Surviving The Retail Apocalypse

[@kurtisconner]

this was great

[@Trediture]

kurt more like kurt

[@petershillito]

Something that might be prompting a bump in physical sales and stores somewhat recently is the quality of online goods is going down the toilet. Amazon is now aliexpress with next day shipping, aliexpress is cheaper, temu, shein, etc, all in a race to the bottom while being as opaque as possible about the products, so you really don't know what you're going to get at the end of it all. Going to a physical shop to see it, even if you buy it online in the end, makes a huge difference. Plus, if something goes wrong, you have a real person to go to for help or a refund, compared to trying to persuade some AI bot that you need to speak to a human, sending the thing back through the mail, etc. In short: online shopping is getting worse, so in-person shopping is stepping in to save the day.

[@ZackarySmigel]

Fantastic point!

[@reaven2535]

This is a huge reason why I was doing online, then stopped doing online. These companies used to have to compete by offering a better service to justify moving from physical stores. Now that they've killed physical stores, they can fuck around and find out I guess. Why waste weeks/months returning and trying broken or misleading products to eventually get something I can use? I went to an in-person vacuum specialty store recently and had the best experience of my life buying something that should not be hard to get, but seems to be hard to find a good quality product for now. Buying online basically feels like a net loss in almost all cases because finding something good is impossible. Reviews? How am I supposed to know if they're real anymore? Articles on websites? Might be AI written and/or sponsored.

[@RaeInTime]

Exactly 💯

[@SammyNail]

@@reaven2535 Let's not forget if your package is stolen the USPS/FedEx/UPS wont work with a vendor for them to get their claim so they have to now replace your item at a total loss as with in-store returns the item is either resold at a lower price or returned to the manufacturer for a refund.

[@randomtinypotatocried]

I'm in Canada and online isn't actually cheaper than buying it in a physical store

[@SolaireIntensifies]

I gotta say I appreciate that you actually go out to location for these videos. It'd be easy to just do a video essay from home but actually going out gives your videos that extra spice that keeps me coming back!

[@bradlauk1419]

"I can't believe this 100k+ subscriber KZbinr actually went to the mall for a video"

[@Destinyisforlosers24]

Correcting someone who’s just giving a compliment is the most online thing ever, please avoid doing it again.

[@maxque2841]

@@Destinyisforlosers24thinking making a competent video essay is easy whether on location or not is also pretty internet

[@Casual_Stroll]

Another aspect of malls is how all of them require driving in a car to get to. Malls in Europe where people can walk, cycle, or take transit to get to them are also thriving. Turns out people will favor online shopping more when the in person retail option involves sitting in several minutes of traffic just to get into/out of a parking lot, but that when you can take a train there and just walk right in it's pretty nice.

[@Lycaon1765]

Once again, suburbia kills all

[@h.w.4482]

it's the same thing with any store outside of a town with 1 million + people, you have to take a car to get there, to get anywhere really. it's just not feasible for 99% of America to have European style walking or public transport infrastructure

[@midori_the_eldritch]

​@h.w.4482 the only reason it's not feasible is when cars became a thing the us decided to only build around cars, and now it's way more expensive to start making more options to travel than it would have been.

[@Casual_Stroll]

@@h.w.4482 Never let anyone tell you that density has anything to do with it. You can go look up places that have good public transit, those that have the most cyclists, and match that up with population density and see that there is 0 correlation. What does correlate with transit use and cycling? Infrastructure supporting it. Here in the US we are simply denied good public transit and cycling infrastructure, instead every road is designed for cars and we haven't invested in rail in decades (thankfully Biden's infrastructure bill is changing that). That is why we all have to drive everywhere, not because we don't have the population density to support it. Also we could prioritize building dense, mixed use neighborhoods as well.

[@Andy_ARBS]

@@h.w.4482 It's not feasible because for some reason the US decided to design malls around parking lots.

[@lilcotorro]

Gen Z here. I definitely prefer malls over online shopping. Its much more convenient in terms trying stuff on before buying and usually has clearance deals comparable if not better than online. My online shopping mainly consists of easily replaceable items like cables and batteries or products I already trust. Malls are a better alternative if you do a lot of buying with older family members, too.

[@marissahicks3529]

Plus it’s a great way to get exercise

[@SammyNail]

careful with some trustworthy items. Scott The Woz put a video up on his 2nd channel not to long ago about Amazon shipping bootlegged SD cards that have 16/32 gigs of memory but are being sold as labeled. In his case, 128 Gigs or higher. Amazon has done nothing to combat this as he's been complaining about it to them for 2 years.

[@randomtinypotatocried]

⁠​⁠@@SammyNailThat shit has been pissing me off for long time now. It's just easier to get them in person and know I'm actually getting the gb size I need

[@PolarRook]

same, i want stuff immediately as soon as I decide to buy it, I hate waiting for online shopping to get to me

[@MrUnkownGuyAC]

@@SammyNailThat's another additional feature of the mall too, it's a place you have visited and you know you can visit again for more things or to resolve any issues with past purchases. With online shopping, any issues with past purchases might take too much effort to resolve and so you are most likely to give up and eat the cost.

[@eclover1231]

I cant believe you personally closed the Shenango valley mall

[@thedilutedspine]

My childhood mall was converted to an office space/corporate headquarters by a local company and I ended up working for that company, in the mall for 8 years. They chopped up most of the stores into large open floor plan offices, named conference rooms after old stores from the mall and tried to keep the "mall vibe" on the main run by using existing escalators, stairs and walkways through the center of the mall. They retained the entrance facad for JCPennys but removed the signage. I sat under the entrance to JCPennys for the first 6 or so months working there. Was cool to watch as they slowly converted more of the mall over the years, opening new areas totally transformed from what my memories of the areas were as a child. Really tickled my nostalgia.

[@ZackarySmigel]

That's honestly insane. Would definitely make for an interesting work experience.

[@transsexual_computer_faery]

that sounds fun

[@neverxnice3577]

Haha i think i know where that may be, i applied somewhere there years ago when i was thinking of moving

[@thedilutedspine]

@@neverxnice3577 Probably for the best you didn't end up there. Three years ago is around when they started laying everyone off. They don't even have that mall office space anymore due to having so little staff locally.

[@thedilutedspine]

@@ZackarySmigel It was definitely a wholly unique work experience, both due to company culture, and the work space. I don't anticipate I'll ever find a similar work environment ever again in my career.

[@the.dirt.man.]

Your commentary content feels personal. Never change that, it’s fucking rare out here

[@brandibucko]

It really does; it’s so great.

[@realcade]

As somebody who consumes a ton of commentary content Zackary’s content is legitimately on a different level he’s a special creator

[@KineticKell]

genuinely! Passion, projects, where did they go? This channel is very refreshing.

[@MattyyOriginal]

your opinion on ownership is correct. My hometown mall had a mini documentary made about it here on KZbin called "What Happened to the Columbia Mall" and essentially, this one specific company buys up dying malls and kills them completely by driving rent up as a tax break.

[@calciumrods1779]

Is the company by any chance Kohan? They also got my local mall (Spring Hill Mall, Illinois) and it closed a month ago :(

[@Echoingsunflowers981]

Is it Simon malls

[@MattyyOriginal]

@Echoingsunflowers981 nah it's Hull Property Group

[@allipoo300]

Namdar is getting my local mall : (

[@obamagaming7909]

It's interesting you talked about how gen z like malls. As a member of gen z who never went to malls growing up, I kinda wish it was more of an option, since it was a third space. A third space, or a place where you go other than home or work (i.e., first and second spaces), is generally just somewhere you hang out. Before malls, people would go to coffee shops, parks, community centers, sports fields, etc., but malls absorbed most of young peoples' third spaces. When malls died, we were left with nothing. Where could we go when we wanted to hang out? Someone else's house? Stay behind after school? We'd usually end up just texting each other or messaging each other on insta, discord, kik, etc. Gen Z was never able to socialize in real life to the same extent as the previous generations, so yeah, malls are pretty cool. Interpersonal communication just feels a little more soulless when you can't actually see the person you're talking to...

[@jacobfalardeau676]

One big factor is that the "retail apocalpyse" is a largely American phenomenon and malls in Canada and Europe haven't seen a similar decline and are busier than ever before. The reason is quite simple - the United States has about 23.5 square feet of retail space per person which is nearly double the countries in second and third place, Canada and Australia, which have 16.8 and 11.2 square feet per capita respectively. The "retail apocalypse" is really just the United States' retail sector correcting itself after several decades of overgrowth. Especially after years of austerity harming the middle class, the US simply doesn't need that much retail space. One of the things that really surprised me watching a lot of those "dead mall" exploration videos on youtube is that most of these malls are in absolutely TINY towns of like 10,000 people that in any other country would need to be 2/3x, even 5x larger in order to have a mall and very often these were towns that relied on a single economic activity like coal mining or manufacturing and once those were gone, the mall went with them because nobody could afford to shop there anymore. The other thing is that American malls are just strange and lack stores that would be considered absolutely essential in a mall elsewhere. I had an American friend visiting who was amazed that mall in my town had a grocery store, a pharmacy, and branches for all major banks but I thought those were completely normal, if not standard, stores to have in a mall because in Canada most malls have those kinds of services because a lot of seniors really appreciate being able to do their shopping in a single enclosed space.

[@sadmermaid]

Agree

[@hadrianryan4179]

I've lived in Montreal before and the stuff you can do indoors in Canada is pretty extensive, but the place is frozen for months out of the year, so it's not too surprising. Right now I live in Los Angeles and the malls are pretty alive and well here compared to what I've seen in my home state and what other friends around the US have told me. It seems similar but subtly different based on region all over!

[@snowrubu]

The idea of a mall not having a grocery store is wild

[@hadrianryan4179]

@snowrubu in NJ I've never seen one, but in CA we have them!

[@snowrubu]

@@hadrianryan4179 in australia it'd be so weird not to have a grocery store. thats like by far and away how we get groceries. we go to the local shopping centre.

[@Ben79k]

nostalgia.. its nostalgia. there will be a generation soon that never experienced mall shopping, and will not have this feeling for it. I appreciate your coverage of this, it was well done.

[@WoodsNorth]

Vermonter here. Great video, nearly spit out my coffee when I saw the “Downtown BHS” image pop up around the 14 minute mark. The building used to be a very large 2 story Macy’s, who ended up abandoning the building about 7-8 years ago. The only reason the high school is there now is because the old campus in the north end of town was found to be over run with PCB’s and other toxic chemicals, so this was the solution while the actual high school was being demolished and rebuilt. Apparently it’s a disaster inside, and it’s kind of the laughing stock of the entire town.

[@jacobadams1987]

another VT’r here! so wild to see burlington highlighted in a video!

[@ahmedic_c]

Some reasons from someone who used to work in commercial real estate: 1. Owners never want to improve their real estate. 2. They don’t like events/ collaborations. 3. They refuse to reduce the rent even for an anchor tenant (like a supermarket). 4. They want f&b more than anything, I’m sick of how many generic coffee shops and restaurants are getting leased meanwhile actual fun experiences aren’t. 5. THEY JUST DONT WANT TO PAY FOR ANYTHING, no upgrades, no repairs, no promotions, NOTHING. And yeah the reason is the landlords’ stupidity

[@JawshPawsh]

If all the malls close, how am I supposed to get free pennies from the bottom of the fountain?

[@marissahicks3529]

Or see Santa :(

[@spb5715]

Don't worry pennies are going extinct too

[@thrildmedia8798]

Vegas fountains baby!

[@CZsWorld]

Great video. I think the fascination with liminal spaces and dead malls also has something to do with the uncanny valley effect. Our brains know what a mall is supposed to look like, so we find it kind of creepy seeing it out of context like that.

[@CapeSIX]

We’re just gonna overlook a RadioShack robot that marries people in the mall? This deserves a full one hour documentary.

[@randomtinypotatocried]

I'm glad someone else mentioned that. I want to know more

[@MoxmOne]

I work at the Macy's as a detective/undercover shopper in the Topanga Mall from what I've seen in the past years I would say that the crime increased (especially organized crime) but the mall is striving here! Nothing has been closing lately only opening but the stores opening are more higher end brand and not those cool little shops we all grew up loving with those nice deals

[@sitkinator]

There is a reason Kane Pixels choose a dead mall for his "The Oldest View" web series. The memories connected or created by malls are very unique and as Kane realized, ripe for horror material. But he also used it as a way to tribute it and the people who grew up in the mall he choose (The Valley View mall) as he spent countless hours trying to make the 3D recreation as accurate as possible. It was not in vain as the comment section was filled with various commentors reminiscing about their memories and experiences in the mall, thanking Kane for the effort.

[@ken131]

Realizing that the Rolling Giants were real was magically melancholic

[@yuranicelady]

Watching those videos profoundly affected me. I watched it for the first time a few months ago with zero context, and found myself in tears by the end. Some of my earliest childhood memories are at the mall with my mom in the 90’s before online retail took over. Maybe this sounds “too deep” but I feel like the oldest view somehow made me feel repulsed by my own nostalgia, and forced me to take an all over closer look at my purpose as a human being that will too one day be forgotten to time and buried like a dead mall.

[@CatherineInFrench]

The part about ownership is sooo true. We face the same thing in Canada. But where I live, we have invested owners who try to outsmart online business and I'm so grateful for that. Our malls are doing pretty well. It ain't perfect but it's something at least. As always your video is super interesting. Thanks ! :)

[@RusselGosu]

Same thing in Australia, there aren't nearly as many malls (we call them shopping centres) per state, but the ones that are here are much like the upscale malls that are mentioned in the video. Entertainment is a huge draw for these centres, as you typically have a cinema, arcade, things like mini-golf and bowling alleys, and much more.

[@sparksfly13]

same here!! in the valley i live in, we've got 2 large malls and 1 smaller (and much older one). all 3 have been performing quite well, while not all at the same rate, they are no-where close to being nearly as dead as the ones in the video. the smallest one has had quite a few store closings in the past few years, though they all seem to *mostly* get filled with only 2 or 3 still empty. it's pretty crazy as the mall originally opened in 1955 and is still standing to this day! all of them get semi-regular updates (every 2 decades or so), and it's always hard to find a parking spot!!

[@randomtinypotatocried]

I do wish Canadian malls would stop having so many candle stores in one mall. Do we really need 4 or 5 of them?

[@ユーモア-v3s]

man I thought you had over a million subscribers, crazy how under-appreciated your content is. love your content keep up the good work!

[@gabi-sw8zw]

They will soon. I bet anyone $500 cash he will have $1 million followers within the next 365 days. The continent is too good and too consistent.

[@Ajlatango]

His channel is fairly new still- he will get there. His content is well researched, interesting and well presented. I’m happy I get to witness his growth

[@sobertillnoon]

The interview section made me cry.

[@johnatkinson1111]

Getting to the mall is also a big aspect, people don’t want to drive as much anymore. Malls used to be the only option or the major option with the only other being Walmart/independent big box stores; but now you can order basically everything online. The Washington Post did an article in February 2023 where they found Gen Z is driving less. Back in 1997 43% of 16 year olds and 62% of 17 year olds had a license but in 2020 it was only 25% and 45% respectively but even the teens with licenses don’t necessarily want to drive a lot. To get teens and young adults to show up you need major events that makes the hassle of finding someone to drive you/desire to drive worth it or you need to have easier access to get there such as public transportation. Perhaps it’s just circumstantial evidence but I live near two malls, one is connected to the states bus network while the other is not. The one that is part of the bus network is doing very well meanwhile the one that is not is very much a zombie mall barely holding on. Now I think management is a big part of it too as the successful malls are the ones innovating however by making it easier to get to these commercial hubs it makes it more likely people will show.

[@randomtinypotatocried]

Throw in gas is getting more expensive

[@MrCharkteeth]

This helped me add value to my understanding of malls. I can see why people love them. Thank you. I'm the kind of person who never liked malls. The experience of going to a mall is loud, crowded, busy, overwhelming, sensory overload. Quickly exhausted and completely drained. Takes the fun out of anything and everything.

[@jayvbspdx]

I know it's not much but you got me with the Rise, Fall, and Rise Again part!!!! I nearly died because I have asthma and can't laugh too hard.

[@ZackarySmigel]

Thanks so much for the superthanks!! Please don't die!!

[@samusismyhero]

I remember one mall successfully being recycled into a Zombie Adventure escape room. Ownership really should refurbish and add things to actually do in malls, like how you described a hotel and baseball stadium in one.

[@saucemagoo9907]

As a 2001 baby I really appreciate how you are able to give updates on things that have slipped away fro memory but held place in my childhood / early teens from malls to old KZbin channels.

[@brewski118sempire]

It's very interesting watching this. My fiance is from the Philippines and the first time I went to visit her I was so shocked by how popular and packed the malls were. They were a destination to be. Part of it is that they are air conditioned and most people there do not have air conditioning so in the summer (which is most of the time) people go there to hang out and shop and do whatever. Another part of it is that they have a diverse selection of stores. They have pharmacies, grocery stores, hardware stores, ect. There is a whole subdivision that is built around the Eastwood Mall in Manila. It's an awesome place to be and I would have never thought I would say that about a mall. Part of it to is the overall view of community in the culture we as Americans tend to be more individual whereas the Filipino culture tends to be more communal.

[@ZackarySmigel]

Oh, that is super interesting! Never would've known that about the Philippines and their mall scene. Thanks for sharing!

[@DragonGuardian100]

Dude your content keeps getting better. It fills me with the perfect amount of curiosity, mixed with slight cringe (but the comical kind, not the kind that causes me to click off), and plenty of smiles. Thanks for being awesome. Stay creative with the ideas, brother!

[@Intrepimid]

Our local big mall almost shuttered last year because the owner couldnt pay back the enormous loan he owed. They never did anything to improve the place. Thankfully some group bought it up and it SOUNDS like they may actuality have plans to rejuvenate it. Fingers crossed because i loved that mall and i can't imagine how bad losing it would be to the community.

[@TamChronin]

Good points all around. I really like your take on the mall death phenomenon, and it's something that grips me as I get older. There's a mall in Phoenix that was opened the same year I was born, and I almost mourned when they closed it down. A lot of people did, because it meant a lot to the community. There were so many memories there. But there are still malls here that are thriving because the owners actually care about the upkeep. Humans need our third spaces, and we get attached to them. So it says a lot when a mall gets run down enough to drive people away, tbh.

[@thesmallestatom]

your audio engineering is top notch!

[@whatchagonnadoscrew8158]

Predict the future? The truth is much more sinister. This man possesses the ability to speak the truth into existence.

[@fettywapofficial]

whenever i watch your analysis videos i literally never want them to end. they’re always so personal and full of insight and clear dedication. love it! :)

[@AutMouseLabs]

I really enjoy dead malls. I grew up going to a half dead mall. So the whole dead mall thing is just liminal, and fun, and nostalgic. I think your analysis is good. To add to it though, oversupply of CRE in the U.S. is a real problem. "Gray Goose" rural malls don't make much economic sense, with the number of families with children who are supplying households being much less than when those malls were built. I hope it will eventually balance out and appreciate that we get to enjoy the eerie vibes while it all happens. Great video!

[@ShawnsLegacy]

Slightly unrelated, but I'm really happy to see how quickly you've grown as a KZbinr in recent months. After hearing how long you've been doing this before the "I promise, this video belongs here" series, it's really satisfying that you finally got the recognition you deserve! Edit: It really spellchecked me into saying "KZbin" instead of KZbinr, why'd I get done dirty like that?

[@darkninjafirefox]

I miss my local mall 😞 it was a nice place to wander around when too hot and humid outside. It's been mostly torn down now, but I loved walking through the back hallways in between stores

[@iagas9]

I feel a little silly but I got goosebumps at the closing mall interviews

[@SoLivvi27]

I find it fascinating that while online shopping has effected how we shop globally, it hasn't impacted physical shopping in the same ways in every country. I'm from Australia, and while department stores aren't quite as popular as they were (we have 2 major 'high end' ones still open: Myer and David Jones), many of the shopping centres/malls that we have in Melbourne at least have been open since the 60s-80s and are still going strong, with some even having expansions planned in the next few years so more shops can open. Dead malls from my perspective are interesting given that the depiction of American teens I was fed in Australia almost always had them going to malls in their spare time (think mean girls, clueless, Hannah Montana, even stranger things). It's funny now that America's the place where malls are becoming dead or abandoned, but in Australia they're still a popular way to shop, and place to catch-up with people.

[@timmystwin]

I was watching the bit where you interviewed people and thought "wow those memories are tame as fuck" but like... that's kind of the point. Took me a while to realise this'd be like if a park closed near me. It's not special, got a few memories there, but it was a core part of life, and it's... gone. And that's kind of sad and I think it's part of the fascination. If a more unique thing closed it'd be interesting for a bit and we'd move on. But so many communities across the US are losing a core part of what was, and that's so... weird.

[@ThatGSguy]

Great documentary. I don't know if you've seen "Dan Bell's Dead Mall series" but I think I got recommended this video because I've seen most of his catalog. Also, I liked the comparison of dead malls to stadiums but I'd offer this perspective to expand on that point. I see stadiums as a destination for an event whereas malls are always meant to have people walking around them.

[@ZackarySmigel]

I've watched a few of Dan Bell's videos, and they are fantastic. You make a great point about stadiums being destinations, which makes it even more interesting that malls are becoming destinations for some people as well. Never thought of it like that!

[@emacydobon]

Just wanted to say I’ve grown to love your videos so much. I’m always shocked how you don’t have more of a following! You go out there and actually DO the video. Love your style man keep it up ❤

[@ZackarySmigel]

Thank you for the kind words! I really appreciate it. I try!

[@_NEPO_]

If just a single person thought "what will we do with the mall once the stores a gone?"

[@arisunohana]

I really found this enlightening cus I feel like the mall connects everyone, and ownership is a part of accountability in the successes of these places. It's overall a sad, weird, nostalgic feeling when you go to a place after childhood and see the massive changes.

[@Onandagus]

I think the state that movie theaters are in are going to be in the same situation. Could be an interesting video topic

[@karatn]

From Malaysia here, where successful malls have become tourist sites. But I'm in a small town, and my childhood malls are mostly dead. The only mall thriving now is a new, humongous mall managed by a REIT, and that's basically the secret behind all "successful" big malls-they're all REITs. So yeah ownership has a lot to do with it. The old malls are owned by small private owners, some may even be dead already, so they're harder to manage as they can't get consent from all owners. REIT malls are better managed but the downside is that they all have the same corporate vendors, and generally not built for small businesses. I still go to my few surviving childhood malls. Surprisingly their food courts are still alive even, perhaps to cater to nearby office workers. The watch shop I've been visiting since I was a child is still around, and they have a fancy website selling watches worldwide. Definitely more closed shops than open though. If they can find ways to adapt like the watch shop, they will survive.

[@dsnodgrass4843]

Big centralized malls were only a couple-decade blip in American history; they opened largely during the economic slow-decline of the 1970s, + by the late 1990s they were running on fumes. Here's what took them out: 1. Strip malls. Higher ROI for owners per square foot; less upfront investment. Sprouted up everywhere like weeds after a rain in the 1990s and 2000s. 2. HUGE maintenance costs for the complex HVAC, power, water, and fire-safety systems that they had to have. 3. Wal-Mart. Wal-mart deliberately set out to crush just about every kind of specialty store these malls had, and were highly aggressive about where they located their stores. They won. 4. Our old "friend", Private Equity. Mall management companies, as well as their "anchor tenant" store chains, were prime targets for PE's "buy, load, and loot" strategy, see the story of "Toys R' Us". Anyhow, this was happening when Amazon was still losing money selling books.

[@dogedad5172]

this is a video i really appreciate, lots of research and personal to all the people you interviewed

[@mbg4me]

I commented back on your first video about the quality and how you were going to blow up. I'm so happy to see that you've not only got a massive following and your videos only keep improving. Cheers

[@ZackarySmigel]

I appreciate the super thanks! You called it. Thanks so much for the support throughout the last 12 months!

[@SoopCanSam-EthoPlaylists]

You bring such a great energy to your videos, and that always brings me back.

[@stone_cold_climber]

Doing my part, helping the algorithm. Great video! My childhood mall in Louisiana closed last year. Rip

[@TheMoonsmith]

Zack you are releasing banger after banger after banger video, just wanted you to know.

[@mewmedic]

Thanks for going into the post pandemic upswing in malls. I still regularly go to malls I don't see a lot of people talking about it.

[@brittster182]

I still can’t believe they found the original back rooms photo was a room in a furniture store or daycare or something like that haha

[@parkerscarabin8993]

My local mall is currently in a quite interesting state; it's not dying, yet it is. There are still lots of people that go to it (you even might still have trouble finding a parking spot), yet inside it feels... empty. I'd say about half the store spaces inside are blocked off and empty inside. Combine this with the oddly timed remodeling in 2021, and everything feels off compared to the "golden days." The place is still lively, dare I say even thriving, and yet it feels so empty and dead at the same time. The answer to all of this is actually quite simple yet fascinating: there are plans to turn it into a combined housing and shopping center (so half of it remains mall-ish, and half of it turns into apartments). My hypothesis for the empty lots is that they're preventing new stores from moving in, to save them the trouble of having to leave shortly or deal with whatever renovations they'll be doing. So for now, it's in this weird in-between time (liminal time, if you will), where it's in the process of being reborn into what may well be a glory just as big, if not bigger than ever before. P.S. It wasn't until typing this out that I realized how fascinating this story is in itself, maybe I'll even make my own video on all of this (I don't upload to this account, but the channel I upload to should be in the bio of this account).

[@ZackarySmigel]

That’s fascinating. It's wild how many malls are in that state. They exist in a kind of limbo, teetering between decline and revival.

[@randomtinypotatocried]

Sounds like the mall across from my apartment. It's in a weird state of busy yet has a lot of blocked off empty store fronts

[@brandibucko]

Everything you make is gold I liked it when you stood in the back room I went to the mall in my hometown two weeks ago :)

[@rachelrivera91]

New subscriber, your video was on my algorithm. I’m so glad!! I’ve been into watching dead mall, dying mall, abandoned mall videos since the end of 2023, when there were many dead mall videos uploaded on Black Friday and during the last Christmas season. And how these malls were halfway empty instead of being full and packed with shoppers like in the past decades. It was pretty sad to see especially I’m among the generation who enjoyed going to the malls in the 90s and early 2000s. Rue 21 was among my favorite stores. Loved Wet Seal, Forever 21, Charlotte Russe, Love Culture, etc. I loved trying on clothes, sampling make up at Sephora, and perfumes at the department stores and trying on shoes at all the different shoe stores. I only buy stuff online if my local malls don’t offer them. Like scrubs, other miscellaneous things one can buy at Amazon or EBay that are rare to find at physical retailers. Thanks for your insight on malls. You offer a different experience on your videos in comparison to other content creators who also cover dead malls. Love your vibe and will continue to enjoy more videos from you in the future.

[@Kossolen]

These RS bangers keep me coming back.

[@labellabeach631]

Gotta click a like 💙💙💙because this topic gives so many of us all the memories when we were kids. We either hung out in the mall as a teenager with our friends, worked at the mall or we took our kids to the mall when they were little to ride the trains and throw pennies in the fountains! Add to that, every 80s and 90s movie pretty much had kids hanging out at the mall or working there too. Nostalgia at its finest, thanks for the memories for us - great job!!

[@MikeCrocker]

The last time I went to a mall was this past weekend, and I realized it was reeeally bumming me out. Something about most stores being empty and being in a place you know is on death row is very sobering. But I agree with this video, malls need to pivot in this current landscape or they're just cooked.

[@lunely]

I really enjoyed this video, I love how you interviewed folks visiting the local mall before it’s closure. Keep up the good work!

[@morgan1928]

Another stellar video dude, keep it up, it’s great to see you finally get the growth youve deserved

[@toti116]

The chipotle one got me in, this one got me to stay. Dope video

[@dahliam5397]

Honestly, this feels like such a breath of fresh air for people to acknowledge that like online retailers did have a huge impact on brick and mortar stores closing. I keep watching urbanist tangential videos and they all talk about how malls just sucked and that's why they failed, but no it's a combination of a lot of things, and on top of that, landlords being shitty like always! I feel just vindicated watching this video and articulating my thoughts better than I could have.

[@risamae3oh3]

this made me tear up a bit. I'm from the valley so the shenango valley mall was my local mall. So many memories of back to school shopping with my grandma when I was younger. I worked at that rue21 for years and the pizza place across the hall would always hook us up with the left over pizza when they closed up at night. I remember taking my little sister there and taking her on little shopping sprees at claire's and she would insist on taking pics in the little photo booth. Going drifting in the back parking lot whenever it would snow.

[@badwolf9956]

You’re quickly becoming one of my favorite channels on YT. Keep up the good work!

[@KrooTon]

I keep forgetting you’re near where I grew up and it throws me off when you reference stuff from my childhood like Shenago Valley Mall 😂

[@defiantdrills]

I actually had no idea they were utilizing the dead mall space in Burlington for a high school, that's awesome! There was a long running joke amidst my fellow Vermonters that they needed to put a 3 story Taco Bell in that space to revitalize the area but I think a high school is a much better option! Great vid, love your work!

[@LrrOfOmicronPersei8]

These interviews are amazing!

[@markroman9007]

What’s funny to me as truck driver I’ve seen more dying malls and a boom in warehouses to the point where a lot of rural land in my area is being plagued with it.

[@actualfoxes]

Great video Zackary, your opening really grabbed my attention and you certainly kept my attention throughout the entire video.

[@Marzahl]

Don’t know if people tell you this much but your video quality and editing is amazing. If you keep it up I’m sure you’ll be a huge KZbinr one day. Good stuff man.

[@RickyMontijo]

“I was married here by a robot when i was 16” i thought for sure we would get no context for this lol

[@StargazingCeres]

On a recent trip, stopping through Boise ID, we randomly decided to check out the mall before we left. Shockingly, it was totally *packed* on a Saturday evening, everyone going about like it was still 2005. My small suburban mall at home. on the other hand, has less than 50% of their store spaces filled and never has a crowd like that.

[@krisramos7453]

I’m a bass fisherman and I get the same feeling on the lake. Either when it’s super super early in the morning and there’s no one on the lake or during the early spring and late fall when there is no one else on the lake. It feels like I’m doing something wrong when I’m doing what I always do just at a different time

[@davidshepherd265]

Dead malls, thankfully aren’t a thing here in Australia. I think the main reason why is because ours pretty much all have at least one supermarket as an anchor tenant. So you go because you need food, and while you’re there you may as well go to a specialty shop, have lunch with a friend, see a movie, etc.

[@ZackarySmigel]

When is the last time you went to your local mall? ANSWER honestly! instagram.com/zas11s/

[@Redarmy1917]

2009

[@schubaal_yt]

Something many people won't think about, but people with intellectual/developmental disabilities often use malls as local community hubs, especially for inclement weather days. I'm gonna say 2019 was the last I was in there, still. My local mall has aforementioned ownership problems but has somehow clung on across the street from a Walmart.

[@XS2TheBoss]

Local mall? 2019. Any mall in my state? 2023.

[@juiuice]

About a month ago I went to the Philippines and saw their malls. Completely different situation over there because they're still thriving. I went to their second largest mall in the country, tons of people walking around, wasn't a single uh.. space (idk what you call it) that had a "for lease" sign or looked abandoned. A lot of restaurants, a lot small stores that were owned by regular people (some were kinda redundant, I saw at least two sports and instrument stores near each other). Same thing with a smaller mall I went to more frequently. Compare this to the nearest mall in my county, handfuls of empty store fronts, there used to be a Sears but that left for awhile now and its just a waste of space they really could've done something with. There used to be an H&M, then it became its own business, and ultimately closed down too. Its space took up like what was originally like 4 individual stores. They have a Target, which I think in the long run kinda hurts the already dying mall, I'm guessing anyone that's going to that Target don't have much reason to actually go beyond to the mall. That, and I think a lot of the traffic came from out of town before, but a more newer, betterer, and closer place sprung up (idk what you call this either, its not a mall, nor an outlet either...?) and most people just go over there. edit: (I still have more to say lol) You know despite what I've said about this mall, I still see teenagers coming by to it whenever I go there, so not completely dead yet.

[@TitanInvictusTube]

Oddly, last week. I had to go to one to get a Lego set I wanted from The Lego Store. It was oddly busy as hell.

[@jam541]

your chipotle video was the first video by you I watched and now I'm obsessed with your channel

[@stevekullens4898]

A problem with malls is that everything has to be going well for anything to go well. If you have a bunch of closed stores in your mall, the shopping experience becomes unpleasant, reducing the amount of shoppers and causing a downwards spiral.

[@neverxnice3577]

Real, but there are many ways to fix that and keep foot traffic through the place, i wish more malls could figure out something to draw people in.

[@livie1967]

another banger video from zackary smigel

[@CarsSimplified]

Another excellent video from Zach. I haven't really developed an attachment to any mall from my past or present, but it's still an interesting topic.

[@trentdavies4976]

I like your documentaries. You should be on cable TV . very well presented !

[@daltonfisher8843]

The audio quality in this video is UNREAL

[@ZackarySmigel]

I've worked so hard to get the audio right over the last year. Its not easy, but I finally feel like I have a solid set up. So thank you for noticing!!

[@charlestonpinballarcade]

You got the flooding right… wtf is up with that in every mall? Why is it malls flood all the time but most other multi level structures seem to not have this problem until they are very old? 😂😂😂

[@TylerYoutubeGamingChannel]

aw man the interview about the pizza shop, I had friends that worked there when we were growing up

[@krazziijenny]

Dude, amazing video ! Always look forwards to it

[@coughfee_beans]

Great video. You explained it pretty well. The 3 thriving malls in my city are all good experiences. They have more than just regular stores and they seem to not just rent to any random business who wants a store. They have a lot of options, located in great neighborhoods, are very clean, modern, have very nice options even for dates whether you want a nice restaurant, to ice skate, watch a movie or just looking for an arcade. I've always preferred to try clothes in person since a lot of brands have different actual sizes for the same size. Getting your things right away is nice and sometimes even critical and the experience is fun. "Window shopping" is fun sometimes too. I just spent a whole weekend at malls with my girl and it was very fun. We may have spent quite a bit but we also looked around not spending money at times. Have you ever been to a nice restaurant food court? That's cool. Getting an espresso martini from a place, an entree from another and a nice meal from yet another, all brought to you by waiters. Thriving malls adapted to the modern time.

[@RetroMario]

I think Contrapoints put it really nicely: The dying malls are, essentially, a new gothic aesthetic. In a dead mall, you get a comparable feeling you get in an abbey or an abandoned mansion. As you, yourself said, an empty stadium. But instead of an Abbey where people were going for their spiritual aspirations, or a mansion that people of wildly different social classes lived in, but the upper class that of this mansion has become irrelevant. A dead mall can mean different things, like, material longings, dreams of success, happy moments with loved ones. Maybe it's so confusing because, that downfall is happening really quick and right before our eyes and many of the aspirations in our culture still remains intact. So the dead mall evokes those feelings but we're not entirely sure why but it is very similar to a building with an old gothic aesthetic.

[@napdogs]

I remember going to a community college like (Tafe) course that was set up in a highschool during the school holidays. It was oddly both comforting and energising to walk through an empty space made to be and usually was packed with people. My friends hated it but I described it feeling like I was a ghost, feeling the presence of crowds of people around me but being unable to interact with or be seen by them. Strangely felt empowering. Needless to say my comments only freaked out my friends more

[@Zoey587]

There is two malls in my city. One of them is thriving as it has big stores, a Round1 and new stores opening. The other used to be the best one until the change of ownership in the late 2010s. The owners don’t care much and in such, is not opening new stores, it’s more local based stores. I can go to one mall on a weekend and it’s bustling while the other one barely has anyone. It’s crazy to think about how ownership can decide how well a mall does

[@drwng79]

You’re an incredible storyteller.

[@kendallnicholson3572]

I found my new favorite video essayist

[@neutral.chaotic]

Third spaces, man. So much more important than we ever thought.

[@theartofgettingready7633]

I went to my local last month! ... to return items I bought online. I'll be crushed if my local mall closes and I can't do that anymore. Going to the post office and standing in line is too much! lol I do miss the old mall days though, when they were full of people and stores, lots of hot snacks available...

[@whiteblaze34]

Good stuff, I hear that Old School Runescape music in the background. Forever driven by nostalgia.

[@MrBaskins2010]

love that new radicals video. that was my local mall as a kid, i cry when i hear that song now

[@coltonkruse2313]

Cool video man! Appreciate your content.

[@jojolt1467]

Dude your videos are insane

[@ninabeena83]

I feel you bro, I’ve outlived several stores I previously worked in/managed - Wet Seal (4 diff stores in 2 states); The Body Shop x2 (the body care one and an apparel store of the same name, kind of similar to F21 when it first opened, or Rue; and Charming Charlie (corporate role for that one))….plus one almost-dead mall….that I know of. Along with what you said, the inefficient transition or adoption of e-commerce tactics, or at least a functional website and ordering processes, was the nail in the coffin for at least Seal and Charlie, and the inability to move alongside changes in consumer preferences and behavior is the root cause of all of their demises. Smh, guess I’ll have to keep my fond memories of being dropped off at the mall as a teen, to just hang out, and mopping away rainwaters😂 during the workday close at hand. I was recently at my most local mall though, also a mostly dead space with all but one anchor store closed and very few other tenants. I went for a gem and mineral show and vendor fair, hopefully the powers that be don’t let the spaces completely die because they do still serve a purpose, and could serve many more tbh. As a skater, a lot of us wish they’d convert at least part of them to rink space - it’s TX and obviously it’s really too hot out for like 9 months of the year to be skating out of doors lol. Liability issues with that concept though from what I’ve heard

[@NickdeBey]

The RS2 soundtrack really ties this all together. Oddly enough I got into OSRS this week and the nostalgia is hitting hard!