Spear at Queen's Gambit '23 - Just the Fighting

[@lordbasilisk]

I love watching spear-play, it's so underappreciated. Polearms are so awesome.

[@JelloThatsMellow]

That backhand spear jab really scored some good points

[@MattParkent]

The spear is such an underrated weapon in modern media. I'm a big fan of polearms in general, and the spear is a timeless classic.

[@weighedgoogcat4499]

My club doesn't train with spears so it was very fun and interesting to see it in sparring! It looked like that the last opponent was pretty tricky 😅

[@Sk0lzky]

Yay spear footage! Thank you senpai

[@peterwest8151]

Awesome spear wielding!! I do feel like these 1 on 1 spearfights sometimes feel suicical. With the rushing in at the slightest opportunity. Like there seems to be no incentive to stay ‘alive’ for very long. Maybe this improves in team fights? Idk, just something i wanted to put out there! Best regards :)

[@peterwest8151]

Just noticed the timer in the back, is there a time score?

[@robinswords]

There's the pressure of the score and the clock driving you to make plays that you might not otherwise do. Though Di Grassi warns in his manual that attacking without first beating aside their own point is risky, it feels like it's commentary born of having seen this mutual stabbing play out too many times.

[@hyleg666]

I'd love a video with your comments and analysis on the matches!

[@HammboneBob]

Really good filming, great video. Thanks for sharing this with us.

[@donaldkelly9833]

Thanks for sharing! Are the tips rubberized or closer to the flexible plastic of Synthetic Longswords?

[@robinswords]

I'm not really sure what they are. It's like a very rubberized foam? Not straight rubber, but stiffer than any foam I've handled.

[@Nabterayl]

They’re a tough rubberized foam with [technically] flexible plastic for rigidity.

[@totally_not_a_bot]

​​@@robinswordsFoam rubbers can be anywhere from cloud-like memory foam to semi-rigid gap filler. I believe rubber HEMA wasters are generally made from a type of polyurethane, which is available as a foam.

[@waffler-yz3gw]

its cool seeing the fight slowly escalate as time goes on edit: seeing people's different styles and adapting to yours is cool too, the red dude starts off auper agressive but when it doesnt work he slowly eases off while still being forward and threatening

[@xCorvus7x]

You seem to be a rather cautious fighter, which some of your opponents with the spear or sidesword punished with quick and more daring attacks. It appears as if spear attacks were actually relatively difficult to parry.

[@robinswords]

It was partially fatigue leading to cautious play from me. This was my third tournament in 24 hours. I get a second wind towards the end when I realized I was falling behind.

[@xCorvus7x]

@@robinswords oh, okay, that explains everything ^^' I salute your struggle.

[@stanlee268]

Great video

[@NecklineArmada]

Do you ever use the dagger (rondell type?) in one of these matches?

[@Otaku155]

Where do you get your long weapons from?

[@benbratko9904]

so my question is how realistic would a 1 on 1 spear v spear fight be? Were two soldiers actually squaring in a duel with spears or was it more likely to be used in a mass formation?

[@EmpressOfExile206]

You never heard of jousting? Lmao

[@BrokenSword1978]

Are handling those spears awkward at times with the gloves?

[@robinswords]

A little. Was hard to pick them up

[@markellevest9225]

I’m foucusing on mma rn but I just ordered me a sword an definitely will not shy away from competitive fighting with weapons I jus train myself when I’m not at the gym for mma just feel like I was supposed to be born when people fought with swords lol

[@markellevest9225]

Meant to say love what your doing I got distracted

[@darkglowbox908]

That guy at 2:18 seems pretty cool

[@andrewahrens214]

I hate that they stop you when you clinch, grappling should absolutely be a part of it.

[@johnny10grasp3]

Who won?

[@barrysmith1202]

a little more transitions to dagger, plz...

[@grilledleeks6514]

hes not there to entertain you. Hes there to win lol

[@barrysmith1202]

@@grilledleeks6514 right, yes, but i'm thinking battlefield; lots of youtubes go to dagger frequently, Euro, Japanese.

[@robinswords]

As the butt of the spear had equal scoring conditions to the dagger, it was usually more economical to simply turn the spear to use that spike than to draw the dagger.

[@barrysmith1202]

@@robinswords i defer, sir

[@Nabterayl]

Rob has already explained the competitor's logic, but I can speak to this as the guy who wrote the rules for this tournament. Any time you're writing rules for a tournament, you need to be aware of the behavior you're incentivizing, and (in my opinion) you need a positive, reasoned answer as to why you're doing that--something beyond "well, that's the best we can do given the limitations of our space/time/gear/judges/etc." In this case, there were two considerations: 1. What do the butt spikes actually represent? Some butt spikes are more like pommels: a counterweight, a smashing surface, but not a spike or a blade. Other butt spikes are real spikes, at least as capable as a dagger and arguably moreso. Obviously, the foam rubber spikes on our partisans aren't either of those things, so we needed to decide what they were supposed to represent. The spike-type butt spikes, or the blade-type butt spikes, seem to get illustrated more frequently in a dueling context (cf. Hans Talhoffer, for instance), which makes sense--a sharp, spike-like butt spike will get dulled pretty quiickly if it's something you rest on the ground a lot. As the format for our tournament most closely resembles a prearranged duel, we decided to assume that the foam butt spikes on our partisans represented sharp spikes capable of inflicting a very serious stab wound. Obviously, we could just as easily have decided they represent a sturdy blunt impact type of butt spike, but we had to decide one way or the other. 2. You can't design a tournament to game-incentivize every single historically attested technique. We know for all but certain that historical chivalric tournaments and fencing bouts didn't even try, and we definitely know that not every historical combat context utilized every single historically attested technique. Thus, when designing a tournament ruleset, it makes sense to decide what subset of historically attested technique you want the rules to incentivize, and why. In this case, while there is ABSOLUTELY a lot of attested, historical, European, polearm-to-dagger transitions, I don't think you can make the case that there is a lot of attested, historical, European, polearm-to-dagger transitions in the more specific context of using short spears (like the 7' partisans we are simulating here) and unarmored combat (which we are also simulating here). The more armor is involved, and the longer the spears are, the more you tend to see transitions to the sidearms in our surviving material--which is exactly what you see, organically, in things like HEMA armored tournaments. As our tournament was for unarmored combat with short spears, I wasn't bothered by the fact that most fencers chose, as Rob did, to use the butt spike rather than their daggers.

[@cloroxy69]

Where do I learn this

[@grilledleeks6514]

whats the point of the ref pretending to also be using a spear?

[@TheRexisFern]

I'm not certain, but I would guess back in the day the ref wouldn't want to get between two duelists and the long stick would assist in parting them after rounds when they might still be in "fighting mode".

[@Druid_Ignacy]

This is west hema tradition, it may have come from some meyer's ilustration with ref with stick. In Poland, Hungary, Czech Republic and France - just to give some examples - hema ref don't carry sticks.

[@robinswords]

When you're not wearing protective gear, trying to intervene bodily into a match where weapons, even blunted, are flying is risky business. The staff is something they can safely thrust into that space as a physical barrier to separate fighters if need be. Sometimes it takes the visual signal, because you can't always hear the halt.

[@Nabterayl]

I’m the director in most of these bouts (the guy in the vest). Different directors use, or forego, the staff in different ways. For me: 1. The length of the staff in front of me creates a minimum safe distance between me and the fencers. I want to get as close a view as I can without interfering with their weapons play or putting myself at risk. The staff helps me measure that in the same way that a point-forward guard helps you measure distance when you’re fencing yourself. It also gives me something to protect myself with if I need to parry an errant weapon. 2. The projection of the staff creates a visual focus for me. I aim it like a sight to help engage my fencer’s brain so I can stay alert to the action. This was the sixth event I had been head judge or director for that tournament, and by this point I had directed hundreds of fights. I needed the help staying focused and on point. 3. Polearm tournaments, even with the Descendant Leather weapons we use, can pack a lot of punch. I like to be able to give the visual and physical sign of interposing my staff between fencers when I call halt, because I know as a fencer that sometimes you literally don’t hear the call. For the sake of everyone’s safety I like to communicate the halt audibly and visually, so I want my staff ready to go to interpose when the action is halted.

[@onlydogontheleft]

Triple spear. Very deadly.

[@ugandanknuckkles9667]

Aren't the spears a bit short?

[@robinswords]

They're on the shorter end for two handed spears, but there were space and power considerations at play. Bigger sticks call for a larger ring, and hit harder on swings.

[@Nabterayl]

Strictly speaking, these are partisans, and sized accordingly: the weapon is supposed to be the height of the user's upraised fingers (which for most people is in the 84" range). That's on the short end for a two-handed spear, as Rob says, but they're the size they're supposed to be for the weapons they're simulating. And there are, of course, the space and power considerations as well.