Top 10 Scorpion Civilizations (AoE2)

[@voidgods]

I usually like your videos at the end, but the "bonus damage against elephants is easy to forget, except if you are an elephant, for more than one reason" is just complete genius, and the fact that it's just there in the middle of the sentence without going further into the joke really made me chuckle, already liked it

[@arcticbeak]

Yes :D But it also reminded me I miss the elephant facts :D

[@cassiolins1203]

Indeed! XD

[@aidanholland8921]

Elephant good memory!!!

[@BettersonMcgee]

Glad someone appreciated it as much as i did. Thanks for saving me from needing to type a comment. Wait--

[@LightKnight_Age_Of]

same

[@carlpult5235]

also the currently popular 10x shared civbonus mod usually lets scorpions shine, or rather lets them laser everything because of how strong scorpion bonuses are to adress their general weakness.

[@nemou4985]

Scorpion bonus should be nerfed while Scorpions themselves should be buffed, to just use regular bonus instead of them needing mega-bonus to just become barely usable.

[@ImSquiggs]

Yeah!!! Scorps getting some love!!! As a kid, I was obsessed with these... and they were just awful. But they looked so cool that I always wanted to make 50 of them and shoot giant flaming arrows into my enemies. I'd use them to siege buildings, fight boats, attack, defend, whatever... I just loved them. Also I lost a lot because they're terrible. Finally my scorps are getting their day!!

[@nemou4985]

They are still awful for everyone but the romans, there should be further general Scorpion buff while diminishing roman bonus (33% less gold should be fine and the general cost being 60)

[@ImSquiggs]

@@nemou4985 I should be bummed that they’re still not useful in most cases, but hell, I’m just stoked that the devs seemed to remember they exist at all for one update!

[@nemou4985]

@@ImSquiggs Truly a positive man I see :P But I still have hope for making them useful in general and not for just like 3 civs (only one of which will use them often).

[@darkweeman133]

​@@nemou4985why nerf the roman bonus?

[@nemou4985]

@@darkweeman133 Because it is either buff all scorpions or only romans which are already strong. To keep roman strenght in line, buffing all scorpions should diminish their bonus.

[@daruddock]

It's always nice seeing scorpions get some love

[@slicksamos8334]

Love the elephant 'for a number of reasons' line

[@bdonaghu]

Nothing more satisfying that seeing a group of infantry units funneled in Black Forest with your group of Scorpions waiting for them 🤣

[@bungalo50]

FatSlobbing

[@Slashixuz]

#10 1:45 Bulgarians #9 2:15 Dravidians #8 2:55 Teutons #7 4:21 Slavs #6 4:53 Chinese #5 6:02 Ethiopians #4 7:15 Mongols #3 8:30 Celts #2 9:21 Khmer #1 10:40 Romans

[@Binarokaro]

It's good to see a top 10 vid of my favourite siege workshop unit! I'm really glad that the unit is finally getting some love

[@mcparker517]

As a low Elo, low APM player, scorpions are far superior to onager. I play mostly Ethiopians and i can tell you, a tortion engine siege onager can wipe out 50 of my own halbs so fast with a few poorly aimed shots. No friendly fire is what makes them great at my Elo (900)

[@nuggs4snuggs516]

I wonder if they're starting to do a similar thing to what they did with the Swordsman line recently: pushing out a series of minor buffs to encourage diversifying unit compositions

[@ryannathaniel9296]

And the best thing is, both of these series of buffs counteract each other

[@AzureKaioshin]

Itd be cool to see a test where you patrol the halbs to truly see the value of balistics on scorpions. A missed opportunity but great video as always Spirit!

[@Shokisan1]

Mass scorpions is my favorite thing to make in this game. Thanks for this great video!

[@willemverheij3412]

The Japanese have a better Scorpion though, breathing fire, no minimum range, respawns to get revenge, has a rope on it's projectile and can pull it back once impaling a target. A favourite in tournaments.

[@fugonee]

The teleport is also a super devastating raiding tool, if not expected by the opponent ofc...

[@SidheKnight]

@@fugonee AoE 2 and Mortal Kombat.. my childhood nostalgia is pleased with the current state of things.

[@fugonee]

@@SidheKnight DEFINITELY feel you on that one! It's always super impressive to me that both of these games are still thriving 30 and 20 years later respectively.

[@willemverheij3412]

@@fugonee Both also returned after a period of being considered dead and gone pretty much. Like Scorpion.

[@fugonee]

@@willemverheij3412 Lmao the konnections keep appearing 😂

[@robfbms]

Please make a "Top 10 Cavalier civs without Paladins" 😀 It will be cool to see Berbers, Romans, Malians, Bulgarians, Sicilians, Poles, Burmese, Portuguese and maybe some other civ (Chinese?) on this list 😊

[@FizzleFX]

0:43 Slow down there pal! Let me pat you on the shoulder for that witty Elephant pun! *pats* you may continue

[@freindlich8112]

I feel like having the fastet wood collection as celts is a bonus aswell, even if I must admit its a small one.

[@t.albertobarbosa8982]

Big ups for the music consistency.

[@jankobehring4445]

The nonchalance of these puns like the elephant one is just amazing

[@jacksonhill4980]

It is interesting to see you now considering the power of units, e.g. the scorpion, not just in a vacuum but instead in relation to the other types of units a civ has to offer that fill the same niche as the scorpion. e.g. Chinese/ Ethiopians already having strong archers, which makes their scorpions relatively weaker not versus other scorpions but in the context of their own civ. It's a cool angle I hadn't considered.

[@MaximusOfTheMeadow]

mmmmmm I think Celtrs tough, but great video!

[@tomascostanzo3673]

To think that scorpions/ballistas used to be one of the deadliest units in AOE at first but then they became the black sheep in AOE2 only to go back to being great again, in general terms, in modern AOE

[@daigonnasema]

In the old AOE game, ballista/helepolis has the highest dps while outrange almost every thing except capatult and heavy capatult, then they change it into a low DPS creep clearing unit

[@inductivegrunt94]

Scorpions really are underrated and under utilized, I'm guilty of this mystery, so it's great that they're getting much love nowadays. And it's no surprise that Celts, Khmer, and Romans are top 3, Roman Scorpions are the best Scorpions after all.

[@ariisee]

When I saw this video's title, I thought "Ok, Khmer and Romans, let's see other 8". Though Celts seem obvious, I always thought about them as "siege", not "scorpion" civ, so there weren't the first that came into my mind.

[@Edit-nk6nb]

JFC Spirit, that early elephant joke ... give me strength!

[@derPandre]

I'd argue everything except the Top 4 are honorable mentions :D Still fun video

[@anonnymousperson]

Spirit, can a unit hit a target further than its maximum range if it has ballistics and its target is heading away from it? What is the furthest a shot can fly if yes?

[@Achilles75]

Interesting question,i was thinking the same when i saw that paladin run off into the horizon with the scorpion bolt following it

[@scarletcroc3821]

Theoretically yes, once the projectile is fired, it will hit the target (or near it) with ballistics. As for the furthest distance, that probably depends on the speed of the unit and the speed of the projectile

[@ariisee]

Someone did that before (maybe SOTL), and I think the answer was 18 range (Trebuchets don't get Ballistics, so Tatars' Trebs aren't counted).

[@diegoblin9090]

Nice video!! I think a test with Habs and Pala using Patrol would have some impact in the results. Maybe only confirming some civs tier position

[@WhiteOwlet]

"Which is easy to forget. Except by elephants. For multiple reasons." Best remark of 2023.

[@ammigaby2300]

The Roman’s are so OP. They are gonna get nerfed so hard, but until then, I’ll keep playing them non stop lol

[@TheGloriousLobsterEmperor]

As a Khmer main since day 1, I so desperately wish that they would give their Scorpions just a *bit* more love. Everyone focuses on their knight rush, but I wish they'd make Double Crossbow just a bit better so that they finally became the ultimate Scorpion civ they were meant to be. *GIVE ME MY FULL DAMAGE DOUBLE PROJECTILES!*

[@mingelcoac]

Sneaky elephant fact plus joke in one go. I love this

[@cpiff100]

I really enjoyed Spirit Of The Law's coverage of Age of Empires 2 Definitive Edition and the Scorpion siege unit! His content is always informative and insightful. It's great to have KZbinrs like him who delve into the intricacies of the game and provide valuable analysis. Keep supporting him and learning more about Age of Empires 2!

[@mcadder]

Perfect ranking imo!

[@teutonicknight533]

I was waiting for your latest Vid

[@cryxibus]

Rocketry should also increase the speed of Scorpion bolts by 1.

[@azh698]

I like abusing the 256x mod to create ICBMs with scorpions!

[@xechyugon2887]

Should make them explode on impact too

[@rat_thrower5604]

May we get an updated Sicilians overview? I've just got that dlc and am confused how they're a cavalry as well as infantry civilization.

[@AxelPaul307]

Next vid idea?: Statistical analysis of 1v1 Romans versus Byzantines to determine who is the superior Roman faction?

[@thomasdwalker9696]

Romans win no contest

[@brotendochill7053]

8:04 I find the wording of "anti-skirmisher damage" confusing often. Does this mean they don't take extra damage from skirmishers? Wouldn't it be "no extra skirmisher damage taken"? or "no skirmisher armor"? I know.... ｓｅｍａｎｔｈｉｃｓ

[@fuyoutubeck]

it's the same as the Cataphract anti anti cavalry bonus defense 11

[@brotendochill7053]

@@fuyoutubeck haha, anything anti anti is trolling by nature 11

[@fuyoutubeck]

@@brotendochill7053 I feel you man aoe2 is becoming more confusing by the day 11

[@agustinfranco0]

hey, i absolutely love your channel, and i was wondering if you could do a comparison with different food sources like the "All Gold Sources Compared" video. would love to watch that. (please like so he sees this)

[@WJen8]

Thanks for the video and info, I've always loved Scorpions as an unpopular choice. Both the game unit and the animal 😂

[@TheSpiritedFendron]

as a Slav main, I love these!

[@maccanorton]

love your videos--I know you are a one person team but would be great if you could check your subtitles. I was very confused by the phrase "thick mirrors"

[@misteral9045]

Scorpions need a bit of an attack buff to truly both be an archer line alternative in-game and more representative of their historical strength. They're basically ancient hand mortars, lightweight and anti-personnel, not really a siege weapon. I think they should be able to target ground, be a bit smaller and faster. For example, Romans measured their ballistae in "spans" (referring to the projectile, 1 span = 35mm) and standard size ballistae were 1-3 spans. The machines stood at 2-3ft high and were easily fitted into fortifications. To fit into aoe2 i think they should have a setup/teardown and have a bit longer range, like 12-13.

[@NoraNoita]

make Scorpions be affected by Blacksmith Upgrades again easy fix.

[@RawmanFilm]

@@NoraNoita Did i miss it was a thing? When was that a thing? :D

[@misteral9045]

@@NoraNoita As seen with the Chinese UT, even +4 doesn't really make that much difference. I'm talking like 20/24(heavy) attack. It doesn't make sense that early firearms do way much more damage than classical war engines, from a comparable range (especially those elite jannies). Additionally, even though the blacksmith is a pre-req for siege workshop, the role that the scorpion fills for most civs is as an archer replacement because their archers suck, which 90% of the time means they lack bracer, so you'd be defeating the idea of scorp-civs by making them affected by blacksmith techs. Not simple as.

[@robertlewis6915]

That sounds like a unique unit to me.

[@misteral9045]

@@robertlewis6915 Having a torsion engine to throw a bolt is about as unique as making a spear.

[@janputz4157]

Damn the scorpion love here sure is real.

[@edopronk1303]

Good video. The music at the end sounds like one of the Railroad tycoon series?

[@asukaaachan2624]

Was loving using them when play Old Age of empires 2. was stupidly use them for buildings because i still childern on that time 😂

[@shogun2215]

The Romans have fast become my favourite civ since they were added, they've converted me to Scorpions in a big way, and I've been able to turn the tide of team games with them in ways I couldn't do with many other civs.

[@matium1528]

Wow...a broken civ...who would have guessed it will be a fan favorite

[@attilathechilla.1383]

been winning games as the Romans with a Khmer ally. the +2 armor makes the Man at arms tough enough to survive most of the feudal age as long as you don't get under the TC, once you get to castle you build a forward siege workshop and start adding scorps with pikes or skirms or light cav as cover. next get balistics and the ballistas tech and start massing up about twenty or thirty. they're not really at their best unless you're up against a large numbers, but the thirty gold you need to make one is super cheap. allowing you to make another gold unit if you want.

[@Kertal1]

That was a good vid ^^ i would also put Romans frst and Khmer second, i love Scorpions and sometimes i play vs bots by just using scorpions ;D

[@eziokwufab-emerenini73]

Hey Spirit, guys of the law here

[@BenjaminTiessen]

The one race you didn't mention was Malians. I think their 15% building cost discount is notable for castle age scorpions. If you were to instantly build 3 siege workshops you would save 90 wood (1 scorpion). And any other building you were required to build would also add up wood savings. The only reason I never build scorpions is because it takes forever to mass them if I don't have enough siege workshops or enough wood. I don't think any of the damage bonuses matter if you cannot mass enough of them.

[@RoastOfEmpires]

How do Tatar scorpions rank on the halb and paladin test when they have elevation? This is applicable to a fortress strat on Hill Fort and looking for max DPS for scorpion units

[@kgb2753]

The best scorpion civs are actually all of the ones in AoE1

[@The_Room_2_Doggys_Revenge]

Speaking about the Mongols, I hope that when you redo your Mongols overview, you bring back the "Khaaaaaan!"

[@FireEarHK]

A question, can the Celt's castle stronghold able to heal the Siege?

[@andresespinosa152]

Hey dude, great video, how about which civ has the best kipchak?

[@tadoriaselan3268]

very telling that the first 6~ entries can be summed up as "scorpions on this civ aren't unusable"

[@Mal-NoName]

IMO one of the most underrated units in the game. Glad MS have buffed them. Also, please dont ever stop making AoE videos 🙂

[@Staklihen]

Teuton's unique tech Ironclad also works for Trebuchets.

[@ambrascetnarwhal2695]

So does Mongol speed, I believe.

[@Staklihen]

@@ambrascetnarwhal2695 Drill is only for Siege Workshop units.

[@Marcara081]

Considering an onager absolutely flattens Karambits, you'd think the Malay would be given very good scorpions to allow for excellent synergy: swarm tactics + area of effect once the karambits gum up your opponent.

[@jonasno3115]

I’d enjoy a visual update of scorpion arrows ❤

[@NiDe500]

On the Ethiopians, there’s also the issue that going with Scorpions means either ignoring the insane power of torsion engine Siege Onagers, or doubling up on expensive siege units with the same counters (bombard cannons, cavalry units, Mangudai, micro-intensive units that can dodge more generally). One could argue you’re not using Ethiopians to best effect by foregoing those siege onagers.

[@informitas0117]

I like the little civ panoramas

[@dannyduchamp]

I subscribe to spirit of the law for the elephant jokes.

[@alex_zetsu]

Wow, I never realized how bad Scorpions were until I saw this. I already knew their weakness to Onagers and Paladins. So we're looking at the _best_ scorpion civilizations and the results are underwhelming. Number 10, 9, and 7 are merely discounted Scorpions that are otherwise generic. Nothing is wrong with a discount, but if these are in the top 10 this isn't a good sign. The Chinese upgrades look great on paper but aren't all that exciting. The Ethiopians did great during the Halbadier test (I couldn't find the video of your halbadier test, but you mentioned they did fine), but in this civilization while Torsion Engines give Scorptions a huge bonus, they are overshadowed by Onagers. At least the Khemer and the civilization that got wiped in 478 (a bit earlier than this game's scope) give the unit love.

[@rs31]

great video as always. I get your point but celt are stronger than Khmer. also the intimidation factor. no one takes on celt siege without bbc

[@Gerrit2686]

No elefant fact?

[@RastislavUhrin]

good job ^^

[@thesadweez]

for a second, when you said "we're gonna talk about scorpions" I felt like you were gonna cue the music to Rock you like a hurricane or something by Scorpions lol

[@rajeshmprao]

I see what you did there with the Elephant joke SoTL

[@ns-islandsroblox]

Spirit of the Law, can you please redo your Top 5 Archer/cav/infantry civs? The old ones are kind of outdated now in 2023. Thanks.

[@edwinpoon]

SotL, we need an update to this list after the recent buff, quickly!

[@EnKayNem]

pog content

[@wintersummers3085]

Why would they give scorpions a buff if they want infantry to be remotely viable?

[@Dasycottus]

In closed big team maps with trade, the post-imperial Ethiopian scorpion+onager+bombard ball is almost unstoppable. Hell, I sometimes skip the SO altogether. With bombards to snipe onagers and other bombards (which they're extra good at, because blast damage + post imp units are often massed), the scorpions are just a firehose of damage. With enough of them, you don't even need any units in front.

[@Pandadude-eg9li]

I just skip the bombards and have the Turk/Bohemian ally utilize the bombards himself.

[@Werevixen]

I've been wondering lately; are Byzantines one of the best water civs now?

[@dj_koen1265]

I don’t think they received any changes recently or did i miss something?

[@gelhardthemd8903]

3:00 Teutons and no Teutonic Knights in this picture? And in blue? Nein!

[@mot.schutzen9079]

What about combining Chinese and Ethiopian unique techs to make the ultimate scorpion?

[@leonardo_pandaboff]

Let's talk about scorpions "I'm still loving you uuuu"🎵

[@augustoclaas8102]

Great elephant joke! 😂

[@GOOSEpooo]

I liked this video the moment I heard the elephant joke

[@Altarknight]

thx again ! :)

[@Spiror]

Please make tower civ top 10

[@Kadir85Akin]

Why does the range of scorpions seem too long in this video? Their arrows exceed the borders of screenshot.

[@LuxiBelle]

They are the 10x shared tech unit of choice when you have Celts.

[@CG-eh6oe]

I think you oversell the impact of ballistics for roman scorps. Scorpion bolts are rather slow, so ballistics only helps if the opponent does not change trajection for a long time, which is unlikely to happen. There are situations where ballistics makes your scorps aim to the nothingness while scorps without ballistics would still hit the bulk of the enemy army, although not the intended target.

[@JG-nm9zk]

10. Bulgarians - Generic but fills role of crossbow -50% food upgrade 9, Dravidians - -30% wood cost (no siege engineers) 8. Teutons - Conversion Resistance, Iron Clad +4 melee armor 7. Slavs - -15% cost 6. Chineese - Rocketry, cheaper techs, no siege engineers 5. Ethiopians - Torsion Engines 4. Mongols - Drill 3. Celts - Fire 20% faster, Workshops work 20% faster, Tech +40% HP 2. Khmer - Double Crossbow(secondary projectile), +1 range 1. Romans

[@nicholastucci1093]

How about top 10 Siege Onager??

[@raphaelguerin2691]

I tried to go scorpions in a Roman mirror matchup but the opponent long swords crushed them . I m not sure why tho

[@dancingphoenixart]

1) Don't go scorpions only, get them as a supportive unit from behind while you have something in front tanking damage and protecting them. Legionaries / Helbs / Cav + Scorpions should all be strong. Also it's a situational unit, it's especially nice in closed off maps with chokepoints like black forest - not sure I'd mass them on arabia. Better raid with cav or push with infantry & other siege with some mixed in maybe. I played a bamboo nothing game yesterday with them (not ranked ofc) where two of our allies just straight died but we were able to both hold and push 2v4 with me spamming units (mostly legionary / helb / scorpions) and him going bombard tower bombard cannon where it didn't matter too much that celt siege countered as I could outspam him enough to hold while we pushed on the other side. That's pretty ideal ofc, with lots of chokepoints and the possibility to get post imp for all the techs. 2) Take in mind they have a weakness against melee targets due to their minimum range. If it happens that melee units run into you, put them on standground so they at least do something - patrolling works too I think Glhf

[@MC-wh3xm]

always gotta start with a transport boat rush if youre gonna go scorps

[@raphaelguerin2691]

@@dancingphoenixart huhh Thx but I’m 1500 lol . My point is that I think that scorps aren’t a good counter against Roman militia line bc of their high armor they discard most of the bonus dmg of the scorps making them not such a great counter .

[@kenc00l]

I think the 33% faster firing rate was removed for Romans?

[@jazzWF]

I didnt even know there was 10 different scorpions

[@sneedfest3399]

My predictions before watching: Romans, Celts and Khmer in top 3, followed by Slavs + Chinese then Mongols, Teutons, Bulgarians, Dravidians and Ethiopians

[@vladokalaba2640]

What is best scorpion team 4x4?

[@amoltov496]

Top ram civs, plz!

[@erwinwendler4621]

The return of the dirtiest unit in aoe 1, the helepolis ❤ I might just buy the roman dlc just so I can abuse this unit vs the ai 11

[@remote24]

Urgh, this game finally should display the exact hidden bonuses. They should not he hidden at all, its just some weird decision that doesnt make any sense. "Bonus vs cav" means so much, even the same unit line has different bonuses. A display for unit speed and minimum range and rate of fire are needed. Take a look at total war warhammer

[@Staklihen]

AoE III and IV dilspay the bonuses.

[@idkmybffjill9682]

Hear me out with cumans; you can have 1-2 siege workshops built as you hit castle and immediately mass up and early castle is their best time imo

[@savarinodragoantonio6505]

Romans are actually the best civ now, combinig troops allow you to have the infantry japanese bonuse and the best scorpions, and their cavalry is amazing too, they must nerf them because they are amazing

[@Rick_Sanchez.C137]

Finally, a video that make sense

[@OpaqueWindow]

Did you ever make any vids on age of empires online? Still the only age of empires I play

[@TheMoppinRaccoon]

Love scorpions!!

[@SIGNOR-G]

MOST underrated unit.