The Downfall of David and Dan

[@shin1300]

That rare moment when the studio wanted to be "faithful" to the source material and the writers wanted a cash grab

[@edienandy]

What source material? Martin’s napkin full of bullet points? Gotta be faithful to those bullet point napkins.

[@Dark_Voice]

@@edienandy I think they completely went the opposite directions than those bullet points even.

[@firstlast-oo1he]

@@Dark_Voice I disagree. Martin probably gave them a general idea, a few bullet points that are in no way the same as execution. You still need to _get there_ . Set up and pay off, as they teach you in screenwriting. They had the pay off (probably general ideas like "Bran wins", "Dany goes mad", "King's Landing is destroyed", "Jaime returns to Cersei", etc), but lacked a quality set up which is HUGELY IMPORTANT, and without it the pay off is severely diminished. Also, the execution of those probably very general plot points is just terrible. Also worth noting, George has said in an interview that he dealt with self-doubt regarding the ending he had in mind, but ultimately decided it was his story and wasn't going to change the ending just because other people may not like it. But I have no doubt it will be SO MUCH BETTER in the books because GRRM isn't the kind of writer to rush a story.

[@Dark_Voice]

@@firstlast-oo1he Could be true or all of it is just their nonsense. Nobody can know for certain so I wont argue there. However, I think GRRM will never complete the books and there will be no ending (leaving the story open ended WHICH is possibly for the best though).

[@DillsyYourDaddy67]

@@firstlast-oo1he To be fair, even if they were just given bullet points, a semi-competent writer would have been able to deliver a way better story.

[@KumaIsKing123]

The most frustrating part is just knowing how ungrateful they were. Literally any TV writer would KILL for a job like this a HUGE salary, great cast, massive budget, and the freedom to go on for as many seasons as you pleased...... But in the end they both completely took it for granted, and saw it as an anchor as opposed to an opportunity.

[@jstout333]

You mean when we got gorgeous and ambitious 1 shot scenes. And massive fights. And twists. And so much was of such high quality. They took that for granted? Or perhaps, delivering what they did was already an achievement and you're ignoring that because the ending wasn't what you wanted.

[@aravinds3846]

@@jstout333 we wanted an ending which made sense and blew our minds . Not some cliche hollywood shit

[@thomasaivaliotis7081]

@@jstout333 That was mostly the directors. He is talking about the writers. Its not about ''not the ending we wanted'' its just a bad ending. It makes no sense in storytelling. You can be a fan of the book or just a casual TV watcher, almost everyone agrees its dogshit.

[@Crichjo32]

@@jstout333 That was mostly down to the directors, actors and fantastic crew in Belfast, they were all fantastic, no one is disputing that. Unfortunately they were all at the mercy of two hack writers and producers, who clearly didn't give a crap at the end, and were just trying to wash their hands of it as quickly as possible. They crew deserved so much better.

[@aahana4931]

and the worst part is the acting,the direction,hell even the costume design was consistent and gorgeous 😭you can see how everyone was passionate about the show and every character in it except them

[@enenao]

D&D: We are the writers! Tywin: Any men who must say 'We are the writers' are no true writers.

[@Melanie-jy2nw]

@@toomeowstream3253 as a writer, I feel attacked 😂

[@7GabriEl7FM7]

😉🍻& i drink to that young lad for you have preached the truth!!

[@MikeJones-qn1gz]

My parents and I watched it together, they dont even like fantasy but they got into the show after watching the first few episodes.... And then season 8 happened and we all just shook our heads

[@alexk5907]

@@Melanie-jy2nw words of advice. Act like a great writer but don't claim to be one. Prove to us by showing your greatness.

[@gfilmer7150]

Show died with Tywin

[@AlmostEthical]

The real crime was not handing the show over when GRRM's material ran out. D&D had no right to complain about being fatigued when they could have passed the show over to fresher and more committed writers.

[@BrainDamageComedy]

exactly

[@endor8witch]

hubris

[@saeedyaghoubi331]

I am wondering, could HBO just fire them ? Was it possible?

[@AlmostEthical]

@@saeedyaghoubi331 Maybe a contractual issue?

[@JayV04]

@@saeedyaghoubi331 probablty in the contract. probably stated they have the final say with everything. hope HBO learns from this and change showrunners if they spot bad writing.

[@kek397]

I'm not questioning your writing ability, I'm denying its existence.

[@SagarsDeck]

Ahhhhh !!!! Loved this comment ❤❤

[@O.G.H.]

"We have powerful friends at HBO, they will hear about this!"

[@Rick-ex6sc]

Fast forward to the beheading please...

[@EntrEsprit]

i wish d&d were writers of some movie between season 7 and season 8,so they would fail and HBO could fire them before season 8 happened

[@daredevil6145]

burn!

[@LordDenningsWig]

Every time I think "I should rewatch Game of Thrones!" I remember S8 and exactly why I can't rewatch Game of Thrones.

[@leonrobinson8180]

So glad I didn't buy any merch (though I was tempted to)

[@RedFloyd469]

Just rewatch it up until the end of season 4. After that, what's canon and what isn't becomes blurry anyway so you can just wait for another 20 years in the hopes GRRM lives long enough to finish the series.

[@aj884]

This stops me from watching even a single episode, I can't deal with the sadness and disappointment of how it all ends (in comparison to what it could have been).

[@samsikora4844]

same

[@rogermoon6801]

I used to rewatch game of thrones every year before the new season came up, and I stopped, literally because of s07-08

[@pr_some148]

Bran saying "why do you think i came all this way" is literally the most annoying thing ever

[@midwings00]

I still don't know why he came all this way..... seriously why?

[@Slick_Tails]

So you see, that's where the trouble began. That smile. That damned smile.

[@benjaminbierley2074]

From a writing perspective, it's Cersei levels of short-sighted since long term Bran being in charge is not a good thing since he is the Three Eyed Raven...a quasi-immortal being...who can warg into anything, at any time, and holds centuries of collective knowledge to the point that the moment he became the Three Eyed Raven he stopped being Bran and immediately became disconnected from being human.

[@ringofasho7721]

That and "It'll be perfect when it fits a woman" are the two biggest cinematic slaps in the face throughout history

[@madsam9403]

It was like everyone was playing out of their character lol

[@bantix9902]

The saddest thing for me is that the cast was so insanely good and talented, every role matched perfectly and the acting was outstanding, I don't even know if a reshoot with different cast would come close to this...

[@mr.clymate7489]

If ever a reshoot is ever done I hope to the old gods and the new that it is a faithful adaption. That way I can say in my head that unfortunately the GOT I watched was a WestWorld Spinoff or was literally just Aegon's Dream visualized.

[@theporcupine9993]

we're gonna have to wait like 30 years until it's fine for someone to revisit it and build it up again from scratch

[@KmiiVC]

even with a truly great cast, as great as the original one, a reboot would have to wait a couple of decades for it to not be bashed about how great the og cast was. it's just too engraved in our collective mind, followers and non-followers of the show alike, for a new cast to even have a chance. a reboot would have to be for whole 'nother generation a few years down the line, not for us.

[@mr.clymate7489]

@@KmiiVC as much as an OG fan I am. I didn’t actually like the original X-men movies. Sure I watched it but back then it was rare to always expect MCU quality. The only XMen movie I liked were the recent rebooted and even those were mid. Logan top tier. At this point just do it, just don’t kill Xavier again.

[@omhh1986]

@@mr.clymate7489 what the actual fuck are you on about

[@LeeJ2512]

It still surprises me how little people even talk about this show anymore. It dominated popular culture for almost a decade and because of how it ended it's been collectively wiped from people's memories. I was obsessed with it when it was airing but now I can't even face rewatching it as I know how it ends.

[@mattrR678]

That is because the last two seasons are so bad the make the first six seasons unwatchable. I remember all the theories, time travel, Jon Snow being the Prince that was promised, all of the plots died. There was so much setup and know how it ends, you just cannot watch it.

[@jorgedeanoperez2997]

My main problem is watching it knowing that Stannis goes down as disgracefully as he does xD I've been reading these books since the 98, and ever since Ned declared him the true heir I've rooted for, supported and admired Stannis's character, devouring every page he is in with a passion. I had my concerns with his portrayal in second season, not giving a fuck about Renly's death as opposed to his deep regret and mourning in the books knowing that it was his duty to kill his baby brother but that it would haunt him to his grave, or how he was so desperate to bang Mel in the third season, when he was almost an asexual in the books, or how much more of a dick they made him throughout the series. But when I saw them killing him off in season five to give his story arch to Jon because a young, angsty outcast sold better than an "old" , angsty outcast (books Stan is 35, but whatever), I knew the show would be forever ruined for me. It takes all the joy from it

[@TrevDaManHanlon]

Exactly how I feel about it man, was my favourite show of all time. Used to rewatch clips constantly, guessing what was going to happen. Since it has ended, have never even gave it a second thought. Which is really sad to be honest, for a series that brought me so much joy, that I can barely look at as I know the beginning. I've watched many shows that finished badly but still look back at some classic moments, for them to completely destroy it where people don't even discuss it, is actually very impressive!

[@SaraLuna1993]

I think its not wiped out from peoples memories, but when we remember, we only get frustrated. No reason anymore to talk about it other than in comment sections of such videos. The end ruined everything before.

[@matewhatthefuck6516]

Same 😭

[@FoxInTheBasement]

Lets not forget David Benioff bragged that "Themes are for grade school essays" while being the head writer for the most thematically dense series

[@gordonchell4364]

Seriously? Sure, themes can be pretentious, but if done right they can give the audience something to ponder over. I love the themes in A Song of Ice and Fire. Specifically the themes of consequences and fear. Also David is one the talk when he writes some of the dumbest scenes in the show and still pretends it's deeper than it actually is.

[@thomasparkin259]

Good grief, yeah the usage of themes is a fairly basic writing tool but it's basic for a good reason! Themes are interesting! They make it easy to construct enthralling plot lines and set up believable twists! Just because one has hit the big time doesn't mean you can just discard the basics.

[@joshtargaryen6917]

Let's not also forgot that David benioff wrote 2 fantastic novels

[@amitx4243]

lets not forget all of chris nolans masterpieces have themes underlining them

[@Lite727]

It’s funny because Game of Thrones can have some very childish (not in a bad way, just mean innocent and juvenile) themes. The stuff with Gilly and Stannis’s wife is pretty ‘don’t judge a book by it’s cover’, then the struggle between Sam and his father is on the side of ‘don’t fat shame/no one likes a bully’ and the list goes so and so fourth. This is a medieval time period and many of the folk lore, fairy tales, and classic Disney animations we’ve seen and heard have utilized the time period as a breeding ground for applicable themes for children so it’s not a wonder as to how prevalent they are in asoiaf. Snow White and Cinderella are living proof of that.

[@Warmaker01]

The most Game of Thrones moment was when they killed the fanbase overnight. Nobody saw that coming.

[@BewegteBilderrahmen]

They killed it so hard people cannot even call it a “red wedding“ anymore

[@kiffu94]

This is gold xD

[@PrinceIsot]

Remember that meme about game of thrones wanting to keep fresh so they would indeed be killing off fans and martin pops out from under a desk..... that happened but it was dumb and dumber

[@BewegteBilderrahmen]

@Fraulein Bella because they killed the whole fanbases enthusiasm so the fans do not make the obvious association anymore that OP could have made (for example: they pulled a red wedding on the fanbase itself)

[@aesir1ases64]

To be honest some hardcore book fans were warning us since season 5 at least, it took season 7 to realize the end of GOT would be a painfull mess.

[@bloodypsycho6025]

Never forget that they didn’t ‘run out of material’ they literally cut about 4 seasons worth of content from the Novels….THAT WERE ALREADY OUT BEFORE SEASON 1 DROPPED. They cut all of Dorne They cut all of Griff story They neutered Danys story to be way less complex They neutered all the prophecies literally None payed off.

[@CursedPR]

Dont forget how they decided to ditch Lady Stoneheart storyline, after teasing us with it via Brann's vision, and the appearance of Lem Lemoncloack hanging people. Only to have The Hound piss on the river after that...

[@hazel1779]

You know, this is actually very sad and painful, and not just for the fans but the staff that was involved. Imagine, the actors gave their best, the music team, the people that made the clothes and accessories, the producers, the ambience, the decoration staff, the CGI team, special effects, and so on... All of them did their best and made a masterpiece with their work, hours of hard work...all to be ruined and overshadowed by the stupidity of these two and their stupid writing.

[@KROGANLovesKittensAndPuppies]

So many great book characters ruined too. Stannis, Barristan, Euron.

[@hendog5667]

@@KROGANLovesKittensAndPuppies Loras Tyrell too, it's like the only aspect they ever covered about him was his sexuality

[@andromidius]

@@hendog5667 Yep. Rolled all three brothers into one character and yet still somehow has less personality or story impact then any one of them. Should have been a massive red flag, but we were still riding the highs of season three and four. Just like how we forgave the changes in Robb's storyline. And no Marwin the Mage? Really? The guy who is pretty much a cameo in the books couldn't even get name dropped?

[@JesusTheWayTheTruthTheLife]

The fact we could have had 13 seasons of this show is probably one of the most depressing things I’ve ever heard...

[@ioannisnavrozidis2733]

If we had 13 seasons planned, George would have enough time to finish the books and give them proper material to direct.

[@reaganabroad4952]

@@ioannisnavrozidis2733 I doubt George finishes the books, but 13 years would have been enough time for better writers to finish the show.

[@Kahlessa]

HBO wanted 10 seasons and that could have worked if they brought in good writers. 1 season for defeating the Night King 1 season for defeating Cersei 1 season for the fall of Dany

[@uzairahmed4197]

@@Kahlessa thats very formularic those storylines would probably bleed into each other each season. And the nightking storyline should be one of the final 2 seasons

[@manbirsingh4244]

@@Kahlessa 1 fucking episode for defeating Night king

[@phillipjohno]

I think that the worst part is that they wouldn't pass it on to somebody else. They deserve to never work again.

[@jtno2]

Pure selfishness and ego on their part. If they were 'tired' of running GOT they should have handed it off and let the series run it's course, not cut it short just because they want to do Star Wars. I hope they rot.

[@ryangd05]

@Mythos53 soooooo for eternity?

[@dacooooo]

They are too rich and powerful rn.

[@betacuck3145]

@Mythos53 best comment so far 😂

[@brendanmatrix9393]

@Mythos53 one of them should be forced to live and shit in a crate, the other to scoop it and throw it overboard. They can switch as they like.

[@thewickedbihoftheeast]

The success of Got was never thanks to D&D. It's all Martin's work. Without him and the source material they showed complete lack of writing skills. Downfall? Nahhh they were never at the top.

[@FreeGumFighter]

One could argue they were considered to be at the top of their field when they were still in the golden years of adapting the Turtle Emperor's work. They did become the biggest show ever, but as you say that was only thanks to GRRM's genius.

[@steelbear2063]

@@FreeGumFighter Glory to the Turtle-Emperor! Purge the fast!

[@joelthehuman]

Thats a real controversial statement. It takes a lot more to create a show then just copying the books. Adjustments on what to leave out, what to show with greater detail and how to visualize a world that has barely be visualized before is a great acomplishement and they are defintive talented in this kind of stuff. Just not im comming up with original ideas

[@FreeGumFighter]

@@joelthehuman GRRM was very involved in the production of the first seasons, he even wrote some of the episodes, but progressively withdrew to focus more on his writing. A good show is first and foremost about an interesting and engaging story, dialogues that makes sense and characters that are believable. As soon as GRRM was out of the picture, it all turned to shit and all the SFX in the world couldn't save it.

[@mananjoshi1311]

@@FreeGumFighter u damn right

[@alanmt8819]

I remember back in 2012-2013, D & D were praised as one of the best screenwriters in the world due to the enormous success of the GOT. Little did the audience know back then that the whole success of the show was based on the original source material provided by GRRM.

[@ululukululu450]

The excuse that they ran out of books is unforgivable.. I have read fan theories that have 10000 times better ending than the garbage they wrote/directed. And if D&D had issues with time or other commitments, they could've just left the show after 5th season and let someone else more enthusiastic and with more time on their hand finish the show... The way D&D sabotaged the show was nothing short of criminal...

[@AstraLuna-o9i]

They ran GRRM off after season 4. That’s when it become pure unadulterated shit.

[@fellino8049]

Because D&D are basically copying GRRM's work. That's why they were success back in the day GoT still following the books.

[@leilameow9582]

And the show started to show signs of decline since then, what a coincidence.

[@Enowise]

Tbf, they did a really good job adapting the books. A decent amount of scenes and dialogs were added and it really didn't feel forced or anything and they really gave more screentime to deserving characters while developing them a bit. Robert and Cersei scene, Arya and Tywin etc... I agree with every criticism, like the final seasons are not even close to being forgivable. Butchering so many characters and then saying "Expectations subverted" is a fucking insult. Still, like a great king said, a good act does not wash out the bad, nor a bad act the good. They did a good job with the first seasons.

[@khangho4167]

"We wanted parents to love it and people who play professional football to love it" WHAT? what the fuck was that supposed to mean?

[@officialthomasjames]

They are so out of touch with reality I can’t even look at these clowns

[@jesse1086]

He's so bad at writing that he couldn't come up with a better example for "everyone" than families and professional football players.

[@HaohmaruHL]

I wonder if they realize that outside usa no one gives a fuck about handegg..

[@Ben-xq8gg]

It's such a stereotypical view as well, it's not like doing sports and liking fantasy are mutually exclusive

[@DM-it1qf]

A professional NFL footballer actually had a cameo when Dany was burning the city (he was athletically running away, of course) I can’t remember his name from the top of my head, but he hated the final series for how the writing ruined it.

[@sennataylor592]

If D&D were worn out, then they should’ve passed GOT on to new writers. It would’ve saved their reputations and GOT would’ve gotten the proper seasons it deserved.

[@ioannisnavrozidis2733]

But they wouldn't get paid

[@alec1115]

@@ioannisnavrozidis2733 They had other deals in the works with Star Wars, they could collect that money.

[@mattrR678]

They probably thought that people loved GOT so much that they could produce anything and it would be loved.

[@Uryendel]

@@mattrR678 They thought people love GoT because they were good writer and not because the source material was good

[@x123MissAnimeFreakx]

It's likely they wanted to keep their names in the credits until the very end. They really should have passed the show on to writers who would have jumped at the chance to work on GOT and given it the time and effort it deserved. Everything is great about season 8 except the writing. I felt sorry for everyone who gave 110% when D&D produced a script that sound like they wrote it the night before the table-read with the actors. The actors and everyone behind the scenes didn't deserve a script like the one they got. It was embarrassing watching the table-read and seeing the actors die on the inside. It's such a shame.

[@christinawasch4526]

Until my Last breath I will remember what they did to season 8.

[@ToriCake95]

5-8. They didn't just write season 8.

[@elenajohnson2750]

Seven was bad too, and 5 & 6 were just “meh”

[@quincyquincy4764]

The north remembers!

[@novakai6668]

I try to remember all the good times watching GOT with my friends, it was a whole event always brought us together... now this last season left such a bad taste it's barely part of our lives anymore... I did a game of thrones speech at my best friend's wedding for fucks sake and this is what we get!!!

[@DeadlyLazer]

What they did, and why they did it

[@nicolaszan1845]

Oh right, how could I forget that being a parent or playing football takes away your ability to enjoy fantasy, one of the most widespread and historically beloved literary genres of all time

[@YanickaQuilt]

*point to Dune*

[@destroyermaker]

So that's why LOTR bombed

[@corbin101]

That part of the video played right as I read this 😂

[@rorygillmore6555]

Yeah that was arguably the weakest lie I've heard yet from these jackasses

[@cheese90210]

It's over 2 years later and I'm still outraged at how all this ended.

[@summ.3433]

@Just Some Guy without a Mustache Cringe

[@linnarlobe4939]

You’re not alone❤️❤️❤️

[@UnLugubreEquivoco]

Yep. You're not alone

[@joevines3428]

Yeah especially when they could have handed the show over to someone else. We could have got 5 more seasons.

[@karthikkumar8652]

@@joevines3428 haha I still waiting and praying for remake season 8🥺

[@LEARSIKCIGAM]

what *should* have happened HBO- “we want 13 seasons” D&d - “we got 8” HBO -“GTFO”

[@seifyasser2225]

HBO: "Drakarus"

[@CarlinConnolly]

Or after season 5... HBO - we're going to pay George to write the scripts, you can edit but we are going with 12 seasons.... 13 is unlucky if you don't like it then we'll get the Hardhome guy in to take over.

[@anasofyesquivel]

SO SAD!!😞

[@WWESVRGAMER]

HBO would have done 20 seasons without jon, dany, tyrion etc.

[@Krishnakumar-wl7ih]

Difficult to do that considering they were magnificent till ssn 6. Pretty sure fans would have gone berserk if this happened after ssn 6.

[@ioannisnavrozidis2733]

Imaging having Bran as a character, he knows everything that happened, he can be everywhere and you choose to do absolutely nothing with him. You have him sitting around, doing nothing only to deliver a stupid line in the last episode.

[@Akispark]

They most likely had a panic attack and started sucking their thumbs whenever they were faced with complex characters they had to write useful dialogue and actions for. Fuck these dudes.

[@noone8253]

Tbh, I think if they explored Bran more, they could have even used him as a puppeteer behind everything to end safe in the throne for a while as the Three Eyed Raven. I don't know if it would be that good, but at least it could make some sense (?), I mean, just a better execution and the ending wouldn't be that bad.

[@IwinMahWay]

@@noone8253 they could've explained it as the elaborate plan of the previous 3 eyed ravens to put an omniscient and all seeing being to rule to put an end to the imbalance of power, basically breaking the wheel. Much better than any ither tyrant that would be biased or go crazy from time to time.

[@johnr797]

@@IwinMahWay previous 3 eyed ravens?

[@MajoradeMayhem]

It's not just Bran doing nothing. Characters everywhere are just forgetting their skills or failing to apply their knowledge. Arya doesn't try to use her face-changing to kill Cersei, the most obviously helpful thing she could do. Jon fails to display any of the moral leadership and decisiveness he is known for. Tyrion has a full on lobotomy. Varys plots in broad daylight. Sansa has nothing to do but bitch at people. It's all such a massive waste of characters.

[@AllGodsDue]

They strike me as guys who were well-off in upbringing, allowing them to have connections or entry into hollywood and tv. They have such little talent, I can't imagine that they actually impressed their ways to success. I went to school with a guy of such background. He couldn't write a script or plot to save his life, but was always assuring our professors and classmates in my screen writing classes he was going to Hollywood. I was mind blown when he actually had a movie come out, and it was complete trash....Dude was by far the least talented person i'd ever had classes with and yet the only one that I know of that made it, all because of connections.

[@Akva77]

Thats what i say too....connections....i have studied three years at the University still i work at a caring home for elderly people....when i apply for a work they dont even call back :( But lots of people from my univ class got jobs cos of connections and parents with good jobs....unfair!

[@josephp.1919]

Idk which but one of them had a dad that was HEAD of Goldman Sachs. So pretty much born on third base.

[@LordWyatt]

I wanted to be an actor growing up…but in high school I found out how hard it is to get into Hollywood if you’re a Pleb😔

[@MS-ux6ze]

nepotism is exactly how hollywood works unfortunately, almost everytime something is good its basically by accident.

[@grantdillon3420]

Guanxi

[@Mandalor10]

It doesn't bother me that these guys are insanely rich. Money in the end means very little. I do enjoy the fact that everyone agrees that they're hacks and terrible writers. Their legacy will always be one of failure.

[@Jorah123456789]

It is still insane and dare I say unfair how these two are basically set for their lives while other potentially much better writers barely get any recognition. Just another proof that talent and hard work are meaningless without proper network and a bit of luck.

[@thekeeperofpromise]

@@Jorah123456789 I’m sure inflation will take care of their earnings. The important thing is that they have lost the respect of the film and television industry and have virtually zero job security.

[@illyrian9976]

David Benioffs father was a board member at Goldman Sachs. He was rich long before he ever wrote a script (D.B. Weiss probably also)

[@dwight3555]

@@Jorah123456789 I'm just a random guy with no writing experience and I still could write a far better story than what D&D came up with, they simply don't give a shit and wrote it in 10 minutes.

[@SippingVino]

Literally everything they touch is recognized as some of the worst writing you can get in Hollywood

[@baronessvondengler]

I will never get tired of videos like this. Pump the D&D hate into my veins.

[@7GabriEl7FM7]

Hahahaha true!!

[@gaborbanko8373]

same. it's just so fucking bad what they have done, that at least there is a lot of fun in hating it.

[@hype12345]

Same !

[@dcwatcher4644]

Literally just watched like 10 game of thrones hate videos

[@Ikeyy]

“It’s taking over me, it’s slowly kicking in”

[@lucasstranger7743]

Let's be brutally honest season 7&8 are the results of giving d&d too much credit for being glorified copy editors

[@AlbertoFolres]

Couff Couff Patty Jenkins and Wonder Woman Couff Couff

[@peteder4127]

Exactly. As soon as they were expected to create storylines themselves and not merely adapt great storylines to film, they completely shit the bed. Cocky worthless idiots

[@YungM.D.]

The sad thing is David Benioff has talent. His novel 25th Hour and the Spike Lee adaptation are good.

[@ThePipojp]

@@YungM.D. City of Thieves is very good too. Honesstly, in a literary sense these two works might be better than anything Martin has ever written. He just shouldn't have involved himself with a big fantasy saga, when he wrote a x man script It also wasn't good.

[@mr.o8539]

@@ThePipojp did you just say Benioff is better than Martin? Did you actually just do that?

[@Autrya]

It's kind of satisfying to learn about their downfall but it breaks my heart that they are still working. There are so many young talented writers who are desperate for jobs meanwhile these guys keep messing up and keep getting more opportunities and money.... smh

[@darrenpat182]

thats how this world is rigged for the already powerful.

[@willav9267]

I would've waited another 3 years if it meant that the last few seasons had book material.

[@Sickofdrawingcowboys717]

I would have waited until the end.

[@babycabbit]

me fucking TOO.

[@christianc.2664]

Up the VILLA!

[@willav9267]

@@christianc.2664 UTV good lad!

[@Ignisan_66]

There was still a lot of book material but the two fuckwits decided to not adapt it. Read the books and you will know.

[@ArushiArya2001]

They destroyed the show that gave them everything.

[@leonrobinson8180]

They believed their own hype. They genuinely thought their success was due to their efforts and not GRRM's writing. Glad they got humbled by the fandom.

[@terrylandess6072]

People were scratching their heads after Season 5. Rolling their eyes after Season 6. Season 7 was truncated, and then they took a year off before an even shorter Season 8. It must be hard to get up and look in the mirror each morning knowing the opportunity that was tossed aside due to lack of talent and hubris.

[@georgerabotov1730]

Burnt out from what created them

[@markusfus1672]

@@terrylandess6072 i dont like got anymore, just bcs of these 2 idiots

[@kaputasri]

@@leonrobinson8180 So true its like those day traders who think they are genius till they run into an unlucky day only to realise they were just getting lucky till then.

[@than217]

My dad was a big GoT show fan and when he died in early 2019 I thought "damn he won't get to see the finale now" after seeing it I'm glad he didn't have to endure that before dying.

[@solidsnake9898]

I’m sorry for your loss. However, I will say that if I could go back in time and not watch the finale I would. So I kinda agree with you.

[@josend]

calling bullshit on this

[@than217]

@@josend On? My dad dying? Okay uhhhh well I disrespect your opinion. And I hope you have a terrible day. www.hayhurstfuneralhome.com/obituaries/Darwin-Ball/

[@annie10103]

Unfortunately the fans who died after it aired probably got to the afterlife and told him how shit it was. Nobody is safe

[@Vincisomething]

@@josend yikes dude

[@liul]

I find it funny when people assume "parents" don't like fantasy elements in their favorite shows. Like fantasy is a brand new genre only teenagers understand or something. Don't they know about the popularity of "The lord of the rings " back in the day? People have been enjoying fantasy for a long time (since humanity exist, if I have to guess). My love for fantasy started as a teenager in the 80's. I'm now a middle age mom and guess what, fantasy and science fiction are my favorite genres still. They personally know one of the biggest nerds, George Rr Martin, who's kind of old, and they still have this stupid preconceived notion about fantasy?

[@EmmaLPeel]

Also, why get involved with a fantasy series if you don’t like magic or fantasy?

[@OAwesomeO]

its obvious what he is doing... he is deflecting their career ending level of critisim by saying its only the childish and immature audience that feels this way.

[@jenjohnson492]

@@OAwesomeO I interrupted it as dumbing it down for soccer moms and athletes.

[@saberthecoolest]

@@jenjohnson492 possible- I’m certain there were several other ways to broaden the viewership WITHOUT watering down the fantasy aspect

[@malikjohnston3883]

not really sure what he even meant by "parents". was he saying he wanted the show to be more family friendly? as in he wanted parents to be ok with their children watching it? even though it's not a show meant to be watched by children? "kids, leave the room; i don't want you to see Shireen being burned alive, even though that's not gonna happen in the books..."

[@hjhngjvnbh]

I genuinely think the cast itself could’ve written a better final season

[@randallt6628]

They all thought it sucked

[@gristle_licker]

this show is one of rare situations where I can say that I could write a better ending and actually mean it

[@megamovieman101]

Nikolaj Coster-Waldau said D&D stopped listening to cast input on the characters in Season 5, and it shows.

[@erenyeager007]

It's been over a year, and I'm still not over GOT S8

[@goldendovah7613]

I recommend you to read the books. You'll dislike season 5 and 6 after reading Feast and Dance. They omitted so much good shit.

[@Neo587]

I will never be over S8 + S7. My rage is still unbroken. When I come across some articles mentioning the original thirteen seasons suggested by GRRM, I swear a lot. And I'm not that type of guy usually.

[@gaboon7777]

@@goldendovah7613 I’d say don’t even bother with the books. George is never going to finish WoW and Dream of Spring will just be that ...a dream

[@goldendovah7613]

​@@gaboon7777 It's still worth reading imo even if he'll never release the rest of the books.

[@gaboon7777]

@@goldendovah7613 but why tho ? So you can wonder the rest of life what could’ve been ? But I’m not mad at ya . I think some of the ending of show may have been what George was planning and how bad it did has him shaking in his boots . That or he’s written himself into a corner and doesn’t know where to go.

[@carlrood4457]

Actually, Benioff probably got the job because his rich dad is friends with the guy who was in charge of HBO at the time.

[@justinklenk]

Daaaaaamn.

[@atharvatawde3697]

These out of touch born rich people 😡😡😡

[@C0L4T3R4L]

It's not what you know its who you know i guess

[@imperiumoccidentis7351]

@Just White Based. “They hated him because he told the truth”

[@Unnatural09]

Nepotism it is then.

[@haydenlane9600]

I remember I found out about David Benioff’s other work when GoT was still in its prime and I found it encouraging like just because you had a few flops doesn’t mean you can’t have success too. I really should have seen it as a warning of what was to come.

[@ErenJaegerDidNothingWrong]

I love how they are now remembered as the guys who ruined Game of Thrones

[@dannyrodriguez2365]

"We wanted families to love it" I'm sorry *WHAT*

[@spikeannoyed]

I know .... taking out the fantasy element of a show with fucking dragons .... it’s a dragon , we know it’s not real, we can deal with fantasy

[@DillsyYourDaddy67]

@Stella Hohenheim Or that scene where they stab a pregnant lady to death. I remember getting my whole family together to watch that wholesome moment.

[@nlawson2004]

@Isaac EDWARDS There was only one rape, right? Involving Sansa and Ramsey Bolton, which was off screen for the most part. I know one is one too much, I just literally can’t remember any other? Also, who was skinned alive? I remember Theon burning some Winterfell inhabitants. There were also background figures who were tortured at that prison-like location Arya ends up in, when she first encounters that faceless guy. Forgot the name of that place? It was a Lannister stronghold. But no major character was skinned alive that I can remember?

[@nlawson2004]

@Isaac EDWARDS Yeah, I was thinking of that, but there’s so much grey and distortion with that whole scenario. Give me a break. But yes, technically she says _no,_ but he knows his sister better than any of us, on some biblical ish brah. I’m not calling that one, one way or the other. The same goes with Daenerys. Listen, after they either maintain a relationship or grow to develop a relationship, I hesitate to rush to define that as _rape._ I’ll let smarter folks than myself call that. I mean clear and obvious rape, like with Ramsey. That’s what makes GOT so textured and complex. It’s not clear. It’s just not, sorry. In a lot of ways, whether you agree with it or not, ultimately, it’s only rape if the woman involved says it is. That’s 50 plus one percent of it. The other remaining percentage is the objectivity of it all. That’s why I don’t consider those defilement, because ultimately the characters don’t either.

[@nlawson2004]

@Isaac EDWARDS And I still don’t recall who the fuck was flayed? I’m thinking of BTVS season 6 when Dark Willow flays what’s his name, the dude that shot Tara, her girlfriend.

[@jaco3394]

Imagine tanking your own career this hard. They had everything going for them, they could have gotten a job anywhere with people bending over backwards to accommodate them, and their own arrogance ruined it for them.

[@johnr797]

@Victor Tronin they didn't? Did they walk around with blindfolds on?

[@Gibsonsg527]

At least I'm happy thier own arrogance killed thier careers.

[@abcdc197]

They made lot of money, they won't make anymore in the movie industry but if they invest smart they are set. They techically won at the end. They managed to get into positions they've no merit to be in and profited of it. For that i admire them. Can't really blame them rather than those who allowed them to be there.

[@DustinJCook]

That's a great point. If they had just let other writers work, or passed the torch to new showrunners and gone and done the Disney stuff, everything would have been fine. It was their own hubris. Like a castle falling down on top of two main characters...

[@anon2427]

@@abcdc197 failing upwards😂

[@Omosisthefuture]

They stated that half the reason they wanted to make the show was for the red wedding. They stated how there were individual moments that blew their mind. That’s part of the problem. They didn’t see the whole story. They only saw massive cool looking moments that subverted expectations. They heard Dany burns King’s Landing and only cared about the shocking moment. They didn’t care about developing Dany properly to reach that moment. They didn’t care about any pacing at all. They heard Bran becomes king and didn’t care about showing his true journey to get there. They didn’t care about letting each lord and lady from each house connect with Bran and gain enough respect and trust for him to bend the knee. That’s why it feels undeserving. Literally nobody outside the north had any reason to kneel to Bran. He didn’t do anything for many houses to see but act as night king bait. They heard Arya stops the white walkers and didn’t care about making it believable. They just had her run right by his entire army to kill him, because they didn’t care about anything besides the “wow she stabbed the night king” moment. They heard Jon kills Dany and didn’t care about developing both of them. They are ice and fire. Their romance is what the story was going towards. They didn’t care about the journey for those two. They only cared about the “wow Jon just killed Dany” moment. The red wedding was so impactful because of the story leading up to it. It wasn’t just subverting expectations and being shocking. The story is what everybody on earth cared about most except the writers of the show.

[@VinaykanthK]

very well framed

[@jivet3919]

Same problem with the Star Wars sequels. No respect for the story, they just wanted to make cool scenes

[@catatoblob8598]

The crazy thing for me is that there are plenty of successful works out there with a big focus on epic moments and not much complex world building. No writer HAS to focus on the parts of writing that they don't enjoy. DB and DBW had plenty of works to choose from that actually play into their strengths, and yet they utterly overestimated their own writing capabilities.

[@KaiSoDaM]

Damn, that's the most impressive summary on how those guys mind where focused. Makes 100% sense

[@Blakenew127]

ON POINT

[@popularcc4539]

You know, it's kind of funny how Benihoff's dad was Chairman of the New York Federal Reserve Bank in 2008 (at the same time as being on the board of Goldman Sachs, which was crazy unethical) and used his position to personally benefit from the 2008 crash...and yet David Benihoff still manages to be the most hated member of his family.

[@yeetnama9094]

@@gatsbygoodwood2575 OYYY VEY...ANUDDA SHOAH

[@anon2427]

Wow crazy, a zogged person working high up in media despite not having the talent to be there? Who would’ve thought…

[@iliayriev9256]

Jurn damn bew

[@nabila5522]

LOOOL

[@1992zorro]

Just see the episode where Dany is giving a Nuremberg speech to her army. It's like all of them have this checklist to make us remember how much they suffered during that time.

[@afc_brandon]

Let's be honest here. They didn't "walk away" from Star Wars. They most definitely got fired, and Disney gave them the courtesy of saying it was a "mutual agreement". The situation is exactly what they deserve. They were two petty men with fragile egos that preferred short-term pettiness and ended with longterm consequences. Not fully, of course seeing as they still got a $200m deal from Netflix; but this world isn't always fair. They LOVED to flex their power. They took their negative reputation on set in stride and enjoyed the fear they would instill on the cast; the infamous "dinner call" that the cast talked about. If D&D invited you to dinner, your character was finished. I recall them once telling a story on tv that they would use that reputation to scare various members into thinking their characters were getting killed off. Furthermore, how they treated Emilia Clarke and Kit Harington says a lot about these two narcissists. When it comes to Kit - it was literally nothing more than David Benioff being petty because his wife found Kit Harington attractive and publicly admitted to a reporter that she found him attractive. This was back in 2015, when Season 6 should have started filming. What happened in Season 6 and onward? Nothing but Jon Snow degradation. Minimal/idiotic dialogue and stabs at his character from others in the show. He has a small pecker, and he's overall small. Jesus, how many times did we hear about how small Jon Snow was? As for Emilia Clarke, she started to stand up for herself - and that's a big no no. We know she was taken advantage of in Season 1 as an up and coming actress, performing as nude as possible for the cameras. If you think she was naked too much in Season 1, then thank Jason Momoa because he protected her from the writers and directors from trying to get her to get more naked than was shown. And as the years passed, Emilia Clarke started taking other roles in Hollywood and was being respected. So, she put her foot down and she paid the ultimate price for it in the end - the assassination of her character. Listen, whether you think Dany was going to go crazy or not is not the argument - it's with how they went about it and basically forced Emilia to find out on her own what route Daenerys would take. She didn't know Daenerys' fate until she was emailed the script, along with the rest of the cast. She said that she felt numb and devastated when she had finished reading it. Kit Harington didn't even read the script until the entire cast got together, and even he was devastated with the reveal of events. For a plot point that was apparently planned and known about for years (doubt), them not revealing it to Emilia Clarke was pretty shitty. Especially considering that Emilia would preach about Daenerys with pride and happiness, unaware to what would eventually become. However, the most damning evidence of their nature would be in regards to Ian McElhinney (the actor of Ser Barristan Selmy). Ian was disappointed in his character's fate and wrote a letter to D&D expressing how he thought it was a mistake to kill Ser Barristan so early on and that the character still had much to offer both to the show and as Daenerys' advisor (people who've read the books know that Ian was spitting nothing but FACTS). How did Dan and Dave respond to this letter? By going public and on tv, mocking the letter to an audience and smugly saying, "the letter just made us want to kill off the character even more." They just can't handle that they're nobodies and have zero talent for writing. When Nikolaj Coster-Waldau would bring grievances about Jaime Lannister's character and how he thought they were going the wrong way about it, these two assholes would just brush him off and say that the would take it into consideration, ie "shut up and act. Let us do the thinking." I have no sympathy for these two whatsoever.

[@aidenallen4965]

Thank you for taking the time to write this 🙏. Highlights how narcissistic these two assholes really are!

[@BIastwave.]

Perfectly written

[@paulinenavarrete123]

👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻

[@Nostalgia_Addict]

Wow. I knew they were stupid and terrible writers but didn't know they were toxic, narcississtic and vengeful.

[@HariKrishnan-kx1is]

You could see how much it hurt Emelia even during the table reads and promotional events before Season 8. She was just being professional and holding it in. Danaerys was such a unique and complex character and what they did to her is unforgivable.

[@EldenLord.]

Only thing that has been consistantly good throughout all the seasons was Ramin Djawadis soundtrack.

[@orfeaskoukoumis5877]

And the acting my friend. It needs unbelivable acting skills to play good in Season 7-8 and yet we had some great acting moments.

[@Hamppariranskis]

@@orfeaskoukoumis5877 which makes me even more pissed when I think about it. Some of the greatest acting performances, incredibly talented people who got screwed over.

[@orfeaskoukoumis5877]

​@@Hamppariranskis Seriously deserving an award for staring at a window an entire season is the most brilliant and disrespectful thing i can imagine for an actor

[@sistersofthegeek5895]

So true! Ramin's score is actually the only thing I "rewatch" 😅👌

[@sistersofthegeek5895]

@@orfeaskoukoumis5877 Also true! Some moments were unbearable to act!

[@8Trails50]

I feel like the decisions made by D&D cannot be understated: - They came up with the one of the most rushed endings of all time, ignoring all the stories and plotlines given to them at that point. Ruining rewatchability and wiping the show clean from our memories - this undoubtedly probably had an effect on martins motivation to complete his books. I mean he gave d&d the ending which im sure they followed in the seasons. The problem is the reception was so bad im sure it impacts his motivation on the project - the biggest issue is their pride. They felt like they were bigger than the show and the books. So they rushed together some piece of crap. Rather than giving up their role to some other writers which would have extended the show to 13 seasons and given it the ending it deserved, they chose to rush it because they felt they were the reason for its success. I truly hope they never get a chance to work on something like this again. You cant have pride and arrogance impact the good of a project that peoples have poured their time and energy in (the author, the actors, fans).

[@arlet101]

Imagine all the hard-working aspiring writers: taking classes, courses, books, working hours and hours on their craft, not submitting a single page until they go through it a thousand times, taking the little money they have for an editor AND these two get high positions?? I mean how?? just how is this possible?? Hollywood gets literally a million of manuscripts from writers everyday and these two are the ones who get chosen??? and no, don't tell me these two write better than a 15-year-old taking a creative class. I'm pretty sure at best it's the same level.

[@TheaTheGenius]

Money my man. Benioff's dad owns Goldmand Sachs and if I'm not mistaken, was friends with the head of HBO when they got the job. So its not a stretch to say that they paid off someone to get where they're at.

[@fftere]

Like in every other business, meritocracy is an illusion. You can fly only if you have the right connections, talent is not a rare resource... you said it yourself. The friends's son is or family members are.

[@DynastyLuminous46]

@@toomeowstream3253 Or fucking murder a billionaire today.

[@bndllama9067]

It's a big club, and WE ain't in it.

[@DiabolicalApostle]

Benioff actually can write well, though. He's written two well received novels as well as the screenplays for The 25th Hour and The Kite Runner. Whether it's creative burnout or avarice that made him wrap up Game of Thrones like a last minute homework assignment is anyone's guess.

[@lucgh2007]

"We wanted to appeal to professional football players..." WTF does that even mean??!! LMAO

[@rebeccab1808]

Quarterback Aaron Rodgers was obsessed with GOT and extremely disappointed in the ending 😂

[@yossarian00]

They wanted the show to appeal to as many people as possible, from all sorts of life. This meant that they dumbed down to show for easier watching, less attention needed to get what's going on, and also more haha funny dialog. Completely alienating the mass audience they'd gathered since the show's start. This is a very common way for shows to end in mainstream media. Easier to follow and understand, less work for the writers, and more people watching anyway. And it starts to become pretty obvious why they made the cunt decisions they did. It's why character interactions that actually lead the plot took the sideline of sidelines because they got replaced by funny banter and a linear pre-written plot for them to be strung along. I will never stop being annoyed.

[@MadDunhill]

it just means they didn't want the show to be just for nerds.

[@IdealConflict]

“We want jocks to like us, not just nerds”

[@danmor2349]

They're saying "only nerds and geeks like fantasy - we want it appeal to cool folks too" ... totally out of touch with reality.

[@GiniroTsuki]

Hearing D&D talking about wanting to take out the fantasy elements so that "parents" and "professionals" can enjoy it just shows that they, along with many other "writers", think that fantasy is a lesser genre compared to others. I'm so sick of fantasy being considered juvenile and/or lesser. It is an amazing genre that allows for so many different and exciting things. Screw off with your holier than thou attitude.

[@justice4144]

That whole topic made me barf. It is true that you have fiction and non-fiction people, but GOT already overthrew all that by being as big as it got in the first seasons. Why the fuck did they want to change a set genre while that was a major part of the whole premise to begin with?!!?!?! I know jocks, parents and professionals that all loved GOT, and I knew the typical nerds and shut-ins that hated GOT. Everyone is different and the want to appeal to an even bigger audiance by simplifying the entire plot is just so fucking dumb and greedy. I HATE THEM

[@LAK_770]

Tolkien literally wrote an essay on this exact topic that any competent fantasy writer should be familiar with. Even disregarding that, just have some basic respect for the genre. Lol you’re ‘burned out’, cry me a river - you’re soft. You’re being paid millions to do a dream job. These two are complete twats. Literally hostile to the source material. So clueless and smug. I wasn’t even a GoT fan but their conduct was so awful that it made me care.

[@kiltmaster7041]

People like this look down on Tolkien, Martin and Sanderson. From what fucking pedestal?

[@jdecker7]

Also they were taking fantasy out of a series so they could work on the lightsaber samurai movie

[@jacedjohnson3541]

They are basically responsible for the clegane bowl bros

[@alegend2337]

Imagine how even more insanely popular this show would have been if they had decided to break it down into more seasons, during the pandemic.

[@ululukululu450]

I find the "no book" reason for the downfall of the show utterly bizarre and nonsensical. And if D&D had issues with time or other commitments, they could've just left the show after 5th season and let someone else more enthusiastic and with more time on their hand finish the show... Bet there are 100s if not 1000s of writers/directors who would've grabbed the opportunity to finish one of HBO's biggest money-maker show. The way D&D sabotaged the show was nothing short of criminal... Absolutely criminal. HBO should've kicked them out after season 6 which already was magnitude of orders worse than Season 5.

[@mxm4587]

It still makes me sad thinking that this show could have had 13 seasons.

[@Foekjoe]

Yeah. Even if they cut it down to like 10 seasons or even 8 really really good seasons would've been good for me. Even if they cut some awesome characters out or changed here and there like in season 1-4. But the fact that from season 5 onwards it started getting worse and worse. And it's forever ruined. They can't reshoot S7-8. They can't reshoot the whole story (imo that would be very wierd since 1-4 are amazing, 5-6 is fine, had some amazings stuff, some meh stuff). I don't think it'll be every done again. The current story of GoT is forever ruined.

[@MajoradeMayhem]

I think 13 seasons would have been pushing it too far for the actors. But making the final seasons so short, removing episodes, is actually insane.

[@TheZakanater]

it's like HBO rome all over again

[@desmondd1984]

It's silly to think they could have kept the actors for 13 seasons. Everyone was exhausted by s8.

[@vinnie245]

@@TheZakanater Not really, Rome was cancelled due to financial reasons, HBO wanted to keep GoT going, D & D just wanted out.

[@jorgediaz4742]

So the moral of the story is never watch anything related with D&D

[@jeankristen.thestallion.5489]

😂😂😂😂 Yeah

[@almierae4914]

that and The Last Airbender movie

[@jannisfaber]

troy has its moments

[@dmp1520]

@@jannisfaber it was unbelievably cheesy , all the corny ham fisted ott elements of got are right there. whatever moments it has its due only to the strength of its actors.

[@aylix2137]

Troy is my one of my favorite movies, but I will admit the writing is easily its weakest point. I’m a sucker for epic history films

[@weeevan3078]

D&D need to do the walk of shame like Cersei did, LOL

[@MehdiQorbani-jh4fz]

Shame, shame, shame

[@maxlin3721]

Agree!!

[@leonrobinson8180]

I'd give my left nut to stone them with ASOIAF books

[@theblackdaria_]

SHAME!

[@krioni86sa]

my poop collection will not in vain then. i stored them in jar waiting to be thrown at d&d

[@khfan4life365]

D&D reminds me of a quote from a certain abridged series. The quote is: “Screw the rules, I have money.” That’s exactly why D&D got so far in Hollywood. They were able to disregard all the rules of telling a story and got far because they come from money. Nepotism rules Hollywood.

[@steveobrien3738]

YOU MEAN TO TELL, THEY COULD OF GIVEN THE SHOW TO SOMEONE ELSE 😭 AND THEY SAID NO 💀

[@dmarti11235]

Worse yet, as popular as GoT was, they could have gotten anyone they wanted at the helm. Even with the same exact endgame, we could have gotten there so much better.

[@rrraynoorrr]

*have

[@pbb3237]

I cant believe HBO just let these dumbasses single-handedly ruin this series, like if they express that they are tired of this just fire them and put people that care about this series. Problem solved

[@JayBenjamin9214]

This was the bit that enraged me too!

[@theblackdaria_]

This along with 13 seasons is the biggest disappointment& news from this video. That petition needs to be taken seriously… we need a re-do.

[@thomascharlton7394]

"Dany kinda forgot about the Iron Fleet" is much funnier when you know David said it, not Daniel Weiss

[@Author_SoftwareDesigner]

Why?

[@thomascharlton7394]

@@Author_SoftwareDesigner Danny is short for Daniel

[@Author_SoftwareDesigner]

@@thomascharlton7394 😂😂

[@KazumiShiunsai]

When they said they toned down the 'fantasy' side of the show to appeal to other ppl is like wtf, are we still in high school?

[@midwings00]

The show began with the whitewalker stuff...the very first scene.....

[@michaelking2857]

@@midwings00 that scene instantly captivating me lol. This is awful lol

[@nekomochi486]

They thought they were making Riverdale.

[@phillewis2630]

It's almost like they just see people as two-dimensional stereotypes. Then again, that would explain the writing for the characters in the final seasons...

[@mr.tutelloni]

I am baffled by this since seasons 7 and 8 had more fantasy elements than before even

[@blakefitzgerald1170]

Imagine having the full backing of HBO and not going all out to make a masterpiece.

[@ssj4rit]

And being paid millions of dollars for it.

[@yarik7432]

I hope if George R R Martin will ever finish his books, they will reboot the series, with normal writers.

[@stevem2323]

@Zsuzsanna Varga Maybe they can make something like Clone Wars.

[@margarethmichelina5146]

@@stevem2323 Well, I heard HBO want to make a prequel about The Targaryens without those two dumbasses. So, hopefully it's like how Dave Filoni saved Star Wars by giving it Clone Wars TV Show and The Mandalorians.

[@gotfan7743]

If you are alive perhaps in 2060 then GOT will be remade. Not just GOT, even Lord of the rings and other popular stories. Why? because it is damn hard to get a original script these days. Look at how Hollywood these days reboots the old films. Yes sometime in future this series will be remade.

[@firstlast-oo1he]

@Dom Fun fact: the showrunner was the guy who directed several episodes of GoT (particularly some of the bigger battles, like the battle of the bastards, hardhome, the long night, and The Bells), Miguel Sapochnick.

[@firstlast-oo1he]

@@gotfan7743 I don't think the issue is with finding original ideas, I think a lot of it just has to do with people trying to protect their jobs (because, you know, this isn't a stable career), and demanding audiences/investors (if everyone hates these remakes and reboots and sequels and prequels and adaptations, here's an idea -- *_DON'T FUCKING SPEND MONEY TO SEE IT, DON'T GIVE THEM YOUR MONEY, VOTE WITH YOUR WALLET_* , problem solved. But the reality is people DO love those movies, so Hollywood is incentivized to make more).

[@Alexwhatisit]

The last 2 seasons should have proved, it wasn't them, it was George's source material that made that series great.

[@thomasmills339]

George wrote 7 and 8 with them . Moron

[@Alexwhatisit]

@@thomasmills339 no he didn't, he's been pretty vocal.about being shut out of the writing process for the last seasons.

[@dmarti11235]

​@@thomasmills339 He pretty much only gave them a vague outline of where he was going with the story. The writing was all D&D.

[@Islandkid679]

And it's his damnable procrastination that has ensured no one will take any further interest even if WoW is ever published...how long does it take to finish up a series ffs...

[@AnaPerez-jh4qg]

Exactly! And you can literally SEE the diffence in the show when GRRM left the project (I think the last episode he help on direct and write was the purple wedding.) Like from season 5 you can FEEL the difference, which a lot of us choose to not really mind it because they still had the books, which made it somewhat good. But I remember that I was FUMING (still am) when they choose to cut out so many important characters. I mean the WHOLE Dorne and Martell storyline was ruined, when its so fucking cool in the books + other storylines that were introduced in book 5 that are so Fucking important and interesting. D&D really did ruined a fucking fantastic show.

[@feudalanarchy4470]

This vid should be called the Trial of David and Dan.

[@Iron-Bridge]

Should they be allowed Trial by combat?

[@mckennalauren]

@@Iron-Bridge absolutely but only if they’re sir bronn of the blackwater

[@Maazitung]

@@Iron-Bridge Who are we to decide for the Gods so yes, they should. But unfortunately, they would probably be able to buy themselves an OP champion with that sweet $200mil Netflix paid them :/

[@dantefromdevilmaycry9857]

@@Iron-Bridge Only under the condition of fighting The Mountain barefisted

[@thanell1373]

I’m so jealous of them I wish I could be terrible in my work and be paid millions to do it

[@KneelB4Bacon]

Every time D&D make a writing decision, the gods flip a coin.

[@justinklenk]

... And somehow it always comes up Tails.

[@Player-kg1ds]

@@justinklenk actually it was mostly coming up heads at the start cuz Lord GRRM was guiding the coin but then he quit and they started getting tails a bit too often...

[@jesse1086]

And everytime it lands a heroic slave freeing queen with a heart of gold commits genocide.

[@jada9401]

My red flag was whenever they made euron a popstar medieval guy

[@christinawasch4526]

His Look was Like: Meeting at 3 with cersei and afterwards my chemical romance concert.

[@Degamer422]

Would it have really hindered the budget that much to give him a damn eyepatch,Correct me if I’m wrong but the whole point of the iron islands is “what if Pirates had a kingdom to themselves” to an extent the way he’s described in the box is the epitome of that Concept.

[@ThaRedPitbull]

I had no idea who Euron was so I didn't think much of his character in the show but once I read a book with him in it I realized the travesty. That guy kind of reminds me of Davy Jones from the Pirate movies. He was mysterious, intimidating, and nothing to mess with.

[@christinawasch4526]

@Ryanator man yeah, the Horn Thing was so creepy and I also loved the theory that daario and euron are actually the Same Person.

[@Bayard1503]

Oh, so late?? Mine was in Season 2 when they were comparing Stannis with a hardcore Republican.. and when they completely scrapped one of the best arcs in that book, the Night's Watch rangers being hunted by the Wildlings... That's when I started paying attention to their inside the episode and I was blown away how silly and stereotypical was their thinking

[@lovleen]

They were never good at writing, they took the material from the books and when the book material was done, the show got worse, season 4 was the peak of GOT

[@lyampetit144]

@antoine griezzman If you aren't able to properly finish the books or if you think it's too big or too complicted, you gave it to someone else. And you wait until you find someone better

[@lordofcastamere9376]

Season 4 has it's problems but overall was good. Yara sailing around Dorne to save Theon but chased away by Ramsay's dogs, not including Tysha as a reason to kill Tywin, Arya with the hound filler and the fight with Brienne vs Hound was awful, I really missed the more detailed version of the battle at the wall. And they never ran out of source material, they did not adapt Feast or Dance at all. Like only 25 chapters out of 120 chapters

[@ThumbsUpMike]

And not to mention, GRRM was involved heavily in the writing process from season 1-4 Then GRRM was out of the writing production from season 5-8 Game of Thrones would've went down as the best TV show in history if it was given to proper writers who actually cared about the show, FUCK D&D.

[@lovleen]

@antoine griezzman They were not decent, they had other people writing with them before and GRRM was guiding them. Benioff wrote the X-Men Origins movie which is the worst X-Men movie. I read the first book of GOT and they literally just took out the quotes and scenes straight from the book. When they rushed past all the source material after season 4 and 5, the truth came out and you could see the decline in quality

[@hornynator]

@@lovleen you should read the other books too. The end of season 4 is the end of book 3, the other 2 books are barely adapted...

[@richardjohnson9543]

The existence and quality of HOTD is proof that D&D could've simply stepped back into exec producer roles and let someone else handle the day to day stuff on GOT. I don't doubt how time consuming and exhausting the job was but to handle it this way was SO wrong. Their slide back into obscurity is much deserved

[@tenukipcgaming1896]

2D "backed out" of the Star Wars deal like Bran backed out of that window.

[@JDizzle785]

Hahaha this is exactly what I was thinking

[@Ealsante]

"The things I do for money" -- Disney, before giving the shove

[@otto_jk]

@The Creator And Rian Johnson got atleast mixed reception with The Last Jedi instead of the overwhelmingly negative reception D&D got with the last season of GoT

[@fakeplaystore7991]

Being passionate at writing garbage is even worse than being a soulless cash grabber. REEEan Johnson is much worse than Friedman and Weiss.

[@vsGoliath96]

@The Creator Rian Johnson makes fine movies when he's not asked to work with an existing IP. His try at Star Wars was terrible and nonsensical because he wanted to take Star Wars in a weird new direction that clashed heavily with the themes of the series. The stuff he makes on his own though? He's done some good shit!

[@MaynightMemory]

A year or two before the show ended I watched a rather long KZbin video about a possible ending for GoT that some fan had just made up. I sat there crying because it was so good and I was so touched - it was a perfect bittersweet ending that brought most story arcs to a satisfying conclusion. And I'm 100% sure there are so many fans out there with no actual writing experience for TV shows but who read all the books and are super dedicated to the show who could have written a far better ending than the actual one.

[@jacksonosborne8380]

Can you link that video?

[@MaynightMemory]

@@jacksonosborne8380 I would love to but I can't find it anymore! I searched my entire KZbin history for it after the show ended but I can't find it anymore :(

[@FaV1]

@@MaynightMemory There are a lot of these out there but here is one that made me cry my eyes out, it was so intense and beautifl and what we deserved: kzbin.info/www/bejne/i3vEemxrlKaHrZI

[@leonrobinson8180]

Doomcock's ending was pretty good too

[@sunshineslowking5025]

"We didn't want to just appeal to fantasy fans, we also wanted parents to love it-" Are you freaking kidding me?

[@fatfrankthepeteacher4237]

They are so stupid. Unbelievable.

[@forksssss8483]

It’s a fucking fantasy show 😃

[@ScotchTapeMafia]

Apparently parents are incapable of being fantasy fans. Wtf

[@comeatmebro8120]

That's the dumbest shit I've ever heard. Parents already made up a major part of the GoT fanbase, y'know, because it's a show geared towards adults

[@tenukipcgaming1896]

So ... Season 8 was their attempt to appeal to adults?

[@transformersrevenge9]

I hated the show since season 5, and everyone called me crazy. Then late season 7 and all of season 8, people suddenly started to see things differently.

[@mrhoplite2931]

Same here. Season 4 still was okish, but from season 5 on it was getting worse and worse. And noticably so.

[@MRKIKE44]

@@mrhoplite2931 season 4 okish? was got peak if you ask me, after that the downhill began

[@DrMuffin1080]

Still a massive fan of 5 and 6. U can’t deny the masterpieces like Hardhome, WoW, and Battle of the Bastards

[@transformersrevenge9]

@@DrMuffin1080 And yet I will deny them. Those are no masterpieces in my book. It's all empty spectacle, supported by bad writing.

[@RH-nk7eo]

S5 was definitely where we started to see a drop in quality. I had this weird feeling like trying to forgive the show but deep down wondering why it's getting so bad. S6 introduced the Hollywood style plot armour and that's when I realised the main characters won't die anymore. By S8 I was basically just watching it for the ending. Wish I hadn't!

[@mitchconner2021]

I really do wonder what rich CEO or executive Benioff is related to. There's no way you fail that much in Hollywood without getting spit out without knowing the right people

[@pplr1]

Goldman Sachs Exec is his dad.

[@mitchconner2021]

@@pplr1 Fucking called it.. I didn't even care to loom it up you can just tell with some of these types of people. Maybe its by the way they talk?

[@pplr1]

@@mitchconner2021 Not sure but you read it right.

[@vinsanity3510]

Benioff’s career is what happens when nepotism is regarded over the art.

[@aplusrecommends9406]

who is he related to?

[@Steeksify]

@@aplusrecommends9406 IIRC his father owns Goldman Sach's.

[@Nostalgia_Addict]

Certain people are firmly in control of Hollywood. They own it.

[@eshai27]

@@Nostalgia_Addict They control industries and let their children and relatives run it. Hollywood, oil, politics, media, entertainment, banking etc.

[@AyataHiragi]

@@aplusrecommends9406 He changed his lastname, his real last name is Friedman.

[@JB-mb6lm]

Never forget and never forgive Dan and Dave. Never allow them to work again

[@Levi-rc8kh]

@Just Some Guy without a Mustache Addressing the greedy and terrible qualities of these writers is not cancel culture. It's called legit criticism to prevent them from ruining future projects.

[@Levi-rc8kh]

@Just Some Guy without a Mustache How tf am I a Nazi? Nazis were people who oppressed and segregated Jewish people through horrible and unjustifiable acts of inhumanity. I'm simply a guy who acknowledges the fact that Dumb and Dumber are disgusting writers. I'm not interfering in other peoples lives by pointing out extremely obvious flaws that are ones done out of corporate greed.

[@leonpaelinck]

the north remembers

[@JB-mb6lm]

@Just Some Guy without a Mustache no.

[@jonataspereira1691]

@Just Some Guy without a Mustache How hard did you get hit in the head?

[@appropriate-channelname3049]

David and Dan Actually led the charge to try and get game of thrones put onto the screen. Initially they worked their asses off but unfortunately with success came complacency and then came boredom. I got to give them credit for getting the show off thr ground. I also though blame them for not stepping back when their hearts where not in it. After season 5 they should have scouted for new show runners and fresh writers had them join the production and then lay the mantle on their shoulders and just stay on as regular producers.

[@angrytom1923]

Hard to believe anyone would hire them after GOT. Their names are Mudd at this point and anything they're attached to is going to be approached with EXTREME caution if not outright dismissal by the viewing public.

[@justinlevy274]

Adding them to my list with Michael Bay and JJ Abrams.

[@mozes6305]

I fear that they're so rich that they don't need another job honestly

[@leonrobinson8180]

@@justinlevy274 At least you know what you're getting with Michael Bay. Dumb, flashy fun at makes tons of money. Jar Jar Abrams is a pretentious hack

[@margarethmichelina5146]

@@justinlevy274 At least Michael Bay and JJ Abrams tried with their own way. Michael Bay ever directed The Rock movie starring Nicolas Cage and Sean Connery and is one of the best movie he ever made and fun fact, he was directed the Got Milk? Commercial with Aaron Burr and that was his debut. Honestly, JJ Abrams is not a bad director, he directed Super 8 which honestly one of the underrated movie and produced Cloverfields and his Star Trek movies are not bad either. Episode 7 has a lot of potential but if he continued Episode 8 and Episode 9, it would be the best trilogies ever. Episode 9 is basically just JJ tried to fix Rian Johnson's mistake but it still failed.

[@ohdannyboy4727]

They said in an old interview that they were only interested in making up to the red wedding. So they were in it for 3 seasons. They just checked out after that and collected the HBO money. This video is great, just summed it all up. We were this close to greatness and these guys just wanted to bounce. The privilege is strong with those two walnuts.

[@D.Rodrigues_18]

D&D kinda forgot about how to make s8

[@jaxsetbertoncarlism8873]

Season 8 was no worse than seasons 5-7

[@D.Rodrigues_18]

@@jaxsetbertoncarlism8873 maybe in your opinion but s8 In my opinion was the worst plus it was the last one so that just makes it worse

[@lordofcastamere9376]

@@jaxsetbertoncarlism8873 Season 5-7 are 1/10, season 8 is negative 1000/10

[@D.Rodrigues_18]

@@lordofcastamere9376 exactly but maybe not too harsh on s 5-7 cause they had some really good episodes/moments

[@lyampetit144]

@@D.Rodrigues_18 Yes, but one or two goods episodes doesn't make a season good

[@gpeddino]

Seasons 1-4: greatly adapted literature, focused on intrigue, well-developed characters and impressive worldbuilding. Seasons 5-8: mediocre TV, fed on star power, stereotypes, technical proficiency and mindless spectacle.

[@ZBM-jj1xr]

@@twelvethrower24 Exactly, I noticed a difference in my reactions to the endings of the seasons. Season 6 ended on some solid episodes, so I was bummed about having to wait so long for season 7. When season 7 ended I was pretty meh about the whole thing and didn't really care anymore about the wait. When season 8 started I got mildly excited again because I was naive in thinking they would pull out all the stops for the end of the series. Boy, that did not quite go the way I thought it would...

[@notribadsvault]

Seasons 5-6 weren’t great, but 7-8 were a different level of awful in a league of it’s own.

[@marionarda2790]

@@notribadsvault i think 6 was better than 5 . The drop between 4 and 5 was huge . 6 was an improvement ( but problems already appeared ) . 7 was bad . 8 even worse and the end of 8 was complete shit to inimaginable levels

[@glorygloryholeallelujah]

I wonder how often the *”big wigs”* at _HBO_ fall asleep crying-knowing they would’ve owned the *worlds most popular tv show,* during lockdowns...if only they hadn’t allowed D&D to *tank it.* 🤣❤️

[@glorygloryholeallelujah]

@@One.Zero.One101 I’m still totally baffled as to why they let it happen! It’s not like they lost the support of GRRM -and d&d would’ve been extremely easy to replace!

[@leonrobinson8180]

@@glorygloryholeallelujah I guess they trusted them. They'd never sabotage their cash cow. Right?

[@thomasparkin259]

@@leonrobinson8180 which is reasonable, D&D had been doing a decent job, apparently. And what sort of fools would be hasty and botch the most important work of their lives?

[@brydonthunder]

​@@glorygloryholeallelujah Remember they had made season 1-4 as well so HBO had faith in them to atleast do a decent job on the final seasons of GoT. Looking back at the time it would of made sense considering how good it was so far. Remember hindsight is 20/20

[@glorygloryholeallelujah]

@@brydonthunder oh I totally understand their faith in the duo…. It’s their willingness to let their cash-cow END, that baffles me!! That’s simply not a -same- sane or normal business practice….to eliminate your TOP product-just because the *managers* of the product are bored (basically). Not the “creator” of the product, he’s still totally “down to clown”…..the managers. It still makes my brain hurt. Lol

[@halflucan]

I was laughing out loud at "Bran the Broken" And Tyrion trying to make it sound like a person with that name would be the leader of the free world :')

[@30noir]

Meh a lot of kings had unflattering titles. Also 'leader of the free world' is a nonsense title used by ignorant yanks.

[@DeanduMClarence]

Cringed when he said it, it’s the kind of name a school kid comes up with when another kid has an obvious impairment or difference about them.

[@jaguarenduda]

@@30noir spot-on.

[@comeatmebro8120]

I can imagine Bran in the background like "Dude, the fuck?"

[@davidgill3356]

Leader of the “free” world....in an absolute monarchy?

[@tauseefsalam5724]

It's like they were born to destroy book adaptions.

[@jenstallaksen4289]

Adapton*

[@tauseefsalam5724]

@@jenstallaksen4289 damn I feel dumb now.

[@Creationweek]

Book adaptions are the only thing they are good at season 1-4 were amazing, but once they stopped having the books to build from they FAIL when they have to write

[@farisabubakar6118]

They're not destroying the books, they just proving the success is because the source material, when they have to write their own materials, they're wack

[@KabbalahSherry]

The 3 Body Problem is one of the best Sci-fi stories EVER written... and Netflix is letting D&D develop it?! 🤦🏻‍♀️😣 Why can't we have anything nice anymore???

[@leilameow9582]

Netflix now wants all of China to hate them as well lol ..well won’t speak too soon until it comes out but based on their track record I’m not expecting anything good.

[@matthewsmith6929]

Imagine how george feels, 25 years after book one released, so 30 years since first idea, he may feel burned out, but loves the content and CHARACTERS. You freaking hacks

[@rockomax4284]

To be fair, George also has a large part in the blame. Why sell the rights of a story that's not finished and not have a contract that allows him to have executive rights for the final product.

[@user-zo5jo3ox5g]

George doesn’t get off the hook for this either, he’s clearly a lazy guy and has had plenty of time to finish. Yet, a single book hasn’t come out since the show even started 10 years ago

[@airwaters]

@@rockomax4284 tbf, Harry Potter began movie adaptations with only three books, so the story ain't finish yet when it is created in live action. I think his biggest flaw is not moving the books forward while the series are in its early seasons, not the granting of rights while the books were unfinished. If he just move the books forward, then S8 might probably have just some decent dialogues than "I duhn wun it" or "youre mah queen". Sad, really, GOT became an unfair victim of incompetence in both the original author and screenwriters.

[@persephonehades7547]

@@airwaters I say we shouldn't blame George RR Martin for how D&D handled the final season. Just because the books aren't complete doesn't mean he doesn't have a plot outline, and he most certainly DID have one to give to D&D. D&D going off-script or rushing it doesn't mean it's George RR Martin's fault. To put it in perspective, it's like saying the person who invented/discovered electricity is at fault for a house burning down from an idiot messing with wires. Besides, even if the book series was complete, it wouldn't change D&D's actions. They would still make poor writing calls, they would still be offered deals from other companies that would make them want to wrap up GOT as quickly as possible, and they would still be too selfish to let other showrunners/writers pick it up.

[@thegreenmage6956]

@@persephonehades7547 don’t forget the quality drop begins post-season 5, season 6 having some highlights, but decreasing quality until trash from there.

[@JustALemurGuy]

It's kinda sad that Dumb & Dumber tried to play down the fantasy element because GoT was literally a show that could be used as an introduction into the fantasy genre. A couple of family members and my partner included never cared about fantasy but actually started enjoying it through the course of GoT.

[@JustALemurGuy]

@Just Some Guy without a Mustache you should always read a comment twice before replying. No where did I say I didnt like fantasy but thanks, Clearly someone loved season 8

[@JustALemurGuy]

@Just Some Guy without a Mustache I shall

[@bobbyquetzalcoatl1876]

@@JustALemurGuy don’t even argue w someone who likes season 8🤣🤣

[@aasimmukhtar7752]

Dumb & Dumber. LOL

[@FlowersforCapitu]

It's both sad and funny because the books have tons of magic in it, way more than the show. It has magic, dragons, direwolves, giants, wargs and seers... That's FANTASY. And considering how the main threat of the story is the "magical ice people"... Dumb & Dumber should have picked something else to work in if fantasy bothered them so much

[@lordofcastamere9376]

I have never understood it. Game of Thrones is the most successful show ever on TV. They are multimillionaires with GoT alone. If it is all about the money, you can make so much more money with adding season 9 and 10, without the dumbed-down version. All the extra merch you would have sold, the rewatches, the blue-rays, an active community, a making-of tour of Game of Thrones (just like Harry Potter). Game of Thrones fan meets and all others. Yes GRRM is the author and would get the most because of author rights, but Dan and Dave would have got a lot more money off this. And most importantly they don't get the reputation that they ruined the biggest tv series ever. Look how many complaints there are with D&D adapting The Three-Body Problem. Even if this is good writing (which I doubt because Benioff cannot write) they still have that reputation. Glad that Starwars ditched them 2 months after the last episode.

[@dogemaester]

I think GRRM didn't want the show to go in the direction of his books, and the books weren't finished.. And D&D probably figured that it's better to end it now, coz they simply lacked the skills to finish the story. Because of this maybe, GRRM really didn't want to write another plotline just for the show, as slow at the books as he is already.

[@lordofcastamere9376]

@@dogemaester George wanted Lady Stoneheart in the show even though it would spoil his own story

[@Dashgr]

Artists don't really care about money after a certain personal threshold. They just want to create and keep doing whatever art form they're passionate about. And sometimes strengths don't line up with passions. If they're great at adaptations (strength) but they're passionate about creating material from scratch (passion) then we'll get more season 7 & 8-type output if they can control it.

[@everlightstudiosg9009]

Ego, pride and possessiveness is a thing. Not everyone is motivated by money my friend

[@aidenpearce6624]

@@everlightstudiosg9009 It will be hard for them to achieve anything now. Many GoT fans will avoid their work just for the sake of it. And the rest will be at least much more critical than average. If it is hard to prove yourself as a newcomer, they will have it mich harder.

[@professional_tool_user]

How often do you hear studios say they will do ANYTHING to back a show? They had the full support of HBO, a cast that often told them what fell out of place, an author who's very much alive....

[@max_galingumas9409]

they did not run out of source material. they abandoned it. even without winds of winter there is enough material for 10+ seasons

[@liampatrick3110]

Yep, source material or not, they just stopped giving two shits.

[@erwinvarelanunez2371]

Exactly, a lot of people didn’t understand that, the first Two BIG red flags that I saw: the short lore from Dorne Combine Victorion and Euron Greyjoy with the cuts in his lore too

[@rafachrzaszcz6997]

Let's be honest. Martin abandoned many subplots in the books and they couldn't get the character continuity. What to do with Arya and Sansa, who are absent for whole the Book V (Dance with the dragons)? GRRM created too many threads in his books and it seems he is confused himself...

[@SH19922x]

They don't care, they're rich until the end of time now, they are the two biggest deadbeat writers that have ever been given a golden ticket to fame. I hate them with every fibre of my body

[@adrianfriedrich5622]

This is a good argument for communism lol

[@winter236]

@@adrianfriedrich5622 what😐

[@TheGamerPhan]

@@adrianfriedrich5622 there’s a difference between capitalism and greed

[@adrianfriedrich5622]

@@TheGamerPhan yeah, greed is personally and capitalism is the system what reward this behavior

[@Pelagion98]

@@adrianfriedrich5622 I live in a post-communist country and I can guarantee to you that Communism rewards deadbeat, lazy, useless, thieving suck-ups and not the working class.

[@RafaelSantos-pi8py]

The fact that D&D will never get serious jobs in writing ever again is the only thing good out of GoT season 8.

[@trizz1350]

Tjat and podrick singing

[@Hirnlego999]

That's not how they look at things though, the question is: Did it make money?

[@medicamedico4335]

@@trizz1350 that was goldd

[@rohanmondkar9467]

It is very infuriating to hear Dan say that we wanted parents and athletes to watch the show as well. Is he not aware that it was the biggest show on the planet which pretty much meant many parents and athletes do watch it already? What made GoT special was the very fantasy aspects of it that were grounded with the human characters and realities of human conflict and war. How do you run a fantasy show and decide to remove or minimize the fantasy element of it when you are reaching the climax of the story where you have to resolve plot points and character arch’s set up previously. I think the asshat literally meant it in the worst way possible: basically that we want to gain audiences that are not nerds aka people who have sex (parents & athletes). No wonder their inner frat boy shines through in the writing of the last 2 seasons with constant dick jokes, dumb character decisions, bastardizing great lines from previous seasons and “kind of” forgetting how to write a good story.

[@dronemachine4694]

Yeah they literally meant fantasy fans can’t be nerds or football players😂😂 couple of clowns

[@Blakenew127]

One of the best descriptions I have read so far

[@RiottaBash]

Imagine in a alternate universe without Dumb and Dumber, we would be watching GoT Season 9 Episode 7 and we would have 4 years with 4 seasons and 42 episodes to go 😔

[@0fwRs]

why did you put this in my head

[@thee_morpheus]

Get Dr. Strange on the line

[@cleanerben9636]

give it 10 years they might remake it from scratch but it depends on GRRM

[@nicholaskenneth113]

I hate you for telling me this

[@lukebullen705]

@@cleanerben9636 A shame because the casting and writing for the first 4 seasons was brilliant

[@johnnythemachine6949]

D.B Weiss: "We wanted people who play professional football to love it" They gave Aaron Rodgers a cameo appearance and he still hated season 8

[@rebeccab1808]

I totally agreed with his rants about the ending!

[@johnnythemachine6949]

@@rebeccab1808 Me too

[@a.w.4134]

I love how he keeps calling them “dumb and dumber” lol EDIT: DAAAMN LOOK AT ALL THEM LIKES

[@aplusrecommends9406]

everyone calls them that

[@LaggMIA]

Wait that's not their names?

[@TheBc99]

They even look a little like them, it's so perfect...

[@WWESVRGAMER]

Cause thats how to get easy Internet points

[@SupportGamin2024]

Because they are dumb and dumber

[@weeoth8380]

what upsets me the most is that people have started defending season 8

[@FindTheFun]

I've always wondered how Weiss got the job after I saw that GoT was literally his only experience on Wikipedia...

[@yidingliu8663]

It is honestly insulting to see him work on Three-Body Problem. I do not like that novel particularly but the writer Cixin Liu is well loved. He was once a Power Plant worker who fought his way to Hugo award. And now this man's work out of all is handed to some spoiled rich fuck who literally got paid millions by dancing on GRRM's great work. Modern TV business at its finest... ...

[@Loukyan]

He has connections?

[@Razax7]

Nepotism

[@cleanerben9636]

@@yidingliu8663 I don't like Three-body problem either but I don't want to see Cixin's work go down the shitter because of tweedle dumb and tweedle dee

[@milovarquiel]

Benioff father is a rich banker from Goldman-Sachs so that's why he got a career, he always used daddy's connections to money so that's why HBO hired him.

[@someone8376]

The only thing with David and Dan without dislikes - this video.

[@jasminewat2662]

So far...

[@superfire6463]

7

[@MrFuller876]

10

[@dylanrinker6831]

@@MrFuller876 15!!

[@doublezero2001]

DD&D D&D with Dislikes

[@wwCs49]

book readers and others starting noticing issues in season 4 and 5, my biggest red flag came before season 8 but still pretty late. when they announced just how short season 8 would be, and when "theres only 6 episodes but they will each be as long/in depth as feature films!" turned out to be a blatant lie when the run times were released. I remember joking with a friend in the years building up to the last season "imagine they completely fuck it up and everyone hates it? no way right?"....

[@jorgediaz4742]

My red flag was the Dorne plot, what a shame really

[@wwCs49]

@@jorgediaz4742 having recently just read all the books, I cant believe how bad they messed up dorne. don't even get me started on young griff...

[@sithsaber1296]

My red flag was robb's storyline romance, it was the first time they made major changes to the book's storyline and tried to make original characters

[@sophiawilson8696]

I noticed it season 4 that they moving from the books.

[@wwCs49]

@@sophiawilson8696 I only just recently read the books so in my ignorance I was spared having the show ruined for me that early. theres def something to be said for treating a show/film adaptation as its own thing and not judging it against the books, but the show towards the end was just awful even on its own

[@dragonmaster1360]

"We tried to keep that stuff to a minimum, because we didn't just want it to appeal to a fantasy fanbase. We wanted them to love it, and we wanted parents to love it, and people who played professional football to love it." The messed up part is... THEY HAD THAT BEFORE THE DOWNPLAY. Game of Thrones was well on its way to becoming a part of the cultural zeitgeist (at least in America, I cannot speak of the rest of the world), which normally takes years, if not DECADES, to occur. And that was WITH the fantasy elements and magick. Everybody had heard of it, even one of my friends who won't watch something if it isn't anime or an internet animation/show. So many people were talking about it. It was a cultural phenomenon, on a similar level as Star Wars. And they literally cut out one of its core elements to appeal to people to which it already appealed... Dumb & Dumber were blind. It fell out of the zeitgeist incredibly fast because of those two idiots. I rarely hear anybody talking about it in a good light, and even then, it's only about seasons 1-4/5, or about the music.

[@Tungdil_01]

The impact of GoT was far beyond the US borders. You can confidently say that it was a global phenomenon. But unfortunately for all of us from this good Earth, the writers decided to butcher the story :(

[@jasonalcatraz5817]

So wait, they suck at writing in general? Always have... *gunshot*

[@justanormaldayatwork9670]

That's deep. Like *SPACE DEEP*

[@margarethmichelina5146]

What do you expect when one of them wrote X-Men Origins: Wolverine? And created the merc without a mouth and called it so called "Deadpool".

[@jasonalcatraz5817]

@@margarethmichelina5146 Fair point, but I never watched that so I never knew.

[@PropiaPersona]

"daddy, directing and producing is harder than I thought" - Some wealthy well connected individuals

[@christianyepez1016]

D&D: We wanted to downplay the fantasy elements to appeal to a broader audience Me: Have you ever heard about Lord of the Rings 🤦‍♂️

[@holysecret2]

Just imagine if Peter Jackson had done the same to LotR. I don't want to live in that timeline

[@armorsmith43]

@@holysecret2 watch the last Hobbit movie.

[@DaroriDerEinzige]

They probaly didn't. Personally, I would even say that D&D would be surprised if you tell them the origin of the whole "Troy Saga"-Thing and that Spartans were a real thing. They are 100% Cliché US Americans.

[@gavaudan2131]

@@armorsmith43 The Hobbit didn't downplay any fantasy elements. It actually added a lot of elements that weren't in the book

[@tomimpala]

I knowww I was just thinking that - Lord of the rings, Harry Potter, Star Wars...

[@Brandon92-z80]

The fact that David and Dan are not part of the House of Dragon series is most likely good riddance.