Start to Finish Oxalic Acid Fogging for Beehives

How to use an oxalic acid fogger for your beehives.
Oxalic Acid: amzn.to/2xiQm1B
Burgess Fogger: amzn.to/2fCVO8f
Respirator Mask: amzn.to/2rVnOcz
Scale: amzn.to/2fCvMSt

[@felipegomez5084]

Beautify beehive. I only miss the mite count before and after treatment ( alcohol wash). It is effective only when we repeat it 3-4 times with 4-5 days intervals or when there's not brood. Kind regards from Chile

[@SoatMon]

I did repeat if 3 times, 5 days apart but did not do the alcohol wash. My hives were just started this year so they did not have a lot of bees. Thanks for the comment and advice!

[@larrypeterson4945]

Friend. I am a little reluctant to try to add to your presentation, however, I might be able to share with you something that you may benefit from. I use "food grade glycerin and oxalic acid" in my fogger. I heat the mixture and add the oxalic acid until no more will go into suspension. I use one pint and screw it into the fogger in a pint jar. One good puff for each box. I will get around to 30 colonies in less than 15 minutes if they are close together. This will be going into my 4th year with good results. I have no dog in this fight, information only. I wish you well, LP

[@SoatMon]

Thank you for your input and sharing your experience. I will have to try the glycerin idea, I bet it works great. Thanks again for letting me know how you do it.

[@joestocker660]

@@SoatMon Thanks to both of you. I bought a lot of glycerin and 190 proof in April to make hand sanitizer for work/personal. I have some of each left. Haven't purchased the fogger yet but I have the OA. Thanks again!

[@catchemalive]

Larry Peterson; do you do an alcohol wash afterwards to see results??

[@stevecorcoran9869]

To ensure you are getting sufficient OA throughout the hive it works better if you lift your top cover when fogging. Once you see fog exiting the top of the hive you know the OA has been distributed through all areas of the hive.

[@SoatMon]

Thanks for sharing your experience.

[@joshuajackson9118]

Any chance you could link the hot plate with the stirring stick? That thing is awesome!

[@SoatMon]

They are called stir plates. Heres a link to one. amzn.to/4b4sQIa

[@joshuajackson9118]

@@SoatMon many thanks!

[@montereychameleonsandmore2666]

How often do you do this how many times a year? One and done every few days for a week?

[@harrykuheim6107]

11 min. for 25 g. and 100ml ?

[@garybrabant5505]

Great instructional video. You didn't mention that this procedure has to be repeated once a week for three weeks and every three weeks through the minute session.

[@SoatMon]

Thanks!

[@simplifygardening]

Hi I am looking for the connection size for the propane as I am struggling to find the cylinders in the uk. any ideas

[@SoatMon]

For the USA it is the standard propane cylinder that is used for a propane torch.

[@colincooksey]

The cylinders are standard blowlamp propane cylinders available from Screwfix - www.screwfix.com/p/rothenberger-disposable-propane-gas-cylinder-400g/71092

[@earose04]

I find it shocking, the lack of scientific detail. Basic Q is HOW MUCH OA put INTO the hive?? Waving the fogger in front while most vanishes is a waste of time and effort. When I did it, I created a solution with 3.5g OA/50ml alcohol. Marked the jar in 50 ml increments, put the nozzle INTO the hive, and held it until had used 50ml. Measured mites before, and a week later. So far, with 12 hives, all but one had over 3 mites before, NONE a week later. I think the method has tremendous potential, but needs some solid , scientific testing. Does anyone have any such results????????????

[@rachellskerlec4713]

Measured mites how?

[@earose04]

@@rachellskerlec4713 Sugar roll method.. Not as accurate, but A. I hate killing bees. and B. only care if above or below 3. My experience is either low or very high. Latest recommendation from UF is to test MONTHLY

[@skywave12]

Cool. I am a Slap it on and get it done. Your Pint Jar likely has gradients in ml and oz. Use that. Also do not tighten the Pint Jar tight to the Fumigator. The Squeeze mechanism may have problems. I use a Harbor Freight Scale in grams. 30 grams. + or -. Use 190 proof Ethanol. Alcohol Boils off Before Water :-) The higher water content dissolves the Oxy Acid a little bit better. Once clear I dose the Bee's. Works for me. PS do not warm the Alcohol too much for a long time. Also Rinse the Fumigator after use. Otherwise Parts will dissolve.

[@SoatMon]

Thank you!

[@stevesoutdoorworld4340]

I do the same thing but don't use the tip on the fogger.It seem to get clogged up too often and you don't need it.Good luck with you bees this year.

[@SoatMon]

That's a good idea to remove the tip. Thanks!

[@cadamczak6856]

I heated water to boiling in a pyrex measuring cup, then placed the pint jar in the hot water, then added the oxalic acid crystals. everclear was never put anywhere near a flame.

[@SoatMon]

Great idea. Thanks for sharing.

[@psyched1231]

I bought a Burgess fogger for this method some months ago. However, I've read so many blog posts that say fogging doesn't kill the mites like the vaporization method does, that I haven't used it. I'd hate to think I've treated my bees when I haven't. Does anyone have a good mite drop comparison between vaporization and fogging?

[@SoatMon]

I agree with you, I would like to see those results as well. I have never actually done an alcohol wash.

[@mikeries8549]

I've done both the fogger and the OxyVap. The best success I've had wintering bees was the fogger year. I was too cheap to put out 165 for the wand. The wand takes so long to do that you find reasons not to. The fogger was so quick that it was easy to just do it. My fogger lasted one season then the pump guts fell apart. Now I'm using the expensive provap110. It's fast and easy and will last me many seasons. I run around 40 colonies. In the long run I think the provap110 is the way to go for me. If I only had 4 hives...

[@rifp8440]

I can't get 190 proof everclear from the wine and spirit store in Pittsburgh without applying for a permit, can I use 95% lab. grade denatured ethyl alcohol instead? Please send me your thought

[@SoatMon]

I would think so but I don't have any experience with it.

[@SNAFUPheonix]

i use a burgess fogger for mineral oil . it wont work well for OA and alcohol for me. After just a few pumps the solution becomes cloudy and wont pass. i found i couldn't get water through it to clean it out, and tried mineral oil, it came back to fogging. Then when trying to clean with water again , flow problems..Finally something broke loose and it passed steam. it appears the Acid or alcohol dissolve the pickup tube on the foggier

[@SoatMon]

I haven't had that issue, not sure what the difference is. Thanks for the comment.

[@mohamed1980hamoda]

Can we treat in this way at high temperatures

[@kamalhalabi8945]

תרגום ערבית

[@rickyschamall3168]

Hi, would,you know why FGMO that is normally used in forgers is not used in this instance? In NZ 95%, 190 proof alcohol is incredibly expensive, had a quote for NZ$118 per litre whereas FGMO is $16. Thx

[@SoatMon]

Unfortunately, I am not familiar with FGMO. Maybe someone that has tried it will answer you. Thanks for watching!

[@wmrogerware]

I think fgmo may be food grade mineral oil

[@glaucouswingedgull]

A number of people use water instead of ethanol. Oxalic Acid in more dissolvable in ethanol than water. Think the 25 gm/100 ml directions for oxalic acid was chosen because that is near the saturation point for oxalic acid in ethanol at room temperature. You would not be able to dissolve quite as much in water as in ethanol, possibly 15 gm/100 ml, just guessing. Some people suggest water would be less damaging to the bees than ethanol.

[@terriblycleverchannelname5620]

Do you think a ULV fogger for disinfectant would work?

[@SoatMon]

I'm sorry I don't know the answer.

[@mikecain5763]

Have you or anyone checked . or is there documentation on how HOT the Burgess machine gets so it goes to gas before it changes to formic acid and carbon monoxide? have you done an alcholol wash a few days after to check fio mites?

[@SoatMon]

I have not seen where anyone has checked for the formic acid conversion. Also, I have not done the alcohol wash. Last year was my first with bees and I split them several times, I did not have enough bees in a colony to spare killing that many. Will probably do this next year.

[@adamsonright2120]

please would you tell me if its ok to use this method while supers are on?

[@SoatMon]

The FDA says no because the oxalic acid will touch your honey but I know that some people do it.

[@adamsonright2120]

@@SoatMon Thank you very much, now I got Everclear 190 grain alcohol, does that work the same? I couldn't find GEM CLEAR 190 anywhere in my area!

[@SoatMon]

That should be the same thing

[@adamsonright2120]

@@SoatMon thanks again

[@ronaldstilwell3464]

Thanks so much for your videos. I am very interested in trying this method of mite control. Most of my hives have a pretty robust mite issue that did not appear to be an issue in September--so I am compelled to try something in order to get through the winter. My only concern is that I typically leave a medium super of honey on hives. Are you aware of the known effect on honey or on empty comb if left in the hive? Most of the honey is capped.

[@framcesmoore]

Ha Ronald I was concerned with that as well but I was told that this method does not hurt the honey that the bees clean it out in a couple of day that the honey was fine to eat this person treats with a fogger every month he said . the dribble method is what contaminates the honey and u have to be careful with it u can not eat the honey with this method.

[@ronaldstilwell3464]

Thanks for the feedback. Not interested in the dribble method.

[@SoatMon]

A lot of people have said it does not affect the honey and oxalic acid is a natural compound found in foods like spinach and rhubarb. However, the county extension pamphlets state that supers must be removed. I think it is because honey for consumption cannot be contaminated by anything. I would not hesitate to leave them in place. Thanks for watching and commenting. Good luck with your bees!

[@ronaldstilwell3464]

Thanks for taking the time to reply!

[@fredvazquez6279]

@@SoatMon Good video and I understand you like to do things fast. However, it is much better to remove the honey supers. You can either smoke your bees to the brooder boxes and place a barrier like a piece of plywood or a piece of plastic between brood boxes and supers or you can smoke the bees down, remove the supers, put your lids on, treat your hives andreturn the supers after 30 minutes. Better to be safe than sorry.

[@marvelous1492]

Is the fog coming out very hot? No concern with scorching bees? I haven't started beekeeping yet but gearing up for spring 2019. Trying to learn all that I can before then.

[@SoatMon]

It doesn't seem to be an issue.

[@cezargeorgenavruc8444]

Distance between woods bars susteining hives ????

[@framcesmoore]

Ha I did this yesterday with 150 grain proof they do not sale 190 here in Virginia, it mixed fine but I did not use it all so I left it in the jar not attached to the fogger when the solution cooled down the acid crystallized it spread like a spider web on the glass did u know it would do that. do u reheat it the next time u want to use it thanks this is a easy way to treat for mites thanks for the video.

[@SoatMon]

You want to keep it in an airtight container. I'm thinking the alcohol evaporated and that caused the crystallization. I would start over as you need to know the concentration of the solution. Good luck with your bees!

[@beetickler6418]

Why not apply the fog underneath the screened bottom board instead of trying to inject it through the entrance?

[@SoatMon]

Usually you close up the hive to keep the smoke in and I don't have screened bottoms. Thanks for the comment.

[@glennfelpel9785]

Well done. Really appreciate you always putting the links to all the items you use. As you say, sometimes it is hard to find the items especially things like Oxalic Acid. It may be common but I have never heard of it. By the way, you must have every tool known to man :-).

[@ElocinAlways]

Glenn Felpel , yup, hes a doll. I got 99.6% OA from amazon, in a whute bottle, man, it wouldnt dissolve in anything. Water, ethyl, everclear, all temps, not a bit of dissolution. Go with Florida Labs, save yourself time ♡♡

[@beebob1279]

Did you try the wood bleach acid from Mannlake? I've go that and want to use it. Hoping it works. If not down to Florida labs I go.

[@cluelessbeekeeping1322]

Have you had any problems with acid attacking the insides of the fogger?

[@brettwillbornsr.8437]

I have been flushing mine with water after use. And no problems so far .

[@cluelessbeekeeping1322]

@@brettwillbornsr.8437 Thanks!

[@phillipthomas253]

Can you elaborate on the spinning stirrer - where did you get it? What is it made of...

[@SoatMon]

If you search for a magnetic stirrer you will find them. Some do not heat. It's basically just a hot plate with a magnet that spins. You then put a bar magnet in the fluid and it spins and stirs the fluid. I first used one when I worked at a local university years ago.

[@phillipthomas253]

@@SoatMon Got it - thank you...great idea!

[@johnnywright1592]

Half cup and 2 tablespoons is your measurements

[@MrKco63]

so you use a respirator but are spraying this into an area of honey to eat later? any danger in contaminating the honey

[@SoatMon]

The FDA approved oxalic acid vaporization for hives but not with the honey supers in place. In other words, you should not have the supers in place that you will harvest honey from. Oxalic acid, however, is found in rhubarb, spinach, kale, cocoa, etc. Thanks for the comment and good luck with your bees!

[@ThePureUSA]

eat honey and enjoy it, dont use powder

[@framcesmoore]

Your hives are pretty thanks for the vidoes

[@SoatMon]

Thank you, I figured as long as I was painting them I might as well make them interesting. Thanks for the comment and watching my video!

[@frankcorbett6227]

HI cant find a mason jar to fit my insest fogger i live in ireland tried loads tread too big

[@glaucouswingedgull]

I had problems with mason jars, as the shoulder of the jar would jam against the pump mechanism, and wouldn’t allow the trigger to be cycled, no matter how hard you pressed. I did find a plastic jar that pickled herring came in that would work, before I actually found a mason jar that would fit. Think I had to use a larger jar, pint, instead of half pint. A number of jars had different thread styles, yet they all seemed to work for me.

[@ElocinAlways]

Im using your method, except mason jar set in boiling water. My oxylic acid wont dissolve . Any ideas?

[@SoatMon]

It may need more heat to dissolve.

[@ElocinAlways]

Soat Mon , i discovered the type i got on anazon, in a white bottle, with green and white label, is the problem. Others had posted it wouldnt dissolve. Got Florida Labs sending some, sooo, hopefully soon bees will be higher ratio in hive than mites 😲

[@framcesmoore]

Ha I live in virginia they do not sell 190 proof they sale 151 proff does it make a difference thanks

[@SoatMon]

Not sure but you may have trouble getting the oxalic acid to vaporize since it will have drive off the extra water first. Probably worth a try though. I bet the oxalic acid will dissolve easier. Thanks for watching!

[@beasbeesrva2615]

I live in Virginia too. You have to apply for a grain alcohol permit through the ABC. Then you can purchase the 190 proof Everclear They may have to order it for you.

[@skywave12]

www.ebay.com/itm/32-FLUID-OUNCES-190-PROOF-X-F-B-ULTRA-PURE-USP-ORGANIC-GRAIN-ALCOHOL/162543323754?_trkparms=aid%3D111001%26algo%3DREC.SEED%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20160908103841%26meid%3Dfdcb3295afdc4929a5714c78eff13967%26pid%3D100227%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D4%26sd%3D162543323754%26itm%3D162543323754&_trksid=p2054502.c100227.m3827

[@framcesmoore]

thanks

[@glaucouswingedgull]

Check my response to a previous questioner from New Zealand who had problems due the excessively high cost for 95% ethanol.

[@PatRoe]

since OA doesn't reach capped brood, how often do you treat?

[@SoatMon]

You want to treat 3 times 5-7 days apart.

[@PatRoe]

@@SoatMon How is this treatment method working and are you still using it. I read somewhere there could be a problem using grain alcohol. Thoughts on that?

[@ElocinAlways]

Was looking for how to kill danged mites, got your exact equipment, made it soo easy. But big battle rages, good or bad with supers on. I leave til spring.

[@natserog]

what is the correct way to clean fogger after use

[@glaucouswingedgull]

After finishing with the Oxalic Acid treatments, remove the jar of oxalic acid. Press the trigger a number of times to remove the solution from the fogger. Take a jar of water and screw into the fogger. Press the trigger a number of times to flush out the fogger. Remove the jar of water and push the trigger a number of times to remove all the liquid. Turn off the propane gas flow. Take a small tissue or paper towel to wipe dry the pump mechanism. Remove the propane tank. Let cool. Store away for next time.

[@privatebubba8876]

The respirator you listed is not for use with oxalic acid. You need a respirator rate for organic acid vapors.

[@SoatMon]

Thank you for letting me know, I have replaced it.

[@mark-wn5ek]

Yeah...like cyanide and mustard gas. These people must think you're huffing the fumes and your lungs will be instantly liquified if you get a whiff. They're the same ones who won't play with matches because they might explode...and get this...start a fire!

[@dennisdwiz386]

There is zero evidence that any of that fog went into any hive. ZERO. Need to actually put the fog into the entrance.

[@crueheads1]

If you watch the video he looks up at the top vent holes after every spray for signs that it's full and the fog is coming out the top of the hive, you can sort of see it leaking out the top/back of the first hives lid in the video, from experience in person it's pretty obvious when the fog fills the hive and start coming out from under the lid... There are certainly ways to make sure more fog gets directly in the hive but not absolutely necessary... I personally use a small length of 1/2" copper pipe pushed into the hive entrance a big and push the fogger tip to the pipe but his way works as well... A mite count before and after will confirm if it worked or not and should be done...

[@psyched1231]

If you have left over oxalic acid/alcohol mix, can it be stored, or will the chemistry degrade over time?

[@SoatMon]

I store it in a closed container.

[@ThePureUSA]

it will degrade

[@djg585]

Which Burgess model is this?

[@SoatMon]

I don't remember off the top of my head but it's linked in the description. That would show you.

[@djg585]

@@SoatMon The link didn't work.

[@mohamed1980hamoda]

hi. can i use formic acid instead of oxalic

[@SoatMon]

I have never used formic acid sorry.

[@RunningWithSauce]

Use Mite away quick strips which contain formic and penetrate brood caps, MUCH more effective and less time consuming.

[@MegaDavyk]

I dosed my hive with a fogger as heavily as you did here and I lost my queens.

[@SoatMon]

I'm sorry about your queens. I don't have a lot of experience with oxalic acid but have not lost any of my queens... yet... Thanks for the information.

[@framcesmoore]

good video thanks

[@SoatMon]

Your welcome. Thank you for taking the time to comment!

[@foolontoo]

nice video... might be a little dangerous if you spilled that alcohol,,,,better screw it on before you light fogger

[@theoeicher]

have you found that the acid is hard on the fogger?

[@SoatMon]

I have only used it one year but have not noticed any problems.

[@tomsaltus3602]

can you do this with suppers on

[@SoatMon]

Some people do. It won't hurt the bees but the FDA has not approved oxalic acid with the honey supers in place.

[@timarheit7272]

According to the EPA's pesticide label. No, you shouldn't treat with supers on.

[@mikeries8549]

It depends on what country you are in.

[@aquigley10]

FDA just updates their guidelines!!!! 2/2021

[@Tarbuckle1970]

I've heard of people using distilled water. Has anyone here tried this rather than alcohol?

[@sergiojacome]

Not sure about varroa but its a excelent way to pissmy bees off...

[@jamesford8315]

Your name doesn't happen to be Walter White?

[@SoatMon]

Sorry no. Thanks for watching my video!