last year some are left and edible. Having said that I know how John tweaks the crops he manages or how AEA does but we didn't really find out how Elaine would do such a thing. I mean if her microscope is saying something is lacking what is done in short order to fix it? I am not at the top of the plant pyramid but I am working on it. My compost is similar to the Johnson method a hot pile with worms moving in after it cools. I use the hot method to keep the worms alive in a North East Indiana winter. I am curious to know if either guest has seen the movie with the bio char reactor that actually charges the bio char with algae. I am also curious of what they would say when it comes to using bio char to get rid of waste as in manure. I am just wondering if there is more to the bio char story than was alluded to like so many other things. I also long for a full blown discussion on phosphorus uptake in squash. I am going to figure this one out, John says fish and a shot of boron may be key in this area, I want to know more.

[@Station-uf3nd]

Do you have the name of the movie are you are referencing? Thanks.

[@karinlindquist2192]

Being "just a gardner" is the best thing in the world, don't undersell yourself. Gardners are just as important as farmers, and I wish more people understood that. I too would like to know what movie you're talking about! :)

[@daneeldemerzel7277]

Hi :) I'm so jalous of John's beard :D Thank you for all the informations. Good crops everyboby :)

[@rochrich1223]

The question of what to do if compost no-till is causing excess phosphorus. Make a virtue of a problem, consider selling prime garden soil at a prime price. A couple yuppies filling a few raised beds might be a sustainable rate to reduce the excess and put a few bucks in your pocket. The rancher won't be changing what he feeds his animals to improve it's poop for your benefit but it might be the best source for you but for the phosphorus.

[@zialuna]

I favor using plant materials instead of animal manures in order to avoid phosphorous buildup, and also the accumulation of salts in the soil. Smaller animal manures excepted, in appropriate quantities.

[@bluejay3945]

Elaine is so against anaerobic processes of which the Korean farmers have been using successfully for 1000s of years. John has actually conducted field research where both aerobic and anaerobic processes need to be in balance.. And here is where Elaine falls flat. During drought soils become primarily aerobic. Likewise during heavy rain and wet soils switch to anaerobic processes. The key to healthy soil is its ability to buffer these 2 extremes. The key seems to improving the environment for both the facultative aerobic and anaerobic microbes who appear to be lacking in most soils. Elaine never addresses the full picture

[@audreybarnes6527]

If this experiment is correct, en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miller%E2%80%93Urey_experiment would the process of compost tea making not benefit from the addition of two electrodes. When discussing redox the suggestion was that healthy soil create a charge of 300 milli amps. Clearly water and electricity don't mix, so this just a question for the experts. I would be intrigued to hear a discussion on the biological processes contained within clouds. Thank you.

[@audreybarnes6527]

www.theguardian.com/environment/2021/jun/21/microbes-and-solar-power-could-produce-10-times-more-food-than-plants the suggestion is that a charge is being passed through bioractor. Is there a reason why you wouldn't feed a compost tea through a bio reactor and accelerate the process.

[@larrysiders1]

The disagreement about Nutrients (trace elements) lacking in the rock dust in soils was allowed to go unanswered. Elaime says all soils have every element required. But John has assayed hundreds of soils with mining type analysis... showing which elements are present and how much of each element is present... and John is reporting that some soils do lack enough essential nutrients TO MAKE SOIL RESTORATION Possible...to make it work (e.g. lacking enough Manganese required for hydrolysis step during photosynthesis). We can't pretend that elements are always present in high enough levels if that's not true.

[@stanleychavez9679]

I love forests as well

[@jontaylor1365]

What a contrast: Elaine's unfocused and imprecise monologue in comparison with John's succinct responses. Elaine's dogmatic theories and John's undogmatic empirical and practical experience. John rules. I just don't understand why Elaine is so respected?

[@georgedebs3566]

They have different presentation styles, there is nothing wrong with that. They both support their experience with emperical study. Dr. Elaine is a pioneer in this field, I recommend you check out the tens of scientific studies she has been involved with. She is the GOAT when it comes to soil science. She also makes the information very accessible to people, which some people don't like.. because it means simplifying some information. But if that means more people practice responsible composting, what is wrong with some simplification? Her methods work, you can't argue with microscope-verified results.

[@jontaylor1365]

@@georgedebs3566 I have seen a number of her videos and I find her dogmatic and inflexible in her opinions. For example openly discrediting Korean Natural Farming as ridiculous or the Johnson-Su's method. She doesn't seem to want to take on the new understandings in microbiology promoted, for example, by Christine Jones. Of course we are all on the same side and you are right that I need to give her credit for her work she has done promoting organic growing.

[@mmccrownus2406]

She's an anti-anaerobic. John says he tried to find any evidence on that to base her opinion upon and couldn't. She makes her money on her courses and such. John makes his money by successful consultation.

[@justinfair5216]

Yes. I reckon if you spend your time looking down a microphone you miss the broader perspective of plant growth and the dynamic intractions with soil and its biology...and people who farm it I'm totally with the essential link in farming is harnessing soil biology, but from what I've heard of Elaine's theory of the heirarchy of succession is off mark. It contains the belief that natural is isolated from man's intervention...and we'd be better off without mankind, whereas it seems obvious that mankind's intervention is intrinsic...either for the negative or the positive granted, but not just for the negative. She has a biased view towards he husbands research...which is understandable...but its why I recommend carefully weight up what she says...you have to leave your established views at the door of inquiry before you enter. I sense things aren't squarely plumbed in the philosophy she speaks from, and she is in danger of feeding off the attention she is gaining, and will become a cult head. It's healthy to question the ideas you stand on. Climate farmers?... The World Economic Forum leaders will be rubbing their hands together over that name.

[@inigomontoya8943]

@@jontaylor1365 I always wonder and would love a discussion between Christine Jones and Elaine Ingham.

[@inigomontoya8943]

I would like clarification on if compost made in the way Elaine does can provide inoculant with species depending on living plant roots. It seems like it would produce tons of microbes that process organic matter but maybe not so many if any mycorrhizal species plant and fungi alike.

[@pathwithin8856]

If you had seen all of the results from 40 years you would need to ask. The outcomes have been stunning, so no it doesn’t just make livestock that just break stuff down.

[@larrysiders1]

Some comments here (below) are uncharitable and a bit uninformed in my opinion. We need both of these pioneers. The Scientist and the Practitioners who can help farmers make the transition from CHEMICAL to Restired Soil Organic. John does actual work helping actual Conventional Farmers transform their farms into Restored Soil Farms. Not an easy transformation at all. Elaine is a scientist who's done essential work in soil science...science that John uses. Elaine's microscopy techniques are great for monitoring compost quality (I use it almost daily), but that tool is worthless for farmers who have to monitor soils (not compost) and monitor plants on hundreds or thousands of acres. John knows lots more about taking dead AND poisoned soils in REAL WORLD farms and... if he can convince the farmer to risk a couple year's income... recommends soil management practices to get the job done. Puts his head on the chopping block...and he still has a head. Elaine's soil biome theory and work is revolutionary and solid and necessary...but theory is not nearly enough to get real farmers to make really risky and really expensive decisions in the real world. Both theory and practicality are needed to save our totally broken Agricultural System.

[@mmccrownus2406]

RE KNF: All the soil life much below ground are anaerobic. She seems to have a phobia. SHe also wants to control things where the KNF/Asians traditionally trust nature and their traditions. Not highly expensive complicated courses.

[@mmccrownus2406]

KNF makes their own pesticides. She should not shoot from the hip. Very ignorant. Biochar IS often charged with micro orgs and nutrients.

[@xx7101]

"Worlds foremost soil biologist" no.

[@sig124]

who is?

[@billiebruv]

Yeah, who is?

[@garthwunsch]

@@billiebruv Dr.Ingham… she may not be perfect or have all the answers - who does - but she’s advanced soil science by light years.

[@billiebruv]

@@garthwunsch Well, I was hoping for a few more names to research, but you're correct by 'light-years'. I hope to be enrolled soon. Also, check out Nutrisoil and Di and Ian Haggerty

[@5ivearrows]

@@billiebruv give Christine Jones a listen

[@johnnyb4869]

Elaine took John to school

[@larrysiders1]

That comment was uncharitable and a bit uninformed. We need both of these pioneers. Theorists and Practitioners. John does actual work helping actual Conventional Farmers transform their farms into Restored Soil Farms. Not an easy transformation. Elaine is a scientist who's done essential work in soil science...science that John uses. Elaine's microscopy techniques are great for monitoring compost quality (I use it almost daily), but that tool is worthless for farmers who have to monitor soils and plants...not compost. John knows lots more about taking dead AND poisoned soils in real world farms and... if he can convince the farmer to risk a year or 2's income... recommends soil management practices to get the job done. Puts his head on the chopping block. Elaine's soil biome theory and work is necessary...but not nearly enough to get real farmers to make really risky and really expensive decisions in the real world. Both theory and practicality are needed to save our totally broken Agricultural System.

[@johnnyb4869]

@@larrysiders1 your right god is great 👍

[@mmccrownus2406]

IF so, professor Kempf taught the class

[@xxpowwowbluexx]

John Kempf is simply a genius and has an immense amount of experience and expertise in this subject and countless examples of actual, practical results.

[@johnnyb4869]

@@xxpowwowbluexx I’ve been following John for a long time

[@paulbray3594]

Funny how Elaine talks about returning to Eden yet she is religious out 420 million years of goo to the zoo to your evolution of Earth's systems. I don't have enough faith to be an agnostic. Just my God given opinion.