John Marston's Daughter Explained (Red Dead Redemption 2)

Gathering all the information that there is to know about Abigail and John Martson's daughter in Red Dead Redemption games.
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Artist: Erlend Flatin
Title: The Dark Woods - • ♫ Horror/Thriller Movi...
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#StrangeMan #RDR2 #RedDeadMysteries

[@guyk768]

The simplest answer I always believed as to why we didn't hear about John Marston's daughter in Red Dead Redemption 2 or saw a grave in Red Dead Redemption 1 would be what I recall John telling Charles about trying to mine for gold from what I recall was The Klondike Gold Rush and she died while John, Abigail, and Jack were there. A child passing away while there or along the way would simply be buried right there from what I've read about things that happened during this time period.

[@cld252]

That would work with Javier’s line from RDR 1 as well, even if the daughter’s already dead the insult still makes sense

[@ShibalotonSeattle]

I always thought so, but it is still kinda odd that John mentioned her several times in 1911, but never even mentioned her once in 1907, nor by Abigail. I guess cannon-wise the only possibility is She was born and lost between 1907 and 1911. But in that case she must have been buried in Beechers Hope, but there is no grave in Beecher's Hope either in 1911. So it must have been a developer oversight.

[@Only.The.Best.]

​@@ShibalotonSeattleI don't think johns daughter is with Abigail

[@gurpinderwarar4625]

I forgot exact location, but somewhere near tumbleweed you can find a grave with no name, most surprising thing was a flower necklace hanging on that grave same necklace Jack made in chapter 2

[@themadtitan7603]

@@ShibalotonSeattle I think it's clear Rockstar completely forgot about her existence. When Rob Weitohff asked about John's daughter during development, they just went *Oh, she died"* without any further elaboration.

[@GPASG]

I find it unlikely for John's daughter to be in any way relevant to the next Red Dead title, seeing as she'd probably have died as an infant/a toddler at most, so she couldn't have possibly contributed in any way to anything ongoing

[@CantRead1]

The next Red Dead game will be a reboot with a entirely new cast of characters and universe. I don't understand why the Red Dead community wants a prequel of a goddamn prequel.

[@GPASG]

@@CantRead1 I know exactly what you mean. If they were to link it in some way the the others, I'd imagine at best they'd do something like Ubisoft did with the Kenway trilogy, as in out of order. Alternatively, they might, as you say do it differently but perhaps include cameos of known characters or such, I would surely expect Rockstar to do a little something tied to the old thing, even if they did no forward thinking (not especially their strong suit).

[@SNOWDUDE13]

@@CantRead1 To see the formation of Dutchs gang, which to be honest would be cool. However I'd personally like to see Red Harlow return.

[@jamiegunnar4100]

@@CantRead1 "will be" 💀💀💀

[@ChocolateMilk..]

@@CantRead1 And GTA5 is a woke po crap!

[@Edkipp712]

I always thought that the daughter was born (or at least the pregnancy was) between Chapter 6 and the Epilogue. As for why they don't speak about it, the loss of a child guts a parent emotionally. They don't really talk about Arthur either. It's entirely possible that the daughter's time was post-RDR2, I actually hadn't considered it. Just my opinion.

[@marythecontrarian]

Yes but why would he never talk about it and then suddenly talk about it twice 4 years after the epilogue? Of course, yes, you can have the opinion, and honestly either way it doesn’t make sense so it’s just as good as any theory.

[@staticradio724]

@@marythecontrarian Maybe it's a distance thing? If she did die between chapter 6 and the epilogue, her death would have been more recent and maybe they didn't want to talk about it yet, during the epilogue. Maybe by the time RDR1 rolled around, enough time had elapsed that the wound had healed over some.

[@pasha_0791]

John talks about his daughter only with Bonnie and Luisa, the former to tell what his life was and the latter because my guess is he didn't think a random Mexican revolutionary would ever meet his family. Never talked about it with his family. As with Javier, either John killing him is canon or Javier just got sloppy with his English.

[@maikybravo6108]

Remember what Arthur said? After the murder of Isac and Eliza Arthur became more stone hearted, he did felt awful, destroyed, and then, it was gone, he felt numb

[@nnnnmhughuuhhjiijj9457]

​@@pasha_0791Didn't Javier also knew that John was a rancher or something along those lines? Maybe, he looked into John? After all he was keeping contacts with Bill despite the fact that nearly everyone separated during the ending of chapter 6.

[@smallfungus2675]

honestly sounds like a little detail they wanted to give to John to make his background tragic, besides the riding wirh Dutch's gang part. Even then it still fits cause of how many infants and children died around that time. I mean Hosea is considered old, yet he's only 55.

[@themadtitan7603]

It's still on RDR2 for not showing it because it's the prequel. RDR1 keeps his past ambiguous so of course they don't show her. But there's no excuse for RDR2 as a prequel not to have his daughter and have her death be an integral part of John's development.

[@coltgun876]

@@themadtitan7603 I mean... The daughter was most likely born between 1907-1911. Not sure why she would have an importance in RDR2 anyway her sole purpose in the 1st game was to give John a more tragic background.

[@themadtitan7603]

@@coltgun876 The daughter is only most likely born between 1907-1911 BECAUSE RDR2 forgot about her in the main story and left us to assume she was born after the epilogue to make any sense of it. In the first game, she was clearly born during John's time in the gang and Javier is even makes mention of her alongside Jack. Showing his daughter and her passing would've done more than make John's past more tragic, it would've added to his character development (hardened him into his world-weary self in 1911) and added to his story in RDR1 by showing why he was such committed father and husband who strived to get his family back by all costs.

[@derpeth2101]

@@themadtitan7603 The daughter could be from some woman not connected to the gang, just like Arthur's son Isaac, who is only mentioned by Arthur to the nun and Rains Fall. John only mentions her daughter to strangers too.

[@saulquintero7]

I hope you never lose the material to keep creating all this videos we all enjoy Mr. Strange Man! Never lose your plan!

[@popom3663]

The man with the Plan!

[@grady3426]

"Just one more good video" - Dutch

[@steveorsomthing7600]

Faith

[@morgue.dweller]

My theories are either; 1. Abigail miscarried. She knew she was pregnant but wasn't far enough along in the pregnancy for there to be much more than blood in the miscarriage process, so there wasn't a body to bury. 2. The baby was born but she was ill and needed to be cremated (or burned) to prevent illness from spreading. 3. Like others said, she was born and passed whilst John and Abigail were traveling and she's simply buried somewhere else.

[@S-Mania]

What about Javier's line in RDR1 about hoping John's wife and children rot in hell? How would he know about her?

[@justinfarmer7460]

While I do agree with 2 and 3 being possible, 1 not so much. Stillborn maybe. If she was little more than a pool of blood, then I don't know how they knew she was a girl.

[@derpeth2101]

@@S-Mania He's just screaming a random insult, doesn't mean anything.

[@b.u.l.1734]

The "I hope you and your wife and children rot in hell" remark from Javier it's just an insult that is typical in Spanish speaking countries: "Me cago en tus muertos/los tuyos". Javier means "children" in a generic sense. It's just a "I curse you and your future generations" type of insult.

[@KerbalOnDres1]

@@S-Mania Maybe John and Javier met sometime between 1907 and 1911? Javier had some problems with the Mexican government after all so he probably didn´t return right after Chapter 6.

[@mordecai9469]

I think that they weren't expecting much from rdr 1 so they just put that as a unimportant detail. Or maybe for some reason they thought it wouldn't be important to tell her story to players maybe because they weren't planning to use John in the second game.

[@Dutch_van_der_Linde_1899]

It's clear that John's daughter came after Jack, as the way John speaks of her during his RDR1's conversation with Bonnie, implying that she lived shortly, plus, Chapter 6 of RDR2 ends in 1899, so sence then all the way to 1907 is a period of a whole span of 8 years, a lot can happen in 8 years, and yes, clearly she was no more before 1911. The only explanation for her death is that she was born while John was away after Chapter 6, and as she died there, she was obviously buried there. Rockstar didn't mention anything about that but this is the only logical reason.

[@beatrixdobson4795]

I always just presumed John's daughter was stillborn and it happened before the epilogue. I really can't see how she could play any part of RDR3 unfortunately

[@Nicola_Bailey]

It looks like Abigail is knitting a sock, but it could be the arm of a baby shawl. Women generally knew well before they told their husbands. Most likely the daughter was sickly and died weeks or months after her birth. The reason there is little reference to her is because she just isn't important to the story, other than John's comments. Really it's pretty much the same as Arthur's son. He was born, then was killed, end of story.

[@jackmarston8337]

Javier saying "children rot in hell" could simply mean that he doesn't know if they had more children and I'm sure he doesn't really care anyway. I find unlikely that she died between Chapter 6 and Epilogue (but this is a nice theory with the name of the horse) because she isn't mentioned once : Why wouldn't they talk about her months after her passing but many years after ? I don't think this is a mourning issue. If Rockstar wanted to talk about her in Red Dead 2, they would have done it. But the fact that she knits (I never encountered this btw, that's amazing) can indeed imply that she makes an outfit for a baby. I love the idea, that's a nice detail and we can interpret it as we wish. Maybe this is a consolation for not knowing when she passed. Maybe the grave was destroyed or maybe she's buried but doesn't have a gravestone ? Who knows. Maybe Rockstar didn't want to add more of her, sadly.

[@user-if4nx2jn8r]

Yeah, I think Javier was just speaking in generalities rather than knowing the Marstons had another child.

[@big_dee33]

What parent goes around bragging about their dead kid? They didn't talk about because they didn't want to. John only brought it up to Bonney to break the ice, show he actually has a personality.

[@nnnnmhughuuhhjiijj9457]

​@@user-if4nx2jn8rDidn't Javier also knew that John had a ranch in West Elizabeth? Maybe, he looked into John?

[@gurpinderwarar4625]

I forgot exact location, but somewhere near tumbleweed you can find a grave with no name, most surprising thing was a flower necklace hanging on that grave same necklace Jack made in chapter 2

[@Therandomguyyoumet5yearsagoalt]

Oh

[@MrBump2]

Thanks for covering this one, his daughter always slips my mind and I struggle to think when she may have lived.

[@MikaelaKMajorHistory]

Considering that Laura Ingalls Wilder (author of Little House In The Prairie books) lost a little brother and they buried him in one of the many places they traveled to stay, I imagine Marston’s daughter was buried in the same way. You couldn’t take a dead corpse around with you so you’d have to bury them wherever you’re staying at in that moment. When you have to move on to somewhere else, you have to leave that grave behind too.

[@MrBoomxl]

What if their daughter died before the events of RDR2, what if she was their first child? Ofcourse there could be many reasons how she died. Maybe that's the reason John was so distant with Jack and refusing to believe he was the father, perhaps he was still traumatised from losing his daughter.

[@jamiemohan2049]

Also possible she is just Johns child not Abigail's and as you said died before rdr 2. Perhaps John fathered her while very young and she was the first child in the gang. When Abigail joined she cared for the girl and John began to develop a connection to Abigail. The girl died, likely tragically and John was distraught. When Abigail became pregnant he stepped up and married her, despite Jack's disputed heritage. Maybe raising Jack and accepting him as his son was a way of also honouring the child he couldn't protect.

[@sussybaka7869]

He says "I had a daughter but she died, years before that I rode in a gang" it couldn't have taken place back in rdr2 or before it. Maybe between 1907 and 1911

[@var-mint7993]

Strange Man never fails to disappoint with these RDR2 secrets vids.

[@itisfreak]

Bruss

[@LilThickRedBone1438]

If they disappoint you, why keep watching?

[@voidified86]

Bro you just revealed the amount of iq that you have

[@jaketaylor2775]

Is it possible that the daughter was John's, but not with Abigail? I find it strange that there would be no headstone or grave or anything for her on the property of Beecher's Hope, even if she had been a stillborn. If he had a daughter with someone other than Abigail, that explaines the lack of a gravesite on the property, and opens up the timeline a lot more. She could have been born before Jack, to another woman, and died young. Before the events of RDR2. The game isn't above including something like that as barely mentioned backstory, as we saw when Arthur confided in Eagle Flies about his son who was killed years ago.

[@Titan4K]

I think the reason why the Marston family doesn't mention anything about Johns daughter, is because she only belonged to John, and never belonged to Abigail. She probably passed away somewhere else hence no gravestone at Beecher's Hope. This is why the Marston family never talk about it, because only John knows about her. He could have had the daughter or at least got another woman pregnant when he left the gang for a year (before the main events of RDR2), hence why him & Abigail fought a lot.

[@j-skullz]

This is interesting actually because it parallels Arthur's story with his son Isaac, would also explain why John was gone for so long and why he struggled to connect with Jack when he returned. And why he mentioned his daughter to random strangers in RDR1, he wanted to keep her memory alive somehow.

[@nnnnmhughuuhhjiijj9457]

Honestly, it's more likely that she died during her infancy in-between 1907 to 1911, there's isn't indication of John having a child or flirting with another woman other that one time, he flirted with Karen, but he was so drunk, like he was on moonshine or something.

[@onurguardian9004]

thats nice point of view realy. and now if RDR3 takes part before Blackwater massacre, we would probably see where John gone for those years and what did he do ;)

[@JOHNMARSTONmemes]

This is the most reasonable answer I think, surprisingly strange man didn’t say this because it is very logical

[@kolyasmirno9116]

Set in 1897...Hardened Father as a Dlc expansion.

[@SpaceMonkeyBoi]

It's a shame that Rockstar doesn't give this game the same love it gives to gta. It's arguably better.

[@S1eepy0w1]

I think maybe she died during the pregnancy, as for the grave I have no clue, maybe she died outside of new Austin? But that would not make any sense either, or maybe it was a accident that Abigail and jack are to scared by to talk about but John can since he’s seen and done worse things, sucks to have no answer to this

[@kennyboy6325]

Hey there! I just finished my first playthrough of RDR2, and of course started looking into the community videos a bit. You, my friend, easily have the best put together videos, with the best evidence to support your theories, while also not using click-bait titles. I just wanted to say a "thank you," as I have been supremely entertained by your content. When I saw this video drop, I honestly said, "Holy $&!^, this guy is STILL putting these out?! Not too surprised, as this game was about the best experience I have ever had, and continues to wow me. Thanks again!

[@brewskiproductionslasvegas]

I'm sure the devs fleshed out every tiny detail they could think of on the main characters. They left it ambiguous for a reason. Probably to leave room for additional story if there'll be more games later, plus people love mysteries. There could also be more clues in the game we haven't found yet too.

[@ianu02]

What about the neckglace Jack made for her momma in RDR2? We can see that same necklace on a tomb in Odd Fellow's Rest. Maybe it doesn't seen to have any relation with the daughter but, I think she died and The Marston family leave the neckglace there on the tomb who is respectively, of their dead daughter....

[@DetroitSoul]

My theory is that John's daughter is an extremely subtle way of one of the developers honoring their daughter that died during production of RDR 1, and the horse being named Rachel is a way that programmer/developer told you the name. Far fetched, I know but with R* these days, anything is possible.

[@themadtitan7603]

I always thought Rachel might've been John's daughter name too. I believe Rockstar simply forgot about that thread because otherwise she would've surely been there in the epilogue and her death would be an integral part of his character development.

[@xulula7035]

@@themadtitan7603 I've seen your comments for years and years lol

[@TheJoec2005]

I've had this theory for a while that Abigail got pregnant after the wedding at Beecher's hope but had a miscarriage

[@jillsnacks]

You don't see this kind of content anywhere besides from the legend himself of course. As always, keep em coming Strange Man, you 🤘!

[@kianoneill453]

The Strange man carrying RDR2 in 2023

[@ericbosse]

I think his daughter died between Chapter 6 and the Epilogue of RDR2. It makes sense, it's thr longer time frame and why they wouldn't of buried her in Beechers Hope. She could of died up in the Yukon while they were searching for Gold

[@judemagnotti2245]

Video Idea Strange, the camp parties have several interesting details not just things you look at, but some things you find out about other characters past. I think that would be a really good video to do

[@ScottyCruse]

Its sad to see Javier say that to John especially when Jack loved the whole gang, Javier was one of the good ones.

[@themadtitan7603]

I think Rockstar just completely forgot about John's daughter in RDR2. Otherwise she would've defintely been there in the epilogue and her death would be an important part of John's development. Even Rob Weitohff asked about it and all he got was a *"uh, she died"* with no elaboration.

[@kopanitis]

Yep, it’s another instance of RDR2 not being a good prequel. Like with many things from RDR1 that were rewritten, forgotten, retconned, this is another one. They probably totally forgot about it and only thought of it when Rob asked. So they put this knitting scene in so they can save the situation even though they have completely ruined RDR1 lore

[@rorycooper237]

@@kopanitis RDR2 is goated, don’t be dissin

[@kopanitis]

@@rorycooper237 on its own? Absolutely! It’s one of the best games of all time and one of my favourites which I’ve poured hundreds of hours into but as a prequel to RDR1 it’s kind of all over the place.

[@themadtitan7603]

​@@kopanitis Even when Rob asked about it, they just gave him a non-answer and didn't care to go back to the script and add her back in. I get the impression they didn't go back and examine RDR1's story much when crafting RDR2's, because their priority was the new story and cast while the prequel elements are just tacked on later.

[@themadtitan7603]

@@rorycooper237 Just because someone criticizes something, it doesn't mean they're blindly hating on it or are saying it's not great. Typical RDR2 fan behavior.

[@mohamadgamal]

It's okay, when RED DEAD 4 or REDEMPTION 3 release in 2045 we will know more about John's daughter

[@ued_general5805]

I think your right when you said Rockstar just simply never went any further with the development of the dead daughter than to just simply add more hardship to John's character in RDR1. The new devs with rockstar developing RDR2 a decade later probably didn't even realize John had a deceased daughter 😅

[@cadusindona]

I’d love to see more in RDR3. Let us suppouse that John and Abigail lost the girl in an accident, but somehow she survived and was raised for someone else. And her and Jack, somehow, antagonize each other, because now she’s the greatest outlaw of the country and he became State’s Marshall, and is in search of her and her gang without knowing they are siblings… That would be freaking amazing dude.

[@dragonwings8610]

There is a theory that John's daughter was buried in Odd Folk's Rest as in RDR2 on one of the graves there, you can find Jack's necklace that he made for Abagail in Chapter 2 during the fishing mission hanging on that grave. It could mean that Jack decided to give that necklace to his late sister in honor of her death.

[@PG-kt1hz]

I dont know, but the Graveyard in the endscreen can be found in RDR2. On One of the crosses, you can find the necklace Jack gave Abigail in Episode 2 (in the fishing misson with Arthur) i always thought that that was the Grave of his daughter, and that Abigail left the necklace there.

[@Srenitystreez]

i was thinking like all the rest of the people and didnt even know they had the same thoughts, But that His daughter died in the womb during the time when Arthur died and Abigail thought john was dead because of all the stress.

[@fino7738]

I personally think that his daughter's death was before rdr2, and thats why I think he didn't want to be a father to Jack, so he doesn't have a chance to go through it again. Plus lines up with Javier knowing that John had more than one child

[@esidarasun8151]

On one of the Luisa missions, she asked the name of the daughter just before we arrived at the destination. I was so mad!

[@TrapperCody]

I want an alternate history of the red dead redemption series where John, Abigail, Uncle and Arthur live. Three playable characters John Arthur and Jack would be cool

[@alan1as1]

Don’t think there will be a rdr3 now that the master mind has left

[@betr8]

It could be that Abigail was pregnant but lost her baby before she was born but they knew from the doctor that she was female or somethin'.

[@dejazO0]

John's daughter had 4 years to get born and die so you telling me in rdr 3 we will get a toddler protagonist riding horses and collecting bounties, killin animals and dueling 😂 before dying savagely at the age of 3 or less.

[@devonaiello5469]

I think she died between 1907 and 1911. Would make sense as to why shes not mentioned in rdr2 barely

[@LizardWizrd]

It might have been that she died when Abigail was giving birth or before because that could’ve happened witch would make Sense why she’s not buried with the farm

[@kevinschofieldjr.9927]

I Iove your videos especially rdr2 I love these secrets explained

[@MrHomeboy521]

Brooo, when I started the video, there were about 400 views.... When I refresh, over 1000. Strangeman, you provide the greatest content 🤘🤘🤘

[@exosluckyone]

i think her not having a grave is definitely important since the game developers wouldn't write voice lines about the daughter and just forget to put one on the lot. i wonder if something happened to her where they couldnt keep the body

[@themadtitan7603]

What confuses me is that in RDR2 we could say they forgot about her but as for RDR1, why didn't they bother to add a grave in that game when the story says John had a daughter that passed.

[@exosluckyone]

@@themadtitan7603 yeah things would be less vague if they added it. i guess we will never know why not

[@simonster-9094]

I think it was implied or assumed in RD1 that she died sometime after John left the gang and before they settled down at Beechers.

[@themadtitan7603]

​@@simonster-9094 RDR1 indicates she was born in the time of the gang because Javier is aware of her and references John's "children" but where is it implied that she died before they settled in Beecher's?

[@alfilzafriyankamz7533]

Conclusion: Just wait for RDR 3 revelation.........😌

[@savannahcamron4926]

I believe that John got his daughter with another woman when he left the gang for a whole year, as we know, when Jack was already born. He didn't want Abigail to know anything about it for obvious reasons. Because her heart was already beating for John and they both had Jack together. That's probably also why he's the only one to mention about his daughter in RDR1 and not Abigail. I don't know how Javier was the only one in the gang to found out. But knowing his friendship/brotherhood with John during the events of RDR2, he probably kept this secret for himself by loyalty. Telling Arthur about it would've been risky since Arthur was close to Dutch. He would've most likely tell Dutch. I guess John didn't want anyone to know about her though Javier knew for some reason. Also, when John said to Bonnie: "I'm married. I have a son. I had a daughter, but she died. Years before that i rode in a gang". I think that when he said "years before that" doesn't necessarily mean that he's talking about before the passing of his daughter but before he got married. Because if we take his sentence literally not much would make sense since Jack was already born when he, John, was in the gang. She maybe died with her mother, the woman John got pregnant, and they both have been buried somewhere. I don't think R* made this up just to give John a backstory. It doesn't sound right. Just a theory of mine... Edit: Sorry for my non-native english by the way...

[@B1_1_9_7_5]

Screw the strange man and screw the Blackwater Massacre and screw the panoramic map this is the biggest mystery in Rockstar a child that's been dead for a decade

[@WhiteyBrandi]

its this incredible guy again~

[@GTG583]

Love it when stranger man drops video out

[@Roastbeef69420]

I believe that she was born in the time that John was away from the gang, more likley to have happened with Abigail at Beechers Hope however he was away from the gang for over a year and barley mentions any details as to why. probably isnt the case but could possibly be an idea

[@RafaielGames]

Thats like calling your wife a horse

[@skxlter5747]

I think rockstar is trying to write his daughter off from continuity cuz she isn't mentioned in this game

[@lynk3067]

Strange man so good at this stuff i bet he can tell Arthur’s babymama life before and after meeting him

[@bethenhiemer]

I always assumed she was stillborn, or a late stage miscarriage, and was laid to rest before they even made it to Beecher's Hope.

[@AnnaBelleEevee]

I'm guessing she died as an infant. Maybe even only a few days old

[@simonster-9094]

I don't think the Marstons not mentioning their daughter in the epilogue does not discredit the theory that she died in between 1899 and 1907. They probably don't talk about her the same reason John doesn't talk about Arthur.

[@fakename2212]

My guess is that it happens sometime between chapter 6 and the epilogue, during the family's period of moving around. They likely don't mention her because she died young, wasn't with them for long, isn't available as a grave nearby to visit, and causes them pain to think about, so they don't bring it up for little benefit other than to cause the other two to have to think about her and be upset, too. Similarly to Arthur's son, she is only brought up rarely and when relevant to the subject at hand.

[@KAustinn]

Abigail was pregnant with their daughter at the Ranch. If you do a greet on uncle you will get this dialogue John: "I thought I already had a child to look after." Uncle: "You weren't doing so well with him. So, God gave you a second chance." John: "Two children now."

[@user-hx6gs9rq7u]

That’s not what that meant lol it was a joke about how now john is going to have to take care of uncle now because he never does any work

[@mikeso231]

There's a place in New Austin called Abandoned Mission and in a different video, when you said that there's a file that shows Arthur and the Tumbleweed Sheriff talking or something like that. The place Abandoned Mission is a house I think or it's one of the working shacks that blow up due to chemical explosion thingy. Since Rockstar decided to abandon Arthur being in New Austin, the files do show the Sheriff of Tumbleweed talking, the house may have been a Abandoned Mission, just like the house name. That's one thing that stood out to me in RDR2.

[@Aquilaris]

Very good video, as usual. This question is one that has interested me, as we never got the answer of it.

[@RVDDP2501]

0:35 - Will there be a video covering the mystery of the floating rocks in the graveyard? XD

[@wolfsburg8572]

This has been one of the more perplexing and enduring mysteries of this series. It really feels like Rockstar simply forgot this detail in RDR2 but given their usually impressive attention to detail in most every other facet, that seems like an odd and fairly major oversight. It's possible she could've lived between 1899 and 1907, but it's weird she wasn't mentioned or even alluded to even once in the Epilogue. I agree the more logical explanation is that she lived and died between 1907 and 1911. That only leaves the questions of: why there is no grave, even in RDR1 where she's actually mentioned, and how did Javier know about her? It seems unlikely he would've been keeping tabs on John's familial status *unless* he and the Marstons had an encounter with each after RDR2 and after the daughter is born, that we never saw. As for her missing grave, I could buy that she died somewhere outside the gameworld and couldn't be brought back to Beecher's Hope. The Marstons participating in the Klondike Gold Rush is a good potential explanation but that would take us back to 1899-1907 and the oddness of her not being alluded to at all in the Epilogue. I get it would be a sad point for John and Abigail but one would've thought Rockstar would've used that opportunity to mention her and cover themselves against this exact discussion. Even some brief dialogue like "She got sick so fast...I hated leaving her up there...etc" would've at least been something. Also, I can't fathom what possible role the daughter could have in RDR3. Certainly none if they continue to go backwards chronologically, unless for some reason there are some time jumps forward with John, when she was alive. That seems weird though. If anything, I would think you would play a new character and the RDR3 Epilogue would have you playing as a young Arthur *sniffle*

[@wedgins]

My theory is that she died when she was a child, from some danger (animals or criminals) between 1907 and 1911, John couldn't protect her. I think that's why RDR1's John is colder, more serious, and mature. It also gives some depth to John's character as this event further motivates him to protect his family when Ross forces him to hunt down his old friends to have them back, even if he kinda knrw that sooner or later they would come after him as well.

[@vaughnalexander32]

I think her name wouldve been something unextraordinary like Jane or Jill.. bc there's John and Jack. And we ALL know Jack and Jill went up the hill

[@kaitlando636]

Lol

[@shadowagent6051]

Yeah,I think the daughter was to give a little more drama to John's story,I think they thought it wouldn't be nice to have a little girl around the ranch after the epilogue in RDR 2 knowing that she would die for some reason at some point,but the knitting thing is a very good reference,it really does makes you think that she's pregnant.

[@marythecontrarian]

I think really they just forgot about it, but a good theory could just be they had enough money to have her buried someone nice and proper with a big marker, close by but not within the realms of the map, but when John, Abigail, and Uncle die, Jack is so distraught and wants his family near him, even though he can afford something nicer. People weren’t always buried in a small church or in their yards, wealthier people got memorials to themselves. I’ve seen several for small children whose parents were well off, which we know Abigail and John were before RDR1.

[@Jhenryx60]

I'm in chapter 2, and although I don't remember under what circumstances, I've already heard John mention that he had a daughter but she died.

[@werewolfking2646]

Just found this out, and I think you should know. There's a spot just outside of the Blackwater Saloon's back where you can chop wood. It's not explained at all in the story mode, so I thought you'd find it interesting.

[@thanoos.k]

great video again mate !!!

[@BarbaricCinema]

Wouldn't it be interesting if the next Red Dead title followed an adult Landon Ricketts (not middle aged like he is in Red Dead Redemption) and his life as gunslinger, his feud with the Butcher Brothers in 1896, his relationship with his wife before she passed, maybe follow some time with him in Mexico, with it all culminating with his involvement in the Blackwater Massacre in 1899? I think it'd be interesting to have another character other than Red Harlow survive a Red Dead title, as well as show more of how wild the West was in their world with people like Frank Heck, Flaco Hernandez, and Black Belle. The story could even be inspired by the Wyatt Earp/Doc Holliday/Gunfight at the O.K. Corral events seeing as Wyatt Earp was the inspiration for Ricketts!

[@londonfog6654]

John's dead daughter: Dialogue with some flavor

[@yoshisampson_yt8349]

Prob died like months after epilogue because John prob still had the scars on and his injury made his daughter be missing like a cheek if something so she passed away to the disorder

[@batsalemswag1373]

i mean it is kinda odd how johns daughter died according to john yet the developers didnt even bother adding a grave for her. My theory is that she was supposed to play a bigger part in the story but the developers cut her off mid game since they are known to do that to many characters especially in rdr2.

[@campos3452]

What confidence! My dude said RDR III. I like that…😁

[@Seanakin]

After having read the first part of the first Sherlock Holmes book, A Study in Scarlet, I firmly believe the horse was named Rachel for other reasons.

[@Ahh828]

I think she died between 1899-1907 instead

[@dapperdamon9315]

I swear the last time I played the 1st red dead was 16 or 17. I dont remember much so im gonna play it over again. I am 20 now so I feel like I would understand the story better

[@MadastheHatter13]

Developer oversight. The barn at the MacFarlanes ranch is missing for the exact same reason.

[@FaithEditz1899]

The strange man someone who gets to the point and has good information Unlike someone (Mr Boss)

[@billcasey2732]

Rob Wiehoff's quote makes it sound like she died before the events of RDR2. Maybe that's why John left for a year.

[@harveyrevealed4867]

I was literally looking up information on his daughter earlier today

[@qveenbeth6273]

Jack would of been such an amazing brother😢

[@TheJuggerClutch]

It's really weird, the lore reason would have to be she was born and died while John and fam were mining for gold before we see their first cutscene in the epilogue, like another commenter said somewhere, and was buried wherever that happened to be. But the IRL reason just seems to be that Rockstar forgot about her, which would be super weird considering how great their attention to detail is, and how important it seems to be to John's character in RDR1. And yet, no one mentions her, she is never acknowledged. Just a super bizarre oversight for one of the most detail-oriented studios in the industry.

[@aleksandarmarinkovic6986]

Question is how Javier knows about her? Considering that he hasn't seen John and the rest of his family since the gang broke up and spent all his time in Mexico after that.

[@walterrender5689]

it almost remind me about arthur late son who past away its sad to not see her or him in either game

[@sasukeuchiha6425]

This game still has a lot to give, that's for sure

[@dutch2415]

Thanks for doing this🙏🙏

[@yesman7777]

The last part about RDR3 made me think that the daughter was alive at the end and was taken by Pinkertons so now she hunts the last few of the outlaws kinda theory😂

[@shellybell4544]

I did not know there would be a RDR 3. But I would love that.

[@dutchplanderlinde2779]

Arthur mentions multiple times that John left the gang for over a year but they never mentioned what he was upto. Maybe his hatred for Abigail at that time made him run away and consequently he fell in love with an honest girl, they had a kid but the mother and the baby died at childbirth, just like John's own mother. His outlook on being a husband and a father might've changed ever since which would explain why he rejoined the gang. Maybe to see how things would play out with Abigail and Jack... and sure enough he begins to love and appreciate them too by the end.

[@edelweiss-]

5:40 no, i think Red Dead Redemption 3 will be about the time how Dutchs Gang was created. would be sensefull to understand the whole red dead story.

[@alwaysbecam8113]

GOAT

[@icantthinkausername1136]

It would make sense if she died between chapter 6 and the epilogue. The epilogue takes places after 8 years from chapter 6, who knows what they did in those 8 years. A lot of things could happen

[@cjwolf236]

Couldn’t it be possible that he had a situation similar to Arthur’s before he even met abagail

[@docburn6189]

all i see is the floating rock in the intro.. my immersion!

[@RyanWRoehlAKZoomberBoomer]

RDR3 COULD BE ANOTHER UNDEAD 2 WHERE YOU JOHN son SAW your family and your "Sister too