Soviet Naval Air Power - Project Orel - Sea Power Cold War Naval Game

[@Enigma89]

I typically try to make my videos no more than 12 minutes but seeing as this mission took 3 hours and that this game is not released yet, I decided to leave in a lot so I hope that the longer video was okay. Thanks. If you are interested in the game you can find it here: store.steampowered.com/app/1286220/Sea_Power__Naval_Combat_in_the_Missile_Age/

[@SyntaxError0287]

One thing id like to see is being able to see some sort of unit icon on the 3d view and not just the map where i could see the enemy fighters from far away.. kinda like wargame

[@slowhornet4802]

Is this game by the same design team which made Dangerous Waters? Which was one of my favorite sims (still is). So much variety, nice pace.

[@alexkorman1163]

I just realized, a cool NPC to add to the game would be the Concorde. It would be flying at supersonic speed and high altitudes, which could easily confuse it for a military aircraft. Fun way to spook a radar operator.

[@Enigma89]

I like that idea!

[@ДушманКакдела]

Yeah i really hope they flesh out the civilian fleets and add coast guards/other infrastructure etc.

[@MarkSynthesis]

Neat idea. Depending on the date (before 1983, when commercial service was terminated by Aeroflot), you could have the Tu-144 do the same role during, for example, strikes on targets within the USSR. They've already own off some airliner traffic that's supposed to be stand-ins for Soviet Aeroflot.

[@subvet3668]

I like how you bracketed the different phases of the operation. I wished more content creators for this game would do that.

[@JSDFEnthusiast]

When the RA-5C Vigilante came into play I about spit out my drink, I'm surprised they added that thing. It's such a unique aircraft. 37:09 insert jeremy clarkson "oh no, anyways"

[@rawnukles]

Best Sea Power vid yet. Nice one

[@PaiSAMSEN]

3:00 Hopefully there's a way to switch from NATO-name to actual name for the missile systems. It's actually one of my biggest pet peeve I have back with Cold Waters. Like just because I know what P-500 is doesn't mean I'll know what SS-N-12 is.

[@crazyVrex]

If not i guess it will be easy to change it in the game files and someone will make a mod for it pretty soon so dont worry.

[@deekamikaze]

I'm sure after playing a few missions you'll get to know what weapons can do what

[@PaiSAMSEN]

​@@deekamikaze I can guessed, after playing a lot of modded Cold Waters campaigns, that I will probably not. At least not as intuitively as when using the actual name of the systems itself.

[@iron_talon]

I have the opposite problem lol. But that's because I learned only the NATO names. Whenever someone says an R-77 or P-500 or S-300 I always grumble and mentally have to translate to AA-12 Adder, SS-N-12 Sandbox, or SA-20 Gargoyle (Or SA-10 Grumble because they stuff so many goddamn missile systems into the S-300 group)

[@firestarteronyoutube5542]

It would be cool if it changed depending on which country you're fighting for.

[@erice.9514]

Tbh this is the best run of that mission compared to other KZbinrs. Man imagine if they would give us coop mission and someone like you would play with someone like JiveTurkey (who has problems deploying his air assets). You really did great

[@cladecq]

Russian AA doctrine of this area (until ~this century) is to always shoot 2 missiles on a single target. Always double AA missiles. With 2 to 4 seconds between them. For many reasons, not only about the poor reliability of russian missiles, but also to limit countermeasure effects, making harder to evade etc. Same for SAM, of course. Always 2 SAM on a single target. You can see the difference in efficiency if you try. The probability of kill will increase quite significantly. I don't have the game, but I'm pretty sure it will work also this way. And for surface engagement : saturation. A good russian attack is when the lastest missiles of the last salvo would hit an already dead target. That is the USSR doctrine of the time. Best is multiple waves (like 8 each), very close to each other (some seconds), so only the first wave could be engaged by the ennemy and there is no time for the next waves coming to close to avoid. 3 waves can ensure dramatic destructions to a task force.

[@Baerinho]

a DnD player would say "rolling with advantage" . And i still hope we can cook up a whole Dance of the Vampires scenario to play around a bit with the over saturation with russian anti ship missles :D

[@TheSDB13]

Quote from a USAF fighter pilot I heard "They're called missiles not hittiles, always shoot two"

[@TheBelrick]

Nato fired 3 of the latest patriot missiles at an SU-34 and they all missed. Poor reliability of USA missiles? Or perhaps its actually a difficult thing to do to shoot down awacs supported modern jets with trained pilots?

[@m1sz3lpl24]

Nothing to do with soviet reliability, just simply increasing % chances of hitting. Also it was standard practice to fire both IR and radar missiles if in range of IR (so for example R-27R and R-27T) so that there are more threat types for the target to worry about, not to mention other than visual there is no way to tell IR missile is in the air, can't notch it either, in fact beaming radar missile defending only makes it easier for IR missile to track

[@vincentvoncarnap]

@@TheBelrick its not unreliability, its the engagement envelope. target was just too far and was aware of the missiles, so it could evade in time. with enough info, you become a lot less susceptible to most missile attacks.

[@k98_zock_tv47]

54:30 I am spotting a "Hero of the Sovietunion"

[@Reynard_11]

57:00 are you sure? 😂

[@k98_zock_tv47]

@@Reynard_11 😆

[@based_and_fumopilled]

Also a diving champion of USSR

[@forcea1454]

You also had the ASW version of the Beriev P-42, which would have been faster than flying helicopters out that far.

[@SuperLocochicken]

37:01 DCS AI moment XD

[@TheHumanHighlighter]

I cannot truly express how much I wanted a video like this, talk about a of a breath of fresh air. The pauses to take in the true atmosphere of the game and the spectacle of it all, edited with the music at a nice volume and some gorgeous cinematic angles to boot. Not just "Hey guys here's gameplay, let me show you how I turned off the HUD for 3 seconds to get my thumbnail and didn't even edit that out of the final video." Literally in the first 20 minutes you interrogated and managed to work around so many things that had me grinding my teeth when other channels did nothing. You know, the 'ol "Why aren't they listening to my orders whelp better throw up my hands and let them die" instead of "My aircraft aren't listening to orders? Hmm... what's the last thing did before that issue occurred..." (ok ok I'll stop) Basically, seeing someone who's well versed in not only the craft of creating a good showcase video, but ALSO the basics of troubleshooting gameplay issues is bliss considering the current coverage of this game. Last part of my wall of text I promise, it's 3 AM and I'm not really all there. I know you were primarily a DCS guy, but seeing you branch out and show that you can tackle games that aren't really even in your wheelhouse signals to me (being one of the people who enjoys a lot of your variety content) that your value is so much more than just being "the DCS cold war guy" as I'm sure many evaluate. Please continue to make quality content for whatever you wish, because I'm very much enjoying the creative/informative/exploratory direction you've been going recently. All the best my friend.

[@Enigma89]

The DCS Cold War thing is always funny to me because I was always a tourist in DCS and I always liked WWII more... The DCS server was trying to bring IL-2 type of play to DCS and with the channel I always wanted it to be about multiple games. So was happy to see this comment. Thanks Edit: just a reminder that this CC version of the game did not come a tutorial so we are all learning it on the fly. So go easy on the others 😅

[@moirakadhan745]

wolfpack345 has similarly edited content, if you're curious :D

[@TheHumanHighlighter]

@@Enigma89 You deserve the kind words and support after the obvious display of effort. I do appreciate the other CC's, but I was just word vomiting at 3 AM and had some frustrations. I make sure to not leave them negative comments an keep it to myself.

[@TheHumanHighlighter]

@@moirakadhan745 Hell yeah, just found his content a month ago, I was just trying not to name names while I complained/complemented.

[@JustJohn505]

this long video was very much needed

[@k98_zock_tv47]

01:12:45 A cargo freighter with an american flag - I would not say thats colleteral damage in this scenario.

[@Khomuna]

Also, there are spy ships in the game, who's to say that cargo ship isn't one?

[@stevemc6010]

Seeing a Soviet carrier group always makes me think of ACE5' Sea of Chaos

[@dougroberts3840]

First time I've ever seen someone beat this mission, great job.

[@Enigma89]

Thanks, I was happy I was able to get through it on my first real try, definitely getting a better feel for the game.

[@scullystie4389]

I like how the Soviet carrier AEW plane is just an S-3 with a dish and some funky engine pods

[@mckoyjackson2518]

Can we get a battle of coral sea type scenario. A US aircraft carrier battle group with full complement of aircraft, cruisers, destroyers, subs and supply ship And a Soviet aircraft carrier battle group of the same. Give the soviets the project 1153 Orel to even the airfleet conplement. Details: The Soviets have broken out of the Mediterranean and are now in the Atlantic trying to sever the link between the American and their European allies. The royal navy and the french navy carriers have already been sunk! The Americans have dispatched a carrier group from Norflok to stop the Soviets. Victory conditions: find and destroy the enemy fleet before they find and destroy you.

[@scullystie4389]

One thing aircraft carrier management needs is the ability to set alert fighters and pre-stage the aircraft you want on the deck. Under real flight ops you'd usually not be bringing jets straight from the hangar to the cat, they'd be fueled and armed topside and arranged in the most efficient spot for their order of sortie

[@redgriffindiver7740]

No such thing as deploying an air launched torpedo "too close" to the sub. Torp goes in, turns and Bam!

[@wanderer2688]

Regarding the rogue Mig 23 at 34:00 , at the bottom bar you can see he's trying to engage contact 7001 (the enemy AWACS), instead of the two recon aircraft who are 7066 & 7067. So when set to weapons free he decided to go for a completely different target.

[@largezo7567]

Great video, please keep making more

[@thomasbessis2809]

That's pretty sick

[@j6moon15]

The way you play is truly.. an Enigma..

[@benleman649]

That second submarine was first detected long before you realized. Even before your unguided bombing runs on the airfield. You just didn't notice because it wasn't being reported as hostile. 😅

[@Enigma89]

I turned off the AI Voices because I felt like it was going to be too annoying for people to watch during a long video so it was easy for me to miss.

[@benleman649]

@@Enigma89 That would explain it. 🙂 Good to know this is a customizable thing.

[@alankucar8025]

Absolutely brilliant cinema, hollywood could never. I have not been this excited about a game since I was like 12 so yay I guess.

[@wastelander89]

I liked watching dcs senerios but this game is way more fun to watch. Hope to see more sea power on your channel I just found your channel

[@MikeKrasnenkov]

1:12:40 they were not shooting at merchants, the missiles were TV guided but connection was lost once the planes engaged different targets.

[@ironmanhowes8200]

i think i heard someone else say that if you press middle mouse button when a unit that's in a formation is selected will select the lead of the formation instead, so it can be easier to give orders to them without making them split up by accident

[@Enigma89]

oooo

[@D00MerJohn]

Contrary to IRL performance the navalizer MIG-23 in game is about equal to the F-15A besides carrying fewer missiles. I like that they added the Orel and all of its companions, it lets us build some amazing what if Scenarios.

[@xgreywolf1525]

Wonder if airport restocking could be a feature? I could imagine a scenario where you have to hold the line, wait for aviation restock to push back opfor or evacuate your position. This also should be necessary for grand campaign.

[@jimiacuwhg3836]

Nice to see some MiG-23s

[@NovaTrap1312]

Never forget what ED took from us brother.

[@Khomuna]

I don't have the game, but from what I've seen from other creators it's hardly worth it to micromanage aircraft, just send them to a waypoint, enable their radars and give them weapons free, they will attack and defend using the appropriate weapons and methods. Same goes for defending against ASMs, just turn on air search for all your ships and set them to weapons free, they will detect ASMs more reliably and engage with SAMs, guns and CIWS as needed.

[@PawFromTheBroons]

Nice to see this has been patched. Last time I've watched that mission, planes refused to RTB on the Orel.

[@bobtank6318]

That engagement at 37 mins was very buggy, but I think there actually may be some intentional behavior behind why they didn’t fire those radar guided missiles at the end. The MIG-23’s radar was terrible when pursuing an aircraft, being unable to get a lock on when facing the rear part of an aircraft. Since it couldn’t get a lock on, it couldn’t fire those AA-7Cs, which are radar guided. Of course, that requires the devs to have actually modeled the problems with the 23’s radar in game. I could be reading way to much into this and it’s just all bugs. And there is no reason they should’ve crashed there.

[@Jason-ye4vy]

they've got to improve SAM accuracy. Being able to loiter within visual range of a carrier at 1000 ft doesn't seem reasonable

[@mkapaceb98]

56:00 this looks like crew abandoned that planes before contact...

[@richnolen6862]

once you get your fighters in position and or assign a specific target, set them to weapons free after they complete the engagement, reassign to weapons tight

[@Bot101101]

These larger scenarios really show the need for a UI update where you will be able to switch the map to a task force/flight group view, i.e. not showing individual ships and airplanes but icons for groups of units based on their approximate centerpoints. This works much better to handle larger scale engagements. Also, you should really be able to open a strike dialog/window where you can assign missiles for an attacking group to a target group. If I have 24 Backfires opening up on a Carrier group I shouldn't have to click around too much and remember just how many missiles I assigned from Backfire #3 to that Ticonderoga cruiser, it should be clearly visible in a strike window. Then click "Execute" and all Backfires launches simultaneously, like they would in real life.

[@ClaymoreM18]

I wonder If with the full game we are going to have the Kuznstsov class along with Su-33; since it launch in 1985; I love her desing, it´s so soviet, even with all her problems

[@marduk87]

I believe its behind deadline. From what ive understood the deadline is 81-82-83 at max.

[@victoriousomen]

​@@marduk87This mission takes place in August 1985.

[@ClaymoreM18]

@@marduk87 Probably yeah, if is not, someone for sure will have a mod for it

[@bobtank6318]

The devs confirmed they will not be adding the Kuznetsov

[@ClaymoreM18]

@@bobtank6318 crippling depression :(

[@HoChiMeme]

TAKR Tbilisi and TAKR Baku equipped with Yak-41s would be a better fit for the game tbh. I hope they add them

[@Dracomarine]

The Soviet Navy really needs to up it's pilot training game...

[@LodewijkVrije]

KH-59, NATO reporting name AS-13 Kingbolt. Missile weight 950KG. (2100lbs) warhead weight 320KG (705lbs)

[@mkapaceb98]

1:18:00 I believed angled deck allows for (almost) simultaneous landing and take-offs?

[@Hurricane2k8]

Your collateral damage was a civilian ship, one of your missiles overshot the two enemy vessels, crossed the straight and went for a freighter, you can see it at 1:07:45 on the map edit: ah nvm, you realized that yourself

[@davidmann1871]

Looks like the ocean surface is the most dangerous anti- aircraft threat. 😂

[@Tiro_Chopper]

I hope the devs will let us choose which naming convention to use, since I can't make sense of the NATO reporting codes for soviet/russian weapons

[@robertbakedalaskanfitzhugh3016]

I have noticed that when a civilian ship is hit you get the message even if the enemy is responsible for the kill

[@aquila3958]

To this day I dont understand why the soviets never went for a true blue water carrier, nuclear powered and with catapults, instead theyd go for the inefficient VTOL carriers coupled with Anti-Ship missiles, which they could construct more of but they were seriously lacking in capability, then when they finally decided on something useful, the Ulyanovsk, it was too late with her being broken up 40% complete

[@pogba638]

Most creators are making their own scenarios based on historical-ish events so if you wanted to avoid spoiling missions you can make some simple ones and still make some content :)

[@Enigma89]

I am not a full time content creator so based on my time limits me on what I can and can't do. I have been working on a Cuba Missile Crisis scenario but I am going out of town this weekend so not going to be able to finish it until November.

[@subvet3668]

I may have missed it but are your radars on ? For both your aircraft and ships the air search radars need to be on to guide the missiles until it's terminal phase since most are semi-active and not the more modern "fire and forget" variety.

[@Enigma89]

So based on the mission type will result in a different loadout. Some of the a2a loadouts are Fox 2 missiles only, in others they will carry a mix of fox 1 and fox 2. When you make planes weapon free they will turn on their radars. So basically it depends on what was happening. When I play while I am not recording, I actually play the entire game from the map screen because it is much easier to manage everything but that's obviously very boring for videos so, I basically have to play in a less efficient manner.

[@cpdumph]

I think he's saying your SAMs are missing because the Slava didn't have its radar on. No data link, no active aams either, they're semi-active aams so your MiG-23s need to be guiding them. Your early warning aircraft can't do it alone. I believe each platform needs to have their own sensors on.

[@Enigma89]

​@@cpdumph I would be surprised if they can launch without any sort of guidance. I am planning on doing a breakdown of how all the radars work in the game.

[@an_odd_one5184]

@@Enigma89 I can’t wait for that!

[@crazyVrex]

i would suggest not to turn them to weapons free if you want to micro them a lot like you did. In weapons free they will just go and pursue a target of their liking, mostly ignoring your commands. Weapons tight is best if you have the time to micro them and give them the kill orders on targets you choose, weapons free is good if you just send them into a certain area and want them to act completely independently and not bother with them.

[@alextheautonomousman8709]

Looks like SP is best played with two windows opened simultaneously (tactical map and 3D world). Wish there would be a way to have the windows separated on screen. Or have at least in the 3D world the centerpoint offset to the right.

[@JdeMonster]

Keel is probably Depth under Keel.

[@benleman649]

Great video, as usual. But how did that AIM-7 missile hit your MiG-23 after the F-15 had been killed already? Shouldn't it have lost guidance immediately? Or is there actually a version of the Sparrow that has terminal guidance?

[@TheSovietWombat]

Imagine this game but with DCS level graphics

[@Enigma89]

I like the graphics for the size an scale of this game. Anything more and it would really start taxing systems. When you get the game and start playing, I think you will be surprised how much easier it is to play from the map mode only and in that view you don't see any 3d renders

[@TheSovietWombat]

@@Enigma89 BUT IMAGINE BATTLEFIELD 3 STYLE SHIP DESTRUCTION

[@H3nry2077]

Not sure, but isnt keel depth the depth of the ocean under bottom most part the ship (keel)?

[@Enigma89]

Yes that's what it is

[@Mecha_Gear]

Rumba Lotte Pun intended

[@thepujajo]

55:48 dude just set the plane weapons free (bottom right)

[@calvinmulraine736]

Its the same music that is in Xenonauts 2

[@kizvy]

Man these mig 23 pilots love crashing into the water.

[@themigmadmarine]

Is it possible to have aircraft set up as on standby ready to launch without launching them straight away?

[@edwardsutherland461]

Does the game have in-mission saves? I love cold waters but the lack of a save feature kills it for me - and this looks like it has some really long missions!

[@hunterhurley5245]

It does not yet, devs said it is being actively worked on.

[@InarusLynx]

Aren't there newer stable releases of the game? I've seen at least 60 if not 61.

[@Enigma89]

I don't do this full time. I typically make my videos weeks, if not, months in advance. I like to have 4-6 weeks worth of videos saved up, that way if I go out of town or get busy with work all I have to do is just make a video public. takes the stress off

[@InarusLynx]

@@Enigma89 ah

[@daviniusb6798]

Who else gets strong game of thrones vibes from the music in this game?

[@Dracomarine]

I don't, but love the song nonetheless. Makes for a great intro song. Microprose nailed it with the advertising campaign on this one.

[@daviniusb6798]

@@Dracomarine They really did, all my beloved content creators are involved plus some I did not know beforehand

[@Jubs1204]

I love mig 23 brainrot

[@Savage1-0-7]

really hoping they go to work on the particle effects. MS paint level shit is unacceptable in 2024

[@akd8525]

Tha air AI needs a lot of work.

[@peteypyotr8158]

Okay cool... Nobody else can play it

[@Locutus_lives]

Free DODO

[@manishy1]

Love the concept of this game but not being able to vs players really showcases how incredibly dumb and predictable the AI is. They just beeline towards the nearest detected targets and engage - no concept of going defensive after being fired upon or detected, no concept of trying to avoid fire or to draw your forces away from the cluster. Really, really simplistic and stupid AI which I think will prove to be a huge problem for the games longevity post-release. At current, mission makers simply resort to staggering the units around the map and simply pray that they don't path to the player's units all at the same time. There are two things that could fix this: 1. Introduce a PvP implementation. The problem with this is how to implement time-dilation to be interesting for both players. Maybe have it be 3-10x while 'no unit is engaging another unit' and turn it down to 1x while 'a unit is engaging another unit' or something? 2. Rework the AI. Program them to have preset 'realistic' behaviours, so that they do things like bait engagements at the edge of engagement ranges, they group themselves up, they turn on and turn off their own radars based on accuracy of data, etc, they coordinate their units to enter engagement ranges at the same time from different vectors, etc.

[@bobtank6318]

AI behavior is something the devs have noted are working on. PVP is a much bigger ask. Devs said any implementation, if it comes, would be a year plus away.

[@Stooltoad5017]

I also want to point out that adding pvp isn’t as easy as flicking a wand. To my limited understanding, if the game isn’t designed to have multiplayer from the ground up, than its really difficult to implement later. I can’t imagine the developers have the time to add multiplayer and continue work on the rest of the game at the same time. Adding multiplayer may just bog the game’s development down when other game features are more important. Continued work on the ai is probably the better solution.

[@coldclaws2479]

naval mig23???

[@mastergshotgun]

au au au, even my eyes got hurt by your Slavic pronunciation... Dude! Come on!

[@Enigma89]

I studied German, Spanish and French not Russian. Sorry