2015 BMW 640i N55 - INTERMITTENT MISFIRE DIAGNOSIS AND FIX

Thank you all for tuning in to Super Mario Diagnostics!
Today I got my ass handed to me by a 2015 BMW 640i intermittent misfire. I hope this video helps others avoid the same mistakes i made!
I hope you all enjoy, like, share, comment and subscribe!
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[@ScannerDanner]

Was it a plug indexing thing Mario? So crazy that swapping plugs the problem stayed with cylinder 4 and didn't misfire on the cylinder you moved it to. Completely understandable how you missed it. I would have too. And props to you for not making yourself out to be a super tech who never makes mistakes. I believe we do more for our communities when we're share our struggles. Keep up the great work Mario!

[@SuperMarioDiagnostics]

I think indexing might only be one aspect, along with depth and possibly plug temp. Thanks Paul for taking the time to watch!

[@ScannerDanner]

@@SuperMarioDiagnostics but if it was plug reach and temperature, why would it be only on cylinder 4? You'd think the other cylinders would have had the same issues. BTW I shared this for you on my SD Facebook page and on my community tab on KZbin for you my friend.

[@SuperMarioDiagnostics]

Cylinders 1 and 2 soon followed suit, then we finally got approval to swap all plugs

[@ScannerDanner]

@@SuperMarioDiagnostics ah got it, that does make a difference then. So as you said, it could be a combination of all three. Reach, temp and index. If this doesn't answer why we must always run factory plugs. I don't know what does. Nice job again my friend

[@SuperMarioDiagnostics]

Yup it's a paradox 😆 but yes the takeaway is that factory plugs actually make a difference, and in this case, swaptronics worked against me. Thanks again buddy

[@douglasgutberlet9490]

Mario this video proved priceless to me. I had a 2014 BMW 335i xdrive in for a Valve Cover gasket replacement due to the classic oil leak onto the converter and a spark plug replacement. The customer provided plugs from FCP Euro ZR5TPP33. I checked the website and FCP Euro claims that the ZR5TPP33S is no longer available and this is the direct replacement, claiming the plugs are identical. Not thinking anymore about it I did the valve cover gasket job and replaced the plugs. It took about 20 minutes of running at idle to develop a single cylinder misfire that started as intermittent and slowly developed into a constant misfire. Not long after I was getting other cylinder misfires with the one cylinder being the most persistent. Not thinking of a plug problem I looked into spark, fuel, compression, air, timing etc... I couldn't find anything to explain the misfire(s). Out of desperation I put the old plugs back in and the misfires did not go away! As a final desperation after exhausting many options and now having all the new plugs back in the cylinders I swapped the new plug from the worst misfiring cylinder to a cylinder that was misfiring very infrequently and amazingly the bad misfire followed the new plug. I spent some more time researching BMW misfires and anything I could find related to spark plug issues and sure enough I stumbled into this video. After watching your video I took a close look at the ignition signal and the hash that you showed and it was almost identical. My hash was near the end of the burn line not the beginning which was very similar to yours. I also scoped the power and ground signals to the ignition and saw a similar hash pattern in their signals as well. I have my ignition signals and can send them out if anyone is interested. Long story short I asked the customer to purchase the ZR5TPP33S plug from the BMW dealer after watching this video and they agreed which I installed and the misfire(s) disappeared. I will only use and insist on BMW replacement plugs on all future jobs. Thanks Again!

[@dellsteelz5905]

wow im currently facing the same issue with my 15' smh as for me i was just installing a new air filter and decided to swap out my plugs due to a small cold start miss i would get even though it didnt throw any codes.... i installed the new ZR5TPP33 plugs from the local part store and the car ran fine but by the end of the night i got a engine light and when i scanned it cyl 4 was the issue...i then pulled the car apart check the coils switch them around etc but still no luck... i even put back the old plugs bmw plugs but not knowing better didnt torque them so now im faced with cyl 3/4 misfire based on the new knowledge i plan to go get plugs from the dealer torque to spec and hope for the best thanks guys for the well informative specs on these german cars

[@douglasgutberlet9490]

@@dellsteelz5905 I would not have believed it was the plugs until I saw Mario's video. Two important things pointed me to the plugs 1) I could move the misfire only when swapping a plug from a misfiring cylinder to a non-misfiring cylinder - misfire followed the plug only. I tried coil swaps and even swapped in the original plugs with no luck. 2) The ignition signal matched Mario's almost exactly - hash at the end of the firing line. When listening or watching misfires on the scan tool the ignition signal with hash almost always misfired. Don't drive yourself crazy get the BMW Bosch Plug ZR5TPP33-S or 12120037582. You will at the least eliminate the plugs as the potential source of your problem with the correct factory plug

[@CubasAutomotive]

Such a humbling experience. You said it, it's "soul crushing". I hate being wrong... I'm glad you pushed through and won in the end, but to also show this entire experience.... it says a lot about you Mario. You're a heck of a guy. ¡Hasta pronto, un fuerte abrazo! 😉😁👍🏻

[@djosbun]

A great man is humble when victorious, but it is the greatest man that is gracious when defeated or admits error. Thank you for being a superb teacher, Mario. Enjoy your Sunday.

[@arthurfricchione8119]

Mario I learned a long time ago in my field the only guys that can ever say they never made a misdiagnosis are the guys that never touch anything. Till this day I'm still learning that when something kicks my butt and then I finally fix it it's a great feeling.. I'd let you work on my vehicles any day. Hold your head high you did great we all take our lumps and move on. You and family stay well and safe Artie.😄😄😄

[@ericseybold5609]

GREAT VIDEO- I learned a lot about the turbulence in the waveform. Remember this famous quote '" The True Definition of an EXPERT, is someone who has made more mistakes at something than the next guy" Keep up the great work.

[@JoesAutoElectric]

Great job brother. This business will certainly do one thing for us. It will keep us humble. So nice to see a network of techs helping each other. There is hope for the automotive repair industry. Keep up the great work and videos brother.

[@SuperMarioDiagnostics]

Thanks Joe!!

[@doncarter4030]

You also keep up the good job joe!

[@Robert-wq5qf]

The balls you have to show you are wrong sometimes. You're a good dude!

[@benkeys2702]

I've been doing this for over 30 years and still get it wrong from time to time. Those who know it all are the ones who stop learning. Stay with it! I enjoy your work.(Detroit born and raised)

[@roxanneabbott8424]

You are an honest man Mario, wish we had more of you! I learn so much from you!

[@theautomotivedoctormr.wils9217]

Followed this one in the groups Mario , glad to see you made a video on it . Nice work gather info from other talented techs to solve problem .

[@Discretesignals]

Awesome video! Been humbled so many times and sure there will be more. You can't fix them all, but the experience and knowledge you gain along the way is so worth the effort.

[@billyyoder8171]

Thank you Mario. This will help multitudes of people. Don't be discouraged. It happens to us all brother. That heart sinking feeling. You shared a video that you didn't have to. This speaks volumes to your humble and caring nature. You use your own personal time to develop a produce a video. Good job again. Have a blessed and safe week to you and your family.

[@michaelfrancis3261]

Wow, this is why I love your channel man, someone that willing to keep it real. A tec is only human are subject to making mistakes. some guys wouldn't have posted this, but this shows that you love what you do and you're willing to help out upcoming technicians like me. I wish I could've given you more like man, again thanks for keeping it REAL. keep the videos coming

[@woog74]

The greatest networking tool to date is the internet. Thx for sharing this with us.

[@RJMaker]

There's nothing gained in value without struggle.

[@michaelnicholson9092]

Solid video. Gotta love our humbling moments. They make us better. Good job Mario.

[@mmichaeldonavon]

Super Mario. First of all, I'm very glad I found your channel. YOU are my kind of person (mechanic/fixer.) :) Believe it or not, I felt as bad as you did when your "cleaning of the carbon" didn't get you the fix you wanted. I really felt bad for you. Let me tell you why: For a long time, I was an Aircraft Avionics Systems tech on USAF Airplanes. We worked many, many systems on the planes (USAF) Like RADAR - Nav systems - Radio systems - flight instruments - engine instruments - flight control systems - etc., etc. temperature and position indicating systems. I got my butt kicked MANY times by these systems. And I'm talking about working at the end of the runway, trying to get a fix so the plane can take off! Many times, I failed - And the plane had to taxi back to the parking spot. Mission Canx. I was not the HERO, I was the goat. Talk about feeling bad. :) Then, later on, after I retired from the USAF, I worked for RCA on TV servicing, etc. Got my butt kicked there. Worked independently on TV's found the same thing as you found. SONY TV's would NOT work with anything other than OEM parts, i.e. Power transistors - certain transformers, and on and on. So, I know exactly how you felt. I also learned from those butt kickings. Like you, keep your head up, and periodically YOU will be the HERO in helping someone else whose butt is being kicked. I'm subscribed. Thanks. N-6395T

[@bobneuman8124]

Great job Mario ! I know how you feel, don't beat yourself up. In this industry, we learn something new all the time no matter our experience level. That's why we need to help each other get through it ! Stay always humble my friend ! 👍

[@joelnrs]

Thanks for your honesty and showing all of the hard work you did. It is greatly appreciated.

[@CarsExposed]

Lesson learned here Mario , I know the feeling we’ve all been there before bud ... thanks for taking the time to share it with all of us 👍👍👍🍻

[@High_Tech_Mountain]

Top notch brother! Thank you for sharing with us! We test to confirm and or rule out an issue. & sometimes our testing can lead us astray! Great information! &&& thankfully didn’t go down to crazy of a rabbit hole! Awesome that the guys @ LMV chimed in with their experiences. Again much appreciated, you sharing with us. Always a pleasure!

[@johndefini3732]

New subscriber!!! The honestly and humility you displayed here is exactly what we are lacking in this field!! I looked past the misdiagnosis immediately when I saw how sincere you were! Now for the rest of the video, I learned quite a bit from watching this and that my friend is something you gave back to the community that goes way beyond the challenge you faced with these spark plugs. I came here cause I'm ready to burn this 335 N55 I am working on because I cannot find what's up with my intermittent misfire and I am leaving energized that I just need to continue testing and trucking on! Now if my 335 just had the access that 640 had!! lol

[@jonathanevans2677]

You learn something different in the automotive tread everyday and it costs nothing to ask someone else for help. 👍👍👍😁😁, and you fixed it in the end that's the main thing,

[@felmar39]

good video as usual mario , everyone of us been there my friend ,the most important thing is you try hard,never stop until find out the real cause of the problem,know a lot of mechanic who will say, "take it to the dealer", not you my friend ,you admit the mistake in public, that's something that say only good things about you. Thanks

[@TheRallyCoop]

Mario. Don’t be so hard on yourself. You’re still a master technician, you will make mistakes once in a while. Learning comes with learning pain. In the end I am very sure that you are not ungrateful for this experience. May the learning never end! Thanks again for sharing.

[@grandsea2]

I find it awesome yhat you are humble enough to post an ass kicking...especially helpful for us low hour Mechanics to see that we are not the only ones!

[@baxrok2.]

Seeing that the valves weren't that bad made me think twice about the cleaning. However, since swapping the plugs didn't help, it was a tricky diag for sure Mario. Thanks for sharing the info!

[@gailtaylor1636]

Back in 2002-03 was in Ford dealership. Had same problem with aftermarket plugs in 5.4's.

[@markferraro5250]

great video SSM great learning expierence for industry one thing to mention is to look at vacuum pulls cranking with pressure pule sensor and look for slighest anomoly to see intake carbon issues all the best brother

[@hoseayerimah6331]

Honestly Mario I admire your resilience "honestly we can't release the car like this we have to keep digging" Great job bro.

[@SuperMarioDiagnostics]

Thanks G!

[@juergenscholl2843]

I feel your pain...but be assured it really happens to ALL of us once in a while! The better ones like you will show it and not cover it up. THANK YOU.

[@jcmobilediagnostics8611]

Very interesting and your transparency is greatly appreciated.

[@rondail5675]

You got up after falling, good for you. Knowing where to go to get help is very important, one person can't do it all. Great video.

[@saab770]

Hi Mario the man that never made a mistake never did anything well done for sticking with the problem to the very end well done keep up the good work John

[@andrewk778]

Always interesting and informative. Thank you for sharing. You’re a class act.

[@isalmankhan1]

Bro we're all students in this trade, but you're the best👍 It happens to all of us, but very few are brave enough to admit & share with others, like you did👍 Honestly in my part of the world, my only helpline is KZbin, nobody shares any knowledge & you're right, my personal experience with German vehicle's is that they hate swap testing, it's like the car is policing you & it won't get fixed by swapping part's😉 Thanks for sharing, there's valuable information for all of us👍 Stay Safe👍

[@Auto-Tech]

Wow, what a great video Mario and also a great experience for all of us (i'm sorry you had to suffer for it). It takes courage to admit when your'e wrong (plus you did it on film), and that makes you a better technician.

[@markinkster9257]

I have said it many times, if you aren't making a mistake now and again , you aren't doing anything. You followed thru and that's what counts. Carry on and teach me more!

[@themechanic6117]

Thanks for sharing this experience. Definitely a interesting case 👍

[@MaicSalazarDiagnostics]

Great video my friend. Plugs are one thing I like to use OEM for this same reason.

[@shaynejohnston2315]

I know exactly how you feel. Sucks when you are so sure of your diagnosis. Only to find out you are wrong. Lucky for you you have your hot lines so to say to call. Only wish I did at time's. Thanks for taking the time to make the videos and sharing. After all we are all in this together. Take care and thanks again.

[@mikesabin8568]

Awesome technician... very intelligent and thorough. Thanks for this

[@stephencook4611]

Great to see you up and running. I hope some of your past problems are behind you now. This is a good video for everyone to watch. The reason I say this is you must install the correct spark plug in the vehicle you are working on. Even if an aftermarket plug manufacturer gives you several different choices, you need to make certain it is the exact kind of plug needed for the vehicle. I have had the same problem with bosch plugs in the past. Not that bosch isn't a good product. They offer choices for spark plugs of different qualities. Personally, I just stick with the iridium tip plugs. They work in almost all vehicles. NGK has a spark plug chart on their website that shows what kind of a sparkplug you can use for any given application. Keep up the good work.

[@annacermed4468]

Is it true or am I wrong, I've never seen such a great number of fruitful comments. I learn from both, your very interesting video and from all points of view of commentators. Thanks a lot, keep going.

[@davidmuley164]

Don't worry, for me , you do a great job...congratulaciones...you're a great man and great mechanical

[@michaelhanglow5051]

We appreciate your humility.

[@RayonsAutoDiagnostics]

Great video Mario, I have experienced aftermarket spark plugs causes transmission problems on Honda and Nissan.

[@iankelly2110]

Thanks for sharing we all have been their at some stage in our life time i have learned from you for sure

[@abisismael1343]

Great expérience. Thanks for sharing it !

[@christianbateman4530]

Bro thanks for sharing so we can learn from your mistakes aswell. Great video keep it up!

[@marcosmateo8439]

Great Video! And i get it, is Soul Crushing cause we take pride in our work and we hate to be wrong. You are a great tech but that’s what i love about Automotive, you never stop learning.

[@JOHNPHUFNAGEL]

Mario you are some of the best techs that i watch, that's crazy I would have never thought it was a plug. Thank you for making these videos and showing your mistakes because everyone can learn from this. I am struggling to remember all the different characteristics of ignition waveforms, do you know if there is a cheat sheet or charts available on the net? Great video

[@richard1835]

Always trying to learn more about BMW's. Thank you. Great Video

[@DJ-tn7vj]

Hi Mario. We all have got hit with the fake plugs issue. had a come back on a new model vehicle with a minor misfire at high rpm with no codes or check light. Put in OEM plugs. Vehicle works and runs great. Lesson learned

[@angelramirez7747]

Awesome video, thanks for sharing bro!

[@DTR0454]

I’m a technician not a magician, excellent content.

[@robertmobileman8304]

Good video Mario I feel your pain ! We all never stop learning in the motor trade , we all learn something different each day.. good job you fixed it !! Rob mobile man

[@alrifainidal]

Keep up the great work . i was hoping you did waveform after fix . because you left me wondering why just #4 cylinder show the misfire even tho the car has all spark plug the same >> i wish for you the best

[@alanw5879]

I fully agree man, more techs need to help each other instead of saying "why are you posting this" . This page is only for pro techs. I hate that, even pro techs were once beginners and had to ask questions. If everyone would help everyone, we could all get these cars diagnosed with out pulling our hair out. I have no respect for those who won't help others, especially guys who can't afford the expensive training we get. Or the tools for that matter. If only everyone would get along. Great video Mario, good lesson on back to the basics sometimes, not that those plugs were a basic case by any means.

[@powayimports4175]

Interesting. I can’t say I’ve had issues using the bosch to be honest. Btw not to be a meanie but when you see no major build up, it’s not the issue. Takes a decent amount for these to make a difference in my experience so far. Glad you got it and it did help me and I’m sure many others!! Mad respect for showing the whole procedure.

[@aarsenalfan]

You did everything by the book, but sometimes looks like experience prevails. Kudos to people who helped. Just say NEXT and keep wrenching. Great video. 👍

[@yamaha37776]

Great video! And as a fan and subscriber I really really appreciate your honesty! You could of easily edited that out, the fact you didn’t, respect! Were human, your still a beast diagnostician! Looking forward to the next video!

[@danman9017]

this is a very good video...there no reason to feel bad.. been a good tech is always learning ....those engine are not made of glass ...so we can see what is going on,...the customer put aftermarket plug and got burn on that,....many guys get burn on aftermarket part....thanks for sharing

[@0RayJones]

I hate that feeling too. I crossed my “t”s and dotter my “I”s and still the car wasn’t fixed. This is a great case study! Good thing you only repaired one thing at a time. What if you replaced the plugs and the did the cleaning at the same time? You would’ve have never caught the actual cause. Thank you for sharing your experience so we can learn.

[@Shas4Ever]

I totally agree, helping is exquisite!

[@gaad7938]

Great vid, Mario! I'm sure you have forgotten more about auto diagnosis than I will ever know. The best learning videos (for me at least) are the ones exactly like this one! Wish more great techs like you would post more of their "failures".

[@stevenkietzke5582]

Life is a learning curve thanks for the video

[@MidwayAutomotiveInc]

Thanks for sharing this video, I got burned similarly with an intermittent missfire at over 4000 RPM that turned out to be bad coils. I swapped it with its neighbor and still, same cyl missfire on high acceleration. I think in both cases it was 2 weak ignition parts that only failed with the particulars of that specific cylinder. Again, thank you!

[@stefanczechorskidds5536]

Wow, thats really a "good one" Mario! The confusing issue is...... (since it turned out to be the plugs , ie non-oem PN) , you would think that you would get that wave form on every cylinder! What is so unique about cylinder #4 ? Maybe BMW figured out a way to place "component protection" on their spark plugs ! I think videos like this do as much good as many of the other "logical" diagnostic videos on YT ; thanks again Mario!

[@SuperMarioDiagnostics]

It eventually started misfiring on cylinder 1 where i swapped the plug to LOL and then number 2 soon followed. We did eventually get am approval to replace all of the plugs. Thanks for watching bud!

[@TomTom-xh6cn]

wow you are a good human Mario! Loved this video a lot!!! ( cleaning the intake at 60k mls on a performance engine is never a bad thing anyway!)

[@jacktingzon2378]

youre a good man mario. thanks for sharing sir.

[@bmwautorepairservice3001]

Good stuff Mario. Your a good guy !

[@MrAaronD1]

Great video Mario as always

[@gilbertomoran7420]

We learn how to humble ourselves in the automotive trade . No pain no gain 💪

[@fixtronictecnotallercolima2131]

So helpful ! , here in Mexico is verry common that situation about those cars , the quality of the aftermarket parts is to low , thanks for share !!

[@HERMANOSGUTIERREZ8690]

Exelente diagnóstico Mario, sabemos que somos humanos y vivimos aprendiendo y enseñando. En este caso te toco aprender es lo bueno de tener buenos colegas experimentados. Saludos!

[@spin1275gt]

You do have to use OEM plugs every time with the direct injected BMW engines. But the hard part is that some engines OEM is NGK and some is bosch. Also you can only install them one time. Because of the crush ring and the position of the electrode.

[@juweekhan]

You got it fixed that all that count nobody knows it all each day you learn a new lesson thanks

[@marvinpostadan3484]

This video showed your character. I’m a fan!

[@matt.108]

Super Mario Diagnostics Nice work brother. I have a 2012 N55 E92. Put those same plugs in. I have a skipping jerky idle at low speeds but can’t get her to throw a code. I think those plugs might be my problem. Ive looked on e90 post and from what I see some DME’s are really picky and some can use them just fine. Seems smoother if I flash to stock compared to my tune but still noticeable. Hopefully those double the price BMW plugs fix my problem.

[@nathantechnician2475]

I get the feeling of been wrong when you are certain on something, it's suck... Nice reality video man

[@benkeys2702]

By the way, I had the same experience with a 97 Mazda Millenia. Someone put NEW copper plus plugs in it. Took two weeks before I put OEM plugs in it. Customer said he put aftermarket plugs because they were told that they were so much better. Since then (20 years ago) I've always tried to use OEM because the vehicle was designed for them. Resistance matters!

[@jhauna1]

Great job Mario, we have these days even on familiar systems, your instinct was right in the first place but got distracted. I was thinking, why didn’t the misfire move to the other cylinder when it was switched around? And out of curiosity, what was the burn voltage on that primary waveform? Thanks again for an awesome video, don’t be hard on yourself.👍🏾

[@halwesth0]

Good job mario ! 👍👍

[@MrXyzasdf]

@27:40 the differences between your wave form and the one sent by your friend can be due to the differences in your time base capture, what is important is measuring the delta in burn time and then comparing.

[@ryderducan]

Your a g my friend, this shit was super elusive and you carried on a finished strong I’d be getting all torn up over it

[@ronyhernandez731]

I’m glad I’m subscribed to your channel I learned a lot from this thanks

[@SuperMarioDiagnostics]

Welcome aboard!

[@ylaabichi38]

Great video keep it up 👍.

[@stahuskies2539]

This has got to be a frustrating one to walk through. But it's a very valuable lesson that I'm sure you won't forget!

[@stahuskies2539]

so glad you got it solved!

[@tedgtfan]

Wow hard lesson learned. Yes you are correct WE ARE HERE TO HELP OUR FELLOW MAN, wish more remembered that. No need to be so hard on yourself, LIFE is getting your ass kicked sometimes daily but tomorrow the sun comes up in a different place guaranteed.

[@LuisGonzalez-ri6yo]

hi mario nice video,went thru same issue whit 2015 x6 50i got me nuts ,even swap injectors end up to be the plug cylinder #1dont have experience whit osciloscope so imaging,thanks for be real.

[@xaviergonzalez5145]

Gracias Mario! Un diagnóstico fuera de lo común, yo hubiera hecho lo mismo! Será que el grado térmico de las bujias Bosch no era el indicado? Extraño realmente! Thank you man!

[@squidchaser]

Your awesome brother keep it up!

[@erikkirby1]

being wrong is the best way to keep learning!!!

[@thebaldmechanichardatheari1124]

Don't feel bad. Been there before and it's horrible. It's so deflating but we are techs and we keep on trying. Bloody after market parts. So easy to say after the fact. Keep your head up.

[@godlikedeveloper8944]

High Quality content, I follow Danner and heard of your name on the forums.

[@TheFrenchPug]

Just went thru the same thing on my 335i. I bought OEM Bosch plugs through eBay and was battling the misfire with those. Turns out, they must have been counterfeit. So I bought NGKs through a reputable dealer that also work for this engine, and installing those solved the misfires. Plus the car has much more power now. So don't feel so bad. No more Amazon or eBay electronics car parts for me!

[@DEEuroworks]

Great video 👍🏼

[@hightttech]

Nice case study. A day in the life of a real tech. Much respect for sharing the disappointment. Keep chasing perfection, Mario; you'll never catch it, but occasionally you'll get a finger on it, and behold the overwhelming feeling of satisfaction. It's a club to which parts changers will NEVER be invited 😆. BTW: In the end, how did the shop charge for diag and repair? (e.g. 2 hr diag + plug R&R, shop eats walnut blast job)