What is KISS ULTRA and is it REALLY better? | ULTRA v. G4 & ULTRA v. Betaflight 🤔

[@uavtech]

Hi everyone, thanks for commenting. It helps the YT analytics. 🙂 This video is for my core audience so they can make good buying decisions. Clearly understand the differences of ULTRA vs. G4 vs. an open-source H7. Also, so folks to put some critical thinking on the hype. I didn't mean to insult any of your deities (Alex) or shake the ground of your core belief structure (KISS is like God status --- enough though the science on it to date shows otherwise). I'm shocked that folks can't believe that an open-source project, solely focused on improving flight performance, actually flies better than KISS. It does, and you can see it for yourself if you actually do the testing. And I don’t mean some half-baked Flat Earth testing, I mean honest testing. While KISS was focused on "Keeping, it, Simple", Betaflight was focused on increasing flight performance. Why is it a shock that it then flies better? I’m sorry that doesn't match with everyone’s worldview, but that's what the testing shows. If you think my previous testing was flawed in some way, we can have that conversation, but no one seems to think that as no one brings up that idea. So, if future testing shows otherwise, we’ll show that, but I’m not going to lie because of your feelings. Again, I’m sorry and I don’t mean to be insulting. I hope you can understand. 75% of the video were feature differences between ULTRA, G4, and an H7 BF FC, but you jump all over the BF > KISS statement. Nevertheless, I have NOT tested ULTRA to date. In talking with Alex - after I did my previous testing, which may be spurred him looking to improve the previous items - he indicated he has worked to improve throbbles, etc… with ULTRA. I trust that he has, but as covered in the video, would want to verify it before telling my audience it no longer exists. I also outlined in the video how difficult it is to get an ULTRA in the USA and that is why I have not done the testing already. If I get a chance, I will take it and update the KISS results I have seen to date, but until then, I’m not going to just take it on word that KISS now outperforms BF. That would be a big insult to all the developers that have contributed to BF over the last 3 or 4 years to make it great; FOR FREE!! (Wow, what community-minded folks that give and give). Finally, if you preferer grapes over bananas, that’s cool. But it doesn’t mean grapes are better than bananas. Actually, bananas are better for you; scientifically speaking. 😉

[@willpowerfpv3246]

It never ceases to amaze me how tribal people get about their preferences. This is why over the past year since I've gotten into the hobby, I've slowly learned that you need to take everybody's opinions with a grain of salt, and experience things firsthand. That's why I have twenty quads already... six of which are 5 in freestyles... of those, four are betaflight, and two are kiss. I don't know enough about tuning to maximize the performance out of all but one of my BF quads. That is on me, not the equipment. It seems like most people refuse to take responsibility for user error, and immediately blame the components, instead of taking a measured approach to make them fly better. BF is hard...but it's also more powerful. Reminds me of Apple vs Android. Anyways, I'm trying to learn, and your content, along with JB and Rosser has been incredibly valuable for me, so thank you. I appreciate your efforts to keep pushing the limits of this thing we love. 👊🏻

[@chrisyoung8062]

I'm not sure why people make tech religious. These are just tools. Find the tool that works for you and learn to use it. BF works for me because it's in constant improvement and plenty of hardware, on which to run it, is available. I get the "feel" argument and can appreciate anyone who believes one FC ecosystem feels better than another. That's cool...fly it. Mark is just saying that according to the math, nothing else out performs BF.

[@joemck1235]

You think people would understand that Im glad you do these videos but by no means stopped me from maybe getting a kiss fc other ultra at some point but bf 4.3 is flying so awesome I'm just sticking to that for now

[@griffusfpv6476]

Ignore the kiss fanboys Mark. Honestly they are all fluff and little to no fact. Your videos have been excellent so please keep it up. I am really keen to see your results when you finally get Ultra though because I've been burned by kiss and it's community as well. Short version of the tale is this: I was coming from years of BF, I listened to ALL the big kiss bois I had shouting in my ears from all over, decided to finally get kiss v2. After paying a ridiculously absurd amount for the ecosystem it flew like absolute ASS, was a nightmare to build correctly with very little documentation out there. I can go into details but thats the gist of it. Now I feel scammed and I won't believe a single thing Alex says until I can verify it myself as well. Credit where credit is due though, a small handful of proper kiss pilots did reach out to me over the years (like krunked and a few more), but in the end no one could help me get kiss v2 to fly remotely close to "good enough". So what I noticed back then is that kiss bois are loud AF, they shout at the top of their lungs "all hail kiss", but when I had issues what I found is that so many other pilots that also tried it had issues, could not find solutions, and ended up leaving and giving up on it. That's why so few kiss pilots seem to not have issues, because of the many that do, there are little to no solutions. Bardwell said it well: "if you have a problem on kiss, well then you're just kinda stuck". 2 years later now and I hope that has changed, but until I see otherwise KISS is read HYPE for me.

[@gluonfpv419]

I recently swapped all my main 5" freestyle quads from BF over to Fettec. Why? Because even though I know BF has the *potential* to fly better, I could never quite get it flying the way I wanted (could never tune out my propwash, and had bad yaw jump), and I was overwhelmed with the number of things you can change and the time it was taking me to tune it. With Fettec/KISS, on a brand new build it takes like 2 minutes to set everything up and throw on the Krunked Golden tune and it flies better than any of my BF quads. I don't like to tune - for me it's a necessary evil. I'm happy with something that flies 90-95% as good as a "perfect" tune if I don't need to tune it at all. If there was a "Golden" preset (for 6s 5" with HD cam - something in the 650-750g AUW) in BF 4.3 I'd consider switching back just because I like the open-source aspect. TLDR; it's not so much that I think (Fettec) KISS is better than Betaflight - I know it's proven not to be - but for me KISS has a preset tune that's better than the BF presets I've tried (or my own tunes), and with my limited time to fly I'd rather tune as little as possible.

[@SupaflyFPV]

My thoughts: Federov has done a nice job and the H7 OSD is great. This is what Kiss users have wanted for years. However BF has been making a lot of great work over these last years on the flight code and the features, reliability and availability have always been good. When you are used to the accurate tracking of BF - the throbbles and Iterm accumulation which Mark mentions get annoying to deal with. I am finding that with my Kiss Ultra. One thing though that still stands out about Kiss in practice, is the propwash response. In order to get close in BF you have to push it to the limits on PIDs and filtering in my experience. However with Kiss - the stock filter setup works bang on out of the box and with most 5" builds. Tuning has to be worked on to tighten it up from stock. To test propwash from an engineering standpoint, someone could tune them both fairly with stock and advanced filter setups on both, log both systems (BF piggyback) and take the gyro in PTB and use the spectrogram to see the peak and median noise in the 40hz region. I'd like to do it if I get the time, it would be a good piece of content. That would give some sort of answer in data. Either way, competition is healthy and the options for pilots of all tastes is improving which makes the hobby better for all.

[@slogan9105]

Really nice overview

[@IvanEfimovLimon]

Thanks for the video. I like the way you finished it. It is true that Kiss devs did not say they fly better or worse than Betaflight. They just do their own thing, and that's respectable. Unlike other firmwares they never really talk s**t about BF. And that KISS OSD looks very nice.

[@GForce3693]

Sniffs*: Ah I love the smell of kiss fanboys crying in the morning. XD

[@danielzawerton7023]

Thank you for an honest and candid view. You do awesome work and I understand the commitment it takes to put out very informative videos like you do. I just happen to be one of those guys who started back in 2016 when there was not a whole lot of information available and the original Rotor Riot guys were putting out the Alien Build, which included step by step videos on how to get started in this hobby. (Thank you Chad Nowack) the drone, the FC, the Radio and all the little tricks and tips of Open TX. I have a lot of friends that fly BF and others that fly KISS, fly what you like and have a great time !!!!!! Be safe ! DZ

[@steezyfpv7620]

I didn't want a Kiss Ultra before today, but between this video and Vannys video, I'm so intrigued 🤣

[@MikePilk]

Just remember everyone it’s all based on personal preference and how comfortable you are flying a certain firmware. BF isn’t the best for everyone, on paper it might be but feel is different. UAVtech is not the end all say all of how you feel when flying a quadcopter. He might be the self designated “vetter” but that shouldn’t stop anyone from trying something different.

[@uavtech]

It is better in every measure i have tested; vetting in detail more than anyone has on the internet.

[@MikePilk]

@@uavtech sorry but I disagree on paper Bf might be better but overall flight feel I prefer kiss. The feel is different between the two. You can’t tell someone else besides yourself how something feels when they fly it🤷🏼‍♂️ it’s down to the end user to decide that’s what bothers me here.🤷🏼‍♂️

[@uavtech]

Folks can have opinions, but when you look at critical strain testing, it shows otherwise I'm sorry to say.

[@GForce3693]

@@MikePilk I don't think UAVTech ever meant one is better for you or anyone else. He is saying, after actually verifying ( check his videos) that one is objectively better. He didn't say you have to like the fact the earth is round... just that it is in fact round and he did test it. ;) Choosing to keep believing the earth is flat is everyone's own choice and fine if that makes you happy. Just know you can't say its flat based on fact, you see?

[@JoeMommaFPV]

I feel like he addressed this very type of comment within the video. You FEEL like it's different, and maybe prefer that "feel" better. But objectively, and scientifically all data shows that BF flies better. That's been proven over and over now. Good example mark used, you may "feel like" the Earth is flat, but science and data shows that it is in fact round.

[@northerntierfpv8947]

This will make the collective's day!! Great content, Thanks Mark!

[@richardheedfpv9626]

Great vid Mark. I started flying around 8 years ago. Betaflight devs have given(literally) to me great flying experiences and a ever improving product. 4.3 is superb. I just want to shout out to all of those who have had input. Cheers.

[@IvanEfimovLimon]

Oh I was waiting for this :) can't watch now, can't wait to watch in the evening ))

[@kwikam]

I love your blackbox log aproach to testing. It’s great for racers. But freestyle is not about tracking the sticks with 100% accuracy. Some people, me included, find doing tricks easier and smoother while performed on those (as you said) rubber bands attached to the sticks. Betaflight is superior in terms of features but man… it’s like some science guy telling skaters which wheels to use on a skateboard to perform better according to his calculations. Anyway, great work Mark, I really appreciate what you do!

[@uavtech]

Blackbox shows all, freestyle or race.

[@alexanderfedorov7890]

@@uavtech 100% follow your setpoint doesnt make it feel good. It means it FOLLOWS SETPOINT WELL. ;)

[@uavtech]

Remind me how we command the quad to fly and what we define as bad? Most define bad flight performance as the quad doing things we didn't tell it to do. What is telling the quad what to do? That's right, the Setpoint. So following that thing is the quad doing what we tell it to do. You guys running away from that point, just underscore you showing your cards. Just admin keeping it simple didn't have a focus on flight performance. BF was solely focused on flight performance and you can't let it go. You want to have your cake and eat it too, but I'm sorry when you do the science, it doesn't pan out that way so far. I'm sorry, you can't have it all. Well, you can't but it needs to be true and it isn't. Do you just want me to lie? You said to me, you never said it did fly better than BF, but then when i say that, you say it does. Pic something and stick with it, but if the testing doesn't show that real life doesn't meet the narrative, it is the fault of the person who set the narrative. Not the person doing the hard testing.

[@zfpv7211]

@@alexanderfedorov7890 I’ve been trying to explain this to Mark for like 2 years now lol it’s like beating a dead horse at this point. No worries though. Everyone has their preference, no reason to hate each other lol I just think it’s funny when people try so hard to push their opinions and call it “science”. One can say that it triggers me. Call it a character defect

[@YoYoYo]

@@alexanderfedorov7890 You can setup BF to not follow setpoint well as well.

[@willpowerfpv3246]

I'm just here to witness the outrage. 😭😭😭 Great video, Mark! 🙏

[@MCsCreations]

Great comparison, Mark! Thanks! 😊 Stay safe there with your family! 🖖😊

[@sunsetpark_fpv]

Thanks for the breakdown Mr UAV - as usual, a normal shlub like me won't notice any difference, I'll be flying my quad all over flat Earth with Betaflight on most of my quads..... 😎 The "round Earth" quads will use INav 😂😎

[@JaydenLawson]

My experience: I'm flying Kiss (v1, v2), and building 3 Ultra quads at the moment. Liking all the new features. Will be using Return to Home quite a bit for some long range videography over the ocean. Have found Alex to be very responsive on Discord.

[@CrawlersCampRc]

I really appreciate you clarifying that this will work with blheli-s! Excited to see your review on how it preforms once you have one.

[@PkwyDrive13]

Flat earthers 😂 they fly KISS.

[@zlachannel8674]

im agreed with mark uav tech, and some people may not wanna hear the truth even with the flight data in their front eyes , they just keep in their brain "kiss is better", (because their has buy the expensive ESC which is not durable enough during crash over the years and their expensive motor) personally i don't feel it kiss is outperform over BF specially in troubleshooting on a worn quad , my kiss stack blows at a few crash, but beta give me infinite/wider setting even if my quad has worn out due the crash over the years and give me an quality stick time with my low budget motors and the most important is durability, for those who doesn't like betaflight is because their dont have time to understand the fine tune & get the remaining 10% on their final tune & some of them just counting on the pricetag what makes them proud when flying with their friends.

[@HayBeseret]

Hi - Thanks for the video ! - for the best of my knowledge and as per Fettech website - G4 does have an on board OSD.

[@SkeezyFPV]

There’s two versions; one with OSD and one without

[@Nici619]

I need popcorn 🍿 for the comment section

[@MasqUp]

Another great video! Thank you for all that you do!

[@jejefpv]

I was hoping for a logs comparaison. Hope you can soon get one Ultra for some real testing, to see how different it is from "old" KISS. Don't pay attention to rough/stubborn comments, thanks for your work.

[@timothyphillips4801]

Earth NOT flat??? ...oh geez...oh well. BTW,great analysis, and explanation. Subbed!!

[@Johow]

Cool video. Thanks! (whats that filter, that lets your teeth look so funny?!)

[@uavtech]

Reality | Life filter.

[@mr-huggy]

I have been flying Fettec G4 with the new non kiss firmware and so far it feels solid, you can configure it from a web browser or from the OSD, theres presets, motor mapping, testing etc. It's in alpha at the moment and more parts are been added as they get done. Fettec are moving away from Kiss much like Kiss Ultra is moving away from Kiss.

[@alexanderfedorov7890]

Ultra continues KISS... Fettec leaves the ship.

[@cheechfpv]

Thank You for science/blackbox backed data! 🙌🏽

[@BrickWallFPV]

Great Video! I switch to KISS G4 because I only use Holybro Single ESC and KISS G4 is the only board that still have Signal and ground on each corner for Single ESC. Coming from Betaflight, KISS might have a different feel to it? KISS just work out for me for personal reasons! Betaflight was great to for me!!

[@Dwacald420]

Build a quad for us so we can have a look at your build quality. That part seems to be missing from all the technical stuff. Thanks

[@nukekasparov]

Would love to see further real comparison between those fcs.. u are awesome mark.. 👍👍👍👍

[@definingslawek4731]

Have you since tested an Ultra? I purchased an ultra from the drop last week for 120 euros and I was so excited to try it, though I’m surprised to see this and how you say the old kiss stuff is objectively worse. I was intrigued by Vanovers video and by Bardwell. I guess I got caught up in the hype train. Will still be fun to try it I suppose, could even try to do a blind test between it and beta flight. Oh well, the hype train is big enough still that I can resell it if I don’t like it.

[@tehllama42]

I hadn't appreciated how much better the KISS ULTRA OSD capability was, that is light years ahead of everything else, in an absolutely good way. If that plays nicely with canvas mode on HDZero, I may actually wind up stacking Kiss Ultra 20x20 boards just to have that kind of capability for some of my dual-sport chase rigs. I have to give them mad props for that, the OSD capabilities are super impressive.

[@uavtech]

Yeah, the OSD is legit. Good stuff Alex!!

[@krsslim]

Having more currently developed options is a great thing for everyone. It was a smart move making kiss work natively with blheli esc's, if they can crank up production of flight controllers & get into a more high volume low cost scenario kiss could be something more commonly used by the masses. Betaflight's main upside is the proliferation of hardware, it would be great if kiss hardware was as accessible.

[@phiveone]

Thanks for clearing up (at least for myself) this whole KISS business.

[@doctorjmobilefilming8194]

Everyone, Mark is correct, don’t even bother to get Kiss Ultra, betaflight flies great with the proper tune.

[@uavtech]

not just great, better. There is a difference. OLD KISS really does not fly well. Serously, the throbbles are horrible but everyone just glosses over that stuff because they spent more $$ on the FC.

[@prottentogo]

Interesting... Americans having to shop overseas and having some trouble with it. Never thought it could be the other way around. 😅

[@GuruGoesUTube]

Exactly, greetings from Austria! :D

[@scottmilano2940]

The G4 is available and does fly great. Kiss does have people like Mr Steele and Vanover recommending it, so it certainly seems worth trying. The G4 feels better than some betaflight FCs I've flown, but my point of comparison is usually a cheap betaflight FC. The Fettec 35amp AIO board flys great too in something like the 2fiddy.

[@uavtech]

Eh, has throbbles bad and drift issues. Ask Alex Federoff, the original firmware developer, he'll tell you.

[@MrAlucardDante]

Vanover flies cinelifters now, so he is no longer relevant. And Mr steele is entitled to his own opinions (and to whoever pays for his gear *cough* TBS *cough*). Evan Turner runs Betaflight and Min Chan Kim FlightOne, that tells a lot about Kiss IMO

[@scottmilano2940]

@@uavtech I don''t have to ask anyone, I can just fly it, unlike Kiss Ultra. I don't have issues. Heck look at Bardwell's comparison video.

[@uavtech]

Min Chan Kim flies BF. At least he did in spec class races he was just at.

[@zlachannel8674]

@@uavtech agreed, the fastest man on earth flies beta not kiss/fettec,,😁.. this is the proved beta has a good consistency and good improvement to support racer,, i wondering if fettec/kiss ESC can support and win the competition without burning in after the crash..

[@pirateradioFPV]

Looks like a decently priced H7 FC to flash betaflight with 🤔😁

[@kuliahtransportasi]

thank you

[@PlanetJeroen]

KISS's own 'Who are we' made me steer clear. I'll determine what is too hard for me to figure out, and find a guide and learn. It's not like it's ... well, never mind, it's pretty close :p But I love learning and Betaflights defaults have not yet let me down on my builds, and if you care to invest a few hours, its not THAT hard to tune, it just sucks.

[@uavtech]

Or you could just be wrong -- because you are. See min pinned comment and chill.

[@PlanetJeroen]

@@uavtech I'm always wrong, I also always get where I was going, so I'm fine 😅 Thanks for your awesome educational material. I don't intend to diss anyone for their choices or try to say that kiss is bad, I just never like when companies say: we will make this digestible for you.

[@TERBANGFPV]

i hope youll get an ultra to test.. i really dont like to fly 'something in the shadow'.. haha cheers mark..

[@YoYoYo]

Mark, qurious if you watched the JB video comparing the G4 and Ultra. What is your opinion based on the footage there?

[@uavtech]

My comment on his Video: 3:45 - Both seemed just as smooth to me. 5:04 - Both seemed the same to me. I would encourage getting off the throttle completely on the 180 and raising rapidly. Then do another series where you raise slowly to draw-out wash differences the best you can. 7:13 - Both A and B have bounceback. It is subtle and I-term based. Would be nice to have stick overlay to confirm your fingers were not moving though (KISS has logging). 8:20 - Too little samples for me to tell on throbbles. Level out more and pump the throttle up and down rapidly. Like 2x faster. 9:13 - no opinion, I'm not seeing the relevance of power loops in grading performance. Unless like for wash coming down off the arc? For that maybe just do split-S turns. Maybe something else to add to moves is 100% throttle punch for 1s and then getting off the throttle and drifting down for 2s to see how well it holds for drift control. There is a balance there for i-gain between good drift control with KISS, but not having too much i-gain with KISS to have more i-term bounceback that is tough to find (the balance).

[@JoshuaBardwell]

@@uavtech power loops were intended to show propwash performance during a smooth arc similar to a split s but under more controlled altitude and speed.

[@daich]

Can you explain why 3.5.7 feels better than 4.2? I haven’t tried 4.3

[@uavtech]

it doesn't. Done. That was easy.

[@daich]

@@uavtech I guess I should rephrase that...why does 3.5.7 feel different and so many pilots prefer it over 4.x

[@uavtech]

because they are crazy? IDK. All I know is factually how 3.5.7 is so much worse. The same guys who made 3.5.7 can write you a book about how 4.0, 4.1, 4.2, 4.3 are so much better than it. You can also just log plenty of things and also put your quad into specific situations where 4.2 and 4.3 are way better. One thing alone, is throbbles. 4.3 is way better than 3.5.7 on throbbles. Also following rates, again 4.3 is much better. I could demonstrate the throbbles improvement on any quad with back-to-back flashes (same PIDs filters, etc...) Keep in mind that for every 1 "so many pilots" the is like 1,000 the other direction. Again, I think it deals with the John Conner effect. As long as they are not hurting anyone, fine stay on old FW, but folk should not put stock in what they are saying is we know for a fact it is false. They will eventually upgrade, trust me. Some folks I'm sure are out there that say they love multi-wii, so should we all try to flashback to it? You can if you want, but we know if flew like crap. But if someone like that, that's cool, but it's not a measure to increase performance and advance the ball in flight performance for multi-rotors. I'm trying to provide good forward-thinking -- no bullshit -- content for my audiance. That means discmissing some of the backwards stuff out there in FPV.

[@joemck1235]

@@daich 4.3 is amazing best out right now

[@SupaflyFPV]

Its mainly the filter setup you are using which affects the feel in my experience. They can be matched with 4.3 and it will all run better. I explored the issue you mention to check, and found once set up BF4 versions are in fact way better.

[@terminsane]

If KISS tried to standardize the UART usage, and made things more plug-n-play, they could get a good advantage in the ease of use demographic

[@baggszilla]

Thanks Mark!

[@brighFive]

I'm so down with you taking a quick break in explanation to dunk on flat earth 🤣

[@uavtech]

Flat KISS. There are striking similarities. Both say random shit that has no basis in reality and both reject any actual data that contradicts their world view.

[@10fantic]

3 stores sell kiss ultra, Nfactory, Kiss Ultra store, and impulserc.

[@1337flite]

"Opinions don't count in my world" ... "That's why most people fly Betaflight - because it flies the best". Nah. Your "doesn't count in your workld" opinion is probably wrong. Most people fly Betaflight because most people fly Betaflight. It may fly better, but that's not why people choose it. They choose it because that is what everyone else is flying so its easier to get going when you start and because it has a truck load of features and you can build a Betaflight quad for way less money. Most people think Kiss flies better because people with big audiences - e.g. Mr Steve say Kiss flies better. BTW thanks for the video I've just come back to FPV after a hiaitus and am tryinfg to work out what's going on with Kiss Flyduino, Fettec and Kiss Ultra. Still not there, but I have a better understanding than I started with.

[@almacfpv74]

@uavtech I love it. Keep selling betaflight. I dont want everyone jumping over to kiss. Keep. It. Super. Small. Leaves more availability for us kiss rippers. Haha. 😀😬😎

[@uavtech]

Likewise.

[@YoYoYo]

Lol. I have both, my backup is the kiss. I'm guessing people like you never flown a good quad in their life. Keep it!

[@zlachannel8674]

@@YoYoYo agreed, kiss rippers never get 100% fine tune in BF, and their has forget the developer in BF also has flown Kiss so beta developer has known better than the user thats why betaflight keeps grown into larger and better because community head are better than an single head

[@xfOL.]

selling betaflight... lol 🤣

[@zfpv7211]

There is no OSD chip on Kiss Ultra. It’s all done on the H7 natively…

[@finleystannard]

Sooooo?

[@uavtech]

Yeah, i didn't say that right. I should have articulated that better, but same difference i thing from a use experience. I do appreciate the clarrification though too.

[@zfpv7211]

@@finleystannard so? Lol that’s just a fact. Not a big deal. Thanks Mark for clarifying

[@cinemoriahFPV]

That's a good thing

[@Dav2112]

Fly what you enjoy guys, we are all just flying toys at the end of the day, I personally couldn't care to look at BB logs because I fly off how it feels in the air, and for me KISS has always felt more direct on the sticks compared to Betaflight. I have also got Betaflight quads that I enjoy flying too, but I had to spend several days messing around with settings in order to get it to fly the way it does, with KISS I just build, throw a base PID tune on it, my rates and arming switch and that's me in the air having fun. Would be interesting to have you look at some of the logs on my Betaflight setup once the nice weather is here again along with footage from the flights, it flies amazing in my opinion, my friend also thinks it flies great too, but I reckon the logs will be a mess if you looked at them.

[@uavtech]

All good. But that doesn't pan out when you actually look at the two. So no knock, it just shows other things influence folks perception of feel.

[@Dav2112]

@@uavtech what exactly is influencing my "perception of feel"? I literally just explained that I prefer the feel of KISS over my best flying Betaflight quads that I have, and that I don't care to look at a bunch of squiggly lines that mean nothing to me at all, so how can you say that other things are influencing my perception?? I'd much rather spend my time flying my quads and developing good piloting skills than spend my time being concerned about BB logs when they don't mean anything to me. Seriously man, when the weather is nice here I'll send you some logs and footage of my best flying Betaflight quad and you can tell me what you think about my logs, I guarantee they are far from perfect, but the quad flies great and does everything I need it to do. You just happen to release your video on an FC you haven't even flown almost straight after Joshua's comparison video as well, nice way to piggy back off larger KZbinrs to gain views. Probably made this in the hopes that Alex would send you a free Ultra!

[@uavtech]

First, if you know anything about making videos, you know I started this 2-days ago. This is not a race to the bottom of dumb-dumb brain. Like a laser level, tape measure or calipers, logging is a measuring tool for flight performance. So when you want to compare flight performance, use the right tools. Work smart. Folks can have their opinion, but when you -- "eh, it's about 8-ft" doesn't match up with my tape measure showing me it is 7'-6" that doesn't mean you are right. It means you eyeballed it and were wrong. It is 7'-6". I don't care how you felt about the distance or your preference for the distance. It is 7'-6" all day regardless of what you think.

[@mfrfpv9079]

most people fly beta flight because you can get it.

[@uavtech]

And it flies better. Hooray!! 😀

[@mfrfpv9079]

@@uavtech fair enough 4.3 has been a big advancement

[@OdysseusVrakas]

Maybe I'd get a kiss someday to see what it feels like. But. I'm still on betaflight for now

[@MrTrollmonkey]

15mins of my life I'm not getting back. Half of this video was spent just bashing kiss without it even sounding liek anything more than you personally not liking it.

[@uavtech]

Yup. Story of my life for anyone else. I never promised testing.

[@MikePilk]

100% facts

[@nigrinimihai1197]

BIG PS: When I get an Ultra you can have all my quads, just send me an Ultra, MARK my words You can have them all.

[@uavtech]

Suite. 117 S. State Street Box 504 Clarks Summit, PA 18411 I'll give them aways to folks.

[@nigrinimihai1197]

I am a man of my word. Love you for your work, learned a lot from you regarding betaflight but ... damn that thing is just pure bliss to fly.

[@nigrinimihai1197]

@@uavtech Mihai Nigrini Romania, Craiova, Dolj Postal Code 200540 Str. RECUNOȘTINȚEI Nr. 45

[@MrAlucardDante]

You do realize you can just swap the FC and keep your quads right? Right ?

[@uavtech]

shhhhh.... don't say that. Viewers love a good give-a-way.

[@Alin.Victor]

Mark, please, dont shake your legs before you go on top of the camel! :) Get a 🐫

[@AB-officialGPM]

1 hour after JB's video LOL

[@uavtech]

Yeah, if you think i can: 1. record, 2. edit, 3. render 4. and upload in 1-hr ... pass me what you are smoking. It takes my PC 1.5 hrs just to render this puppy. LOL.

[@PacketFPV]

@@uavtech what potato are you rendering on?

[@uavtech]

An HP Zbook workstation 15u G6. Eh, it's what I got.

[@MrAlucardDante]

I'm curious to know where you heard that a barometer is mandatory in France.

[@uavtech]

France pilots. Maybe only for commercial use?

[@MrAlucardDante]

@@uavtech maybe. Or it might be an old law when drone were under the french faa regulations. Nowadays it’s not mandatory anymore with the EU rules. Thanks anyway

[@uavtech]

IDK, it's on the Cinelifter group FB page where i have heard it a couple times. I thought it was just a know thing, but maybe not? It is not so much a baro, but you are required to know your height maybe? Again, just hearsay that I didn't question but maybe i should. Apparently you can't believe everything you hear on the internet (KISS ref.)

[@MrAlucardDante]

@@uavtech French/Eu laws states that you can't go above 120m, so having a baro to know your height is recommended. But I doubt anyone will go that high anyway ;)

[@jejefpv]

No baro is mandatory for hobby pilots in France. But pro pilots are supposed to work with homologated quads, which requires altitude limit capability. With BF, it requires a modified FW, that's why they are happy to see it comming for Kiss Ultra.

[@lleston8927]

So far so good with BF!

[@enlightx]

impulse rc are also a reseller, there is not an osd chip its graphical and done within the h7,

[@uavtech]

Yup, missed Impulse and articulate the OSD thing well. Thank you for clarifying as well.

[@ninmarioscc]

I'm new to the whole fpv hobby I have a betaflight and a kiss build I like how the kiss build feels but I like the convenience of betaflight with the speedybee app. I want to keep flying betaflight but how do I make it feel like my other kiss build ? Im not loyal to brands I hate tribalism I like and support products that have good value.

[@uavtech]

Tuen off i-Term Relax and anti-gravity in BF. After that you have to find the sensitive balance of i-gain, like you do in KISS to not have bounceback. But like in KISS you will get lots of throbbles and drift.

[@rolliseventeen]

i like the hardware and some decisions, but there is always one thing to hate it. unlocking the board online in the past, using patreon to unlock features? does it have rpm filters, bidirectional dshot? i just tuned a iflight f7 mini twin gyro, was easy. BB logs into pidtoolbox, just watched a few videos from Brian. (cool dude) with Kiss: not possible atm, maybe in the future with a premium pateon account for one year.

[@elxero2189]

Those things are unicorns only guys dedicated to kiss can even get these it seems as they are out of stock as soon as they come back

[@RuthlessFpv]

Haha had a couple good laughs, bruh kiss ultra dont have a osd chip its in H7, and i beg to differ btw you cannot even remotely compare kiss v2 pid performance with kiss ultra pid performance, ALOTFKNLOT has chnaged, pid controller has had almost a complete revamp, Betaflight im sorry to say is crap at its best, ive been flying kiss for over 3 years now.... kiss v2 performance vs kiss ultra performance is two complete different story's

[@uavtech]

But just 6-months ago, old KISS was amazing so I do 't get it.

[@YoYoYo]

Well, we can see the JB videos how "much" better it is. :D Another hype. Will pass!

[@nigrinimihai1197]

Betaflight is over and done, and I will not tolerate anything else form now on. I either fly FCFC Ultra or wait for the chance to do so, there is no more hope for that slider mess and it slides everywhere but where it should. I flew it three times on my friens quad there is no point to betaflight anymore. Hope I see a batch of 100.000 Ultras to fill the market, until then. RIP Betaflight. Only Ultra can rip packs as it should. The truth has been spoken. Over and Out, I am on a hunt. Love you all, no hate , just the truth, no marketing here.

[@uavtech]

Umk.

[@willpowerfpv3246]

Hahahahahahahahhahahha. NO.

[@joemck1235]

lmfao

[@MouwDown]

Oh Boy, smh.. I think you are a spectacular example of a fan Boi. 🤘🤣

[@scoutfpv]

Wow that flat earth comment.

[@terminsane]

KISS Ultra fanboys are flat earthers confirmed

[@DRONEPOISON]

Fake news

[@uavtech]

No, ULTRA is real and has features (a fact) and may have performances improvements over the G4. Not fake news.

[@seattleitefpv]

KISS Ultra is largely a hobby at this point. We'll see in 6 months to 1 year where things settle. Until then, anyone considering the KISS ecosystem should probably stick with FETTEC. The ecosystem fork is terribly unfortunate, and the fact that it's all closed source makes it even worse.

[@biggfpv2721]

U cant get one from krunked?

[@uavtech]

I have not asked. Prefer to buy i guess. Idk. Alex (Krunked) is vested. I don't want that pressure.

[@fawkeyes5111]

proprietary software just sucks in general. i happily donate for open source projects instead.

[@Krunked]

as you run bl32 escs?

[@fawkeyes5111]

@@Krunked not yet. still running blheli_s on everything (or jazzMaveric). i don't go hardmode at that topic but whenever possible i choose open source over proprietary software. but i value good products too like i changed form frsky to tbs crsf (it was before expressLRS showed up/ came to my eye). if bl32 escs for example has features i need at some point in the future i would go for it. i'm not against any brand/company in general.

[@biggfpv2721]

Its his site, nfactory, and impulse rc

[@uavtech]

where on IMRC?

[@alexcook4851]

Impulse are out of Australia

[@biggfpv2721]

@@alexcook4851 i was just saying he said only two places there is 3 but only two for usa buyers

[@alexcook4851]

@@biggfpv2721 I’ve ordered a bunch from impluse to Canada, good company

[@biggfpv2721]

@@uavtech impulse rc tried posting a link but wont let me

[@bigfuzzyarchon2007]

Kiss flies much better than betaflight, something must have been wrong on your end if you thought otherwise. Unfortunate. You can't prove something flies better with objective data, you gotta actually fly the quad.

[@zfpv7211]

I agree. Lines following lines on a graph prove control theory works. Big deal, that’s been a thing in industry for decades. Even back in the pneumatic days. How the quad feels on the sticks, how it responds and is predictable, that’s what matters.

[@uavtech]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/j4e1c5p6aNiHqZo --- you need to check out my videos that clearly demonstrate otherwise. Also I have much more data behind that if you want to see it. I'm happy to upload. Don't be 14:44

[@uavtech]

@@zfpv7211 guys, those lines mean something that shows differences that you can CLEARLY also see hin HD. Just come'on. [depressing] Yes, i can predict kiss throbbles every day of the week. So those lines show a prediction is true.

[@joemck1235]

Sounds like more hype like flightone

[@bigfuzzyarchon2007]

@@uavtech there is no actual freestyle going on in your video, look at how professionals like Vanover use Kiss Ultra for freestyle. kzbin.info/www/bejne/pJOYoYGihJd8ipI My analogy for you is that you are saying that a Porsche 911 is a better car than a Corvette, because of all these data points, which might be objectively true, but some people are just going to greatly prefer the Corvette.