Star Trek Deep Space Nine Ruminations S4E06: Rejoined

[@space_hobbit]

i tend to not be active in the comment section at all, but for this episode I've decided to just give my two cents, because I really like it. Not for any objective reasons, admittedly, but from the purely personal experience that when I watched it for the first time as a young teenager and saw the relationship between Jadzia and Lenara being treated just like a straight relationship would have, without any form of shame or "scandalism" because both happened to be female, it gave me a lot to think about, and something I came back to some time later when I started to figure out that I was a gay woman. So while I agree that in universe it may not have made a difference and that that takes away from the meaning in character, for me it mattered, even though it only did because i happened to be a confused gay teenager that happened to watch a rerun of Star Trek because I had nothing else to do that day :)

[@paulscott2037]

It had never occurred to me before but it would have been awesome to have Dax exiled from Trill and still had season 6 and 7 occur as it did. As you say there could have been ways around it, but it would have been a cool to have Ezri needing to deal with the fact that she now has this entity inside her that she had been taught to reject societally.

[@Norvo82]

For what it's worth: Lenara will be mentioned once more in DS9, towards the end of season 5. She's the one who comes up with a tricky plan to close down the wormhole, with Dax noting that "she was always a lot stronger on theory than execution".

[@Galvion1980]

Oooooh , Dax is a petty, bitchy ex! I LOVE IT!

[@sharkdentures3247]

"You get no episodes or character development of your own, unless you are a member of the elite five - or six." (in TNG) Yeah, Unless your name is Barkley!!!! lol

[@vesuvanprincess]

Hey Lore, you sounded exactly how I anticipated you would on this episode. For the most part I agree with your analysis actually but I'd like to point out, for me as a young lesbian growing up in the 90's, the kiss was a really big deal. It gave me hope for a better future the same way I always imagine Kirk and Uhura's kiss did for a previous generation and that's not nothing. Yeah, within the context of the actual narrative it's pretty boring humdrum love of the week melodrama. But at least for one teenage girl it made a difference and I think it's worth appreciating it for that at least. PS,KZbin comments are of course the worst but for what it's worth I think you are doing a great job even with these hot button topics. Keep up the great videos.

[@subraxas]

Lovely comment, Jessica. However, I do not really think that this episode was "pretty boring humdrum love of the week melodrama". I am convinced that it was well-written, well-executed and that its premise itself bore a decent amount of substance. That is also the reason, among others, why this episode does not have a B-plot. Because there was a lot to it. Meridian was a stinky pile of crap and I am able to re-watch it only because of its funny B-plot (Quark wants to scan Kira to create a sexy program for a holosuite). However, Rejoined is pretty good and Avery Brooks (directing here) did very well IMHO.

[@gcooper642]

Weird take on exile. You never get to see your home again. Yeah, you won't die, but it still has a psychological effect. There was an episode of TNG where a Romunlan could be exiled and he was lamenting not being able to go home, so someone created a holodeck program for him, but it wasn't the same. Also Garak who constantly pines for home.

[@TroyeMB]

she's the second Borg queen? *that's* why I recognized her voice! --- practicing her best Lore imitation: "why does *this* happen -- because 'plot'..." --- and Lore throws a Doctor Who reference into his Star Trek rumination and gives the Platy mental whiplash... --- well... at least *this* comment shouldn't bother you, Lore... (PlatyMcBear)

[@JoeCool7835]

As for why the wormhole tests would be done at DS9, it'd make sense if the Trill wanted to study the wormhole already there to try to replicate it. That's something the writers could've included in dialogue without any additional shots.

[@andrewkyriacou6405]

Maybe I can start the comments off with something not very controversial with a usual personal thoughts on the episode. I like this episode for a few reasons: First it gives some insight into the Trill which, as you've said, are definitely an interesting species which not much is done with and that's a shame. I would have liked to know more about them. Second that Sisko moment where he's got Dax's back. That was great. That's about it though as you were talking about Dax's whole falling in wove with everyone while it does feel very contrived you could potentially make a character out of that. Perhaps the combination of Jadzia and Dax have created a personality that for whatever combination of character traits, is quick to fall into and out of love and will grasp at that potential happiness wherever it pops up quicker than the average person will. There also might be an element in that of Dax going 'screw it I've lived many lives I'm going for this crazy thing because then it's something new'. I won't talk about the whole kiss controversy other than to say I'm surprised they managed to get it in and its a shame that the way things were then that they got flak for doing it. Anyways not the best episode but at least it had some good bits in it.

[@jf7296]

I don't think the Trill would let the symbiote really die, they will enforce the banishment. Then right before Dax die, they would smuggle her back and take the symbiote.

[@nathanschultz5538]

Don't worry, Lore. You English better than most!

[@KnightRaymund]

Many more are compatible than they let on but there are few symbiotes. That's why they lie and say it's rare to be able to join. The symbiotes ARE rare and precious.

[@danielyeshe]

To me it makes perfect sense to do this test at DS9. The Bajoran wormhole is the only stable wormhole known to exist. And Dax has the most knowledge of it.

[@earlwatt7677]

I believe the references stopped because Dax knew that when Lenara left the station, the decision was final. Like many who have been in a relationship that means more to you than to the other person, you deal with the letting go by not chasing the feelings, by not keeping the torch lit. You suffer through the pain and then you bury the dead relationship and never look back, almost in a pillar of salt kind of way.

[@johnashley327]

Now I'm looking at Kira's shoes. I never noticed a uniform change. 😂

[@NoelleMar]

This review was surprisingly funny (in a good way). XD I definitely disagree with leaving the kiss off screen in favor of the relationship. Because so many people completely miss gay representation even when it’s all but thrown in their faces, which is hurtful to queer people who rarely see themselves represented in a way that is equal to the way heterosexuals are represented. As in, if straight characters can kiss on screen and it isn’t considered x-rated, there’s no reason for a homosexual couple to not be able to kiss. And it is important to normalize that for gay people who feel isolated and defective AND for straight people to realize that it’s more normal than repulsive. As you said, the point of this episode is that gender doesn’t matter! Ultimately I agree that the story was heavy handed. But i think it DID mean something, or else it wouldn’t have been protested, especially to those who were gay when it came out. (Judging by the comments, seems as though a lot of people still consider gay relationships to be “extraneous” and unnecessary.) Considering Andy Robinson was told that he was *playing Garak too gay* in the first few episodes, when no relationships were mentioned and there was certainly no on screen kiss, I don’t think they would have been able to carry on the relationship between the two women, even if they never kissed. I agree that would have been more powerful and better storytelling, though. It’s just crazy to me that people will accept literal aliens but find it “obnoxious” when some of them might not be *heterosexual*. WTF?! So from a storytelling POV, I agree. But in terms of its real world impact, I disagree. As I mentioned in another comment, somebody had to break that taboo, might as well be Star Trek!

[@danielyeshe]

Kahn is referenced again - not saying when due to spoilers.

[@jasoncrowell8863]

Rule 34.1: If it exists, there are shippers of it.

[@thedragondemands]

A question for the ages: if they did the alternative, have two women as a stated romantic couple as recurring characters for years on the show....at the cost of never having them actually kiss on-screen.....would it have had as much impact? Would fans still be talking about it 25 years later? Would it be remembered at all? How many remember Ivanova's same-sex relationship, which was implied but never stated on-screen due to censorship at the time? In short, which was considered more historic? The fact that Kirk kissed a black woman on-screen, Uhura, OR, that Uhura had an understated romantic attraction to Spock for years on the show? Played by a white actor? (and in a love triangle with Nurse Chapel, don't get me started...) ...on the balance, the Uhura kiss had more impact than a long-simmering low-level attraction. ---- That being said, I fully agree with your complaint, "This was a bottle episode and not even referred to again in dialogue. Why couldn't they at least have Dax TALKING about Lenara in later episodes? Worried if she was okay during the Dominion War? Etc." I wish we'd gotten that.

[@JanetDax]

As a lesbian it would have an impact on me to see Jadzia with another woman. Its more just than kissing and sex.

[@ahumanbeingfromtheearth1502]

@@JanetDax the question isn't weather it would have had any impact, the question is how much impact it would have had.

[@dirtywashedupsparkle]

Well it may not have had continuity, but the episode must have highlighted the whole gender issue big time in its day. What I appreciate is that the various facets of having an attraction that is genuine and yet taboo and how to navigate that is complex and does not come with easy answers. There are wider cultural consequences and yet that clashes with personal feelings and the need to act true to them. I would not have liked this episode if it did not treat that dilemma seriously, and I think it did. Whichever side people fall on this, there has to be respectful consideration of all sides, and after watching this I can appreciate something of the difficulties of relationships that are seen as taboo. I probably agree Terry's crying isn't the top level, but it did enough for me. This should have carried over into continuity in some way. It was heartening the way Sisko talked to Jadzia about this and provided his support and understanding of how difficult it was. A triangular wormhole, that is an odd shape.

[@StefanTravis]

I've heard it argued that Dax was wrong to want the relationship with Khan, because she was trying to relive a finished relationship from her past. That she was swept up not with the new blended personality of Khan, but with her own nostalgia. Don't know if I agree, but it's a thought.

[@danshive4017]

Singular they / them is a valid option.

[@athrunzala6919]

I never got this rule of association, Jadzia is associating with Sisko, wasn't that part of the rule, then Ezri came back and was close to Worf, what the heck?

[@TroyeMB]

ummm... at a guess, it's because neither Sisko nor Worf are Trill, so Trill society doesn't care -- they "don't count"...

[@Galvion1980]

Neither of those are joined Trill, so why in the F would it matter? Only joined Trill are bound by this rule.

[@nickokona6849]

This episode for me goes in the skip it category when I rewatch DS9. The only thing I liked was that Eddington got to do something. I like Eddington, but he never got the appropriate level of development and use imo.

[@thedragondemands]

Let us not blame this episode for the writing failures on Season 3's "Meridian". Let's put the shame behind us.

[@pakapata]

can you do a lore of the serie Danganronpa and the game VA-11 HALL-A ? I REALLY would love to hear your analyze of those characters

[@DrZaius3141]

It's understandable that it's easier to push through a single episode with one kiss than an entire arc with a full relationship that is not heteronormative in some way. You will trigger the right-wing either way (they are very easily triggered as we know), but once an episode is out, there's nothing they can do. If you want an entire arc, you would however get the full-on rage boner of the right-wing: complaints, death threats, rape threats, etc. It's a shame that his was all the times allowed for, but definitely an understandable decision.

[@TheMarcHicks]

Wow, so much outrage over a kiss 😉.

[@MissTea_Trekkie]

What??? :::SPOILER::: Did you describe Ezri in this with the exception of the exile??? (Jadzia dies and another Trill that is not prepared)

[@jamiengo2343]

Am I the only one who thinks that the Bajoran Dress Uniform this episode looks disgusting?

[@madalynnights4612]

Perhaps the only Jadzia episode I enjoy

[@stanislavkostarnov2157]

the "don't show don't tell" attitude is something very much the mantra of the 90s so doing as you say would have done exactly that which those refusing to give LGBT a voice would have wanted... personally, I am kind of against anviliciouse propaganda in Star-Trek however, I really like though how ST.LowerDecks simply treats LGBTQ as something completely normal in universe, without highlighting it for controversies sake ... but I guess it is made already in a very different age under very different conditions... PS: if the relationship did continue, I would have liked her to become the Borg-Queen on camera because looking at how things are going, she believes an ununited universe (without full union even in the most intimate senses) cannot defeat the founders as a threat. she does this as a section 31 project (backward time travel involved)... convincing some section 31 members of her feelings

[@jmiester25]

That kiss was kinda hot

[@Jokie155]

Oh good, it's the episode I have refused to watch even once to date for being such a blatant message show that has zero subtlety while the creators pat themselves on the back with maximum smug. Time to have thoughts about it I guess. On Babylon 5, let's be frank in that the reason the Ivanova-Talia relationship didn't go anywhere was because Andrea Thompson was discontent with her role in the show and ended up leaving with the story that provided the most closed-case reason for her character to depart. There was no small amount of build-up towards that, mainly the underground railroad for the telepaths unveiling the true nature of Psi-Corp to her which prompted a deep discussion between the two. I am far more supportive of this despite it being cut short by off-screen issues because they actually bothered to do stuff with it, and JMS wasn't patting himself on the back going 'Oh I am so subtle with my plotline for these two, subliminal messaging is the best'. No, as he said himself at a convention I believe he was just a hormonal teenager about the matter but went with it anyway. I am fed up with Trek writers trying to act as if they have always been pushing these social justice issues for all of time. That first interracial kiss in TOS was from a horrible episode where both parties were mind controlled. What a context to have that momentous occasion exist in. And how about the TNG episode "The Outcast" with the androgynous aliens? Frakes said he was entirely comfortable playing opposite and making out with a male actor, but they nixed that both in casting and the script so their pro-homo episode ended up being a drawl of dullness with no point left to it. But I guess at least it didn't try to be Subtle™ about the brainwashing. And then there's also the episode where Guinan discusses relationships with Lal, and what was intended to feature a homosexual couple in the background yet again got nixed. Thank God that Whoopi refused to say the line as intended which was even more crass on the matter because she actually had enough influence to stand up to them. I get that the writers have to pick the battles they want to fight. But they DO NOT get to claim credit for the ones they backed down from, or utterly botched in the worst kind of way. I hate episodes like this. This, Far Beyond the Stars and Profit and Lace I will never, ever watch. Really.

[@NoelleMar]

Jokie155 I don’t understand why showing characters who are not heterosexual is “pushing an agenda” or promoting being politically correct. You’re upset about having a gay couple in the background when Star Trek shows interspecies relationships? Why is it considered heavy handed only when characters are a different race or sexuality, and “subtle” or “normal” when characters re straight white men? Not saying this episode in particular wasn’t heavy handed, because it was lol. But in spite of how good or bad a lot of these “controversial” episodes are (controversial because of people who consider showing diversity UNNECESSARY), somebody had to break the mold, and I think it’s fair enough that Star Trek tried to do it. Sorry, Lore, I know you don’t like controversy, but good sci fi stories and Deep Space Nine bring up so many relevant issues, that sometimes I just have to reply lol. This is also one reason I don’t usually read the comments before posting. -_-

[@parallaxnick637]

Lanara Khan is a she. I have no idea what Khan is.

[@MisterFanwank]

i always love seeing more about the strange rituals and rules of trill society, but i usually roll my eyes at jadzia episodes. she's a great supporting character, but when she has the spotlight she just doesn't interest me much. she's decent at conversational acting, but she fumbles dramatic acting too often. compare what's supposed to be a heartbreaking scene in this episode to nog's admission to sisko that he and his father are terrible ferengi, so he has to be something else if he wants to get anything decent out of life

[@AaronBaugher]

Yes. If I ranked all the episodes from best to worst, I think most of the Dax episodes would fall around 10-20 from the bottom. They aren't terrible, they're just forgettable. When I see a title like this one and recognize it as a Dax episode, it takes a while to remember which one. Someone/thing from Dax's past lives shows up, Jadzia Dax has to deal with it, and in the end it's back to status quo. That kind of makes sense, since Dax must have dealt with that kind of thing many times already in past lives. But that means there's no real arc for the character to go through. There could be for Jadzia, except that she has Dax's memories to learn from already, so not really. I don't blame the actress for it all, and not even really the writers. I think the character may have been too alien to pull off well as a side character. The best they could do most of the time was a young woman with kind of an old soul and an affinity for Klingons.

[@frazerrhughess]

The sexy lesbian make out lady is the borg queen?????

[@Galvion1980]

Sooo much slashfic potential....

[@Yura-Sensei]

I stopped watching star trek when I witnessed a female specimen touching lips with the other female specimen. Talk about crossing the goddamn line! Absolutely unacceptable. Think of the implications.. of the children.. hmm.. wait, I already forgot what am I angry at here.

[@tak178]

It was a contrived story from the beginning, and served no useful purpose. Another useless attempt by the writers to get ratings and promote their agendas. That's why it's a pointless episode.

[@williamcody1849]

I still kinda think homosexuality should be taboo.

[@zuzoscorner]

Yeah, i skip this episode -_-

[@mr51406]

An romance o’the week. At the time run of the mill in big cities but daring in the redneck rural areas. It’s a bland story but definitely better than other attempts by Trek to do token representation of 2LGBTIQ+ persons. Ira Steven Behr is a sincere ally so I thank him for an attempt at opening at least a window. Listen to his self criticism in “What We Left Behind” for more. Of course 2 women kissing is acceptably spicy. All others would have to wait for Discovery. Thanks to Lore for being an ally too. IDIC. 🖖🏼